Tears of the Kingdom's new thing is actually pretty old
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- Опубліковано 7 чер 2023
- The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom gives players the freedom to do functionally... anything they can imagine. All the tools are there in the first hours of the game. But this style of play dates back to original immersive sims like Prey and Thief, and the work of legendary developer Warren Spector. Patrick Gill takes us through the history of Zelda and the way Tears of the Kingdom it breaks from tradition by going back to something old.
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#legendofzelda #tearsofthekingdom #polygon - Ігри
I love the quote "If people get that you can fight, sneak, or talk, we're gonna rule the world. If they compare our combat to Half Life, we're dead." It's by Warren and it's so perfect for how well it aged, from 2000 to now
I mean, im sims aren't exactly ruling the world right now.
If history is to be believed TOTK will be the last Zelda to be in Im Sim, or the last Zelda game period.
@@mechanicalmonk2020 Exactly, because the games' combat was compared to Half Life.
A bunch of half-life nerds just started steaming at this perfect comment 😂
@@liamwhite3522if they could somehow make the combat feel like darksouls I think it would be an unstoppable force.
I hope they never try dark souls and Zelda might share things but combat shouldn't be one of them. It has its own puzzle based gimmick heavy combat based more around fun than balance. DS is kind of the opposite and is completely reactionary combat w few gimmick bosses anymore
DM: as you travel through the woods, you discover a little korok, stuck on his back -
player: i cast fire bolt. 17 to hit
It's too hot!
I attack the darkness!!
The korok lays, stuck on its back, baking in the hot sun rolling around trying to turn itself over, but it can’t not without your he -
Why is there a cross
I've kinda beaten this particular horse dead, but the whole "immersive sim" aspect of ToTK really sold itself to me when I threw an Ice Fruit into the water, and it froze. I shot arrows with them attached, and it froze. I was swinging my ice weapon around in an area with shallow water, and it froze. That... didn't happen in BotW. And I _know_ that was because they had the Cryonis rune, but it was still a weird thing when the whole existence of Ice Arrows was basically just "freeze enemies" given Majora's Mask already gave precedent to them freezing things. And water turning lava into rock? I never would've expected them to do that. But here we are, with our funky little platforms. I crossed an entire flowing river with ice platforms. Needless to say, my stock of Ice Fruit has never recovered.
I remember when I started exploring what was possible. "Okay I got all the different boxes together for this puzzle, now I need to... one just broke. Getting it back requires dismantling this whole thing for parts. Screw it, throw some fruit into lava for a replacement. Let's make more of them! Just put a lid over all this mess and ascend through it I am DONE!"
you only need a few ice fruit, just use ultrahand to move the ice platform as far as it can go and back, then use recall and ride it out. make another ice platform and repeat til you're across
Just fuse an ice sheet to a weapon to make it freeze more watter
if the river was flowing torwards you, you could shoot one ice fruit at other end of the river, wait for it to come to you, and then recall it and and ride it to the other side
@@adamsbja i spent SO LONG running back and forth getting the wooden box in that shrine, just for it to break while trying to build stairs and only after i finished the shrine i remembered i can jump up through stuff, i felt so dumb
THANK YOU for giving PREY 2017 its due.
2017 was a bonkers year in gaming (Breath of the Wild, Nier Automata, Hollow Knight, Persona 5 and so so many) and somehow PREY has remained one of the special experiences.
I think in the coming years people will look back on 2017 and 2018 as the 2004 and 2007 of the modern gaming era
I'm a huge Arkane fan and an even bigger ImSim fan but it just really didn't impress me or hook me even a little bit.
Does it start slow? I'd love to give a good game it's due.
@@GuitarSlayer136 yeah it's slow but near the end game you get insane powers and there's always billions of crazy solutions to find
@@GuitarSlayer136 When they announced Prey 2017, I immediately had a strong bias _against_ it, for being completely unrelated to the original Prey which I'd been hoping for a sequel to for many years. As such, I didn't actually give Prey 2017 a fair shake until a couple years ago, 2021-ish. The more I played, the more I fell in love with it, and the ending cemented it as one of my favorite games of all time. It's possible that it's just not for you, but if you quit relatively early, I'd recommend giving it another chance.
Prey (2017) is a lot like Titanfall 2 (2016): if you actually played them, you'd understand what all the fuss was about, WHY both games were incredible, and WHY both games deserved to do much better financially than they did.
Titanfall 2 --especially-- proves that you can make a far superior product and STILL get destroyed by that year's objectively bad Call of Duty game.
Only at the 1:20 second mark, and it reminded me of the most competent my players had ever been in a dnd game. I had them come upon a village at sunset intending the next few sessions to take place there, the villagers met the party cautiously and had explained that for the last few weeks they had been attacked by werewolves every night, the werewolves dragging villagers off to the woods one by one and that the werewolves were due to attack any minute, in the ensuing scuffle their ranger refused to let one werewolf get away and after a series of creative ideas and good rolls managed to kill it, as the werewolf returned to their human form it turned out to be one of the missing kids. The rest of the plot followed that the werewolves were actually a rebel sect trying to uncover a demonic cult operating within the town, the lycanthropy being contracted intentionally to hide their actions and fake their deaths to remove suspicion by the cult (I was a big animorphs kid).
In ONE 2 hour session the party had uncovered the conspiracy, exposed the leader, and killed the infant demigod they worshipped. They felt bad for blowing through it so fast but I was so impressed by everything they had done I didn't care.
It's things like this that make DnD awesome. Your table sound fun! Best wishes, stay well!
Throw some extra periods in that second "sentence," mate; it took me 4 tries to read it.
@@andrewstoner2032 Never
@@andrewstoner2032 Accept the guiding light of commas.
@@andrewstoner2032skill issue
that poor DM 😭
Its the difference between:
Thats not how you're suppoed to do that.
and
That's one way to do that.
The beautiful thing about immersive sims is the trust you build up in the game's systems that lets you feel comfortable trying your own solutions. You only feel confident to experiment when solutions that seem like logically they should work, do consistently work regardless of how off-the-wall they seem.
If even 10% of the time your experiments failed because the developers didn't consistently simulate some element of the game (like if some metal objects didn't attract lightning and you only found out after sneaking through the bokoblin camp), the magic would be broken. It's a testament to the insane level of craftsmanship put into this style of game that players feel so free to try new things and play their own way.
That's what had a lot of developers' jaws dropping. "Okay, A is neat, and being able to do B without any lag is impressive, but then you can put A and B together and it just WORKS most of the time?"
Just went through this in the silliest possible way in totk. Saw someone fuse a stick of butter to a sword. So I figured it'd probably melt off if it got hot. Tested and confirmed.
@@RandomEntry13013 But will the butter act as a low friction surface when fused to a shield?
Probably. Until it melts away, at least.
@@RandomEntry13013 man this game is IMPRESSIVE
I think the moment I really figured out what the game was about was during one of those challenge shrines where they strip you of all your gear and I had no arrows, but I had a spear and an explosive barrel, so I Fused the barrel to the spear and chucked it at the enemies to give myself an 'in'. My brain wrinkled in that moment to understand I was _meant_ to find workarounds and solve puzzles in interesting ways, and it's been so gratifying to do so.
I also like using Ultrahand to pick fruits from trees; just bring them over my head and drop them on Link.
I once saw a clip of a guy throwing a bomb spear and the spear kept being blast back at him by the explosion, so he just kept chucking more and more bombs till the enemies died. It was super neat.
have you tried using ultrahand to build a plank with a bunch of apples fused to it, then going up to to an a cluster of apple trees, using auto build to select that recipe, and have all the apples in the area come flying to the center, then cancel the auto build and the apples just drop at your feet?
@@chefdano3474 have you considered how enormous your brain is? I am 100% doing that.
Does auto-build work like that for materials?
If you don't have autobuild or mineru yet, you can pick an apple and fuse it to the next apple and they both fall
well i'm very curious about the footage credit for "what some of these freaks are getting up to" because that lightning rotisserie roomba is something to behold
once you start clicking on these videos your UA-cam feed will just fill up with them. I'm seeing hynox getting taken out by orbital lasers and lynels in a hydraulic press pretty much every time I open UA-cam.
It’s not an immersive sim vid until a carefully worded explanation of the genre 😤
thank you warren spector for single handedly producing a collective 5 million hours of youtube game design analysis, bless you old man.
Could just call it what it is. An action RPG. Gotta be pretentious gaming hipsters though.
@@bargaintuesday812 they're functionally different things tho, like "action RPG" could easily apply to mass effect for example
@@huwcresswell6996 Yes. That's also an action RPG. No further breakdown is required.
@@bargaintuesday812 you are such a nerd, jesus christ. what even prompted you to post this and how the hell did you find a way to get upset by the term "immersive sim" but not "action rpg"?
What I find really interesting is the ways in which you're still encouraged to act in certain ways, despite being given all the tools to skip them. For instance, you're often encouraged NOT to just climb up a mountain, but instead to find a cave and ascend through the ceiling to skip all of the dull climbing. Similarly, shrines often teach new techniques to use, despite the fact that you can bypass a lot of them with zonai devices.
this is interesting. i do feel like there was less of this than in botw, but i understand why they still leave it in since it allows people to still be creative and do whatever while giving other people a sort of more accessible way to solve the puzzle and still have fun with it.
You cant use zonai devices inside shrines
@you can use ones that you already have fused to equipment (unless it’s one of those trials, I guess). For example, a lot of the shrines include traversing up by solving a puzzle, but if you have a rocket on a shield already, you can just shoot yourself up into the air.
Yeah. There are so many objectives with super simple solutions, but right next to that solution is a giant pile of Zonai devices, just to make you consider a more chaotic approach
Prey is a hidden gem it honestly deserves to be discussed way more than it is. The only commonality between two playthroughs is the order you enter the zones of the station.
I am a fan of immersive sims starting from system shock never missed one. But for some reason, Pray felt REALLY boring. It's the only one that I haven't completed.
My issue with immersive sims is that i feel so stupid playing them lol.
I have the base tool's, but thinking of ways to make them interact often goes over my head. I love them though. When I do discover something it gives me a massive eureka moment
yeah its annoying when i do something which feels cool to me and then i check youtube and someone made a fuckn orbital laser cannon
I'm the same way lol whenever I encounter a puzzle, I immediately look around for the useful debris that the devs put there to help solve it. Mostly, I just forget about the tools I have available to me in favor of the ones directly in front of my face.
what?
what????
what??????
EUREK- oh. duh.
True, but there's this thing -- all ways to play them are valid, even if it's the simple "run and gun" approach
honestly i feel smart until i see the absolute engineering going on in other people's games hahaha i'm like HOW did yall think of that, i was proud of my laser car
I think Warren Spector's discussion about easily-missed content is very relevant here too.
“There was a lot of content that was easily missed in Deus Ex… I remember having arguments with people at Origin Systems about this years before Deus Ex came out. The prevailing wisdom among developers was that it was expensive and time-consuming to create content, so you wanted players to see everything. I never bought that idea.” Warren and the team at Ion Storm Austin took the opposite approach. Missing content was part of the concept from the start - it was foundational. “It was part of the contract we made with players.”
“I’ve always felt that you want players to have unique experiences - you want them to answer questions differently than other players and see different things as a result.”
In the 90's / early 2000's, this type of immersive sim gameplay where you might totally miss an interesting interaction or object or quest was seen as basically a waste of resources.
But in the modern era of youtube or tiktok clips or streaming, this kind of thing becomes critical for a game's marketing. Seeing a clip of someone discovering some cool unique secret you had no idea was there, or dealing with a problem in a totally unique and crazy way, or using a mechanic you had no idea existed... all of these things are actually awesome for generating buzz around a game and building a really strong internet community.
I think this is why we've seen this focus on emergent gameplay become more and more popular. Immersive Sims had a period where they almost died out, but this style of emergent gameplay with many different ways to solve problems is now becoming mainstream.
I know a lot about immersive sims from hbomberguy's video on DXHR, and it's so weird that TOTK technically is one while having so few of the actual mechanics from the most genre defining ones. Skill points, character creation (as in skills and abilities not how they look), the ability to change the story, NPCs that have a bearing on the story, etc...
It's so different in so many ways but the core gameplay, putting aside everything else, is an immersive sim through and through
Eh. Those design elements are more specifically Deus Ex than Immersive Sim. I'm pretty sure that neither Thief, nor System Shock have skillpoints and honestly, Deus Ex's particular skill and upgrade system is rarely in games these days, and they're in none of the modern Immersive Sims i know of. Arkane's design has elements of it, as upgrades in both of those games are also scavenger hunts, but they're not as restrictive as Deus Ex was.
I recommend playing a few Immersive Sims, even(or especially) the older ones. System Shock(the Enhanced Edition, not the remake, though i'm sure that's good too) especially is a game that i just love through and through, partially because of its hostile design. They're a great look into gaming history, and are also just fun games by themselves.
I would argue that you actually do have some ability to change the story in BOTW and TOTK, simply since technically all quests are optional and you can go fight the final boss right after finishing the tutorial.
Instead of skill points I would say that "multiple ways to do things" games often have ways to try and point the player at those different ways. Dishonored has powers for stealth or stabby. Deus Ex: HR (can't recall if the originals had this) give XP for exploration and finding ways around combat. Changes in the story depending on how you proceed (mainly thinking Dishonored's high/low chaos here but there's plenty other examples).
TotK doesn't do that. If I sneak in the back of an enemy fortress to reach a tower there's no special reward; my reward is not having to fight all those guys, maybe a couple of rocks I can drop on them that would've been used against me. The most story changes is someone saying "how did you get here" or "what, you already did that?" before going on to the next part of their script. It's pretty hands-off in encouraging the player to find those tricks.
@@axelory7676 system shock does actually have it,and it's pretty in depth specially in the second game
@@gregoryhayes7569 That’s a really good point. it’s not just the story but in general everyone experiences the game differently.
tears of the kingdom has really given me hope that we might see more immersive sims, or games with those elements, in the future. in the same way that botw paved the way for a lot of open world games, maybe incredible sandboxes will be the next big thing for a little while
TOTK is almost an immersive sim but its missing the core of freedom when completing quests. all the quests have 1 solution, there's no freedom there like in an actual immersive sim. TOTK is as much as an immersive sim as Cyberpunk 2077
I feel like they're gonna learn the wrong lessons, like they always do. They learned from botw that green fields equal freedom, and they'll learn from totk that making dysfunctional vehicles is the optimal way to get everywhere (or something like that).
How did BotW pave the way for open world games when the Grand Theft Auto games, the Elder Scrolls games, the 3D Fallout games, the Far Cry games, the Assassin's Creed games, and the Arkham Games all predate it?
Valheim fits in here somewhere, I’m sure!
@@unlostmaniac8735 by core freedom you mean on how the quests are coded?I mean "doing x thing to y stuff" and there's a different reaction if you do z instead?I remember prey and deux ex having stuff like that while playing but I don't see it as a requirement since not every im sim does that,I thought that only the patch for said objective being personalized or not that would matter
the ultra-hand + rewind + ascend combo to get higher up is genuinely a staple of my gameplay at this point hahaha or even just ultra-hand + rewind to take a little ride wherever i'm struggling to reach
the fact that the main consensus of the players on totk is “the devs did not expect you to do this” solidifies it as a real immersive sim game
Is more like the devs leaving there car keys on the table knowing that the player base will take it out for a ride
Either you test the game to ensure player's can't commit war crimes or you give them 100 different ways to commit said war crimes. There's no in-between
i think it just solidifies the userbase as kinda dumb
@@Yoshizuyuner that's 100% what it is. Aunuma has said that Ascend started as a dev cheat tool. But it was so fun to use, they rebalanced it a bit and made it an actual power.
I really liked the editing here. The effort that went into finding relevant clips for each line of the script is appreciated.
I just remember the light bulb that went off in my head playing the original deus ex and noticing a rocket launcher is just a gigantic lockpick.
always happy when someone finds a clever way to share a D&D story. props
in a lot of immersive sims, those interactions are also programmed. And that can make it harder, which is also why this can be a niche because with the same programming budget you have a lot more interactions. Plus you have to program them in a way that doesn't make them completely game breaking. Like in breath of the wild there's a video out there that shows all the ways you can reach the flying beast without any bird person help. But then once you reach it the unintended way, you discover you cannot land on it.
I recently finished prey mooncrash after not playing the base game years ago. Absolutely incredible stuff. Zelda is a mad good immersive sim too! Also the DMC music drop is well appreciated!
Never played a Zelda game, but I did have the thought recently that Breath of the Wild and Tears of the Kingdom are kinda immersive sims with the creative shenanigans they let you get away with. Very cool to hear Pat articulate the same idea.
Coincidentally, my fantasy for the summer is to try to make a level of an immersive sim because it would be fun to plan out creative solutions for simple obstacles like "get into this building," and a creative exercise doing it all myself (coding, design, writing, music, acting). And this came from a recent love of DnD, so it comes full circle.
I’ve also never played one but I’m enjoying hearing people’s opinions this go round
When I first started TotK all the abilities felt more limited than the BotW ones, but that was because I was already fluent in the old ones. It took a while to realize stuff like "oh, Ultrahand is just Magnesis AND it can do this other stuff" and then it kept expanding and expanding. I found myself doing some things the "hard way" of gliding across the map instead of just building a super bike because I found it fun and it was neat that there was still a "normal" way to do those tasks.
As the end of the video said, what endeared me to both games was that it never felt like they complained when you found a trick. Metal weapons work for this electricity puzzle that was supposed to be about finding a key to unlock the crate? "Okay, sure." Some massive amount of jank collapses just after you get across? "Well you're on this side now, so have a 'you did it' jingle." Even glitches like bomb-launching at a bajillion mph felt like they were working within the system, and so were available to play with.
There was this part of TOTK where you’re “intended” to clear the clouds and reveal a sky island. However, a completely valid strategy is to just fly into the stormy clouds and wander until you find a shrine. This is part of a grander story line that I won’t spoil, but I was aghast when I simply went into this stormy island only to venture farther than where I intended and completing a part of the game way earlier than I probably should have.
Oh god I did this too. I guess I started as far from the shrine as I possibly could have, and I was shooting arrows into the fog and looking for the sparks to confirm platform placements. When I realized what I had done I felt like the smartest, dumbest guy alive -Pat
@@polygon Exactly the feeling!
no way you're supposed to clear it?? i haven't even gotten to that part. i just saw a storm thing on the map and went straight to. ended up being my 2nd sage lmao
I floated in really high and saw the shrine poking through a gap in the Clouds. I didn’t just skip the clear the storm part, I skipped the whole island. Then I went back and did it for fun.
The Rules of Nature:
1. Nature Rules!
2. See Above.
you forgot the most important part of an immersive sim: the number 0451 *must* be mentioned somewhere
The Ultrahand/recall box combo works better of you let the box fall almost all the way, recall it, and climb up during the delay, if you get on top of the box before recall undoes the fall, it will launch you up giving you just a bit more height.
You have to be careful not to let the box fall all the way as it is likely to break.
"the side path keeps going" me entering the Horned Statue's cave and coming out 3 hours later with an entire new set of armour
"absolutely fuckin not, but I loved it!" Now that's an awesome D.M. right there!
TotK while lacking in several ways has been scratching an itch I didn't know I had. Now I'm finding out there's an entire genre of games like this. Definitely going to check out Prey.
IF you find that Prey is a bit slow, try Dishonored without a doubt.
I really love how immersive sims are getting a new push by Zelda & Co. They encourage some really amazing creative thinking, but demand a lot of content, testing and good systemic game design
Thanks for the subtitles, helps a lot to understand some stuff and also it’s hilarious when describing sounds 😂
I don’t usually comment, but this is one of the best Polygon videos I’ve seen in a very long time.
This is a really good video, Patrick! I enjoyed it a lot!
I've never really heard somebody refer to BOTW or TOTK as immersive sins but it makes so much sense.
Awesome explanation of something I was thinking while playing both games, but could never put into words. I love this style of game.
2:59
You can also cause alert which might make the enemies come through the door opening it and then you go through that door.
The creative problem solving of both BotW and TotK reminds me of a little indie game called Tiny & Big: Grandpa's Leftovers. In it you're thrown into big open levels and only get 3 tools: a laser cutter to cut objects, a hook to pull objects towards you and rockets to send objects flying. It's awesome how the levels are both the obstacle and also the solution and there's nothing quite like it!
Love immersive sim elements in games, and I hope to see more of them! Great video!
new pat vid everyone say thank you pat
The immersive sim experience is getting that tuba guy who was stuck in the hole out by attaching a metal plate and two carefully-placed hot-air balloons with campfires lit simultaneously with a perfectly-timed bullet-time fire-arrow shower ... and then realising you could have just lifted him out with Ultrahand
Very nice to know that already existed games from a near past that used this style of a gameplay, its impressive. Very nice video, good writing, editing and narration, congratulations for this channel team, please keep up with the great work. ❤
God, I've literally been on a massive Deus Ex kick for the past month, and then this video was posted JUST as my copy of Tears of the Kingdom arrived. Spooky.
the thing that's hooked me the most I think is the fact that all the shrines that just give you an obstacle and a bunch of odds and ends to work with feel so fun to mess around in. I end up feeling like I've totally circumvented the intended path to the end in those shrines even when it's clear that what I did is pretty close to what nintendo wanted the player to do, which is just the best.
I still remember when I first tried the BOTW Demo at a little pop up thing in a Mall when it was first coming out, on the great plateau, you see a camp of bokoblins with a tree beside them with a beehive, one arrow later and that was that. I instantly knew the game was something different after that.
Elite video topic. Love you guys.
Ah, another banger video from Pat 'Totally Immersed' Gill
8:40 this. Tried deus ex so many times and constantly thought I miss stuff. Went all ways after I finished the room/missions. Or Definity Original Sin 2. Its a pain 😅 especially when alternative paths are dissappear after you finished a section. I have a huge fear of missing out it seems
I watched this video right when it came out, and have since been bingeing my way through all the games used as examples in this video. ImSims are my favorite type of game now. Thanks for making this video.
In a way, TOTK scratched that itch that I thought Cyberpunk 2077 would. Funny how things turned out.
Pat, you actually explained my favorite part of tears of the kingdom and helped me understand my grips with some of the game as well. The game is a wonderful immersive sim but the second you want to do the main story line you’re pigeon holed into doing talking to very specific people in the correct order and getting the requisite items or whatever to continue. I always found myself getting frustrated when this would happen with the main story and its 100% because i enjoyed the freedom of the immersive sim aspect! Being confined to fetch quests was such a wild whip lash for me that it pulled me out of the game.
I was actually just thinking today: "Man, I want to watch another great Patrick video" and then it happened.
I really like this style of essay. Thanks!
Great video! Yes. I've been playing immsims since Deus Ex '99 (am replaying Mankind Divided right now) and am also adoring TotK for the reasons you laid out. What a great love letter to good gameplay and clever creativity!
That opening story was so Maine it made me homesick
Immersive Sim mechanics work really well in a Sandbox Open World, so here's hoping other Triple A devs take note and try to follow
This was the first polygon video I’ve watch in many months. Thank u Pat for still being cool
This video is fire! Thanks for putting this together!
Prey (2017) was such a criminally underappreciated game. It EASILY has some of the best (and realistic) environmental and level designs in any game I've played -- just SO DAMNED GOOD!
I wish Prey (2017) had done better financially as it deserved to do better.
It serves as proof that simply creating a better product doesn't guarantee success, not in an industry that annually rewards lazy "copy-paste" games like FIFA or Call of Duty with record sales every year.
3:59 so what goes through my head everything I hear someone say “rules of nature”
This dudes videos ALWAYS slap! Keep up the good work.
huge shout out to the captions on this one
Ooh, great shout out to Prey (2017). I love that game!
9:35 Bold of you to show footage of the _one_ 2D Zelda that lets you take dungeons in any order
This is a very good video, but honestly, my favourite part is probably just Pat stifling a laugh both times he says "Rules of Nature".
"Under the influence of amphetamines, he has built his players a scale model of a subterranean thief's lair" superb.
Great writing and delivery!
cannot BELIEVE that Prey (2017) has Prop Hunt-style object possessing
love the term "desirable dead end", AND i love the incredible cardboard dungeon by your buddy. there's truly no limit to what can be created with hot glue,foam and cardboard.
Prey looks such a delight, i must add it to the todo list. Really enjoyed this video
What an intro.
At almost 30 now I am only just realizing that the majority of my most prized memories with games were from Immersive sims, I never really understood the difference between Immersive and RPG and generally went with "I prefer RPGs" when talking to friends about gaming. But now I come to think of it, it was always immersive sims.
Psy-Op's Mindgate Conspiracy (when Control came out, even though it's a 3rd person action game, the physics manipulation took me back to when I was 8 playing this for the first time)
GTA San Andrea's (kinda)
Deus Ex and the OG Hitman games were the only decent games my 2006 laptop could handle, so Deus Ex got like 20+ playthroughs, same with all Hitman games.
The Bioshock series
Mercenaries (sandbox mostly like GTA)
The Dishonored series
When I finally got around to PREY it became one of my all time cherished gaming experiences.
The Half Life series
The Elder Scrolls series
The Splinter Cell series (mainly Chao Theory)
The Metal Gear series
Gosh looking back at what I grew up playing I really need to be more grateful I was able to have those experiences honestly.
I don't think anyone would call Bugsnax an immersive sim, but the developers have talked about deliberately having elements of systemic gameplay. It's a creature collector, and there are always multiple ways of capturing any given bugsnack. The player has tools, but can also chain together combinations of tools and use the creatures own ai and behavior. There are even creature interactions that happen on their own without player input (like two "aggressive" types getting into a fight). I love it because it drives home the feeling of this being a full ecosystem with living beings, rather than a scavenger hunt.
One of my favourite things is sneaking up on monsters. Hell, sometimes I think that Nintendo actually intentionally puts things so that you'll come around the back, because there's no way I could just keep coming up on the back of a monster camp, or come at them from the air.
shoutbout to amphetamines
Why do so many stories about Maine remind me of living in West Virginia (in the best way)? Lol.
I had no clue how far back these sims went but it makes sense. I hope we get more games like this, preferably some without the camera angles that tend to cause motion sickness in folks. I love the Zelda games but I definitely can't play them for too long at a stretch.
And with that I have a word to describe what makes the medium of TTRPGs so special. Immersive Sim is the core principle, the thing that should be built towards to fully see what table top RPGs can do.
It's so great that video games are building towards this too. While it is much harder to create content like this in video game form, the advances in techniques are there for TTRPG designers to work from, especially since deductions on system design are still fairly niche.
I just wish I could get paid to build table top role playing games.
EXCELLENT explanation. I've watched a few videos explaining the Im Sim genre, but this one really clicked. BOTW's systems were already impressive, and TOTK's are just bonkers. And here I was thinking I'd never played an Im Sim - might have to try Prey or Dishonored next.
omg this has finally given me a word for the type of game I've been looking for!!! I'm an extremely casual gamer (think botw/minecraft/acnh on loop) and i /loved/ botw, and had been looking for a similar game since i played it. the only game that's fulfilled the brief for me has been totk! but i was using "open world" as the label for what i wanted, which meant I'd find plenty of open world games, but only really ones that wanted me to finish missions in specific ways. and "sandbox" felt /too/ open for what i was looking for. I'm so excited to go looking for more immersive sims to play!!!
beautiful cameo from pat's poor frog robot
"Absolutely not, but I loved it" is what all of us DMs hope to one day say to a player when asked that question.
I was talking to my friends who are all playing ToTK, and having not BoTW or it I said "It sounds kinda like an immersive sim" and they all said I was making a bit of stretch cause I haven't played it. So vindicating to see this.
I've never thought about BoTW and ToTK being immersive sims!
Great video! 👍
well written and executed, loved this video thoroughly
Another immersive sim to check is: arx fatalis (and maybe dark messiah to an extent)
“Why are you locked in the bathroom?” “You talking to me?”
That D&D story reminds me of SO MANY old D&D stories, and oh my god, that is exactly what it feels like!!
It’s nice to see immersive sims finally getting some love from the larger public.
The problem I have with breaking boundaries or defying expectations in Zelda is with combat - it doesn’t feel like you’re properly rewarded. Every time I’ve tried to create an elaborate Zonai contraption, set up traps using the elements, or use recall/ultrahand to smack a monster - it’s hardly enough to disarm a Blue Bokoblin, let alone put a dent in any of the late game enemies. Things like the time bomb/bomb barrels, beam emitters, and heavyweight items are just always far less efficient than taking out your strongest weapon and beating down an enemy with it. I don’t want to break those boundaries because I spend 5 minutes preparing just to take away 100 or less HP
I got distracted partway with trying to hear the bgm - it had a slight one winged angel thing goin on.
I love Pat's videos!
So, apparently, I haven't actually played TotK. I went through the whole story, including that jaw-droppingly awesome fight against Ganondorf, I did a lot of the shrines, explored a decent bit of the depths, etc., but judging by this footage here, I have not played TotK.
Hell yeah Pat, your videos rule every time.
This vid lead me to the discovery that Patrick is a fellow UMaine alumni and New Media major! Go black bears!
I hope Pat is having a great day
This makes me want to give DeusEx and System Shock another try. I’m definitely going to replay dishonored and Prey now that I’ve had such enjoyment with TotK
another pat instant classic video. i love this
Metal Gear Solid 5 seems to fit the description accurately
absolutely
A lot of Hideo Kojima's games would, actually.