Damn. Good find. I'm roaming around learning about this trunion stuff. Just earlier today ordered the CHE's for $40.00 more than the Comp trunions. Glad I did.
Hi, I’m about to upgrade my rockers for my new engine and not sure which way to to go. Could you please tell me which bronze bushing kit you ran that failed?
@@LivingMyBestLife956 Considering the Smith kit is $140 and tons in stock and the CHE is $220 and sold out this should give you a clue..... I'd go CHE over any other option for a bolt on upgrade unless you are running a shitpile of spring pressure and then the BTR shaft setup with the TSP roller tip rockers.
I know it’s an old vid, hoping to get a response. How many miles have you put on with the CHE upgrade? Currently gonna have a rebuild and trying to get any information I can on these before making a purchase.
I had put on about 12k miles on the first set. I would have kept running them except I did go to an aftermarket cylinder head (Liberty casting which is 1" taller and uses custom rocker stands). I probably would have been fine to keep using my original set, but I decided to get a new set due to any potential changes in geometry. I have no issues or complaints with the CHE kit. They are the gold standard if you ask me.
@@SilverSurfer77 As far as the rocker stands, what was the difference with those compared to the stock ones? I’m just really nervous about going through with the build and something happening with the stands or rockers themselves and something failing on me then ruining the engine. Also thanks for the response!
@@rolandcarrasco2717 the blue ones in the video were CNC billet from Livernois motor sports. Livernois claims OEM rocker trunnion bearings fail due to the flimsy cast OEM rocker stands. Even though I went with the CHE trunnions I wanted extra valve train stability with these stands. They also have an option to get with them ARP bolts which I did (although in hindsight I should have just purchased ARP rocker studs). My current heads are the FED M311's which have a different bolt hole spacing which requires a different rocker stand. You can see them here: ua-cam.com/video/eeeyVY2-g70/v-deo.htmlsi=WQVYhgsSowF66BJ6&t=280 Don't be nervous. I don't know the specifics of your build, but you should be fine with just going the CHE route. You might want to take a look at the BTR shaft mount system though. Moderately priced and has the advantage that several rockers are tied together with a common shaft that is anchored with several bolts, so that increases stability over a single bolt per rocker. The downside IMHO is that it uses the needle bearings and that makes me nervous. Maybe I am just overly nervous though after my experience with Comp bearings.
@@SilverSurfer77 I’ll look into the Livernois with the studs. Is going with studs vs bolts preferred or is it a personal preference thing? Going with the 224r cam. Not really focused on heads right now just because I wanna get it built and done already but now I know I can check out your build to give me a good idea how those heads run and what I’ll need to do for them.
@@rolandcarrasco2717 I think it really comes down to how fast you are going to spin the motor. More RPM's = Need for Valve train control. My motto is "aint no kill like overkill" and considering the valve train is the weak point of the LS motors, it makes sense to beef up this part of the motor. I am guessing with a 224 cam you are not going to spin very high...and CHE bushings with OEM rocker stands and bolts are going to be fine. I have a 233 cam and shift at 6900-7000 rpm at WOT. You can always add the CNC stands and ARP hardware later, it is not hard to upgrade after the motor is built.
I ordered my CHE kit pre-installed in oem LS3 rockers by Texas Speed in 2019. They included a different type of bolt head, allen key I think? Livernois did not know if their stand was compatible with that bolt design, do you know?
When I had the Comp trunions, the kit included different bolts, which were Allen head (I think). The comp trunions cannot accept oem bolts. The standard CHE kit does not include bolts, which tells me they accept standard LS rocker bolts. The Livernois rocker stand shouldn't matter as it's a direct stock replacement. I think you'd be fine running the bolts included in your kit.
The part number for my kit is 13702-KIT and when I read the instructions, it makes no mention of an aftermarket rocker stand. Do you have a part number for the stand or any other info?
Did you install the Comp trunnions using their installation tool? I had the Comp kit in my LS3 heads and the trunnions were extremely worn after 20-30k
Realize this is old, but i have had a set of comp trunions for little over 75,000 miles now. They show almost no wear on them and i got a .640 lift cam with some pretty stiff springs. The only reason i took them off is because the heads are away getting cnc ported. Doing a mild refresh on the motor. I plan on running the same comp trunions when it goes back together. I cant speak personally about the che bushings, but ive heard its not uncommon to see quite a bit of bronze flaking in the oil filter after short mileage. Under 20,000 in some cases. Just my $.02
I am glad your trunnions are working out for you. I am curious how well they fit in the rocker stands. Are the loose and wobbly like mine here in the video?
@SilverSurfer77 no mine actually fit like factory, I kinda looked at them as basically a factory fit with snap rings. To be clear I think the che is a great piece too. I just wasn't sure if they would have the longevity of a roller bearing with big spring pressures. Sounds like we've got opposite experiences lol
@@sikrandall83 when did you guy your kit? Do you still have the part number? I got mine in June 2015 PN 13702-KIT. Maybe they fixed some issues since then?
Legend, thanks for the info.
I am just about to upgrade to the CHE kit from stock.
Awesome, glad you liked it. Good luck on your build!
Damn. Good find. I'm roaming around learning about this trunion stuff. Just earlier today ordered the CHE's for $40.00 more than the Comp trunions. Glad I did.
You made the right choice!
Enjoy your bronze flake in your oil filter from the Bronze Trunnions. I know I experienced it and now run Comp Cams Caged Bearings
Hi, I’m about to upgrade my rockers for my new engine and not sure which way to to go. Could you please tell me which bronze bushing kit you ran that failed?
@@brocksutliff8782 Smith Brothers Bronze bushings.....Comp Cams Caged Trunnion Bearing Upgrade or stay stock.
@@LivingMyBestLife956 So you put cheap shit in and it fails; and then conclude the expensive shit is also bad?
@@johnw3724 Smith Brothers is cheap shit? I think not.
@@LivingMyBestLife956 Considering the Smith kit is $140 and tons in stock and the CHE is $220 and sold out this should give you a clue..... I'd go CHE over any other option for a bolt on upgrade unless you are running a shitpile of spring pressure and then the BTR shaft setup with the TSP roller tip rockers.
I know it’s an old vid, hoping to get a response. How many miles have you put on with the CHE upgrade? Currently gonna have a rebuild and trying to get any information I can on these before making a purchase.
I had put on about 12k miles on the first set. I would have kept running them except I did go to an aftermarket cylinder head (Liberty casting which is 1" taller and uses custom rocker stands). I probably would have been fine to keep using my original set, but I decided to get a new set due to any potential changes in geometry. I have no issues or complaints with the CHE kit. They are the gold standard if you ask me.
@@SilverSurfer77 As far as the rocker stands, what was the difference with those compared to the stock ones? I’m just really nervous about going through with the build and something happening with the stands or rockers themselves and something failing on me then ruining the engine. Also thanks for the response!
@@rolandcarrasco2717 the blue ones in the video were CNC billet from Livernois motor sports. Livernois claims OEM rocker trunnion bearings fail due to the flimsy cast OEM rocker stands. Even though I went with the CHE trunnions I wanted extra valve train stability with these stands. They also have an option to get with them ARP bolts which I did (although in hindsight I should have just purchased ARP rocker studs).
My current heads are the FED M311's which have a different bolt hole spacing which requires a different rocker stand. You can see them here:
ua-cam.com/video/eeeyVY2-g70/v-deo.htmlsi=WQVYhgsSowF66BJ6&t=280
Don't be nervous. I don't know the specifics of your build, but you should be fine with just going the CHE route. You might want to take a look at the BTR shaft mount system though. Moderately priced and has the advantage that several rockers are tied together with a common shaft that is anchored with several bolts, so that increases stability over a single bolt per rocker. The downside IMHO is that it uses the needle bearings and that makes me nervous. Maybe I am just overly nervous though after my experience with Comp bearings.
@@SilverSurfer77 I’ll look into the Livernois with the studs. Is going with studs vs bolts preferred or is it a personal preference thing?
Going with the 224r cam. Not really focused on heads right now just because I wanna get it built and done already but now I know I can check out your build to give me a good idea how those heads run and what I’ll need to do for them.
@@rolandcarrasco2717 I think it really comes down to how fast you are going to spin the motor. More RPM's = Need for Valve train control.
My motto is "aint no kill like overkill" and considering the valve train is the weak point of the LS motors, it makes sense to beef up this part of the motor. I am guessing with a 224 cam you are not going to spin very high...and CHE bushings with OEM rocker stands and bolts are going to be fine. I have a 233 cam and shift at 6900-7000 rpm at WOT. You can always add the CNC stands and ARP hardware later, it is not hard to upgrade after the motor is built.
I ordered my CHE kit pre-installed in oem LS3 rockers by Texas Speed in 2019. They included a different type of bolt head, allen key I think? Livernois did not know if their stand was compatible with that bolt design, do you know?
When I had the Comp trunions, the kit included different bolts, which were Allen head (I think). The comp trunions cannot accept oem bolts.
The standard CHE kit does not include bolts, which tells me they accept standard LS rocker bolts.
The Livernois rocker stand shouldn't matter as it's a direct stock replacement.
I think you'd be fine running the bolts included in your kit.
New rocker stand is required. Comp Cams recommended. Mine didn’t do that with comp cams
The part number for my kit is 13702-KIT and when I read the instructions, it makes no mention of an aftermarket rocker stand. Do you have a part number for the stand or any other info?
Did you install the Comp trunnions using their installation tool? I had the Comp kit in my LS3 heads and the trunnions were extremely worn after 20-30k
I installed them using the supplied washer system they included in the kit. Instead of an arbor press, I used a drill press to push it in.
how about a link to that rocker arm stand.
www.livernoismotorsports.com/gm-rocker-bar-bases
Realize this is old, but i have had a set of comp trunions for little over 75,000 miles now. They show almost no wear on them and i got a .640 lift cam with some pretty stiff springs. The only reason i took them off is because the heads are away getting cnc ported. Doing a mild refresh on the motor.
I plan on running the same comp trunions when it goes back together. I cant speak personally about the che bushings, but ive heard its not uncommon to see quite a bit of bronze flaking in the oil filter after short mileage. Under 20,000 in some cases. Just my $.02
I am glad your trunnions are working out for you. I am curious how well they fit in the rocker stands. Are the loose and wobbly like mine here in the video?
@SilverSurfer77 no mine actually fit like factory, I kinda looked at them as basically a factory fit with snap rings. To be clear I think the che is a great piece too. I just wasn't sure if they would have the longevity of a roller bearing with big spring pressures. Sounds like we've got opposite experiences lol
@@sikrandall83 when did you guy your kit? Do you still have the part number? I got mine in June 2015 PN 13702-KIT. Maybe they fixed some issues since then?
@SilverSurfer77 oh shoot man, it's about 5 or 6 years old too. I'd have to look and see, but I honestly have no idea what the part number was now
Thank you for the vid
You're welcome sir!
Mine did the same shit. F comp trunions