Just wanted to let you know that we weighed our goats tonight (as we always do). We increased/ changed mama’s goat feed according to your advice starting yesterday. One twin gained 8 ounces and the other 6 ounces which is incredible in 24 hours!!Once they double their birth weight ( very close) we will start milk sharing and depending on their continued weight gain. Again I am so grateful!!
I'm sorry I wasn't clear. Kids doubling their weight by two weeks is only a landmark that means they are getting enough milk. It does not mean that it's okay to start separating overnight. They are nowhere close to being able to eat enough to get enough protein and calcium. They need to be drinking their calories in the form of mom's milk, which is the perfect food for them. I made this video that explains this in more detail. ua-cam.com/video/q3iyEhYvUF4/v-deo.html
Thanks for the info. It was so timely. Last night I switched completely to 16% organic goat pellets for my milker. She acted so hungry. I also bought organic alfalfa pellets IF she inhales her feed on the milk stand. We start milk sharing tomorrow. All goats get free feed alfalfa, orchard and coastal. We mix in some chaffhaye to the ration to slow down feed inhaling. I also doubled the feed since her twins are 2 weeks old now. I have lost sleep over this issue and didn’t get the info I needed and wanted. Fortunately we had already doubled mom’s morning ration of 16% goat pellets and doubled her evening portion last night hasn’t resulted in diarrhea today so far. Thanks again!! Maybe my shingles will go away now! Plus had one baby with aspiration pneumonia.
I'm glad your goat didn't get diarrhea from the sudden increase in feed. It is recommended that you do that more gradually. Having diarrhea in a milk goat or nursing mama is really gross because the udder is just below the rectum. I only had that happen once, and that was one too many times. 🙂
I feed 16%goat feed with beet pulp, alfalfa pellets and BOSS. I feed grass hay. I fed alfalfa hay many years with multiple problems so switched to grass hay. Here alfalfa hay is $12-$15/bale. Sometimes higher.
What if a doe refuses to eat grain? I can’t figured out why she started doing this. I used to feed her 1# per day because she’s feeding 2 doelings that were born in May and milking nearly a quart on once a day. But recently she started refusing to eat the grain and sifts down to the alfalfa pellets and BOSS instead. She does get 1st cut alfalfa hay. I’m at a loss.
It could be because there is something wrong with it. Is she the only one who is refusing? Did it start after you bought a new bag? Did you change the brand you're using? If you can't figure out why she's refusing to eat it, there's not much you can do. At least she is eating alfalfa and alfalfa pellets, which have just as much protein. So she should be able to maintain her body condition.
Hi Deborah, What do you do if you don't have access to goat feed? In some countries (outside of the US), goat or sheep feed is not available. What the vets in those countries suggest is feed for calves, which I remember you saying giving other animal feeds is a no no. We are doing the best we can with what is available to us and have been fermenting steel cut oats for 3 days, I have been sprouting lentils and growing lentil microgreens for them, adding in loose minerals (again, not specific for goats as that is not available but have researched the ones I use and is close to the goat minerals available in the US) giving some green beans, lacto fermented carrots, apple cider vinegar, mulberry and raspberry leaves, some berries/fruit and herbs (varies based on what is available on our farm). We also have rotational grazing pastures and do chopped leaves from high protein trees. They get at least 3 hrs per day of grazing (longer if weather allows) plus free choice hay. We do not have alfalfa pellets available but I have seen powdered alfalfa here if that is something you think would be of benefit. Any suggestions? Thank you!
You've probably heard me talk about goats gorging themselves on chicken grain and getting sick -- or eating sheep feed and getting copper deficient. It's not about the name of the species on the label but what's in the nutritional analysis and how much they eat. In the US we used to use cattle minerals for goats before there were good goat minerals available, and that is often the answer for people in other countries. If you can find cattle minerals with at least 1700 ppm copper (1700 mg/kg copper) and 50 ppm selenium (50 mg/kg selenium) and a 2 to 1 calcium to phosphorus ratio, that should be pretty good. A dairy cow feed (or calf feed) that is 16% protein with 40 ppm (or mg/kg) copper and 0.5 ppm (or mg/kg) selenium would be good for your does in milk.
The withdrawal for milk is 7 days, according to FARAD.org, which is referenced in the article Abby shared. I want to add that a pour-on should NEVER be used orally. That is a VERY old practice -- like 20 years old -- and I thought it had finally died, but since you mentioned it, sounds like some people are still talking about doing it. It is meant to be used topically, and in goats, it only works well for external parasites, not worms.
@@DeborahNiemann yes I would never you is orally. There is a reason it’s topical. Just wondering if when it seeps into their skin If you have to wait a bit to withdraw from milk.
Is it safe to give wethers alfalfa hay? My wethers live with my does, one of whom is in milk. If they cannot have alfalfa, will i have to rely on alfalfa pellets for my doe? As it is now, they have grass hay in their pen and shelter, and my doe gets a chance to eat alfalfa hay for a few minutes when she gets off the milk stand. She does get grain (with chaffhaye, BOSS, oats and beet shreds) on the milk stand.
No one can say what will happen if your wethers eat alfalfa regularly. We know that excess calcium can cause zinc deficiency and calcium stones in the bladder (not to be confused with struvite stones caused by eating too much grain), but the question is "how much is too much," and that's impossible to answer because it varies from one goat to another. (We know cigarettes cause cancer but not everyone gets cancer.) Someone with five wethers might only have one that winds up with a stone that causes a blockage -- and that's really key -- whether it causes a blockage. I had a student who could not convince her mom to stop giving grain to their wether until he went to the vet for an unrelated issue, and when they did an ultrasound, they just happened to see that his bladder was filled with stones. He has just been lucky that they were all small enough to pass -- so far. Since you said wethers, it sounds like you have more than one, so maybe you could separate them from the does? Even if they are together outside during the day, you could separate them into different stalls at night so boys can get grass hay and does can get alfalfa. That way, they could all get what they really need. Does in milk really need alfalfa. Their hay should be 50-100% alfalfa, and more is better. If they are out on pasture, you have to figure that into their total diet, so they really don't need any grass hay at all if they can get it while grazing. If you are giving them a 16% protein goat feed, you should not be adding other grains to it because you are diluting the protein with things like oats and beet pulp, which have very low protein. You only need to throw in a handful of BOSS because it's just for increasing butterfat. Chaffhaye is alfalfa, so that's good, but it should not take the place of goat feed. They should still have 1# of goat feed for every 3# of milk produced.
Thank you so much for your advice! I am new to goats, and the advice I've heard is all over the place! After listening to your livesteam, I weighed my grain and realized that I have not been feeding my doe enough! So, between not enough alfalfa hay and not enough grain, it's no wonder she's gotten a bit thin!
Just wanted to let you know that we weighed our goats tonight (as we always do). We increased/ changed mama’s goat feed according to your advice starting yesterday. One twin gained 8 ounces and the other 6 ounces which is incredible in 24 hours!!Once they double their birth weight ( very close) we will start milk sharing and depending on their continued weight gain. Again I am so grateful!!
That's awesome! Thank you for sharing. ~Abby
I'm sorry I wasn't clear. Kids doubling their weight by two weeks is only a landmark that means they are getting enough milk. It does not mean that it's okay to start separating overnight. They are nowhere close to being able to eat enough to get enough protein and calcium. They need to be drinking their calories in the form of mom's milk, which is the perfect food for them. I made this video that explains this in more detail. ua-cam.com/video/q3iyEhYvUF4/v-deo.html
Thank you and I am waiting until they reach 20 pounds and will only milk once a day.
Thanks for the info. It was so timely. Last night I switched completely to 16% organic goat pellets for my milker. She acted so hungry. I also bought organic alfalfa pellets IF she inhales her feed on the milk stand. We start milk sharing tomorrow. All goats get free feed alfalfa, orchard and coastal. We mix in some chaffhaye to the ration to slow down feed inhaling. I also doubled the feed since her twins are 2 weeks old now. I have lost sleep over this issue and didn’t get the info I needed and wanted. Fortunately we had already doubled mom’s morning ration of 16% goat pellets and doubled her evening portion last night hasn’t resulted in diarrhea today so far. Thanks again!! Maybe my shingles will go away now! Plus had one baby with aspiration pneumonia.
I'm glad your goat didn't get diarrhea from the sudden increase in feed. It is recommended that you do that more gradually. Having diarrhea in a milk goat or nursing mama is really gross because the udder is just below the rectum. I only had that happen once, and that was one too many times. 🙂
I feed 16%goat feed with beet pulp, alfalfa pellets and BOSS. I feed grass hay. I fed alfalfa hay many years with multiple problems so switched to grass hay. Here alfalfa hay is $12-$15/bale. Sometimes higher.
I have to order decent organic alfalfa hay at $35 a 50 pound bale. I am only feeding two does and have two doelings only 2 weeks
What if a doe refuses to eat grain? I can’t figured out why she started doing this. I used to feed her 1# per day because she’s feeding 2 doelings that were born in May and milking nearly a quart on once a day. But recently she started refusing to eat the grain and sifts down to the alfalfa pellets and BOSS instead. She does get 1st cut alfalfa hay. I’m at a loss.
It could be because there is something wrong with it. Is she the only one who is refusing? Did it start after you bought a new bag? Did you change the brand you're using? If you can't figure out why she's refusing to eat it, there's not much you can do. At least she is eating alfalfa and alfalfa pellets, which have just as much protein. So she should be able to maintain her body condition.
Thank you for addressing this subject. Newbies need to know this info.....❤
You're welcome! Glad to hear you found the information helpful! ~Abby
Hi Deborah,
What do you do if you don't have access to goat feed? In some countries (outside of the US), goat or sheep feed is not available. What the vets in those countries suggest is feed for calves, which I remember you saying giving other animal feeds is a no no. We are doing the best we can with what is available to us and have been fermenting steel cut oats for 3 days, I have been sprouting lentils and growing lentil microgreens for them, adding in loose minerals (again, not specific for goats as that is not available but have researched the ones I use and is close to the goat minerals available in the US) giving some green beans, lacto fermented carrots, apple cider vinegar, mulberry and raspberry leaves, some berries/fruit and herbs (varies based on what is available on our farm). We also have rotational grazing pastures and do chopped leaves from high protein trees. They get at least 3 hrs per day of grazing (longer if weather allows) plus free choice hay. We do not have alfalfa pellets available but I have seen powdered alfalfa here if that is something you think would be of benefit. Any suggestions? Thank you!
You've probably heard me talk about goats gorging themselves on chicken grain and getting sick -- or eating sheep feed and getting copper deficient. It's not about the name of the species on the label but what's in the nutritional analysis and how much they eat. In the US we used to use cattle minerals for goats before there were good goat minerals available, and that is often the answer for people in other countries. If you can find cattle minerals with at least 1700 ppm copper (1700 mg/kg copper) and 50 ppm selenium (50 mg/kg selenium) and a 2 to 1 calcium to phosphorus ratio, that should be pretty good. A dairy cow feed (or calf feed) that is 16% protein with 40 ppm (or mg/kg) copper and 0.5 ppm (or mg/kg) selenium would be good for your does in milk.
Thank you so much for your reply, I am so very appreciative of you and the information you share. God bless you, have a wonderful day!
You're welcome! Were glad to hear you the information helpful! ~Abby
@Debraniemann do you know what the withdraw time from ivermectin pour on is? Not orally given but topical.
Hi @cutiecake436, check out this article on Milk and Meat Withdrawal. Hope it helps! ~Abby
thriftyhomesteader.com/milk-meat-withdrawal/
The withdrawal for milk is 7 days, according to FARAD.org, which is referenced in the article Abby shared. I want to add that a pour-on should NEVER be used orally. That is a VERY old practice -- like 20 years old -- and I thought it had finally died, but since you mentioned it, sounds like some people are still talking about doing it. It is meant to be used topically, and in goats, it only works well for external parasites, not worms.
@@DeborahNiemann yes I would never you is orally. There is a reason it’s topical. Just wondering if when it seeps into their skin If you have to wait a bit to withdraw from milk.
@@DeborahNiemann thank you
Is it safe to give wethers alfalfa hay? My wethers live with my does, one of whom is in milk. If they cannot have alfalfa, will i have to rely on alfalfa pellets for my doe? As it is now, they have grass hay in their pen and shelter, and my doe gets a chance to eat alfalfa hay for a few minutes when she gets off the milk stand. She does get grain (with chaffhaye, BOSS, oats and beet shreds) on the milk stand.
No one can say what will happen if your wethers eat alfalfa regularly. We know that excess calcium can cause zinc deficiency and calcium stones in the bladder (not to be confused with struvite stones caused by eating too much grain), but the question is "how much is too much," and that's impossible to answer because it varies from one goat to another. (We know cigarettes cause cancer but not everyone gets cancer.) Someone with five wethers might only have one that winds up with a stone that causes a blockage -- and that's really key -- whether it causes a blockage. I had a student who could not convince her mom to stop giving grain to their wether until he went to the vet for an unrelated issue, and when they did an ultrasound, they just happened to see that his bladder was filled with stones. He has just been lucky that they were all small enough to pass -- so far.
Since you said wethers, it sounds like you have more than one, so maybe you could separate them from the does? Even if they are together outside during the day, you could separate them into different stalls at night so boys can get grass hay and does can get alfalfa. That way, they could all get what they really need. Does in milk really need alfalfa. Their hay should be 50-100% alfalfa, and more is better. If they are out on pasture, you have to figure that into their total diet, so they really don't need any grass hay at all if they can get it while grazing.
If you are giving them a 16% protein goat feed, you should not be adding other grains to it because you are diluting the protein with things like oats and beet pulp, which have very low protein. You only need to throw in a handful of BOSS because it's just for increasing butterfat. Chaffhaye is alfalfa, so that's good, but it should not take the place of goat feed. They should still have 1# of goat feed for every 3# of milk produced.
Thank you so much for your advice! I am new to goats, and the advice I've heard is all over the place! After listening to your livesteam, I weighed my grain and realized that I have not been feeding my doe enough! So, between not enough alfalfa hay and not enough grain, it's no wonder she's gotten a bit thin!
I meant feed-not grain. Sorry