None of the (rather good) monitor speakers I have ever owned have ever had any noticeable bass, so I have added a modest subwoofer, in that rather tiny room, and the results are amazing. The monitors sound like expensive full sized speakers in that room and are completely enjoyable.
A lot of people confuse sub woofers with those that are blasted out in cars. If you're in a club, it's possible you want additional sub bass, but in a small room, just have the sub woofer at a sensible volume, relative to the bookshelf speakers. Doesn't matter what size the room is.
I've just bought a second REL T9i to complement my Focal Aria 936's. My listening room is 17 by 11 - so not huge by any means. But adding the second REL was a sonic revelation. Luckily I can turn up loud and the RELS really make the scene rock!!! The sub-bass seems to emanate from the entire room and is not directional from the Focals. Mind - blowing.
Exactly; As cool as that might make the experience, it's not really natural or at least balanced. I kinda hate that with concerts and I guess most theaters. Although I understand you want to quite literally blow people away. I'd rather have a good balance and not sit there shaking away when someone merely SPEAKS in a movie or something. XD I remember seeing 'The Dark Knight Rises' in a theater and every time "Bane" spoke it was like I had my head in a barrel. No thanks. And, you can still set it so it's neutral but lets loose when things go down in music or movies. That's the trick of setting it right, really. Tweaking the mid-range and high-end is rather easy (because it's so clear), but the low-end... much trickier I've found.
In my experience, there's ALMOST nothing wrong with any type of speakers in any type of room, it's all about tweaking (positioning, leveling, equalizing) it so that the sound is balanced enough. - I have a setup in a 10x10ish feet room which has two medium-sized bookshelf-speakers with 4.5" woofers, which were originally surrounds but I just improvised, and they're not that strong in the low-end. So I got a 6" subwoofer to go with it and with some tweaking of the levels, cross-over and some settings I got it to blend in nicely. I got it to a point that it's quite modest, just riding along, unless it gets fed a really strong signal by whatever source. It really completes the sound and it's one of those things that when you remove it you miss it. What I mean with "almost" nothing wrong with any type or size is that I definitely am a believe in the right size for a given room. It all depends on the size of the room as well as the distance you're listening at and so forth, but there's such a thing as too large. You can let speakers sit at lower levels all you want, but in my view speakers really need to WORK, as in really move their cones and so on. - It all has to do with "driving" them, much like you would do guitar-speakers or amplifiers and tubes to get them "cooking" so to speak (though, you don't want to actually fry speakers), which brings out life in them. You don't want them to be too passive and just sit and have a snooze because they're only being tickled in terms of what they're capable of. So, with larger speakers, you're going to have to get rather loud to get them moving enough air, so I wouldn't say perhaps 10" or larger speakers are suitable for a smaller room. The 6" subwoofer that I have is already held back to not over-saturate the low-end, with it being at 7 on its own volume-knob and even then attenuated by 2dBs on the amplifier. - I mean, I would do a disservice to an 8" or larger speaker, probably, and that's a bit of a waste in my opinion. The bookshelf speakers I have are borderline on the small side, but they work decently and that's why there's a subwoofer.
I run EIGHT 8" subwoofers in 4.4 cubic feet of enclosure with 50 square inches of port tuned to 30Hz and powered by 630w RMS of Class D power (soon to be 2000w RMS) in a 3.2m x 3.2m room (so about the same size as this one) and I don't consider it to be a waste of time at all, as I feel 25Hz vibrations under my feet, bottom and arm and behind my back lol... the speakers are also fairly sizeable, with 10" woofers in sealed enclosures and 3" tweeters, powered by 100w RMS per side.
I run a 2.1 setup with one MartinLogan Dynamo 700W sub, DSPeaker Anti-Mode 8033, a pair of KEF LS50's and a Creek Evolution 2 integrated amplifier. And loving it!
Floyd Toole has a nice video where he says if you have a rectangular room, you can kill the room modes (standing wave dead spots/loud spots) by using 2 identical subs either in the middle of the left and right walls or in the middle of the front & back walls. You can put them in the corners too - but then you have to cover all 4 corners. 4 subs!! That might be a bit much for a small room - especially since corner placement gives the sub more effective power.
I have a small den that is a bit larger than 10 x 10. I have a desk with stereo powered 4" reference speakers and a Schiit Jotunheim Dac Amp. I found that not just headphones (T-1's), but the speakers ran great off the Jotunheim. But, they still needed a subwoofer. I bought the S8 Emotive down facing subwoofer. And Wow; It is great. Not just with music but with games like Battlefield 1; I can turn up the volume on that subwoofer and the gunfire and explosions come to life. My grandkids love it....... Then for 60's and 70's music; a few turns on a knob or two, and they bring the old great artists back to life... So, yes, a subwoofer worked for me.
My room is roughly 12x16'. I added a Dayton 8" 80w sub recently for just $99, plus a pair of high pass x-overs (100hz @ 12db) for another $40 to my AR18b monitors. It's my primary 2 channel music system and it sounds great.
I have 8 subs in my 9 11 ft room tuning is key Paul said it right raise it just till u hear it then back it down a bit so ur Speackers are still dominant over sub
Hi Paul, we judge speakers by their imaging, soundstage, dynamic range performance etc. but how could we judge a good sub woofer? I’m going to add a sub woofer for my system & will go for Rel, because if you like it they must be very good . Thank you. From Rana, Virginia
In short yes, but for high quality bass look into the Speaker size,matching wattage and impedance, blending treble with bass at same line level( hi gain low gain outputs).also might want to use a delay effect to prevent speaker lagging.I use a single 300 watt 10 in sealed enclosure car sub in my guitar rig with a matching power amp and it sounds way better than when I tried using a 6.5 inch 50w ported home theatre sub which barely had any tone which was very hollow sounding.
Subs are never a no no. The size may get to be a factor but only if the size gets stupid. By stupid I'd say that the room would have to actively hiss air at the joints. This may upset some folks who believe that rooms can be driven in to acoustic compression which will cause various distortions. This energy level is pretty nuclear but never the less, it does exist,,, you just have to quantify the compression level as atmospheric by SPL. Ooops, this is tough for most people to quantify. Subs should be smooth and supportive like Paul states.
Hey Paul. I’m a little confused at the moment. You say this room is where Sprouts are built and tested. It is my understanding from multiple articlesI have read online that the Sprout is built in China. Can you clarify?
It depends on the type of subwoofer . Normal typical monopole subwoofers (vented or not) do very well in small rooms due to pressure loading . Dipole subwoofers however will suffer . They will not benefit from pressure loading and their bottom end is limited by the largest dimension of the room . For a range down to 20 Hz with a dipole sub , you will need a room with a width or length of a least 8.5 meter (half the wavelength)
Well... my music room is 11 x 9 with an Outlaw RR2160 receiver, a turntable, NAS and a couple of Andrew Jones SP‑FS52 towers and I gonna tell you this: while they were on the living room as part of my home theater, I noticed that those towers lack at bottom end. However, after I got a couple of different towers for the living room I moved them to that room and the bass there is unbearably boomy. So much, that I'm thinking to have bass traps in a couple of corners ( my options are limited ) So... in theory, If I have a sub added to the equation, I would go insane and def! What can I do to damp the bass a little? Thank you.
always subs, i agree. its a whole new world os sonic beauty out there for those extra hz extension, i did some dsp tp get lower extension and 20hz is in reach for me know, was 30hz before. it helped a lot. all kinds of music sounds different now :)
The term "subwoofer" grate on me. If a loudspeaker is designed correctly, the woofer should go down to 20 Hz within 3 db or so. If a speaker is not designed to reproduce even bass, it shouldn't be marketed as a full-range speaker. Subwoofer conjures the idea of 32' ducts under the floor to reproduce infrasonic (earthquake) frequencies. I don't have a problem separating woofer enclosures from midrange and tweeter enclosures. Heck, the woofers, midrange and tweeters can even be from different manufacturers or vendors. Just call them what they are.
My music room's not huge, a bit bigger than our friend who posed the question, probably 11 ft x 17ft, but my bass has transformed since I installed two subs. And I have Thiels and you're wrong about no bass at all.
Of course we can my pc -listening -bedroom is 12 square meters 3 width x 4 length and i have an active 125 watts 10' sub under my pc desk and my sound is great but wait having a sub in our room it doesn't mean that the sound volume has to be at max .......ok ?? I always listen to music at normal volumes
I am using dynaudio sub 250 in my 2.1 system, it’s small as well, but very tuneful for all kinds of music, I like it very much. before getting dynaudio I was seriously considering to buy a TR-3D, but never had a chance to listen to it.
I have to disagree with your choice of two subs ( especially in a smallish room) ..I don't know whether you are aware of this, but at low frequencies (20-60 Hz viz ) the room becomes a PRESSURE domain ... this condition arises because of the short dimensions of the room. You will find only one sub will work but adding a second will only add differential pressures due to its location. So ... if you HAVE to add a second sub then stack it on top of the first one ... but NEVER in adjacent corners !
In my 10' x 10' room the only way to have smooth bass from subs below 60hz is by having 2 subs. Both up front on the insides of my speakers {they don't give much below 60hz anyway}. Otherwise I get a big mode at 50hz the opposite side of wherever a single sub would be, due to wavelength size. Best way I've found, aside from experimentation, is using REW's Room Sim feature.
There is NO such thing as stereo subsonic sound !! I'm always banging on about this ... in a small room two subs can negate each other due to phase changes ... one sub is ALL you need ... truly !! If you don't believe me go try it for yourself and you'll see what I mean ! If you really MUST have two subs then connect them to the mono sub line level output on the pre amp and place the two subs right next to each other ... only if you are outdoors can you split them apart !!
What we feel with a sub as well as what happens in a room when we have more sources of low frequencies (similar to placing a sub in the right place for the listener). While you're correct that lower frequencies haven't any directionality in that domain, please don't ignore how the room fills with sound.
what does it mean 11x11 room ? Feet ? inches ? meters ? Is there any sub woofer could you suggest me for a 3 meters room ? I would love to have a better one instead of those cheap pc speakers 2.1. Really would appreciate it.
Thanks so I guess my room is about the same (3x3 meters). Do you some sub-woofer suggestion for it ? I have a small one but it doesn't give good enough power as I would...
Lol I have six subs in a room not much bigger than yours and yes it makes a massive difference. It makes the bass more real. Its not to go louder its to sound more accurate.
Precious Paul always has good advice and his approach is exactly my approach dating back to the late 1970's, but enough of this gay banter, you need to take those boxes you've got stuffed in the corner there and replace them with young women dressed in bikinis and high heels continuously tickling each other, which is not really audio related but it is tasteful and appropriate nevertheless.
You'd be very hard-pressed to find many audio vendors which don't have specific parts manufactured in China. But what's far less common are the vendors, such as PS Audio, who assemble all of those parts in their respective home countries.
I bring it up because Steve Guttenberg had an opinion video a few days ago on Sprout and he said it was "Made in China". For me, that usually means it was manufactured, assembled, and shipped to the States. If the parts are made in China and it's put together in Boulder then that's something else entirely (at least for me).
Paul McGowan When I was in the trade, we had a partner company in China that assembled product. It was shipped to our warehouse and we tested every single unit. It ALL comes down to who does the design work and how stringent the QC process. Nothing wrong with the Sprout being assembled in China.
"Futz around? " I felt like I was back in NY visiting my cousins for a second. ;) I live in an apartment and was considering a REL T Zero.... if I am careful, like described here? Just maybe...
Never work? I live in apartment and have a 7.1 surrround with amplifier how did I do it? First you need a carpet in your living room also put another small carpet underneath your subwoofer. Also don't get a big subwoofer get a 8 inch also don't get port subwoofer instead get a closure subwoofer and get alot of sound proof👍 it's common sense. I also have a Dolby headphone for Xbox one x games and movies.
Are you worried about your subw🙂🙂fer how big is your sub? Maybe is just too big you need a 8 inch but powerful enough and get closure sub NOT ported one. Just read Alex Knight replies I help him out already! ✌
I'm not sure I agree with you that bookshelf speakers have no bass if you buy proper professional monitor speakers something like tannoy active 800A or 802 114DB what takes a line input 3.5 mm jack, monitor speakers give plenty of bass and realistic flat response. that's another gripe I seem to have isn't it better to have monitor professional speakers then say hi-fi speakers, generally because you're sitting close to the speaker anyway what you would do with a monitor speaker 4 or 5 feet no difference to a hi-fi speaker really, So near field or medium field is not an issue. consider what you can get for a good quality professional monitor speaker like the one I mentioned is about $800 I think is more superior than a Hi Fi speaker. Isn't it about reproducing what the studio has produced in the first place? your hi-fi speakers colour the sound. if you go down that route place the monitors on acoustic foam you could just get a small sub one that takes left and right inputs into 1 driver that is enclosed with ports is all You Need even for a medium to big room will be noticeable.
Sorry but you are wrong... Full range is 20 Hz - 20 kHz so you ABSOLUTELY need a subwoofer if you are using bookshelf speakers. I have huge JBL Studio 230 speakers and I still need a subwoofer to get the full range.
Yes-Yes - 8"150 Watt & Walk up that Stairway 2 Heaven /Ported Front or Rear- no-Matter.Placement is Important.Many a Beer & Have a Cheer while u Fall down the Rabbit Hole. Engage! U thought movi'n the Wife's Piano was fun.2 X 150 lb's of Subwoofer's /50 location's in 4 hr's & U still will not Win [ if there such a Thing ].No Worries / Paul is about to Introduce , Da Yank-Zilla.& this D-Vice will solve All ur Audio Woe's.YYZ-60+NOOB Approved & Certified.pls- give da Man a Reason 2 git outta Bed ! If he ain't doui'n ,well,there's Always a Park Bench with Pigeon's 2 Feed...Paul, Cute & unasuming as U R / B the Alfa that U is...YYZ-Mohawk-60+NOOB
None of the (rather good) monitor speakers I have ever owned have ever had any noticeable bass, so I have added a modest subwoofer, in that rather tiny room, and the results are amazing. The monitors sound like expensive full sized speakers in that room and are completely enjoyable.
A lot of people confuse sub woofers with those that are blasted out in cars. If you're in a club, it's possible you want additional sub bass, but in a small room, just have the sub woofer at a sensible volume, relative to the bookshelf speakers. Doesn't matter what size the room is.
Or tower speakers
@@raymondleggs5508 Not the same animal.
Jim Thiel was beloved by the audio community and is dearly missed. Amazing speakers and a true audio legend.
I've just bought a second REL T9i to complement my Focal Aria 936's. My listening room is 17 by 11 - so not huge by any means. But
adding the second REL was a sonic revelation. Luckily I can turn up loud and the RELS really make the scene rock!!! The sub-bass seems
to emanate from the entire room and is not directional from the Focals. Mind - blowing.
YES! I have 2 Rel T7is so i know exactly what you mean.
Turn it up until the sub blends in.... Huh i should try that. I usually turn it up until it starts to shake everywhere 😆... Then the wife complains ☹️
Exactly; As cool as that might make the experience, it's not really natural or at least balanced. I kinda hate that with concerts and I guess most theaters. Although I understand you want to quite literally blow people away. I'd rather have a good balance and not sit there shaking away when someone merely SPEAKS in a movie or something. XD
I remember seeing 'The Dark Knight Rises' in a theater and every time "Bane" spoke it was like I had my head in a barrel. No thanks.
And, you can still set it so it's neutral but lets loose when things go down in music or movies. That's the trick of setting it right, really. Tweaking the mid-range and high-end is rather easy (because it's so clear), but the low-end... much trickier I've found.
🤦♂️🤣😅🤣😅🤣😅
In my experience, there's ALMOST nothing wrong with any type of speakers in any type of room, it's all about tweaking (positioning, leveling, equalizing) it so that the sound is balanced enough. - I have a setup in a 10x10ish feet room which has two medium-sized bookshelf-speakers with 4.5" woofers, which were originally surrounds but I just improvised, and they're not that strong in the low-end. So I got a 6" subwoofer to go with it and with some tweaking of the levels, cross-over and some settings I got it to blend in nicely. I got it to a point that it's quite modest, just riding along, unless it gets fed a really strong signal by whatever source. It really completes the sound and it's one of those things that when you remove it you miss it.
What I mean with "almost" nothing wrong with any type or size is that I definitely am a believe in the right size for a given room. It all depends on the size of the room as well as the distance you're listening at and so forth, but there's such a thing as too large. You can let speakers sit at lower levels all you want, but in my view speakers really need to WORK, as in really move their cones and so on. - It all has to do with "driving" them, much like you would do guitar-speakers or amplifiers and tubes to get them "cooking" so to speak (though, you don't want to actually fry speakers), which brings out life in them. You don't want them to be too passive and just sit and have a snooze because they're only being tickled in terms of what they're capable of.
So, with larger speakers, you're going to have to get rather loud to get them moving enough air, so I wouldn't say perhaps 10" or larger speakers are suitable for a smaller room. The 6" subwoofer that I have is already held back to not over-saturate the low-end, with it being at 7 on its own volume-knob and even then attenuated by 2dBs on the amplifier. - I mean, I would do a disservice to an 8" or larger speaker, probably, and that's a bit of a waste in my opinion. The bookshelf speakers I have are borderline on the small side, but they work decently and that's why there's a subwoofer.
Your videos are incredible helpful. Thank you so much. Bought a REL and love it. Will get a second one of the REL T/7i next month.
Why not get a bigger Rel sub 1st time round instead of 2 ? Thanks from a beginner.
You can put a subwoofer in any room and that’s a fact 😂😂😂
I run EIGHT 8" subwoofers in 4.4 cubic feet of enclosure with 50 square inches of port tuned to 30Hz and powered by 630w RMS of Class D power (soon to be 2000w RMS) in a 3.2m x 3.2m room (so about the same size as this one) and I don't consider it to be a waste of time at all, as I feel 25Hz vibrations under my feet, bottom and arm and behind my back lol... the speakers are also fairly sizeable, with 10" woofers in sealed enclosures and 3" tweeters, powered by 100w RMS per side.
I have 2x12 inch subwoofers in a 2,5m * 4m room and it sounds fantastic.
@Happy Nuggets If I wanted I guess :P
I have 2x10 inch in a 3m x 4m room, positioned 1/4 and 3/4 and they sound amazing yes
I run a 2.1 setup with one MartinLogan Dynamo 700W sub, DSPeaker Anti-Mode 8033, a pair of KEF LS50's and a Creek Evolution 2 integrated amplifier. And loving it!
Floyd Toole has a nice video where he says if you have a rectangular room, you can kill the room modes (standing wave dead spots/loud spots) by using 2 identical subs either in the middle of the left and right walls or in the middle of the front & back walls. You can put them in the corners too - but then you have to cover all 4 corners. 4 subs!! That might be a bit much for a small room - especially since corner placement gives the sub more effective power.
Awesome SOUND ADVICE!🙌🏼🔥
I have a small den that is a bit larger than 10 x 10. I have a desk with stereo powered 4" reference speakers and a Schiit Jotunheim Dac Amp. I found that not just headphones (T-1's), but the speakers ran great off the Jotunheim. But, they still needed a subwoofer. I bought the S8 Emotive down facing subwoofer. And Wow; It is great. Not just with music but with games like Battlefield 1; I can turn up the volume on that subwoofer and the gunfire and explosions come to life. My grandkids love it....... Then for 60's and 70's music; a few turns on a knob or two, and they bring the old great artists back to life... So, yes, a subwoofer worked for me.
My room is roughly 12x16'. I added a Dayton 8" 80w sub recently for just $99, plus a pair of high pass x-overs (100hz @ 12db) for another $40 to my AR18b monitors. It's my primary 2 channel music system and it sounds great.
Do you remember which specific REL models you used in your listening room 2?
I have 8 subs in my 9 11 ft room tuning is key Paul said it right raise it just till u hear it then back it down a bit so ur Speackers are still dominant over sub
Hi Paul, we judge speakers by their imaging, soundstage, dynamic range performance etc. but how could we judge a good sub woofer? I’m going to add a sub woofer for my system & will go for Rel, because if you like it they must be very good . Thank you. From Rana, Virginia
In short yes, but for high quality bass look into the Speaker size,matching wattage and impedance, blending treble with bass at same line level( hi gain low gain outputs).also might want to use a delay effect to prevent speaker lagging.I use a single 300 watt 10 in sealed enclosure car sub in my guitar rig with a matching power amp and it sounds way better than when I tried using a 6.5 inch 50w ported home theatre sub which barely had any tone which was very hollow sounding.
Nope put 2-450 watt subs in a 7.2 set up in a 10' x 12' room, sounds amazing!
What if you like it when the sub is loud and cause attention to itself is that wrong?
Paul, what do you think of DSPeaker 2.0 dual core?
Hey Paul. I really value your opinion. Can you tell me what your thoughts are on the Golden Ear super Sub XXL. I'm in the market to buy one.
Paul, have you heard jl audio subwoofer? Will it fit for hifi listening?
Subs are
never a no no. The size may get to be a
factor but only if the size gets stupid.
By stupid I'd say that the room would have to actively hiss air at the
joints. This may upset some folks who
believe that rooms can be driven in to acoustic compression which will cause
various distortions. This energy level
is pretty nuclear but never the less, it does exist,,, you just have to
quantify the compression level as atmospheric by SPL. Ooops, this is tough for most people to
quantify. Subs should be smooth and
supportive like Paul states.
I added a sub to my secondary system in my small kitchen and now it sounds better than my "main" system.
I have a 2nd small listening room 11x12 . And it has been kind of a nightmare to find the right placement for my dual pb 1000's.
:D if you don't need one of those pb 1000s, i need one.
Get the SB1000 instead
Really nice Tips! Thank you
I've got two subs in a small room. Fantastic results.
How small is your room?
Yay subwoofers
Hey Paul. I’m a little confused at the moment. You say this room is where Sprouts are built and tested. It is my understanding from multiple articlesI have read online that the Sprout is built in China. Can you clarify?
Exelent video and description in how to adjust subs to system.
Great, but a pair of REL subs is a couple of grand. Is it not better to get some decent floorstanding speakers?
Excellent! That makes tons of sense!
It depends on the type of subwoofer . Normal typical monopole subwoofers (vented or not) do very well in small rooms due to pressure loading . Dipole subwoofers however will suffer . They will not benefit from pressure loading and their bottom end is limited by the largest dimension of the room . For a range down to 20 Hz with a dipole sub , you will need a room with a width or length of a least 8.5 meter (half the wavelength)
Gerrit Govaerts Vented subs are not monopoles. Sealed subs are monopoles.
They are in that frequency range . We are talking about meters .
Well... my music room is 11 x 9 with an Outlaw RR2160 receiver, a turntable, NAS and a couple of Andrew Jones SP‑FS52 towers and I gonna tell you this: while they were on the living room as part of my home theater, I noticed that those towers lack at bottom end. However, after I got a couple of different towers for the living room I moved them to that room and the bass there is unbearably boomy. So much, that I'm thinking to have bass traps in a couple of corners ( my options are limited ) So... in theory, If I have a sub added to the equation, I would go insane and def! What can I do to damp the bass a little? Thank you.
always subs, i agree. its a whole new world os sonic beauty out there for those extra hz extension, i did some dsp tp get lower extension and 20hz is in reach for me know, was 30hz before. it helped a lot. all kinds of music sounds different now :)
thanks for this, I had read much different advice on the internet. Just order mine :)
Thank you so much Sr.
The term "subwoofer" grate on me. If a loudspeaker is designed correctly, the woofer should go down to 20 Hz within 3 db or so. If a speaker is not designed to reproduce even bass, it shouldn't be marketed as a full-range speaker. Subwoofer conjures the idea of 32' ducts under the floor to reproduce infrasonic (earthquake) frequencies. I don't have a problem separating woofer enclosures from midrange and tweeter enclosures. Heck, the woofers, midrange and tweeters can even be from different manufacturers or vendors. Just call them what they are.
My music room's not huge, a bit bigger than our friend who posed the question, probably 11 ft x 17ft, but my bass has transformed since I installed two subs. And I have Thiels and you're wrong about no bass at all.
AR-3a speakers were "bookshelf" with excellent bass. However you would need a rather large bookshelf.
thanks!
4:00 =Golden rule
Of course we can my pc -listening -bedroom is 12 square meters 3 width x 4 length and i have an active 125 watts 10' sub under my pc desk and my sound is great but wait having a sub in our room it doesn't mean that the sound volume has to be at max .......ok ??
I always listen to music at normal volumes
That's not for me. I need the thumping. Always have, always will!
The Gallo TR-3D works well in small rooms and it takes up the least amount of space of any true subwoofer.
I am using dynaudio sub 250 in my 2.1 system, it’s small as well, but very tuneful for all kinds of music, I like it very much. before getting dynaudio I was seriously considering to buy a TR-3D, but never had a chance to listen to it.
I have to disagree with your choice of two subs ( especially in a smallish room) ..I don't know whether you are aware of this, but at low frequencies (20-60 Hz viz ) the room becomes a PRESSURE domain ... this condition arises because of the short dimensions of the room. You will find only one sub will work but adding a second will only add differential pressures due to its location. So ... if you HAVE to add a second sub then stack it on top of the first one ... but NEVER in adjacent corners !
In my 10' x 10' room the only way to have smooth bass from subs below 60hz is by having 2 subs. Both up front on the insides of my speakers {they don't give much below 60hz anyway}.
Otherwise I get a big mode at 50hz the opposite side of wherever a single sub would be, due to wavelength size.
Best way I've found, aside from experimentation, is using REW's Room Sim feature.
Great advice you do not want to notice the sub
There is NO such thing as stereo subsonic sound !! I'm always banging on about this ... in a small room two subs can negate each other due to phase changes ... one sub is ALL you need ... truly !! If you don't believe me go try it for yourself and you'll see what I mean !
If you really MUST have two subs then connect them to the mono sub line level output on the pre amp and place the two subs right next to each other ... only if you are outdoors can you split them apart !!
What we feel with a sub as well as what happens in a room when we have more sources of low frequencies (similar to placing a sub in the right place for the listener). While you're correct that lower frequencies haven't any directionality in that domain, please don't ignore how the room fills with sound.
The answer is simple! Ask the neighbours !🤔
yes I had one and my system sounded better.
rel is stil british i think ? best thing i ever did 2 rel t9i subs holy cow unbelievable CHEERS TOP ADVICE
what does it mean 11x11 room ? Feet ? inches ? meters ? Is there any sub woofer could you suggest me for a 3 meters room ? I would love to have a better one instead of those cheap pc speakers 2.1. Really would appreciate it.
Feet. He is in US.....
Thanks so I guess my room is about the same (3x3 meters). Do you some sub-woofer suggestion for it ? I have a small one but it doesn't give good enough power as I would...
@@ynnap7251 The sub must be matched with your main channel speakers.
REL Acoustics T5i - should work very well.
Lol I have six subs in a room not much bigger than yours and yes it makes a massive difference. It makes the bass more real. Its not to go louder its to sound more accurate.
Wow
Why not just get full range speakers or floor standing speakers that have Bass instead of trying to balance a sub with smaller bookshelf speakers
Not everybody has room for large floor standing speakers and even with multiple smaller woofers It just doesn't sound the same as a dedicated sub/s
4:32 My brain when I check the fridge an hour after getting subway for the family
Precious Paul always has good advice and his approach is exactly my approach dating back to the late 1970's, but enough of this gay banter, you need to take those boxes you've got stuffed in the corner there and replace them with young women dressed in bikinis and high heels continuously tickling each other, which is not really audio related but it is tasteful and appropriate nevertheless.
Woohmm Woohmm That was funny
I thought Sprout was made in China?
Some weird damage control going on in this video.
thegrimyeaper What are you referring to? Didn't hear any damage control about anything.
You'd be very hard-pressed to find many audio vendors which don't have specific parts manufactured in China. But what's far less common are the vendors, such as PS Audio, who assemble all of those parts in their respective home countries.
I bring it up because Steve Guttenberg had an opinion video a few days ago on Sprout and he said it was "Made in China". For me, that usually means it was manufactured, assembled, and shipped to the States. If the parts are made in China and it's put together in Boulder then that's something else entirely (at least for me).
Paul McGowan When I was in the trade, we had a partner company in China that assembled product. It was shipped to our warehouse and we tested every single unit. It ALL comes down to who does the design work and how stringent the QC process. Nothing wrong with the Sprout being assembled in China.
Jtr 215rt towers go down to 18 hz
"Futz around? " I felt like I was back in NY visiting my cousins for a second. ;)
I live in an apartment and was considering a REL T Zero.... if I am careful, like described here? Just maybe...
Subs are great, but many of us live in apartments/condos and that just never works.
Never work? I live in apartment and have a 7.1 surrround with amplifier how did I do it? First you need a carpet in your living room also put another small carpet underneath your subwoofer. Also don't get a big subwoofer get a 8 inch also don't get port subwoofer instead get a closure subwoofer and get alot of sound proof👍 it's common sense. I also have a Dolby headphone for Xbox one x games and movies.
Are you worried about your subw🙂🙂fer how big is your sub? Maybe is just too big you need a 8 inch but powerful enough and get closure sub NOT ported one. Just read Alex Knight replies I help him out already! ✌
I agree no ported sub for the apartment and placed on carpet or dense foam to isolate vibration
open baffle SW FTW. 3 db more bass vs transmission to neighbors
Nonsense! You just don't need a very big one.
I crank my subs! lol
I'm not sure I agree with you that bookshelf speakers have no bass if you buy proper professional monitor speakers something like tannoy active 800A or 802 114DB what takes a line input 3.5 mm jack, monitor speakers give plenty of bass and realistic flat response.
that's another gripe I seem to have isn't it better to have monitor professional speakers then say hi-fi speakers, generally because you're sitting close to the speaker anyway what you would do with a monitor speaker 4 or 5 feet no difference to a hi-fi speaker really, So near field or medium field is not an issue. consider what you can get for a good quality professional monitor speaker like the one I mentioned is about $800 I think is more superior than a Hi Fi speaker. Isn't it about reproducing what the studio has produced in the first place? your hi-fi speakers colour the sound. if you go down that route place the monitors on acoustic foam
you could just get a small sub one that takes left and right inputs into 1 driver that is enclosed with ports is all You Need even for a medium to big room will be noticeable.
Sorry but you are wrong... Full range is 20 Hz - 20 kHz so you ABSOLUTELY need a subwoofer if you are using bookshelf speakers. I have huge JBL Studio 230 speakers and I still need a subwoofer to get the full range.
Yes-Yes - 8"150 Watt & Walk up that Stairway 2 Heaven /Ported Front or Rear- no-Matter.Placement is Important.Many a Beer & Have a Cheer while u Fall down the Rabbit Hole. Engage! U thought movi'n the Wife's Piano was fun.2 X 150 lb's of Subwoofer's /50 location's in 4 hr's & U still will not Win [ if there such a Thing ].No Worries / Paul is about to Introduce , Da Yank-Zilla.& this D-Vice will solve All ur Audio Woe's.YYZ-60+NOOB Approved & Certified.pls- give da Man a Reason 2 git outta Bed ! If he ain't doui'n ,well,there's Always a Park Bench with Pigeon's 2 Feed...Paul, Cute & unasuming as U R / B the Alfa that U is...YYZ-Mohawk-60+NOOB
Why not I have and plan 9n a second for my 7.1 set up
Is it just me or does this guy talk a lot yet say nothing?