Still a class time, Will. It’s all about the mental side. I managed to go sub-3 at London but I was on for 2:55, and I saw that slip away for the same reason - I got swept up, pace started spiking, my head went, then my legs went. There was no reason why I couldn’t run 2:55, but on the day it wasn’t there. There’s no reason why you can’t run 2:5X - you’re clearly more than capable - but it’s easy to get swept up in the race. Maybe a quieter, flatter marathon to get one on the board is worth a look - I’ve got no doubt I could’ve gone quicker in that scenario and I’ve got no doubt you can run 2:55-2:59. It’s definitely there!! Go again mate
Appreciate it mate! I would love 2:55 one day! I know I'm gonna get the sub 3 soon, just got to stay focused on the day and this race highlighted the importance of it more than ever. Amsterdam I'm told is really flat so it should make for an epic race for me.
Ey up mate. I'm Sheffield based and new to running. Just wanted to say your videos have been a massive inspiration behind me starting running and trying to get healthier. Keep up the good content and hope you see you at a race one day.
Hey Will - this really spoke to me after having a disappointing run at Newport 2 weeks ago! I definitely suffered from a lack of discipline and to be honest, really poor concentration on the day and it was definitely mental more than physical that caused me to struggle. Lots of lessons learned I think! I had the same thing with pacers too when the 4 hour pacer and pack went past me at between 24.5 - 25 miles and I really tried to keep with them for half a mile before giving up on the idea as my head had already gone before then, but it was like the final straw 😂. I got 4.03 which annoyed me for days but now I'm okay with it and at least i pulled a sprint finish for the last 300 metres or so to salvage some kind of pride and to prove to myself that I did care. I have Copenhagen in 2 weeks and I'm determined to wipe the slate clean and do things better for that. Time to be more positive on the day for me I think , even when things get tough and potentially go wrong. I always try and remind myself that we do marathons out of choice and no one ever forced us to! Really appreciate this video as it echoed so much of the introspection I had after Newport and the honesty I had to force myself to make from that day.
Thanks Chris, Copenhagen sounds good best of luck with it. Let us know how it went. I do wonder if running with the pacer can actually make things worse. One to experiment with I guess.
@@TheWu Yeah, I think I am just going to figure out my strategy on the day. I generally prefer to go on ahead of pacers and just know that they are there if i need them, but I think I could do with sticking with a pacer and pack for the discipline this time. We shall see. Right now i am 4 days into a really awful cold that has knocked me out and so I'm trying not to even think about it! Whatever i do though I am going to enjoy it and will deffo let you know how I got on!
Well run race! Just evaluate the race and the weeks leading up to it and use that to find the weaknesses so you can fill that gap in the next training cycle. That's what progression is all about! You have a great attitude and you will continue improving! Keep pushing!
Hi Will. I think the fact it’s such a near miss when you weren’t at your best is really positive. Remember that when you are feeling better. It should be yours next time. Although I’m not new to running because of the content your video content is really important in helping me prepare for my marathon 4 weeks tomorrow.
Great analysis. I've been guilty of surging at London at about 16 miles. By 21 I was managing cramps. Was able to get through about 5 mins off my target of 2.40. Not a disaster but could have done better. Sounds much like you here.
I feel your pain, it's really hard when you get into that mindset. I even have to ignore when people are passing me at park run and not try to start chasing people down😂😂 maybe your next one you need some music, headphones you can use as back up if you need to zone out?? Don't be so hard I yourself, best of luck👍
Yes, more experience and practice is required and really drill in the mental side of it before my next one. I don't really like using music to run, at most I maybe listen to a podcast but when racing I like to me in my own head.
Almost getting a sub 3 for.marathon you didn't have high expectations for is really good! 4:17, 4:26, 4:324:49 for the last 4km isn't too bad - I'd probably say you were closing on hitting the wall rather than actually hitting it. I've hit the wall twice and you literally cannot even walk forget run.
you performed a lot better then me, i think i hit the wall then a tank ran over me. but i got to the finish. you cant control all the variables on the day unfortunately. well done
A 3hr9s and a 3hr32s, surely you'll be 3rd time lucky next time. I think it's good you had a go in that 27-37k so your not left wondering later what if. So how's the gel belt? Ive seen them but worried I loose some, sounds like it's okay.
It will be 4th time lucky, I had a really bad attempt in York last year. Gel belt is good as it allows me to carry all my other bits in the waist pockets. Very cheap from Decathlon as well.
U need do more harder longruns👍🏻 make ur longruns key workout! Longruns up to 40km .. where u run 15-25km in ur marathon pace in that longruns👍🏻 this is the way to success .. u build up ur longruns from 25 km to 40 km .. and start ru those more harder! And ur body be more comfortable to handling ur marathon pace when ur body be caput!
Yes I have to do more long runs for sure. Although wouldn't long runs reaching 40km be too much for training? Nearly the full marathon distance would require too much recovery time?
@@TheWu you need buil up ur body slowly , 16 weeks training .. where, for example, your long runs become like a staircase 20 25 30 35 38 40 km .. then you shouldn't do a 40 km log run every week .. no more than 2 such sessions .. you should make a long run a key work out .. better to focus on long runs than to do 10-12×1000m intervals .. then the focus should be on long threshold sessions .. 4-5×5km .. but these sessions should also be built like stairs that you start with 2km 3km 5km .. then train... for example on the track 200m and 400m to get extra speed .. it's all about getting comfortable in marathon pace .. how many miles do you train per week? you dont need run extreme weeks to run fast ..all its how u train .. when I ran 2.16 marathon I trained only 140-165 km weekly and had a full-time office job at the same time
When I ran 3:00:09 last year I probably ran 80km to 90km average weekly. I don't think I could even do that these days with the baby at this stage. So you think each week one session would be the speed track like session and then the only other "hard" session would be the long run? The long run would be blocks of threshold? Is that faster than my half marathon pace?
I don’t know. A sign of hitting the wall is a sharp decline in heart rate because your muscles just can’t do it anymore. Your heart rate was still increasing until 41k. You were really only 1k from getting away with the hard push. So muscularly you were only 4.5 minutes off. Sure, you slowed down, but your engine was still revving pretty good. Maybe some caffeine towards the end, waiting 1 more k to start your push, and a better mental focus on how even though your legs feel trashed, your body is able to still push, maybe these were all that you were missing.
Yea possibly, I just knew at 38km my mind was gone so in that sense I hit the wall completely in the mind, but physically I was just bit by by coming to the point I would have had to completely stop. I had caffeine in a couple of gels I think mid way but I also wonder if missing my 5th and 6th gel could have played a part too.
Still a class time, Will. It’s all about the mental side. I managed to go sub-3 at London but I was on for 2:55, and I saw that slip away for the same reason - I got swept up, pace started spiking, my head went, then my legs went. There was no reason why I couldn’t run 2:55, but on the day it wasn’t there. There’s no reason why you can’t run 2:5X - you’re clearly more than capable - but it’s easy to get swept up in the race.
Maybe a quieter, flatter marathon to get one on the board is worth a look - I’ve got no doubt I could’ve gone quicker in that scenario and I’ve got no doubt you can run 2:55-2:59. It’s definitely there!! Go again mate
Appreciate it mate! I would love 2:55 one day!
I know I'm gonna get the sub 3 soon, just got to stay focused on the day and this race highlighted the importance of it more than ever. Amsterdam I'm told is really flat so it should make for an epic race for me.
Ey up mate. I'm Sheffield based and new to running. Just wanted to say your videos have been a massive inspiration behind me starting running and trying to get healthier. Keep up the good content and hope you see you at a race one day.
That's so awesome to hear! Glad you found the content useful. Have you signed up for any upcoming events??
@@TheWu nothing major just yet. Doing my first Parkrun at millhouses next Saturday. We'll see where I go from there 😀
Ah I sometimes go there, but recently more to spectate.
Hey Will - this really spoke to me after having a disappointing run at Newport 2 weeks ago! I definitely suffered from a lack of discipline and to be honest, really poor concentration on the day and it was definitely mental more than physical that caused me to struggle. Lots of lessons learned I think!
I had the same thing with pacers too when the 4 hour pacer and pack went past me at between 24.5 - 25 miles and I really tried to keep with them for half a mile before giving up on the idea as my head had already gone before then, but it was like the final straw 😂. I got 4.03 which annoyed me for days but now I'm okay with it and at least i pulled a sprint finish for the last 300 metres or so to salvage some kind of pride and to prove to myself that I did care.
I have Copenhagen in 2 weeks and I'm determined to wipe the slate clean and do things better for that. Time to be more positive on the day for me I think , even when things get tough and potentially go wrong. I always try and remind myself that we do marathons out of choice and no one ever forced us to!
Really appreciate this video as it echoed so much of the introspection I had after Newport and the honesty I had to force myself to make from that day.
Rooting for you at Copenhagen!
@@dinicti Thank you so much!
Thanks Chris, Copenhagen sounds good best of luck with it. Let us know how it went. I do wonder if running with the pacer can actually make things worse. One to experiment with I guess.
@@TheWu Yeah, I think I am just going to figure out my strategy on the day. I generally prefer to go on ahead of pacers and just know that they are there if i need them, but I think I could do with sticking with a pacer and pack for the discipline this time. We shall see. Right now i am 4 days into a really awful cold that has knocked me out and so I'm trying not to even think about it! Whatever i do though I am going to enjoy it and will deffo let you know how I got on!
Another fantastic video. Your calm demeanor will make this channel grow. Amsterdam is your race Will
Ah Thanks James, really appreciate that.
hi william, another fantastic vid, so very interesting keep them comming
Thanks for the watch.
That was a very admirable effort on race day. You definitely gave it a really good go.
Yes the day had a lot of positives to look back on too! Thanks
Some solid training over the summer and you'll smash sub 3 in Amsterdam 💪🏻
Amsterdam should be epic!
Well run race! Just evaluate the race and the weeks leading up to it and use that to find the weaknesses so you can fill that gap in the next training cycle. That's what progression is all about! You have a great attitude and you will continue improving! Keep pushing!
Exactly that! This race really made me think what to work on for sure.
Great coupe of videos mate. Keep
them coming.
Thanks!
Hi Will. I think the fact it’s such a near miss when you weren’t at your best is really positive. Remember that when you are feeling better. It should be yours next time. Although I’m not new to running because of the content your video content is really important in helping me prepare for my marathon 4 weeks tomorrow.
Thanks! Oh nice, which Marathon are you doing?
@@TheWu Edinburgh. Not the nicest of marathons but will see how it goes.
I think I saw on the Fordy Runs channel when they ran Edinburgh , i remember the didn't like it i think, although can't remember the reason why.
You still smashed it. Me and roll on to Amsterdam. I had 3 gels left aswell my fuelling plan was out of the window
Thanks mate!
Great analysis. I've been guilty of surging at London at about 16 miles. By 21 I was managing cramps. Was able to get through about 5 mins off my target of 2.40. Not a disaster but could have done better.
Sounds much like you here.
Yea it's nice to know it can happen to much better and experienced runners as well! makes me feel a bit better haha!
I feel your pain, it's really hard when you get into that mindset. I even have to ignore when people are passing me at park run and not try to start chasing people down😂😂 maybe your next one you need some music, headphones you can use as back up if you need to zone out?? Don't be so hard I yourself, best of luck👍
Yes, more experience and practice is required and really drill in the mental side of it before my next one. I don't really like using music to run, at most I maybe listen to a podcast but when racing I like to me in my own head.
Almost getting a sub 3 for.marathon you didn't have high expectations for is really good!
4:17, 4:26, 4:32 4:49 for the last 4km isn't too bad - I'd probably say you were closing on hitting the wall rather than actually hitting it. I've hit the wall twice and you literally cannot even walk forget run.
Yea I guess I was just about holding on, but in the context of the goal it was at 38km I hit the wall mentality as I knew it was over.
I stayed in the same hotel, 15th floor too, missed the entrance at first and went through the multi storey😂
It was quiet on the top floor but crap internet signal. It's ok but I'd probably choose somewhere else next time.
@@TheWu indeed the lift was fast though and ar least it was new and clean👍
Was that you I bumped into during the race whilst you were filming?
Yes I didn't realise until after I found your channel mate!
you performed a lot better then me, i think i hit the wall then a tank ran over me. but i got to the finish. you cant control all the variables on the day unfortunately. well done
Thanks, hopefully we learn from this experience so in the end it made us better.
A 3hr9s and a 3hr32s, surely you'll be 3rd time lucky next time. I think it's good you had a go in that 27-37k so your not left wondering later what if. So how's the gel belt? Ive seen them but worried I loose some, sounds like it's okay.
It will be 4th time lucky, I had a really bad attempt in York last year. Gel belt is good as it allows me to carry all my other bits in the waist pockets. Very cheap from Decathlon as well.
U need do more harder longruns👍🏻 make ur longruns key workout! Longruns up to 40km .. where u run 15-25km in ur marathon pace in that longruns👍🏻 this is the way to success .. u build up ur longruns from 25 km to 40 km .. and start ru those more harder! And ur body be more comfortable to handling ur marathon pace when ur body be caput!
Yes I have to do more long runs for sure. Although wouldn't long runs reaching 40km be too much for training? Nearly the full marathon distance would require too much recovery time?
@@TheWu you need buil up ur body slowly , 16 weeks training .. where, for example, your long runs become like a staircase 20 25 30 35 38 40 km .. then you shouldn't do a 40 km log run every week .. no more than 2 such sessions .. you should make a long run a key work out .. better to focus on long runs than to do 10-12×1000m intervals .. then the focus should be on long threshold sessions .. 4-5×5km .. but these sessions should also be built like stairs that you start with 2km 3km 5km .. then train... for example on the track 200m and 400m to get extra speed .. it's all about getting comfortable in marathon pace .. how many miles do you train per week? you dont need run extreme weeks to run fast ..all its how u train .. when I ran 2.16 marathon I trained only 140-165 km weekly and had a full-time office job at the same time
When I ran 3:00:09 last year I probably ran 80km to 90km average weekly. I don't think I could even do that these days with the baby at this stage. So you think each week one session would be the speed track like session and then the only other "hard" session would be the long run? The long run would be blocks of threshold? Is that faster than my half marathon pace?
Once the pacer passes you, thats it
Next time I might not even go near the pacer so I purely focus on myself.
I am going to try and just stick slightly behind the pacer next time. When they run past it breaks hearts! 😂
I don’t know. A sign of hitting the wall is a sharp decline in heart rate because your muscles just can’t do it anymore. Your heart rate was still increasing until 41k. You were really only 1k from getting away with the hard push. So muscularly you were only 4.5 minutes off. Sure, you slowed down, but your engine was still revving pretty good. Maybe some caffeine towards the end, waiting 1 more k to start your push, and a better mental focus on how even though your legs feel trashed, your body is able to still push, maybe these were all that you were missing.
Yea possibly, I just knew at 38km my mind was gone so in that sense I hit the wall completely in the mind, but physically I was just bit by by coming to the point I would have had to completely stop. I had caffeine in a couple of gels I think mid way but I also wonder if missing my 5th and 6th gel could have played a part too.