"Just ignore him sweetie. We don't want to insult differently abled people. I know he does some odd things, but he has something called Cosplay and we need to respect that." - my aunt, probably
Funny thing, that surcoat I'm wearing, it's literally is my wife's medieval dress she bought for attending a medieval fair ^_^ But hey, they don't exactly sell these kinds of things for men, how else was I to get such a stylish casual wear surcoat?
agreed. i have a few kilts and a thick cloth that i can use as a quick kilt if i need to take the pup out after im already in bed. i can roll it up or down to fit the weather.
Can we talk about color too? Medieval media tends to depict everyone wearing dull colors and leather. A lot of brown, grey. The artwork however shows lots of bright colors, at least for the nobility.
THANKYOU, I was forgetting for a moment the _Correct_ term of pharse for what he is talking about, and what 100% is Not a "Ballgown" or is otherwise infact by attire a "Dress." . . . Shad making a troll video to troll video, ok. but still, some consistency is nice? XD meh. If he wants to goof is on him as we know what he means is not called a dress.....
This isn't a robe. A robe is a different type of long garment. Same with a gown. They were rich, sometimes ceremonial, split garments worn open over top your other garments, usually lined in fur. Robes are things that would be worn by ministers and doctors (in the PhD sense) and the like as a sympol of their status. What wizards wear are more like extra long tunics which worn by older men in positions of power, once again as a symbol of their status. What current medieval wizards miss is the robe over top. Basically, ya'll been walking around in your underwear.
There is one effect on combat that I've experienced while sparing in surcoats and other long garments like this. With the covering of the legs, your opponent can have trouble striking low. It is significantly harder for them to see you pull your leg back when they swing for the legs, which means they just catch cloth instead of you. And on several occasions, their weapon got wrapped up momentarily in the surcoat, allowing me to strike.
@Zero .Karma Ah yes, hakamas. Many people mistake them for skirts, when in fact the ones used in martial arts are large pants. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hakama
@Zero .Karma I thought Shad was going to talk about that in this video since it is the only combat advantage to wearing a dress. He doesn't seem to know much about history or sword fighting tactics.
The Hakama appear to have originally been riding overpants, kinda, but yep, the hiding of the footwork is deliberate. Also helps with smooth fluent movements.
Unlike Shad I have no experience with official HEMA combat, I have fought something similar to historical Rapier in the SCA. A long skirt or dress like garment can conceal foot work below the knees very well especially if the fighter knows how to slide their feet instead of step while maintaining the height of their stance. It's not much of a difference but it is a difference that can become an advantage.
For years I've been internally raging every time a character says that skirts/dresses are restrictive in combat. Now I am internally cheering that someone has called bullshit.
Jackie Chan wears a dress in one of his old films. If I remember correctly, he uses the dress to conceal leg movements. So they have a potential strategic advantage.
@@logicisuseful i have recently seen it in regards to GW's new light elves, despite that they wear long garments based on those worn by eastern soldiers...
@@matthiuskoenig3378 You say that like the eternally online GW fanboys would be in a position to know either combat or how a dress restricts movement.
Thanks Shad for the ❤️. Oh yeah same man whenever I hear the words “Man wearing dress.” I always think of that moment in the movie...to be fair it looked good for a “dress”. Hahaha!
"Surko"? Oh. It is the way how it pronounces in russian language. Only after your comment i understood that i know what word "Surcot" means. Thanks a lot!
@@андрейкопылов-л6ъ It depends on the region, time period and the class of people saying it, so trying to get the authentic pronunciation is pedantic at this point. Modern French is good enough. But if you want to now : Bliaut : Bliaut, Bliaude, Blaude, Biaude. It's just variations depending on the region, the only difference in the prononciation is the [d] that's added at the end in some versions, and the [l] and [j] sounds that disappears in other versions. Houppelande : Same as the old french pronunciation as far as I know, maybe in some regions the [d] was pronounced [de] but that's about it. Surcot : The main difference here is that most of the time the [R] would actually be a [l] and the [y] a [u].
There anything you can't do? * Fighting with capes * Shooting arrows like a machinegun * Imposible Archery * Debunking katanas * Making mainly dress fighting I won't be impressed if the next video is about combat while wall-running as prince of persia.
In Polish it means a tracksuit specifically. It's a common outfit for an urban thug 'round here. So boys in dresses are nothing to laught at in Poland. Especially when you're surrounded by them in an alleyway at night.
It's also important to note that those garments shortened considerably over the years, so much so that getting onto a horse might leave nothing to the imagination (a problem which Chaucer complains about in his Canterbury Tales) and which would later result in the Cod Piece. Let's not forget that "high heals" were originally developed by horse riding knights. Trousers, on the other hand, were mostly regional things that developed along side of the tunic based outfits. So not only did real men wear dresses at one point they even wore miniskirts.
Maybe it's time that unisex dresses like the kirtle be a thing once more, *outside* of medieval fairs, and even the current skirts and dresses be made available to men also.
@@kevlarandchrome Pencil skirt was not a problem on loading dock and hauling heavy items up and down ladders, took a few days before anyone commented at work, lol.
@@9051team you mistake therr meaning. The artic sea they are referring to is an area of Neptune towards the southern hemisphere which is a surprisingly bright shade of blue, and not the sea surrounding the North Pole.
You know, this is very similar to heart patterns in the medieval period. Today it’s seen mostly as a ‘feminine’ thing whereas in the medieval period it was seen as a cool pattern... just look at its use on Gothic style armor!... also, that background is still amazing, keep up the good work Shad!!!
Hearts are used differently today than they were then. I don't think anyone finds the 'hearts' of historical armour even by modern sensibilities as particularly feminine.
I have found that I appreciate the heart shape much more after hearing one supposed origin of the heart shape having a much more... masculine origin - particularly when turned upside down!
We still have men's coats that are quite long. Haven't seen anyone complaining about their unwieldiness, although truth be told, most of us don't have to get on a horse daily
@@wendigo1619 modern coats restrict movement a lot. For aethetic reason the sleeves are pointed downwards, If you lift your arms, eather all the rest of coat goes up, or you tear it.
Thank you for making this video. Not exactly related to long menswear of the middle ages, but I typically wear dresses that are mid thigh to slightly below the knee in length over leggings, and people randomly assume they would get in the way for some reason. They really don't as long as the skirt flares enough for a full range of leg movement like you said, and as long as the material's sturdy enough you can wear them for all kinds of stuff like running, hiking, working with livestock, gardening, and yardwork. The one drawback I've noticed with longer dresses that go below the knee, is that they can be a bit of pain to crawl around in if you have to crawl on your hands and knees. As a short person with short arms, an object rolls under something large, I usually have to crawl under what ever it is to get it out. If you're wearing something below the knee, even if it's appropriately flared, you still have to try and roll it up out of the way or you'll basically step on it when crawling. You can still crawl and all, it's just annoying.
"Men didn't wear dreases... exluding wizards." I love that you added that disclaimer! ... I would like to add that preists and bishops also had dress like vestiments and robes too sometimes. ... Preists having mostly white or earthtones. robes, and mages having bright collors, expecially blue, red, or purple.
@@zacharybrown5325 well, if something is called a "wizard", but it doesn't possess any qualities of a wizard, then it's not actually a wizard but something different. But you are right, mages did exist, although not the magic ones.
@@zacharybrown5325 I have no idea what the fuck you are talking about. First of all, it was just a joke and you are finding some meaning that never existed. Secondly, I clearly do make a distinction between terms "wizard" and "mage". I don't know how you missed it, but the original post wasn't talking about real actual history, so I said something obvious, which meant "that's not how it works irl". Are you trying to say that people can shoot fireballs from their hands? No. Then why are you even arguing if your logic doesn't contradict anything I said? I even corrected my misuse of the word "mage". Now guess why most people dislike people who talk about occultism and mythology. (Hint: they act like you do instead of acting like normal decent people)
"Dresses are just fashionable!" Although it was quite a funny joke, it's actually true, I can totally imagine my main character from my book wearing one. Also, as I've been searching for historical clothing, I can't wait for your next video! Let the mind molding begin, Shad!
If you're interested in historical dress I would look into Bernadette Banner, or Morgan Donner. They are two UA-camrs how focus on historical costuming and dress history. Morgan Donner would probably have more videos relevant to medieval times but Bernadette is just delightful.
They call it a kilt because that's what happened to the last person who called it a dress. :) Kilts are very specific style of garment. Fun note great kilts were designed the way they were to alsobe able to make a tent out of.
@@gaberielpendragon They call it a kilt because it's pleated (kilted) and they're speaking Scots rather than Gaelic, which means they're probably not actually wearing a kilt. The people that actually wore kilts, historically, called it "am féileadh beag" (the little wrap) for the little kilt, or "am breacan féilidh" (the wrapped motley) for the great kilt. In the 18th century, the former was borrowed into Scots and English as "philabeg". Fun fact: great kilts aren't Medieval, they emerged in the Renaissance (1580s-1590s), and the little kilt in the latter part of the 1600s.
One could easily argue that these would actually be beneficial in fights The legs are fully obscured by them and without the leg split you cannot see, at a glance, the opponents leg movements with the same level of certainty
Today's hakama are mostly the split type, so they're technically wide pants, though skirt-style variants also exist. Also, funnily enough, they evolved from being mostly worn by (court-) women as undergarments to later being mostly worn by men. This includes the samurai, who wore the split variant almost exclusively, to ease riding (just like many long European garments got cuts for the same purpose). Nowadays they're not worn much anymore, safe for some traditional festivals/sports or vocations (As far as those go, it seems to be mostly disconnected from gender though). Western clothing has almost completely replaced traditional styles in more everyday capacities, though I guess one could mention yukata when talking about men in dresses :)
To be fair, jeans are remarkably restrictive if not tailored right or made of an elastic fabric. Even my dress slacks allow me more movement than most jeans.
THANK YOU! I'm so sick of fantasy or historical fiction women complaining that their skirts restrict their movements. I've climbed mountains, kicked open doors, and done all sort of things in a skirt with out any inconvenience. True the modern pencil skirt does not allow this. But peasant, basic pleated, or princess seamed skirts, ankle length or shorter, in no way encumber a person's movements.
Quick notes on hoop skirts from the amateur dress historian! "Hoop skirt" is actually a somewhat broad term. There are many different kinds, and they come from different periods. The earliest hoop skirt that I know of is the farthingale. Farthingales came into fashion during the Italian Renaissance, and it's basically a normal skirt with 3-4 hoops of some light and flexible material (cane, baleen, etc.,) sewn into the bottom half. This causes the over skirts to stand out in a sort of cone shape. Variations of the same idea are scene all the way up the the 18th century, where it sort of dissapeared. But hoop skirts had not breathed their last. The crinoline was invented in the late 1850's. It was more of a dome shape, and its hoops were made of thin spring steel. These were suspended by this fabric strips called "tapes", making a light and flexible skirt support that collapsed like an accordion when it was taken off. Hoops are not as unwieldy as most people seem to thing them, but they probably would very difficult to fight effectively in. Happy watching everybody!
From my experience in the SCA, another advantage of wearing a dress/tunic/whatever is that they wear out much more slowly than pants do. Your movement puts a lot of stress on a pair of pants and very little on a dress/tunic/whatever.
I think the term “Tunic” is sort of similar to how we use the term “Coat” or “jacket” today. There are dozens & dozens of types of Coats & jackets, But we still use the same term for all of them.
Since fashion is descriptive (reflecting what is/was used/worn), as opposed to prescriptive (defining what should be used/worn), all you need is to start wearing the things.
Isnt the idea of a dress derived from 'dress' as in clothes in general. We all still get dressed and undressed regardless of who you are classwise. The only reason a dress is understood to be a female garment is because I suppose it went out fashion as pants became more popular with males. The word dress in old english is 'put straight', im guessing because its going to be a fairly straight stitch compared to a complex pant design as you said.
This is very interesting. I’m writing a book set in the 1100s and after tons of research I realized none of my characters were wearing what I thought they were wearing 😂
What did you think they were wearing at first? :'D I myself realised my ocs in the 13th century and up were going to get real familiar with everything BUT pants.
ElvinGearMaster Irma haha, same here. I had a Scottish character who was going to wear a kilt...until I found out kilts as we know them weren’t a thing until about 500 years later 😬
@@tamangelinart The Romans had short dresses/togas and would put leather hanging strips as protection around and a breastplate on their chest. But I think they had to make changes to their uniform when they came to England as they were always moaning about the cold in their letters home. The big treat of the day was the hot bath at the end of their shift.
For anyone who still has doubts about wearing them in combat, consider this. I live in Pennsylvania Dutch country. Amish ladies will perform all sorts of strenuous, physical labor, every day, in an ankle length dress.
@@7dayspking And? It´s not like the point was that the amish ladies would kick your ass. The point was that dress didn´t restrict their movement while working, so it probably wouldn´t even when worn by a fighter. (Hell depending on the labor it might even require wider range of movement than fighting.)
@ Of course the resistance is the issue. The potential existance of restriction of movement is the whole point of this conversation. How is what you wrote in any way relevant to that topic? (For that matter, what the hell was even supposed to be your point? People get sweaty when they work? Also "worth the trouble to accomodate".... how/for/in what?)
@@kotanightshade8989 pants came from central-eastern sources, but we don't know if it was the city living persians or the nomadic horsemen that did it first. admittedly nomads sounds more likely but we don't know for sure.
I tried to use the sword in several types of "dresses" and "skirts" and it is usually the modern stuff that gets in your way... But even the medieval versions had their limitations when it came to length... add a few centimeters and try to walk the stairs... You will "enjoy" youself very much. Broad or not. The same thing is with fighting in an uneven terrain. You can easily step on the back side. So, just a few comments from a woman :-D
I've never stepped on my own skirt going up stair but then again I also pick up the front by several cm if I'm in a hurry. Walking backwards in one is fine if you're a weirdo like me and kick the back up before planting your foot 😅 most of my weight is bared by the ball and toes of my foot when I walk so they meet the ground first so I usually don't catch my dress anyway. I understand that's not normal though.
@@savannahrae9122 I am actually very clumsy... And yes, the point is - you have to grab your skirt when walking the stairs... It's impractical :-D I have actually made myself my own design ao I don't have to deal with these problems any more... Still needs a bit of work, but the front is fine :-D
@@veronika.rel.wiesner ah yeah clumsyness does make it worse. Not going to lie I think picking up the dress when going up stairs looks so elegant to me I love it 😍 but for free movement for working fields or other high movement activities an ankle length is plenty good enough if you're already fine with long skirts.
@@savannahrae9122 I personally am for skirts that reach about the half of your calf, but that's personal preference... Another annoying thing with long skirts are people behind you, who tend to step on them. Meh. It's really a shame, cos' I quite like wearing skirts... and shooting bow... and fencing...
These videos are very much enlightening regarding the medieval period. It's always a delight to watch them. Never learned so much about the period before, cheers.
I've worn a yukata in Japan on more than one occasion, and that's technically a dress as well but the ones I wore were obviously cut for men. And I really liked wearing them! In general, I appreciate long clothes (worst part about summer is that I can't wear my coat). That "dresses" fell out of fashion for men is something I consider a damn shame. I mean, you look really good in that surcoat! But if you were to wear a dress cut for a woman, well... it'd probably look comical.
I remember reading somewhere that the length of one's clothing was also a sign of one's wealth and prestige, because mostly only the nobility and clergy could afford enough fabric for really long garments. Not sure how accurate that is though so feel free to correct me!
kinda. That was true only for garments longer than ankle length. For example, medieval noblewomen in the 12th-14th centuries often wore floor length houpelandes. These had to be lifted when walking, so you wouldn't trip. Obviously, that's very much a status statement. Trains on dresses also started to be used in the 1500s. Again, that's obviously a status statement. Whether someone wore an ankle length or knee length garment though, was a matter of preference and current fashion: not so much status.
This question of "fighting dresses" makes me think of the hakama worn in eastern Asian cultures. These are the very wide bottom garments that are trousers, with two separate legs, but are so wide that they appear to be a long, pleated skirt. These were worn by Samurai men, and are still worn today in Japanese martial arts like Kendo, Aikido and Judo. They allow for both the freedom of movemen and leg protection of trousers, but the wide, flowing material is also said to help obscure the fighter's leg and foot movements during combat. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hakama
For the past 8 years or so I really began delving into my Slavic/Baltic heritage and part of that I started researching the clothing of my ancestors. The people of Eastern Europe were slower to adopt the fashion of Central/Western Europe so by the time the Renaissance started in the bulk of Europe the majority of Slavs and Balts were still using the remnants of medieval Europe. Clothing such as embroidered undershirts, zupans, kontuszes and delia's were still fairly prevalent in the 16th, 17th and 18 centuries. Of course it goes without saying that the nobles were quicker to pick up the fashion trends, especially those of the royal court.
It's not just about it being easier, it's also about it being a lot more cost efficient, you can pass down dresses much easier than pants, and they're much easier to resew. One of the reasons we don't have a lot of historical dresses pr. say is because they were very usually just resewn into new ones. Pants and more "specified" pieces of clothing, so a bit harder to resew. EDIT: Also feel like it's important to correct some of the things you say about hoop-skirts. They're not made out of a wooden frame, they're made out of whale-teeth, which is Extremely flexible. (what we call boning) sure it gives a larger frame area, but it isn't hard to move in. The thing that would really say something about how great it would be in combat would be the length, that and if it got stuck in something. I know one of the pictures you're using is from Priorattire, and she actually made a video about her moving about in the big bell crinolines, which is a step up from just panniers or pocket hoops. She also talks about the corset etc. which have been getting a bad rep, interesting watch for sure :>
But they are universally depicted wearing pants, so the 'dress' is not an alternative to that. Not that men seem to be typically depicted wearing full length robes, more just above the knee with full length robes being more prominent on religious or political figures and before the 14th century.
@@7dayspking He shows images through out this video of men wearing dress like clothing that extendes beyond the knee, most images shown show it going beyond the knee. 0:53 There are 2 men on the right with it reaching just above the ankles, and one on the left that is appears he has pulled up to above the knee while he is working. And the guy on the left also appears to not be wearing pants. 1:02 We again see 3 men with it reaching there ankles, with nothing that clearly shows anyone wear it above the knee. 1:10 Ignoring the people who look to be priests, at least 2 of them have it reaching just below the knee, with another 2 not wearing pants. 1:49 This one is clearly from latter in them medieval period, as is obvious from how high the hem is on the furthest left guy, even so the guy to the far right is wearing his below the knee and isn't wearing pants. 3:36 2 men on the right side, one going to the ankles, the other mid-calf 4:36 Man on the left has it covering the knees, which is not above the knee, and the other looks to be hanging a little below the knees 6:49 The 2 men on the left both have it reaching to just below the knees While I am sure I can find more examples bot in this video and else where, I am too tired to continue going through
We still use dress in all other context generically. you get dressed, you put on a dress shirt or dress uniform. etc. you put on your "best dress" (best clothes)
Technically they're more like robes but yeah. In fact, you can see similar garments today. Many more traditional Catholic priests, and most bishops, will wear a robe-like garment called a cassock.
Depends on the specific type of garment, some types of houppelande are more robe like, being more voluminous and meant to be worn over other clothing as an outer garment, but others are literally the same regardless of the gender wearing it, like the kirtle, which is more specifically defined as a dress.
Well, etymologically, the English word "robe", is just the French word "robe". Which is the French word for dress. And for robe. Because in French you use the same word for both. Because it's the same thing.
I remember seeing something about how women who fight have said the issue with large ball gowns is usually the sleeves, not the skirts which restrict their movements.
A benefit that might be gained from wearing a sircoat in combat is the fact it obscures targets below the waist, making attacks intended to trip an opponent less likely to succeed.
Hell yes! I wear monk's robes whenever I go LARPing, and I'm as fast and agile as anybody. It never gets in the way. A long sleeveless gambeson on top and longsword in hand, and I'm a whirling dealer of fake death. I'm also practicing Montante drills in order to get better. Plus, the access to air really helps me keep cool, even in summer.
I actually have experience skirmishing in something similar to what you're wearing! It wasn't quite as voluminous, but at no point in daily activities did it feel in any way restrictive. BUT THEN during combat, it didn't hamper me most of the time, however, almost every time I tried to retreat out of range by stepping backwards, my heel would catch on the back hem and trip me. The garment didn't reach the ground; it would just catch on my foot as I lifted it and put it back down, and although I never got hit in spite of it, it could have cost me my life on the battlefield. Just a personal anecdote.
@@GODAXEN They basically provide air conditioning. I wear monk's robes while LARPing, generally at the height of summer, and even though they are black, even the slightest breeze helps cool much more than pants do.
Yes, yes, YES! As a professional skirt/dress wearer (I wear them every single day, and have since I was a child) I can confirm that they are NOT detrimental to one's mobility - I will grant that it does depend on cut and type of material, of course. But with enough width, and a material that doesn't fly in your face at the slightest puff of wind or cling to your legs, you can do anything in a full length skirt/dress. I have ran, swam, gymmed, skated, gone skiing, played horse (on both two and four legs), ridden actual horses and done a bunch of other activities in skirts - none of them had splits either. And yes, skirts keep the heat in very well. Thank you! It's so refreshing to hear someone not used to dresses state that they are perfectly fine to move around in. I'm so tired of the old, "How can you move, you're wearing a dress!" argument. I write characters who wear skirts/dresses everyday and ride horses and fight and whatnot, specifically because of this misconception.
Man Shad I am so excited for the one Million, I have been a fan since before 100k, I think. It has been such a pleasure watching you climb and rise, I am sure it is simply amazing to think back from the beginning to what your channel has become for you. I am so proud of you already and I don't even know you or live in your country. Anyways. Soon!
the times when I've been in plays and things that might be gonsidered "period pieces" I've thoroghly enjoyed dressing in long flowing clothes. Bring back male dresses!
In Japanese Kendo the Hakama and Kendo-gi looks like a dress. Of course it too has a purpose: to mask your foot work so that the enemy can not easily guess your fighting stance or position. We may think it looks funny now, but back then it can really give you an edge (pardon the pun) in combat. Thanks for sharing the lols as well as the great info, Shad! Great video!
You forgot to mention kilts and robes. There was a heraldic encyclopedia at my school (this was decades ago so I don't have access any more to give the exact title of the publication, sadl) that contained a quote from a knight stating that he was fond of getting robes in tribute because they were great for dealing with drafts when he visited certain cathedrals.
As someone who comes more from the realm of unarmed combat, a dress like that does impose certain differences in how one would fight, but it is still quite possibe to fight wearing one. Kicks would be slightly different, as there is a slighly higher chance of tangling your feet in the fabric than wearing pants, though I don't think it would change too drastically. The biggest issue I can think of would be stances. In unarmed fighting, many styles take advantage of lower stances than you normally see in armed combat, and a garment as long as the one Shad is wearing would probably drag the ground in some of those stances, increasing the chances of tripping. Also, when your garment drags the ground, your opponent could possibly step on it to limit your mobility, rather than grab it. None of this says that you can't fight while wearing this kind of clothing, just that you'd have to fight differently. I guess this is why you almost never see this kind of garment being worn by fighters that use these kinds of techniques (though these fighting styles normally don't come out of the European tradition, but are more often found in South- and East-Asian fighting arts). Wrestling and other grappling arts, however? Yes, this would be highly inconvenient, given how often one would use their legs to grapple an opponent in most of those fighting styles. TL;DR: This kind of garment wouldn't affect most known HEMA styles (almost as if they were developed assuming this was just what people wore) or a lot of armed combat styles in general, but other combat styles could be more affected; A.K.A., don't wear a dress to a wrestling match.
Surprised Shad didn't mention one major advantage of flared 'dress-like' garb during armed combat, something modern Kendo users still emphasize: a large flowing 'skirt' (or puffy pants like in Kendo) helps conceal your footwork, making it harder for your opponent to anticipate your movements.
-i've not watched the video through yet- while i know larp isnt a direct comparison to real combat, the majority of my characters wear dresses or skirts. the increased manoeuvrability in combat is very advantageous and they're also incredibly comfortable. -having now watched the video- many garments of the period would have been pieced together anyway, so the use of gores to give more flare (while i understand this was more the style in late saxon/ early norman era, it stands to reason that it would continue into medieval periods, the cut of Shad's overcoat suggests this also) combine this with the fabrics being much denser than modern, machine woven counterparts, and you have a flared skirt which would keep out of the way of the wearer. great video as always
@@gavinmcintosh7022 No you're misunderstanding. A dress covers the entire body, a skirt is for the lower body only, you dont wear a shirt with a dress but you would be topless with a skirt. So no matter how short your legs are the kilt is a skirt, not a dress.. unless you're implying someones legs are so short that the kilt would be right below their arms. EDIT: That's really interesting, i didn't know there was different names for the patterns. Thank you for telling me that!
In Saudi Arabia this “ dress “ didn’t go out of fashion, but it transitioned into different types and different specifications, to make a Thob (always white and has a rectangular shape) for professional wear, And a Qamis (can be different colors and has rectangular shape) for casual wear, but a dress (can be different colors and most of the time has hourglass shape)
I do think I get a connection here when I've watched a bit of wuxia films years ago, and the Ruroni Kenshin film recently, to know that wearing long flowy robes don't impede one's combat.
Mom! The guy next door is wearing a dress while playing with his sword and yelling at a camera now.
"What? Again??"
Call the FBI!
"Just ignore him sweetie. We don't want to insult differently abled people. I know he does some odd things, but he has something called Cosplay and we need to respect that." - my aunt, probably
@@sofiadragon6520 but he's soooooo weird!
@@pillowprincess3673 throws rocks down at FBI through machicolations
Honey where's my dress
Shad: I'm wearing it right now.
Shad's wife: This quarantine is getting to him.
Funny thing, that surcoat I'm wearing, it's literally is my wife's medieval dress she bought for attending a medieval fair ^_^
But hey, they don't exactly sell these kinds of things for men, how else was I to get such a stylish casual wear surcoat?
@@shadiversity Who wore it best?
@@HuevoBendito I'm willing to bet his wife wore it better. Shad still looks cool though!😎👍
Medieval fashion is great. Especially long (not so long like in video, but to the knees) shirt/tunic/etc with waistline (became wider down below).
@@shadiversity LOL. It is pretty damn good story! Why did not you say about that in the video? It is so much fun and interesting! Thank you.
Forgot to mention how comfy they are. Comfy, easy to make and practical.
agreed. i have a few kilts and a thick cloth that i can use as a quick kilt if i need to take the pup out after im already in bed. i can roll it up or down to fit the weather.
I want to try one now
Kilts too. I wear them regularly, and other than windy days, they're wonderful
PotterSieben long flowing dresses/skirts are the best during windy days.
I think they'd be very convenient.
Can we talk about color too? Medieval media tends to depict everyone wearing dull colors and leather. A lot of brown, grey. The artwork however shows lots of bright colors, at least for the nobility.
Green and yellow were very popular.
Medieval people loved color. Even the peasants could aford colorful clothes
@@BastiatC Red and blue where also popular, but in general more expensive, so more suited for nobility.
Shad’s trend of discussing a particular thing then immediately asking if you can fight with it is absolutely amazing
Coming next week : Historical Jewellery but how practically a it to fight in ?
@@sithiscollector1681 And how practical is it to fight with (using it as a weapon)
@@patheronaetherson2860 well, you can easily use some brooch or a hairpin as a stabbing weapon
The medieval soup spoon; How it's made, how it was used, why holding it a certain way was considered a social taboo, can you fight with it?
A man with so much subpressed anger and violence! He turns everything in the fight...
;)
We in the wizard community call them robes.
THANKYOU, I was forgetting for a moment the _Correct_ term of pharse for what he is talking about, and what 100% is Not a "Ballgown" or is otherwise infact by attire a "Dress." . . .
Shad making a troll video to troll video, ok. but still, some consistency is nice? XD
meh. If he wants to goof is on him as we know what he means is not called a dress.....
True.
We?
Robe is also the french word for dress. France is actually a kind of gigantic Unseen University...
This isn't a robe. A robe is a different type of long garment. Same with a gown. They were rich, sometimes ceremonial, split garments worn open over top your other garments, usually lined in fur. Robes are things that would be worn by ministers and doctors (in the PhD sense) and the like as a sympol of their status. What wizards wear are more like extra long tunics which worn by older men in positions of power, once again as a symbol of their status. What current medieval wizards miss is the robe over top. Basically, ya'll been walking around in your underwear.
There is one effect on combat that I've experienced while sparing in surcoats and other long garments like this. With the covering of the legs, your opponent can have trouble striking low. It is significantly harder for them to see you pull your leg back when they swing for the legs, which means they just catch cloth instead of you. And on several occasions, their weapon got wrapped up momentarily in the surcoat, allowing me to strike.
@This Dude You realize that "Aikido users" who participate in MMA tournaments are maybe a tad more prepared than the average esodojo Aikidoka.
@Zero .Karma Ah yes, hakamas. Many people mistake them for skirts, when in fact the ones used in martial arts are large pants. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hakama
@Zero .Karma I thought Shad was going to talk about that in this video since it is the only combat advantage to wearing a dress. He doesn't seem to know much about history or sword fighting tactics.
The Hakama appear to have originally been riding overpants, kinda, but yep, the hiding of the footwork is deliberate. Also helps with smooth fluent movements.
Unlike Shad I have no experience with official HEMA combat, I have fought something similar to historical Rapier in the SCA. A long skirt or dress like garment can conceal foot work below the knees very well especially if the fighter knows how to slide their feet instead of step while maintaining the height of their stance. It's not much of a difference but it is a difference that can become an advantage.
For years I've been internally raging every time a character says that skirts/dresses are restrictive in combat.
Now I am internally cheering that someone has called bullshit.
Jackie Chan wears a dress in one of his old films. If I remember correctly, he uses the dress to conceal leg movements. So they have a potential strategic advantage.
Most times I’ve seen comments like that, they’re about wearing pencil skirts or ball gowns, and stilettos are frequently in play, too...
@@logicisuseful i have recently seen it in regards to GW's new light elves, despite that they wear long garments based on those worn by eastern soldiers...
@@matthiuskoenig3378 You say that like the eternally online GW fanboys would be in a position to know either combat or how a dress restricts movement.
Reviving a dead meme here:
“It is not a dress alright?...It’s called a Tunic!” - that Pharaoh guy from Night of the Museum 2
I was thinking of that too.
Thanks Shad for the ❤️. Oh yeah same man whenever I hear the words “Man wearing dress.” I always think of that moment in the movie...to be fair it looked good for a “dress”. Hahaha!
Yamato no Ryuujin “It was the high on fashion 3000 years ago I assure you.”
Great movie but dead meme lol
Perfect! XD I was just thinking about Prince of Egypt, Joseph's tunic. And also movies about Jesus and stuff. They wear tunics there too.
Bliaut : Blee-ho / [blijo]
Houppelande : Hoop-land / [uplã:d]
Surcot : Surko / [syRko]
Hope that helps ;)
"Surko"? Oh. It is the way how it pronounces in russian language. Only after your comment i understood that i know what word "Surcot" means. Thanks a lot!
That's modern French pronunciation. Not the way it was pronounced in medieval times
@@FranciscoTornay Oh, really? Do you know proper version? If it is true of course.
With more fancy words they were probably closer to modern french. Also the regional accents would change the pronunciation.
@@андрейкопылов-л6ъ It depends on the region, time period and the class of people saying it, so trying to get the authentic pronunciation is pedantic at this point. Modern French is good enough.
But if you want to now :
Bliaut : Bliaut, Bliaude, Blaude, Biaude. It's just variations depending on the region, the only difference in the prononciation is the [d] that's added at the end in some versions, and the [l] and [j] sounds that disappears in other versions.
Houppelande : Same as the old french pronunciation as far as I know, maybe in some regions the [d] was pronounced [de] but that's about it.
Surcot : The main difference here is that most of the time the [R] would actually be a [l] and the [y] a [u].
There anything you can't do?
* Fighting with capes
* Shooting arrows like a machinegun
* Imposible Archery
* Debunking katanas
* Making mainly dress fighting
I won't be impressed if the next video is about combat while wall-running as prince of persia.
I need that Prince of Persia demonstration
Not to mention making boob armour practical. Shad is both an expert scholar a true nerd.
Have you not seen the Bowmaster of Helm's Deep?
Also, no capes!
next thing you know, surfing with a shield
@@Wolvenworks
Legolas or Link?
Funfact: dress in norwegian means suit.
In Polish it means a tracksuit specifically. It's a common outfit for an urban thug 'round here. So boys in dresses are nothing to laught at in Poland. Especially when you're surrounded by them in an alleyway at night.
And kjortel means kirtle. :)
It also means overalls
So does it in English. The morning dress is a suit
Can’t change it from 69
It's also important to note that those garments shortened considerably over the years, so much so that getting onto a horse might leave nothing to the imagination (a problem which Chaucer complains about in his Canterbury Tales) and which would later result in the Cod Piece. Let's not forget that "high heals" were originally developed by horse riding knights. Trousers, on the other hand, were mostly regional things that developed along side of the tunic based outfits. So not only did real men wear dresses at one point they even wore miniskirts.
*heels
Yeah , even Roman men / gladiators wore mini skirts made of a protective material with long wrap sandals went to the knee or over .
Maybe it's time that unisex dresses like the kirtle be a thing once more, *outside* of medieval fairs, and even the current skirts and dresses be made available to men also.
TLDR: Don't wear a pencil skirt into combat. Everything else should be fine.
It depends on how high the slit is. And what type of war paint you're wearing.
A single high side slit or double front slit can work if it's high enough, but don't try it with just a back vent. Don't ask how I know.
@@kevlarandchrome Pencil skirt was not a problem on loading dock and hauling heavy items up and down ladders, took a few days before anyone commented at work, lol.
That is, unless you have really good legs.
It doesn't matter how hard you try, Cloud will always be the most fabulous in a dress.
Botw link?
True facts
Actually I think Tequila Joseph is
@@TurtleStranger The hottest video game character ever.
Shad Fact: Shad tried to play the game Billiards, but on his first attempt at a "break" the cue ball ended up some where in the Arctic sea.
I thought it'd've hit Pluto's heart?
Blesemy! It should have reached the depths of space!!!
@@mme.veronica735 That was probably the 2nd attempt
@@9051team you mistake therr meaning. The artic sea they are referring to is an area of Neptune towards the southern hemisphere which is a surprisingly bright shade of blue, and not the sea surrounding the North Pole.
And thus, the first narwal was created.
You know, this is very similar to heart patterns in the medieval period. Today it’s seen mostly as a ‘feminine’ thing whereas in the medieval period it was seen as a cool pattern... just look at its use on Gothic style armor!... also, that background is still amazing, keep up the good work Shad!!!
Hearts are used differently today than they were then. I don't think anyone finds the 'hearts' of historical armour even by modern sensibilities as particularly feminine.
I have found that I appreciate the heart shape much more after hearing one supposed origin of the heart shape having a much more... masculine origin - particularly when turned upside down!
@@felixfeliciano7011 Thank you. You've ruined love hearts for me forever. :)
We still have men's coats that are quite long. Haven't seen anyone complaining about their unwieldiness, although truth be told, most of us don't have to get on a horse daily
Long coats just keep you warmer
Trenchcoats are the ideal winter wear.
In winter I always love to wear my trenchcoat, can't be the only one!
I ride a horse a lot, and i wear a trench coat a lot while riding so it doesn't really get in the way because it often goes over the horses ass
@@wendigo1619 modern coats restrict movement a lot. For aethetic reason the sleeves are pointed downwards, If you lift your arms, eather all the rest of coat goes up, or you tear it.
Thank you for making this video. Not exactly related to long menswear of the middle ages, but I typically wear dresses that are mid thigh to slightly below the knee in length over leggings, and people randomly assume they would get in the way for some reason. They really don't as long as the skirt flares enough for a full range of leg movement like you said, and as long as the material's sturdy enough you can wear them for all kinds of stuff like running, hiking, working with livestock, gardening, and yardwork. The one drawback I've noticed with longer dresses that go below the knee, is that they can be a bit of pain to crawl around in if you have to crawl on your hands and knees. As a short person with short arms, an object rolls under something large, I usually have to crawl under what ever it is to get it out. If you're wearing something below the knee, even if it's appropriately flared, you still have to try and roll it up out of the way or you'll basically step on it when crawling. You can still crawl and all, it's just annoying.
"Men didn't wear dreases... exluding wizards." I love that you added that disclaimer!
...
I would like to add that preists and bishops also had dress like vestiments and robes too sometimes.
...
Preists having mostly white or earthtones. robes, and mages having bright collors, expecially blue, red, or purple.
Priests still wear dress like vestments in many places, the cassock is still very much part of the modern catholic church
I'm sorry to disappoint you, but mages didn't exist in medieval history. Also, Christian priests-clerics still do wear robes/dresses.
@@helgenlane *Merlin WOULD like to know your location, except he already does*
@@zacharybrown5325 well, if something is called a "wizard", but it doesn't possess any qualities of a wizard, then it's not actually a wizard but something different.
But you are right, mages did exist, although not the magic ones.
@@zacharybrown5325 I have no idea what the fuck you are talking about. First of all, it was just a joke and you are finding some meaning that never existed. Secondly, I clearly do make a distinction between terms "wizard" and "mage".
I don't know how you missed it, but the original post wasn't talking about real actual history, so I said something obvious, which meant "that's not how it works irl". Are you trying to say that people can shoot fireballs from their hands? No. Then why are you even arguing if your logic doesn't contradict anything I said? I even corrected my misuse of the word "mage".
Now guess why most people dislike people who talk about occultism and mythology. (Hint: they act like you do instead of acting like normal decent people)
Shad, watching you do high kicks with a sword while wearing a dress has made my day infinitely better, thank you.
Funnily enough, men were also the first to wear high heels and make them fashionable, before women wore or used them
Don't forget the lace
I’m also pretty sure at one point butchers wore them to not get blood on their shoes. I may be wrong, as such is on the internet
@@the_void996 Maybe to make them taller? Give those under 6' guys a chance?
Like the 'dresses' they were different than modern feminine wear. Modern female dress is designed to shape specifically to a female's frame.
@@7dayspking In addition, modern high heels are to make women look taller, whereas medieval high heels weren't as thin and were for practical use.
Lockdown seems to have turbocharged Shad. Can we have a medieval garment sewing demonstration? Moat making techniques?
I second that
@@dturner6332 Thirded!
I second the moat
I made a denim tunic. Still working on a hood for it but it came out well for the first article of clothing I've ever sewn on my own.
Shad needs to demonstrate the difficulties of fighting in a hoop skirt.
"Dresses are just fashionable!" Although it was quite a funny joke, it's actually true, I can totally imagine my main character from my book wearing one. Also, as I've been searching for historical clothing, I can't wait for your next video! Let the mind molding begin, Shad!
If you're interested in historical dress I would look into Bernadette Banner, or Morgan Donner. They are two UA-camrs how focus on historical costuming and dress history. Morgan Donner would probably have more videos relevant to medieval times but Bernadette is just delightful.
I’ve been trying to find some people talking about proper medieval clothing too, so thanks. :)
its not a dress..... its a kilt..... an abnormally long kilt....
They call it a kilt because that's what happened to the last person who called it a dress. :)
Kilts are very specific style of garment. Fun note great kilts were designed the way they were to alsobe able to make a tent out of.
@@gaberielpendragon with the amount of fabric... ye... could probably semi comfortably fit two people to
@@gaberielpendragon maybe it's an old joke, but I really enjoyed it, thanks
@@gaberielpendragon They call it a kilt because it's pleated (kilted) and they're speaking Scots rather than Gaelic, which means they're probably not actually wearing a kilt.
The people that actually wore kilts, historically, called it "am féileadh beag" (the little wrap) for the little kilt, or "am breacan féilidh" (the wrapped motley) for the great kilt. In the 18th century, the former was borrowed into Scots and English as "philabeg".
Fun fact: great kilts aren't Medieval, they emerged in the Renaissance (1580s-1590s), and the little kilt in the latter part of the 1600s.
@@gaberielpendragon ty, a kilt, is not a robe, not a dress, and definately not a skirt.
Gambason nope never been seen or heard of especially on this channel
Modern fashion completely ignores men. This is what we want to wear. It's a discrimination
Yes. Thank You.
You have a mistake. No need in "S" in word "mens".
I am just trying to help, not anything else.
Lowkey yeah , I mostly wear what ever I think looks good a dress tho haven’t gotten the Ball that aye 😅
We'll give you dresses if you give us functioning pockets.
@@mythlover20 Man, so true. Girls never get pockets! Give me pockets!!!
"We've been through this. It's a HARP, and you KNOW it"
"Oh right. That's a harp. And that's a dress."
"*ROBE.*"
Wonderful movie
@@churchboy4609 Which one? I think I might have seen it, don't remember.
@@eteren0 emperor's new groove.
@@Al-ir6vb Thank you. Have actually seen it, quite a few times.
I wish I could like this more than once!
One could easily argue that these would actually be beneficial in fights
The legs are fully obscured by them and without the leg split you cannot see, at a glance, the opponents leg movements with the same level of certainty
Shouldn't even be a question for anyone who has practiced aikido, kendo, or some other martial art while wearing a hakama.
@Bilbo Fappins Why would you something so brave, yet so controversial?
@Bilbo Fappins At least kendo is, so the sentence is valid anyway.
Or anyone who's done martial arts in a skirt.
Today's hakama are mostly the split type, so they're technically wide pants, though skirt-style variants also exist.
Also, funnily enough, they evolved from being mostly worn by (court-) women as undergarments to later being mostly worn by men. This includes the samurai, who wore the split variant almost exclusively, to ease riding (just like many long European garments got cuts for the same purpose). Nowadays they're not worn much anymore, safe for some traditional festivals/sports or vocations (As far as those go, it seems to be mostly disconnected from gender though).
Western clothing has almost completely replaced traditional styles in more everyday capacities, though I guess one could mention yukata when talking about men in dresses :)
@@Orochimarufan1900 So... basically the samurai are wearing women's underwear as their main clothing? ;)
As a former goth kid and someone who's been in fights both wearing a skirt and pants, I'll pick a skirt to fight in any day over a pair of jeans.
To be fair, jeans are remarkably restrictive if not tailored right or made of an elastic fabric.
Even my dress slacks allow me more movement than most jeans.
THANK YOU! I'm so sick of fantasy or historical fiction women complaining that their skirts restrict their movements. I've climbed mountains, kicked open doors, and done all sort of things in a skirt with out any inconvenience. True the modern pencil skirt does not allow this. But peasant, basic pleated, or princess seamed skirts, ankle length or shorter, in no way encumber a person's movements.
Quick notes on hoop skirts from the amateur dress historian! "Hoop skirt" is actually a somewhat broad term. There are many different kinds, and they come from different periods. The earliest hoop skirt that I know of is the farthingale. Farthingales came into fashion during the Italian Renaissance, and it's basically a normal skirt with 3-4 hoops of some light and flexible material (cane, baleen, etc.,) sewn into the bottom half. This causes the over skirts to stand out in a sort of cone shape. Variations of the same idea are scene all the way up the the 18th century, where it sort of dissapeared. But hoop skirts had not breathed their last. The crinoline was invented in the late 1850's. It was more of a dome shape, and its hoops were made of thin spring steel. These were suspended by this fabric strips called "tapes", making a light and flexible skirt support that collapsed like an accordion when it was taken off. Hoops are not as unwieldy as most people seem to thing them, but they probably would very difficult to fight effectively in. Happy watching everybody!
From my experience in the SCA, another advantage of wearing a dress/tunic/whatever is that they wear out much more slowly than pants do. Your movement puts a lot of stress on a pair of pants and very little on a dress/tunic/whatever.
What's SCA? Society for Creative Anachronism?
@@Technotoadnotafrog Yes.
This is what to consider in science-fiction: Culture, such as fashion, will change.
I think the term “Tunic” is sort of similar to how we use the term “Coat” or “jacket” today. There are dozens & dozens of types of Coats & jackets, But we still use the same term for all of them.
Shad, you don't know how long I've waited for a more detailed video on clothing in Shadiversity. Thank you!
The Virgin Shirt VS The Chad Male Dress
That would be The Shad Male Dress
We need to create a petition to bring back medieval costumes into fashion.
Since fashion is descriptive (reflecting what is/was used/worn), as opposed to prescriptive (defining what should be used/worn), all you need is to start wearing the things.
@@muche6321 Just what was going to say
Isnt the idea of a dress derived from 'dress' as in clothes in general. We all still get dressed and undressed regardless of who you are classwise. The only reason a dress is understood to be a female garment is because I suppose it went out fashion as pants became more popular with males. The word dress in old english is 'put straight', im guessing because its going to be a fairly straight stitch compared to a complex pant design as you said.
I love having loose moving clothing in combat. It obfuscates my body from my opponent :D
This is very interesting. I’m writing a book set in the 1100s and after tons of research I realized none of my characters were wearing what I thought they were wearing 😂
What did you think they were wearing at first? :'D
I myself realised my ocs in the 13th century and up were going to get real familiar with everything BUT pants.
ElvinGearMaster Irma haha, same here. I had a Scottish character who was going to wear a kilt...until I found out kilts as we know them weren’t a thing until about 500 years later 😬
@@tamangelinart The Romans had short dresses/togas and would put leather hanging strips as protection around and a breastplate on their chest. But I think they had to make changes to their uniform when they came to England as they were always moaning about the cold in their letters home. The big treat of the day was the hot bath at the end of their shift.
For anyone who still has doubts about wearing them in combat, consider this.
I live in Pennsylvania Dutch country.
Amish ladies will perform all sorts of strenuous, physical labor, every day, in an ankle length dress.
Labor is not fighting, they're not even related. See what happens when a laborer fights a fighter.
@@7dayspking
The laborer is mass slammed and throws small rocks at the pikemen?
@@7dayspking And? It´s not like the point was that the amish ladies would kick your ass. The point was that dress didn´t restrict their movement while working, so it probably wouldn´t even when worn by a fighter. (Hell depending on the labor it might even require wider range of movement than fighting.)
@@sojtus8681 Thank you. At least somebody gets it.
@ Of course the resistance is the issue. The potential existance of restriction of movement is the whole point of this conversation.
How is what you wrote in any way relevant to that topic?
(For that matter, what the hell was even supposed to be your point? People get sweaty when they work?
Also "worth the trouble to accomodate".... how/for/in what?)
Night at the Museum 2:
"Why are you wearing a dress?"
"This isn't a dress, it's a tunic, it was in fashion 3000 years ago"
When I first started wearing my casual kilt, I thought:
"Bifurcated leggings are the biggest mistake against comfort in human history!"
Couldn’t agree more. I haven’t worn the fabric leg torture tubes in a month. Kilts for the win.
As far as I'm aware, pants and leggings came out of the nomadic horsemen for wearing on horseback before they developed the saddle
@@kotanightshade8989 pants came from central-eastern sources, but we don't know if it was the city living persians or the nomadic horsemen that did it first. admittedly nomads sounds more likely but we don't know for sure.
For LARP I like wearing my goblin war-skirt. One of the combat benefits is that it makes it harder for my opponent to tract my footwork.
I tried to use the sword in several types of "dresses" and "skirts" and it is usually the modern stuff that gets in your way... But even the medieval versions had their limitations when it came to length... add a few centimeters and try to walk the stairs... You will "enjoy" youself very much. Broad or not. The same thing is with fighting in an uneven terrain. You can easily step on the back side. So, just a few comments from a woman :-D
I've never stepped on my own skirt going up stair but then again I also pick up the front by several cm if I'm in a hurry. Walking backwards in one is fine if you're a weirdo like me and kick the back up before planting your foot 😅 most of my weight is bared by the ball and toes of my foot when I walk so they meet the ground first so I usually don't catch my dress anyway. I understand that's not normal though.
@@savannahrae9122 I am actually very clumsy... And yes, the point is - you have to grab your skirt when walking the stairs... It's impractical :-D I have actually made myself my own design ao I don't have to deal with these problems any more... Still needs a bit of work, but the front is fine :-D
@@veronika.rel.wiesner ah yeah clumsyness does make it worse. Not going to lie I think picking up the dress when going up stairs looks so elegant to me I love it 😍 but for free movement for working fields or other high movement activities an ankle length is plenty good enough if you're already fine with long skirts.
@@savannahrae9122 I personally am for skirts that reach about the half of your calf, but that's personal preference... Another annoying thing with long skirts are people behind you, who tend to step on them. Meh. It's really a shame, cos' I quite like wearing skirts... and shooting bow... and fencing...
Kendo uniforms are a good example of dress-like clothing being used in combat and not getting in the way
These videos are very much enlightening regarding the medieval period. It's always a delight to watch them. Never learned so much about the period before, cheers.
Yer his videos are always very informative
I love how you never stop. You're relentless. I love your energy. Thank you, good sir. You are a treasure.
You're a wizard harry!
NO! I'M JUST YOUR AVARAGE MEDIVAL PERIOD MAN!
“A lot of times you could just not wear any thing underneath”
*scottish music intensifies*
I've worn a yukata in Japan on more than one occasion, and that's technically a dress as well but the ones I wore were obviously cut for men. And I really liked wearing them! In general, I appreciate long clothes (worst part about summer is that I can't wear my coat). That "dresses" fell out of fashion for men is something I consider a damn shame. I mean, you look really good in that surcoat! But if you were to wear a dress cut for a woman, well... it'd probably look comical.
I remember reading somewhere that the length of one's clothing was also a sign of one's wealth and prestige, because mostly only the nobility and clergy could afford enough fabric for really long garments. Not sure how accurate that is though so feel free to correct me!
Also, I don't think any common peasant would want to wear a long dress every day while tilling crops, digging, doing construction work
kinda. That was true only for garments longer than ankle length. For example, medieval noblewomen in the 12th-14th centuries often wore floor length houpelandes. These had to be lifted when walking, so you wouldn't trip. Obviously, that's very much a status statement. Trains on dresses also started to be used in the 1500s. Again, that's obviously a status statement. Whether someone wore an ankle length or knee length garment though, was a matter of preference and current fashion: not so much status.
This question of "fighting dresses" makes me think of the hakama worn in eastern Asian cultures. These are the very wide bottom garments that are trousers, with two separate legs, but are so wide that they appear to be a long, pleated skirt. These were worn by Samurai men, and are still worn today in Japanese martial arts like Kendo, Aikido and Judo. They allow for both the freedom of movemen and leg protection of trousers, but the wide, flowing material is also said to help obscure the fighter's leg and foot movements during combat.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hakama
For the past 8 years or so I really began delving into my Slavic/Baltic heritage and part of that I started researching the clothing of my ancestors. The people of Eastern Europe were slower to adopt the fashion of Central/Western Europe so by the time the Renaissance started in the bulk of Europe the majority of Slavs and Balts were still using the remnants of medieval Europe. Clothing such as embroidered undershirts, zupans, kontuszes and delia's were still fairly prevalent in the 16th, 17th and 18 centuries. Of course it goes without saying that the nobles were quicker to pick up the fashion trends, especially those of the royal court.
It's not just about it being easier, it's also about it being a lot more cost efficient, you can pass down dresses much easier than pants, and they're much easier to resew. One of the reasons we don't have a lot of historical dresses pr. say is because they were very usually just resewn into new ones. Pants and more "specified" pieces of clothing, so a bit harder to resew.
EDIT: Also feel like it's important to correct some of the things you say about hoop-skirts. They're not made out of a wooden frame, they're made out of whale-teeth, which is Extremely flexible. (what we call boning) sure it gives a larger frame area, but it isn't hard to move in. The thing that would really say something about how great it would be in combat would be the length, that and if it got stuck in something. I know one of the pictures you're using is from Priorattire, and she actually made a video about her moving about in the big bell crinolines, which is a step up from just panniers or pocket hoops. She also talks about the corset etc. which have been getting a bad rep, interesting watch for sure :>
But they are universally depicted wearing pants, so the 'dress' is not an alternative to that. Not that men seem to be typically depicted wearing full length robes, more just above the knee with full length robes being more prominent on religious or political figures and before the 14th century.
"She also talks about the corset etc."
Oh. Seems interesting. Can you please link it? It would be nice.
@@7dayspking the "pants" are most likely a pair of stockings or hose.
No need in links, i found it. Thanks for saying about that!
@@7dayspking He shows images through out this video of men wearing dress like clothing that extendes beyond the knee, most images shown show it going beyond the knee.
0:53 There are 2 men on the right with it reaching just above the ankles, and one on the left that is appears he has pulled up to above the knee while he is working. And the guy on the left also appears to not be wearing pants.
1:02 We again see 3 men with it reaching there ankles, with nothing that clearly shows anyone wear it above the knee.
1:10 Ignoring the people who look to be priests, at least 2 of them have it reaching just below the knee, with another 2 not wearing pants.
1:49 This one is clearly from latter in them medieval period, as is obvious from how high the hem is on the furthest left guy, even so the guy to the far right is wearing his below the knee and isn't wearing pants.
3:36 2 men on the right side, one going to the ankles, the other mid-calf
4:36 Man on the left has it covering the knees, which is not above the knee, and the other looks to be hanging a little below the knees
6:49 The 2 men on the left both have it reaching to just below the knees
While I am sure I can find more examples bot in this video and else where, I am too tired to continue going through
We still use dress in all other context generically. you get dressed, you put on a dress shirt or dress uniform. etc. you put on your "best dress" (best clothes)
Technically they're more like robes but yeah. In fact, you can see similar garments today. Many more traditional Catholic priests, and most bishops, will wear a robe-like garment called a cassock.
@@Vivi2372 lol then your bathrobe is a dress, your pants are just long shorts and, your socks are just soft shoes.
thought that said bascock...
Depends on the specific type of garment, some types of houppelande are more robe like, being more voluminous and meant to be worn over other clothing as an outer garment, but others are literally the same regardless of the gender wearing it, like the kirtle, which is more specifically defined as a dress.
Well, etymologically, the English word "robe", is just the French word "robe". Which is the French word for dress. And for robe. Because in French you use the same word for both. Because it's the same thing.
knghtcmdr Right you are. Real priests were cassocks.
I remember seeing something about how women who fight have said the issue with large ball gowns is usually the sleeves, not the skirts which restrict their movements.
Shad in a dress. We didn’t know it, but we needed this.
A benefit that might be gained from wearing a sircoat in combat is the fact it obscures targets below the waist, making attacks intended to trip an opponent less likely to succeed.
This is very interesting!
One of the combat benefits of the Japanese Hakama was that its large dress-like legs could conceal movements of the wearer.
Now i can crossdress without my parents throwing me out...
I know this is a joke but I feel sorry for people who have such parents :c
I have been wearing a short tunic for about a year.(It was my grandmother's)
But then you wouldn't truly be crossdressing then
Pumps and a mini-skirt is not battle attire.
@@bjorn301 Depends on the type of battle your fighting.
Hell yes! I wear monk's robes whenever I go LARPing, and I'm as fast and agile as anybody. It never gets in the way. A long sleeveless gambeson on top and longsword in hand, and I'm a whirling dealer of fake death. I'm also practicing Montante drills in order to get better. Plus, the access to air really helps me keep cool, even in summer.
I actually have experience skirmishing in something similar to what you're wearing! It wasn't quite as voluminous, but at no point in daily activities did it feel in any way restrictive. BUT THEN during combat, it didn't hamper me most of the time, however, almost every time I tried to retreat out of range by stepping backwards, my heel would catch on the back hem and trip me. The garment didn't reach the ground; it would just catch on my foot as I lifted it and put it back down, and although I never got hit in spite of it, it could have cost me my life on the battlefield. Just a personal anecdote.
I didn't even know this was a point of discussion. Who doesn't know this already?
Imagine if these dressing styles became a thing again
Everyvody's wearing short pants and weird sweater shirts nowadays.
I wish it Would
If they made them with air conditioning I gladly wear them.
@@GODAXEN They basically provide air conditioning. I wear monk's robes while LARPing, generally at the height of summer, and even though they are black, even the slightest breeze helps cool much more than pants do.
So, next autumns fashion?
Yes, yes, YES!
As a professional skirt/dress wearer (I wear them every single day, and have since I was a child) I can confirm that they are NOT detrimental to one's mobility - I will grant that it does depend on cut and type of material, of course. But with enough width, and a material that doesn't fly in your face at the slightest puff of wind or cling to your legs, you can do anything in a full length skirt/dress.
I have ran, swam, gymmed, skated, gone skiing, played horse (on both two and four legs), ridden actual horses and done a bunch of other activities in skirts - none of them had splits either. And yes, skirts keep the heat in very well.
Thank you! It's so refreshing to hear someone not used to dresses state that they are perfectly fine to move around in.
I'm so tired of the old, "How can you move, you're wearing a dress!" argument.
I write characters who wear skirts/dresses everyday and ride horses and fight and whatnot, specifically because of this misconception.
makes me think of fantasy robes
edit: also the japanese hakama, worn by samurai
Man Shad I am so excited for the one Million, I have been a fan since before 100k, I think. It has been such a pleasure watching you climb and rise, I am sure it is simply amazing to think back from the beginning to what your channel has become for you. I am so proud of you already and I don't even know you or live in your country. Anyways. Soon!
the times when I've been in plays and things that might be gonsidered "period pieces" I've thoroghly enjoyed dressing in long flowing clothes. Bring back male dresses!
In Japanese Kendo the Hakama and Kendo-gi looks like a dress. Of course it too has a purpose: to mask your foot work so that the enemy can not easily guess your fighting stance or position.
We may think it looks funny now, but back then it can really give you an edge (pardon the pun) in combat.
Thanks for sharing the lols as well as the great info, Shad! Great video!
We're men, we're men in dresses.
We roam around the forest looking for messes.
You forgot to mention kilts and robes. There was a heraldic encyclopedia at my school (this was decades ago so I don't have access any more to give the exact title of the publication, sadl) that contained a quote from a knight stating that he was fond of getting robes in tribute because they were great for dealing with drafts when he visited certain cathedrals.
As someone who comes more from the realm of unarmed combat, a dress like that does impose certain differences in how one would fight, but it is still quite possibe to fight wearing one. Kicks would be slightly different, as there is a slighly higher chance of tangling your feet in the fabric than wearing pants, though I don't think it would change too drastically. The biggest issue I can think of would be stances. In unarmed fighting, many styles take advantage of lower stances than you normally see in armed combat, and a garment as long as the one Shad is wearing would probably drag the ground in some of those stances, increasing the chances of tripping. Also, when your garment drags the ground, your opponent could possibly step on it to limit your mobility, rather than grab it. None of this says that you can't fight while wearing this kind of clothing, just that you'd have to fight differently. I guess this is why you almost never see this kind of garment being worn by fighters that use these kinds of techniques (though these fighting styles normally don't come out of the European tradition, but are more often found in South- and East-Asian fighting arts). Wrestling and other grappling arts, however? Yes, this would be highly inconvenient, given how often one would use their legs to grapple an opponent in most of those fighting styles.
TL;DR: This kind of garment wouldn't affect most known HEMA styles (almost as if they were developed assuming this was just what people wore) or a lot of armed combat styles in general, but other combat styles could be more affected; A.K.A., don't wear a dress to a wrestling match.
Surprised Shad didn't mention one major advantage of flared 'dress-like' garb during armed combat, something modern Kendo users still emphasize: a large flowing 'skirt' (or puffy pants like in Kendo) helps conceal your footwork, making it harder for your opponent to anticipate your movements.
No joke now I want such a ,,dress" xDD
There are very simple patterns for tunics/kirtles online, just adjust the length according to your preference.
do it.
I edit my novel every time one of your videos comes out.
That dress looks comfy as hell tho
You showed Izabel from PriorAttire! My life is complete!
Love the title thank you for your hard work keep it up shad, #respectthedress
Another great video that helps me understand Medieval times! Thanks Shad!
At the risk of sounding gay, I wish men could wear dresses or kilts without being weird in the public eye. Imagine how comfortable it would feel.
-i've not watched the video through yet- while i know larp isnt a direct comparison to real combat, the majority of my characters wear dresses or skirts. the increased manoeuvrability in combat is very advantageous and they're also incredibly comfortable.
-having now watched the video- many garments of the period would have been pieced together anyway, so the use of gores to give more flare (while i understand this was more the style in late saxon/ early norman era, it stands to reason that it would continue into medieval periods, the cut of Shad's overcoat suggests this also) combine this with the fabrics being much denser than modern, machine woven counterparts, and you have a flared skirt which would keep out of the way of the wearer.
great video as always
Though those dresses/tunics are a liability when floor vents are involved!
I'm so using this video in my argument to make my husband wear more historically authentic clothing to the Sherwood Forest Faire next year.
Aye, but we called them kilts. Wore one at my wedding, no sword though.
@JohanMDK Careful that's now the wife, the monster part. The ravenous part is the kid.
A kilt is a skirt, not a dress though. A for effort though.
They gave me a knife but it was fake, it’s like they wanted be to die in combat
@@starcraft2own Depends on how short your legs are. But Shad was right, nice and warm. Got the family tartan but wore the Gordon in the Army.
@@gavinmcintosh7022 No you're misunderstanding. A dress covers the entire body, a skirt is for the lower body only, you dont wear a shirt with a dress but you would be topless with a skirt.
So no matter how short your legs are the kilt is a skirt, not a dress.. unless you're implying someones legs are so short that the kilt would be right below their arms.
EDIT: That's really interesting, i didn't know there was different names for the patterns. Thank you for telling me that!
The Japanese used the flaring on their kimono pants to mask footwork, so it actually aids combat in a duel setting.
8:01 Shad: Dresses are fashionable
New fashion collection for summer and autumn 2020, presented by Shad Brooks
I’d refrain from saying “taking my sword out now” while wearing a dress.
..........And dance whenever able
also, It's only a model behind
We do routines
In Saudi Arabia this “ dress “ didn’t go out of fashion, but it transitioned into different types and different specifications, to make a Thob (always white and has a rectangular shape) for professional wear, And a Qamis (can be different colors and has rectangular shape) for casual wear, but a dress (can be different colors and most of the time has hourglass shape)
TLDR: In Saudi Arabia yes a dress is the only manly clothing 👍
I wish modern fashion focused on these again.
1:39
*Back in the days, when "Vault-Tec" was called "Keep-Tec"^^*
THOU HAST A CASTLE????!!!
He actually made a video about it too, somewhere on his channel anyway
It even has machicolations. No dragons though :(
@@Bilbosilius_Zwackelbaggins He could get a pet lizard with the name dragon in it and have it listen to a Sabaton song.
@JohanMDK Liar. On this channel it is very much a sex thing
5:36
"Bliaut"
I can feel my inner slav fighting to get out.
English is weird. You can drink a drink and dress in a dress and plant corns of corn to get more corns of corn.
And this sentence is in fact an actual sentence with meaning: "Police police police police police police."
I do think I get a connection here when I've watched a bit of wuxia films years ago, and the Ruroni Kenshin film recently, to know that wearing long flowy robes don't impede one's combat.