What a strange workflow - the idea of putting the color spaces into DWG is to have a color space that will accomodate all camera gamuts into one space. Then on each group or clip level do color correction and grading and then - on the timeline level output to your display target. By doing so, you can not only have the display target - you can also have the output target if the deliverables are required to be sent to a different target or gamma. This is one of the strangest workflows I have ever seen presented as a tutorial. There is no reason to have the second CST at pre - group level. Shot matching two clips that look almost the same is also not very instructional to your viewers. Sorry, but new users need to know that this is not how any pro colorist works, and this kind of tutorial has some information that is correct and good for them to know. But the context of doing this as a workflow is completely out of the norm and for a lot of good reasons.
Thank you for adding your knowledge! Like I said, I’m not a pro colorist and it’s kind of a DIY workflow. Pinning your comment so folks can hear your perspective.
I agree Jim, I have some Nikon footage and some Sony FS5 footage from the same interview, and the two look nothing alike. I've almost given up on trying to get the Nikon D850 footage to look right.
I highly disagree with your view, Jim. Even if this is not a standard workflow, it does not mean, necessarily, that it is wrong. It is an alternative to the same thing that you find in every single YT channel. At least for me, this workflow was the only one that gave me some light on how to match footages from iPhone and the ZVe10... I know, very low budget cameras, but this workflow made it work fine....
@@randrescastaneda I don't think I said it was wrong, I simply stated the standard workflow and some caveats of doing it this way. To tell new users that is not the standard way of approaching color management is just so they know that it's unconventional. For whatever reason. Shot matching is something that all colorist have to do all the time - even if from a pro shoot of Arri cams - one angle can differ from the other. The workflow I suggested for many reasons is not a one off. When working as a colorist in most cases the technical transforms and color management is done, then the primaries, then shot matching. Having a solid foundation that works with any situation speeds the process up and create continuity to every project.
@@JimRobinson-colors I apologize for the misuse of my words. You're right, you did not say this approach was wrong. However, it still seems to me that that is what you implied. In any case, I am not a colorist, so I have no informed saying on this. However, I think that Darren Mostyn (@DarrenMostyn) uses a more complex, yet similar approach to the one in this video, and he is a professional colorist (ua-cam.com/video/kdTMRQP_V7E/v-deo.htmlsi=iChDBgL6cr9H8Qde). Am I reading this correctly?
Great video. Starting to really think about switching from Premier to DaVinci. Would be cool to see “how to switch from Premier to DaVinci” workflow and/or tips about the process videos. Happy 2023 🎉
That’s a great idea. Making the switch sounds intimidating, but I’ve really appreciated the advantages that Resolve has in the types of projects I work on.
I haven't even started grading much, it's literally an interest. But your video for me is proof that Google is literally reading my mind cos I was thinking of this a few hours ago 🤣🤣🤣 Thanks for the video. I'm getting into Resolve cos it's free. So this was a potential issue I thought of when watching a movie. So you've answered my question that may come up in a few months when I'm actually doing this properly 😁
Maybe. I understand that CLog2 has a better dynamic range than CLog3, but I’m not sure where SLog3 falls. I just use CLog3 most of the time because the R5 C doesn’t shoot CLog2, which is a weird and annoying decision by Canon. I would use the same process to match CLog2 to SLog3, though.
Thanks for sharing. I do have a question. I have worked in "color managed" and non color managed spaces in DR. It seems to me that letting DR manage the color space is essentially the same thing as doing it manually. Why do you believe this is not the case? DR recognizes most modern production cameras automatically such as Canon or Sony. What's the difference please?
You’re right, DaVinci’s automatic color management will take care of some of this for you. I prefer to do it manually because it’s just easier for me to follow this way, plus when I get into the grading stage post-correction, I know exactly where the transformations happen.
Thanks! I have some footage from older Canon 600D, in 1080p, which I need to match with Slog3 footage from Sony a6400. The issue is that Canon already has colours "baked in", and it is just a normal video file (mp4 I believe), it is not a log/raw format. Do you perhaps know how would I approach this, what settings can I use, can I use Color space transform on that?
You’ll have better luck matching the SLog3 clips to the Canon clips, but don’t expect it to be perfect. You’ll probably have to do it manually, but you can still use this workflow to get the Sony clips into Rec709 before further adjustments.
@@brandnewextragood Thanks! I did some research and got an idea, but don't know if it makes sense or is it technically correct. So, for the Slog3, I am adding a Color Space Transform node at the end of the graph. I am setting inputs to Slog3, output to Rec.709 with Gamma 2.4. and I do my grading, which looks good. Cool, got that out of the way. Now, for the Canon RGB footage. I have learned that I can use CST node at the beginning of the graph, now with the inputs of RGB and outputs of Slog3 (So, now I want to output that RGB footage to look like the Slog3 one), which does indeed make it look very much like LOG. Now, if my logic is right, I could basically add one more node to the end of 600D graph which would now have the inputs of Slog3 and output of Rec.709, same as for Sony, and I would do my grading in between. Does this make sense?
this is totally random... but my wife walked by as you said, "don't use LUTS," and she totally misheard what you said. She was like, "what are you watching," and I had to explain LUTS to her lol
Amazing! Truly mind-blowing, subbed for sure. Any tips for matching GoPro footage to Sony footage? I film in the flat profile on my GoPro 10 and Slog2 on my Zv E10, any suggestions would be appreciated!
Hmm, I don’t think GoPros can film in a true log profile, can they? You might have to match them by eye. One trick I learned years ago is to match contrast first by dropping saturation to zero (so you don’t get distracted by it) and adjusting exposure via curves or whatever until the exposure is the same across both clips. Then bring up saturation again and adjust white balance/tint until those match as well.
@@brandnewextragood No there's no true log profile just a "flat" setting. Thanks for the tips with the contrast, sat and WB. I appreciate you taking the time to share your knowledge, I will try these tricks for sure!
Nice post.. to the point. efficient! Question: I haven't seen doing the CST twice: beginning & end... That threw me off a bit...😂 I usually like to do it at the end, before all my balance/ratio corrections. If you are doing the Davinci gamut conversion at the beginning, why not using at project level the "managed" option... ? Just curious... thanks mate! cheers~
Thanks for watching! You could absolutely use DaVinci’s color management at the project level, and I do that on some projects in the editing stage so that I’m editing things in Rec709. But when I get to finishing/serious about color, I prefer to do the color management manually with two CSTs, just because it makes sense to me to see the nodes sequenced like that.
What a strange workflow - the idea of putting the color spaces into DWG is to have a color space that will accomodate all camera gamuts into one space. Then on each group or clip level do color correction and grading and then - on the timeline level output to your display target. By doing so, you can not only have the display target - you can also have the output target if the deliverables are required to be sent to a different target or gamma.
This is one of the strangest workflows I have ever seen presented as a tutorial. There is no reason to have the second CST at pre - group level.
Shot matching two clips that look almost the same is also not very instructional to your viewers.
Sorry, but new users need to know that this is not how any pro colorist works, and this kind of tutorial has some information that is correct and good for them to know. But the context of doing this as a workflow is completely out of the norm and for a lot of good reasons.
Thank you for adding your knowledge! Like I said, I’m not a pro colorist and it’s kind of a DIY workflow. Pinning your comment so folks can hear your perspective.
I agree Jim, I have some Nikon footage and some Sony FS5 footage from the same interview, and the two look nothing alike. I've almost given up on trying to get the Nikon D850 footage to look right.
I highly disagree with your view, Jim. Even if this is not a standard workflow, it does not mean, necessarily, that it is wrong. It is an alternative to the same thing that you find in every single YT channel. At least for me, this workflow was the only one that gave me some light on how to match footages from iPhone and the ZVe10... I know, very low budget cameras, but this workflow made it work fine....
@@randrescastaneda I don't think I said it was wrong, I simply stated the standard workflow and some caveats of doing it this way. To tell new users that is not the standard way of approaching color management is just so they know that it's unconventional. For whatever reason.
Shot matching is something that all colorist have to do all the time - even if from a pro shoot of Arri cams - one angle can differ from the other. The workflow I suggested for many reasons is not a one off. When working as a colorist in most cases the technical transforms and color management is done, then the primaries, then shot matching. Having a solid foundation that works with any situation speeds the process up and create continuity to every project.
@@JimRobinson-colors I apologize for the misuse of my words. You're right, you did not say this approach was wrong. However, it still seems to me that that is what you implied. In any case, I am not a colorist, so I have no informed saying on this. However, I think that Darren Mostyn (@DarrenMostyn) uses a more complex, yet similar approach to the one in this video, and he is a professional colorist (ua-cam.com/video/kdTMRQP_V7E/v-deo.htmlsi=iChDBgL6cr9H8Qde). Am I reading this correctly?
Thanks for the post. I'm a newbie to DaVinci and this process obviously worked. Just what I needed.
Glad it helped!
Great video. Starting to really think about switching from Premier to DaVinci. Would be cool to see “how to switch from Premier to DaVinci” workflow and/or tips about the process videos. Happy 2023 🎉
That’s a great idea. Making the switch sounds intimidating, but I’ve really appreciated the advantages that Resolve has in the types of projects I work on.
This is so helpful!! Thank you so much!!
Glad it was helpful!
Hello men, nice video. Did you have on your preferences, tag clips to rec709-A automatically?
Thank you very useful keep up the good work
Glad it helped!
thank you for the help!
I haven't even started grading much, it's literally an interest. But your video for me is proof that Google is literally reading my mind cos I was thinking of this a few hours ago 🤣🤣🤣
Thanks for the video. I'm getting into Resolve cos it's free. So this was a potential issue I thought of when watching a movie.
So you've answered my question that may come up in a few months when I'm actually doing this properly 😁
That’s awesome! Good luck in your journey with Resolve, it’s a great editor.
Would there have been any advantage in using clog2 for the Canon instead of 3?
Maybe. I understand that CLog2 has a better dynamic range than CLog3, but I’m not sure where SLog3 falls. I just use CLog3 most of the time because the R5 C doesn’t shoot CLog2, which is a weird and annoying decision by Canon. I would use the same process to match CLog2 to SLog3, though.
Thanks for sharing. I do have a question. I have worked in "color managed" and non color managed spaces in DR. It seems to me that letting DR manage the color space is essentially the same thing as doing it manually. Why do you believe this is not the case? DR recognizes most modern production cameras automatically such as Canon or Sony. What's the difference please?
You’re right, DaVinci’s automatic color management will take care of some of this for you. I prefer to do it manually because it’s just easier for me to follow this way, plus when I get into the grading stage post-correction, I know exactly where the transformations happen.
Gold. I only shoot Canon but even matching within a brand can be funky. I use PP. This video may put me over the top to make the switch.
The hardest time I’ve ever had matching color was between two Sony cameras both filming in SLog3. It’s weird!
Thanks! I have some footage from older Canon 600D, in 1080p, which I need to match with Slog3 footage from Sony a6400. The issue is that Canon already has colours "baked in", and it is just a normal video file (mp4 I believe), it is not a log/raw format. Do you perhaps know how would I approach this, what settings can I use, can I use Color space transform on that?
You’ll have better luck matching the SLog3 clips to the Canon clips, but don’t expect it to be perfect. You’ll probably have to do it manually, but you can still use this workflow to get the Sony clips into Rec709 before further adjustments.
@@brandnewextragood Thanks! I did some research and got an idea, but don't know if it makes sense or is it technically correct.
So, for the Slog3, I am adding a Color Space Transform node at the end of the graph. I am setting inputs to Slog3, output to Rec.709 with Gamma 2.4. and I do my grading, which looks good. Cool, got that out of the way.
Now, for the Canon RGB footage. I have learned that I can use CST node at the beginning of the graph, now with the inputs of RGB and outputs of Slog3 (So, now I want to output that RGB footage to look like the Slog3 one), which does indeed make it look very much like LOG.
Now, if my logic is right, I could basically add one more node to the end of 600D graph which would now have the inputs of Slog3 and output of Rec.709, same as for Sony, and I would do my grading in between. Does this make sense?
this is totally random... but my wife walked by as you said, "don't use LUTS," and she totally misheard what you said. She was like, "what are you watching," and I had to explain LUTS to her lol
😆 that’s hilarious. Another anti-LUT convert!
Thank you!
Amazing! Truly mind-blowing, subbed for sure. Any tips for matching GoPro footage to Sony footage? I film in the flat profile on my GoPro 10 and Slog2 on my Zv E10, any suggestions would be appreciated!
Hmm, I don’t think GoPros can film in a true log profile, can they? You might have to match them by eye. One trick I learned years ago is to match contrast first by dropping saturation to zero (so you don’t get distracted by it) and adjusting exposure via curves or whatever until the exposure is the same across both clips. Then bring up saturation again and adjust white balance/tint until those match as well.
@@brandnewextragood No there's no true log profile just a "flat" setting. Thanks for the tips with the contrast, sat and WB. I appreciate you taking the time to share your knowledge, I will try these tricks for sure!
No good I don’t have clips showing up to match them I just have a tiny timeline
Make sure you have the clip thumbnails showing by clicking “Clips” on the top left side of the screen in the color page.
Nice post.. to the point. efficient! Question: I haven't seen doing the CST twice: beginning & end... That threw me off a bit...😂 I usually like to do it at the end, before all my balance/ratio corrections. If you are doing the Davinci gamut conversion at the beginning, why not using at project level the "managed" option... ? Just curious... thanks mate! cheers~
Thanks for watching! You could absolutely use DaVinci’s color management at the project level, and I do that on some projects in the editing stage so that I’m editing things in Rec709. But when I get to finishing/serious about color, I prefer to do the color management manually with two CSTs, just because it makes sense to me to see the nodes sequenced like that.
@@brandnewextragood thanks mate! cheers!