3d scanning: Einstar VS Revopoint (Range, Pop2 and Pop3)
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- Опубліковано 12 вер 2024
- Comparing the Shining3d Einstar to the Revopoint Range, Pop2 and Pop3 scanners.
Full disclosure - I had requested to try the Einstar which was loaned to me by Shining3d. In the end, I ended up buying it from them rather than sending it back.
Discount link for Einstar ($50 off, I get a little as well) is in the comments
I agree with @PUTV3D. First, your August video uses an outdated version of Revo Scan, neglecting the crucial revopoint pop 3 update from July, which undermines the credibility of your evaluation. Second, your initial comparison is flawed as you used Range in feature mode and Einstar in marker mode, creating an unfair, apples-to-oranges comparison. Third, when you did switch Range to marker mode, you used marker points optimized for EinStar, rather than those designed for Range. These discrepancies have led some viewers to question whether your review is intentionally biased in favor of Einstar, potentially for promotional reasons.
Sorry, the Revo device is inferior. I sent mine back. The Einstar while a resource hog gives me infinitely better scans by far.
Next time could you at least make sure youre using the most recent software and actually have all the scanners at the proper scanning distance/ range set up
That was the most recent version, and it was at the correct distance on the router.
@@K-Mach every revopoint was in the too closeb or too far instead of excellent distance from the object. And as it says there wasn't enough markers. And unless it was recorded previously they changed the UI in the new one again so all the icons were at the top it's been that way for a few versions
You said paid promotion and it sure looks like it when one set of scanners isn't handled correctly
Just popped into einscan and revo sites and started a order.
Einstar is 1.204.euros with shipping, (price on website is without vat)
Range is 779.euros with vat and shipping (clear pricing no hidden fees)
So that is 400.euros more than the range... soo not the same price sorry.
And this considering you are assuming hobbiest buying the einscan have at home a laptop (for mobility) that has the minimum reccomended specs by einstar
"These are the minimum suggested specs for your PC or laptop to run the EinStar smoothly:"
CPU: Intel Core i7-11800H or above
RAM: 32GB or above
Graphics card: NVIDIA GTX 1060 or above
VRAM: 6GB or above
I have never tested the einscan because it is just too expensive and i dont have 3.200.euros to invest in a scanner and a brick if i want to scan anything on the field like going to a friends house to scan a part that cannot be moved.
But at least one thing is a fact You clearly have issues using the Revopoint scanners. And like You state most probably Your fault. It is ok most people dont RTFM :)
I got the Einstar today for 1000€ included shipping. I re-bought it a year later now because I really needed a scanner for bigger parts more often.
First time I bought it I returned it because parts size of a controller were hard to scan with it.
I think the couple 100€ more it’s worth to spend to get the better software. It has a alignment built in too.
I watched several reviews before buying the einstar... and it seemed like it would be a great solution for me. But after spending half a month with it, I still haven’t gotten a decent result with it and I’m beginning to think I got tricked by paid for reviews. Cause my experience is nothing like any of those videos describe.
Exact same price?
You fail to mention that on the einscan you need a pc that costs as much as the scanner to even run the thing lol
Pretty sure I specifically talked about this, but my opinion on that is you're not going to be able to do anything with a 3d scan without a decent computer, which would have to have at least the specs required for scanning, so it's not a valid argument.
@@K-Mach well it is completely different to be able to scan anywhere with a mobile phone and process the files in the studio vs having to carry a heavy 2k.euro+ laptop that not everyone has (so has to buy). So it is a valid argument.
@X3msnake That's not the same thing. Portability is one thing while requiring a computer is another. You have to have a decent computer no matter what, the fact that you can't use the einstar on your phone is an entirely different thing. I also touched on the portability thing.
@@K-Mach can the einscan work with a surface 3 to scan and mesh?
well any of the revopoint scanners can.
You don’t need a 2k laptop to scan with the Einstar. And 16gb is enough to scan. You can save the scan data and mesh it later with a gaming pc.
My first intro to 3d scanning is the revo mini, its frustrating because I need to scan automotive parts and interior stuff etc.. but it just cant do it and is more suited to figurines and stuff. Having seem your frustrations with the range having the same issues I think it has cemented the fact that I will go for an einstar next. Thanks fo the video!
Yeah, i am agree with you. I am own Einstar, revopoint mini, pop2 and range 3d scanners. In most situations Einstar wins. It is really simple to work with it. Software is awesome! But! When i need extradetail - i am using Revopoint mini! It is much more accurate. If it is needed to scan something that is no more than 30cm in length - i am using Revopoint pop2. If i need to scan really big models, like automotive parts, sculpture or human body - i am choosing Einstar. Also, i can use revopoint with mobile phone. In some cases it is really matter. So, for me best option is to own Einstar and to own revopoint mini.
I need to scan the details of the cars. There was a sad experience with EinScan SP v2, very sad software.
EinStar has software from EX. Do you still recommend EinStar?
What are the parameters of your equipment?
@@carimprover I found, that ram should be at least 32gb. If you have 64gb ram - it will be perfect. But, i had never had bad experience when i was scanning car parts with einstar.
@@evgeniyzelenin7910 Понял, 32 конечно нормально так, у меня в ноуте 24 (((
Вот я тоже планирую сканировать в основном автомобили, в том числе интерьеры. Сам уже много лет работаю с 3d моделями авто, но с дизайнерской стороны + оптимизация под игры.
Хочу вникнуть в процесс сканирования, был горький опыт с Shininig SP, отражатель фар в универе сканировал, мозг выносило только так. Возможно из-за слабого пк) Если дело пойдет, то думаю обновиться всё же до scanfrom l5
I've been using the Pop2 heavily, so I'll comment on that. I can agree all the frustrations you've had and shown. With the most recent update RevoScan, it does help a lot, but the issues are still there. I have a friend that has Pop1, Mini and range. With his limited scans he likes his mini and range so far and seem to have less of an issue than me. And i've seen people scan the interior of their car to design roll cage w/ the Range. I don't have Einstar but from all the videos i've seen, it seems to be a lot more useful for reverse engineering and all around scans. That's my next scanner to get if i get one again around $1k range. if you're only into scanning hand sized objects and toys, Revo scanners are good. If you're into larger objects and reverse engineering, Einstar looks to be better and I would get that instead. There's a learning curve like anything else. I agree 100 it does take a lot of time to get things right for Revo. If you have plenty of time, a hobbyist that only needs a few scans here and there, sure, Revo scanner very cost effective and works for the most part. And then there's the CAD part lol.
this video just summed up all my gripes with revo products, they are no different than creality or 3dmakerpro products, the einstar was the only device with an acceptable workflow, which did not require that i control the lighting, or drown everything in home made scanning spray, and the tracking is just something else, as your experiments have shown. the exstar software is absurdly powerful for what that scanner is, it really payed off that they use the same software for this entry level scanner they also use for the enterprise class systems.
You are using old version of Revo Scan from May , not latest release 5.2.4 , the distance is not proper , poor scanning perfomance on your side, I suggest that before you make any comparison you should learn how to work with the scanner proper . I wonder how much you got paid for this sad presentation since you sounds negative before you even start .. I did used Einstar , and you cant compare the quality here .. fake review my friend it is so obvious 👎
Ha, coming from someone who's obviously getting paid to produce revopoint tutorials.. that's a good one.
@@K-Mach at least viewers can see the reality in action and get educated for getting excellent results, and my YT channel is private to help out the community , not paid for telling a lies like yours .. I know what the scanners can do , I made 1000,s of scans with them for my own work and mostly paid for them myself . Your propaganda just pop up on my feed , and that is a big 👎🏻
Great job you did there with the methodic testing and also the down to earth user perspective review!
Just a few things I want to point out:
-Without using markers and scanning spray, you made the scanners job particularly difficult. Without markers, these kind of parts shouldnt even be attempted even with a high end scanners, because theres a very high chance that dimensional accuracy will be off. This comes inherently from how the frame alignment algorythms are abale to work with the data, and theres no getting around this. You get a feel for what you can and cannot scan without markers if you scan alot.
-I wish you did some dimension checks, comparing the scan data to traditionally measured dimensions. I did my own research and tests, comapred data collected with a professional scanner, the revopoint scanners and caliper measurements. This is a topic nobody owning these entry level scannersreally talk about: The overall dimensional accuracy and detail reproduction. Theres a difference between resolution, accuracy, and detail reproduction capability. For example one scanner has a 0.3mm accuracy, which is fine on paper, you think you can work with that. You might think a scan with 0.5mm deviation is absolutely fione for what you want to achieve. However, these inaccuracies in each frame can pile up to a much larger compounding error, we are talking a couple of milimeters. The larger you scan, the worse it gets. The worse the singe frame accuracy a scanner can get, the faster the compounding error sets in, the smaller the object you can scan reliabliy. You really have to be mindful of this.
Also resolution numbers can look good on paper, really the collected data quality (accuracy and precision combined) which drives detail reproduction, is far far more important. You can have a beautifully detailed sharp scan that contains only 250000 points, and a shooth, rounded out scan with missing or badly defined details, that contains 1 million points raw. Both on the same object but with different quality scanners.
On the other hand, the pop3 will work much better on smaller objects than the range or the einstar because of the detail reproduction capability. The scanned data quality can rival or match some industrial scanners, although ease of use often lacks.
-Using a cellphone or tablet for data collection and previewing using the revopoint scanners is a perfectly viable option. You can collect data on-site and then transfer over the data to the desktop pc in the office and process it there, no drawbacks.
Thanks -
For the scanning spray, I wanted to attempt to give it the best "pick it up and go" option to see how they'd respond.
I had done a little for dimensional checks but I didn't add it into the video unfortunately. I don't have an easy way to measure the larger distances unfortunately, which would give the best idea of overall scale issues however I did measure the slot on on the saw and compare to the actual and it was very close - I believe it was supposed to be 50mm and it was within .025mm for both scanners.
For the compounding error - I don't think that this is a "per-frame" error or it would end up being massively out of scale, especially over a larger distance.. but I don't know for sure. I believe I mentioned it in the video but I expected the 0.5mm deviation to be in the event you were to scan a flat surface, it would have undulations of +/- 0.5mm. I don't know that for certain though.
I agree on the phone collection point, however I think its being sold as if you could do all of this on the phone and get a decent result. I've used the Pop2 in that way and got a (kind of) decent looking scan, but the idea that it is the only hardware you'd need in order to scan I don't agree with.
I have a range scanner myself and have the problem with every scan that several point clouds are on top of each other. But these are not recognized when they are put together, so I always have 2 or more scans on top of each other, it makes me so aggressive. As you rightly say, 500 dollars is ok, but not for the same price as an einstar shining... I regret not buying the egg star!
33:05 accuracy and resolution are not the same. 0.2mm resolution can have 0.05mm accuracy. If I remember correctly the Einstar had around 0.1mm accuracy when I tested it.
I returned it because I needed a scanner for smaller stuff but I am considering rebuying it. There is just no other scanner for medium to big scans with this price on the market.
have you tried the REVO RANGE?
I rebought the Einstar but I wish I had waited a little longer. Creality Raptor looks very interesting.
Isn't it true that the gyros only detect rotation and acceleration? If that's true, then once the CNC accelerates to final speed (almost instantaneously, I imagine), the gyro will stop registering any movement (assuming the CNC gantry is perfectly straight). So the 'bending' of the part is inexplicable when using the CNC scan.
As far as I know you are correct, though the gyro only does rotation and there would be accelerometers for movement. I can't explain the potato chip effect other than software OR the gyros being poor hardware and telling the software there has been a rotation.
@@K-Mach Sorry, I forgot to make the distinction between accelerometer and gyro. But now that you steered me there, perhaps the Revo devices only have gyros and not accelerometers, and the gyro(s) are drifty as all-get-out. What I learned with my (paper weight) POP 2 is that if I move the scanner at all, in hand-scan mode, I get zero useful results. I had to mount it on a stand to keep it absolutely still, scan one small section of an object, then finish the scan, move the stand a couple of inches, and make a new scan. This 'need' made the device unusable.
@@imacmill It would make little sense to me, but its entirely possible. I tried the same thing with kind of taking on shot and moving, taking another shot, etc and ended up getting some sort of scan, but it was far from useable and super time consuming. Originally I had tried setting the mini and pop up on a linear rail with a stepper motor controlling it to get consistent movement at a regulated speed but didn't have anymore luck either. I believe the software has somewhat improved, not sure when you tried it last but it might be worth dusting off, updating it and giving it another try to see if there is any difference for you. Its not a cheap paperweight, maybe you can still get some use out of it.
@@K-Mach I'll dust it off and give the new software a try. I'll give it exactly 3 scan attempts, and if I don't see useful results, back in the box it goes.
Back when I bought it, I did consider making a mount to attach it to my 3D printer, for the same reason you cited, but didn't bother with it, since the scan volume would be so limited. Your CNC mount is awesome, though, and it's obvious that didn't help the Revo products much.
The Einstar is superior, easily. Its a resource hog but if you have the hardware its head and shoulders better than the Revo device.
The device delivers extremely imprecise scans. In the most precise setting of the POP3, it scans a ground gauge block of 60x30x10mm as being almost 0.9mm larger than it actually is. The point cloud was measured, not the even less precise mesh data. Regardless of whether you work with or without markers and with or without matting spray. The calibration only works in one out of 30 attempts. Unfortunately, the calibration panel is also crooked. In reality it is only ~10fps not 18! Simply garbage!
So pop 3 theoretically is the best, as far as quality goes, especially with updated software
Quality is a very hard thing to quantify from what I can tell, the claims of resolution of scan don't really tell you a lot. Of the 3. I think it may have the higher resolution but the downside to that is 1) tracking issues present in all the Revopoint lineup and 2) a very small working envelope. Really comes down to what your application is if that's a worthwhile tradeoff though. I have the mini and it's a higher detail scanner, but only has a approximately 50mm2 field of view, which for me is generally not useful.
@@K-Mach what about reverse engineering of some smaller but not miniature parts? For example I want to scan a flared magwel for a pcc to redesign it for a better angle, so it’s not a detailed part like a board game miniature or a coin or hair, but angles, flats and especially correct dimensions are crucial? Einstar is also on discount right now, and is only 50$ more than advanced edition of pop 3, so I’m on the fence. 0.1mm isn’t really worse that claimed 0.05, and even with update revopoint software is not the same quality at all, I guess
@@sunnesonne To be honest, what I'd say is buy the pop3 on Amazon, try it and if you find you don't like it return it in the return window. I know I'm a bit biased since I've struggled so much with the software, it has improved though and likely will continue to do so.
Really for something like that I'd be using machine shop measuring techniques generally for the majority of it anyhow as that will give you the best accuracy, a protractor, set of decent (mitutoyo) calipers and a reasonably flat surface goes a long way, add in some inexpensive radius gauges and you can probably get most of it. I'm not familiar with how they attach though, so maybe there is something more complex that measuring wouldn't be able to get you?
@@K-Mach I enjoy working with my mitotoyos, funny thing is I accidentally ended up with 3 six inchers, so now if I have any concerns I can just remeasure with another one lol; realistically the dimensions precision I’m looking for is within 0.5-1mm, as I can work around it in fusion or shapr3d. I was designing a handguard for a shotgun, that was kind of annoying to do by hand and took many prototypes to properly align and fit the locking mechanism and have minimal handguard/body curvature gaps. Scanner would have helped me a lot, that’s why I want to get one, but don’t see a reason to buy something too expensive or something for large surfaces, as I’ll keep it under 40cm cubed for 99% of my parts. Still stuck between einstar and the pop3, as both are great and for the price pop3 does come with a lot of extras which is certainly showing how much the scanner and software costs itself. Einstar software is certainly great and I don’t think that pop3 will get updates like bambu printer, as it’s not an innovative product and they seem to come up with a new scanner every year
@@sunnesonne The 6" were the first measuring tool I bought and I've still got them 14 years later. Need to get a new set at some point thought I've never really run into an issue where they were wrong!
I can see how a scanner would help with that type of thing, thought I am not entirely familiar with how they attach as I've never worked on them. As I showed in the video, the "spiral of doom" as its called is a common issue for the revopoint stuff, but if you're using it with a fixed marker setup you will likely not have as many issues. The other thing that I was VERY impressed with on the Einstar is ability to do the "connected domain" and invert to clean up the extra data. That doesn't exist with Revopoint and its a lot more frustrating of a process to clean up scans in my experience. 40cm² is actually a decent scan volume, so you end up really having to decide if you need the detail or not in my opinion. I'm actually going to try re-scanning the saw at the lowest resolution and see what I get for an output, all critical information like holes will be measured to confirm anyhow, or drilled in place to make sure they line up and I'm now curious how the model will come out.
I'd agree somewhat on the pop3, I think the cost of those scanners is substantially less, and they give you some accessories that are nice to have however you can go get a lazy susan from almost anywhere and build a rotary table with markers, and all of these scanners have a threaded hole for 1/4 NC which is standard for cameras, so you CAN find things to do the same thing as the accessories they give you if you were to buy the einstar and try to outfit it in a similar way. Again, if I were you I'd go the amazon route and try the pop3, if it just becomes a struggle then send it back and go to the einstar.
Regarding the suggestion that Revo consider charging for version bumps, I would absolutely not pay money to buy a new version that makes my original purchase actually usable.
I would agree if the subscription was required, what I was getting at was that you could own the version, and they could continue to work on that for a couple months or so, then release a new version that has a cost. I would never support subscriptions that are required to use hardware. I'm not sure if you keep up with the revopoint products but they just got the range out, and there's another one in the pipe releasing this coming week on kickstarter so that they can keep money coming in. It would be nice if these things evolve into a standard output so there could be other software for scanning and not the OEM software only. Hopefully one day.
@@K-Mach Unfortunately my experience with the company has soured me from buying any of their products. Not only is my POP 2 all but useless, but on day 1, the battery compartment lid on the turntable would not snap closed when the batteries were inserted. The batteries sit proud of the opening, and the snap-lid would contact the batteries 2mm before getting to the 'snap closed' position. I spent a few hours taking photos and videos to send to their tech support, and in the end they basically washed their hands clean of it. I ended up designing and 3D-printing a replacement lid that works fine. Strange problem that they should have offered to correct by sending me a new turntable, but they refused..
@@imacmillI've heard similar complaints on facebook groups about their customer service, you'd think for a company that small they'd be VERY customer service oriented while they get their products out and (hopefully) work on improving them and the software. My personal opinion is they don't have a lot of direction as far as what they're working towards.. just keep pushing new versions out the door to get money, make some improvements, do it again however I think thats going to end in failure if they don't put a lot of time into working out the bugs and massively increase the customer support - at least for hardware issues. Not an easy task but they've gotta do something..
I bought a POP 2 about a year ago, and after spending a week with it and encountering all the BS you did, it has been a paperweight ever since. Pretty significant buyer's remorse on it.
Thats exactly how I ended up feeling when I got my mini. I haven't sold it off (for some reason) yet, but I hope the video gave you an idea of the difference between the scanners.. The einstar just works, as opposed to the typical revopoint experience.
@@K-Mach Thanks. I'm not inclined to buy another scanner at all, as my Revo purchase was a spontaneous (and in retrospect, silly) purchase. I have very little need for a scanner...it was a luxury to begin with.
I watched this video hoping against hope that the Revo scanners had been made usable after all this time of mine collecting dust, but alas, nothing has changed.
Discount URL - www.einstar.com/discount/kmach?ref=ierBDI6g
thanks for the video, this was exactly the comparison i was looking for. cheers
If there is something else you'd like to see that would've been a bit better please feel free to let me know, but I'm glad it helped you. Comparing these things is tough to do in a reasonable way I've found.
@@K-Mach you covered everything I thought I needed to know and more stuff that I should've known I should know haha. Ended up picking up the Einstar. As far as the video I think your mic could be a lot better but for your first published video it was still very informative and helpful
@@balooooba glad to hear that. Yeah I was struggling with getting any decent sound, I even had ordered one of those clip on mics but it still sounded bad. The voice over part was the best I could get but that's really tough to do.
Did you end up using my code when you ordered? $50 off
you can use audacity to normalize your audio, just bring the clips to the same level, even if your mics are bad you can at least bring them to the same level so we don't get ear rap*d. the other option is to pickup a cheap rode wireless mic and keep that the same distance from your mouth.@@K-Mach