Repairing a Hacked Up Pinbot System 11 Williams Pinball MPU & Installing NVRAM To Ditch Batteries
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- Опубліковано 2 сер 2024
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One of my favorite repair moments was a Williams "Fire" pinball that had battery corrosion and burnt connectors. When I turned it on, the connectors started smoking, and the corroded MPU kept rebooting and saying "We've lost her! We've lost her! We've lost her!". It ended up being a really nice game after the restoration though. And I thought I was the only one that said "hackery" or "lopped" LOL.
Sometimes they seem to have a mind of their own!
This is awesome Sounds like I am listening to Mathew McConaughey !
I prefer solid state pinball machines over EMs anyday. So any time you're working on a SS, I enjoy it very much. Thanks for sharing and looking forward to more SS repair videos.
More on the way!
I just watched this today - I'm your 'leaf blower guy!' too funny.. I got it about a month ago which is likely when you recorded this :) I just have my Amazon button on my menu bar set for you.. I enjoy the videos and learn a lot. So thanks for all the detail.
Ha, thanks Bob! We appreciate you doing all that, glad to know people are enjoying the videos out there and thinking of us!
Fibreglass brushes are great. They really changed how I do trace repairs. They're perfect for stripping burnt crap and solider masks.
They make it a little easier to solder to the old solder too it seems...
NV Ram for the win! So far I use it on two pins and on a Pole Position, and it works great, I love it! I flip the bird to batteries! :D
I'm using it more and more myself, I just put some in a Bally tonight!
17:05 in PinBot, the Lane Change is used to move the Extra Ball light to the next return lane or outlane (left to right). Great machine, great video!
That makes sense!
haha your Twilight Zone sound effects and camera tilt was spot on. I laughed!
I'm going to have to start adding the music back in :)
You know.. you got me started on this pinball thing.. I'm rebuilding my 3rd EM game... and now you throw all this SS candy at me... I'm gonna have no space and no money really soon. Looking forward to seeing thin pin bot working. Thanks again Ron.
That's the thing with these pinballs man, they multiply!
Thank you for posting!! I have a Williams f-14 Tom Cat pinball with the exact burned out pieces! I found a working board the other day on eBay. Because of your videos it has given me hope that I can get this thing done. Thank you so very much. From Iowa
You can definitely fix it Willie, if you run into any trouble send us a message.
Great board repair job done! 👍
Thanks Danijel, we appreciate you hanging out with us :)
Great video. Thanks for posting this. Have a nice day.
Thanks again, Kurt!
You got me convinced..... only use white rubbers.... at first i thought the black was kinda cool and a nice fit on this dark play field... but the different bounce did it for me.... no black rubbers :P
Yeah if you play around with them on different machines you'll see the difference. They're basically useless in my opinion.
Keep up the good work you allways make me smile when you fix them pinball machines 😊
Great Roiberad, we'll keep fixing them :)
nice job. I always thought that game went nuts on cpu controlled lights but for that game it works and looks good. good job on replacing with nvram. they only thing that would have been very instructional is how you removed and install the socket for it. the reason I say this is that there are lots of videos of people soldering on pristine new boards but very few of doing rework on older oxidized boards. it took me awhile to learn a process which had a high probability of sucess. seeing your process might save a lot of boards from disaster from somebody new trying to figure out how soldering top and bottom at the same time on old boards is done. when I learned to solder before doing rework I never learned to properly prep a surface with the fiberglass pen and maybe use a little flux on rework to improve my odds. you are very instructional and do a great job teaching how to repair these games, I learned from you a proper methodology to test lights on a game by writing down each bulb being out instead of trying to find and repair them in a round robin method on the fly during a bulb test, mised the fact I had one bulb shorted to gnd but missed it during test because the game would not blow a fuse until the game played since the blown bulb would not blow the slo blo fuse during the short blink time of the bulb test.
That makes sense, sometimes the problems are tricky to track down like that! I just like to take it slow when I work on them and try to be thorough.... Thanks for watching as always Robert, we appreciate it!
Ron, thanks for the video.
Thanks TCB!
I have never experienced a component failure due to static discharge from my hands/tools. But, I live in the humid southeast, same as you... I suspect that, if we lived in a dry climate, we would have been electro-zapping chips all over the place without grounded pads and wrist straps. At least, that's my story and I'm sticking to it!
They’ve moved the goal posts on it now they say they break a year later lol 😂. Think how damn dumb that is 😎
qMan I love this pinball machine. it was the one I was playing in the dorm at college when I met my future wife. We have been together32 years and married 28. I keep telling her I am gonna buy one someday
That's very cool, who used to win ? :)
@@LyonsArcade I did. I was always the better pinball player
Great video.
Thanks Mobile Decay!
Watching this, hoping to pick up some tips. I just bought a partially working Diner. Can't wait to pick it up and crack it open.
That's a cool game!
@@LyonsArcade I'm loading it into my house right now. 👍
Check the batteries :)
@@LyonsArcade Oh yeah. Thanks. That's the first thing that's coming out... 😂👍
... incrível.. parabéns.. voce é o Leonardo DaVinci das máquinas..
#sensacional 🍀👏👍.. obrigado por compartilhar sua sabedoria👏👏👏🍀🙏
É muita gentileza sua dizer! Agradeço que nos vejamos nos divertindo, até o próximo vídeo!
Fibre brush is great for the clean up but please do not get them stuck in you skin or lungs .
or fingers
I'll try not to stab myself with them!
@@LyonsArcade No the problem is that as you rub you get tiny fragments of fibre glass cracking off and if you then touch these they can get into your fingers like splinters... not fun... also best not to stab yourself.
8K x 8 FRAM memory (Ferro-electric NV-RAM) circa 2015 from the Cypress company. I picked up a couple of the larger chips (different manufacturer) with the idea of using it as the NVRAM for a high end (but older) analog scope.
These chips are great, same speed and operation as a normal RAM so its just a straight swap, though I have to do a bit of work as one of the chip enables (for the RAM) is not on the FRAM...
Thanks for the video.
Cheers,
Thanks for watching, Eddy!
As you say great parts for retrofits. The price/density makes them unattractive for new designs though, which is presumably why Ramtron floundered and ended up selling out to Cypress in 2015.
Cypress still consider the FM16W08 a current part, but the fact the part in the video still has the Ramtron logo on it suggests it has spent a lot of time sitting on a shelf.
@@petermichaelgreen - Yeah FRAM is too pricey to get a high density memory part. They are still great for smaller (4K, 8K, 16K) RAM banks which hold partial or complete configuration or calibration data (as in the case with my Tek 2465 A/B scopes) usually found in older 80's, 90's equipment.
That's a pretty niche market though. There is some life in it though, such as IoT and IoT Gateway products.
Cheers,
BTW, the FRAM technology is also used in some MCUs like the TI *MSP430FR4133* SoC which creates some interesting possibilities with these micro-controllers.
I remember being a little kid and seeing one of these at a Nicklecade or maybe a restaurant or something. It was making cool music and had pretty lights (I remember it having rainbow backglass lighting so I think it had a mod of some sort) so I was poking at the buttons trying to figure out what it was, leaving fingerprints on the glass, being a real obnoxious kid in hindsight... and then it said "I SEE YOU" and scared the bejesus out of me. I was afraid of pinball machines for a few years after that hahaha. Not as bad as the time I got ambushed and traumatized by one of those horrible, nightmare-inducing, tacky, singing Christmas trees, but pretty close.
That's awesome! When I was a kid I went to Disney Land and was scared to death of Goofy, lol. I went and hid.
man i would love to play this on reall hardware as i own and have play the nes version of this and its so good
They made quite a few of them, you may run into one, one of these days!
Actually, If someone stores the machine with the NVRAM for ten years or so, in a storagebuilding with an
average temperature of 185 f, it might need a replacement. 🤣 🤣🤣 (that´s what the "pros" said, when i asked them)??. Don´t take offence, I just had to forward that comment. Thanks for a another great video Ron. You´re awesome. 👍
Thanks Mr Vectrex we appreciate you watching :)
D1 stops the battery from trying to power the game when the system is off.
D2 (as you said) stops the game from charging the battery.
Sounds right!
I think the fembot peg board on the right looks better with black rubbers but I'd change out the rest.
We'll get at it here in a video or two :)
Man, I'd LOVE to own a PinBot... How much do these usually go for anyway? Welp, awesome video once again. I do enjoy your videos fixing these machines, and the schematic deep-dives.
Thanks Crystal, this one was $2999 we think it's sold though (somebody's coming to look at it Friday)
@@LyonsArcade Ahh! Oh well. :D Still, thanks for the rough pricing. I know how much to save for if another one ever shows up. Thanks!
Can't wait to see the gameplay, never played a Pin-Bot. Is there a change you are going to do an Addams family?
I probably won’t anytime soon because I don’t run across the really expensive ones very often. That’s my favorite machine though!
JOE CLASSIC, can you explain or show more how the solenoid voltage Crossed lines with the 5 volt circuit of the transistor that injected the solenoid voltage of the flipper buttons into that transistor has was burnt. I don't think the wiring harness caused this so how did the flipper buttons solenoid voltage happen to "cross lines" with that transistor to damage it?
We'll show it in a future video when we work on the flippers, basically the switch to change lanes is right next to the end of stroke switch on the flipper stack. so if one switch touches the other one it burns up the switch matrix because the one switch has solenoid voltage on it and the one next to it has the switch matrix voltage on it.
@@LyonsArcade yes thanks show it in the next video. I can't believe they didn't put anything to isolate the solenoid switch from the switch matrix.
Nv Rams are good but on games with clock and date and other functions the chip does not support that . I just use remote battery and I think it’s good and everything is cool people........
Everything is cool everybody just calm down :) Thanks for watching Electronics Tech we appreciate it!
I wonder if that scorching and missing traces are just from a botched transistor removal.
It could be, but I've seen transistors burn up the pcb like that many times, before anybody even tries to remove it.
Never..Everrrrr Never Never..Nice Chris Jericho reference;)..or was it Spongebob and Patrick..hmm lol
I think it was Outkast 😎
Excellent info on Wms machine. I have a Wms Space Shuttle and while working on one problem suddenly both flippers don't work.. Testing the voltage(DC) on the flipper coils I measure 70 v. Shouldn't it be around 50? I don't know where the "relay" for the flippers are or even if that is related. Any thoughts on this would be appreciated.
Did you figure it out? Check out www.PinSide.com the people on the forum there can give you specific help on something like this, does everything else work on the game?
@@LyonsArcade Thanks for the reply. Previous to flipper issue I was replacing rubbers and working on lamps. I'm still working on flippers and flashing lamps.
What setting on your multimeter are you using to test your chip paths at 33:00 ? I think you mentioned resistance ohm for sockets? Leads going to each side of socket pins and comparing values to next socket same path?
Yes you set it to ohms, and then i'm checking from the pin on the chip, to the pin on the other chip or wherever that trace leads to (to see if the socket is making good contact with the board). Low resistance (less than half an ohm or so) means the socket is properly mated to the board.
The reason I was checking from the one socket, to the chip in the socket next to it is when you have roms or rams they usually have mostly the same signals running to them, for instance the same address lines and data lines, so when you are trying to figure out where pin 9 goes for instance, it probably goes the same place pin 9 on the other chip goes. If you're certain you don't have a few shorted together and you're just trying to confirm that they're connected to the pad on the board, you can check from one chip to the other pin by pin, and then analyze the few that aren't connected. So 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9 may all be connected to the same pin on the other chip (that is the same part number and thus the same pinout) but pin 10 may be not connected. When you look at the schematics, you might see that pin 10 is the chip enable pin, so it's different on each chip, i.e. the one socket has pin 10 connected to a different place than the pin 10 on the other socket. So then you can trace down where it actually goes and make sure the ohms are low (it's connected). If you do that for each pin you confirm electrically that the socket is perfect.... especially if you're working on a damaged board where a trace may be broken or lifted.
@@LyonsArcade ok.thank you
Whats the old one sitting next to it?
Oooo, 'Pinbot', one of the two "sexiest" pinballs out there. The other one being Xenon. Fix'er up I say!
Love me some Xenon :) Here's a video we did of one if you want to see : ua-cam.com/video/CZlCKQIapiQ/v-deo.html
Three words: Bride Of Pinbot.
There is a Jackbot pinball too
@@DavidWilliams-rn6uq Sorry, my bad. I of course meant 'Bride Of Pinbot'. =)
Is there a purpose for the high wattage resistors to be upside down?
They seem to be like that on all of them, they may be thinking that it radiates heat away from the board better like that.
I can see that. I'm just used to them being the other way.
Now that you've replaced the battery backed RAM with NVRAM, how would you go about clearing the RAM should you want to restore the machine to factory settings? Is there a pin on the NVRAM chip you can short out?
There's a setting in the menu to restore factory settings.
@@LyonsArcade Oh, that's good, I hadn't thought of that.
@Lachlant1984: I was thinking the same thing myself. When it comes to laptops, and CMOS chips, you always needed a way to drain the memory because the system could get into a state where it wasn't operational to reach the stage in bootup allowing one to wipe the CMOS. So generally you needed to leave the battery connector shorted for a time to let it reset before you could get back.
Ron, Is there some alternative way to clear the NVRAM? (should the system somehow develop the kind of memory corruption which may prevent normal booting? maybe its only a problem for Laptops and Desktops of the 1990's?)
@@goddessesstartrekonlinefle3061 The creator of the video says there's a setting in the menu to rest the settings back to their default factory values.
@@Lachlant1984 Yes, I did read that, thanks. My point is that in some systems (specifically, as an example 386/486's) CMOS memory corruption can leave the system in the point where it can't even get as far as any kind of menu. You could even have corrupted CMOS actually permenantly damage the system. So I'm very used to absolutely requiring being able to physically blank settings memory by removing the battery as the only way to fix some issues (of course, I only know about PC's, I'm presuming such problems don't happen to Pinball machines). Though I thought I'd ask incase there was maybe some jumper, or physical switch to blank the settings memory? (just curiosity) maybe this "menu" is a physical set of switches?
Someone send you a yellow marker without the ink?..... :D
Exactly :)
4:23 is that Joe, in the background, hammering on another poor, defenseless, coin door?
No, he's just repairing a Donkey Kong PCB.
gotta keep the chips level otherwise the barrels won't roll straight lol
ROFL :) coin door :)
Do you happen to be a troubleshooter when you fix things you like for them to stay fixed not for them to go bad a month or year or five years later
Exactly, plus if we sell them if they end up breaking the customers won't be happy, so we want them to stay fixed if possible!
You should have checked the flipper button switches for blade adjustment, no?
Yes, and the leg levelers. And also I should clean the back of the game. Anything else you want to point out, or did you notice anything positive that happened here?
@@LyonsArcade Damn dude! Triggered again! Your skin is so thin you must bleed all over everything.
BTW, Always excited to see your videos! I've learned so much from you.
@@LyonsArcade No, please don't take me wrong. I really liked you digging into why Q49 may have barfed. I thought you may have wanted to look at the lane change points om the flipper buttons to see if there was evidence of the higher voltage crossing over. I enjoy the videos.
Hi guys. I am interested in buying the pinbot. There are none avail in New Zealand. Please advise on shipping and cost of machine kluge at xtra.co.nz