Why the Dutch Wait Less at Traffic Lights
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- Опубліковано 26 лип 2020
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Hate waiting at traffic lights? Yeah, me too. Good thing the Netherlands has smarter traffic lights to make sure that happens as little as possible. It's amazing what you can do when you design to move as many people as possible, instead of as many cars as possible.
Special thanks to Matt from BeyondTheAutomobile.ca who helped with some of the content for this video. www.beyondtheautomobile.ca.
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References:
Safety Evaluation of Protected Left-Turn Phasing and Leading Pedestrian Intervals on Pedestrian Safety
www.cmfclearinghouse.org/detai...
www.cmfclearinghouse.org/study...
Signalized Intersection with Prohibited Right-turn-on-Red, Highway Safety Manual, 1st Edition
www.cmfclearinghouse.org/detai...
www.cmfclearinghouse.org/study...
All Directions Green (Tegelijk Groen) - Groningen
Lucas Magalhães (UA-cam, used with permission)
• All Directions Green (...
Rood, groen en geel
75 jaar verkeerslichten in Amsterdam
onsamsterdam.nl/rood-groen-en...
VETAG / VECOM / SICS
www.ssstechniek.nl/vetag-vecom...
Nautikaris Korteafstandsradio (manufacture's website)
www.nautikaris.com/products/t...
Verkeerslichtbeïnvloeding (Wikipedia)
nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Verkeer...
Korteafstandsradio (Wikipedia)
www.wegenwiki.nl/Korteafstand...
Groningen installs rain sensors for cyclists at traffic lights (The Netherlands)
www.eltis.org/discover/news/g...
Why giving transit vehicles their own lane speeds up traffic (the Downs-Thomson Paradox):
• Do Your Buses Get Stuc...
Every time he says "In the Netherlands.." I drop another penny in my migration jar.
I might have to start saving up too.
There are only to option, have your Citi update its streets or move to the Dutch ciclyts paradise.
Dont worry, we welcome all in our country as long as you obey our laws and rules (and also some unwritten rules that needs time learning). And like 60% of the poepte in the Netherlands can at least speak a few words English.
Though at the moment it might not be an opportune time, we have a housing shortage in the near her lands and the housing prices are very high. Cities are very expensive and houses in villages and towns are very sought after and people with money buy them For 20.000 euro minimum over the asking price
Just a heads up 😜
if you are from the US can we exchange? I want to get out of this country and move to the US but its hard to get there... The Netherlands and the EU accepts everybody. and yes its not a good thing.
@@Underp4ntz_Gaming_Channel I'm from Colombia, do you need Colombians? Shakira? Sofia Vergara like?
In the Dutch city of Enschede, they have traffic lights that will give even higher priority to cyclists and pedestrians when it is raining.
And the lights hang above the cycle path, comparable to traffic lights for cars.
They've done that to the intersections in Groningen as well. They modified it last summer I believe.
@@wimvdg that's.. kind of insane, but I guess it works ?
@@wimvdg that's incredible!
Very stupit to let cars wait for bike👎 its mean more co2🤪
I never understood how 1 person in a car has more "value" than 1 person walking or on a bicycle.
Normally it is that they assume a car will have at least two people in it, compared to assuming it will have one person even if that is more common now. In some ways I can understand this as you have the capacity inmost cars to have two to four people in it, though to me even with this cars can travel to a location much faster than other modes of travel as such giving way more often to those forms of travel would not make that much difference to the drivers arrival time.
Cars have more than one person in them on average but in busy city intersections there's usually more pedestrians waiting to cross than people in cars, definitely
really they should have less value. For the same practical work, they take far more energy and space and they incurr more road damages. Assuming the value of a vehicle is the value of the work of transportation minus the costs to maintain and use. Speed is less useful than fluidity, as the speed of stopping drastically shifts the balance
That is because you don't sell cars or make your living because of them!
It's simple, actually, both persons have no value, it all comes down to how much their transportation costs per person.
I know this an old video, but an interesting titbit:
There was a study done in The Netherlands on traffic lights with varying degrees of efficiency.
It concluded that people were far more likely to commit traffic rule violations at poorly optimized traffic lights.
So not only are efficient traffic lights convenient, they also reduce traffic rule violations and thus improve safety even further.
Soo true! I’m a Dutch person and I was on a vacation in Spain a few weeks ago, they have the same traffic lights system as in the USA and it caused people to walk / drive true red lights all the time! And as a Dutchmen it really shocked me but we are just spoiled.
@@jacks3395 I live in Argentina which Im guessing has a similar system to Spain, many times you'd end up waiting to cross a completely empty street just because of a dumb red light. What do most people do? Ignore the traffic light and cross anyways because it makes no sense.
As an American, I can guarantee I have violated traffic signals on several occasions because it is so annoying to wait an entire cycle to proceed.
Exactly right. As a bicyclist in the US, it's obvious that the traffic signals ignore me. So I return the favor.
That's pretty logical, if traffic lights are efficient that would mean there would be almost always, unless the road is deserted as in the night, traffic crossing the intersection. This would make it outright dangerous for people to ignore the light and cross anyway, and takes advantage of our danger avoiding instincts, that most people still have.
As a cyclist I'm far more inclined to wait at a smart and busy intersection than I would be at a dumb but mostly deserted intersection.
Another Fun Fact of traffic lights in Netherlands. Priority vehicles like ambulance has a device on board that gives GPS coordinates that gives their exact location for the emergency call center to monitor, or the Commando post. But this device also makes it possible to intervene with traffic lights to turn red for the crossing traffic. So that they can take their priority in safety.
Meanwhile in Singapore emergency vehicles obey speed limits & stop at red lights
@@lzh4950 that's really good! There is a number one rule in our emergency services. Own safety first. And that is what Singapore will respect too.
We have that in the US as well
I think, we should to establish these innovations in Germany ... it's perfect and more conflictless : )
Busses as well, but that also might just be that one place in my town. I've had several times that I was going to school (elementary school) and that I had to wait like 8 minutes in front of the traffic light because of the busses, eventually the light turned green because of, how surprisingly, a bus.
North Americans reacting to European cities is how I imagine time travellers reacting to the future.
North America is so antiquated it's mind-boggling.
@@theuniversewithin74 not all european countries have this. Having something like this is expensive in big countries. Eventually can be implemented but will take time. I hate not having something like this even for cars. Having to wait 3 min in a red light at night when there are no cars running on the others lanes sucks. They only need sensors but a bit more expensive lights. I know it can be expensive to maintain but will helps everyone live way more.
Well I normally say that the US got stuck in the 1960s on many levels. The following seem to be very underdeveloped: Healthcare access, average education, consumer rights, police training, weapon safety, worker's rights, financial security and public transport.
@@brunobruno1152 yep sone of that applies for Canada as well
@@dodovomitory3496 ah OK! Didn't know!
Something else very important I didn't see mentioned is how the timings are controlled to the millisecond. The Dutch engineers realized that each second that cars/people have to be stopped significantly increased the length of stopped traffic. So for example if you're the last car crossing a intersection, the system sees that and while you're still going across the light, it already changes to yellow so the other people waiting can have their green asap. There's basically no downtime where cars or people are not crossing an intersection. It's awesome and very efficient.
Here in the US, our “smart lights” definitely don’t do that. One car on a cross street will trigger the light, forcing 20 to sit for a full green light cycle.
Some american lights have this, as in they will wait until the "last" car hits a sector a bit before a light to start changing to yellow. This results in two things:
1) the "last" car will see a yellow at the transition to the "Point of No Return" (when stopping for a yellow is more dangerous than going through the yellow) causing panic to the driver and a hazardous situation.
2) It leads to some cars waiting at a red light indefinitely when there is absolutely no traffic in the green direction to trigger the change by "last" car.
So it does the same thing, but in the absolute worst way possible. How american.
Also in the netherlands .
People expect it will be green and chase through red.
a crossraod nearby the light are so close you had to run otherwise it will be red and cars will run you down.
If your light is green don't expect it is safe always look out.
I envy that so much here in the US.
@@ProtozoanKid
You mention an important difference in the design of these light between (most) EU and USA lights. Your light in USA is on the other side of the crossing. While it is on your side/above you in EU.
So EU design can be more responsive without confusing drivers since they are already past the light.
For the die hard car lovers out there.. Pedestrians, Cyclists and Public transport are good for you too. It means less general car traffic.
Thank you for saying this! As an automotive enthusiast, I fully agree. This needs to reach more people.
With regards to traffic, we take so many things for granted in The Netherlands. I love hearing all about the intentions behind it and its implementation.
I moved to Canada for work recently and have lived in The Netherlands all my life. All I can say is that the infrastructure here is weird and it feels like it is always fighting me.
I'm dutch but travel a lot worldwide...yes holland is very well organised and all is of the highest standards. But it's still a bit messy everywhere since the police is very weak in maintaining order. Anyway, if the weather is good Holland is a very nice place to be.
AniCator I am sorry for your lose , I am from Canada and cars and trafic scares me when I go back to Canada now , its like going back into time :( but the nature is nice in Canada :) to bad there no way to get to it in Canada :(
Talking Traffic is een samenwerking tussen bedrijfsleven en gemeenten om 'slimme' verkeerslichten te plaatsen. Zie www.talking-traffic.com/
@@truusjenskens8485 The police is more about serving less about controlling. So you will have less traffic controls more police helping people in trouble... but generally people stick to the rules. I have no hate towards traffic lights... its rare that i got to stand anywhere long.
I’m Dutch and I was like: “Wait, that’s not a thing?” Then I realized that i live in luxery....with my bike...
.
Here I am living in america, thinking, I would love to go on my bike more. But I can't because cars here don't give a crap about bikers or walkers. So it is very scary and risky to do so. But I really need the exercise
Lions2lambs it’s not because cars don’t care I’m sure they do it’s because America is a bad country
@@ghostlyducky362 do you live in America?
You just need to go to Germany and you‘ll find most of the unpleasant points he tells about American traffic lights as well :/
8:30 Amazing how hundreds of people went whizzing by just in seconds. I can't imagine what the traffic hell would be like if all those people each had their own car. Designing cities for only cars was a mistake
That's exactly what I thought. I have never in my life seen so many people on bikes in my life. I wish we had the same amount of bike traffic here. Then the city would finally care about our safety.
If you look at old traffic footage in black and white you see lots of bikes
It was more widely used before cars became mainstream
But it was a calculated mistake I guess. I don't know - and that would be very interesting to know - how this decision was made. For me it's hard to believe that no one sound the alarm on the consequences of relying that much in cars.
@@lu4414 big oil and gas paid for tons of adds during the transition to change minds. It wasn't a mistake. People did fight back against it for a bit. But this was done purposefully with all the intend to give car and oil more power
US law makers: "it's just not feasible for light signals to be able to detect a single motorcycle, so we'll make it to where if a car comes up behind a motorcycle the motorcyclist should pull just barely into the intersection and if a motorcyclist sits through 2 cycles of the light they can turn on red as long as it's clear. Even though both things put motorcyclists at higher risk it's just how it has to be" (this is literally the law in my state).
Netherlands: *lights change for a single bicyclist before they ever even need to stop*
I swear in the US we're determined to do things the stupid way.
this dude's entire channel is essentially, "This is why Toronto sucks and I'm glad I left" lol
This channel is a bit unfair to Toronto, to be honest, just because I go back there a lot, and it was the last city I lived before the Netherlands. It's definitely not the worst example (that would be Phoenix, AZ), but just the convenient one. I've lived in and visited a lot of cities in a lot of countries, though. I bash Brussels a lot, too.
Actually, the real reason I hate Toronto is because it has so much *potential* to be great, but isn't.
But you have fucking SILICON VALLEY with superior software engineers that get 200k a year or more !! How come so little is automated in USA? USA doesn't even have a robotic arm company for production. Only Germany and Japan make those. So many software engineers in USA earning massive amounts of money and what they do? nothing?
@@HermanWillems Silicon Valley is busy figuring out more ways to monetize people's internet use.
@@NotJustBikes Brussels is confusing and disorienting. Unindicated double laned roundabouts, pedestrian crossings where you don't expect them, bus lanes coming from nowhere. I drove there for no more than an hour, almost hit 2 pedestrians, a cyclist and almost had a bus in the trunk of my car.
I drove about 1200km through Sicily on a holiday, that's actually far less scary than Brussels. And I drove through some pretty small mountain villages and roads...
@@HermanWillems I hope you realise that silicon valley is not in Canada, right?
The Amsterdam traffic light have also a morning rush hour and evening rush hour mode, because the traffic flows in the opposite directions.
That ... makes sense! I suspect that they do that in North America, too (traffic engineers spend all their time thinking about moving cars) but I also wouldn't be surprised if most cities didn't do that.
It's not just Amsterdam, even smaller towns have different modes for times of day.
Also there is regularly a night mode on traffic lights here, after 22:00 or 23:00 traffic lights will just be disabled since there is limited traffic. This is a common thing on major roads in The Hague.
@@NotJustBikes Yeah I think everywhere does that. In Toronto the standard used to be 3 modes ("timing plans"): "Morning rush", "afternoon rush" and "other", but now the standard is for Morning Rush, Afternoon Rush, Weekend, Night and Other. The difference is that in the Netherlands the timing plans are much less rigid. While North American designs will typically have at most a handful of degrees of freedom where the timing can respond to real-time traffic movement, Dutch signals will commly have dozens and dozens. So the real-life traffic signal phases are often totally different than the background "timing plan" (hence why the countdown timers skip so much time).
Ha ha! When there is a schedule based setting in the Netherlands, then it is to slow cars down.
The inner city streets will just get clogged up, so no use shoving more cars into the system. In the evening, you might want to flush cars out as fast as possible ... but not if the motorway is jammed.
Added feature: As soon as cellphone roaming data detects slow speeds, car navigation users will get recommendations to use a motorway ramp on the other side of the city. The fastest route, not the shortest.
If done right, it is a system. Not just one intersection.
One traffic light rush hour mode I still remember is from an intersection close to my old high school. During the morning rush hour (and this was before they modernised the intersection and about 15 years ago) the traffic light would favour the bikes lanes that lead to the school, making the wait time so short that barely any cars could move and dozen of bikes could cross. And it was a good thing too, because there were always so many teens on bikes.
I'm sure there are many other places in the Netherlands which do the same around high schools, since they have so much bike traffic every day.
The fact we live in a smart technology era and we are still ruled by a 1960s traffic light system is absurd!
Here in Canada, when cars make a right turn on red, the driver always looks to the left to avoid cars passing. Often, they completely ignore the possibility that there is a person who might be crossing the street to the right from them. It is really easy to get hit by a car as a pedestrian.
Its so stupid too. You have to look left to make sure you dont get rear eneded, and then rapidely check right (Oncoming and from your tight right) to make sure you dont hit a pedestrian, basically forcing you to rotate your head rapidely 180 degrees just to not end someones life. Like how fucking stupid is that.
@@grishnikov48 don’t forget about the bike flying by in the bike lane so you have to almost break your neck to look behind you
@@Conrailfan2596 Oh yeah, like when I try to continue on my bike lane, but they are so many cars starting to turn right that I'm force to awkwardly zig zag between them...
same in america, its pretty much impossible to be safe when making such a turn. You need to be looking far left and far right at the same time
Check for pedestrians crossing periodically when waiting for a gap. After knowing the gap sufficient look in front and right. If you are still staring left you are unsure if it is safe to start so do not move yet.
Im from the Netherlands and finally I understand why waiting at a traffic light in GTA is not possible for me
Hahhaha I get you!!
wait, you mean those metal pole's with light? your not supposed to destroy them with a tank?
Legend
I'm from Los Angeles and it still isn't possible
bro je hent volledig gelijk
Dutchie here: Last week i even got a lettre from my townhall, if i could fill in a survey about what traffic locations i think are confusing or dangerous. :) Safety first. Im proud of the Netherlands.
You should be proud of the traffic system. The rest of the world should take the walk of shame. LOL
Its only that safe and good in the rich neighbourhoods and small villages
I am too. Netherlands = best lands
@@saafisgoed8139 No.It's everywhere like this in the Netherlands
@@saafisgoed8139 nope, not true. This happens everywhere
I currently live in one of the few US cities in which I can be happily car-less and visited my family in Clearwater, Florida. I was determined to get to a bike path less than 1 mile (1.6 km) away without driving so I decided to bike. My bike trip included no bike lanes, sidewalks that ended with no prior warning, a completely broken pedestrian crossing signal (it went through 2 whole cycles before I gave up and hoped I was crossing at the right time across 6 lanes of traffic), a completely blind right turn for cars that would hit me of they happened to be turning when I was allowed to cross, a "hit this button to put flashing lights on this sign that tells drivers you may be crossing but doesn't tell them to stop or slow down," some weirdly sharp and completely blind turns on a narrow sidewalk (it is way too dangerous to go on the road there), and a sudden change in pavement that I slowed down for but which led to my phone flying out of my purse in my basket and landing facedown on the road... all to bike somewhere less than a mile away...
America: The land where you need a car to go biking
This week: Ambiguous blinky yellow pedestrian crossing lights!
Next week: The HAWK - a signal stupider than its acronym.
What city? I'm moving
@@MSCCA I was living in Chicago at the time of the comment. The other city mentioned is Clearwater, Florida
the netherrland: where traffic is designed to accomadate ALL traffic and where cars do not have 200% priority. where cars tend to give bikes priority, even in places where cars have. where car roads are closed rather than bicycle paths when there is maintanance on the bicycle path, so the bikes can go on the car roads without delay. where there are roads that are car-sized, but where only bikes can drive.where it is completely safe and socially acceptable for 6-ish children to go out on their bike, and for 80+ year old people to cycle wherever they want.
8:25 I'm at awe at the beauty of this perfectly optimised crossing of people. The sheer coordination. Amazing.
It looks like coordination, but it's actually a few simple rules, just like a starling murmuration. When you start crossing, you have priority, and the closer you get to the other side, the more you have to yield.
Living in Amsterdam.
I always thought “nothing spectacular happens here”
Could it be i am a bit spoiled?
You are definitely spoiled.
Very spoiled!
dutch privilege - not being discriminated against for being a cyclist
I miss being spoiled. Living now in cyclist unfriendly city of Luxembourg.
@@micheltibon6552 ,.
Hey hey y can visit Amsterdam anytime but Sunday mornings are the greatest to bike around.
Enjoy life as much as y can 🍀💪
I never thought a UA-cam channel dedicated mostly to talking about traffic would be so addicting to watch. lol!
I've been BINGING this channel lately!
I have a hypothesis: most things are fascinating when you get into the nitty-gritty details and have someone who is enthusiastic about the subject.
@@sgtpastry probably. but this is also very interesting due to the relevance and importance
I like how this channel focus on the cultural side of city design, it's not a technological limitations, it's not even a cost limitations - as pedestrian cities saves on almost everything - it's a culture one. Some places decided that people in cars are more important than others, others decided that everybody should be able to get around easily and safely.
8:25
"Traffic lights where bikes get a phase all at once"
Man I love those, one moment every car stop and the next "Chaos - Activate!" XD
its not as chaotic as it looks. for cars it would be a disaster, but bikes can do that kind of stuff much safer and smoother.
Although it only works in places where people aren't hot-headed. They tried it 1 day in Delft(?) and it was a disaster. It works flawlessly in Groningen and Enschede.
The thing to remember is that when you start crossing, you have priority and when you're at the other side of the intersection you need to yield (because you have already crossed, so making someone wait for you might mean they get a red light). In between you have a sliding scale.
This only works if people are not self-important jerks. It's only difficult if people ignore each other.
Yes, I am passionate about this.
You're not the only one who's fascinated by the traffic lights in the Netherlands. In fact, I quit my job designing traffic signal operations in Toronto and moved to the Netherlands to learn Dutch traffic signal engineering, work with Dutch signals, and hopefully bring some of those things home to Toronto! And yes, the exercises with traffic signal design are indeed much more difficult here! I've identified a bunch of features and reasons, and I'll be making a series of videos this summer to unpack the factors which make Dutch signals are so much better than ours. The difference is absolutely night and day.
You have already mentioned some of those features, such as the multi-stage crossings that give as many opportunities for pedestrians to cross unoccupied parts of the intersection as possible, the widespread use of fully-protected signals (including right turn signals!). But the reasons are also more complicated than simply "cars vs transit/bikes/peds". That was certainly the case in the past, but today the issues are much more complicated. In fact, the document you cited (the Toronto Traffic Signal Operations guideline) states on page 1 that the objective of Toronto traffic signal operations is to minimise PERSON delay, and encourage non-car modes of transportation. In fact there's nothing at all about cars in the guiding principles. Until 2015, this objective was simply "to minimise VEHICULAR delay" like you describe, but that is simply not the case anymore. Of course old habits die hard - engineers have spent their entire careers optimising for car movement, the equipment available for Toronto to use is all based in the North American car-centric mentality which means that Toronto often gets painfully inefficient results using it in a different way than intended, it takes a while to completly revamp an entire signal system to follow a new objective, and every other jurisdiction outside Toronto still optimises for cars. I could go on for hours, but I think it's easier to unpack these issues in video essays than a comment on a video...
Thanks for your comment! Yes, I know that the document states "PERSON delay" now, but as you said, old habits die hard, and in my experience, what actually got deployed in Toronto didn't always meet that "vision." And, of course, there are hundreds of traffic lights and they didn't all get updated in 2015! :)
The biggest issue I have in Ontario is that the traffic manuals just don't have the right street designs available for truly safe streets, so engineers can't really build them. Especially when it comes to cycling. The Ontario Traffic Manual Book 18 is absolutely pathetic when compared to the CROW Manual. The tools for safe and effective streets just aren't there.
Ctrl+C, Ctrl+V, minor changes to fit it in properly for the win!!!! Everybody likes this kind of industrial espionage here. Steal all our ideas with our blessing. :P
@@NotJustBikes All very true. And there aren't just "hundreds of signals" in Toronto, there are over two thousand!
OTM Book 18 is remarkably useless considering so many of the other books set such high standards for roads in Ontario - then the cycling book basically just says "yeah whatever, I dunno". The City will be coming out with their own cycling infrastructure guidelines soon, which set much higher standards than the OTM. But although the City's original intent was to implement Dutch signal designs, those were thwarted by pedestrian (!) advocacy groups who opposed the multi-stage crossings and thereby eliminated any possibility of efficiently implementing real-time traffic control or fully-protected signals.
@@OntarioTrafficMan Always expect demographic advocacy groups shooting themselves in the foot. I'm guessing their reasoning was something along the lines of "multi-stage crossings will slow pedestrian journeys". Of course, they're not only wrong, but a slightly slower much safer journey is absolutely preferable.
@@Quintinohthree Yes that was exactly the reasoning. The problem is that advocacy groups and local politicians tend to label certain things as "good" or "bad" whereas in fact they can usually be either good or bad depending on how they're implemented. And it's not a question of slower but safer journeys, multi-stage crossings could allow pedestrians FASTER and safer journeys by giving more opportunities to provide a Walk light across part of the intersection. All single-stage crossings accomplish is to force people to stop even when there isn't anyone in the way on their part of the intersection.
As a Dutchie, those huge American intersections are somewhat intimidating to cross. I'm used to having crossings with separated sections, and slower car traffic with fewer lanes. And I think they would be terrifying for elderly, children or people who can't walk well.
Yes! They are! But North Americans have become totally desensitized to it. Unsafe intersections are just expected.
It's not just America who has these Intersections, our neighbour Belgium has them as well. probably why Belgium is the least liked country to drive around in, in al of Europe.
A lot of elderly people here cross these big streets far away from traffic lights as traffic is only coming from one direction at a time.
But that is the problem with American streets. The are just huge. And that does not make them safer. Instead, people are driving faster. In the Netherlands you have to cross a much smaller street and traffic islands are used for pedestrians as well.
That's not even the biggest intersections I've seen.
I started watching this mornibg, I've been radicalized in less than 20 hours.
Love your content and as a us citizen totally agree that planning for citizens crossing on bike or foot is awful.
It has probably been mentioned before, but at busy intersections Dutch traffic lights have a separate program for the morning and evening rush hours. It is also a goal to make each cycle no longer than 120 seconds in which all directions have been dealt with once. Not only pedestrians are given a head start, but cyclists also receive the green light a few seconds earlier in the event of partial conflicts between turning motorized traffic and straight ahead slow traffic. The road user can see from the traffic light whether there is a partial conflict: with an arrow light there is no partial conflict, with a round light there may be a partial conflict and attention is required.
I am a civil engineer in the Netherlands and we have 2 types of trafic lights, managed and static light. The examples you pulled up are all managed lights and they indeed detect cars and bicycles and changes the timings accordingly. The static system just gives green in certain intervals and they are falling out of style fast. Also, all traffic light systems are designed to be conflict free. That means, 2 lines of traffic will not cross paths when they are green. The book to learn this was not more then 50 pages (for introduction at least) it was fun to learn! I might still have it somewhere?
This video brought up a question for me. In the US our walk signals turn on for a specific interval of time based on a standard fast walking speed - even able bodied people have to rush to get across before the light turns green for cars again. For people who are elderly or have disabilities that affect walking, we often don't even make it to the middle of the street before the walk signal turns off and cars are free to go (sometimes zooming off right in front of us) again. Do signals in the Netherlands account for this (like with sensors that can tell if someone is still crossing) or do the walk signals there also just stay on for a specific amount of time?
Could you find the title of the book? I would love to read about traffic light systems :)
@@liambean The difference is, that in the Netherlands there probably is no crossing where you have to cross more than two lanes at the same time.
I agree! Please share the book title!
@@5thElem3nt true because if that would be the case we would either dig a bike tunnel under or build a bridge over the road to improve safety and traffic flow.
Hell if nature get in the way of traffic to often they get a "naturaduct" or however they're called here.
Everyone: North american right turns give me so much anxiety
Me coming from Asia: wow north american driving is so peaceful and relaxing :D
I got scolded by my father for entering a roundabout's non-outermost lane, when I wasn't going to take it's 1st exit. Heard roundabouts are a pretty unfamiliar thing in my country as well
What kind of weiner gets anxious from making a right turn?
Must surprising thing is when someone finds the driving in your country peaceful when you already know it's not. It's nice to have Peruvian friends :P
Southeast Asian city centers are insane. I would never drive there myself and I consider myself to be a fairly experienced driver.
You haven't seen Africa😂😂😂😂
This sounds too good to be true. I knew about "smart traffic lights", but this seems to take it to an entirely different level...
I've sent this video to someone I know at my city's transit department (:
As a kid cycling to school in the 90s I hated when the traffic lights became smarter. I had learned the patterns of the old "dumb" lights and would alter my cycling speed to arrive just after the light turns green (even going so far as to delay a bit more if there were a lot of people blocking the path). Once the lights became smarter it became impossible to predict :)
during the winter it feels like the entire city is just a green wave for my bicycle.... people in their warm cars get their priority lowered a notch and rightfully so ;p
yes, in the winter my home work commute is 30 minutes by car, in the summer its 20 min. But in the summer I want to bike, in the wet winter, not so much... aaarch!
@@Blackadder75 they make it longer in the summer so you can take a sip of water at the traffic lights so you don't get dehydrated ;)
I'm pulling this out of my ass, but why not look at it that way?
@@Selfaggrandized he said longer in the winter, not summer
@@specialopsdave Think about what Selfaggrandized said. Would it make more sense to drink water in the summer when you're in a car or riding a bike?
@@jaypaans3471 If i'm being honest, I take drinks of water at stoplights in my car very regularly since my A/C is broken
Then again, I have no choice but to drive because of a 20 minute commute that becomes 1 hour on our public transportation around here 💀
You're making me fall in love with our country and cities again. It's so funny, because I used to say how I found it adventurous to drive in other countries like the US for instance. Now, thanks to your channel, I'm starting to realize how it's not adventurous, it's dangerous and only adds to stress and irritation. Thank you for the effort you're putting in this, I'm a big fan of your content!
Thanks! It's good that people appreciate Dutch traffic engineering. It's pretty great!
@@NotJustBikes It is! But it's something we take for granted, as I'm discovering through your videos now. So, thanks for the insight!
It's adventurous. Most adventures include some danger. But as a tourist it's ok , you only do it a very short period of time, if you live there, it's another thing.. the last time I was in the USA was in 2001, and even then I already noticed how shoddy and backwards the place was (California, so not exactly a poor area) I concluded that the US is only a livable place if you are at least a millionaire, so you can buy yourself out the crap
I lived in Netherlands for 5 years and a year back moved to Australia, I am angry every single time walk crossing a traffic light. Now I clearly understand why. Thanks for the video.
I'm blown by the level of sophistication of these traffic lights.
The dutch: "I just don't understand why everyone loves our country"
Us: *dramatically gestures to this video*
This channel
So what exactly is America good at? Aside from racism and guns.
Froggy 01 Hopefully not a collapse towards fascism.
@@froggy0162 I thought Central/Eastern Europe was good at being racist.Oh my bad,
*being homophobic
@Snails40 america is overrated. So many places in the world where things are much better. America is not so great
Having binged about a dozen of your videos I am now convinced that The Netherlands are already in the year 3021, whereas North America is the Middle Ages
Don't worry, most countries are stuck in the past. And also, while the Netherlands has all this great stuff for cyclists and pedestrians, it's also for cars. There are still way too many cars here as well.
Completely without cars is still fiction, but it's certainly possible to reduce it even further. Faster, (preferably) underground public transport hubs and hyperloop-like transportation, replacing trains and connecting cities and countries is the future in my opinion. And from those hubs access to fast and underground metro-like systems to suburbs and villages, replacing busses and trams. In tubes you can pull a near vacuum to greatly reduce the energy needed and therefore cost.
In combination with old fashioned walking and (e-)biking of course above ground. You have most of the ugly transportation underground that way, you have excellent and very fast means of transporting large quantities of goods and people, more space above ground for green and buildings due to reduced space otherwise needed for asphalt, only bike lanes and sidewalks. No more trucks and reduced transportation by ship due to efficiency in speed and cost.
The problem we have is that a car gives you a sense of freedom, you can drive anywhere at anytime, and it's an extremely direct way of transportation. You step into your car and drive to your destination. Therefore, you probably won't get rid of them completely. But if you offer speed and cheap or even free transportation it might convince people to, instead of driving by car from A to B, to travel by public transport from A to C to B.
Maybe the 'easiest' way to implement all of this is to build a completely new city from scratch, totally car free. I don't know but I for one would like to see that day.
We also have an education system which takes your grades and puts you in an according difficulty. This can be helpful, but in most occasions, it gives people unnecessary stress and sometimes lowers confidence.
@@berbal9658 isn't that last part just schools in general?
@@joost9098 sense of freedom my ass, i don't get to choose when I want to drive to somewhere in a car centric city i know i live in a car centric city. Lol hyper loop.
I just love how passionate this guy is about traffic design, it's such a niche thing to be furious about but I completely support it, what a great and useful channel
Thanks, dear Dutch, our neighbors to the west.
You again showed how we should improve here in Germany as well. Hopefully some intelligent traffic controllers see this and implement it.
As a Dutch person I really like how others look at our country. Things we find so normal are for some so exclusive and fun to watch/experience.
Like I wonder that you in America in some city's can walk down the shop with an AK rifle on your back without people being scared. While we can smoke weed in front of a cop XD
Meanwhile some of my countrymen are like "We have economic freedom (I think they're referring to neoliberalism) and freedom from crime/racism/school shootings, so stop asking for freedom of speech"
@@lzh4950 That's a sad thing to think. After all humanity is built on improvement, it should never be you have X and Y so you shouldn't be asking for Z.
@@Ometecuhtli Yeah some other people in my country call that a "false dichotomy", though it may be possible that we con't completely have both
I am an American. If you see some walking around with an AR15 or a knockoff AK47 in public, you should be afraid.
In many states, open carry of firearms is perfectly legal, and only in the hopolophobic states of Hawai'i, California, Illinois, New York, New Jersey, Maryland, and Massachusetts would open carry cause consternation--and it's illegal anyway. In fact, some of the states with the most liberal firearm laws actually have significantly lower firearm murder rates than the states with the most restrictive gun laws. The Czech Republic and Lithuania are the only EU countries I know of wherein you have a right to be issued a firearm licence--and concealed firearm licences.
In fact, in Alaska*, Washington, Oregon, Nevada, Arizona*, Montana*, Colorado, New Mexico (effective June 29), Illinois, Michigan, Virginia (effective July 1), Vermont*, and Maine, the firearms laws are liberal in that concealed firearm permits are shall-issue AND cannabis is legal for recreational use. (* next to the state indicates you may carry a firearm concealed without a permit--Vermont has always permitted carry with no permit and doesn't issue permits.)
In any event, it's unlawful to possess or be in control of a firearm if you're intoxicated by alcohol or other drugs. Also, in most states wherein recreational cannabis is legal, it's unlawful to use it in public, except in New York, where you may smoke or vape it anywhere smoking is permitted.
Check Wikipedia for state gun & cannabis laws. You'll find it interesting.
In many Dutch cities, the local authorities do their best to keep cars OUT of the city centers.
Only on certain times are cars and trucks allowed in the centers to resupply the stores and is almost always before and after the store opens and closes.
On some streets, cars are "guests" and have to give way to ALL other traffic and can't go faster than 30 kilometers per hour. (18Mph)
Fun fact, there are 17.28 million people living in the Netherlands and there are about 8.5 million cars and around 22.8 million bicycles. (around 1.8 million of those have electric assistance)
Considering you have to pay 6 euros/hour (I don't remember exactly) to park in Amsterdam, this is more than sufficient to stop me from parking.
@ Singapore's downtown parking is generally cheaper (mostly S$3-6 (~€2-4)/hr) & so are tolls, but cars (~550,000x with a ~5.7m population) are taxed more heavily (effectively ~200%), & you need to bid for & buy a document (called the Certificate of Entitlement, whose supply is controlled as a form of vehicle population control) to legally buy a car too. So the externalities of private transport are internalised more by the government than by private landlords. Perhaps this is how public transport fares can be made relatively cheaper here as well (with construction though not operation being largely government-funded I recall)
I guess many European cities preserve their centres by keeping cars away (except for those of residents and police and some buses). I've heard that here in Italy our ZTLs, Zona a Traffico Limitato, limited-traffic zone, cause many problems to tourists driving around
I'm in the midwestern US, and have leading pedestrian signals across the intersection of two major roads near my house. It's remarkable how much it actually DOES make me feel safer when I can clear half the intersection before car traffic is allowed to move. I still have to be cautious of the right-turners, but that's life in America.
Right-turners are the exact reason I stop in the middle of the lane at a red light, so nobody is getting past me until I make my way halfway across the street on my e-bike.
My bike has a super-fast take-off anyways, so people shouldn't complain. If they're in a rush to get somewhere, they should learn to leave a few minutes earlier.
I'm an expat living in the Netherlands for the past 2,5 years, I can say things like these made me fall in love with the country. It just makes sense!
Great. Welcome!
A belated welcome to the netherlands my friend! I hope you found us to be a welcoming place!
As someone living in the Netherlands, the intersections in America gave me anxiety
You’ll get used to it
I like this channel but I do think he exaggerates way too much. Having been to both Amsterdam and Toronto I didn’t feel any safer in Amsterdam. It’s not like drivers here deliberately turn right when pedestrians are crossing. Millions of people in Toronto including myself cross the road everyday without getting mowed down by a car. I’ve had more dangerous encounters with cyclists distracted on their cell phones in Amsterdam in a week than I have with drivers in Toronto in a year.
@@theactivecoconut6077 Oh yeah, Amsterdam can be a clusterfuck. Especially when you don't know how to deal with our rules and / or cyclists yet, it's a learning process. On the other hand, there's more to the Netherlands than just Amsterdam :)
@@whynikkiwhy Yes I also went to Groningen and Haarlem it was definitely less of a clustefuck. The Netherlands is a beautiful country! If you ever come to Canada don't be afraid of crossing the road the drivers here know to stop for pedestrians when turning.
@@theactivecoconut6077 The biggest difference is because in Toronto the road systen is just fundsmentally fucked, and in Amsterdam the accidentd are mainly because bikers are on their phone, or tourists don't get the rules. So it's human error instead of the fundamentals
I lived in Amsterdam. When I went back to Italy ,my country, I felt so frustrated by the traffic (dis) organization , total nonsense of lights, zero sensors , close to zero bike lanes . Using again the car make me wanna migrate again , but then I see the weather , the Caribbean water near my home, and my mind is torn apart! Then I see people throwing garbage everywhere not caring of the place where they live and then I want emigrate again. Your videos touches me deep. I wish to know how to import this civilization here,starting from things that could help the traffic to project to spread bike lane everywhere!
As a Dutch person with a long history of family vacations in your beautiful country, I can only say: Italy can learn and get better traffic system... but we have to make do with our rainy weather, and brown sea.
Maybe climate change will change the weather in the Netherlands. ;-)
@@autohmae I would not hope that , if it happens for real ocean rise due to climate change bye bye Netherland
@@LuckyM83 the Netherlands will build some really big barriers to keep the water out or to redirect the water where it needs to go. But if we have to much climate change then we can't do it. An extreme example I've heard is: 6 meter sea rise per year by 2100. That would be very likely be impossible for even the Netherlands to keep up with.
@@autohmae everything can happen , but I don't think it will be that quick.theres possibility that climate can even revert to cold like in the past then sea Will retire a bit. In the backyard of my home I found shells, like sea clams, lots of them , fossils, means that in the past there was water in the place im living( we are around 8 km from the sea).Also, nearby here , under the soil ( countriside)there is a really old church , houses remains from another era and my own apartment is build on top of tombs ( you know , Italy , found archeological reperts and they decided to build a big building on top of it, Italian logic .... But this is another story).
Aw, yes. Good old North America, where I get a mini panic attack as a pedestrian every time I'm at an intersection and given the walk signal, but I still have at least 3 cars almost hit me because they are also told to go
Prioritizing anybody who's going somewhere instead of only people in cars? What a concept...! Lovely video!
Very socialist way of thinking.
@@S1rWakka What does traffic signals expanding their field of considered civilians have anything to do with public ownership of industry? Yes, public services are socialist, roads, trains, schools, mail, all of that is socialist ALREADY. Having discussions about how to make the road signaling systems work more efficiently has no impact on where the funding for the road services comes from
@@jek__ Building roads that benefits as many people as possible is more socialist than buildings roads that stimulate the purchasing of more cars. Other addicts of socialism are indeed non-relevant here
@@S1rWakka What does traffic signals expanding their field of considered civilians have anything to do with public ownership of industry? It is in the best interest of both private and public industry to provide for the needs of the people who use the services they create
@@jek__ the only thing americans hate more than walkable cities is communism/socialism
No, you're not the only one who closely observes traffic signaling.
I grew up in Florida, which is one of the worst places in North America for pedestrians and cyclists. Years after I left, I had returned for a visit. While listing all of the things I didn't like about Florida, I said to a friend, "I don't even like the way they hang the traffic signals here!" I think he thought I was nuts, but that's alright. 😊
I agree. Traffic signals at the other side of the intersection seems so weird and ineffective.
@@xFD2x In Ireland they're staggered in such a way that there's a period when nobody is crossing in any direction on every cycle. I couldn't believe it the first time I saw it. No differentiated pedestrian green for right turns on yellow light, no separation of light cycles on each side of the intersection to avoid blocking circulation both ways when it's green for just one side to turn, etc... Not sure if they had terrible road safety because of all the drunk driving or something
My favorite traffic light is one here in Amersfoort. It’s at a crossroad on the major road around the city center, so most cars will just stay on the road, and won’t make a turn onto to smaller road intersecting it. Because of this, they’ve made the cycling traffic light that goes straight ahead permanently green, unless a car drives up the lane to make a turn, which will happen maybe once every 5 minutes. This way cyclists very rarely have to wait, even though they could easily cross.
I am enjoying everyone telling stories about their favourite traffic lights. :)
Welke kruising is dit? Is me nog nooit opgevallen haha
@@dimitry1653 Ik vermoed die bij de Amersfoortse kei / vlakbij de koopgoot. Die staat iig altijd op groen.
Dimitry op de ring bij de hendrik van viandenstraat bushalte
@@NotJustBikes The Nijntje one in Utrecht is of course the best traffic light, nothing beats Nijntje!(although the Karl Marx one in his place of birth in Germany comes close)
Here in Zwolle we have one of those all bikes green at the same time, like they have in Groningen, but i hate that. We also used to have a traffic light that wasn't a little man, but a woman. Pity they didn't bring her back when the municipality changed to LED.
The reason that i'm replying here is because Yfke's story made me remember that we have the same thing. When a straight route has more bike traffic then there is turning car traffic the right turn for cars is red while the one for continuing bicycles is green. Never ever thought about it, until this video...
The fact that trams have no priority is utterly insane!
I have been in the Netherlands many times. Once, after I landed in Schipol at late evening, I drove to Alkmaar. Approaching the city, there was pratically no people around. At any intersection traffic lights were red, but as soon as I was about 50 m away, they turned green to me. This happend at all intersection I went through. So I assumed that in such a condition they give red to all directions: when a vehicle (or a bike or a pedestrian) comes, they give it green if there is no other traffic coming. This was midblowing to me.
We also have something called "groene golf" (green wave), which isn't really a traffic light itself, but it keeps the heavy traffic, such as trucks (semi's) on a roll. These green waves detect heavy vehicles and keep the traffic light longer on green, even if there is traffic waiting to cross the intersection. These green waves are usually on main roads with intersections that have roads comming and going into a city or industrial area, to keep the heavy transport vehicles moving without stopping for a red light.
These wavy connections between intersections have another side. Many motorists race to the next to catch the green light there as well. And then the system detects that cars drive too fast and it punishes the decent drivers by going on red early.
It also decreases speeding! If you go too fast you’ll end up getting red lights again
I love watching traffic light patterns, but yeah I'm an engineer.
Im not, but i like watching it to. Im just curious;)
I'm a cities skylines engineer 😅
Trust me, im an engineer.
(The meme)
I hate watching them, knowing that they will just prioritise cars at all cost.
I do like to watch traffic lights as well. I also get paid to do it, since I program traffic light controllers!
My new favorite NJB video, I love how you manage to discuss topics people experience constantly in daily life but until your videos never gave much thought. (awful sentence structure but hopefully you understand). Going from "whatever" to "oh that is really cool, actually" in the space of 10 minutes. Or maybe that's just (the slightly inattentive, ignorant) me. Well done. Have you tried to edit/alter your at home traffic light, different speed or colors?
Thanks! I'm really happy with how this video turned out, and it was really useful to get help from a real traffic planner (beyondtheautomobile.ca).
My real traffic light has been gutted already, with LEDs installed (not by me). It actually needs some work (it's a bit flaky and the red light is partially burned out). The colours come from the original lenses on the light, so all of the lights inside are white. They could be changed with filters but given that they're original, and very old, I'm hesitant to touch them. It works with a wireless remote control already too!
... and in case anybody is wondering why these comments are older than the published video date, it's because Patreon supporters get access to my videos before they're published. ;)
patreon.com/notjustbikes
i HATE the right turn through a red in the US when i visit! Coming from the UK I see the red light and think "ok great, no car coming, safe to cross" and then as I am halfway across a car comes out of nowhere and looks so indignant that a mere pedestrian dares to cross the road!
and to think you have right of way ever if it was green for him
When I was in high school, I once had a temporary job for the municipality counting traffic users going through traffic lights at every light cycle. The goal of that study was to ensure that the amount of traffic users that had to wait wouldn't become too big, especially at the more dangerous places. So even if the traffic systems are already quite good in the Netherlands, we're always trying to find ways to optimize them even further.
A new video from Not Just Bikes excites me. then once im done watching it I realize i have watched all his videos already and then the waiting begins again. 10/10 would watch again
As MBO software engineer second year project we programmed streetlights
And some implementations we're added in our city (Hoofddorp)
And still noticing my programming where we indeed measure amount cars and or the time it takes to clear the streetlights and does other priority than other moments
Some streetlights have a sign next to them, don't trust your default ordering of the streetlights
Because the behavior changes at different scenarios
Love the attention to work that everyday people sees but not noticed
Here in Portugal it’s roundabouts and zebra crossing. 8 years in England driving drove me nuts by the amount of traffic lights everywhere at each intersection. And they were the kings of roundabouts....
The lift and traffic light software projects are fond memories from my days of computer science at university☺️ So lovely to see sophisticated implementations better people's lives in the Netherlands.
(Pardon me for skipping most of the over 800 comments.)
Amsterdam (where I have lived all my 64 years) used to be as car-centric as probably most of the world. There may have been a turning point (or several) around 1970. In 1971 a through tram service was created (not from scratch) to connect the (then) far West of Osdorp with the Centraal Station via the Leidseplein, as much as thought possible using its dedicated lanes (notably on the Overtoom) and control of traffic lights. The narrow Leidsestraat (which had already been closed to bicycles since about 1960) now got closed to cars as well. Moreover, the frequency of that tram service was raised substantially. It was a great success, encouraging the city council to extend the concept. In my impression (not an opinion), the idea shifted from "public transport first" to "cars last".
The original priority for cars may have been supported by left-leaning politicians as support for the rising wealth of the workers. But Amsterdam could not cope with so many cars. Hence the support (even stimulus) for public transport. Far later, environment and health entered our minds. You might say, that Amsterdam is back to private transport, only now on muscle power. And once again, the city runs out of parking space for private vehicles. (I'm primarily referring to the surroundings of the Centraal Station, but far more places in Amsterdam are short on parking space for bicycles.)
Once you see things this way (which should be just one of the ways to look at it), you're bound to see the next parking crisis arise in many places in the Netherlands.
So maybe MaaS ("mobility as a service") should be promoted once again, with cycling reduced to "last mile" (a term I'm borrowing from goods transport by rail) and recreation. That "last mile" would be both one's way from home to a public transport stop and one's way from a public transport stop to work or education, vice versa. If considerable shorter than "a mile" it could be walked, if longer, it could be ridden on a bicycle or perhaps driven in a car. (Yes, I'm skipping boats and weather conditions.)
At least here in the Netherlands, town planning tries to combine public transport stops with offices, conferencing venues, education, hospitals, sport venues.
Back to bicycles and traffic lights. (My experience may be outdated.) Cycling from Amsterdam to adjacent Amstelveen may show the political difference in the traffic lights. I remember endless pressing buttons and waiting when riding south from the Olympiaplein. (I do remember that same irritation from several locations within Amsterdam, but I have forgotten the spots.)
Anyway, in the last fitfy years views on "traffic" seem to have gone through quite some development, taking into account the various modes of transport, tweaking traffic lights in ever greater conjunction. (I have been pointed at the building from where most of the automated traffic lights in the Netherlands would be controlled.)
Nature, probability, and humans: *provide a challenge*
The Netherlands: THROW ENGINEERING AT IT.
To be honest, isn't that always the solution?
US: Throw feelings and politicians at it!
@@ArrowRaider and lots of taxpayer money
@@ArrowRaider US: Guns are the solution!!!! Guns and only Guns! God bless our Guns. :)
@@HermanWillems That is a very touchy american subject! unless you are in texas. Everywhere else, allot of people are scared of guns and will only have one in fear of another person with a gun
I remember loathing crossing roads in NZ on my last vacation (late 2019), seems like every intersection that had traffic lights had a push-to-cross button. That did nothing. I had to wait for so long (several minutes!) at every crossing that once I got fed up and had enough time to google the official NZ regulations (multi-MB PDFs) about pedestrian crossing design and how the push buttons were supposed to work, how long should they "stay red" after pushing and lots of others regulations... that not a single crossing actually seemed to obey. Cars are 100% the priority, that much was clear but near the end of my trip I just had to take a picture of a sign in Paihia (right at the start of Williams Rd) - it literally says (and I'm looking at the picture right now): "PEDESTRIANS GIVE WAY TO VEHICLES" 🤷🏻♂️
@@Anonymous-df8it Yes, that's why I took a picture of it
My friends and I are all studying ECE at UW (3a) and we wanted to tell you we love your content!!!!
Yaaaaaa! 🥳🤓🤩
Nice! UW is not the same since the Bombshelter pub closed, though. 🍻
@@NotJustBikes True! But ever since we started watching your videos we always make sure to critique the bad planning of the university and the crazy number of parking lots around :)
That’s University of Washington?
All these micro-moments of happiness when the traffic light gods smile on you and give you a green earlier than expected add up over time and with a lot of people. Especially in the rain and when it's cold. The counters suddenly going down very fast feels like the machine/matrix giving you a little 'there you go bro!'-moment. Good people-centred design pays itself out in cumulative happiness too. Even without taking into account the avoidance of the negative effects bad design has (annoyance, road rage, injuries, lost loved ones).
It's nice if they go faster than expected, but I have an intersection here where it tends to seemingly get stuck on the last part of the countdown. That is really frustrating.
You pointed out the most enduring effect of these human-focused designs: Little bits of happiness. Like a smile from a passerby. Together they make a huge difference.
Honestly as a dutch I wouldn't be surprised if we add priority to cyclists when it's raining, if we don't, we should lol.
@@GundamReviver - I'm afraid there aren't rain detectors in use to be prioritised by the traffic lights algorithm decision-tree. While getting soaked while waiting I had ample time to wonder why rain detectors had not been used. They exist for decades already.
@@tubularap Actually, there are. Groningen has some for bike lights and I read here in another comment that Enschede does, too.
In Rotterdam we have traffic lights that give priority to cyclists when its raining ;)
Afaik only on that junction on the Boezemlaan with the Nieuwe Boezemstraat
One thing to consider is how this changes people’s relationship to rules of the road. Torontonian pedestrians jay walk with reckless disregard, bordering on mild contempt, for things like walk signals. Largely, I think, because those lights are so dumb. You end up needlessly waiting far too often.
First time everyone standing next to me just started walking while I was staring obediently at a ✋🏻 signal I was a bit startled. Now I scare my suburban friends and family doing the same thing out of habit. It only took me a few DAYS of living in TO to stop looking at walk signals and start looking for gaps in traffic.
Pedestrians do the same thing in Chicago! I remember feeling like a goody two shoes for waiting for the walk signal when I would take a train to Chicago from the suburbs as a teenager. Now I wait for the gaps like you do 😂
We do have this in Berlin...That Pedestrians and Bicycles get their green light first in the same direction as car traffic as well.
And if you know this (our intersections are mostly stupid and hard-programmed), the drivers can also get going more frequently. "Bicycle has green? well, then it's my turn in two seconds"
Berlin intersections suck. I hated that the traffic lights are on the side of the street of the cars. This means pedestrians don't know what motorists see. Also sometimes you have to wait in the middle of the street because the boulevards are so wide. Cool city otherwise.
@@adanactnomew7085 Yeah i know. I'm living in Berlin. I was just refering to this little thing with the bicycle lights.
Pedestrean crossings at boulevards are horrible yep. *Stares at Kaiserdamm*
What I also like about the traffic lights here in the Netherlands is that some cities disable certain lights at night. This way you don't have to wait at an empty intersection at 1 in the morning.
Yes! They flash yellow at night. That's so convenient.
Next to a lot (I think most to even all?) have the paintwork and signs ready in case of a power outage. Changing it to a no-light intersection with the priorities.
And even if they don't disable them, at 1 am the traffic is very light so you'll get detected immediately and be given a green. It can literally shave half the time of a trip journey.
The intersection near my house here in (small town) USA does that; at exactly midnight the "main drag" gets flashing yellow and the side streets get a flashing red. I think another intersection further down does the same but I don't usually head in that direction that late.
@@ME-hm7zm I've found that very common in a lot of the US, in particular in more rural areas.
This channel is incredible. Every urban planner in the world should be forced to watch all the videos posted.
I'm curious how much the placement of the traffic lights plays in the safety of an intersection. In North America they are placed on the opposite side of the intersection and mostly high overhead, but in the Netherlands they are placed before the intersection and much lower. Maybe it has no impact, but I suspect it does have an impact. Aesthetically I think it looks better to have the lights lower and on the approach side of the intersection.
They are the stoppage point for cars in case there are no road markings. So they serve a purpose other than their main function as well.
In Denmark we both have traffic lights across the intersection and right at the approach. Never knew others did it differently
This guy i know from England always bitches about that when he comes here lmao. He says the lights here are in illogical places
In South Africa they are placed on both sides, but optimised for the driver to see at least one traffic signal face. It does have an effect on safety as they are the control devices and the more drivers which see them, the safer it should operate. The high overhead lights are more for vehicles far behind to see clearly. In these examples in the Netherlands, the intersections are much smaller footprint and not as much car traffic so no need for overhead lights
@@ruukinen road markings should always be present. Traffic lights are secondary traffic control devices. If there's no electricity, drivers should be able to navigate safely
Your comments on traffic control in North America are spot on. I find that they tend to be lazy and unimaginative.(and I am a civil engineer)
Her in Vancouver, the lights seem to be designed to inconvenience everyone equally. Many years ago, I asked a classmate who had taken a job with the city of Vancouver, why lights were not synced better. He replied that they were - going to city hall in the morning and away in the afternoon so that the mayor, council and city engineers were taken care of.
I have had many times, when I have hit every light red on the way home from my father’s house at 10 PM! There are at least 50 lights in the 20km trip, roughly half are pedestrian actuated. Some stretches, where there is a light at every street, it’s drive a block, have the light turn red when 30 m away, sit through the light with not 1 pedestrian or car going through the intersection. Repeated every block!
At night the lights are set to a fixed cycle and the pedestrian controlled lights seem to be set to jus screw with drivers heads. Is it any wonder that people speed and run re lights here.
Watching your channel makes me appreciate life in the Netherlands even more...I used to think the Netherlands is like a big village and too traditional (considering lack of skyscrapers etc.) but little did I know, that actually almost everything here is more advance and way more thoughtful for the citizens.
I could not hope for any better place to live than here in the Netherlands
Nevertheless, there is still much to improve. Housing is too often built to make a profit, whether for developers or landlords, and not to provide adequate housing to those who need it. Many small towns lack good public transport and remain car-focussed to this day, because again public transport is based on what makes a profit more than on what people need. I could go on. It's not just bikes, but it is mostly bikes.
@@Quintinohthree Of course everything can still be improved and we should complain when we notice something. But at least when we complain with supporting evidence we have a better than even chance of it at least getting looked at. That does not take away that we are actually doing really well.
@@rutgerprins Actually another very important reason why they are avoided, is because they will create a lot of issues if it comes down to local heavy winds and shadow/shade related problems. Something most people don't think about, but from an engineering point of view one of the biggest problems with big buildings.
just came back from iceland and reykjavik has the same problem, it was 4AM and i was alone at a stop light for 3 minutes waiting for the ghost cars and pedestrians to go first.
I've watched several of your videos, most of them not only apply to the Nederlands but all of Europe or at least the Northern, Middle and Western part of it.
Thanks for those videos. The next time I am upset about some not optimal traffic situation here in south part of Germany, I think at your videos and a smile would come to my face about how good we have it here :)
That´s so true. I live in Germany but close to the Netherlands so I am familar with their traffic lights and it such feels so good and fluent.
8:41 Literally as this video was uploading, a UA-cam commenter randomly told me that there is a "pedestrian scramble" in the city centre of Vlaardingen. Do you know of any others?
The biggest of the world: "Tokyo Shibuya crossing"
I think there are some bike scrambles in the Netherlands.
Oh yes I live in Vlaardingen and the Ped. Scramble is located in the center 🙂 It's very useful since you have to wait just one time at a light no matter your direction of travel 😉 However it's used less then before since a lot of shops around it are closing due to the high rents in this region 😕
In the Netherlands I don't, but here in Portland, Oregon someone decided to install one in a busy pedestrian area that gives two full scramble phases during peak hours and from Friday afternoon-Saturday night. The problem is, the intersection is maybe 7.5 meters wide and a streetcar stop is located at the corner near side the intersection, so if there's even 1 car just after the parallel cycle ends, that streetcar is sitting there for a whole 2 minutes before it can even service the platform just to wait another 2 minutes (funny enough, the streetcar can use opticom for the next intersection). People cross "illegally" there all the time because during car green phases they're just standing and most people are going straight, but again, it's like 7.5 meters which is like a hop and a skip to cross. Now, theoretically this was to reduce the turning traffic from being held up by pedestrians, but I really have to wonder what that time savings was and why the streetcar isn't given priority even at it's own stop. If you wanted to look it up for laughs, it's the intersection of NW 11th and Couch next to the famous Powell's Books, I honestly think it's one of the many "pilot projects" that PBOT just filed away as too expensive to fix or they just forgot about it altogether.
Edit: Just realizing that the intersection in question used to just have stop signs. It must have been an LOS thing to install those signals and I bet that intersection has a worse LOS than it did prior to the traffic lights. Not saying LOS is a good metric to go by, but I can't imagine having all modes wait longer helped anyone. The area does get busy but I don't believe a signal was the right solution to this area, especially considering how small the intersection is and the fact there's another signal (thankfully timed with the one at Couch) 200ft at the next intersection. There's even train to wayside control loops in the ground if they wanted to just put in priority or part time warnings. If they wanted to reduce traffic on Couch they should make it so you can't have parallel thru traffic on Couch (it's 200ft from the region's biggest East/West thoroughfare).
Sorry, getting caught up in the absurdity that is North American traffic engineering, it's easy to do. After I visited the Netherlands I've just never looked at it the same, even in places like Portland that are considered "good" in the US.
Tons of Dutch signals inadvertently provide pedestrian (and often bike) scrambles when it's possible based on a lack of vehicle demand, but you would only really find a deliberate pedestrian scrambles in jurisdictions with relatively unintelligent signals (by Dutch standards) such as Vlaardingen or Den Haag. In general it tends to be more efficient to adapt to traffic movements than to force the signal to always serve a particular stage with pedestrians in every direction. And more efficient means shorter cycle lengths, which means shorter wait times for pedestrians.
As an “Amsterdammer” myself I find it fascinating how he looks way different at the Netherlands then I do
You ever hear the saying, "you don't know what you have till it's gone". I came to America from Africa thinking I was going to heaven. Now I look at my Africa as heaven.
I love your videos, I lived in the Netherlands for 2 years and never really gave much thought to why lights always seemed to magically turned green when I reached them on my bike... very interesting!
Seeing this just now, a year later. I’ve been following NJB for a few months and joined your Patreon after “Houston”. This is another great video that really engages many people!
You should join a bus driver for a day in Utrecht, on most of the intersections we have special bus lights. Maybe this could be an interesting topic.
Yes that would be pretty cool. Bus drivers! Let me know if I can ride with you! 😁
@@NotJustBikes You've probably seen these, but to get you started nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Negenoog_(verkeerslicht)
@M J Grasscutter In my city Enschede there are parts of the roads, which are dedicated to busses. But, police cars, ambulances, fire department and taxis are also allowed to use these bus lanes. Here's an example of such bus lane: www.google.nl/maps/@52.2172405,6.944551,3a,75y,90h,90t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s71nmqSnhB95p5Ox5RF91kw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
Well, Almere even has (except for a street called the Evenaar) a completely segregated bus network. They have special bus lights as well. It works a bit like an above-ground metro in that sense, but then with bus tyres and a max. speed of 50km/h.
we indeed have special bus lanes and corresponding lights for the busses in the netherlands, and they are significantly different so you cannot confuse them while using the other stop signs/ traffic signals
In Groningen we have alot of intersections where all cyclist get green light at the same time! Takes some time getting used to, but saves alot of time.
Oops i reacted to soon! Just saw that you briefly talked about it @8:25. In the video!
It's the best!
They work really well, but not everyone knows how to use them properly. You can even see it happen at 4:00, two cyclist from the right should have priority, but are not given. When cyclist get green from all directions, traffic from the right still has priority, even if there are other signs or markings related to priority. Those are only in effect when the lights are out of order.
@@karelb84 incorrect, there are no priority rules at these all-green intersections because a traffic light overrules all other priority:
Bij een verkeerslicht in werking vervallen alle andere voorrangsregels (rechts gaat voor, haaientanden). Dat geldt dus ook voor een verkeerslicht met tegelijk groen. De voorrang tussen verschillende fietsers bij een tegelijk groen regeling is dan ook formeel niet geregeld. (source: Fietsersbond)
And while it must be shocking for the Dutch to have no rules, it does make sense at these 4-way junctions because otherwise traffic wont flow as easily.
So you're right about how not everyone knows how to use them properly. Expecting to have priority when you don't can be dangerous.
@@InWeCome I knew about all signs and markings losing their meaning with working traffic lights, but was unaware that traffic from the right is also included. Usually, cyclists will give other cyclists from the right priority, as they still need to cross the intersection. But I guess this is more of an unwritten rule.
Only now I understand why I was often lucky having a green light. Thanks Not Just Bikes!
I'm an American that used to live in Germany from 2006-2011 and I this channel makes me really miss it and want to move back but I can't 😭
This was a great video! I actually think they’ve not even done that primarily for efficiency, but because they realise cyclists don’t flow like drivers. On a bike, it takes physical effort to start again and get back to speed once you’ve stopped. That sounds obvious, but making green lights happen immediately when detecting cyclists, without forcing them to stop regularly, is key to make it a convenient, fast and attractive mode of transport. It’s less important to give that priority for cars because they just need to lightly press on a pedal and they go, plus if they have to wait they’re sheltered from the rain and cold. Other countries seem to ignore that human aspect completely and just treat different modes as an efficiency problem.
Yes, you're absolutely right in everything you've said. It helps that traffic engineers here have actually ridden a bike in their adult lives! 😁
On the other hand, cars produce less exhaust if they can keep their momentum.
@@GoldenBeholden That's true on an individual vehicle level, but at a network level the reduced fuel consumption per vehicle-kilometre tends to be far outweighed by the additional kilometres that people will drive if the engineers are obsessed with eliminating stops for cars.
@@GoldenBeholden but that is more than offset by making the streets safe for walking and cycling, many times over!
Plus, if you're worried about the 2% of exhaust due to this, then you should *really* be worried about the other 98%. But in my experience, drivers only care about their exhaust when they're not allowed to drive as fast as they want, wherever they want. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
@@NotJustBikes Ah, yes, that makes sense.
Having green in all directions as a cyclist is fantastic and crazy at the same time. You have to speed up or slow down in order not to get hit or hit someone else with your bike. People cross even diagonally.
Also a more recent development is longer walk periods for elderly people. They press the button for 3 or more seconds to get a longer window to cross.
Sounds like the old Hot Wheels Criss-Cross-Crash toy.
Smart traffic lights? More like genius traffic lights. Even in a system with only cars it would be nice if the "main" direction was always prioritized unless there was someone coming through elsewhere. That concept is pumped up to new levels in NL.
Came across something in my city (Dordrecht) that might interest you. Some traffic lights (37) now work with an app called Schwung. You download the app, put the phone in your pocket while cycling. The app communicates with the traffic lights and basically automates and gets rid of the physical button you have to push next to the traffic light. It also tries to learn the route and timing of the user so it can automatically request the light to turn green just before you reach it.
To someone from the UK it's amazing seeing pedestrians acctually waiting anywhere except at a massive intersection. Especially in smaller/quieter towns, most people push the button in case it changes quickly then cross when they think it is clear anyway haha. Then again, jaywalking isn't a law here
I usually jaywalk when it's clear, without pushing a button at all, in order to not to waste my time waiting for stupid system to accumulate enough cars to reach the city imits, for only me to try'n'cross 4 lanes in 8 seconds. I wait and freeze, they burn brakes to stop, and burn fuel to get going again.
I jaywalk - they go freely, with priority to run me down, if i fail to clear. Everybody wins :D
Also, here in RF, some of the drivers are praising this kinda mishap, by flashing, to let you know it's okay to go, even if they don't plan to stop. I once was given clear by a lorry driver, to cross a motorway offramp. (don't ask me, how i got there, #localinfrastructuremadness #nowaytoreachwithoutacarplaces)
As someone from Portugal I've seen roundabouts slowly replacing most major traffic intersection hotspots in my city and I love them. It's a ~100K population town, and it's done wonders for my sanity. Also in recent years bike paths have been blossoming, I imagine it's a European directive of some kind. Much appreciated.
North American drivers can't navigate roundabouts. It melts their brain, and they end up so much more dangerous because of that.
@@nolyspe Google maps helps with that to be honest. And because america doesn't have many it probably isn't taught in practice in driving school
I live in downtown Vancouver. We had several incidents of pedestrians being struck by right and left turning vehicles at our street corner, so they recently changed the timing of the light to have a slight pedestrian lead-time. I’ll be watching closely to see if it makes the intersection safer
Shoutout to the Canadian capital city for providing some great footage for all the bad examples of traffic management! Go Ottawa Go!
Ah, I thought I recognized some places in the video. Hi from Gatineau.
Videos like these should be obligatory in all traffic engineering schools around the world.
9:20 “Aw no no no no, not you, not you, it’s okay” Aww, good pet traffic light 🤣
I'm generally impressed but one thing I've noticed is that were there is a series of traffic lights (such as locally in Leiderdorp) it seems that the sequence is either going to let you through all of them on green or stops you at all of them. You just have to keep your fingers crossed when you head down the road. However I am now more convinced that our lights are more friendly to road users other than car drivers and that surely has to be better for the majority.
Britain used to have that, called "the green wave". If you went through the first green doing the speed limit, you'd go through all of them. Then the planners decided it was a bad idea and got rid of it.
@@paulqueripel3493 Hey we have that in Argentina too. The trick here is to catch the green wave you have to drive at a specific speed (say 30km/h) otherwise you will get a red light eventually. That way you keep drivers going at a reasonable speed
what you just described is called an offset, it's complicated but you can set a series of traffic signals in one direction to go green after a certain period relative to each other. so A goes green, B goes green as you get to it etc. offsets are directional though so if you went through on all green EB you would get stuck at all reds WB. if you're going the wrong way the lights won't be as you approach them because you're waiting for the "wave" to reach you in the opposite direction. the traffic light system we use in the UK (SCOOT) can tell which direction has the most flow and will prioritise that offset accordingly.
Your videos consistently blow my mind, despite being super boring on paper. Thanks!
When I was in high school in Seattle, WA I took the city bus to go home (Seattle Schools fully subsidizes busing for high schoolers instead of yellow buses) and on the way home I had to cross a busy residential street. The traffic light was extremely unreliable. After pressing the button I would often count 2 to 3 safe times to cross with no traffic and when the light finally changed 2 minutes later cars would have to stop for me. I just gave up pressing the button and used my best judgment for knowing when to cross.
Yes, and if you had been hit by a car they would blame you for crossing without a signal, instead of recognizing that pedestrian-hostile traffic lights make people cross unsafely.
@@NotJustBikes Well, and generally speaking, that's why the Dutch obey the traffic lights.
Most times there is a good reason why you have to wait for a red light.
And bicyclists wil show any traffic engineer which 'red lights' could be improved by not obeying it !
@@xFD2x also if the driver of a vehicle have an incident with a pedestrian/bicyclists the driver of the vehicle is the one that gets the blame.
A pedestrian/bicyclists is here in the Netherlands seen as a weak person in traffic. So of course they obey the traffic light :)
@@xFD2x That reminds me of a 'demonstration' of sorts where cyclists were fined for crossing a red light in Utrecht in 2014. This particular light was notorious for giving pedestrians green but cyclists in the same direction along side them were stuck behind red. Pretty much all cyclists who were familiar with the road ignored the cycling light and obeyed the pedestrian light instead. One day the police decided enough is enough and started fining this intersection. Thanks to social media within hours most cyclists stopped at all red lights in the city, resulting in a traffic jam of cyclists within the city.
The media immediately took the side of the cyclists and the traffic lights were given the blame, the court agreed and even blamed the city for undermining the public trust in traffic lights. Within days after the incident the traffic light was given new cycles and prioritization and increased the green time for cyclists 5 times without hindering the other traffic flows. All fines were nullified and the whole ordeal resulted in a big headache for the responsible alderman.
@@xFD2x That's a fair point - in many places they'd attempt to stop that by fining jaywalkers, rather than using the jaywalking data to highlight that the crossing is inefficient.
This is exactly the kind of content I like to see at 1:06 am when I can't sleep!
Well it was made at 1:06 am when I couldn't sleep, so that makes sense.
Love the "request a light" function in NL and the traffic density detection,
all i would love to see from other country's is that the light goes orange first before changing back to green again.
A very interesting video resume to see our trafficlights trough the eyes of a knowledgeble expat/foreigner and how it works across the big pond
especially to get all the "i should not be on my phone" to not be on their phone and for others to pre-check the crossing before hitting the gas on green.
My town (in America) has just installed radar in all of our lights that do the exact thing you describe (minus the bike lanes, we’re too hilly and rural for bike lanes). It’s really cool having it turn green for your when there is a break in traffic or when you approach and there no traffic on the main road, and if you approach, it will stay green or yellow to let you through. I do wish that it did give more priority to pedestrians and bikes in the sidewalk however.