I forgot to say that Maruki's method of just erasing pain/trauma would have no end to it. In other words, it's a slippery slope. Someone loses their job? Gotta patch that up. Someone is diagnosed with an illness? Gotta rewrite that too. A relationship eventually breaks down? Maruki's on the job to fix that! And how would he act when one person's idea of happiness would bring harm to someone else (i.e. one person wants to stay in the relationship, the other wants to break up)? One of the major aspects of counseling is helping clients learn tools/find ways to cope with adversity and to build resilience. There's no way to prevent every bad thing that could ever happen to us in life. There's no way to control how other people act or think about us. The only thing we can do is decide how we respond to life's difficulties and grow through the process. If you want to see more of how I break down the themes of the 3rd semester and how the Thieves deal with adversity, I suggest this video: ua-cam.com/video/GBTjPRdAtpM/v-deo.html 🎮TWITCH: www.twitch.tv/ladyvirgilia 🐤TWITTER: @VirgiliaLady twitter.com/VirgiliaLady 🌟PATREON: www.patreon.com/LadyVirgilia GENSHIN LORE CHANNEL~ ua-cam.com/users/LadyVirgiliaGenshin
Who wouldn’t have suspected him of having a Palace sooner if you read Maruki’s words in Rank 6-9 of his Confidant carefully? I believe because he hits close to home to you in some regards, you may have personally suspected Maruki as a Palace Ruler when you entered that Palace for the first time.
@@bessieburnet9816 It begs the question, in a future spinoff (Sumire WILL be involved no doubt due to her relations with Maruki, her fairy godfather), HOW will he use his Persona’s power to rewrite memory?
The rewritten realities seem random and unrelated, but they all have the same origin: A desire to look away from strife and pretend that bad things never happen. In other words, Maruki is projecting his insecurities to EVERYONE!
Which begs the question: What happens when Maruki eventually dies? Would Azazoth/Adam Kadmon take over for him? Would it even need a person to function in the first place? How would it take care of things? Would it be impartial or biased? So. Many. Questions!
Maruki also projects really hard, ESPECIALLY onto Sumire, he tries to claim to Joker and Company that Sumire might not be strong enough to move on from her pain, and I just couldn't shake the feeling that he was talking about himself...
@@mystery8820 I kinda want Sumire to confront him though, more for her sake than for his. She deserves closure that isn't delivered at the point of a sword or a glass slipper. Maruki isn't a bad man, he's just a bad therapist who made REALLY bad choices when given the powers of a god.
I am a Licensed Professional Counselor. I definitely caught all the unethical boundary issues, but I also wondered how different our ethics might be from those in Japan. Thank you for shedding some light on the cultural differences. I disagreed with his methods, but it was not as simple as just labeling him an unprofessional quack, because I saw clearly what his intentions were. That's what I loved about his character. The varying shades of grey. Also that you spent hours cultivating this relationship with him and then having to watch it unravel. I felt a lot of sympathy for him. I have done most of my work in substance abuse. I know the pain both professionally and personally of watching someone self destruct while being powerless to stop it. I remember working with teens in a rehab and thinking of how much they would thrive if I could just pluck them out of their environment and put them somewhere safe and nurturing for the long term. I also related to losing someone close to you. I definitely wanted to give him a hug and cry it out with him.
He was not answering to his role as a counselor, he was answering to the higher calling given to him by a higher authority. It's impossible to analyze his actions in mundane society while ignoring that his motivations transcend not only society, but any preconceived notion of the boundaries of the human condition.
I think it's important to note that there's a big reason Maruki is such a bad counselor. He's terrible and unethical as a counselor because he is NOT trained to be a counselor. He's trained to be a clinical researcher. They are WILDLY different methods of study and skill sets.
I find it interesting that the mental health counselor had a Persona from HP Lovecraft's mythos, especially when Lovecraft's work is mostly about people going mad when they see reality.
I do think saying that Maruki resorted to wanting to rewrite everyone's cognition simply being a desperate plee to cope with his own pain undersells it a little bit and at worst is a misinterpretation. It kinda implies that his mind is just going in the wrong direction, but in the 3rd semester we can see that Maruki's motivation is purely an undeniable aspiration and force of will to do what he believes is right. It never came off as "I know what I'm doing isn't exactly right, but it's what I want" rather that it is flat out the correct way to do things, and that it's best for everyone. I think the Adam Kadmon evolution out of nowhere really shows that what he was trying to accomplish was only his deepest desire to do what's best and what will make everyone happy, he quite literally had a shonen protagonist moment because he refused to have his dreams crushed at the last moment. I think the game makes it pretty clear that the conflict between Maruki and the Phantom Thieves is a clash of ideals rather than his goals being a result of something being wrong deep inside him, despite the origins of those goals.
Yeah, among Lady’s work this video really surprised and disappointed me. It seemed to intentionally overlook key elements of the character in service of constantly reaching for “and he’s very wrong.” Given the benefits of the world he was offering, I was expecting a more balanced take on his psychology, ethics, and intentions. The biases were strong here-even blatant. I just subscribed after four videos, but now I’m reconsidering. Lady covers an under-represented context/perspective that I love to see, but… this was such a surprisingly reductionist take for the character essay I was most excited to hear from her.
Great video, Lady! I always learn something from this series, and I’m gonna miss it. Maruki’s view of trauma as something that has to be erased rather than be dealt with reveals so much about him. And while it is an appealing idea to get rid of bad things that happen, doing so would change someone completely. Sumire is the clearest example of this, but it applies to the other Phantom Thieves. Like Ryuji can’t be the guy you meet in P5 if he’s this well-liked person that society accepts. Ultimately, a general theme of Persona is that people can overcome difficult problems and that’s what leads to maturation. And what I love about this arc is that everyone, including Maruki, has to learn that lesson. On another note, Akechi’s role in the third semester is really good. I think his lack of relationship with Maruki allows him to see Maruki’s true intentions. In my mind, Akechi’s time with Shido, another Palace ruler, helps him in that regard. But maybe even more fundamentally, I just don’t believe that Akechi would ever let someone rule over him. To me, Maruki’s job as a taxi driver is a temporary thing. I could see him doing something else in the future like opening a small cafe similar to Leblanc. What I’m really interested is in what Rumi’s up to. I hope she’s alright
So glad to hear you got something out of these videos ^^ Yes you're absolutely right! All the characters learned to build resilience and became more mature people because of all the adversity they faced. I think the thing I like so much about the Persona games is that, aside from all the Persona stuff of course, everything is set in our modern reality, including the problems people face. Not saying other RPG settings are not as good or that we can't learn from those characters, but I think Persona truly excels at teaching us how to deal with difficult life circumstances since the character/confidants' personal problems are exactly what goes on every day in our real world. And good point on how Akechi is essentially a third party and therefore, can view the whole Maruki situation objectively (and how messed up it really is). I hope Rumi is alright too...after Maruki's Palace crumbled, I wonder if Rumi's changed cognition still holds... or if she reverted back to the actual reality... oof that's actually tough to think about :/ Thanks always for your insights Silver!
@@LadyVirgilia I just finished P5R and was wondering the same thing with Rumi. Would alternate realities prior to the 3rd semester revert back to how they were? I'm assuming they would, and I'm curious how Maruki moves forward. I'd like to think he'd be at her side once again, because I'd assume she's still going through therapy to work through her trauma. At least this time, he wouldn't just wish for the trauma to disappear and he'd actively support the process that allows Rumi to cope with her trauma. I get that he distanced himself after Rumi's reality changed, but I don't suppose there would be a reason for that if this were the case.
I'm going to miss the individualist vs collectivist opening monologue... I think one important point to consider is that when people say Maruki is an "unethical" councillor, it means he breaks the specific code of ethics for the profession. It doesn't necessarily mean he's a cruel or malicious person. The term "unethical" is often used to refer to general living ethics. (lol, and you say he's not malicious right after I type that) I like Maruki's inclusion because I feel that therapists are under-represented in media and when they do show up are often corrupt or evil... and well Maruki kind of is too but unlike most he genuinely means well. What you said regarding therapy in Japan lines up with what little I've heard of it. Given what I've heard about attitudes towards physical disability, I wonder if mental disability is similar (i.e, seen as something embarrassing that should be hidden), with sufferers afraid to get help for fear of bringing shame to their loved ones and communities. You make a good point about the pressure of being in a position of authority in Japan. Most of P5 analysis focuses on the effects of authority on those lower in the hierarchy, but thinking about it the problems actually go both ways: if those in Japan are taught to never criticise authority figures, it gives those IN authority some very unrealistic expectations to live up to, and pressure to be "perfect". As for my thoughts on Maruki's ending, there was a comment on one of Thoughtbubble's videos that said being a taxi driver was even more fitting since you have to let the passenger decide where to go. Some think Maruki is too distant from the corrupt authority themes of the first arc, but I think he's the perfect final antagonist for the PTs: a friend of theirs with good intentions who is in danger of BECOMING as bad as the Palace rulers but isn't quite there yet. I feel like Maruki subtly starts getting drunk with power during the 3rd semester, and a single person with the power to re-write anyone's thoughts if they don't comply with what he, individually, thinks will make them happy goes against everything the PTs should stand for. With Maruki, the PTs finally have an adult they can set on a better path before they truly become "rotten". And in typing this, maybe Maruki's cognitive control is a metaphor for how therapists normally work in Japan: giving the final say in what their patients should do to be happy. I already liked Maruki a lot, but this video made me discover new way to appreciate him. (Side note, the parts about councillors empowering their patients to change themselves is a theme that's apparently explored well in Psychonauts 2, a game I'm really excited to play soon. Thoughtbubble loves both Psychonauts and Persona, are there any other fans of both franchises out there? Because there should be.)
I'm glad you have such a fond view of those opening monologues haha~ And yes, Maruki's counseling is unethical based on the code of ethics for the APA, NASW, etc.. And also unethical in general when he rewrites everyone's cognition in the 3rd semester... I love that view of Maruki and his new taxi driving career! And also love your insight into the conclusion of the Phantom Thieves' as an arc (via preventing Maruki, a friend, from becoming as bad as all the other Palace Rulers before). Thanks for sharing that! And I've never really looked into Psychonauts before, but you've kinda piqued my interest! Gonna do some research on it and perhaps give it a try at some point.
yeah like sure maruki may be good with his power at first but if read some of the text and npc he is chaning the cogitation of people who really don't need it and what him not going mad with power with it.
@@LadyVirgilia Admittedly Psychonauts is very different in style to JRPGs, being a collect-a-thon platformer with a "Tim Burton meets Pixar" art style, but it levels all take place inside people's minds and the themes explored there are just as deep as this series.
@@mystery8820 I'm a counselor myself, and from the point of view of therapist ethics, Maruki is certainly unethical--he creates a dual relationship with Joker, uses self-disclosure in self-serving ways, breaks confidentiality a few times (iirc), and also (to really understate his actions in the third semester) imposes his own treatment/mental health goals on others against their will. Idk if Japanese therapists share the exact same bedrock principles as Western therapists, but in Western therapist ethics, he violates the principles of autonomy and nonmaleficence, at least. If I may speak on @LadyVirgilia's behalf, I believe she was referring to this in calling Maruki unethical. As for the PT's ethics, that's certainly a topic for debate, just not the one being had here. I would argue that Maruki's unethical behavior isn't undone or cancelled out by the PT's unethical behavior, in part because these two parties are not bound by the same code of ethics, and in another part because that's not how ethics work.
Yo, if it were me in Ren's position, I would not have the strength to reject Maruki. I don't care how different I'd be, what connections I got and how stronger I've became. Many people have been through worse than me and never recovered. Flowery words help people in your vicinity, but what about the world, when world leader show no interest in helping their people? If I got the power, I'd change the world too.
i mean, makes sense on the surface. But the entire point is that, if you're giving away your freedom to a good samaritan with power, then what happens if you ever disagree with that person's point of view? or what happens if he turns corrupt? you'd just be trading one abuser for another, and with no possibility of change to boot You say ''If I got the power, I'd change the world too'' but what maruki offers isn't power to change the word. It's as if he's a slave owner saying 'hey be my slave and i proooomise to not use the whip'
@@shinkamuithere is no true freedom in our reality either. There would be no clashing point if view if Maruki's world is the reality. Turning corrupt? Baseless assumptions, and throwing this out is just trying to find arguments outside of the game's moral dilemma. His power does change the world, make it a better place. Maruki's world is still the way better alternative than our reality. Once people point out the levels of tragedies and suffering in this world, people who reject Maruki's ideals always have no answer
He absolutely WOULD turn corrupt; he's just one guy with absolute power. Absolute power corrupts absolutely; doesn't matter how good your intentions initially are. @@mvl3379
This was a really amazing and insightful video! Maruki is one of my all-time favorite characters and getting a better understanding of the cultural context he was based within really helps to cement this in. Also thank you so much for the shoutout at the end of the video! I really appreciate it!
Ahhh thank you so much! and I'm glad it could provide some more perspective on a character you love! I've enjoyed watching your Persona content, so hearing from you means a lot! ^^
Maruki is one of, if not, my favorite antagonists ever. The whole palace turned into a love and hate relationship with Maruki only for me to start crying when he asked Joker if he can let it all out. I still tear up to this day.
I'm so grateful that you've made these. I've been thinking about writing P5 fanfic, and your discussion of these characters through a Japanese lense will help immensely. Maruki was easily my favorite antagonist, and I didn't consider just how difficult it'd be to be a counselor in Japan.
I have to say that Maruki is a pretty good antagonist to close out P5R. We get to know him throughout the game, and the seeds of what he ends up doing are planted all throughout your interactions with him. And the fact he genuinely means well is a bonus. But what I don't see people talk about is the darker bits of his personality just beneath the surface. Whether it's the creepy manipulative cult leader vibes he starts to give off, or the fact he basically tries to use the PT's happiness as ways to force Ren to stay, or his tendency to project his insecurities and beliefs on others, it's clear that Maruki has issues. And in the ending where you side with him, everything seems happy until you start thinking of potential ways his world can turn for the worse. In the best case scenario, it becomes a stagnant world where everyone lives in blissful ignorance. Worst case scenario, Maruki snaps and goes full AM from I Have No Mouth and starts torturing everyone for all eternity. So yeah, I feel he really did need to be stopped before he goes down a very dark path.
I am glad someone mentions Maruki’s inner darkness. I find it more unsettling than most of the Palace Rulers. And also, he poisoned Sumire’s heart for almost a year.
I was thinking about the fact that we all age and will die from old age. Dr. Maruki will die and once he does someone else will have to take over his job as basically a god.
To add on, I found it surprising that, while most people you see are happy, the homeless man you meet in Shibuya is still in the same situation. It just seems odd that homelessness would even still exist in Maruki's perfect reality. It suggests that Maruki's world isn't as perfect as it seems.
I wish that past characters could appear more in the later games. One of the P1 characters (and more importantly a Persona user) actually is studying to go into therapy in P2. She should be well established in her field by P5. Maki might be the most qualified therapist to deal with the problems of the cast of P3-P5. Probably not P1 or P2 because she’s personally close to those casts, but I don’t know how professionalism works if you’re quite literally the only person in the world qualified who also understands the supernatural. Either way, she’d be able to give Maruki the help he needs. I hope they cross paths one day. If not, I hope he can move forward through his own power, though that is tough to do alone. Maruki is a wild antagonist. He’s not malevolent, but definitely in the wrong. It’s a breath of fresh air from the usual Persona antagonists. He’s complex in a different way from the other antagonists. He’s so desperate to help others, but needs help himself. He’s fascinating.
OMG it's so rare to see another person bringing up P1 in the context of Royal!! Maki would *absolutely* be the doc lending a hand to all the ppl going through persona-related issues and trauma, I love her sm. God I really want Maruki to be referred to her practice (hopefully going strong after all that time!), ESPECIALLY when Maki's own story was literally about coming to terms with her own idealized reality ;_; And I mean, for someone like Maruki? Who post-change-of-heart might recognize he'd been developing some patterns of grandiose delusions (what saviour/messiah/hero complexes are usually classified under), and now wants to address that delusional thinking? Literally *who could he go to* besides Maki, who wouldn't ALSO assume everything about the Metaverse was just delusions as well? Anyway now I kinda wish taxi jobs paid better lol, Maki's gonna need to schedule a few more sessions to cover it all. But honestly, I also like her getting the chance to discuss her own growth with anyone from P3-P5 -- since she's gone through a LOT, & despite the differences in how the whole persona thing works between games I think she'd have a lot of wisdom to share.
I know this comment is a year old but adult Maki sitting down with Maruki and maybe even Ichinose is something I'd be interested to see now that you brought it up.
So glad to have a new one form you!! And Maruki!!! I definitely agree that Maruki’s path is very much a product of pressure he feels to do more and the frustrations with the frictions between societal values in Japan and being able to put forth breakthroughs in helping people truly get better.
Brilliant. Something I love about P5R is how they allow certain concepts be expressed through characters to their logic (if not extreme) end. Daring to believe one can harness and change reality at will to erase traumas makes for such interesting fiction. What makes it come alive is watching how a well meaning character can evolve into such an extreme state. Well done on the video.
Did anyone else try siding with Maruki to see what happens? What's really surprising is that everything seems to work out. I kept expecting the other shoe to drop, with Maruki turning into a monster. But instead, everyone's happy, and it ends with Maruki checking up on the team, then walking away alone. It, at least, suggests that Maruki might actually be a responsible God. Which is pretty daring. Then again, SMT does love these sorts of super-grey moral/ethical scenarios. I'll admit that I was really having a hard time convincing myself to be OK with destroying Haru and Futaba's families again.
On the other hand, Sumire is now stuck as Kasumi forever and you basically let Maruki warp Akechi into a shell of his former self against his wishes... :S
@@F1areon But on the other other hand, Akechi 2.0 has friends, and found acceptance - the one thing he never had, and the seed of his psychopathy. This Akechi seems genuinely happy. It almost feels to me that it's who Akechi could have been, with a better childhood. It's an interesting ethical pickle. I do agree, tho, the Kasumi/Sumire thing is a bit unfortunate.
@@jasonblalock4429 Yes, but Akechi himself made it VERY clear right beforehand that he did not want you to do that to him. He knows full well about all his screw-ups and wants to move past it on his own terms, so to look at that and basically go "LOL too bad; you don't know what's good for you, let me take care of it UWU" is a real dick move to pull.
@@F1areon *Akechi is a murdering psychopath.* People like that are never allowed to just do what they want in a civilized society. Your argument would hold weight if he was some random innocent guy, but no, he's a killer who almost certainly has HUNDREDS of deaths to his name - or did you forget about derailing the train, and all the car crashes he caused? In any other scenario, the only question regarding Akechi is whether he should be put to death or locked up for life. However, Maroki opens up a third possibility, where Akechi gets to be happy, and not even be punished for his many many crimes. A lot of people would say it's far better than he deserves. But either way, there is simply no valid argument for letting him walk free. And if those are the options on the table, Maroki's approach would appear to be by far the most humane.
@@jasonblalock4429 Again, though, Akechi very much knows he committed horrible atrocities and made it REALLY clear to Joker that he's accepted the fact that he'll be punished for it. Sure, Maruki COULD erase all of that and make him happy, but Akechi ALSO made it clear *he doesn't want him to do that*, in part because Maruki's way of doing so is to barge into people's heads and use Azathoth's power to mess with their cognition and alter the bits of their personalities that wouldn't fit in the new world (bc he's projecting his own issues on everyone else like crazy and going ham on his "Pain = bad = destroy it at ALL costs" thing). And in the Bad Endings where you DO take Maruki's deal? Akechi's whole "Detective Prince" persona (pun not intended) is all that's left of his personality now, and he might not even realize that anymore. Joker basically just let Maruki lobotomize Akechi against the latter's wishes. Even *with* all the horrible shit Akechi did, that's STILL a real dick move to pull on him after everything that's happened. (Especially with, as LadyVirgilia comments, how easily that could escalate and become a slippery slope... Like where's the point where Maruki STOPS trying to "fix" people?)
Great as always, Lady! I have this sort of Buddhist/reincarnation vibe from Maruki changing careers, from a counselor/researcher (probably a well-respected, lucrative occupation?) to a taxi driver (don't know how well it pays, but from the way us humans may or may not take them for granted, whether by choosing to join them in conversation or not, or otherwise, but likely not as respected as the former occupation) - i don't know if there are connotations of different social statuses of those jobs in other countries, but i felt like because of what he had done with his powers, he therefore had to "start again from the bottom". I wonder how much of that was his own willingness and understanding of needing to start over, as he himself said (or otherwise this being his "karma/punishment"), and how much was due to the change of heart the Thieves brought onto him by defeating him. Furthermore, i wonder if how much of his "Madman"-ness was fully himself, or his Persona going berserk and becoming his Shadow due to the Day of Reckoning. There's the possibility of both, where his distorted desires could finally be unleashed by his inhibitions being loosened, or the fact that he didn't really seem to become the Gentle Madman immediately beforehand, even when he was spitefully showing his completed paper to the professor (I believe during that moment, Maruki really did want to use his cognitive psience research to change and heal the world morally, ethically, and consensually).
Awesome analysis on Maruki! Fav part was definitely how you compared the ratio of counsellors available to each population as it really grounded the situation. All the points tied together really well too, and made me appreciate Dr. Maruki even more.
This is arguably your best P5 analysis video, combining many ideas from previous videos. It's funny, at the end of vanilla P5, I remember Sae Nijima telling Joker when he gets out of jail something to the effect of to "let the good adults handle things from here." Maruki spends the whole game, as you point out, appearing like one of these "good authority figures." I guess we saw how that turned out 😄
I am really happy with the new persona them with what they did with the royal content gave me hope and faith for persona 6 and whatever they work on next for atlus. Maruki became my favorite antagonist from any media. I understood where is was coming and related to it to a degree. Been gaming since 1999 he is the first antagonist to make me cry. Gamers nowadays take for granted and or refuse to acknowledge the work and research atlus put in to there games. It’s always something new when I replay persona 4 or research other atlus games. We don’t get this in any other games outside of falcom and maybe Zelda
Wow a first time experience for you! Even after all your years of gaming! Games making people feel all kinds of emotions...you love to see it! ^^ Glad to hear Maruki resonated so much with you~ Unfortunate that this happens, but I can understand why Atlus games come across as contrived to a Western audience. The topics that seem so forward-thinking to Japan has oftentimes been common place in Western society for years already.
@@LadyVirgilia when a game can bring those type of emotions out of a person then you know it is something special. I cried during the ending of persona 3,4,5 and cold steel 2 because of the journey I went with the characters and I grew along with them as a person. Especially persona 4 I wouldn’t be writing this comment without it got me out of bad case of depression. It’s crazy that we get a lot of forward thinking stuff from Japan and other places the somebody turns a blind eye to until a celebrity, popular news media says something about it. Wish it wasn’t like that but I hope that will changes soon.
Maruki is one of my favourite villains, I love him so much. I had to go to counselling as a child and my counsellor always gave me snacks I never got at home. His palace was the only one i cried at the end of tbh.
as someone whos had a fair share of bad therapists and counselors, whos interference left me worst than how i started despite their "good" intentions, maruki will always personally strike a sour note for me. but he's a wonderfully constructed character, and your video only served to make me appreciate him in that regard more. ive loved your p5r series since the first video! and ive recommended your videos to pretty much everyone i know who likes persona.
@@Hermiju98 I meant that I never thought that you actually said in your comment that you are someone who had a fair share bad therapists and counselors who left you worse that how you started. That first part of the comment surprised me, that’s all.
I think a big issue with him is also the fact that Sumire doesn’t hate him for what he did. Forcing her to dissociate actually gave her time want to keep going forward, to make peace, and find support systems in friends. While I’ve also had some iffy therapists, the fact that it actually helped Sumire and gave her time to come to accept gives me mixed feelings. Especially with the implication that she might’ve attempted persona 3 previously.
Nobody should experience pain and suffering in a perfect world. Hes just like Akira in Strikers, wanting to save everyone from the brutality of society.
Thank you so much for sharing your thoughts! I loved every bit of this video, and now I'll have more things to think about when it comes to Maruki. The ending for him honestly made me really happy. Something about starting over is really fulfilling. Sometimes we're really pressed to pursue certain dreams, but it really is okay to try something new. I love that royal showed both sides of that. Fight for what you want, but dont be afraid to start over. It's hard to come to terms with the fact that you're not responsible for people's happiness, and I'm sure now that he's learned that, he's doing much better. I'll bet he makes a lot of friends being a taxi driver.
Does anyone remember the survey question part of Maruki’s Palace? For some reason, the right answers to those questions really hit him in the right ways. About calling for help in difficult scenarios, not being afraid to start anew, and his admiration/respect for the PTs in general. They really were the answers he chose by the end.
Since you brought up ThoughtBubble; someone mentioned in the comments that a taxi in a sense is a good symbolism of Maruki's change: being a vehicle that drives a person to their destination. So in a sense, the driver doesn't control the destination of the rider but the rider tells the driver their destination which is the opposite of what Maruki was doing.
So Maruki is wrong for taking away people's traumas, but also wrong and manipulative for giving them back to Sumi? Interesting. I believe that when discussing this character, one has to first declare, and then not double back on, whether they believe that trauma (being defined as any life altering events violently and nonconsensually inflicted on a person, and the lasting effects thereof) are an essential and valuable part of a person, or not. Next, one needs to declare whether their point of view is that self-determinism is a greater virtue (and therefore a more ultimate objective) than well-being. Then we can take the Epicurean approach and examine the quadrants defined by those dichotomies for contradictions. As I see it, Maruki is only reprehensible if trauma is indispensible and self-determinism is the ultimate virtue. (These are the ideals Joker believes in, after all.) If trauma is dispensible, then no ability to self-determine is even lost by erasing it. (eg. the introjective Kasumi is just as valid and whole of a person as the self-aware Sumire is, and so the preference of both for the body to belong to Kasumi is valid.) If well-being is a higher priority than self-determinism, then the sacrifice of a sadder and wiser self for the creation of a better and happier one is a worthy one; not at all in vain. (eg. the thriving Kasumi is a more valid and whole person than the damaged Sumire is.) And of course, if trauma is dispensible AND well-being is preferable to self-determinism, then the individual needs no power at all as long as the authority they belong to honors that well-being, as Maruki does. So if you are going to maintain that your ideals align with Joker's, it is your own moral inertia I would advise you to be wary of. Those ideals are those of a cynic, or even an anarchist. One who views violence as a language and trust as a weakness. They are passable beliefs for an oppressed citizen of a faulty society to have, but if any citizen with those ideals overturns the ruling class or ascends into their ranks, the result is tyranny - a society that no longer even pretends to serve the needs of individuals. The invention of a conscious, ethical, individual God (given the understanding that one has not yet existed) might be the last, best chance at.a good world for humanity. That opportunity, in any context in which it may arise, should not be destroyed on principle alone, especially not before even determining whether the ethics of humanity's former scope even apply anymore in the wider formerly-supernatural world that such a being's existence accommodates.
yes, maruki was wrong to distort sumire's mind and sense of self instead of helping her come to terms with her sisters death, and he was wrong to forcefully retraumatize her to prove a point to joker and akechi we can see from the other phantom thieves that joker leading them to their own conclusions and helping them come to grasp what happened is better than flatly telling, say futaba, "akechi killed your mother and you're living a lie" two things can be true at once, and joker doesn't need to violently retraumatize his friends to convince them that they need to face their pasts
One thing I'd like to just say is that I admire the work and dedication put into these videos, even one year down the line. I would say that maybe for the statistics on health care workers per country, it might've been better to use a western country similar in size to JP or at least much smaller. Comparing population statistics per job with the US is always going to look bloated because of the sheer scale of the country. As someone that has also studied health care and is extremely interested in social welfare provision, I run into a lot of councillors and social workers, and sometimes volunteers, completely out of their depth that 100% remind me of Maruki. I personally term it having a martyr complex at times, and it's very noticeable online, where someone will feel powerless or put the burden of responsibility for 'fixing' someone on themselves. It was very interesting to see this in a fictional game character with an official position. One thing I like, is that the game does not tell you that Maruki is wrong - you are afforded a choice. This is a strength of many of the SMT games. Being able to make your own philosophical choices where reality is concerned. I think for many, Maruki's offer was extremely tempting and outside of the fictional context of a game, I count myself as one who may have sided with Maruki. With the supernatural component to Maruki's reasoning, it seems like what he offers is Utopia - and thanks to that supernatural component, I don't think a slippery slope can really happen. Even if some judgments may seem contradictory, if they result in everyone's individual and collective happinness, that seems objectively better than the reality that we live in. (but ofc, as even the game allows, that's open to interpretation and personal values). It might be easy for those of us living with next to no baggage in a first world society to deny Maruki's utopia - but for people who live in a living ongoing hell, it's a very hopeful outlook, even if it leads to a world that's arguably stagnant and far from 'human'. tl;dr: there's no way to prevent every bad thing in life - but with Persona/SMT supernaturalism, that's more than possible. From a non-supernatural pov, I'd agree that Maruki's method is essentially slapping a bandage on an open wound. I don't know if you still check these comments - but I was curious about whether or not you've ever checked out or played Higurashi no Naku Koro Ni. It was written by a Japanese social worker and while some aspects of it are memey/and the adaptations focus more on the shock horror element, there are a lot of examples of Japanese cultural contexts directly harming individuals who do not fit into the collective; i:e the case of Satoko Houjo, a girl who is cut off from the collective of the village and is abused by her uncle, and ignored by the powers that be despite overwhelming evidence that she's being abused. I think it's something you'd find interesting. Thank you once again.
I was under the impression that the characters "perfect" reality was self-generated by each of them, rather than what maruki believed to be what they wanted.. I think the former is much more powerful, because it means that those characters are really agreeing to sacrifice their most heartfelt dreams for the true reality.. I think this decision is far less emotionally charge if its just maruki's potentially incorrect prediction of what they wanted..
The whole Maruki narrative arc remmembers me of the concept: "Physician Heal thyself" or Carl Jung's wounded healer. He is trying desperately to heal the world because he can't deal with his own pain.
I was really happy with his role in the new narrative, though I have to admit that the slap fight at the end both didn't make sense to me and made me laugh out loud. He didn't strike me as a "now we must punch this out AS MEN!" kind of character.
While it was kind of silly (I highly enjoyed the fisticuffs myself), I think it was Maruki's way of forcing Joker to make him fully give up, by beating him man to man with fists and not personas (Not that they had them at that point I beleive as the palace was breaking down); the fist fight may have also been kind of symbolic of him getting one hell of a wake up call or it being drilled into him that running from his own pain and trauma is not the answer, neither is trying to make the world a utopiea.
i feel like the fistfight was immensely symbolic, as they fight with personas, but their fights isnt *about* or *because* of the personas. So it makes sense that the fight doesn't stop just because the metaverse collapsed, they both still carry their disagreement and convictions to the real world with their very real fists. Also it ties back around the fact that joker got into probation because of an alledged punch he never threw. It all started with in a backhanded manner by shido, and it ends on a very straightforward manner with maruki
Thank you so much for these videos. One of them showed up in my recommendations and I ended up binge watching the whole playlist. I've played the original P5 and Royal twice each, but it's almost mind-blowing how much context and subtext that I completely missed. I definitely have a MUCH greater appreciation for the story and characters now.
Maruki’s proposal leads to a stagnant world where humanity isn’t evolving nor being pushed forward. You wouldn’t have to in such a blissful world. At the same time, you would be surrendering your free will for an easier life without free thought. Exactly what spawned Yaldybro in the first place.
Indeed, his actions match Yaldaboalth's but through a rose-tinted glass. It's benevolent but can be potentially malevolent if left unchecked. Especially when Maruki is still keeping his personal demons bottled up. Not to mention it causes an imbalance to good and evil, life and death, happiness and sadness. One cannot exist without the other. It's a power no mortal should have. Despite all of that power, Maruki is still just one man. A flawed human individual running away from the truth and the pain instead of confronting it. He's too blinded by his own failures, fears and his desire to create a better world, he doesn't see the responsibilities and potential consequences that go with it. And since this whole thing is similar to what Yaldaboalth did, the Phantom Thieves feel kind of insulted because they felt responsible for nearly causing a cataclysmic dimensional merger by being manipulated by a malevolent deity, and they nearly paid for it. They save the world from an ambitious deity just to get manipulated another? Too soon, Maruki. Way too soon.
Sure, but the irony of it all is palpable, don't you think? The ultimate 'goal' of society, of humanity, really, is to make life as comfortable and easy as possible for the majority. All technological progress, all civil advancement, everything is (theortically) oriented towards that goal, if you truly take a long step back and see the forest. All Maruki (on paper) is trying to do is fast forward that into 'right now'. Everybody wants a utopia, but not really.
I’ve been wondering if Maruki’s palace, which iirc contains a lot of propaganda (posters and videos) about happiness, isn’t also in part an allusion to the Happy Science cult that’s pretty big in Japan. I don’t know much about the cult, though.
Maruki's reality would have broken down at a large enough scale, especially if two people, or groups of people, have competing wishes. But still, I can't help thinking about this storyline every time major world events happen. There are so many people around the world who's lives would benefit from his reality. If I were in Joker's shoes, I'm not sure I could reject it.
@@alexanderthemagnifcent2573There's a lot of people who would, and I struggle to fault them. I don't know my own answer, but it's difficult to fault, I dunno, say, a person with terminal cancer or some other hideous disease, or a person living in a terrible country or environment, who played the game and came away thinking 'sign me the hell up'.
I know these are old videos, and you're likely done with these. But I was wondering if you would consider doing videos like these on the P5S cast? Sophia, Zenkichi, the Jail Monarchs, and EMMA's creator. I would love to see what you have to say about them.
I think he's trying to reverse what he did to Rumi it would be difficult without his persona but violent managed to reverse her cognition changes so maybe Rumi could do the same
20:16 I still haven’t excused, nor forgiven Maruki for what he did to Sumire, even today. He took her ability to choose to live life and grasp her future for MONTHS. That aside, I wonder if he can meet up with a certain other character from Strikers. They are gonna have a LOOOOONG talk.
I have experiences with bad counselling sessions so Maruki makes me angry at him lol. But thats just my personal experiences and I definitely doesnt want to project my pain to other people.
I think a big issue with him is also the fact that Sumire doesn’t hate him for what he did. Forcing her to dissociate actually gave her time want to keep going forward, to make peace, and find support systems in friends. While I’ve also had some iffy therapists, the fact that it actually helped Sumire and gave her time to come to accept gives me mixed feelings. Especially with the implication that she might’ve attempted persona 3 previously.
I was finally able to play Persona 5 Royal all the way through since it came out on switch a few months ago. The situation during the Maruki arc was far more dire than this video made it seem. No one, regardless of how pure their intentions are, should have that kind of power. Absolute power corrupts absolutely.
It’s funny cuz P5R’s final arc is in reference to the events of P1. And in that story, the BBEG that’s comes into being is the reason why the events of the persona series even came to be. One guy tried to play god, and made a reoccurring problem that continues to endanger people. Tho, tbf, literally every cognitive experiments (P1, P3, and P5) cause death. Esp with the implication from P5S that Wakaba likely experimented on Akechi.
what's wrong with him being in persona 5? he's yaldabaoth by way of the phantom thieves, and just as strong of a reflection of their beliefs as akechi was a foil to them
2 years have almost passed since P5R release on 3/31. And despite my reservations that he could change for the better… I still haven’t forgiven him for what he did to her…
Manipulating and Brainwashing a young girl who was suicidal and depressed to thinking she was her dead sister. Forcing and created behind Joker's back after he literally defeat a god and save the world, Almost got Sumire and Joker killed by when was fighting and he stood and he did nothing but made shit worse by making her Persona go berserk that would also killed her if The Thieves didn't intervene. And then try to guilt trip Joker to accept his shitty reality by using Akechi life on the line. He is not a fucking Saint. Dudes a fucking spineless coward should been thrown in jail.
Idk, she literally thanked him for the whole dissociation stuff. I think it would be easier to hate the guy if Sumire actually hated him for what he did and didn’t appreciate his help at the time. Sometimes people just aren’t ready to face the truth, and it helps to distance yourself from the pain, change, and find new support. It may not work for you, but apparently it did for Sumire.
I forgot to say that Maruki's method of just erasing pain/trauma would have no end to it. In other words, it's a slippery slope. Someone loses their job? Gotta patch that up. Someone is diagnosed with an illness? Gotta rewrite that too. A relationship eventually breaks down? Maruki's on the job to fix that! And how would he act when one person's idea of happiness would bring harm to someone else (i.e. one person wants to stay in the relationship, the other wants to break up)?
One of the major aspects of counseling is helping clients learn tools/find ways to cope with adversity and to build resilience. There's no way to prevent every bad thing that could ever happen to us in life. There's no way to control how other people act or think about us. The only thing we can do is decide how we respond to life's difficulties and grow through the process.
If you want to see more of how I break down the themes of the 3rd semester and how the Thieves deal with adversity, I suggest this video: ua-cam.com/video/GBTjPRdAtpM/v-deo.html
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Who wouldn’t have suspected him of having a Palace sooner if you read Maruki’s words in Rank 6-9 of his Confidant carefully?
I believe because he hits close to home to you in some regards, you may have personally suspected Maruki as a Palace Ruler when you entered that Palace for the first time.
But Maruki has that power now. So he uses it to help people. He has stated it will be within reason.
@@bessieburnet9816
It begs the question, in a future spinoff (Sumire WILL be involved no doubt due to her relations with Maruki, her fairy godfather), HOW will he use his Persona’s power to rewrite memory?
The rewritten realities seem random and unrelated, but they all have the same origin:
A desire to look away from strife and pretend that bad things never happen. In other words, Maruki is projecting his insecurities to EVERYONE!
Which begs the question: What happens when Maruki eventually dies?
Would Azazoth/Adam Kadmon take over for him? Would it even need a person to function in the first place? How would it take care of things? Would it be impartial or biased?
So. Many. Questions!
Maruki also projects really hard, ESPECIALLY onto Sumire, he tries to claim to Joker and Company that Sumire might not be strong enough to move on from her pain, and I just couldn't shake the feeling that he was talking about himself...
That man should stay the hell away from Sumire in a future spinoff.
@@mystery8820 I kinda want Sumire to confront him though, more for her sake than for his. She deserves closure that isn't delivered at the point of a sword or a glass slipper.
Maruki isn't a bad man, he's just a bad therapist who made REALLY bad choices when given the powers of a god.
I am a Licensed Professional Counselor. I definitely caught all the unethical boundary issues, but I also wondered how different our ethics might be from those in Japan. Thank you for shedding some light on the cultural differences.
I disagreed with his methods, but it was not as simple as just labeling him an unprofessional quack, because I saw clearly what his intentions were. That's what I loved about his character. The varying shades of grey. Also that you spent hours cultivating this relationship with him and then having to watch it unravel.
I felt a lot of sympathy for him. I have done most of my work in substance abuse. I know the pain both professionally and personally of watching someone self destruct while being powerless to stop it. I remember working with teens in a rehab and thinking of how much they would thrive if I could just pluck them out of their environment and put them somewhere safe and nurturing for the long term.
I also related to losing someone close to you. I definitely wanted to give him a hug and cry it out with him.
He was not answering to his role as a counselor, he was answering to the higher calling given to him by a higher authority. It's impossible to analyze his actions in mundane society while ignoring that his motivations transcend not only society, but any preconceived notion of the boundaries of the human condition.
I think it's important to note that there's a big reason Maruki is such a bad counselor.
He's terrible and unethical as a counselor because he is NOT trained to be a counselor. He's trained to be a clinical researcher. They are WILDLY different methods of study and skill sets.
He also endorses escapism alot
I find it interesting that the mental health counselor had a Persona from HP Lovecraft's mythos, especially when Lovecraft's work is mostly about people going mad when they see reality.
Fitting because he kinda wants everyone to avoid "reality" to he happy.
I do think saying that Maruki resorted to wanting to rewrite everyone's cognition simply being a desperate plee to cope with his own pain undersells it a little bit and at worst is a misinterpretation. It kinda implies that his mind is just going in the wrong direction, but in the 3rd semester we can see that Maruki's motivation is purely an undeniable aspiration and force of will to do what he believes is right. It never came off as "I know what I'm doing isn't exactly right, but it's what I want" rather that it is flat out the correct way to do things, and that it's best for everyone. I think the Adam Kadmon evolution out of nowhere really shows that what he was trying to accomplish was only his deepest desire to do what's best and what will make everyone happy, he quite literally had a shonen protagonist moment because he refused to have his dreams crushed at the last moment. I think the game makes it pretty clear that the conflict between Maruki and the Phantom Thieves is a clash of ideals rather than his goals being a result of something being wrong deep inside him, despite the origins of those goals.
Yeah, among Lady’s work this video really surprised and disappointed me. It seemed to intentionally overlook key elements of the character in service of constantly reaching for “and he’s very wrong.” Given the benefits of the world he was offering, I was expecting a more balanced take on his psychology, ethics, and intentions. The biases were strong here-even blatant.
I just subscribed after four videos, but now I’m reconsidering. Lady covers an under-represented context/perspective that I love to see, but… this was such a surprisingly reductionist take for the character essay I was most excited to hear from her.
Great video, Lady! I always learn something from this series, and I’m gonna miss it.
Maruki’s view of trauma as something that has to be erased rather than be dealt with reveals so much about him. And while it is an appealing idea to get rid of bad things that happen, doing so would change someone completely. Sumire is the clearest example of this, but it applies to the other Phantom Thieves. Like Ryuji can’t be the guy you meet in P5 if he’s this well-liked person that society accepts.
Ultimately, a general theme of Persona is that people can overcome difficult problems and that’s what leads to maturation. And what I love about this arc is that everyone, including Maruki, has to learn that lesson.
On another note, Akechi’s role in the third semester is really good. I think his lack of relationship with Maruki allows him to
see Maruki’s true intentions. In my mind, Akechi’s time with Shido, another Palace ruler, helps him in that regard. But maybe even more fundamentally, I just don’t believe that Akechi would ever let someone rule over him.
To me, Maruki’s job as a taxi driver is a temporary thing. I could see him doing something else in the future like opening a small cafe similar to Leblanc. What I’m really interested is in what Rumi’s up to. I hope she’s alright
So glad to hear you got something out of these videos ^^
Yes you're absolutely right! All the characters learned to build resilience and became more mature people because of all the adversity they faced. I think the thing I like so much about the Persona games is that, aside from all the Persona stuff of course, everything is set in our modern reality, including the problems people face. Not saying other RPG settings are not as good or that we can't learn from those characters, but I think Persona truly excels at teaching us how to deal with difficult life circumstances since the character/confidants' personal problems are exactly what goes on every day in our real world.
And good point on how Akechi is essentially a third party and therefore, can view the whole Maruki situation objectively (and how messed up it really is).
I hope Rumi is alright too...after Maruki's Palace crumbled, I wonder if Rumi's changed cognition still holds... or if she reverted back to the actual reality... oof that's actually tough to think about :/
Thanks always for your insights Silver!
@@LadyVirgilia I just finished P5R and was wondering the same thing with Rumi. Would alternate realities prior to the 3rd semester revert back to how they were?
I'm assuming they would, and I'm curious how Maruki moves forward. I'd like to think he'd be at her side once again, because I'd assume she's still going through therapy to work through her trauma. At least this time, he wouldn't just wish for the trauma to disappear and he'd actively support the process that allows Rumi to cope with her trauma. I get that he distanced himself after Rumi's reality changed, but I don't suppose there would be a reason for that if this were the case.
I'm going to miss the individualist vs collectivist opening monologue...
I think one important point to consider is that when people say Maruki is an "unethical" councillor, it means he breaks the specific code of ethics for the profession. It doesn't necessarily mean he's a cruel or malicious person. The term "unethical" is often used to refer to general living ethics. (lol, and you say he's not malicious right after I type that)
I like Maruki's inclusion because I feel that therapists are under-represented in media and when they do show up are often corrupt or evil... and well Maruki kind of is too but unlike most he genuinely means well.
What you said regarding therapy in Japan lines up with what little I've heard of it. Given what I've heard about attitudes towards physical disability, I wonder if mental disability is similar (i.e, seen as something embarrassing that should be hidden), with sufferers afraid to get help for fear of bringing shame to their loved ones and communities.
You make a good point about the pressure of being in a position of authority in Japan. Most of P5 analysis focuses on the effects of authority on those lower in the hierarchy, but thinking about it the problems actually go both ways: if those in Japan are taught to never criticise authority figures, it gives those IN authority some very unrealistic expectations to live up to, and pressure to be "perfect".
As for my thoughts on Maruki's ending, there was a comment on one of Thoughtbubble's videos that said being a taxi driver was even more fitting since you have to let the passenger decide where to go.
Some think Maruki is too distant from the corrupt authority themes of the first arc, but I think he's the perfect final antagonist for the PTs: a friend of theirs with good intentions who is in danger of BECOMING as bad as the Palace rulers but isn't quite there yet. I feel like Maruki subtly starts getting drunk with power during the 3rd semester, and a single person with the power to re-write anyone's thoughts if they don't comply with what he, individually, thinks will make them happy goes against everything the PTs should stand for. With Maruki, the PTs finally have an adult they can set on a better path before they truly become "rotten".
And in typing this, maybe Maruki's cognitive control is a metaphor for how therapists normally work in Japan: giving the final say in what their patients should do to be happy. I already liked Maruki a lot, but this video made me discover new way to appreciate him.
(Side note, the parts about councillors empowering their patients to change themselves is a theme that's apparently explored well in Psychonauts 2, a game I'm really excited to play soon. Thoughtbubble loves both Psychonauts and Persona, are there any other fans of both franchises out there? Because there should be.)
I'm glad you have such a fond view of those opening monologues haha~
And yes, Maruki's counseling is unethical based on the code of ethics for the APA, NASW, etc.. And also unethical in general when he rewrites everyone's cognition in the 3rd semester...
I love that view of Maruki and his new taxi driving career! And also love your insight into the conclusion of the Phantom Thieves' as an arc (via preventing Maruki, a friend, from becoming as bad as all the other Palace Rulers before). Thanks for sharing that!
And I've never really looked into Psychonauts before, but you've kinda piqued my interest! Gonna do some research on it and perhaps give it a try at some point.
yeah like sure maruki may be good with his power at first but if read some of the text and npc he is chaning the cogitation of people who really don't need it and what him not going mad with power with it.
@@LadyVirgilia Admittedly Psychonauts is very different in style to JRPGs, being a collect-a-thon platformer with a "Tim Burton meets Pixar" art style, but it levels all take place inside people's minds and the themes explored there are just as deep as this series.
@@LadyVirgilia
Unethical? Not to play Devil’s Advocate but… what about the Phantom Thieves? Aren’t they unethical too?
@@mystery8820 I'm a counselor myself, and from the point of view of therapist ethics, Maruki is certainly unethical--he creates a dual relationship with Joker, uses self-disclosure in self-serving ways, breaks confidentiality a few times (iirc), and also (to really understate his actions in the third semester) imposes his own treatment/mental health goals on others against their will. Idk if Japanese therapists share the exact same bedrock principles as Western therapists, but in Western therapist ethics, he violates the principles of autonomy and nonmaleficence, at least. If I may speak on @LadyVirgilia's behalf, I believe she was referring to this in calling Maruki unethical.
As for the PT's ethics, that's certainly a topic for debate, just not the one being had here. I would argue that Maruki's unethical behavior isn't undone or cancelled out by the PT's unethical behavior, in part because these two parties are not bound by the same code of ethics, and in another part because that's not how ethics work.
Yo, if it were me in Ren's position, I would not have the strength to reject Maruki. I don't care how different I'd be, what connections I got and how stronger I've became. Many people have been through worse than me and never recovered. Flowery words help people in your vicinity, but what about the world, when world leader show no interest in helping their people? If I got the power, I'd change the world too.
i mean, makes sense on the surface. But the entire point is that, if you're giving away your freedom to a good samaritan with power, then what happens if you ever disagree with that person's point of view? or what happens if he turns corrupt? you'd just be trading one abuser for another, and with no possibility of change to boot
You say ''If I got the power, I'd change the world too'' but what maruki offers isn't power to change the word. It's as if he's a slave owner saying 'hey be my slave and i proooomise to not use the whip'
@@shinkamuithere is no true freedom in our reality either. There would be no clashing point if view if Maruki's world is the reality. Turning corrupt? Baseless assumptions, and throwing this out is just trying to find arguments outside of the game's moral dilemma. His power does change the world, make it a better place. Maruki's world is still the way better alternative than our reality. Once people point out the levels of tragedies and suffering in this world, people who reject Maruki's ideals always have no answer
He absolutely WOULD turn corrupt; he's just one guy with absolute power. Absolute power corrupts absolutely; doesn't matter how good your intentions initially are. @@mvl3379
This was a really amazing and insightful video! Maruki is one of my all-time favorite characters and getting a better understanding of the cultural context he was based within really helps to cement this in. Also thank you so much for the shoutout at the end of the video! I really appreciate it!
Ahhh thank you so much! and I'm glad it could provide some more perspective on a character you love!
I've enjoyed watching your Persona content, so hearing from you means a lot! ^^
Maruki is one of, if not, my favorite antagonists ever. The whole palace turned into a love and hate relationship with Maruki only for me to start crying when he asked Joker if he can let it all out. I still tear up to this day.
I'm so grateful that you've made these. I've been thinking about writing P5 fanfic, and your discussion of these characters through a Japanese lense will help immensely. Maruki was easily my favorite antagonist, and I didn't consider just how difficult it'd be to be a counselor in Japan.
So glad to hear it and best of luck with your P5 fanfic writing! ^^
I'm an avid P5 fanfic reader, and these videos help me better understand the characters too
I have to say that Maruki is a pretty good antagonist to close out P5R. We get to know him throughout the game, and the seeds of what he ends up doing are planted all throughout your interactions with him. And the fact he genuinely means well is a bonus. But what I don't see people talk about is the darker bits of his personality just beneath the surface. Whether it's the creepy manipulative cult leader vibes he starts to give off, or the fact he basically tries to use the PT's happiness as ways to force Ren to stay, or his tendency to project his insecurities and beliefs on others, it's clear that Maruki has issues. And in the ending where you side with him, everything seems happy until you start thinking of potential ways his world can turn for the worse. In the best case scenario, it becomes a stagnant world where everyone lives in blissful ignorance. Worst case scenario, Maruki snaps and goes full AM from I Have No Mouth and starts torturing everyone for all eternity. So yeah, I feel he really did need to be stopped before he goes down a very dark path.
I am glad someone mentions Maruki’s inner darkness. I find it more unsettling than most of the Palace Rulers.
And also, he poisoned Sumire’s heart for almost a year.
I was thinking about the fact that we all age and will die from old age. Dr. Maruki will die and once he does someone else will have to take over his job as basically a god.
@@yoshikirby101 Never thought of that, basically resets the game when yaldabaoth was still in control
@@xSinitsu exactly my thoughts, no matter how much Maruki thought his world would help it would definitely bring ruin to everyone eventually.
To add on, I found it surprising that, while most people you see are happy, the homeless man you meet in Shibuya is still in the same situation. It just seems odd that homelessness would even still exist in Maruki's perfect reality. It suggests that Maruki's world isn't as perfect as it seems.
I wish that past characters could appear more in the later games. One of the P1 characters (and more importantly a Persona user) actually is studying to go into therapy in P2. She should be well established in her field by P5. Maki might be the most qualified therapist to deal with the problems of the cast of P3-P5. Probably not P1 or P2 because she’s personally close to those casts, but I don’t know how professionalism works if you’re quite literally the only person in the world qualified who also understands the supernatural. Either way, she’d be able to give Maruki the help he needs. I hope they cross paths one day. If not, I hope he can move forward through his own power, though that is tough to do alone.
Maruki is a wild antagonist. He’s not malevolent, but definitely in the wrong. It’s a breath of fresh air from the usual Persona antagonists. He’s complex in a different way from the other antagonists. He’s so desperate to help others, but needs help himself. He’s fascinating.
OMG it's so rare to see another person bringing up P1 in the context of Royal!! Maki would *absolutely* be the doc lending a hand to all the ppl going through persona-related issues and trauma, I love her sm.
God I really want Maruki to be referred to her practice (hopefully going strong after all that time!), ESPECIALLY when Maki's own story was literally about coming to terms with her own idealized reality ;_;
And I mean, for someone like Maruki? Who post-change-of-heart might recognize he'd been developing some patterns of grandiose delusions (what saviour/messiah/hero complexes are usually classified under), and now wants to address that delusional thinking? Literally *who could he go to* besides Maki, who wouldn't ALSO assume everything about the Metaverse was just delusions as well?
Anyway now I kinda wish taxi jobs paid better lol, Maki's gonna need to schedule a few more sessions to cover it all. But honestly, I also like her getting the chance to discuss her own growth with anyone from P3-P5 -- since she's gone through a LOT, & despite the differences in how the whole persona thing works between games I think she'd have a lot of wisdom to share.
PERSONA 1 MENTIONED
I know this comment is a year old but adult Maki sitting down with Maruki and maybe even Ichinose is something I'd be interested to see now that you brought it up.
@@serenepastel interesting
So glad to have a new one form you!! And Maruki!!! I definitely agree that Maruki’s path is very much a product of pressure he feels to do more and the frustrations with the frictions between societal values in Japan and being able to put forth breakthroughs in helping people truly get better.
Brilliant.
Something I love about P5R is how they allow certain concepts be expressed through characters to their logic (if not extreme) end.
Daring to believe one can harness and change reality at will to erase traumas makes for such interesting fiction. What makes it come alive is watching how a well meaning character can evolve into such an extreme state.
Well done on the video.
Did anyone else try siding with Maruki to see what happens? What's really surprising is that everything seems to work out. I kept expecting the other shoe to drop, with Maruki turning into a monster. But instead, everyone's happy, and it ends with Maruki checking up on the team, then walking away alone. It, at least, suggests that Maruki might actually be a responsible God. Which is pretty daring.
Then again, SMT does love these sorts of super-grey moral/ethical scenarios. I'll admit that I was really having a hard time convincing myself to be OK with destroying Haru and Futaba's families again.
On the other hand, Sumire is now stuck as Kasumi forever and you basically let Maruki warp Akechi into a shell of his former self against his wishes... :S
@@F1areon But on the other other hand, Akechi 2.0 has friends, and found acceptance - the one thing he never had, and the seed of his psychopathy. This Akechi seems genuinely happy. It almost feels to me that it's who Akechi could have been, with a better childhood. It's an interesting ethical pickle.
I do agree, tho, the Kasumi/Sumire thing is a bit unfortunate.
@@jasonblalock4429 Yes, but Akechi himself made it VERY clear right beforehand that he did not want you to do that to him. He knows full well about all his screw-ups and wants to move past it on his own terms, so to look at that and basically go "LOL too bad; you don't know what's good for you, let me take care of it UWU" is a real dick move to pull.
@@F1areon *Akechi is a murdering psychopath.* People like that are never allowed to just do what they want in a civilized society. Your argument would hold weight if he was some random innocent guy, but no, he's a killer who almost certainly has HUNDREDS of deaths to his name - or did you forget about derailing the train, and all the car crashes he caused?
In any other scenario, the only question regarding Akechi is whether he should be put to death or locked up for life. However, Maroki opens up a third possibility, where Akechi gets to be happy, and not even be punished for his many many crimes. A lot of people would say it's far better than he deserves.
But either way, there is simply no valid argument for letting him walk free. And if those are the options on the table, Maroki's approach would appear to be by far the most humane.
@@jasonblalock4429 Again, though, Akechi very much knows he committed horrible atrocities and made it REALLY clear to Joker that he's accepted the fact that he'll be punished for it. Sure, Maruki COULD erase all of that and make him happy, but Akechi ALSO made it clear *he doesn't want him to do that*, in part because Maruki's way of doing so is to barge into people's heads and use Azathoth's power to mess with their cognition and alter the bits of their personalities that wouldn't fit in the new world (bc he's projecting his own issues on everyone else like crazy and going ham on his "Pain = bad = destroy it at ALL costs" thing).
And in the Bad Endings where you DO take Maruki's deal? Akechi's whole "Detective Prince" persona (pun not intended) is all that's left of his personality now, and he might not even realize that anymore. Joker basically just let Maruki lobotomize Akechi against the latter's wishes. Even *with* all the horrible shit Akechi did, that's STILL a real dick move to pull on him after everything that's happened. (Especially with, as LadyVirgilia comments, how easily that could escalate and become a slippery slope... Like where's the point where Maruki STOPS trying to "fix" people?)
Great as always, Lady!
I have this sort of Buddhist/reincarnation vibe from Maruki changing careers, from a counselor/researcher (probably a well-respected, lucrative occupation?) to a taxi driver (don't know how well it pays, but from the way us humans may or may not take them for granted, whether by choosing to join them in conversation or not, or otherwise, but likely not as respected as the former occupation) - i don't know if there are connotations of different social statuses of those jobs in other countries, but i felt like because of what he had done with his powers, he therefore had to "start again from the bottom". I wonder how much of that was his own willingness and understanding of needing to start over, as he himself said (or otherwise this being his "karma/punishment"), and how much was due to the change of heart the Thieves brought onto him by defeating him.
Furthermore, i wonder if how much of his "Madman"-ness was fully himself, or his Persona going berserk and becoming his Shadow due to the Day of Reckoning. There's the possibility of both, where his distorted desires could finally be unleashed by his inhibitions being loosened, or the fact that he didn't really seem to become the Gentle Madman immediately beforehand, even when he was spitefully showing his completed paper to the professor (I believe during that moment, Maruki really did want to use his cognitive psience research to change and heal the world morally, ethically, and consensually).
Awesome analysis on Maruki! Fav part was definitely how you compared the ratio of counsellors available to each population as it really grounded the situation. All the points tied together really well too, and made me appreciate Dr. Maruki even more.
This is arguably your best P5 analysis video, combining many ideas from previous videos. It's funny, at the end of vanilla P5, I remember Sae Nijima telling Joker when he gets out of jail something to the effect of to "let the good adults handle things from here." Maruki spends the whole game, as you point out, appearing like one of these "good authority figures." I guess we saw how that turned out 😄
I am really happy with the new persona them with what they did with the royal content gave me hope and faith for persona 6 and whatever they work on next for atlus. Maruki became my favorite antagonist from any media. I understood where is was coming and related to it to a degree. Been gaming since 1999 he is the first antagonist to make me cry. Gamers nowadays take for granted and or refuse to acknowledge the work and research atlus put in to there games. It’s always something new when I replay persona 4 or research other atlus games. We don’t get this in any other games outside of falcom and maybe Zelda
Wow a first time experience for you! Even after all your years of gaming! Games making people feel all kinds of emotions...you love to see it! ^^
Glad to hear Maruki resonated so much with you~
Unfortunate that this happens, but I can understand why Atlus games come across as contrived to a Western audience. The topics that seem so forward-thinking to Japan has oftentimes been common place in Western society for years already.
@@LadyVirgilia when a game can bring those type of emotions out of a person then you know it is something special. I cried during the ending of persona 3,4,5 and cold steel 2 because of the journey I went with the characters and I grew along with them as a person. Especially persona 4 I wouldn’t be writing this comment without it got me out of bad case of depression.
It’s crazy that we get a lot of forward thinking stuff from Japan and other places the somebody turns a blind eye to until a celebrity, popular news media says something about it. Wish it wasn’t like that but I hope that will changes soon.
Maruki is one of my favourite villains, I love him so much. I had to go to counselling as a child and my counsellor always gave me snacks I never got at home. His palace was the only one i cried at the end of tbh.
as someone whos had a fair share of bad therapists and counselors, whos interference left me worst than how i started despite their "good" intentions, maruki will always personally strike a sour note for me. but he's a wonderfully constructed character, and your video only served to make me appreciate him in that regard more.
ive loved your p5r series since the first video! and ive recommended your videos to pretty much everyone i know who likes persona.
Wow, I never actually thought you had bad experiences with counseling.
@@mystery8820 what do you mean by that.
@@Hermiju98
I meant that I never thought that you actually said in your comment that you are someone who had a fair share bad therapists and counselors who left you worse that how you started.
That first part of the comment surprised me, that’s all.
@@mystery8820 oh alright. it felt weirdly familiar of you to say that which is why i was confused. i didnt mean anything bad with my reply
I think a big issue with him is also the fact that Sumire doesn’t hate him for what he did. Forcing her to dissociate actually gave her time want to keep going forward, to make peace, and find support systems in friends.
While I’ve also had some iffy therapists, the fact that it actually helped Sumire and gave her time to come to accept gives me mixed feelings. Especially with the implication that she might’ve attempted persona 3 previously.
Looks like we both dropped anniversary uploads today.
I’ve been looking forward to this
- Count Dooku
Nobody should experience pain and suffering in a perfect world. Hes just like Akira in Strikers, wanting to save everyone from the brutality of society.
We shouldnt suffer from unnecesary pain but I think we should still be able to disagree and struggle.
Thank you so much for sharing your thoughts! I loved every bit of this video, and now I'll have more things to think about when it comes to Maruki.
The ending for him honestly made me really happy. Something about starting over is really fulfilling. Sometimes we're really pressed to pursue certain dreams, but it really is okay to try something new. I love that royal showed both sides of that. Fight for what you want, but dont be afraid to start over.
It's hard to come to terms with the fact that you're not responsible for people's happiness, and I'm sure now that he's learned that, he's doing much better. I'll bet he makes a lot of friends being a taxi driver.
Does anyone remember the survey question part of Maruki’s Palace?
For some reason, the right answers to those questions really hit him in the right ways.
About calling for help in difficult scenarios, not being afraid to start anew, and his admiration/respect for the PTs in general.
They really were the answers he chose by the end.
Since you brought up ThoughtBubble; someone mentioned in the comments that a taxi in a sense is a good symbolism of Maruki's change: being a vehicle that drives a person to their destination. So in a sense, the driver doesn't control the destination of the rider but the rider tells the driver their destination which is the opposite of what Maruki was doing.
So Maruki is wrong for taking away people's traumas, but also wrong and manipulative for giving them back to Sumi? Interesting.
I believe that when discussing this character, one has to first declare, and then not double back on, whether they believe that trauma (being defined as any life altering events violently and nonconsensually inflicted on a person, and the lasting effects thereof) are an essential and valuable part of a person, or not. Next, one needs to declare whether their point of view is that self-determinism is a greater virtue (and therefore a more ultimate objective) than well-being. Then we can take the Epicurean approach and examine the quadrants defined by those dichotomies for contradictions.
As I see it, Maruki is only reprehensible if trauma is indispensible and self-determinism is the ultimate virtue. (These are the ideals Joker believes in, after all.) If trauma is dispensible, then no ability to self-determine is even lost by erasing it. (eg. the introjective Kasumi is just as valid and whole of a person as the self-aware Sumire is, and so the preference of both for the body to belong to Kasumi is valid.) If well-being is a higher priority than self-determinism, then the sacrifice of a sadder and wiser self for the creation of a better and happier one is a worthy one; not at all in vain. (eg. the thriving Kasumi is a more valid and whole person than the damaged Sumire is.) And of course, if trauma is dispensible AND well-being is preferable to self-determinism, then the individual needs no power at all as long as the authority they belong to honors that well-being, as Maruki does.
So if you are going to maintain that your ideals align with Joker's, it is your own moral inertia I would advise you to be wary of. Those ideals are those of a cynic, or even an anarchist. One who views violence as a language and trust as a weakness. They are passable beliefs for an oppressed citizen of a faulty society to have, but if any citizen with those ideals overturns the ruling class or ascends into their ranks, the result is tyranny - a society that no longer even pretends to serve the needs of individuals.
The invention of a conscious, ethical, individual God (given the understanding that one has not yet existed) might be the last, best chance at.a good world for humanity. That opportunity, in any context in which it may arise, should not be destroyed on principle alone, especially not before even determining whether the ethics of humanity's former scope even apply anymore in the wider formerly-supernatural world that such a being's existence accommodates.
yes, maruki was wrong to distort sumire's mind and sense of self instead of helping her come to terms with her sisters death, and he was wrong to forcefully retraumatize her to prove a point to joker and akechi
we can see from the other phantom thieves that joker leading them to their own conclusions and helping them come to grasp what happened is better than flatly telling, say futaba, "akechi killed your mother and you're living a lie"
two things can be true at once, and joker doesn't need to violently retraumatize his friends to convince them that they need to face their pasts
One thing I'd like to just say is that I admire the work and dedication put into these videos, even one year down the line.
I would say that maybe for the statistics on health care workers per country, it might've been better to use a western country similar in size to JP or at least much smaller. Comparing population statistics per job with the US is always going to look bloated because of the sheer scale of the country.
As someone that has also studied health care and is extremely interested in social welfare provision, I run into a lot of councillors and social workers, and sometimes volunteers, completely out of their depth that 100% remind me of Maruki. I personally term it having a martyr complex at times, and it's very noticeable online, where someone will feel powerless or put the burden of responsibility for 'fixing' someone on themselves. It was very interesting to see this in a fictional game character with an official position.
One thing I like, is that the game does not tell you that Maruki is wrong - you are afforded a choice. This is a strength of many of the SMT games. Being able to make your own philosophical choices where reality is concerned. I think for many, Maruki's offer was extremely tempting and outside of the fictional context of a game, I count myself as one who may have sided with Maruki. With the supernatural component to Maruki's reasoning, it seems like what he offers is Utopia - and thanks to that supernatural component, I don't think a slippery slope can really happen. Even if some judgments may seem contradictory, if they result in everyone's individual and collective happinness, that seems objectively better than the reality that we live in. (but ofc, as even the game allows, that's open to interpretation and personal values). It might be easy for those of us living with next to no baggage in a first world society to deny Maruki's utopia - but for people who live in a living ongoing hell, it's a very hopeful outlook, even if it leads to a world that's arguably stagnant and far from 'human'. tl;dr: there's no way to prevent every bad thing in life - but with Persona/SMT supernaturalism, that's more than possible. From a non-supernatural pov, I'd agree that Maruki's method is essentially slapping a bandage on an open wound.
I don't know if you still check these comments - but I was curious about whether or not you've ever checked out or played Higurashi no Naku Koro Ni. It was written by a Japanese social worker and while some aspects of it are memey/and the adaptations focus more on the shock horror element, there are a lot of examples of Japanese cultural contexts directly harming individuals who do not fit into the collective; i:e the case of Satoko Houjo, a girl who is cut off from the collective of the village and is abused by her uncle, and ignored by the powers that be despite overwhelming evidence that she's being abused. I think it's something you'd find interesting.
Thank you once again.
To me, Maruki and Namatame are similar, since both suffered from the Messiah complex, doing bad things with good intentions.
I recently discovered your channel and I'm amazed by the quality of your work. Congratulations and thanks for sharing!
I'm on a binge, I love this channel
Great video. Dr. Maruki is a fascinating character/antagonist
I was under the impression that the characters "perfect" reality was self-generated by each of them, rather than what maruki believed to be what they wanted.. I think the former is much more powerful, because it means that those characters are really agreeing to sacrifice their most heartfelt dreams for the true reality.. I think this decision is far less emotionally charge if its just maruki's potentially incorrect prediction of what they wanted..
The whole Maruki narrative arc remmembers me of the concept: "Physician Heal thyself" or Carl Jung's wounded healer. He is trying desperately to heal the world because he can't deal with his own pain.
i loved Maruki when i first met him and his back story was so tragic ;-; edit: gentle madman is such a increadible ost
I just wondered why we didn't see everyone with snacks and juice boxes in his distorted reality.
@@cassiedevereaux-smith3890 thats a good point
Even though he's a palace ruler... I LOVE Maruki. I don't know why but I love him.
I was really happy with his role in the new narrative, though I have to admit that the slap fight at the end both didn't make sense to me and made me laugh out loud. He didn't strike me as a "now we must punch this out AS MEN!" kind of character.
While it was kind of silly (I highly enjoyed the fisticuffs myself), I think it was Maruki's way of forcing Joker to make him fully give up, by beating him man to man with fists and not personas (Not that they had them at that point I beleive as the palace was breaking down); the fist fight may have also been kind of symbolic of him getting one hell of a wake up call or it being drilled into him that running from his own pain and trauma is not the answer, neither is trying to make the world a utopiea.
i feel like the fistfight was immensely symbolic, as they fight with personas, but their fights isnt *about* or *because* of the personas. So it makes sense that the fight doesn't stop just because the metaverse collapsed, they both still carry their disagreement and convictions to the real world with their very real fists. Also it ties back around the fact that joker got into probation because of an alledged punch he never threw. It all started with in a backhanded manner by shido, and it ends on a very straightforward manner with maruki
I've been waiting for this ! - Akihiko Sanada
RIP Billy Kametz. He did and awesome job portraying Maruki.
Thank you so much for these videos. One of them showed up in my recommendations and I ended up binge watching the whole playlist. I've played the original P5 and Royal twice each, but it's almost mind-blowing how much context and subtext that I completely missed. I definitely have a MUCH greater appreciation for the story and characters now.
Maruki’s proposal leads to a stagnant world where humanity isn’t evolving nor being pushed forward. You wouldn’t have to in such a blissful world. At the same time, you would be surrendering your free will for an easier life without free thought.
Exactly what spawned Yaldybro in the first place.
Indeed, his actions match Yaldaboalth's but through a rose-tinted glass. It's benevolent but can be potentially malevolent if left unchecked. Especially when Maruki is still keeping his personal demons bottled up. Not to mention it causes an imbalance to good and evil, life and death, happiness and sadness. One cannot exist without the other.
It's a power no mortal should have. Despite all of that power, Maruki is still just one man. A flawed human individual running away from the truth and the pain instead of confronting it. He's too blinded by his own failures, fears and his desire to create a better world, he doesn't see the responsibilities and potential consequences that go with it.
And since this whole thing is similar to what Yaldaboalth did, the Phantom Thieves feel kind of insulted because they felt responsible for nearly causing a cataclysmic dimensional merger by being manipulated by a malevolent deity, and they nearly paid for it.
They save the world from an ambitious deity just to get manipulated another? Too soon, Maruki. Way too soon.
Sure, but the irony of it all is palpable, don't you think? The ultimate 'goal' of society, of humanity, really, is to make life as comfortable and easy as possible for the majority. All technological progress, all civil advancement, everything is (theortically) oriented towards that goal, if you truly take a long step back and see the forest. All Maruki (on paper) is trying to do is fast forward that into 'right now'. Everybody wants a utopia, but not really.
@@papapalps2415EXACTLY
I’ve been wondering if Maruki’s palace, which iirc contains a lot of propaganda (posters and videos) about happiness, isn’t also in part an allusion to the Happy Science cult that’s pretty big in Japan. I don’t know much about the cult, though.
It definitely is a Happy Science allusion; his Metaverse outfit even references Happy Science's god figure "El Cantare".
Maruki's reality would have broken down at a large enough scale, especially if two people, or groups of people, have competing wishes.
But still, I can't help thinking about this storyline every time major world events happen. There are so many people around the world who's lives would benefit from his reality. If I were in Joker's shoes, I'm not sure I could reject it.
Honestly I’d rather live in his new world.
Same
@@Hyp3rSonic I’m happy I’m not alone
@@alexanderthemagnifcent2573There's a lot of people who would, and I struggle to fault them. I don't know my own answer, but it's difficult to fault, I dunno, say, a person with terminal cancer or some other hideous disease, or a person living in a terrible country or environment, who played the game and came away thinking 'sign me the hell up'.
I know these are old videos, and you're likely done with these. But I was wondering if you would consider doing videos like these on the P5S cast? Sophia, Zenkichi, the Jail Monarchs, and EMMA's creator. I would love to see what you have to say about them.
Rip Dr Maruki
I think he's trying to reverse what he did to Rumi it would be difficult without his persona but violent managed to reverse her cognition changes so maybe Rumi could do the same
I really thought he'd be a romance option to be honest. I mean we can already romance adults too like a reporter and even your teacher.
Interesting
20:16
I still haven’t excused, nor forgiven Maruki for what he did to Sumire, even today. He took her ability to choose to live life and grasp her future for MONTHS.
That aside, I wonder if he can meet up with a certain other character from Strikers. They are gonna have a LOOOOONG talk.
Hoo boy, can’t wait for that convo.
Oh my god if we get those two in the same place at the same time in Strikers 2 I'm going to be so happy!
I have experiences with bad counselling sessions so Maruki makes me angry at him lol. But thats just my personal experiences and I definitely doesnt want to project my pain to other people.
I think a big issue with him is also the fact that Sumire doesn’t hate him for what he did. Forcing her to dissociate actually gave her time want to keep going forward, to make peace, and find support systems in friends.
While I’ve also had some iffy therapists, the fact that it actually helped Sumire and gave her time to come to accept gives me mixed feelings. Especially with the implication that she might’ve attempted persona 3 previously.
I wonder if you could do analysis videos on the other confidants
I was finally able to play Persona 5 Royal all the way through since it came out on switch a few months ago. The situation during the Maruki arc was far more dire than this video made it seem. No one, regardless of how pure their intentions are, should have that kind of power. Absolute power corrupts absolutely.
It’s funny cuz P5R’s final arc is in reference to the events of P1. And in that story, the BBEG that’s comes into being is the reason why the events of the persona series even came to be. One guy tried to play god, and made a reoccurring problem that continues to endanger people.
Tho, tbf, literally every cognitive experiments (P1, P3, and P5) cause death. Esp with the implication from P5S that Wakaba likely experimented on Akechi.
For me, Maruki feels like a great character in a wrong game for him.
what's wrong with him being in persona 5? he's yaldabaoth by way of the phantom thieves, and just as strong of a reflection of their beliefs as akechi was a foil to them
Maruki should've won
I agree
He should have been a bartender
That's his night job. Competing with Lala.
he should've been at the club!!!!
Good intentions or not I’ll never forgive the son of a bitch for what he’s done…
2 years have almost passed since P5R release on 3/31. And despite my reservations that he could change for the better… I still haven’t forgiven him for what he did to her…
Yeah making people happy what a monster
Manipulating and Brainwashing a young girl who was suicidal and depressed to thinking she was her dead sister. Forcing and created behind Joker's back after he literally defeat a god and save the world, Almost got Sumire and Joker killed by when was fighting and he stood and he did nothing but made shit worse by making her Persona go berserk that would also killed her if The Thieves didn't intervene. And then try to guilt trip Joker to accept his shitty reality by using Akechi life on the line. He is not a fucking Saint. Dudes a fucking spineless coward should been thrown in jail.
i aint readin all that lmao
Idk, she literally thanked him for the whole dissociation stuff. I think it would be easier to hate the guy if Sumire actually hated him for what he did and didn’t appreciate his help at the time. Sometimes people just aren’t ready to face the truth, and it helps to distance yourself from the pain, change, and find new support.
It may not work for you, but apparently it did for Sumire.
I hate Maruki. That’s all