@@coolgreenbug7551 I'd argue that most protagonists have to be interesting or have interesting people around them, and many protagonists and their friends are not awful people.
It's also why Snyder is a terrible choice to start a DC Universe, specifically with Superman. Superman IS hope, he is the heart of the DC universe. Despite being an alien, Clark Kent is more human than anyone else. And he is Clark Kent, not Superman. Superman is just a mask, but he's always Clark first. That's why Snyder's films just don't work, they fundamentally misunderstand the character (best shown with how he treated Pa Kent).
As a huge Superman fan, this gave me chills, I loved the three new scenes, wouldn’t save the movie but would make it significantly better. Jimmy is such an important and underrated part of Superman mythos, through the aspect you mentioned about Superman having a friend who legitimately believes him and is inspired by him. He just shows the positive impact Supes has in the world around him. Also, while not particularly fitting in this context, he serves in other stories (like his issue in All-Star) to show just how crazy sci-fi fantasy Metropolis and the DC Universe can be to a regular guy, and that can lead to a lot of cool adventures and world building. Anyway, great video!
however, it would go against everything the movie itself is about. thats why jimmy was shot in the start, to get the point across that this is not that kind of story. Clark doesnt get inspired by anyone until the end of the film, if he would get inspired and supported from the start it would have been a totally different story.
@@joaobueno450 Or you could watch a completely different film. Its not that the film gets Superman wrong, the film simply have the guts to make superman different and fully commits to that difference in all aspect. For what it is, and the purpose and the point for the change it work. Sure I totally respect other peoples states, but down condemn it simply because its different
That would be a little too cheesy, you gotta make sure Jimmy and Superman’s relationship is bright and hopeful but not corny otherwise it’s tonally inconsistent and cringey
Jimmy Olsen didn’t need to be like comic book cheery; he could’ve also just been an optimist for Superman’s existence through BVS without having to be killed by a terrorist
I see Olsen's character in BvS is just another example of hollywood replacing every single redhead with non-redheads. Hollywood really seems to hate gingers.
I* don’t read the comics but I love lore and I knew the direction u were going with this. Jimmy is the Everyman. The person Clark would probably be like most even if he didn’t have powers. An optimist looking to a better tomorrow and knowing the the hero he believes in would save him. He’s Superman’s link to those that believe in what he’s supposed to stand and one the pillars that keeps the flying blue boys scout truly grounded. Truly human.
Jimmy Olsen, CIA Agent, was such a lost opportunity. Imagine if the US govt put him into place alongside Lois in an attempt to learn who Kal-El is? But Jimmy ends up deciding to conceal the truth because he believes in Supes...
Can we talk about how in man of steel they had a gender swapped Jimmy? Its Jenny. The dark haired woman in all the newsroom scenes with perry white and lois. They even mentioned it in either the commentary or behind the scenes if I remember correctly?
I heard about that pretty late in the game but figured since Zack put Jimmy into the movie as Jimmy, it was pretty clear what he expected from the character.
@@jinxie712 In the comics Jimmy would crossdress a lot and called himself Jenny so in my head cannon Jimmy survived the bullet and just works at the Daily Planet dress as a women CLASSIC JIMMY OLSEN
@kafu Kemeh That's what I'm thinking they'll do if they decide to retcon Jimmy's execution. I figure that there is a Jimmy Olsen, and the CIA wants to insert an operative with Lois when she goes in to interview the warlord. So the CIA operative takes Jimmy's identity, and Lois is only told that his name is Jimmy so she won't accidentally blow his cover by calling him by his real name. On the other hand, Snyder thought murdering Jimmy was a "fun easter egg for the fans", so I wouldn't expect him to try to bring Jimmy back.
@@cesarsantivanez4111 he has Superman without his interaction with people and a Batman that kills with no commentary on Batman killing. Superman kills for shock value since the movie continues as if he didnt.
@@pdzombie1906 Peter parker isn't JUST a photographer. He's also got the superhero angle. How many stories are there where petes only function is photography? None. There is no reason to have a character in a movie if they are just a photographer. Everybody with a cell phone can fill that role now.
Chris Allen People are more than their job, dude. They’re, you know, people. Who believe things and interact with others and make decisions that impact the world around them.
@@UltimateKyuubiFox Not this one. This one is utterly useless and serves no purpose at all beyond being a friend of superman. That's moronic. Theres a reason that no comics use him very much
Jimmy Olsen from Name-Drop City? Two ways that could go... Fawcett City, original home of Captain Marvel and the Marvel Family before they shifted to Philly, or... Bludhaven. Can you imagine?! Jimmy Olsen from the city so terrifying it makes Gotham's Narrows and Metropolis' Suicide Slums look like Beverly Hills? That would be ridiculous, but amazing.
The moment I realized Zack Snyder couldn't care less about these characters. It's like when I heard Tim Burton say years after he made the Batman movies that he's never read a comic book.
Funny how the world is divided into two, the ones who support Superman, and the people who hate Superman, in this movie. Maybe that should have been his purpose. To represent the people who accepted Superman.
The problem with that is, Superman himself needs to think that everyone outside his family either hates him or is sceptical of him. Jimmy Olsen would pretty much shoot this idea in the head
I love your addition, and definitely agree that the brightness in people and atmosphere needed to be represented to help explain Superman. Please keep up the great work c:
@@Vesohag Jesus had disciples before his resurrection. Seeing superman lose the support of his loved ones when lex frames him would have added emotionality to his character.
@@skeletor4436 pay attention to the movies. Superman was only depressed in BvS because a large portion of humanity hated him. Superman wasnt inherently depressed. In MoS he was upbeat and joked around with lois and military soilders on several occasions. In MoS clark goes from being unsure of himself, his purpose and scared of humanity to choosing to be the worlds saviour and proud of his identity. In BvS he feels guilty over black zero, and doesn't know how to be the worlds saviour. This causes him to not even believe superman can exist. However he is inspired by batman to believe in himself and humanity. With this new found hope he sacrafices his life happily. A 2 movie arc a child could understand and it somehow went over your head.
Smallville's Jimmy Olsen had the best arc/character development and served an interesting purpose...until he was killed off and unceremoniously replaced with his oddly doppelganger...nephew with the same name?
Grace Randolf has been parroting BvS as this godly elseworld story for 5 years. I'm so glad Nando set the record straight. Excellent commentary on what makes a story elseworld or not.
Yes thank you!!! She keeps saying that but no person who actually worked on the movie ever said it was an else worlds. Not to mention it still doesn't work as an else worlds story since the writing and characters themselves are so inconsistent
Well said! In Superman: Secret Origin by Geoff Johns and Gary Frank, there's this perfect scene where a distraught Superman thinks Jimmy is about to jump off a building and rushes to him. He wasn't but he was pretty sad too and wants to leave Metropolis. They have a talk and in the end Clark tells him "I haven't made many friends in Metropolis, it'd be a shame to lose the only one I've got". THIS is a human Superman. This is ALSO a HOPE giving/inspiring Superman.
Snyder's version of Lois (Amy Adams) looks like a female version of Jimmy Olsen! Jimmy's character competes with Lois for screen-time, they serve a similar purpose (traditionally), just Lois' relationship with Superman/Clark is more storied and meaningful.
Jimmy Olsen is supposed to be "us"-the people who look up to Superman while Lex is the "you can't please everyone" character. They actually serve a purpose and create a dynamic around Superman. People keep saying that Supes isn't relatable (which I disagree with), then the characters around him should represent us. And thank you for making this. Jimmy is an integral character and Zack Snyder just had "fun" with him. Clearly he didn't understand Superman and the world around him. I enjoyed your content. I actually binge-watched your MoS rewrite. While I don't agree with some parts, you really had great ideas that made the story more logical (ironic since the idea of MoS was to make a "realistic" take on Superman). And the things I disagree with are caused by the fact that you were doing a rewrite and you were limited by the film's story, themes, and even character arcs. If it were up to me, I'd just write an entirely new Superman movie, a trilogy for that matter. I do have ideas but the odds of that even getting realized is zero to none.
Facts, i loved those videos Nando made but I also would rather an entirely new story instead of a rewrite that’s limited….honestly would do that for the whole DCEU instead of just Superman
I am a huge dc comics fan and this video explaining how Jimmy could have worked is just beautifully done You are just said all the things that have bothered me about the Snyder universe
I just wanted to say, both your dialogue writing and your dialogue reading has improved noticeably in the last few months! Great work! Got an ad during the sponsor segment. If that aint just UA-cam, lol.
I have an interesting relationship to Batman v Superman, because I liked the movie... but I'm becoming more and more convinced that the reasons I like it ("this isn't how these heroes are supposed to be but that's the POINT") are the opposite of why Zack Snyder expected people to like it
Singer saw Superman, as a Super Man. Snyder sees Superman as a little more optimistic version of Dr. Manhattan. Since 2006 we don't have the Real Superman.
the best super hero stories deal with the responsibility to be both the super hero and the alter ego, responsible to save the day and be there for their city, but also there for the people most important in their life
I find it funny that after making a bit of a big deal about Perry White being played by a black guy & Jimmy being a woman for Man of Steel, that they then just dropped the female Jimmy completely. It's not even like it was a different director making a different decision. Also, Louis & Clark: The New Adventures of Superman tv series maintained a large part for Jimmy Olsen throughout, so it's not like there's a lack of evidence of making him work on film.
@Nando V Movies I think you should have mentioned the supergirl TV show. I know this is a movie channel and it is hard to compare a show to a movie, but the season 1 reimagining of Jimmy Olsen and the little tidbits throughout the seasons about his knowledge of Clark is so unique and is quite useful.
.... it's really telling, and really disturbing that Snyder's idea of "having fun" with a character is literally having them killed execution style. It sounds like a line used by a super villain from one of the comics he's failed to adapt.
14:43 Great video great pitch But the conversation can end slightly sooner with clark just saying "well, you have one now" and patting his shoulder as he walks away This would really capture just the friendly attitude of superman without the awkward "well if you wanna go out for a drink" thing I think for a moment he can be confident It can also be read as clark getting his hopes up after seeing someone believe in him
Honestly, the thing that's turned me off from Snyderverse movies is exactly what this video's about: character's giving hope. It really feels like Zack and his team just want to make Watchman, but with the big name DC characters.
Since Jimmy is a kid when Clark shows up, I think "pal" would be like "champ" or "sport." So maybe his introduction is Superman is floating above the Daily Planet, tons of people snapping photos yelling questions, and a nervous, maybe 14 year old, is the only one who asks Superman permission for a picture. Surprised and pleased, Superman says, "Sure pal, where do you want me?" Jimmy has him pose next to the globe on top of the daily planet, everyone respectfully clearing the way, and Jimmy gets the photo that Perry White decides to print.
It actually means a lot to me that someone finally made a 20 min video on the DCEU's Jimmy Olsen, once again proof that this movie could have been more than what it was
I love how some UA-cam creators who work with other creators act like they are part of some secret club and I just like to imagine you guys all sitting around a table - Kingsmen style - with holograph copies of each other and you discuss the goings on of UA-cam and the comic verse.
Late to the party here. Loved Fraction's run on Jimmy. Funniest book of the year. But your Jimmy and Superman scene reminds me of Ennis and McCrea's Hitman 34. Worth a Google. I know you aren't the biggest Ennis fan but the book won an Eisner for best single issue of the year and is the best Superman story you've never read.
I brought this up before & it always pops in my mind when Jimmy Olsen & MoS/BvS is brought up, so I'll say it here too before Nando makes his points & sways me. I thought it was really cool when MoS introduces _Jenny_ Olsen, & I was really looking forward to how they would use her going forward. Then nothing happened. It still bugs me.
Except the character's name is just Jenny. She's never given a last name. Her being an Olsen is a fan theory, as I don't recall it ever being addressed by Snyder, Goyer, etc. Hardly surprising that she never appears again, though. The Daily Planet hardly appears again. It seems like Snyder isn't interested in anything about Clark Kent. It's all about Clark being Superman, not about Superman being Clark.
You know, I don't think any interpretation of Superman in live action has ever capitalized on Clark and Jimmy's relationship much or at all. In the Adventures of Lois and Clark (the best Superman), Jimmy is used almost exclusively to foil off of Perry as a protege and as office comic relief, be he and Clark don't personally ever have any moments or arcs or regular banter going on together. Jimmy has a Superman watch but never uses it. And Superman didn't give it to him. In Smallville, Jimmy is introduced to let the CW fan insert OC Cloe date her way through the significant Superman mythos. So he was Cloes boyfriend for a while. And a few episodes gave him things to do with Lois, but never Clark. I really really love your take on using Jimmy in this movie. Superman needs a friend, whose not a love interest, to remind him of the optimistic hopeful people he does everything for.
We need to take into consideration that this movie has a lot from different comics, like TDKR, Birthright, Crisis on Infinite Earths, The Death of Superman, etc. And in the Injustice comic, if I remember correctly, one of the first things to happen is the Joker killing Jimmy Olsen.
Yeah, this is a lot of what I've been saying for. Awhile. ZS should have used analogs in original characters. Always get told by Snyder Fans that Jimmy is useless, and it just backs up the idea that they don't know anything about the dcu
Main continuity + Else world = Multiverse story, or something to that effect! Movie Idea: Golden age Superman & Red Son superman are from kryptonian colonies destroyed & Modern Superman is from Krypton proper & he & Golden have a Mentor-Apprentice relationship! Kent is a very common name, so it could work & Modern Lois could be a descendant of Gold Lois's sister, or cousin!
I am completely sure Zack Snyder is the kind of person who wants to do everything in his own way, but is so scared of failure that he takes benefit of recognizable characters (Superman, Batman, etc.) without caring about them, he only cares on his story.
@@dragonx3015 most of MoS and BvS story had already been done in comics.(earth 1, birthright, dark knight returns, war of the supermen, etc) Snyder didnt invent he adapted.
Take me down to [NAMEDROP CITY] where the grass is [COLOR] and the girls are [USER PREFERENCE]
Ok, this one made me laugh xD
I see you are a person of culture as well.
I was already laughing with the content of the post (there was an attempt), the joke made it even better.
You're the hero we never knew we needed
Commenting just so I don't lose this one 🤣
That killed me! XD keep being awesome c:
This could actually fuse very well into your BvS rewrite from awhile ago.
Like having the no legged man become Metallo
This
Now I’m just hanging on for a full BvS rewrite
.
@@loyalcarpark4642 the Nando Cut
"He has no cynicism" is exactly why Snyder thought Jimmy was best used as cannon fodder.
But Jimmy is a decent person
People don't like watching decent people
All of the interesting characters in fiction are all awful people
@@coolgreenbug7551 I'd argue that most protagonists have to be interesting or have interesting people around them, and many protagonists and their friends are not awful people.
@@wildwolf8505 I know that, I was just saying what Zach Snyder probably thinks
@@coolgreenbug7551 I'm tired and completely missed the sarcasm.
It's also why Snyder is a terrible choice to start a DC Universe, specifically with Superman. Superman IS hope, he is the heart of the DC universe. Despite being an alien, Clark Kent is more human than anyone else. And he is Clark Kent, not Superman. Superman is just a mask, but he's always Clark first. That's why Snyder's films just don't work, they fundamentally misunderstand the character (best shown with how he treated Pa Kent).
As a huge Superman fan, this gave me chills, I loved the three new scenes, wouldn’t save the movie but would make it significantly better. Jimmy is such an important and underrated part of Superman mythos, through the aspect you mentioned about Superman having a friend who legitimately believes him and is inspired by him. He just shows the positive impact Supes has in the world around him. Also, while not particularly fitting in this context, he serves in other stories (like his issue in All-Star) to show just how crazy sci-fi fantasy Metropolis and the DC Universe can be to a regular guy, and that can lead to a lot of cool adventures and world building. Anyway, great video!
however, it would go against everything the movie itself is about.
thats why jimmy was shot in the start, to get the point across that this is not that kind of story.
Clark doesnt get inspired by anyone until the end of the film, if he would get inspired and supported from the start it would have been a totally different story.
@@haalandfilms1695 Yes, it would be a completely different movie, and that’s why I think it would be better.
@@joaobueno450 Or you could watch a completely different film.
Its not that the film gets Superman wrong, the film simply have the guts to make superman different and fully commits to that difference in all aspect.
For what it is, and the purpose and the point for the change it work.
Sure I totally respect other peoples states, but down condemn it simply because its different
Imagine you're the guy who gets cast as Jimmy Olsen in a Superman movie, and then you read the script 😐
Imagine anyone actually caring to play a useless irrelevant side character like Jimmy Olsen 😐
@@filmgoblin5016who hurt you?
"Superman is what I can do, Clark is who I am " from Clark to Loise, in the 90's tv series. I always liked that. That Superman was hopefull
Jimmy is human frailty and humility coupled with undying optimism. Why wouldn't Clarke want to fight for humanity with a friend like that.
nando, i love you, but i can't believe that you set yourself up and then missed it. 16:23 jimmy "we're FRIENDS!?" superman "... pals."
OOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
That's the perfect response
That would be a little too cheesy, you gotta make sure Jimmy and Superman’s relationship is bright and hopeful but not corny otherwise it’s tonally inconsistent and cringey
@@mrcritical6751 but what if sups visibly cringes during the ellipses...
@@bae_ofpigz that just begs the question why he said it if he himself hates saying it
Jimmy does not work in the Snyderverse because he's actually a happy person. That goes against everything the Snyderverse stands for
But he turned superman angsty. You know the guy who's known for being a symbol of hope. So I'm sure he could've turned Jimmy into a edgelord.
Jimmy Olsen didn’t need to be like comic book cheery; he could’ve also just been an optimist for Superman’s existence through BVS without having to be killed by a terrorist
@@somethingclever4297 "this is my world. You are my world" yep sounds pretty angsty to me
@@elijahlee3610 the world should be his world
@@JayJay-kq8ol he said that too Lois
As someone who really does enjoy Snyder’s films, I DEFINITELY agree with your argument that Superman needed Jimmy Olsen.
This is a comment of contradiction.
Just imagine if they treated Jimmy Olsen like this and Rupert Grint played Jimmy
Given how WB mistreated him as Ron Weasley before. I’m not sure that he’ gonna turn out well as Jimmy.
I see Olsen's character in BvS is just another example of hollywood replacing every single redhead with non-redheads. Hollywood really seems to hate gingers.
I mean lois, who usually has black hair is played by a redhead in bvs
Every minority: *screams in agreement*
F
This really annoys me as well
Meanwhile Jessica Chastain has to dye her hair blonde for Dark Phoenix when she could’ve been Mera! 😩😭
Jimmy is what Superman sees in humanity, the wide eyed hopeful dreamer, and Superman wants to protect that because he sees the best in humanity.
I* don’t read the comics but I love lore and I knew the direction u were going with this. Jimmy is the Everyman. The person Clark would probably be like most even if he didn’t have powers. An optimist looking to a better tomorrow and knowing the the hero he believes in would save him. He’s Superman’s link to those that believe in what he’s supposed to stand and one the pillars that keeps the flying blue boys scout truly grounded. Truly human.
Jimmy Olsen, CIA Agent, was such a lost opportunity. Imagine if the US govt put him into place alongside Lois in an attempt to learn who Kal-El is? But Jimmy ends up deciding to conceal the truth because he believes in Supes...
Just those added 3 scene pitches already had me misty eyed. You're absolutely right, BVS was hopeless without reprieve.
Can we talk about how in man of steel they had a gender swapped Jimmy? Its Jenny. The dark haired woman in all the newsroom scenes with perry white and lois.
They even mentioned it in either the commentary or behind the scenes if I remember correctly?
I heard about that pretty late in the game but figured since Zack put Jimmy into the movie as Jimmy, it was pretty clear what he expected from the character.
And they played her off as if she was Jimmy?
@@jinxie712 In the comics Jimmy would crossdress a lot and called himself Jenny so in my head cannon Jimmy survived the bullet and just works at the Daily Planet dress as a women
CLASSIC JIMMY OLSEN
@kafu Kemeh That's what I'm thinking they'll do if they decide to retcon Jimmy's execution. I figure that there is a Jimmy Olsen, and the CIA wants to insert an operative with Lois when she goes in to interview the warlord. So the CIA operative takes Jimmy's identity, and Lois is only told that his name is Jimmy so she won't accidentally blow his cover by calling him by his real name.
On the other hand, Snyder thought murdering Jimmy was a "fun easter egg for the fans", so I wouldn't expect him to try to bring Jimmy back.
@@slothbaby2104 *Leslie Lowe intensifies*
The shippers would go crazy over scenes like this. What a great characterization.
Ant-Man and the Wasp and the Ant-Man>Quantumania
It hasn't even come out yet
@@sebastien-loikntsangou-kan5264 I think he means the title
@@sebastien-loikntsangou-kan5264 It's the title Nando proposed for the movie.
@@peterfrank3365 really?
Zach is a fine person to have behind the camera, but in the writing room? Get em outta there I'm sorry bruh he doesn't get the characters at ALL
He does understand the characters
In what way he doesn't?
@@cesarsantivanez4111 he has Superman without his interaction with people and a Batman that kills with no commentary on Batman killing. Superman kills for shock value since the movie continues as if he didnt.
@@felipea1399 I'm surprised lex luthor didn't get his money via hard work and kindness and regurely donated his money to charity.
BvS is written by Chris Terrio and David S. Goyer.
@@hruaiacolney3066 Presumably he had final say though. Since he and other directors seem to always get all the credit.
Zach Snyder: Kills beloved character to show how much he cares about fans or lore...
Synder fans: Finally, Jimmy Olsen has a purpose...
They aren't wrong. Jimmy is totally useless, he's just a photographer
@@chrisallen9296 Peter Parker would like a word with you...
@@pdzombie1906 Peter parker isn't JUST a photographer. He's also got the superhero angle. How many stories are there where petes only function is photography? None. There is no reason to have a character in a movie if they are just a photographer. Everybody with a cell phone can fill that role now.
Chris Allen People are more than their job, dude. They’re, you know, people. Who believe things and interact with others and make decisions that impact the world around them.
@@UltimateKyuubiFox Not this one. This one is utterly useless and serves no purpose at all beyond being a friend of superman. That's moronic. Theres a reason that no comics use him very much
I love BvS, but this would have definitely made the film better
You know what the saddest thing about this is? Jimmy Olsen only works in the DCEU if they used your version of Man of Steel.
#ReleasetheNandoCut
Jimmy Olsen from Name-Drop City? Two ways that could go... Fawcett City, original home of Captain Marvel and the Marvel Family before they shifted to Philly, or... Bludhaven. Can you imagine?! Jimmy Olsen from the city so terrifying it makes Gotham's Narrows and Metropolis' Suicide Slums look like Beverly Hills? That would be ridiculous, but amazing.
Zack Snyder: "I thought it would be fun"
The moment I realized Zack Snyder couldn't care less about these characters. It's like when I heard Tim Burton say years after he made the Batman movies that he's never read a comic book.
A character who’s genuinely fun, likable and without cynicism. In a Zack Synder movie. Error 404
You haven't seen owls of Gahoole have you?
@ΑΡΙΣΤΟΤΕΛΗΣ ΛΑΧΑΝΟΠΟΥΛΟΣ Zack didn't take much creative control of the film though.
You continue to surprise me with your creativity, Nando. I freakin' love it.
excited for rise of skywalker episode 4
It is coming very soon. It's currently mostly finished on Patreon.
i legitimately check youtube daily for it 🔥
@@cianfreehill792 yeh bro loved ep 3
@@NandovMovies cmon its been 15 mins! How soon are we saying.
@@NandovMovies lets goooooo!!!!!!
Funny how the world is divided into two, the ones who support Superman, and the people who hate Superman, in this movie.
Maybe that should have been his purpose. To represent the people who accepted Superman.
Just like in the Legacy episode
@@srstriker6420 Legacy episode of what?
@@byronsenior6499 Superman: The Animated Series
@@byronsenior6499 Superman the animated series, the one where he believes he was Darkseid’s son
The problem with that is, Superman himself needs to think that everyone outside his family either hates him or is sceptical of him.
Jimmy Olsen would pretty much shoot this idea in the head
I love your addition, and definitely agree that the brightness in people and atmosphere needed to be represented to help explain Superman. Please keep up the great work c:
If Superman is a Jesus figure in the Snyderverse, he definitely lacked some apostles
That's why you have JL. And then he comes back from death.
@@Vesohag Jesus had disciples before his resurrection. Seeing superman lose the support of his loved ones when lex frames him would have added emotionality to his character.
@@dominic-columbine but Jesus also had people that would still believe in him when and after getting crucified.
This sums up the reason I hate Zack's DC movies, this comes off like he doesn't care about Superman at all.
For someone who doesnt care about superman he sure does spend a lot of time fleshing him out
@@elijahlee3610 He doesn't? He creates a character called Superman that doesn't resemble Superman at all.
@@elijahlee3610 he does't flesh superman out at all he just makes a depressing mess
@@skeletor4436 pay attention to the movies. Superman was only depressed in BvS because a large portion of humanity hated him. Superman wasnt inherently depressed. In MoS he was upbeat and joked around with lois and military soilders on several occasions. In MoS clark goes from being unsure of himself, his purpose and scared of humanity to choosing to be the worlds saviour and proud of his identity. In BvS he feels guilty over black zero, and doesn't know how to be the worlds saviour. This causes him to not even believe superman can exist. However he is inspired by batman to believe in himself and humanity. With this new found hope he sacrafices his life happily. A 2 movie arc a child could understand and it somehow went over your head.
@@RadinV1 yes because happily giving your life for a bunch of people who hated you isnt superman at all
Man of Steel could be a Hyperion movie, if they learned into the spiteful and detached side of Clark.
Wow I'm just now realizing jesse eisenberg would've been soooo much better as jimmy olsen :/
i'll raise you one better and say the character bvs REALLY needed was bibbo bibbowski
Actually this is a great idea
I really miss/loved that character
You nailed it.
Smallville's Jimmy Olsen had the best arc/character development and served an interesting purpose...until he was killed off and unceremoniously replaced with his oddly doppelganger...nephew with the same name?
Smallville's Jimmy Olsen was the best, just like Lex Luthor and Lionel Luthor
@@ЖудаМ and Oliver Queen... Shame about the Clark kent :p
@@ЖудаМ That was Henry James Olsen, the older brother of the comic book James Bartholomew Olsen.
The convoluted plot lines of DC live action shows never fail to amuse me.
@@ЖудаМ Lionel is a Smallville original characther.
Grace Randolf has been parroting BvS as this godly elseworld story for 5 years. I'm so glad Nando set the record straight. Excellent commentary on what makes a story elseworld or not.
Yes thank you!!! She keeps saying that but no person who actually worked on the movie ever said it was an else worlds. Not to mention it still doesn't work as an else worlds story since the writing and characters themselves are so inconsistent
Didn't know The Weekly Planet got put into Batman v Superman. Wow they sure hit it big.
Funny how that podcast started in anticipation of BVS
@@CoalDiamondandhisawesomeness i remember when it was released they kept joking about how they were gonna stop the podcast and little me was worried
Ah those jimmy/Superman scenes you made up almost made me cry
Was not prepared for these feels😭🖤🖤
Well said! In Superman: Secret Origin by Geoff Johns and Gary Frank, there's this perfect scene where a distraught Superman thinks Jimmy is about to jump off a building and rushes to him. He wasn't but he was pretty sad too and wants to leave Metropolis. They have a talk and in the end Clark tells him "I haven't made many friends in Metropolis, it'd be a shame to lose the only one I've got". THIS is a human Superman. This is ALSO a HOPE giving/inspiring Superman.
The Supergirl version of Jimmy Olsen is an interesting, different take too. Surprised it wasn't mentioned.
Unfortunately, he was overshadowed and isn’t relevant as he was during Season 1 and 2.
He's boring af the show makes him even worse
That guy isnt Jimmy Olsen
Hollywood should hire you as a screenplay consultant or something.
That's the Endgame.
Next video: Captain Marvel needed Rick Jones.
I'd say The Incredible Hulk needed Rick more than Captain Marvel
@@Judeman765 true, but he definitely should've been in CM, too.
I'm surprised he hasn't done a rewrite for that movie.
No, Captain Marvel needed more Shazam. The old wizard is supposed to stick around as a mentor to Billy, not evaporate as soon as they meet.
Rick Jones stand-alone movie! He Rosecrantz and/or Guildensterns through Hulk, Captain America, and Captain Marvel stories as their sidekick. Somehow.
This is probably one of my favorite videos you've made. Thanks for the awesome content
Snyder's version of Lois (Amy Adams) looks like a female version of Jimmy Olsen! Jimmy's character competes with Lois for screen-time, they serve a similar purpose (traditionally), just Lois' relationship with Superman/Clark is more storied and meaningful.
I think the movie needs superman actually supermaning y'know
Him saving the day and people liking him
The moment you said, "No cynicism", Snyder and DC were a hard no too...
They nailed this interpretation in the first season of Lois and Clark.
As well as the Superman Animated Series by Dini
@@dlvnmedia but that's pretty much perfect bro
@@porassrivastava8242 "A brave new metropolis" is easily one of the best evil superman ever.
Jimmy Olsen is supposed to be "us"-the people who look up to Superman while Lex is the "you can't please everyone" character. They actually serve a purpose and create a dynamic around Superman. People keep saying that Supes isn't relatable (which I disagree with), then the characters around him should represent us.
And thank you for making this. Jimmy is an integral character and Zack Snyder just had "fun" with him. Clearly he didn't understand Superman and the world around him.
I enjoyed your content. I actually binge-watched your MoS rewrite. While I don't agree with some parts, you really had great ideas that made the story more logical (ironic since the idea of MoS was to make a "realistic" take on Superman). And the things I disagree with are caused by the fact that you were doing a rewrite and you were limited by the film's story, themes, and even character arcs.
If it were up to me, I'd just write an entirely new Superman movie, a trilogy for that matter. I do have ideas but the odds of that even getting realized is zero to none.
Facts, i loved those videos Nando made but I also would rather an entirely new story instead of a rewrite that’s limited….honestly would do that for the whole DCEU instead of just Superman
Also in some ways Superman is more relatable than Batman lol
I've literally had the same thought
Jimmy Olsen is like the mumen rider of superman
It's funny how some of these big budget movies can sometimes forget the little moments. They help make the story.
I am a huge dc comics fan and this video explaining how Jimmy could have worked is just beautifully done
You are just said all the things that have bothered me about the Snyder universe
13:18 "weekly planet" shoutout to mr. sunday movies
I just wanted to say, both your dialogue writing and your dialogue reading has improved noticeably in the last few months! Great work!
Got an ad during the sponsor segment. If that aint just UA-cam, lol.
I have an interesting relationship to Batman v Superman, because I liked the movie... but I'm becoming more and more convinced that the reasons I like it ("this isn't how these heroes are supposed to be but that's the POINT") are the opposite of why Zack Snyder expected people to like it
WB really messed up choosing Zach to be at the helm of their cinematic universe.
Aww, that was so good!
Singer saw Superman, as a Super Man. Snyder sees Superman as a little more optimistic version of Dr. Manhattan. Since 2006 we don't have the Real Superman.
Totally love that you hollered out some other channels!
Jimmy crushing on Clark and simping for Superman is what I needed today. Thank you.
the best super hero stories deal with the responsibility to be both the super hero and the alter ego, responsible to save the day and be there for their city, but also there for the people most important in their life
I've been reading so much Superman recently to get through things, this is my Superman to a tee
Jordy Vanderput’s class on color grading is amazing for anyone decently experienced in premiere
I truly believe that Zach Snyder could've been so great at a "Midnighter Vs Mister Majestic: Rise of Authority" film.
"Clark smiles" Hold on, hold on, hold on. He doesn't do that in these movies.
@kafu Kemeh to quote Batman “not enough”
Perfect understanding of these characters
Another worthwhile video. And it reminds me to again wonder why so many seem so enthusiastic about the upcoming Snyder cut of Justice League.
well said
Perfect!
I find it funny that after making a bit of a big deal about Perry White being played by a black guy & Jimmy being a woman for Man of Steel, that they then just dropped the female Jimmy completely. It's not even like it was a different director making a different decision.
Also, Louis & Clark: The New Adventures of Superman tv series maintained a large part for Jimmy Olsen throughout, so it's not like there's a lack of evidence of making him work on film.
Excellent story idea and essay
@Nando V Movies I think you should have mentioned the supergirl TV show. I know this is a movie channel and it is hard to compare a show to a movie, but the season 1 reimagining of Jimmy Olsen and the little tidbits throughout the seasons about his knowledge of Clark is so unique and is quite useful.
.... it's really telling, and really disturbing that Snyder's idea of "having fun" with a character is literally having them killed execution style. It sounds like a line used by a super villain from one of the comics he's failed to adapt.
Nando I like this but this wouldn’t fix batman v Superman. I think you should do a full rewrite of it.
@kafu Kemeh I have seen it like 4 times. It is not very good
14:43
Great video great pitch
But the conversation can end slightly sooner with clark just saying "well, you have one now" and patting his shoulder as he walks away
This would really capture just the friendly attitude of superman without the awkward "well if you wanna go out for a drink" thing
I think for a moment he can be confident
It can also be read as clark getting his hopes up after seeing someone believe in him
Honestly, the thing that's turned me off from Snyderverse movies is exactly what this video's about: character's giving hope. It really feels like Zack and his team just want to make Watchman, but with the big name DC characters.
SNYDER DOESNT UNDERSTAND DC HEROES
At this point, *DC* doesn't understand DC heroes.
13:18 “this should be in the Weekly Planet bullpen” 🤣
I need that collab. Two of my favorite movie youtubers
@@ghostgabe81 Same!
Since Jimmy is a kid when Clark shows up, I think "pal" would be like "champ" or "sport." So maybe his introduction is Superman is floating above the Daily Planet, tons of people snapping photos yelling questions, and a nervous, maybe 14 year old, is the only one who asks Superman permission for a picture. Surprised and pleased, Superman says, "Sure pal, where do you want me?" Jimmy has him pose next to the globe on top of the daily planet, everyone respectfully clearing the way, and Jimmy gets the photo that Perry White decides to print.
It actually means a lot to me that someone finally made a 20 min video on the DCEU's Jimmy Olsen, once again proof that this movie could have been more than what it was
Your Jimmy script is awesome! Cheers! :)
I love how some UA-cam creators who work with other creators act like they are part of some secret club and I just like to imagine you guys all sitting around a table - Kingsmen style - with holograph copies of each other and you discuss the goings on of UA-cam and the comic verse.
Nice slip up saying The Weekly Planet instead of the Daily Planet. My Sunday would be proud
That'd be such a sweet scene. Well-done!
Late to the party here. Loved Fraction's run on Jimmy. Funniest book of the year. But your Jimmy and Superman scene reminds me of Ennis and McCrea's Hitman 34. Worth a Google. I know you aren't the biggest Ennis fan but the book won an Eisner for best single issue of the year and is the best Superman story you've never read.
I brought this up before & it always pops in my mind when Jimmy Olsen & MoS/BvS is brought up, so I'll say it here too before Nando makes his points & sways me.
I thought it was really cool when MoS introduces _Jenny_ Olsen, & I was really looking forward to how they would use her going forward. Then nothing happened. It still bugs me.
Except the character's name is just Jenny. She's never given a last name. Her being an Olsen is a fan theory, as I don't recall it ever being addressed by Snyder, Goyer, etc.
Hardly surprising that she never appears again, though. The Daily Planet hardly appears again. It seems like Snyder isn't interested in anything about Clark Kent. It's all about Clark being Superman, not about Superman being Clark.
You know, I don't think any interpretation of Superman in live action has ever capitalized on Clark and Jimmy's relationship much or at all.
In the Adventures of Lois and Clark (the best Superman), Jimmy is used almost exclusively to foil off of Perry as a protege and as office comic relief, be he and Clark don't personally ever have any moments or arcs or regular banter going on together. Jimmy has a Superman watch but never uses it. And Superman didn't give it to him.
In Smallville, Jimmy is introduced to let the CW fan insert OC Cloe date her way through the significant Superman mythos. So he was Cloes boyfriend for a while. And a few episodes gave him things to do with Lois, but never Clark.
I really really love your take on using Jimmy in this movie. Superman needs a friend, whose not a love interest, to remind him of the optimistic hopeful people he does everything for.
Don't forget Smallville it was revealed that was Henry James Olsen. James Bartholomew Olsen only appeared in 2 episodes.
To skip ads skip to the end of the video then rewind the video to the beginning
Sam Huntington's Jimmy Olsen continues to live in my head, rent-free.
I love your Perry White impression XD
We need to take into consideration that this movie has a lot from different comics, like TDKR, Birthright, Crisis on Infinite Earths, The Death of Superman, etc. And in the Injustice comic, if I remember correctly, one of the first things to happen is the Joker killing Jimmy Olsen.
Great stuff. Ur right Superman needs jimmy, Lois, perry n his parents.
Someone needs to hire you and La'Ron as screenwriters.
Zac Snyder doesn’t understand Superman? Well, color me shocked.
13:17 turns out Jimmy Olsen is the alter ego of James Maso from the Weekly Planet podcast.
Yeah, this is a lot of what I've been saying for. Awhile. ZS should have used analogs in original characters. Always get told by Snyder Fans that Jimmy is useless, and it just backs up the idea that they don't know anything about the dcu
The radio show is where kryptonite also comes so that is really important in superman mithos!!!
Main continuity + Else world = Multiverse story, or something to that effect!
Movie Idea: Golden age Superman & Red Son superman are from kryptonian colonies destroyed & Modern Superman is from Krypton proper & he & Golden have a Mentor-Apprentice relationship! Kent is a very common name, so it could work & Modern Lois could be a descendant of Gold Lois's sister, or cousin!
I am completely sure Zack Snyder is the kind of person who wants to do everything in his own way, but is so scared of failure that he takes benefit of recognizable characters (Superman, Batman, etc.) without caring about them, he only cares on his story.
You do realize nothing he brought to the big screen was his original idea right?
@@elijahlee3610 It wasn't?
@@dragonx3015 most of MoS and BvS story had already been done in comics.(earth 1, birthright, dark knight returns, war of the supermen, etc) Snyder didnt invent he adapted.
@@elijahlee3610 Really? Thanks! But still I'm not sure if Snyder really cares about his characters
@@dragonx3015 if he didnt care about his characters why bother giving superman a 5 movie arc
The actor of Jimmy was Julian Luthor in Smallville
Never new
Oh yeah!
@@Ben-rd3mg always old
Bravo yet again..... First the Zod/Bizarro retelling now this!!!! HBO plus should hire you as a script doctor.....
What about no legged man as Metallo