Speaker Cables Really Don't Make Much of a Difference?
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- Опубліковано 24 бер 2021
- In this video I actually measure cheap vs expensive cables using very precise test equipment connected to an amplifier and resistive loads as well as a loudspeaker to show the amplitude and distortion differences. The results may surprise you. Have you been sold a placebo when it comes to "high-end" cables? Watch this video to find out.
0:58 Test Equipment
2:31 Speaker Cables Under Test
4:10 DC Resistance of Cables
4:47 AC Resistance of Cables (Rac)
6:22 Inductance of Cables (Ls)
7:12 Capacitance of Cables (Cp)
7:59 Reference Equipment
9:22 Frequency Response & Distortion of Various Cables with 8-ohm load
12:19 Frequency Response & Distortion of Various Cables connected to Loudspeaker
14:30 Placebo Effect and Listening Bias
15:30 Burden of Proof is on the Cable Manufacturer
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I was once present in a Kimber demostration with Ray Kimber himself presenting his cables. He setup his demo with one pair of speakers laying on the floor and connected to an amplifier via cheap cables, and another identical pair of speakers on top of them and connected to the same amplifier using Kimber cables. Sure enough, when Ray A-B switched both pair of speakers there was an audible difference in favor of the speakers connected with Kimber cables. When I remarked that the audible difference was most probably attributable to frequency response differences caused by the different positions of the speakers, he flatly denied it. I then asked him to switch the positions of the speakers so those connected with Kimber were on the floor and repeat the test, which he reluctantly did. Now the speakers with Kimber cables were at a disadvantage, and at that moment most people present understood we were being fooled by a high-end cable manufacturer and left the room.
That's as bad as the Monster Cable demo that compared the brightness of light bulbs using their 12awg cable vs generic 18awg. People wee in awe not realizing they were being duped since both set of cables, although the same length, were different gauge in favor of Monster.
Kimber Mountebank
"I then asked him to switch the positions of the speakers so those connected with Kimber were on the floor and repeat the test...." That was a stroke of genius on your part. Hats off to you.
To make sure both speakers were truly identical internally I would have asked him to swap the cables around along with the placement of the speakers.
I was at a audio show where Monster Cable was demonstrating the difference between lamp cord and their cable, each connected to a separate Dahlquest DQ10 speaker. Sure enough, the speaker with the internal treble volume control turned down sounded muted. How about that!
Audiophiles are super humans with the power of super hearing but like all super heroes, they have one weakness..their super hearing goes away the moment their vision is blocked
Epic comment right there 😂❤️
Nailed it...
There is a lot of people who consider themselves audio files but like people who wear glasses their ears are not in tune like their eyes are not in tune. It's amazing the percentage of people who do not have a flat band and foreign listening capacity with their ears as tools and it limits everything after that point.
🤣
It's like food, visuals is 50% at least
As a professional audio engineer, I know this to all be true. I also knew this over 3 decades ago as a 12 year old with a budding interest in audio (and a subscription to an audiophile magazine). Some people just prefer the buttery smooth sound of their own voice when they say how much they overspent on speaker wire.
Well said sir. I wish some would place the thickest of veils over their mouth or other methods of expression and cease feeding a market of BS that is actually holding back geuine advancement in fidelity of audio reproduction.
But it sounds much better when they have gold plated teeth.
@@jobinjon That gave me a good laugh.
Perhaps we can get the music industry to recognise this and have all singers gold plate their teeth. I'm a Dental Surgeon and I endorse this for my financial health and love of music! :P
Willy wavers!
Pro audio engineer here as well for over 20 years... our company just used Belden 10-12 gauge wire for all of our massive PA systems.... The machines might give you some differences,,,, it's all the same.... ears won't hear the difference.
I am glad I came across this video! When I was setting up my system, I was telling the sales guy that I could not hear a difference between the $3k cables vs the ones for a couple of hundred. He blasted me with all this gibberish (like you pointed out) of floating highs, thundering lows, yada yada yada ... so I switched the cables myself when he went to get a different CD, and low and behold, he kept pointing out how great the cables were, until I pointed out that he was really talking about the cheaper cables HAHA I then went to a different store to buy my stuff HAHA Incidentally, I think the same way about some of these wine guys who can taste the wind in Chardonnay in April when the sun was partly obscured by 3 clouds over the knotted oak barrel that had some rust on the steel hoops HAHA
I would not be man enough to tell him the truth...too embarrassed to myself
You’re a legend dude!
When it comes to car audio the cable matters such as ofc vs cca. Non ofc power wires causes voltage drop to big sound systems and distortion to speakers wired at ohm lol
With wine it MIGHT be true, with cables never
There was a study published in the journal Brain and Language (2001) where 54 wine experts were given two glasses of wine and asked to describe the flavor of each glass. One was white, the other red. The experts identified the flavors of the wines, describing them as you might expect of a red wine and a white wine. Unfortunately for the experts, both glasses of wine were actually the same white wine, but one had been dyed red using a tasteless food dye. Wine terroir is almost certainly less important than what kind of wine it is, and if the color can have such a strong effect on the experience of the drink as to override what type of wine you're drinking, you can be sure that the difference of a particular year, or one farm vs another, etc, is made up garbage, and the "experts" are just sniffing their own farts because the culture has convinced them to do so. @@johnholmes912
Finally someone who does a common sense test of speaker cables.
Thanks for the Video. 14 years Electronics Technician in the U.S. Navy Submarine force. Gene, you are spot on with your measurements and explanations. People who dislike this video and message are in denial. Most likely because they overspent on speaker wire ~ Peace.
In a blind test I hear changes in cables on my system every time. For better or worse... Explain that.
@@infooptimalfitness7720 Whatever you can assert without evidence, I can dismiss without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens.
Thank you!!!! I'm an electrical engineer and have know this all a long. I remember once walking into an High end audio store to buying a amplifier. The sales man started talking about speaker wire. I let him ramble on for a few minutes and then I told him I was an electronics engineer. He immediately stopped trying to sell me the expensive cable and handed me a spool of 10awg.
I get asked this question by my friends all the time. I just tell them to go to the hardware store and get the multi-strand 14awg or thicker wire. Sometime they don't listen to me. Sometime they will start talking about what the sales man tried to talk them into buying. Now I can point them to your video ..... Thanks!!!!
I did all this testing back in the late 90's and came up with the same resaults, I even ran some blind test with a friend who managed a Hi Fi shop with some clients. They thought they could hear something, but looking at the resaults they were random. we did trick them by telling them they were on the expensive cable when they were not.
You did a blind test where you tricked them?
Finally! A credible source who has the courage to measure it and say it! Thank you.
Calling the Denon PMA-A110 state of the art is a joke. My $2,999 Benchmark Audio AHB2 amp has orders of magnitude less distortion and noise than this run of the mill amp. And yes, the less noise and distortion results in a cleaner, clearer sound.
Forgot to mention the AP analyzer shown is at its noise and distortion limits when measuring the Benchmark amp output according to 2 independent tests.
@@edgeecards it doesn't matter you can't hear the difference in the measured distortion it's beyond the limits of human hearing that's all that matters.
@@edgeecards The A-110 shows extremely low THD+N for an amp of its kind: traditional Class AB Integrated.
Since you invoke measurements by AP (as such, tested evidences), you should know that you wouldn't be able to hear any difference between both if level matched. As you wouldn't between the AHB2 and Purifi. AHB2 measures better (and better than any amp out there) but both will be equally audibly transparent.
Also, the noise doesn't reach the limit mesurable by an AP (x555) at all. Distorsion yes, but SINAD is pulled down to ≈112dB only because of the Noise. Still the best performance measured so far.
@@curly1002 cite please.
Steve is officially competing with Steve Gutenberg for the craziest shirt award of 2021.
I just hope Genes ceiling came out nice after painting 😁
Gene's shirt is way way out there, light years in fact.
The best youtube presentation I’ve seen. Thank you for your clear, concise and logically presented explanation of speaker cables and their electrical characteristics along with the quantified results and test equipment used. Being an Electrical Engineer, who was a NATA Signatory and Calibration Facility Registration Holder of a Lab that could measure Electrical parameters from DC to daylight, it’s a real pity there are so many snake oil salesmen in the Industry where so much misinformation can be presented without any form of evidence.
I came across your video recently because I have just started getting into the home audio/ home theater scene. What impressed me the most about this video was the level of depth you went into analyzing the scientific data. You didn't just present a surface level overview of the studies, but instead delved deep into the methodology, sample data, and statistical significance of each study to draw your conclusions. Overall, I found this video to be an excellent example of how science can be effectively communicated to the general public... Thank you! (and Thank you for saving me my hard earned money)
Gene's voice came through my samsung s20 speakers very airy and chocolaty. Must be magic.
baahahahaha!!!
I disagree: to my ear, over my precisely calibrated and completely accurate system, it was thin and wan and sluggish, until I changed cabling, when it became like rich corinthian leather
LOL! Chocolaty...ya gotta love that audiophile term!
Must be all the chocolate 🍫 he eats lol
Must be the power cable your cell is using
Speaking as an audiophile, that was the most clear, useful and to-the-point 17:13 speaker wire audio analysis on UA-cam. Ever.
Exactly..good thing am new to to this stuff and learned this early
The fact that he talks about measuring the wire itself and looking for many of the needed qualities of a quality speaker wire. I think the basic principle whether you are audio file or electronic Guru it basically all needs to get to the principles of electricity and Signal installation and that is with a foil sleeve and ground separated. Also have ESD sleeve. A science with different strands of wire as well as the core to the strands. I have not yet seen anyone make a speaker wire with the way I think they should be done. I am still waiting.
@@MacNifty awesome insight. You pinpointed out something special about grounding. Sheathing could connect to a small battery or large capacitor to soft release the energies. Am I getting that correct?
Hi, i turn on the close close caption in English to try understand better as my first lenguage is not english , can you help me to understand better what he said , just a little resume, i will appreciate a lot!!
I agree!
I have been reading and watching your reviews and technical know how for years. Since I purchased the Yamaha rx-v2700 back in 2007. Purchased after having read your review. I still have this receiver as the main source in our 5.2 family room. On almost daily since new and never a single problem. This cable video is just one example of so many honest, well explained videos and writings. Just wanted to pass on a big thank you Mr. Dellasala All the very best to you and yours. ~Mike in Montana
i have a BAS in electronics engineering, and maybe 22 years in the field. I really like how you did this video! REALLY informative, and you are obviously educated in this field as well
Not many people know what inductance, capacitance, susceptance or a decibel actually represent.
I love to see you do a comparsion between an "expensive" unbalanced cable compared to a budget XLR cable.
balanced would only bean advantage if you had a very very long cable run
Gene says the most sensible words I've heard in a long time, "we need more science in audio". Amen. Massive cred to Gene for doing this. My biggest Audio Hero, PWK, also had a great line about this (you probably know it already), "if it isn't based in science and physics, it's Bull$#!t". He also liked to insist on measurements because "if you don't measure, you can't possibly know what you have". These tests lend credibility to those of us who recommend generic OFC wire, and to manufacturers like Kimber, who actually STICK to the science and physics of it. Just makes me wish that the more nefarious peddlers of reptile juice could be shut down by the FTC for making false claims.
For years they have been treating the consumer as fools. Is always with gimmicks and features. Fancy looks and fancy slogans. Fancy prices and fancy brick and mortar display centers. quality materials fine. We really do need more science with audio just like we need more science to tell the people on the media about the science they go with for about this disease and vaccination schedule.
I do in a sort of way agree with you, but allow myself to be skeptical about our scientific capability.
Imagine 200 years ago and the newest science then, it did in no way measure radio waves, and still did radio waves exist.
Electricity has also been outside science, so has infrared and lots more. Also, he did at no time measure the sound, only the electrical properties. :-)
@@friedmule5403
What you seem to misunderstand is that the sound which you’re referring to is exactly what was measured. What’s being heard is actually electronic values of an electrical signal which comes out of the wall socket and processed by your audio system, and which fools your brain into think that music is being played in you room which actually has no instruments or musicians. IT’S ALL ELECTRONIC SIGNALS NOTHING MORE.
@@ReubenAhing Yes you are in a way right BUT:-) What you have is a signal in and out where you can measure every degree of distortion, noise and whatever. What you do not have is the human ear.
If we do take a tube-amp signal and a solid state signal and measure both, is there no doubt of what signal would look like somebody had purposely destroyed the signal. Still do many prefer the tube "sound", that meaning, noise, distortion and so on, in not the only factor in what the human ear likes.
Therefore, do I suggest putting the debate to rest, while truly measuring the sound, in the same way audiophiles have done it for a decade. An alternative is to find out what différance there is between a great sounding distorted amplifier and a bad sounding clean one,
EDIT: Forgot to say, you are at no moment fooling your brain in any way, your brain is 100% doing what it is supposed to do. What your brain does is to convert pressure waves to sound, and it dont care if it is produced by speakers or instruments, it just translates what it gets. This is also why the question: "if a tree falls in a Forrest and nobody is around, does it make a sound?" is stupid, because sound is only there if you have something to convert the air movement to sound. :-)
@@friedmule5403 The human ear has no relevance in this conversation. This whole video is about cables. The only function of cables in this scenario is to transmit electrical signals. And the only value of the cable is to transmit the signal as close to the original as possible, from one end to the other, that's it. Everything else is putting lipstick on a pig.
Don’t show this to the reviewers that push the ultra high price gear cause they’ll blow a gasket telling you you cables should cost at least half as much as your gear. But you did forget about cable lifters, now that’s where the sound difference really starts! 😂😂😂
This is brilliant. As a longtime fan of generic 14-gauge Home Depot cable, you’ve confirmed what I’ve always believed about high-priced speaker cables. It’s “jewelry”.
I agree! I bought a 100 ft roll of RCA brand 14 gauge copper zip cord at Home Depot ($30) six years ago. Now unavailable and replaced with spools of "speaker wire" for double the price!
Reading speaker cable reviews is gold
A more apt color would be 💩
This is such a breath of fresh air. Science vs snake oil! Thank you!
My ears feels good with 4 cables per speaker with inner diameter 1.2cm with cross each same pole from the other and in tied.
So don't believe anyone and make some cables to feel if it is a difference.
Maybe, but what if the measurements can not show what you are looking for? :-)
He is trying to judge if they sound different, but has absolutely no instruments that measures the sound. It measures the electrically properties, and even that does in some few test show a big difference. I think his result is like if you send water trough two pipes with the same diameter and measures no différance. Nobody has tasted the water, if it tastes the same. :-)
look up blind tests.. @@friedmule5403
Thank you for taking the time to run these comparison tests and for making this video. It’s extremely helpful to have empirical tests like this without the overly artistic audiophile commentary found in so many other channels and publications. FYI, this is a great video length for you too. I love the info you provide, but I rarely have the time or attention span to sit through your normal 1-2 hour long videos.
Thanks so much for this video Gene. I've been into home theater and audio for over 20 years and no one has ever given me a better explanation about cables than this. Please keep up these great and informative videos.
Excellent work Gene! Thank you for putting in the time and effort into this! 🙌🏻
I'm just waiting for the next argument that the differences can be detected at the quantum level by those with clean auras and a highly meditative sonically induced trance state. So the next audiophile product would be a meditation chair, Himalayan seasalt lamps used by monks, and aura enhancing essential oils. Hehe. Good video!
Van Den Huul actually makes makes health rings (bracelets) that they claim also can help improve the sound of your system.
LOL
Or it just gets dismissed by the "listen, don't measure' religion.
I find the best way to counter cable snobs is not to argue the merits of the cable but to ask what else you can do with the money they cost.
Like, those cables cost $600,- I can upgrade my phono cartridge for that or tube roll my amplifier. Don't you think that is going to make a bigger impact? The nice thing is, you can play this game indefinite.
"So the next audiophile product would be a meditation chair, ...(snip!)
Funny you should reference that, I actually own a meditation chair!
It's enhanced with plenty of reading material to expand my mind, and I flush when I am done.
Oh, there are huge difference in the cables. It's just that all of us on this page lack the golden ears that only the cable manufacturers seem to possess. Lol 🤣🤣
You answered all the questions I had in mind. Thanks for the great video.
Glad I found your channel! Found others, most say the difference is very little. But with your equipment, makes it clear. Thanks again! 🤘
The plebs rejoice! It is nice to know my finite budget can safely be distributed elsewhere in my system.
Spend your money on speakers. Done.
@@jimmythefish I have a denon e300, KEF C60 (sealed bookshelf with 8" drivers) and an SVS NSD sealed 12.
These speakers don't thrill me, it is hard to tell if they need more headroom or my receiever needs better speakers, I suspect both honestly. Midbass isnt there.
So I was thinking, get another sealed SVS 12, get a decent amp, speakers and room treatment.
On $15000 USB cables..
@@jimmythefish And room treatments. Gene did mention room treatments.
@@ghostrecon3214 I have the C30 kefs. Sadly the midwoofer doesn't have midrange clarity. Partially a symptom of a polycone woofer
Mad respect gene, you show actual measurements and flat out say there is no audible difference. There are alot of people on UA-cam that will say there is a difference even though they know for a fact there is none. Now if you want to buy cables because they look nice or alot of effort went into making them go for it. Love the content, keep it up!
excellent video. Love the fact that you actually took the time and effort to do the tests. Your scientific method seems solid.
15:23 - real nice pun there. Slipped it in and didn't even blink. Great info and in-depth work on the cables as well - thank you!
Always glad to have my hearing and sanity affirmed! Thank you, I can hear differences in systems and setups but haven’t hear differences in cables. Thank you.
As an engineer and an audiophile, I never bought into the hype of expensive wires. I was very happy with my Kimber cables.
LOL, Kimber Cables ARE expensive cables!
Every couple years i get antsy when i dont have a new piece of gear i want or need to buy and start looking at expensive cables.
After spending a couple hours looking at different cables I'll eventually watch a video like this or read a measurements forum. Brings me back to reality and reminds me my current cables are already of good quality and i need nothing else.
Thank you
You're chasing that dopamine hit moment of when you first heard a nicer system. Now that you have that nicer system, there really isn't any new audio experience that is going to wow you like those early BIG moments and upgrades. That's why people go chasing this kind of snake oil.
@@jonnyo2121 I think you described the situation perfectly 👍
Audio technology reached its absolute peak about the time of the Apollo moon landings, when transistors delivered stable, quiet and flat frequency response from 20 - 20 k Hz. Everything since hen has been splitting hairs. That’s why audio equipment reviews are so subjective, using adjectives (airy) instead of objective measurements.
Excellent channel.
"I know there's gonna be a lot of resistance on this." - brilliant!
Consider the induced reactive response!
Gene Thank you again for this video, peoples must stop thinking cables are magic and those videos need to be reposted often to show the reality up there! in the past i use to buy audioquest cable thinking i had the best sound possible spend a fortunes on those. now i use regular knukoncept cooper and old monster cable i had left over to realize that the '' Sound " remain exactly the same. thank you
23 years ago, I purchased my first surround system, it was a 5.1 Kenwood with a 10" sub. The cables were 16g pure copper. I remember saying to myself how tiny they were but the system always performed so well. The only difference in quality of sound that I can honestly say is going from RCA to Optical from my DVD player to the receiver.
Thank you for the tests. Much appreciated 👍.
Amazing!!! You just told me years of your research! Knowing that this test equipment is still around and being used i hope younger people want to learn this and continue it on. Everyone this is great info!!! People need to research and learn and ask questions, if you get a mean answer then keep asking till gene or someone trustworthy sees it! Great work Gene!! Really great work! I hope people see more outta this!
Great video Gene! I love how you put your SOTA audio test equipment to use, unlike some other YT audio reviewers that have them sitting in the backgroung accumulating dust while they blabber away unsubstantiated claims and fooling themselves into thinking that their aging ears can hear things that can't be measured.
Thanks Gene for explaining this audio topic in a clear and concise manner that even a schmuck like me who has practically no education in the field of electronics and electricity can almost understand. Touche' and keep up the great work.
Thanks Gene. I appreciate your testing and reporting on this. These are things that I've long been wondering about, and you have clarified it greatly. I enjoy many of your other videos. They are all very informative. I am also subscribed. Bell notification is also on now. Thanks again.
Great job. I’ve been waiting for this to drop.
So cool, Gene. I love the open testing and 'real world' explication.
Excellent. Thank you so much for your hard work on this video test. Very informative and eye opening. Best Regards and keep up the great work. Love it.
I bought Kimber Kable 8TC just because of your videos for my Martin Logan Classic ESL9'S AND NAD M22'S . I wanted a great cable that was worth my money and to know my speaker cable would never be a weak link. Thx for all your great videos!
Superb informative and honest video, well done Gene, i've been saying more or less the same thing for 52 years. Hats off to you
Finally somebody explained this properly! Kudos for your time spent to make this video! 👍🏻
That is probably the best information on speaker leads I've ever heard . Thank you .
Just the video ive been looking for . Thanks
Great video Gene! 👍Glad you showed some excellent measurements! I made my own DIY (and DIY video) 10ft pair of cables for about $60-70 😎. I’m super happy with them!. I do like a bit of an eye candy and good durable construction.
Great explanation, supported by some well described and decent research. Highly appreciated!!
That was so informative and brilliantly presented. Thanks for your incredible work and you have a new subscriber
Memories! I came across the Kimber cables from years back when I was a more engaged audiophile, endlessly searching for THE system, whatever that was! As an EE as well as an audiophile, the Kimber were the only specialty firm speaker cables that impressed me as having bon-fide engineering applied. I had a rare respect back then for the Kimber team.
Interesting to see the Kimber performed better. More interesting to see that it doesn't matter for audio at all. Imperceptible to human hearing.
@@tvtime1505 Yes, true!! 😉
So basically what you are paying for is the how the cable looks rather than how it sound, it’s a bit like choosing a gold bar as a door stop
@frankcousins7655 Yes, practically speaking, the Kimber cables do look nicer than regular zip cable, sure. Of course! But they are well made and so do instill a long-term confidence in them also. All without the expensive voodoo oil hyperbole. Actual engineering was involved. And regarding the doorstop scenario, hey, wow, a gold brick as a doorstop would look rather incredibly impressive!! But with the economy diving the way it is, definitely no, to using it as such. It's better to squirrel gold away in a vault as one of many means of protecting wealth. I'd use a mason's brick as a doorstop instead! Cheers, and good day! 🍺
Once again, I can't praise Gene enough for taking the time to actually measure equipment, and therefore giving us a no BS result!👍👍
"Jewelry" is perfect. I have my living room system bi amped with 14/2 romex specifically because I want it to look like a clever, cheap DIY guy outsmarted the man.
Super informative! It's what I thought, but this confirms it. Thanks
Great video Gene. "People hear what you tell them to hear"-Albert Einstein
I just became a supporting member. Your time, effort and attention to detail are a much needed and appreciated addition to this expensive and complex hobby we have. Thank you for all you do!
Love the videos and the research Gene! Keep up the good work. Thank you for being honest and helping to educate us all.
Nice post Steven. Respect brings respect. I'm on the hunt just now for some cables. Hence..
Regards from Valencia Spain.
I’ve always wondered but couldn’t find a good source. I had been using audio quest wire at like three dollars a foot for the last 20 years and when I moved to a 11 channel system, I wasn’t about to lace all of that through the walls. I went to a 12 gauge copper strand wire and I’m enjoying my system immensely. Thanks for taking the time and effort to invite science into the conversation
Great Video! Thank you very much! Finally some real testing in a Cable Video! Best regards from Austria!
It doesn't matter what tests you do Gene - the 60+ year old, golden eared audiophiles with bat-like hearing will always "hear" a massive "night and day" difference between cables
Hey I resemble that remark 60+ years old !!! BUT my ears only whistle like a bats - and cable is cable - spend the money on your significant other so they let you indulge in your passion.
Some are 70+ and have hugely successful audio review channels.
They hear a massive difference until they are forced to do a blind test where that massive difference disappears completely. what a waste of money.
@@dlloyd6300 What do YOU care? Is it YOUR money??
@@robertherman1146 BS is BS, regardless of whose money it is.
I swear your emotions and feelings have a deeper affect on how you hear sound. My hifi is rackmountable and I custom built my cables to the perfect length and each channel has it’s own colored cable sleeving. Even all AC power cables got the custom treatment. I put a couple weeks into building the cables until everything looked perfect. The appreciation of the craftsmanship that I put into my cables has a bigger impact on sound than the actual cable material. I know if I swapped the current perfect cables for the reject/mess-up cables I built it will sound worse because I don’t appreciate them as much. It’s kinda like when your stressed, it’s harder to focus on the sound of your music. But when you start relaxing, you can notice a difference in sound.
Agreed. Music always sounds better to me at night, especially if I killed it at the gym and still have endorphins going...
I wonder why that isn't the case at Hi Fi shows, where there is usually a consensus regarding which system/room sounded the best? Were all the observers in the identical emotional state? And only in THAT room?
@@robertherman1146 well, it’s like a wine tasting. You mentally prepare yourself before showing up. Also, you bought tickets to a hifi convention/show. Pretty sure you wake up with audiophile on the brain.
This gives me peace of mind. Just moved and was getting ready to setup my system and wondered if I needed to get new wire. Maybe better wire. Great video as always!!! 🔈
Excellent! In the 1980s, I built and sold speakers ... as a hobby. Later I was a product developer and R&D manager at Telecom for a few decades, I know a little about transmission lines. Very good video, thank you. I have had interesting (and short) discussions with sellers who want to sell me a lot of copper at sky-high prices. Sellers are usually quite limited in technical fact discussions 😁. Great to see someone who makes a good measurement effort and presents the result. 👍
after seeing all your videos, I've stopped using expensive cables and instead going for copper 12 AWG generic cables. Thanks for doing actual science!
I thought the same, I had my flagship arcam and Canton reference book shelf with oppo player hooked to regular bestbuy speakers wire with no conditioner power supply and reg hdmi cable.
Base not great and clarity was also not the best. I thought I need to upgrade my amplifier. More power required.
Then I was advised to look into wires, hdmi and power conditioner.
Did some research and purchased van den hul ultimate hdmi 4k cable, then same company mid level speakers wire and Puritan conditioner. Ask my wife to listen before after difference.
One simple answer. Big difference, base went up, much refined sound and distortion was gone.
I used to hear mild noise from arcam tridol power supply now that is gone.
Thats my take on this. Personal and family experience.
@@jackryder6732 lol oh boy...
@@mattw3406 This is the typical snide reaction from people claiming to know it all yet look like they just fell out of a Goodwill in terms of personal appearance. You really don't know what the difference was, or whether it had an effect.
haha, the guys smoking crack. the hdmi didnt do anything, the other ones didnt either. but people believe what they want to believe, its why these cable companies continue existing@@PeteNice29
Excellent, Mark Waldrep, PH.D., professor of music production at Dominguez Hills in California would love your approach, he calls out smoke and mirrors as well, but not to disparage others, but to speak the truth about audio. Well done.
Wayne Kerr, never gets old.
Gene, you were wonderful. The only things left are Pepsi challenges in actual listening testing. I noticed that you did not want to hurt the feelings of the high priced speaker manufacturers. You said that many cables have some merit in construction and beauty but functionally, they are nothing more than "jewelry". Great presentation.
Gene is the man! Keep up the great work! In our modern world of sketchy information, it’s great to have someone give you real facts with no BS! 👍
Thanks Gene. I normally use 12 gauge CCA cable. I splurged and bought some generic OFC 12 gauge cable from Amazon, which is still cheap compared to so-called high end cable. Thanks for validating something I always felt. I will never spend thousands on speaker cable but I will start using a better grade of cable just because I have invested a bit into my systems.
That's the key. Use the very best CHEAP cable. Even though it probably makes no difference, I make the leads as short as possible and the same length.
Awesome presentation with a very candid and thorough explanation of audio cables from the cheapest to the ridiculous, thank you kind sir.
Outstanding test and report. 👍 Thank you. 🙂
Hi Gene I think this is the correct way to go is measurements rather than emotional conjecture that can tell the true story. Keep up the good work
Thanks Gene. I always thought that was the case with cables.
Hey man this is a great video I love the amount of detail you put in it.
including all the equipment that you use you use and the graphs
You are the real deal
I have a few suggestions for videos if you could use that testing equipment to let us know a
good better best scenario
External Dacs , rme, modi, soncoz, topping, denafrips
Audiophile power cables
And even skw speaker wire
Keep up the good work
Hi Gene thank you for an excellent review. What is the maximum length of speaker cable you would recommend, and does the gauge matter if you need a longer cable? Many thanks Stephen
Scientifically confirms what I sorted out years ago. I never claimed there *wasn't* a difference, just that the difference was insignificant and surely not worthy of spending $100's to $1000's of cables. I found that investing that $$ in better amplification and speaker technology always yielded superior results.
Thanks Gene! Great work here.
Greetings,
In the early 1980's, high-end speaker cables were beginning to appear on the market. Some of the product claims were totally unbelievable and had prices to match. And, the nonsense is still being foisted on us today.
Audio cable must be burned or run-in for a 100 hours. The best cable is cryogenically treated. Audio cables are directional. They must be supported off the floor via insulators. They have damping factors. They must be 'conditioned' to keep the wire molecularly aligned. Ad nauseam. It is all snake-oil designed to part the naive buyer from his money. It is all a crock!
The ONLY factor that affects performance of audio cables is the wire gauge for a particular maximum distance between amplifier and speakers at a particular Ohm rating. If you have the proper gauge, all audio cable will sound exactly the same!
"Realizing that wire resistance was the critical factor in speaker wire, Gordon Gow, then President of McIntosh Laboratory, still a maker of world class, high fidelity amplifiers, used a speaker cable demonstration to show there was no listening difference between high-end audio cables and plain line cord (14 AWG lamp cord wire).
Fifty-foot lengths of wire were used in the blind comparison. The setup consisted of a master control relay box and two slave relay boxes. A three-position switch was used to select one of three different speaker cables of equal length. One was common line cord. The other two cables were from popular high-end manufacturers. 8-ohm speakers were selected for the test. The two other brand name cables were heavier than the line cord. The test proved his point. No one could hear ANY DIFFERENCES using several different 8-ohm speaker systems." -- from Speaker Wire, A History by Roger Russell.
@@stevefranks6541 but did they coat the wires with the required Slick 50 teflon treatment for better signal lubrication?
Most the passive crossover components in "mid" HiFi speakers let alone the exterior cables are terrible, inductors with thin AWG wire and capacitors that drift as they age ahha
The point is that AFTER spending on the best room treatment, speakers, etc, cables, especially AC power, make a huge difference. Just huge.
But if your system is cheap, no you’re not going to spend $1000 on a cable for a $1000 amp.
@@Fluterra AC Power Cables make no difference, nor does power conditioning, the power supply in any component is responsible for giving the electronics +- DC or split rail in audio amps, so AC wiring bears no impact, basics.
Please cover interconnect as well.
Awesome. What a terrific video. Very well constructed and dumbed things down for us non-audio engineers. Thank you for doing this stuff!
Great work. Appreciate the time and effort you put into this
Thanks. This is reassuring because my cables are nothing special and I often wonder whether I should spend more $ on cables and wires to get better sound. Clearly not. Spend the $ elsewhere.
Here they come Gene, the Fancy Cable Mob with pitch forks and fire cross' to the Audioholic Smart Home...Oh how dare you speak the Truth....lol..
I run Mediabridge 12AWG to all of my SVS Ultra speaker 7.2.4 setup. Denon x6700h to Monolith 7x for floor speakers and an Outlaw 5000 for atmos speakers, they sound great with those in wall rated cables from Amazon. I have learned so much about room correction and speaker placement that has improved my home theater experience from this Amazing, Truthful Channel. 👍
Fantastically Informative x.
Good analysis. You could also see the difference modeling with crossover design software. I think the WK LCR meter will give a model of the components, or it looks like a series RL. Plug the equivalent circuit elements in and it should also reproduce what you've found in the frequency response. The phase should be shifting from 0 deg towards +90 deg starting about a decade below the break point where you were measuring the inductance rise in the frequency response. Not sure how much difference phase shifts make at high frequency - maybe similar to shifting your head a few cm. It would be great tp see more info on phase at lower frequency - what if phase shifts within the bandwidth of an instrument's tone? Should be canceling more than without significant shift in phase, similar to two channels being out of phase.
Interesting video Gene, all my speaker cables and interconnects are from Mogami. They have a very good reputation and are not expensive. Thank you for the service you provide to the audio community
Mogami makes great cables, snake oil free.
I use mogami gold guitar cables. Great stuff with lifetime warranty.
Gene, did you send your speakers to Danny at GR-Research for an upgrade? Maybe you'll hear the difference then
@@mag290, tweaking the speaker CAN'T make a difference to the "sound" of the cables. Did you watch the video?
@@mag290
🤣
Great information Gene. I would like to know your thoughts on Monoprice's flat speaker cable. I would like to have rear channel speakers but getting cable to that wall (it is an exterior wall) would be very difficult. Monoprice touts this wire as something you can paint over and never notice it is there.
Thank you for your tremendous work!
Always wondered about this... 👍 Thanks so much.
Thank you for clearing that up! I use a spare electric cable for one speaker, it works as good as the thicker speaker cable on the others, but is easier to hide on the wall. I think the non-symmetric layout of the placement in my room is the bigger difference, but even that is not audible after setting it up with a microphone wizard in the amplifier. Not an audiophile, but I do like good sound!
I use monoprice 12ga. I had long runs for some bi amped speakers and I used double runs to effectively increase the speaker gauge. Thanks for the continued great content Gene.
Mono price cables are copper clad aluminum (CCA)! Essentially junk.
They have pure copper also
Very nicely done. Great to see a realistic and scientific approach to making a meaningful test. So happy I didn’t buy in to the overly expensive cables. I did buy what I think are good cables.
Great video. Thanks for doing this! :)
Excellent video. I'm using 22 year old fms audio wires. In a bi wire set up. Zero on the bottom and diode for the upper. Very happy and still then for another 22 years
The loudness difference of .3db, and distortion difference of 0.006, I am sure is purely a function of the conductivity improvement of the wire. Great tests! Confirms my snake oil theory.
Thank you, as an electrical engineer, I always wondered why the audio industry as a whole doesn't do many legit testing and measuring since its all very objective. "this speaker feels so airy and the mids are just smooth", wtf does that mean give me some measurements! Thanks again. :)
That's quite right. Question though- the sound hits the ear drum, then gets sent to the brain to be heard, so is there or counld there be some quality which the brain hears but yet is not measurable on instruments, it being instruments are not a brain?
@@tituslawoffice4778 , eggzackly
@@tituslawoffice4778 good point.
ask your möyö stig ma about äirynäß ^ ?^
@@tituslawoffice4778 If there's no device on the planet that can measure it, then there's no way you will be able to tell the difference. 99% of people can't even tell the difference between 320kbps, and lossless FLAC, which on paper is very measurable. This is assuming your hearing is perfect, your listening room is perfect, and your speakers are thousands of dollars as well as your amplifier.
Thanks for this excellent review on cables!
First time watching your channel. Impressed with the thoroughness of your research and presentation. Just subscribed. Thanks