Orca VS. Great White: E2: Deep Dive into Locations and Frequency of these Events
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- Опубліковано 3 сер 2024
- Episode 2 in the series.
00:00 Were you right about where you thought the Sophia footage was filmed?
01:00 Many news outlets are getting the public confused with Sophia in Baha and the orcas in South Africa.
01:50 This is NOT the first time this has happened. Not even close. Not the first time it has been witnessed. Not the first time a solo white shark has taken out a white shark. Not the first time orcas have removed the liver and left the rest. It is concerning that South African scientists are so anxious to make the news that they are publishing incorrect data. The Farallon incidents and the Baha incident all took place before the Mossel Bay incident that is in the news.
02:24 The first documented incident at the Farallon Islands in 1997 proves all three of the above wrong in itself. A few years later orcas killed another white shark at the Farallones, making it two cases of orcas preying on white sharks at that location alone well before these other incidents.
04:00 In EVERY case reported of white sharks being killed by orcas there have been multiple orcas present. No orca has even been truly hunting alone in these reported cases. Sometimes the whales gang up on the shark an sometimes only one in the group engages in the killing, but no orca has been alone.
04:27 Why am bothering to point this out? Because it has been suggested that the orcas labeled as "rogue" in South Africa, Port and Starboard, are possibly teaching other orcas to kill white sharks and even how to kill them in a one on one manner. This is based on incorrect and incomplete evidence. It is flat out wrong. It almost seems like fear-mongering focused at the orcas as being a threat to the marine ecology there.
05:00 The same scientists condemning the orcas were assembled by the South African government to present evidence that the fishing industry is NOT to blame, but the orcas are. When sharks have friends like this, who needs enemies?
05:50 Are you aware of the other scientists who don't agree with this data?
06:00 Begin the deep dive into all the locations this has happened and when. California, Mexico, Australia, South Africa, and likely New Zealand. Out of these, how many times did one orca do the killing?
08:00 4/5 places where white sharks and orcas are known to both frequent has had a documented case of orcas killing white sharks.
09:43 With the evidence available, do you think orcas do this more often than we are aware or is it as rare as the documented cases?
10:15 Why have we seen this more in South Africa?
11:45 The killer whale that killed the white shark at the Farallones was a transient, meaning it hunted marine mammals, not fish. Yet it killed the white shark on the spot as if it new exactly what it was doing.
12:39 Remember, the majority of the cases of white sharks that have apparently been killed by orcas were NOT witnessed, but are based on finding carcasses washed up on shore. This limits what we know about how the killing took place or even if some cases were scavenging events.
13:00 Will humans acknowledge their own role in changing the condition of the ocean and consequently the behavior of the animals in it?
Several more episodes are coming in this series. The entire series can be viewed at this playlist:
• Orca VS. Great White
#shark #orca #whiteshark #killerwhale #predation #port #starboard #sophia #portandstarboard #roguewhale #greatwhite #southafrica #mosselbay - Домашні улюбленці та дикі тварини
I would agree with you on multiple fronts. 1. Us having drones and more cameras let's us see this more. 2. I do agree sometimes, the orca sees a white shark and decides to kill it for food because it happened to be there. And 3. It could be a response to a multiple of things. I don't think it happens as often as people are saying, but it does happen
First time I saw anything of it was in the film Orca the killer whale with Richard Harris but I'm betting it's happening from the dawn of time
I remember that movie!!
This was worth the wait. Can't wait for part 3
Love watching your videos Skylar Thomas! U and your team does such an amazing job with these shark's. And thank you so much for what you do for them. Keep up with the great work man! 😃 💙💙💙 Continue to keep reeling in some more videos for us fans 😃🙂✌️👍🥰
That's very kind of you. I wish i had a team....
I highly encourage you to watch this one if you have not. ua-cam.com/video/UHd3VdbkTHE/v-deo.htmlsi=2QebUPgExSH2ifbw
@Whitesharkvideo Thank you so much. I will watch it. And thank you for the website 😊 You're the best Skylar from one of your fans from Las Vegas. 🙂👌 👍Have you ever done videos on Thresher 🦈's ? They're so adorable and their cute little faces especially their tails 😍 Thresher shark's are one of my most all time greatest and favorite shark's 💙💙💙💙 I also followed you on Instagram and Facebook a few weeks ago.
Fascinating subject. There was an alleged report in the 1990s I believe where a fisherman apparantely witnessed a large great white shark attacking an estranged young orca. I have not been able to track down the newspaper article yet, but it wouldn't surprise me if that also happens. Given the opportunity, I see no reason why a large white shark wouldn't do that.
Cheers.
I believe it was off San Francisco by the way.
No location. No additional footage. Something is very fishy about these orca attack videos. No pun. Great legwork though!
What do you mean by no location?
The orcas seem to make short work of the white sharks when compared to the very drawn out process of killing a whale or seal, so the window of opportunity to get footage is small.
I have to question the second Farallones case (the first one is obviously real) as I’ve not seen any mention of it even in academic publications published well after it had supposedly happened, and there don’t seem to be any observations of it either.
Speaking of the Farallons, the first (and definite) case where a transient killed a GWS involved a juvenile GWS being attracted to a sea lion the orcas had killed earlier, so the transients were still there to hunt their usual prey: it might even have started off as a defensive behaviour (guarding the kill) rather than predation.
And it’s fucking ridiculous how this entire brain vs. brawn narrative of smart and “weak” orcas beating “big and dumb” sharks originated when orcas are not only much larger, but when the entire idea they use tonic immobility is based on extremely limited data due to the attacks not being observed or not showing the behaviour.
Good comments.
Responding to your first point. In my uncut interview with the boat captain working the whale and shark boats at the Farallones, he refers to a second killing during which they didn’t witness the kill but were alerted by the birds. Peter Pyle, resident white shark scientist at the Farallones, took a tissue sample from the carcass where the orcas were feeding and determined it was a white shark. To your point, this tissue sampling does not appear in any publications, yet I find it weird that Mick would make up a story with such specific details.
ua-cam.com/video/ZgeG-DfNeCw/v-deo.html
Regardless of if we include that example, white sharks have temporarily fled the Farallones multiple times since that date. This publication states that none of their tagged sharks seemed to have been killed in any of those three exoduses, but they couldn’t rule out that an untagged shark might have been killed. Either way there’s a clear correlation of white sharks responding to orca presence.
Here’s a quote and a link to the publication.
“Acoustic tag detections documented the abrupt and consistent flight of white sharks from SEFI in 2009, 2011, and 2013 (Figs 3 and SI). In the best-documented instance, killer whales from two separate pods (offshore and transient ecotypes; Table 1) arrived at SEFI on November 2, 2009, when 17 previously tagged white sharks were present. Killer whales were present at SEFI for just over 2.5 hours between 12:48 and 15:30 local time, remained on the western side of SEFI during approach and initiated three separate killing bouts on pinnipeds, then departed to the north. There were no observations of direct predation on white sharks, and all tagged animals were later confirmed alive through acoustic detections; still predations on untagged white sharks could not be ruled out.”
www.whitesharkvideo.com/uploads/8/6/9/8/869848/s41598-019-39356-2.pdf
Point 2. In 1997, I agree that it was likely a case of defending the kill, which I think warrants a deeper discussion on the ease with which an orca can kill a white shark if it can do it for any number of motivations.
Point 3. I certainly don't think white sharks are dumb and haven't said so. And I agree that the tonic immobility hypothesis is premature and likely wrong and yes, is based on very little data. The shark is pretty much already f'd at the point that it appears to be flipped over. Looks more like a dead body simply rolling over.
@@Whitesharkvideo
The big issue with that study is they assume predation when the orcas present are mammal-hunting transients; if predation was why orca presence deterred sharks it would be more reasonable if it was the Offshore ecotype (which do eat sharks) that were involved.
That, and that 1997 case goes against the idea of great whites being afraid of orcas since that particular shark wouldn’t have tried to steal an orca kill if it was.
My point re: intelligence is that media report love to play into false stereotypes by invariably hyping it up as “brains beats dumb muscle”, when intelligence isn’t why orcas can kill GWS (even if they do have a smaller-than-usually-assumed intelligence advantage); a massive size advantage is. That’s not only harmful to public understanding of these interactions, it’s also actively harmful to sharks as a whole and hampers conservation efforts as well.
Can't wait for the ep 3, really want to go deeper about this topic because I hate when people only know about Orca is the apex predator, don't just think about that, the shifting or displacement of predator in our ocean mean something is not right about our ocean right now and people have to know about that, don't just think about who's the apex predator
Glad you will be tuning in.
South African fisheries have been turning a blind eye to illegal fishing boats for years. Clearly certain palms are being greased and blaming two transient Orca for decimating a population of sharks that have been living, breeding and feeding there for hundreds of millennia is nonsensical in the extreme.
To have the scientists in on this is unacceptable
Yes, and it’s been bad for a long time. I have an interview with a whistleblower from marine coastal management from all the way back in 2007
its not rare..
It's very rare in the overall scheme of things. 99% of white sharks don't get attacked by orcas and 99% of orcas don't go around attacking great whites.