In ny experience, if you love what you buy, you forget about the money, but if you don’t like it; the only thing you remember, is the amount you spend.
Getting rid of used stuff is increasingly difficult. Dealers don't want the stuff even as a trade in because floor space is so expensive. Selling on the web is fraught. Shipping is becoming increasingly expensive. There's often not a market from stuff from boutique company. I am buying far, far less stuff now because I just can't get rid of it when I'm done with it
You're right with everything you've said Richard. The fix obviously is buy a system until you wear it out. I'm tossing brand new Bose 901's and a Stanton turntable and finally a Yamaha receiver for all the reasons you've stated. I have a system now that will follow me to the grave, no more issues of selling it.
👍30 years ago, I paid $800 for a Japanese made amplifier, Steve, and being a financially challenged younger guy, I thought, Jeez, I must be out of my freaking mind !! Well, it turns out that, to this day, I feel like it was worth every penny!😉
I've had excellent luck with using The Music Room to dispose of my used gear. You can sell it outright to them, or trade it in towards something they have for sale. Even if they won't give you cash for your gear you can still sell it through them on consignment. I've used all three of these methods. SkyFi Audio is another outfit that buys used gear, although they tend to concentrate on vintage high end equipment.
Hello Steve, really enjoy your vids & commentaries:] I can relate, I was an audio rep before going back to college and had that same feeling with customer decisions. At the time I jumped the gun on a pair of JBL L220 Oracle speakers, negotiated with my significant other and have been enjoying them for close to 40 years. Never regretted buying that something... I lusted for....Cheers from Montreal.
I recently upgraded all my components. Bought my Arcam SA20 amp by listening in store. Liked the sound and looks. Bought turntable and speaks by watching reviews on UA-cam. Went with Elac SB283 speakers because reviews mentioned that the speakers were so good with bass they didn't need a sub and I didn't want to use a sub due to space. Reviews were right. They are incredible sounding on their own. Dual CS 618Q turntable is exactly what I was looking for but came with a 30 day return if I changed my mind. I very happy with my system but it was expensive. My wife would cut me off if she knew. Only live once and the sticker shock goes away every time I spin some vinyl.
Value for money as you will get the use of it over many years. Arcam SA20 is definitely not at wreckless price point in the Intergrated amplifier market 🙂
John Rutan in New Jersey and Frank Huang in Westchester county New York owned two of my best 'go to' stores because they were so passionate about audio and pleasing their customers that I truly believe that they would never steer me wrong. Love those guys and bought plenty of equipment from both of them.
I got an open box deal on a Music Hall MMF 9.3. I'm fairly happy with it.I plan on keeping it as I would like to own at least tables. But, ideally, I'd have 3 tonearms. Or 4. Lol.
I love the last system. I just put together a little bedroom system with a Fosi BT20a pro, FX Audio DAC-X6 mkII, WiiM Mini, and Klipsch R-41m bookshelf speakers with a Klipsch R-100sw sub, all on the restored 1937 Singer sewing machine my Grandma got for Mother's Day in 1937. I'll have to rearrange the room and make it look cool for a pic. The knob on the Fosi matches the woofers on the Klipsches and it all looks fly on the nice woodwork.
Being a South African Audiophile we can barely afford any high-end equipment new with our currency trading at 18 ZAR to the USD. Can you as an American imagine paying 18 times what you currently do for anything you can buy in the US? Luckily we have a few local sites that sell used equipment in mint condition. If it wasn't for that I would probably never own anything audiophile-grade in my life.
Thats's why I have owned Mcintosh since 64. Never have lost money buying and owning Mcintosh electronics.. I also only buy some thing I have auditioned many times. Also I worked for a Mcintosh dealer for many many years 1970 till 2004 full time and part time from 63 to 70. while going to school and working for a Radio Station.
Steve, there is a vendor here in Oz that is selling the Magico A9, their flagship speaker, for 1.5 million AUD. I normally avoid the class war stuff, but you can still buy a HOUSE for that number almost anywhere outside hotspots in Sydney and Melbourne. Aspirational ? Sure, for the lucky few who win Lotto - for the rest, that is an insane choice.
Why you should sell? Carefully choose and keep it as long as you can. I have technics amp for 40 years now, class a, working perfectly, sounds perfectly with any speaker and so on so on…..
I could have saved a fortune by getting what I really want instead of what I can afford. Now I really stretch to what I really want and don’t have to move stuff on as much.
When I was 25, I bought a car of 50/k. I'd better had bought a 50/k audio system, as it would still have been here. Better buy really good gear, with the help of a trusted audio shop, and enjoy it for decades. Of course, over time sometimes gear is changed, but I have never worried about resale value. In fact, I just traded in speakers and they have been nearly free to own, though I had them some 20 years.
I'm using bamboo cutting boards between my speaker stands & Mission QX2 Mk 2 speakers 🔊 to raise the height a little as tweeter is by design below mid bass drivers. Wasn't expecting an overall improvement in sound quality too - but there really is 😀 🇬🇧
Given the subjective nature of listing to Hifi, and also the very real nature of the placebo effect, how the systems look is a very important aspect. Especially with the very high priced high end components. Look and feel can become as important if not more important than the tiny variations in the quality of sound. This is because of the law of diminishing returns that applies to all products.
Dont buy cause someone on audio forum said it was good. I know a guy who bought 5000 USD worth sansui. Without listening. Afterwards he said his cheaper Yamaha sounded better lol
If you are buying expensive audio stuff with a CC, you probably cannot afford it. This will make it much , much worse if you are not happy with the sound. Because expectations get high when the price is high and the wallet is empty.
Nothing wrong with buying on a CC. Cash back, hotel rooms, air miles, etc. The problem is people not paying their card charges in full every statement.
@@36karpatoruski You're talking like a man who has some dough laying around. Most do not, and go to CC HELL. I'm a cash guy. Don't fly because my arms get tired and hotels are AIDS factories and the sheets are cum catchers that usually don't get washed. Even the 4 stars. Labor is always an issue in the sleepover world. UGH
I’m close to pulling the trigger on used speakers that I absolutely love the sound of. However, the lack of warranty and unknown ability to have them repaired is a big risk. I’ve had very little trouble with speakers so I wouldn’t expect to have problems but if I did I would be out a lot of money. Wish I knew what is the right way to go. These speakers are what I really want and a good value if they last. If they don’t last I’m really in trouble. So hard to know if it’s worth the risk. I can’t afford these speakers new so it’s either used or going with something of far less quality. Help please!
@@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac Steve, you are a legend and I really appreciate you taking the time to respond. I am following your advice on this. Thanks again.
Thanks Steve. I love your videos and these topics provoke great thought. I am at a place where I’m enjoying what I have. Something old, something new, something borrowed... Yes to more shows with you and Herb!
Thanks for the video Steve. You make some good points. However, I got a very inexpensive speaker amp and a separate cheap preamp from Schiit Audio and I could not be more pleased. I spent most of my budget on a pair of Heresy IV's and that's why I was able to get away with a low powered amp (just 10 watts) but it drives those speakers just fine.
I've learned to buy what looks and feels the best to me, because how it sounds in the store means nothing. Your room, speakers, and equipment will make whatever you are buying sound completely different than what it sounds like in the store.
My personal approach: Find reviewers that have the same taste as you and trust their reviews; try to listen to the piece at home if possible; have a few good reasons why you want to pull the trigger on the piece; and finally, when you listen to it, avoid listening to the fireworks. By "fireworks" I mean the obvious characteristics like extension, bass, etc that you perceive right away. It is a bit like meeting a new person: you might be impressed by the chit chat, the impressive stories, but whether you will like that person depends on a lot of more subtle things. I find similar traits in high-end audio. Take your time, and be patient.
Wow, find reviewers that have the same ... trainers (taste) as us and trust their reviews. Wow, go down to Manhattan; look at all the footwear walking around and uh ... yeah; if someone wearing our style of shoe goes into a certain coffee place, then we'll go in there too and if everybody else in there is wearing different shoes from ours, you know, avoid listening to the fireworks. By 'fireworks' I mean obvious things like people wearing other footwear. You know for a supposed physicist, you know Miguel is Steve's rival for Albert Einstein. What Miguel says has to be pearls of wisdom in Steve's opinion.
The worst way is to buy because a UA-camr say its good. When you look at the biggest Hifi Channels the Product Choices are very repetitive. I wouldnt even take this Klipsch, Wharfedale, SMSL, Topping, Mission etc Gear for free that get tons of reviews. The realy good Stuff mostly dont get reviews because when you are in the scene beside this hifi youtuber, the people recommend and know the good stuff (ATC, Neumann, Strauss, CraneSong, SPL, Amphion, Genelec etc..) And this Brands dont need this promotion on youtube.
@@MMK___ ATC? Billy Woodman? You know ... in his early days Billy made a cloth dome tweeter and we had to have EL34 tubes to drive the Axtent, Radford 15 or 25, and ATC were just bigger versions of the crummy Axtent that needed you know equipment that was so expensive that nobody that Steve has ever shown of the System of the Day, even has now! But the main thing is being good at a low price.
@@MMK___ If we used a QUAD 405-2 with ATC you know ... Wow, would it sound good? No it would sound like the worst thing you ever heard! Because EL34 tubes in a Radford they're using a minimum of components and it's all artifice and stunning workmanship. So ATC ... you know, with what feeding it? Dropping names is an old trick. But if you can some system that is sweet for a low price, that's what a lot of people need.
You talked about being a hi fi salesmen and helping people in this video... I had an interesting conversation with a hi fi salesmen recently. I was in my local hi fi shop in Raleigh NC, which is a really nice store, and asked one of the salesmen his opinion on a pair of speakers. He goes into this speech about how buying hi if is subjective, etc... Um yeah, obviously, I just wanted the guy's opinion. He gave me the speech again and would not give his opinion on any speaker. Have to admit this irritated me a bit, b/c the guy was really condescending about it. I told him that as a hi fi salesmen his only real value is his opinion. I don't think he liked that;-)
My first entry level system was thoroughly unsatisfactory. I got no joy from it whatsoever. Each item was reviewed well and sounded ok with audiophile recording but lacked any ability to breath life into any sort of music. I then made another miss-purchase of my first "high end" piece of gear. Dynaudio Confidence C1 Platinum speakers. They were "a bargain buy". I put some more money together to buy an amp to suit. Also "a bargain buy" and also punched by a sales clerk as a "very good match" for the dynaudios.... Still I got no joy from the equipment. Ling story short. My hifi journey has been riddled with bad purchases. And it has taken me around 5 years to find gear that moves me. All the while, having to sell off my bad purchases at a loss. It's been a very interesting journey this far. I love my current system. And I've learned a lot. Most importantly. 1. Big money does not equal big joy. 2. Check out gear with your favourite poorly recorded music. Not audiophile recordings. 3. Steve was right. High efficiency horn speakers and tube amps really do it "for me". Thanks Steve.
I bought Klipsch RP600M (Gen 1) because of the good reviews and low low price on the gloss finish. It’s a fine speaker. I’ve enjoyed it. But I didn’t get what I really wanted. And now I’m thinking about my next move. Food for thought next time my itchy trigger finger hovers over the add to cart button.
I use a sub. I used to be anti-sub but ever since I connected it using the speaker jacks it’s been a game changer. Meaning, integrated amp > into sub > out of sub > speakers. It’s integration is better in my experience than using a dedicated sub / preamp rca output jack.
@@tewwywuggles with my main system I use an RME ADI-2 Pro FS R BE as my dac and preamp. I run XLR to my amp and the 1/4 outs I use the left to my left dub and the right to my right sub. Musical bliss for me.
US Audio Mart seems to be a graveyard for expensive gear that I personally have never heard about. How do you decide to buy an expensive piece of used gear. Yikes!
This is the only problem when building your own speakers, I've just finished the medium monitors, they cost me around £800 to build, they are equivalent to a set of £3,000 monitors, but if I tried to sell them, I'd find it hard, even though I run my UA-cam channel, lucky I'm not bothered, but if you want to sell equipment, alway buy good quality, so you can trade it easy, great video steve
I would never build my own speakers because the odds are not very high of getting the sound just right. I'd rather be able to return speakers that don't work for me in my space.
Great content as always, thank you. After 25 years as an audio enthusiast and following the twists and turns of upgrading (Graaf, Accuphase, Unison Research, Kef, B&W, Martin Logan. … etc etc. I have finally found peace and satisfaction….. with a Lingdorf TDAI 1120 and Wharfdale Linton Heritage. (Room Perfect made a huge difference) and a vintage Pioneer CD transport. (2500 CD’s) Oh the time and money spent to arrive at something relatively inexpensive. Now it is just about the music….
After 25 years we'd expect you to know that Lyngdorf TDAI-1120 you know has a brand name similar to 'Lying', you know to tell lies. We've all heard the New York made Frontin' Audio stuff and you know as soon as we make a sound, you know a noise like Wharfedale Linton Heritage, well we know where you're coming from ... Wharfedale City. Hey ... 'Water seeks its own level' simply means quality people of integrity find other quality people of integrity and vice versa. It also means high quality finds high quality and low quality finds low quality. This is true in business and in life. It is a scientific fact: water does indeed reach its own level.
A strategy that's worked for me is deciding that I'm interested in purchasing a product & then just keeping an eye on it. A few months later I may see that a replacement model caused the price to drop or a dealer or manufacturer is closing it out or selling a demonstrator unit. Checking websites regularly helps a lot with the process.
I made the mistake of buying Pioneer speakers you recommended because they were half off and you liked them. I didn't like them, couldn't sell them and gave them away for free. Expensive lesson learned
I’ve only bought stuff I have demoed. Before buying these Vandersteen Model 2Ce Signature III I listened to them for several hours before buying. Same with the Model 1 CI+. I am now addicted to Vandersteen.
I only buy based on sound, not price (within my budget of course). I found a really nice audio shop that gives me back 100% of the purchase value if I upgrade within a year after I've bought a piece of equipment. So it's hard to go wrong. Another thing I do is I always make sure I have all the money needed to buy something I want and never buy on credit.
I wouldn't use such a benefit, since a valid design should be good for about 25 years, plus I buy very carefully , intending to keep and use the products I carefully select.
@@richardelliott8352 I understand you because I too tend to keep my equipment for a long time. But this is a good way of getting into Hi-Fi and gradually upgrading to a flagship model. You can buy something cash and put money aside for a year and upgrade without losing a dime since they take back your product in exchange and give you what you paid for.
@@richardelliott8352 Everybody is the same but you know, SONY made many valid designs that were good for 2.5 years. So they had ten times more experience of buying stuff than you did with your 25 years old piece of kit.
I think id like a H190 too I've heard the H120 (£2250) & I think that would be more than sufficient to drive my 89.5 sensitively Focal floorstanding speakers. However they are currently being driven by Naim 70 wpc amplifier so physiologically I would need to "upgrade" to the H190 (£3000) 🙄 The H390 is £5250 here in UK 🇬🇧 so unless I win the lottery.... & as you say then I would feel as though I needed a more premium pair of speakers to "match"
When I choose what to buy using my heart instead of my head, I'm much more satisfied with what I buy. I find I have less or no buyers remorse afterward.
Absolutely, there are lots of great American speaking companies, Vandersteen, ZU, TEKTON, etc. Amps, Decware, Van Alstine, First Watt, etc. DAC, Schiit
I am not an audiophile, really, just love the music, and started to pay more attention to sound quality. Maybe because of that I really relate to the "feel and look" test you mention. I bought the LEAK Stereo and CDT mostly because I fell in love with the looks, it transported me to 60's and 70's, and just by that it made me enjoy the music even more. Great video, as always!! Congrats on you content.
Well ... the Leak Stereo 130 and Wharfedale Linton Revival you know. I had Wharfedale Glendale XP2 at the same time as the Realistic Optimus X-100 and the problem with Wharfedale was the 6 ohm load and Medium Sensitivity, 86dB SPL to 94dB and 8-ohm with the Realistic. But the Glendale was truly ... awesome but a real power guzzler and Leak 130 isn't the best match today for the new Linton, it needs far more than 45 watts, because the new Linton is still a 6 ohm speaker and has 88dB/w/m.
You are absolutely right. I am on the market right now for a pair of speakers and I would love to get the new Linton’s, with the stands. But I know they are not the best match for the Leak, so it’s not all about the “looks”, even for a non-audiophile like me.
I tried the Lintons with the LEAK Stereo but it sounded like the Lintons could do more. Paired with a refurbished Denon PMA-1060 amplifier the Lintons are really good.
Hi Steve. Again You have made a very good - and IMPORTANT - video.. Which can protect hifi guys, for making the same mistakes that for instans I have done, through the years...Im now 65 years.. And know the importanse of watching this video clip...Even if its - at my age - and years in living with hifi - is like getting a comb, now I have lost most of my hair..he he😊 But for newer guys, interested in hifi.. Your advices in this video is GOLD 👍🤗
I am fortunate in that I have a great relationship with a dealer who allows me to loan equipment. I think this is the best option as I can hear how the item on loan integrates with the rest of my system. I do realise, however, that there has been a significant reduction in physical stores which has resulted in more reliance on reviews. Selling equipment has become more challenging as I discovered a couple of years ago. Fortunately, the dealer has contact with someone who buys second hand equipment. I realise that this means not getting the best price but it was better than nothing and meant that I didn’t have a fairly large box lying around the house.
I always liked this quote: “Extravagance in the pursuit of excellence is no vice.” The headline advertising blurb from Elac-Miracord when they introduced the first turntable priced at the then-extravagant sum of $200. I think their biggest competition, the Dual 1219, was priced at $180.
Buying gear because it was a good deal really worked for me, but I am conscious that I lucked out big times. First was a German integrate amplifier, Aaron No.1a. I was looking for a second amplifier for the summer as my 845 tube amp generated to much heat and this, unknown in America, 6 month old amp came in as a super deal, I bought it hoping it would be good enough for summer listening, I sold my 845. Not long after, we moved and my then speakers could not fill my new bigger room. A dealer/distributor that I dealt with a few times in the pass was closing shop and offered to sell me a sealed box pair of spendor sp1/2R2 for less than a 1/3 price, plus he threw in a pair of beautiful sound anchor stands. This was 13 years ago and I am still using this combination. Getting this combination was pure luck, I brought my amp at a friends place to try with his Vivid audio loudspeakers, we where both amazed how good this intergrade could play and we also agreed that the combination lacked musically, just too neutral. But combined with the big almost tube like sounding spendors (polymer diaphragms), it's musical bliss, still no plans to upgrade. The only draw back is that the front of my speakers are just under 8 feet from the back wall or what some people call front wall for the music to open to its full potential and this is our living quarters, thank goodness for my super understanding girlfriend, I really lucked out with her, but that's a story for another day.
Hey Steve, thanks for putting my system up. Would you believe there’s been a few changes since? 🤷♂️I still have the LP12 though and listened to you and Herb talk about them with great interest. 👍
Resale difficulty is particularly true with antiques and art. AND, the ridiculously high seller commissions (to cover their overhead for the facility, etc.) wipe out any profit almost guaranteeing a loss. My experience and suggestion with any type of stereo purchase is to save and spend 90% on the speakers. Do a LOT of listening and spend months listening to all types of speakers at different!!! stores with different front ends (tube, solid state, and a mix) until one pair of speakers keeps bringing a smile to your face over and over. Spend almost your entire budget on those speakers and plan to keep them forever. Buy anything used and inexpensive for a front end to play music. In time, you can save and start the next phase of the system assembly by exploring either an integrated amp or separates. I'd lean toward integrated. They have perfected the design. It's a lot less money, and audibly I doubt you would hear the difference. Spend all of your budget on this purchase after months of listening experiences. Lastly, choose a source unit upgrade: CD or TT. CD is far less money and simple. Then, treat your room with inexpensive methods to improve the listening space. It does make a difference.
You talk about listening at lower volumes, but finding speakers that do this well is difficult. Most reviewers do not mention this and specs don’t indicate which speakers do this well.
Yes... have seen so many ultra bargain seekers. They keep looking for that $200 bookshelf that sounds like $2000 pair they heard in store. Or similar for amp. Then selling those speakers... lucky if they get 50 bucks. So after 10 cheap things... they could have bought that pair they really wanted.
The viewer systems are interesting. Out of curiosity, I google the heck out of the components as they are often unique. It'd hard for me to hear all the makes and models as you mention them. Could you provide a means to list them out in the video description or otherwise?
The problem I'm having now is, I'm beginning to invest more money into speakers, amps, etc. I do alot of research. Not just youtube, reading, reviews. What Steve just said. Dynaudio evoke?, or Harbeth P3esr? Maybe q acoustics concept 30, or Zu audio DWX? That's just speakers.😂
Since 1980 I've had 3 systems, all of which I still have, which work and which I use whenever I want a change of sound. In the early days no demo no buy now I'm in more rarefied area of £15k to £30k a box no dealer home loan unit not considered. However I know the sound I like which makes it easier. For last 25 years have used mostly Audio Research and Krell but during the pandemic changed to Constellation Mono blocs. Have used a Linn Sondek and Magnaplanars since the 1980's, have 4 pairs of the maggies and upgraded the Linn to a Klimax over the years. The only out of the blue buy was a Transparent cabling loom which has made a huge difference. As cartridges are > £2K no demo no purchase. Quality kit lasts the only thing that died were my original Tannoys from the 1960's, 2 pairs of Kefs still work and sound interesting.
Pride of ownership i think its a huge part of buying audio equipment. How equipment looks and feels, particularly when it comes to speakers. They are audio furniture.
my first speaker i bought over 20 Years ago was because i went to a local store to listen to s great deal some JBL floorstanding speakers. after listening i asked if i could hear something else and listen to a pair B&W DM601s2 Despite having less BASS the JBL's were garbage compared. so I went home with a set of B&W DM602s2
Unfortunately until you understand , used gear is the best way to maximize your💵. Buy a $10k piece 40% to 60% off new. Warranty is only useful in 2 to 3 years normally. Buying new gear is also experimental and just cost much more. Do your Dodecanese and educate yourself and use your good common sense.
I've decided to stop for a while. It is hard to move stuff without taking a huge loss. Even on E-Bay, they rip you off with their cut, then shipping is outrageous, etc. There are no showrooms anymore like in the 80s where you can go and touch and at least listen to many different products. I mostly rely on UA-camrs who review gear, but even that at times can be misleading. Hooking a product up to $50K in gear for example when yours is $10K, $5,K or less.
Yes. I don't want to make ANY big mistakes buying expensive audio. I'm not a rich American audiophile. I'm a Yorkshire man in retirement. I spend as long as it takes before choosing amp, speakers, source components etc. If I'm not sure I will try to audition at home if possible. In order to free my decision making being limited by looks I don't care about looks my hi-fi lives behind large cabinet doors. Although It actually looks great by accident not through choice
Great topic Steve!!! I buy something mostly based on Brand name and sound quality. I am a big Technics fan, and their new audio gear is just way to expensive for me. I still have the Technics gear I bought new in 1989 and it works perfectly to this day and I use it everyday for at least 3 hours. The sad part is the new Technics gear is so expensive so I am forced to buy other brands. I am impressed with Yamaha audio so if anything happens to my Technics gear I will probably be buying Yamaha, piece by piece, But I still have the incredible Technics Speakers I bought new in 1989 and they work perfect and sound incredible. Hopefully they will last me the rest of my life!!
My AS-10 (AcousticResearch licensed acoustic suspension 2-way large bookshelf spkrsys)were solidly built 'high- Value' affordable speaker kits in 1964. Really desired the highly acclaimed AS2ax by AR but each enclosure was more than a month's pay(USAF..E-4). The AS-10s served adequately & were still beautiful dark walnuton all surfaces expt back...so The pair was totally refurbed w/UPGRADED hi-db spkrs + superTweeters & 3way crossovers. wt=~42lb ea encl. Conseratively rated to handle ~ 150wrms. My fav among the 8 pr of spkr sys because they deliver such wonderous vocals. DJ-in-TX 15:51
I bought marantz because I listened to the hype and it made my ears bleed and I had total fatigue. I was perfectly content with my Sony but it blew out completely. And yes selling gear is fraught with problems. Could never sell my gear on eBay. Ugh!!!
The way to avoid mistakes is to buy good gear that is well supported and has a good reputation USED! Then you can experiment your arse off and never lose a dime. And if you have a good sense of what is a great deal, you can even make a few bob (shekels) along the way. Good Mid-Fi is the sweet spot for turning over gear easily. Esoteric audiophile brands do not turn well.
After going for a long period of time trying to upgrade my loudspeakers and failing and then having my ML 333 ampliffer die and then going for a long period without and amp, I made an impulsive purchase for a Mono pair of 400 W Parasound JC 1’s when I found them on sale for $2000 off. I thought I remembered a very positive review by John Atkinson where he after hearing bought a pair. They sound fine but I think they are overpriced for the sale price of $16000 a pair. I believe most of the upper end electronics is way overpriced. I also think many audio dealers don’t serve the customers well.
I always find a dealer that will allow me to test a product in my system before I buy. I spent several weeks comparing audio research and Krell amps at home - absolutely vital and I avoided a very expensive mistake.
I prefer buying used, open box, or model close out to take some of the depreciation hit, should I want to change direction later. Create a short list of options and be patient usually searching out a deal on,. Same rules apply to other hobbies when possible. I typically over research on projects. Audiophile stuff is a bit difficult as I don't know many who are into it and a showroom isn't exactly like being in the house. I have more than one expensive hobbie. So, max bang for the buck is a constant calculation as well as being realistic about how much my untrained ear can detect. Ultimately it is about kicking back back and enjoying listening to some music.
"Get what you really want" ok , great but how does a person know what they really want if their experience with that gear is limited and not in their own home /listening environment . the best you can do is have a friend that you spend a lot of time with and get to know the set up that way or listen in a show room ,: make comparisons and pick the one you like the best . there is always some unknowns . as to the advice of pick the one that has the best resale value , is terrible advice . That advice is as bad as buying what you don't want because it's on sale. if you know what you want then forget about resale and enjoy it for years and years . if you are buying with resale in mind then you probaly don't know what you want or are obsessive and lack the ability to appreciate what you have .
Hifi dealers hold limited stock these days and will often push you towards gear they have on hand and try and talk you out of an indent order. I guess they want the cash and the stock turnover. That has happened to me before. You need to be firm! Also some brands are very hard to get service, so I agree with Steve's warning about that.
I love a good story behind somthing. The first hifi stereo i fell in love with was the G.A.S. Son Of Ampzilla with dahlquist dq-10s, simply because it was my dads setup in the 70's. My first acquisition was an Aragon 4004 with the matching 24k preamp. Loved the Dan D'agostinoI, "poor mans Krell" connection, still think it it the beautiful. Brutal and monolithic... could look at it forever. The stereo that keeps me dreaming is the 47 Labratory, 4706 Gaincard and the lm3886 op-amp such as the Akitika GT-102. Love the simplicity, amazing sound and fun. I like to move around when listening so open baffle, electrostatic, and omni-directional speakers are fun and interesting. Dont care much about numbers if i donr feel anything about the product!
I built a pair of TI “Overture” LM3886 amp boards built from scratch from plans published in the magazine Audio Express. Made my own circuit boards and all. Just be sure to use big heatsinks. I understand Jeff Rowland used the LM3886 amplifier modules in one of his integrated amplifiers. The LM3886 boards combined with a basic 12AU7 tube input stage are still rockin’ 10 years now in a pair of powered speakers in my office.
heck, my house is full of stuff that I bought just because it was a good deal;-) I use all of it, but I would have probably made different decisions if that product was not on sale. I bought the original Elac UniFis because they were an open box sale. Think I paid $200 for them at the time. Hated those speakers. They are sitting in a corner right now. I should be able to get most of my money back, but that was a complete kneejerk purchase.
It is vital to audition any hifi purchase in your own home, the bottom line comes down to your budget you can get a great sound out of a budget system if well matched. The other important thing is to audition gear with a cd or vinyl you know has been well produced and you know very well, these days good hifi systems don't have to break the bank manafactures know how to produce good quality hifi gear at a budget price why? that is the biggest market.
*Your advise and opinion is very valuable Steve. Listening to you is always very fascinating. Thank you so much for sharing years of experience and knowledge, greetings from the UK.*
In ny experience, if you love what you buy, you forget about the money, but if you don’t like it; the only thing you remember, is the amount you spend.
Getting rid of used stuff is increasingly difficult. Dealers don't want the stuff even as a trade in because floor space is so expensive. Selling on the web is fraught. Shipping is becoming increasingly expensive. There's often not a market from stuff from boutique company. I am buying far, far less stuff now because I just can't get rid of it when I'm done with it
You're right with everything you've said Richard. The fix obviously is buy a system until you wear it out. I'm tossing brand new Bose 901's and a Stanton turntable and finally a Yamaha receiver for all the reasons you've stated. I have a system now that will follow me to the grave, no more issues of selling it.
👍30 years ago,
I paid $800 for a Japanese made amplifier, Steve, and being a financially challenged younger guy,
I thought, Jeez,
I must be out of my freaking mind !!
Well, it turns out that, to this day,
I feel like it was worth every penny!😉
I’ve sold lots of hifi on local Craigslist.
I've had excellent luck with using The Music Room to dispose of my used gear. You can sell it outright to them, or trade it in towards something they have for sale. Even if they won't give you cash for your gear you can still sell it through them on consignment. I've used all three of these methods. SkyFi Audio is another outfit that buys used gear, although they tend to concentrate on vintage high end equipment.
@@geraldschrader8511The Music Room in Colorado is fantastic!!
Hello Steve, really enjoy your vids & commentaries:] I can relate, I was an audio rep before going back to college and had that same feeling with customer decisions. At the time I jumped the gun on a pair of JBL L220 Oracle speakers, negotiated with my significant other and have been enjoying them for close to 40 years. Never regretted buying that something... I lusted for....Cheers from Montreal.
Oh that’s awesome, I always enjoy seeing Herb on your show!
I recently upgraded all my components. Bought my Arcam SA20 amp by listening in store. Liked the sound and looks. Bought turntable and speaks by watching reviews on UA-cam. Went with Elac SB283 speakers because reviews mentioned that the speakers were so good with bass they didn't need a sub and I didn't want to use a sub due to space. Reviews were right. They are incredible sounding on their own. Dual CS 618Q turntable is exactly what I was looking for but came with a 30 day return if I changed my mind. I very happy with my system but it was expensive. My wife would cut me off if she knew. Only live once and the sticker shock goes away every time I spin some vinyl.
Value for money as you will get the use of it over many years.
Arcam SA20 is definitely not at wreckless price point in the Intergrated amplifier market 🙂
John Rutan in New Jersey and Frank Huang in Westchester county New York owned two of my best 'go to' stores because they were so passionate about audio and pleasing their customers that I truly believe that they would never steer me wrong. Love those guys and bought plenty of equipment from both of them.
I got an open box deal on a Music Hall MMF 9.3. I'm fairly happy with it.I plan on keeping it as I would like to own at least tables. But, ideally, I'd have 3 tonearms. Or 4. Lol.
Having a relationship with a good dealer is the key - who will lend you gear and help you develop a taste in fine quality hi-fi.
And also help you build a system with synergy.
Sage advice as always! Thanks for all you do. 🥰
I love the last system. I just put together a little bedroom system with a Fosi BT20a pro, FX Audio DAC-X6 mkII, WiiM Mini, and Klipsch R-41m bookshelf speakers with a Klipsch R-100sw sub, all on the restored 1937 Singer sewing machine my Grandma got for Mother's Day in 1937. I'll have to rearrange the room and make it look cool for a pic. The knob on the Fosi matches the woofers on the Klipsches and it all looks fly on the nice woodwork.
The Music Room in Colorado is fantastic for used or new!!
Being a South African Audiophile we can barely afford any high-end equipment new with our currency trading at 18 ZAR to the USD. Can you as an American imagine paying 18 times what you currently do for anything you can buy in the US? Luckily we have a few local sites that sell used equipment in mint condition. If it wasn't for that I would probably never own anything audiophile-grade in my life.
Great video! One day I’ll pull the trigger and your advice is so helpful.
Thats's why I have owned Mcintosh since 64. Never have lost money buying and owning Mcintosh electronics.. I also only buy some thing I have auditioned many times. Also I worked for a Mcintosh dealer for many many years 1970 till 2004 full time and part time from 63 to 70. while going to school and working for a Radio Station.
Finally! Yes! Buying Advice! I like this and when you do a recommendations list, I also like when you build/put together systems!
Super duper thumbs up! LOVE this! I can relate.
ps I used to work in a high end music instrument store. West LA Music. from mtw in L.A.
Steve, there is a vendor here in Oz that is selling the Magico A9, their flagship speaker, for 1.5 million AUD. I normally avoid the class war stuff, but you can still buy a HOUSE for that number almost anywhere outside hotspots in Sydney and Melbourne. Aspirational ? Sure, for the lucky few who win Lotto - for the rest, that is an insane choice.
Why you should sell? Carefully choose and keep it as long as you can. I have technics amp for 40 years now, class a, working perfectly, sounds perfectly with any speaker and so on so on…..
I could have saved a fortune by getting what I really want instead of what I can afford. Now I really stretch to what I really want and don’t have to move stuff on as much.
When I was 25, I bought a car of 50/k. I'd better had bought a 50/k audio system, as it would still have been here. Better buy really good gear, with the help of a trusted audio shop, and enjoy it for decades. Of course, over time sometimes gear is changed, but I have never worried about resale value. In fact, I just traded in speakers and they have been nearly free to own, though I had them some 20 years.
Gosh Steve there are some really beautiful systems today. I put the speed down to 75% just to enjoy them. Greg
The IKEA turntable isolation platform!
I'm using bamboo cutting boards between my speaker stands & Mission QX2 Mk 2 speakers 🔊 to raise the height a little as tweeter is by design below mid bass drivers. Wasn't expecting an overall improvement in sound quality too - but there really is 😀 🇬🇧
Be very careful when purchasing panel speakers. They are very revealing, demanding with regards to amplification and room placement.
Any plans to review the new Martin Logan Motion series Xt F100's
Given the subjective nature of listing to Hifi, and also the very real nature of the placebo effect, how the systems look is a very important aspect. Especially with the very high priced high end components. Look and feel can become as important if not more important than the tiny variations in the quality of sound. This is because of the law of diminishing returns that applies to all products.
Dont buy cause someone on audio forum said it was good. I know a guy who bought 5000 USD worth sansui. Without listening. Afterwards he said his cheaper Yamaha sounded better lol
If you are buying expensive audio stuff with a CC, you probably cannot afford it. This will make it much , much worse if you are not happy with the sound. Because expectations get high when the price is high and the wallet is empty.
different is better i think a lot of audio sounds the same so a hifi that sounds dif is more of a listen
Nothing wrong with buying on a CC. Cash back, hotel rooms, air miles, etc. The problem is people not paying their card charges in full every statement.
@@36karpatoruski You're talking like a man who has some dough laying around. Most do not, and go to CC HELL. I'm a cash guy. Don't fly because my arms get tired and hotels are AIDS factories and the sheets are cum catchers that usually don't get washed. Even the 4 stars. Labor is always an issue in the sleepover world. UGH
Taking advice from the Audiophiliac is another expensive mistake!
I’m close to pulling the trigger on used speakers that I absolutely love the sound of. However, the lack of warranty and unknown ability to have them repaired is a big risk. I’ve had very little trouble with speakers so I wouldn’t expect to have problems but if I did I would be out a lot of money. Wish I knew what is the right way to go. These speakers are what I really want and a good value if they last. If they don’t last I’m really in trouble. So hard to know if it’s worth the risk. I can’t afford these speakers new so it’s either used or going with something of far less quality. Help please!
I don't blame you, and you sound like a risk averse person so don't do it! There's other fish in the sea.
@@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac Steve, you are a legend and I really appreciate you taking the time to respond. I am following your advice on this. Thanks again.
More Herb!
What's your talking heads cube?
PS SPROUT 100 + ELAC SPEAKER
Do what feels good. Live and learn. You'll make mistakes but you'll also learn more by doing than by reading web pages.
Thanks Steve. I love your videos and these topics provoke great thought. I am at a place where I’m enjoying what I have. Something old, something new, something borrowed...
Yes to more shows with you and Herb!
Thanks for the video Steve. You make some good points. However, I got a very inexpensive speaker amp and a separate cheap preamp from Schiit Audio and I could not be more pleased. I spent most of my budget on a pair of Heresy IV's and that's why I was able to get away with a low powered amp (just 10 watts) but it drives those speakers just fine.
I find when upgrading equipment. I need to spend a minimum of 3 times what I already have. Or it's more of a sideways move not better just different
yes i agree
I've learned to buy what looks and feels the best to me, because how it sounds in the store means nothing. Your room, speakers, and equipment will make whatever you are buying sound completely different than what it sounds like in the store.
My personal approach: Find reviewers that have the same taste as you and trust their reviews; try to listen to the piece at home if possible; have a few good reasons why you want to pull the trigger on the piece; and finally, when you listen to it, avoid listening to the fireworks. By "fireworks" I mean the obvious characteristics like extension, bass, etc that you perceive right away. It is a bit like meeting a new person: you might be impressed by the chit chat, the impressive stories, but whether you will like that person depends on a lot of more subtle things. I find similar traits in high-end audio. Take your time, and be patient.
Wow, find reviewers that have the same ... trainers (taste) as us and trust their reviews. Wow, go down to Manhattan; look at all the footwear walking around and uh ... yeah; if someone wearing our style of shoe goes into a certain coffee place, then we'll go in there too and if everybody else in there is wearing different shoes from ours, you know, avoid listening to the fireworks. By 'fireworks' I mean obvious things like people wearing other footwear. You know for a supposed physicist, you know Miguel is Steve's rival for Albert Einstein. What Miguel says has to be pearls of wisdom in Steve's opinion.
@@keplermission I find your foot fetish rather fascinating.
The worst way is to buy because a UA-camr say its good. When you look at the biggest Hifi Channels the Product Choices are very repetitive. I wouldnt even take this Klipsch, Wharfedale, SMSL, Topping, Mission etc Gear for free that get tons of reviews. The realy good Stuff mostly dont get reviews because when you are in the scene beside this hifi youtuber, the people recommend and know the good stuff (ATC, Neumann, Strauss, CraneSong, SPL, Amphion, Genelec etc..) And this Brands dont need this promotion on youtube.
@@MMK___ ATC? Billy Woodman? You know ... in his early days Billy made a cloth dome tweeter and we had to have EL34 tubes to drive the Axtent, Radford 15 or 25, and ATC were just bigger versions of the crummy Axtent that needed you know equipment that was so expensive that nobody that Steve has ever shown of the System of the Day, even has now! But the main thing is being good at a low price.
@@MMK___ If we used a QUAD 405-2 with ATC you know ... Wow, would it sound good? No it would sound like the worst thing you ever heard! Because EL34 tubes in a Radford they're using a minimum of components and it's all artifice and stunning workmanship. So ATC ... you know, with what feeding it? Dropping names is an old trick. But if you can some system that is sweet for a low price, that's what a lot of people need.
in your viewers system from Santa Rosa: Fyne Audio F703's are very nice sounding/looking speakers.
You talked about being a hi fi salesmen and helping people in this video... I had an interesting conversation with a hi fi salesmen recently. I was in my local hi fi shop in Raleigh NC, which is a really nice store, and asked one of the salesmen his opinion on a pair of speakers. He goes into this speech about how buying hi if is subjective, etc... Um yeah, obviously, I just wanted the guy's opinion. He gave me the speech again and would not give his opinion on any speaker. Have to admit this irritated me a bit, b/c the guy was really condescending about it. I told him that as a hi fi salesmen his only real value is his opinion. I don't think he liked that;-)
My first entry level system was thoroughly unsatisfactory. I got no joy from it whatsoever. Each item was reviewed well and sounded ok with audiophile recording but lacked any ability to breath life into any sort of music.
I then made another miss-purchase of my first "high end" piece of gear. Dynaudio Confidence C1 Platinum speakers. They were "a bargain buy". I put some more money together to buy an amp to suit. Also "a bargain buy" and also punched by a sales clerk as a "very good match" for the dynaudios.... Still I got no joy from the equipment.
Ling story short. My hifi journey has been riddled with bad purchases. And it has taken me around 5 years to find gear that moves me. All the while, having to sell off my bad purchases at a loss.
It's been a very interesting journey this far. I love my current system. And I've learned a lot. Most importantly.
1. Big money does not equal big joy.
2. Check out gear with your favourite poorly recorded music. Not audiophile recordings.
3. Steve was right. High efficiency horn speakers and tube amps really do it "for me".
Thanks Steve.
I bought Klipsch RP600M (Gen 1) because of the good reviews and low low price on the gloss finish. It’s a fine speaker. I’ve enjoyed it. But I didn’t get what I really wanted. And now I’m thinking about my next move. Food for thought next time my itchy trigger finger hovers over the add to cart button.
I added a sunwoofer to my rp600m's and made a huge difference. Just a suggestion.
What would you say was missing?
@Soltballs7608 for me it was size and depth since it was in a large area.
I use a sub. I used to be anti-sub but ever since I connected it using the speaker jacks it’s been a game changer. Meaning, integrated amp > into sub > out of sub > speakers. It’s integration is better in my experience than using a dedicated sub / preamp rca output jack.
@@tewwywuggles with my main system I use an RME ADI-2 Pro FS R BE as my dac and preamp. I run XLR to my amp and the 1/4 outs I use the left to my left dub and the right to my right sub. Musical bliss for me.
US Audio Mart seems to be a graveyard for expensive gear that I personally have never heard about. How do you decide to buy an expensive piece of used gear. Yikes!
Good way to end the week Steve ! As usual, very insightful discussion. Awesome multiple viewer systems segment too.
This is the only problem when building your own speakers, I've just finished the medium monitors, they cost me around £800 to build, they are equivalent to a set of £3,000 monitors, but if I tried to sell them, I'd find it hard, even though I run my UA-cam channel, lucky I'm not bothered, but if you want to sell equipment, alway buy good quality, so you can trade it easy, great video steve
I would never build my own speakers because the odds are not very high of getting the sound just right. I'd rather be able to return speakers that don't work for me in my space.
Great content as always, thank you. After 25 years as an audio enthusiast and following the twists and turns of upgrading (Graaf, Accuphase, Unison Research, Kef, B&W, Martin Logan. … etc etc. I have finally found peace and satisfaction….. with a Lingdorf TDAI 1120 and Wharfdale Linton Heritage. (Room Perfect made a huge difference) and a vintage Pioneer CD transport. (2500 CD’s)
Oh the time and money spent to arrive at something relatively inexpensive. Now it is just about the music….
After 25 years we'd expect you to know that Lyngdorf TDAI-1120 you know has a brand name similar to 'Lying', you know to tell lies. We've all heard the New York made Frontin' Audio stuff and you know as soon as we make a sound, you know a noise like Wharfedale Linton Heritage, well we know where you're coming from ... Wharfedale City. Hey ... 'Water seeks its own level' simply means quality people of integrity find other quality people of integrity and vice versa. It also means high quality finds high quality and low quality finds low quality. This is true in business and in life. It is a scientific fact: water does indeed reach its own level.
A strategy that's worked for me is deciding that I'm interested in purchasing a product & then just keeping an eye on it. A few months later I may see that a replacement model caused the price to drop or a dealer or manufacturer is closing it out or selling a demonstrator unit. Checking websites regularly helps a lot with the process.
Helps to have a trial period, so you can demo it in your system before you decide.
Seems to hardly be a used market for speakers unless it’s super old surrounds rotting type stuff
I made the mistake of buying Pioneer speakers you recommended because they were half off and you liked them. I didn't like them, couldn't sell them and gave them away for free. Expensive lesson learned
I’ve only bought stuff I have demoed. Before buying these Vandersteen Model 2Ce Signature III I listened to them for several hours before buying. Same with the Model 1 CI+. I am now addicted to Vandersteen.
I only buy based on sound, not price (within my budget of course). I found a really nice audio shop that gives me back 100% of the purchase value if I upgrade within a year after I've bought a piece of equipment. So it's hard to go wrong. Another thing I do is I always make sure I have all the money needed to buy something I want and never buy on credit.
My crummy comment keeps getting deleted! My crummy comment.
I wouldn't use such a benefit, since a valid design should be good for about 25 years, plus I buy very carefully , intending to keep and use the products I carefully select.
@@richardelliott8352 I understand you because I too tend to keep my equipment for a long time. But this is a good way of getting into Hi-Fi and gradually upgrading to a flagship model. You can buy something cash and put money aside for a year and upgrade without losing a dime since they take back your product in exchange and give you what you paid for.
@@richardelliott8352 Everybody is the same but you know, SONY made many valid designs that were good for 2.5 years. So they had ten times more experience of buying stuff than you did with your 25 years old piece of kit.
Which audio shop is it that gives you back 100% with in a year?
I wanted a Hegel H190 but I got such a good deal on a Hegel H390 I bought that instead. The only problem with it is now I need better speakers.😊😊
I think id like a H190 too
I've heard the H120 (£2250) & I think that would be more than sufficient to drive my 89.5 sensitively Focal floorstanding speakers.
However they are currently being driven by Naim 70 wpc amplifier so physiologically I would need to "upgrade" to the H190 (£3000) 🙄
The H390 is £5250 here in UK 🇬🇧 so unless I win the lottery.... & as you say then I would feel as though I needed a more premium pair of speakers to "match"
wow the guy with the nola speakers can adopt me anytime lol
😂 Thanks. I’m very happy with them. I bought them from a friend who moved on to Linkwitz.
Always get what you want because in the end you make a full circle and end up getting what you want after you get what you settled for.
When I choose what to buy using my heart instead of my head, I'm much more satisfied with what I buy. I find I have less or no buyers remorse afterward.
Is "Made in USA" audiophile level equipment a thing? I was wondering if it's possible to get a speaker, amp and dac system all made in USA.
Absolutely, there are lots of great American speaking companies, Vandersteen, ZU, TEKTON, etc. Amps, Decware, Van Alstine, First Watt, etc. DAC, Schiit
I loved my Apogees Scintillas 🙂
I am not an audiophile, really, just love the music, and started to pay more attention to sound quality. Maybe because of that I really relate to the "feel and look" test you mention. I bought the LEAK Stereo and CDT mostly because I fell in love with the looks, it transported me to 60's and 70's, and just by that it made me enjoy the music even more. Great video, as always!! Congrats on you content.
Well ... the Leak Stereo 130 and Wharfedale Linton Revival you know. I had Wharfedale Glendale XP2 at the same time as the Realistic Optimus X-100 and the problem with Wharfedale was the 6 ohm load and Medium Sensitivity, 86dB SPL to 94dB and 8-ohm with the Realistic. But the Glendale was truly ... awesome but a real power guzzler and Leak 130 isn't the best match today for the new Linton, it needs far more than 45 watts, because the new Linton is still a 6 ohm speaker and has 88dB/w/m.
You are absolutely right. I am on the market right now for a pair of speakers and I would love to get the new Linton’s, with the stands. But I know they are not the best match for the Leak, so it’s not all about the “looks”, even for a non-audiophile like me.
What you have described here is a lover of music who is paying attention to sound quality. 'Audio' recorded sound, Phile- lover of (Latin)
I tried the Lintons with the LEAK Stereo but it sounded like the Lintons could do more. Paired with a refurbished Denon PMA-1060 amplifier the Lintons are really good.
Hi Steve. Again You have made a very good - and IMPORTANT - video.. Which can protect hifi guys, for making the same mistakes that for instans I have done, through the years...Im now 65 years.. And know the importanse of watching this video clip...Even if its - at my age - and years in living with hifi - is like getting a comb, now I have lost most of my hair..he he😊 But for newer guys, interested in hifi.. Your advices in this video is GOLD 👍🤗
I am fortunate in that I have a great relationship with a dealer who allows me to loan equipment. I think this is the best option as I can hear how the item on loan integrates with the rest of my system. I do realise, however, that there has been a significant reduction in physical stores which has resulted in more reliance on reviews.
Selling equipment has become more challenging as I discovered a couple of years ago. Fortunately, the dealer has contact with someone who buys second hand equipment. I realise that this means not getting the best price but it was better than nothing and meant that I didn’t have a fairly large box lying around the house.
I always liked this quote: “Extravagance in the pursuit of excellence is no vice.” The headline advertising blurb from Elac-Miracord when they introduced the first turntable priced at the then-extravagant sum of $200. I think their biggest competition, the Dual 1219, was priced at $180.
What a great quote! For people like us it's the truth.
Buying gear because it was a good deal really worked for me, but I am conscious that I lucked out big times. First was a German integrate amplifier, Aaron No.1a. I was looking for a second amplifier for the summer as my 845 tube amp generated to much heat and this, unknown in America, 6 month old amp came in as a super deal, I bought it hoping it would be good enough for summer listening, I sold my 845. Not long after, we moved and my then speakers could not fill my new bigger room. A dealer/distributor that I dealt with a few times in the pass was closing shop and offered to sell me a sealed box pair of spendor sp1/2R2 for less than a 1/3 price, plus he threw in a pair of beautiful sound anchor stands. This was 13 years ago and I am still using this combination. Getting this combination was pure luck, I brought my amp at a friends place to try with his Vivid audio loudspeakers, we where both amazed how good this intergrade could play and we also agreed that the combination lacked musically, just too neutral. But combined with the big almost tube like sounding spendors (polymer diaphragms), it's musical bliss, still no plans to upgrade. The only draw back is that the front of my speakers are just under 8 feet from the back wall or what some people call front wall for the music to open to its full potential and this is our living quarters, thank goodness for my super understanding girlfriend, I really lucked out with her, but that's a story for another day.
Audio gears is way over price
I am more fearful now 😂😂😂
Hey Steve, thanks for putting my system up. Would you believe there’s been a few changes since? 🤷♂️I still have the LP12 though and listened to you and Herb talk about them with great interest. 👍
The law of diminishing returns.
Resale difficulty is particularly true with antiques and art. AND, the ridiculously high seller commissions (to cover their overhead for the facility, etc.) wipe out any profit almost guaranteeing a loss. My experience and suggestion with any type of stereo purchase is to save and spend 90% on the speakers. Do a LOT of listening and spend months listening to all types of speakers at different!!! stores with different front ends (tube, solid state, and a mix) until one pair of speakers keeps bringing a smile to your face over and over. Spend almost your entire budget on those speakers and plan to keep them forever. Buy anything used and inexpensive for a front end to play music. In time, you can save and start the next phase of the system assembly by exploring either an integrated amp or separates. I'd lean toward integrated. They have perfected the design. It's a lot less money, and audibly I doubt you would hear the difference. Spend all of your budget on this purchase after months of listening experiences. Lastly, choose a source unit upgrade: CD or TT. CD is far less money and simple. Then, treat your room with inexpensive methods to improve the listening space. It does make a difference.
You talk about listening at lower volumes, but finding speakers that do this well is difficult. Most reviewers do not mention this and specs don’t indicate which speakers do this well.
Yes... have seen so many ultra bargain seekers. They keep looking for that $200 bookshelf that sounds like $2000 pair they heard in store. Or similar for amp. Then selling those speakers... lucky if they get 50 bucks. So after 10 cheap things... they could have bought that pair they really wanted.
The viewer systems are interesting. Out of curiosity, I google the heck out of the components as they are often unique. It'd hard for me to hear all the makes and models as you mention them. Could you provide a means to list them out in the video description or otherwise?
The problem I'm having now is, I'm beginning to invest more money into speakers, amps, etc. I do alot of research. Not just youtube, reading, reviews. What Steve just said. Dynaudio evoke?, or Harbeth P3esr? Maybe q acoustics concept 30, or Zu audio DWX? That's just speakers.😂
Since 1980 I've had 3 systems, all of which I still have, which work and which I use whenever I want a change of sound. In the early days no demo no buy now I'm in more rarefied area of £15k to £30k a box no dealer home loan unit not considered. However I know the sound I like which makes it easier. For last 25 years have used mostly Audio Research and Krell but during the pandemic changed to Constellation Mono blocs. Have used a Linn Sondek and Magnaplanars since the 1980's, have 4 pairs of the maggies and upgraded the Linn to a Klimax over the years. The only out of the blue buy was a Transparent cabling loom which has made a huge difference. As cartridges are > £2K no demo no purchase. Quality kit lasts the only thing that died were my original Tannoys from the 1960's, 2 pairs of Kefs still work and sound interesting.
Good points Steve! I'm on the hunt for an upgrade for to my old '86 Technics SLDL1 linear tracking turntable.
Pride of ownership i think its a huge part of buying audio equipment. How equipment looks and feels, particularly when it comes to speakers. They are audio furniture.
my first speaker i bought over 20 Years ago was because i went to a local store to listen to s great deal some JBL floorstanding speakers. after listening i asked if i could hear something else and listen to a pair B&W DM601s2 Despite having less BASS the JBL's were garbage compared. so I went home with a set of B&W DM602s2
Unfortunately until you understand , used gear is the best way to maximize your💵. Buy a $10k piece 40% to 60% off new. Warranty is only useful in 2 to 3 years normally. Buying new gear is also experimental and just cost much more. Do your Dodecanese and educate yourself and use your good common sense.
I've decided to stop for a while. It is hard to move stuff without taking a huge loss. Even on E-Bay, they rip you off with their cut, then shipping is outrageous, etc. There are no showrooms anymore like in the 80s where you can go and touch and at least listen to many different products. I mostly rely on UA-camrs who review gear, but even that at times can be misleading. Hooking a product up to $50K in gear for example when yours is $10K, $5,K or less.
Yes. I don't want to make ANY big mistakes buying expensive audio. I'm not a rich American audiophile. I'm a Yorkshire man in retirement. I spend as long as it takes before choosing amp, speakers, source components etc.
If I'm not sure I will try to audition at home if possible.
In order to free my decision making being limited by looks I don't care about looks my hi-fi lives behind large cabinet doors. Although It actually looks great by accident not through choice
Great topic Steve!!! I buy something mostly based on Brand name and sound quality. I am a big Technics fan, and their new audio gear is just way to expensive for me. I still have the Technics gear I bought new in 1989 and it works perfectly to this day and I use it everyday for at least 3 hours. The sad part is the new Technics gear is so expensive so I am forced to buy other brands. I am impressed with Yamaha audio so if anything happens to my Technics gear I will probably be buying Yamaha, piece by piece, But I still have the incredible Technics Speakers I bought new in 1989 and they work perfect and sound incredible. Hopefully they will last me the rest of my life!!
My AS-10 (AcousticResearch licensed acoustic suspension 2-way large bookshelf spkrsys)were solidly built 'high-
Value' affordable speaker kits in 1964. Really desired the highly acclaimed AS2ax by AR but each enclosure was more than a month's pay(USAF..E-4).
The AS-10s served adequately & were still beautiful dark walnuton all surfaces expt back...so The pair was totally refurbed w/UPGRADED hi-db spkrs + superTweeters & 3way crossovers. wt=~42lb ea encl. Conseratively rated to handle ~ 150wrms. My fav among the 8 pr of spkr sys because they deliver such wonderous vocals.
DJ-in-TX 15:51
I bought marantz because I listened to the hype and it made my ears bleed and I had total fatigue. I was perfectly content with my Sony but it blew out completely. And yes selling gear is fraught with problems. Could never sell my gear on eBay. Ugh!!!
The way to avoid mistakes is to buy good gear that is well supported and has a good reputation USED! Then you can experiment your arse off and never lose a dime. And if you have a good sense of what is a great deal, you can even make a few bob (shekels) along the way. Good Mid-Fi is the sweet spot for turning over gear easily. Esoteric audiophile brands do not turn well.
After going for a long period of time trying to upgrade my loudspeakers and failing and then having my ML 333 ampliffer die and then going for a long period without and amp, I made an impulsive purchase for a Mono pair of 400 W Parasound JC 1’s when I found them on sale for $2000 off. I thought I remembered a very positive review by John Atkinson where he after hearing bought a pair. They sound fine but I think they are overpriced for the sale price of $16000 a pair. I believe most of the upper end electronics is way overpriced. I also think many audio dealers don’t serve the customers well.
I always find a dealer that will allow me to test a product in my system before I buy. I spent several weeks comparing audio research and Krell amps at home - absolutely vital and I avoided a very expensive mistake.
I prefer buying used, open box, or model close out to take some of the depreciation hit, should I want to change direction later. Create a short list of options and be patient usually searching out a deal on,. Same rules apply to other hobbies when possible. I typically over research on projects.
Audiophile stuff is a bit difficult as I don't know many who are into it and a showroom isn't exactly like being in the house. I have more than one expensive hobbie. So, max bang for the buck is a constant calculation as well as being realistic about how much my untrained ear can detect. Ultimately it is about kicking back back and enjoying listening to some music.
"Get what you really want"
ok , great but how does a person know what they really want if their experience with that gear is limited and not in their own home /listening environment .
the best you can do is have a friend that you spend a lot of time with and get to know the set up that way or listen in a show room ,: make comparisons and pick the one you like the best . there is always some unknowns .
as to the advice of pick the one that has the best resale value , is terrible advice .
That advice is as bad as buying what you don't want because it's on sale.
if you know what you want then forget about resale and enjoy it for years and years . if you are buying with resale in mind then you probaly don't know what you want or are obsessive and lack the ability to appreciate what you have .
Hifi dealers hold limited stock these days and will often push you towards gear they have on hand and try and talk you out of an indent order. I guess they want the cash and the stock turnover. That has happened to me before. You need to be firm! Also some brands are very hard to get service, so I agree with Steve's warning about that.
I love a good story behind somthing. The first hifi stereo i fell in love with was the G.A.S. Son Of Ampzilla with dahlquist dq-10s, simply because it was my dads setup in the 70's.
My first acquisition was an Aragon 4004 with the matching 24k preamp. Loved the Dan D'agostinoI, "poor mans Krell" connection, still think it it the beautiful. Brutal and monolithic... could look at it forever.
The stereo that keeps me dreaming is the 47 Labratory, 4706 Gaincard and the lm3886 op-amp such as the Akitika GT-102. Love the simplicity, amazing sound and fun.
I like to move around when listening so open baffle, electrostatic, and omni-directional speakers are fun and interesting.
Dont care much about numbers if i donr feel anything about the product!
I built a pair of TI “Overture” LM3886 amp boards built from scratch from plans published in the magazine Audio Express. Made my own circuit boards and all. Just be sure to use big heatsinks. I understand Jeff Rowland used the LM3886 amplifier modules in one of his integrated amplifiers. The LM3886 boards combined with a basic 12AU7 tube input stage are still rockin’ 10 years now in a pair of powered speakers in my office.
If it’s ugly it’s problem not designed well functionally in a lot of cases (unless it’s eccentric 30k type ugly I guess)
heck, my house is full of stuff that I bought just because it was a good deal;-) I use all of it, but I would have probably made different decisions if that product was not on sale. I bought the original Elac UniFis because they were an open box sale. Think I paid $200 for them at the time. Hated those speakers. They are sitting in a corner right now. I should be able to get most of my money back, but that was a complete kneejerk purchase.
What about being in EU on holiday, buying speakers there for less money and sending package to neighbors home.
That is so very true Steve ! Caveat Emptor; please give careful thought to each purchase to facilitate the most satisfying result !!
It is vital to audition any hifi purchase in your own home, the bottom line comes down to your budget you can get a great sound out of a budget system if well matched. The other important thing is to audition gear with a cd or vinyl you know has been well produced and you know very well, these days good hifi systems don't have to break the bank manafactures know how to produce good quality hifi gear at a budget price why? that is the biggest market.
If you cant pay with pocketmoney dont buy. As simple as that.
Great show Steve!🙂 I like the multiple VSOTD's supplements and to Bring Herb on the show is a very sound idea!
Hello Steve, long time follower ❤️ ✌️ and 🎶
This is my comment for the Algorithm!
Thanks!
Brilliant 😅😅
*Your advise and opinion is very valuable Steve. Listening to you is always very fascinating. Thank you so much for sharing years of experience and knowledge, greetings from the UK.*
Thanks for watching!
Who doesn't appreciate more Herb?
Everyone wants your money.