The Best Differential for our Land Rover Defender (Why change again ?)
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- Опубліковано 22 гру 2023
- We might now have the best differential for our Land Rover Defender. Why did our rear diff fail ? A year ago, our rear differential failed and with the help of Xcess4x4 we were able to get the best diff rebuild with a mix of his expertise and Ashcroft parts.
Our fully equipped 4x4 allows us to go out in nature and offgrid. A DIY camper build that we are now testing through overland adventures and offroad adventures before enjoying a one-year family road trip, living in our Land Rover Defender camper.
Enjoy the video, like, share, and comment below :)
✅Our modified Land Rover Defender 110 rebuild : • DEFENDER CAMPER REBUIL...
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IMPORTANT NOTICE : We share with you our experiences and how we do maintenance and repairs on our Land Rover Defender. We cannot be held responsible in the event of damage or breakdown of your vehicle. Please always refer to the workshop manual or contact a professional mechanic. - Навчання та стиль
I’ve just ordered a new diff from Nigel at Xcess 4x4. It will be nice to have a strong diff I can rely on and hopefully no more whining 😊
Hi thank you so much I have also been looking to upgrade my Defender 110 TD5 differential, and thanks to your video I have now been in touch with Xcess 4x4. Loving all your videos please keep doing them. Many thanks Brian
Glad it helps!
It's a common failure on Defender TDCi (2007 - 2016, puma) models. The P38 rear diff has a thin crown wheel compared to the older Salisbury diffs. Using cap bolts and pegging with an Asncroft centre as you have done is the best you are going to achieve. For most owners the P38 diff is fine but overloading the vehicle will always highlight these weak points.
Yes it's seems to be the best we can do with this diff regarding the possible upgrades 👍
Looks like a beauty! I like the way you two approach repairs, just part of owning the LR and using it the way it was intended. We are the same, try and buy the best we can at the time and be proactive about replacing other parts. So far our diffs are fine (knock wood) but so far on our trip we have replaced the transmission, half shafts, bearings, cv joints etc. 🙂🙂
Yes it's part of the game and nowadays it's easier to get some of the info and good parts from good companies.
Best land rover diffs ever Nigels work is impeccable, you only have to compare weights of old diff to Nigels Xcess4x4 ones and you know the quality, let alone looking at the internals. Ultimate Diffs are they
The only thing he does that adds weight is welding bits to the carrier bearing caps and the pegging, the later is done by many around the world 🤦🏻♂️. Weight is determined by the components which he does not make….
Nigel has a great expertise and was very helpful when we had this failure last year
@@husq2100 he built mine out of early stronger diff housing so much heavier duty than Puma diff
@@grahamwest1079there really isn’t too much in them weight wise regarding the cast diff housing themselves. Definitely weight change when you change diff centres (hemispheres)….
Good luck with the new diff and merry Xmas to all and a happy new year.👍😉
Thanks! Same to you :)
Once you go to Xcess4x4 you'll never go anywhere else... That reminds me I have five or six exchange diffs he needs back! Thanks for sharing the landy love.
Quick aside... IF you *didn't* fill that front axle with the likes of K48 (and ditched the seals) then one or both of your seals to your hubs have failed leaving a potentially quite dry CV. Might be worth checking.
Very happy indeed! will check that with my husband :)
I notice that the "temporary" crown wheel bolts you put in are incorrect! They are set screws, threaded to the head, they should be threaded only where they screw into the carrier, having threads right to the head causes a serious weakness, a technicality now as I think you have replaced the diff unit, but worth pointing out. Chris B.
Well , you do drive it very fast on the highway witch will get it extremely hot , then all the off road stuff water mud holes ect.
Change your fluid more often , it looked bad in the video .
At 8:45 : the front diff oil looks really (too) dark in the video; it's usually not clear due to swivel grease leaking into the axle, but that should only give it a silvery, graphite-like colour. Also don't forget to check / top up the swivel grease - it's not the "lifetime" filling LR claims.
Yes it's the grease from swivel
Diff's don't like quick shiftig reaktion on muddy & stony surface, like steep rock climbing section's !!!
This you have to handle only with a constant slow drive mode - NEVER with speeding up !!! Dosent metter with or without a haevely loadet car.
My Land Cruiser 80 got now 370.000km on the clock, without any problems - still perfekt 😅
XXX Mary Christmas & good Luck for 2024 - Tom
Great if your vehicle never had any issue 👍 and regarding the advice, depends on the situation sometimes it's necessary to push the mechanics
If you break that go to makher in the uk ,Dave knows his landrovers and they can provide you with more heavy duty axles.They are in simply in a different universe,Axles that can handle 700 hp .
Already was in contact with them but unfortunately won't have time to go to the UK and do that kind of mod before our year-long trip
Ask me about my Ashcroft transfer case that lasted 60,000 kms of highway travel before failing! TBH i’d not use Ashcroft again even though they discounted the repair parts!
Ashcroft does make some good parts and it’s why many other companies use their parts. We wouldn’t order anymore a rebuilt case directly from them, this is why we went for Xcess4x4 rebuilt
I am surprised at all the money, time and new parts you spend on your Landy, I am driving a 2015 LR with only 60k on the clock and never had any issues of your kind. I have to say my LR is far away from car's weight and I never use it in such extrem conditions, I am more the regular Overlander......😀My previous LR was a 90 ( had 5 in total already ) and there I had the intermediate shaft break at only 40k, apparently common on the new Puma setup.
Good luck with the new diff and merry Xmas to all and a happy new year......
Greets from Zurich
Tom
Well I might be more surprised that you're on your 6th LR when we only bought 1... not sure who spent more 🤔 😄. Enjoy the holiday season too 👍
@offtrackfamily good point 🤣🤣 I have had 6 over the last 20 years but never had any major issues but also sold them with fairly low milage again....anyway happy holidays to you guys too 🎄🌟👍
weight is a killer
It doesn't help for sure
Glad you are pleased with the new Unit.
For those armchair experts making ill informed posts with dubious comments have a watch of this video. Also look up "The glass bolt paradox" (on website too) regarding bolt technology ...
The "Short Nose" / P38 Rear 110 Differential replaced the Salisbury unit (a early USA DANA 60 axle center) plus LR bits, and other than being a horrible unit to work on was bonkers strong (due to the main bit being USA / Dana and not LR)
This pretty dire replacement unit that came after the Salisbury is nowhere near as strong and has serious design / cost cutting issues, which we have - and continue to see what we can reverse engineer out :O) ua-cam.com/video/wZBUpViYyGI/v-deo.html
Thanks Nigel! Happy with the unit and our decision was based on our discussions regarding the use of our LR. Not going for the full axle replacement even though knowing it's not as strong was a choice we had to make. We're quite confident because the repair we made with your bolts and help on torque, etc, on the one we replaced didn't move a bit. This means when work is done properly with the right parts, it minimises the possible failures. Great work!
Did you change the gearing in the diff, or keep it 3.54 (or whatever the standard ratio is)?
Careful! You keep lifting things like that you’ll end up with arms like your husband. As far as what happened to the diff. has a dozen possibilities. It’s a vehicle that’s what they are made to do. At least that’s my experience.
Would need to lift way more than that to be at his level 😄. Breakage comes with use and I agree that’s what they are made for :)
What halfshaft upgrades did you use? Ashcroft or Xcess?
What was the cost of the Xcess diff? If one may ask?
Merry X-mas and hopefully a happy new Landy year
300m halfshafts from Ashcroft. For the price, it's best to ask directly xcess4x4
Please share the link to purchase, we r having same error. Thanks
Toujours du bon boulot le sanglier des alpages… 😁
👍😄
effectivement il à l'air de super bien bossé, on peut connaitre son adresse ?
merci et ...joyeux Noël !
@@Kaoniaw06 garage tré-la-tete, Contamines-Montjoie
The fact that you managed to break one is actually impressive. How much torque and horsepower does the defender make?
I'm from the states and we don't have them here. I was surprised by how modern the dashboard and steering wheel are. What year and spec model do you have?
It’s a Defender puma 2.4 Tdci of 2009 👍🏼
It doesn’t take much torque/hp unfortunately as these diffs are terrible design, substantially weaker than a Dana44…
Yup. ❤
🙌👍
Next upgrade is the Salisbury from a 130 or 110, which has a much beefier crown wheel and pinion. Your present upgraded components are fine to help the small diff, but it is a small diff, small thin gear set that was originally designed for a 1971 Range Rover which was never intended to carry loads. It will fail again but hey, thats the price of four wheelin.
Agree 👍🏼 this is what we talked about with Nigel from xcess4x4, it’s the best we can get with a simple replacement and the level up upgrade is going for the Salisbury with all the changes that it requires. We do hope this will hold on 😁
1.rst time I came across your channel, just because if the #diff, I guess.
Right from the start: Your channel is so different in a positive way! I never, really never saw a (car) channel with a woman talking tech! (except 1 (actually 3 in total), where they both shared but she had obviously no clue what she was talking about). That is cool.
Besides: When a bold sheers off the bold is too weak. This must not happen. Probably a miscalculation by Landrover. I see why they made caps by forging instead of cast and a fixing point instead of centering by bolds.
But the bold itself must not fail. There are a lot of sizes to calculate the correct one.
Thank you ! Happy you enjoy the channel 👍🏼
👍👍👍
🙌🏼👍🏼
Winchester gears make some bullet proof transmission and transfer box.
We have their gearbox and transfer case on for more than a year and all goes well 👍🏼
Given the modifications and weight I would defenetly try to get a Salisbury diff. Or you could decide to stop spending money by tryng to upgade to a MB or Toyota qualitywise.
Not sure he’d spend less with another 4x4 🤔
If that is the case then you still can get a Salisbury with HD halfshafts and an ATB or locker
Heavily modified Land Rovers will break down more imho, overly payload will speed this process, angles of axles change by mounting a lift kit which make the oil level too low especially when filling the diffs up and the vehicle isn’t on his wheels,oil levels aren’t in par because the filling plug hole is lower this way
Filling diffs is always done with car on ground in our case. If we choose to modify our Defender to be able to do what we want, it’s up to us. There’s no complaining on our side on what happens, we’re simply sharing. If you’re able on your side to do all your mechanic, all your mods, to travel, go offroad, go off grid, etc, also with your 2 grown up kids and with a light weight 4x4 and not break anything, your welcome to open a channel and share your way of doing 👍🏼
👍👊
👍🙂
Petit "up" sur le montage de différentiel air locker Ashcroft , on ne peut pas mettre les vis d'origine Land Rover pour fixer la couronne elles sont trop courtes . Donc j'ai pas eu le choix j'ai mis les vis Chc qui sont ivrées avec le kit , Loctite frein filet bleu et serrage à 48 Nm , pas le choix on verra à l'usage.
Petite rectification gros souci avec le casier Ashcroft , la face d'appui de la couronne n'est pas concentrique donc je me retrouve avec un voilage de 0.15 mm sur la roue dentée donc complètement dans les choux donc risque de casse ou détérioration rapide du pont. Franchement je suis très déçu d'Ashcroft je vais de suite les contacter.
Quel était le produit en mousse mis dans les mains meneuses ?
Graisse graphite
probabilmente la rottura, è dovuta alle sollecitazioni maggiori dovute al peso che grava sul ponte posteriore, visto che anche che le flange dei semiassi ballavano, ricordatevi che ora avete viti diverse nei due differenziali 🤓🤓🤓
It's a possibility ! Weight does add a lot of stress on many parts. Had those different screws on previous rear diff for a year and didn't have any issue on front differential 👍
Those screws/bolts may have been over torqued during setup. Either that or they're not the correct grade.
SHCS are class 12.9, factory LR flanged head crown wheel bolts are class 12.9. It could be the reduced head area, reducing clamping area leading to earlier distortion. It could be installation or it could just be the crappy diff design… personally I would never use SHCS on the Crown wheel Or the carrier caps.
@@husq2100 Interesting. Thanks for the info.
By replacing all of them and seeing that nothing moved after a year, it could be these reasons
Pour moi le problème vient non seulement du type des vis employées mais aussi de l'utilisation que vous faites de votre 4x4 vu son poids. Les vis que vous avez utilisé pour fixer la couronne ont des têtes Chc qui ne sont pas conformes aux originales qui elles comportent des têtes 6 pans à collerette crantée. Lors du serrage vous faussez le couple de serrage préconisé avec vos vis Chc . Je suis en train de monter des différentiels Aschroft pneumatiques sur mon Def et justement j'ai remarqué que les différentiels étaient livrés avec des vis Chc que je ne monterai pas. Votre Defender est peut être aussi trop lourd pour une utilisation tout terrain sévère. Mon Defender Td4 2.4 avec repro (180 000 km) qui est aussi équipé d'un toit relevable avec pas mal d'équipement pèse 2670 kg (sans les 70 l d'eau mais avec 120 l de go) . Je n'ai jamais rien cassé sur les pistes , vu le poids j'évite si possible les situations trop difficiles justement pour éviter la casse. Il faut faire un choix un véhicule trop lourds n'est pas fait pour faire du tout terrain ou franchissement "hard", vous casserez toujours quelque chose au niveau des transmissions. J'ai aussi remarqué que vos mains meneuses et demi arbres arrières avaient pris du jeu , pourtant apparemment c'est du renforcé, j'en conclu ce ça ne tient pas mieux que de l'original. En 180 000 (beaucoup de pistes) je viens de changer ces demi arbres (origine) pour la deuxième fois . La prochaine fois ce sera pour des nouveaux arbres d'origine Land Rover avec la main meneuse solidaire (non démontable) de l'arbre. Par contre je n'ai jamais eu de souci avec la transmission avant.
They came loose maybe? not torqued properly.
That’s a possibility
The hype with Land rover should be sometimes related to its fiability.I don't know any LR owner not having thèse problems.UA-cam is full of the same failure stories.Weight + speed are no good combinatiin on a car which is still the same as 1948 concepts conceived It.Time to upgrade or inject more €€€
Many owners share their failures but not all of them try to find the best upgrade to not have it happen again.
For high stress applications never use set screws, always use bolts of the correct grade
Both are the same. Something else is going on….
👍
a defender have never used Allen bolts to hold the ring gear, thats some ash croft, put in there, only seen the factory bolts brake once, dou to beeing over overtightened, we only use thefactory bolt in them, and only install arb lockers, just did 2 110 td4 for the military, here last week, we have only strippen the pinwheel a bounch on time when racing, and then we brake teeth off the crorn wheel, and we run an land rover dealer ship, build 4x4 for what ever the customers wants and wish for,
Where's your garage?
100% agree. Socket Head Cap screws!! What the......?
we are located in denmark @@offtrackfamily
Its still a shortnose/p38, worthless…
Will with time...
First of all, good luck with the new replacement. No one likes broken parts, especially when touring.
A few notes on LR diffs and their bits.
The rear diff in question is referred to as the P38 type or short nose. First introduced in the P38 Range Rover and then in the rear of 110&130s from ~2002. These are not the same as the front diffs (and rears found in 90s,D1 and RRC). These are the worst diff LR offered in LRs.
The broken bolts in your video are referred to as Socket Head Cap Screws. If of decent quality these are always class 12.9. LR NEVER installed these in any diff. They used originally a grade 8 crown wheel bolt, then moved to a class 12.9 flange head bolt in about the mid 90s. The carrier bearing cap bolts are class 8.8. Class is the metric rating system, grade is SAE (imperial) All crown wheel bolts are 3/8 UNF thread. I’m not a fan of using SHCS as they have a reduced head area, reducing clamping area. Washers are not the same as a structural head and deform easier.
I can not see how welding some bits of steel to the caps make much of a difference, except for potential distortion and added stress risers.
Ashcroft actually offer a completely new HD diff that is their own design with their own hypoid gear set. These use a Rover type hemisphere so have their usual locker options. This is a bolt in option for the P38/short nose diff only.
Ashcroft droppe the new 110 I think its NLA
Thanks for your message! We did think about this new Ashcroft option when researching & talking with xcess4x4 but weren't really keen on trying out a kind of prototype that required a propshaft mod also. If it's currently NLA, seems we made the right decision.