Just discovered this channel by accident and am glad I did! you deserve WAY more subs for sure. Excellent video quality, excellent presentation, and great material. Really good!!
I like how you've spread this series out Mike. It's allowed me to reflect on what you've shown which has helped my learning. I appreciate your hard work!
Ohhh man, I'm glad you didn't mind. It's not ideal, but my current workload didn't let me get the editing done very quickly lol Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Yes, Sir. Watched & waited, Waited & watched, thru' the series... Always, educational - No Doubt, Your, Expertise :) Missing links, could be - What was the mileage? On the original engine? Why were chains replaced? A Post-mortem of That failure, would've been... Million views? You didn't wanna go there? Knock on The Door? At Midnight? Not a good ad for GM?... FM? :)
Hey Emmett, thanks for watching! I definitly use a 10mm socket more but that's not very interesting. Sharing my PICO diag videos seems to garner more attention. ;) Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Great series, thanks. Question on scopes - I'm a DIY mechanic, always wanted to invest in a scope but not able to justify Pico pricing. Are there cheaper options worth having? I know Pico is the gold standard.
Which cam sensor is used to synchronize the spark and fuel timing? I have a no start engine and the only defect found is a bad? Left bank exhaust phaser.
This was live.? Sorry Mike, didn't get my morning warning text from you. Lol. Great Stuff as usual buddy. Always great to see you at work. Cheers Brother. 😉👍🍻
@@GoTechTraining Ya ya...kinda what I thought. Just found it funny that it had the live chat box as if it was live. Besides, I figured it was a good reason to give ya crap anyways for not texting me... Live or not. 😂😂😂😂👍🍻
one thing i didnt hear, whether i wasnt paying attention or you didnt say was to disconnect the vvt solenoids so as to get base timing just in case the computer is trying to work the phasers.
Interesting video! It would be interesting to redo the test with the sensors unplugged to see if it changes the results. I am totally unfamiliar with these engines. Can you determine if the chains are stretched by looking at live data with a scan tool? Or with bidirectional control, for example call for some amount of advance, perhaps full advance and see what you actually get?
Nice one mike. Is there a website where one can check good wave forms when drawing out scope analysis. Am pretty sure this timing wave pattern varies across each brand of vehicles. So in a case where you have an over advanced timing what would the cam signals look like. Would they be coming to the extreme left. Educative I must say
Hey Mayowa, check out Diag.net or the Automotive Waveform group on Facebook for known goods. As far as advance timing, yes, it would shift to the left on the scope. Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Hi Mike, I need your help. I got a 2008 Buick Enclave with a 3.6 engine. It was driving fine, but out of nowhere, while pulling the driveway to park the car, it died on me. The vehicle had been maintained with oil changes every 5K miles. I thought it was security system as I got a new key cut but I used the original one and it cranks but no start. Then I thought it might be a fuel pump but I can hear it and I tested the fuel rail pressure, and it was 50-52. I did scan the car before I took the battery for replacement, and I can share the scan report. I checked all fuses and relays under the hood, and nothing was wrong. I need to ask you for guidance to figure out the car is not starting, please. Thank you in advance.
Hey, I don't have a First Look sensor. I have the PICO pressure transducer though. What kind of stuff are you looking to see? In cylinder pressure? Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
i got a 2009 3.6 acadia in with 94k with this same exact pattern both banks and its throwing a p0008 perf. dtc for b1 same thing where the exh does not cross with the missing tooth of the crank im thinking this is not how these are but b1 stretches first due to oiling schematics. and the car you scoped its not far at all from setting a dtc. this seems to be common with these engines on the back/right bank (b1)
Hi mike I sent you an email. What would the wave pattern look like with a bad timing tensioner. Mine isn’t meeting up with the teeth on the crankshaft when I sync with the exhaust cam. Would a bad tensioner make the cam not meet up with the expected teeth from the left
What are the data PIDs you could look at in lieu of a scope? Seems like there would be some PIDs that could provide a smoking gun. Clearly the computer tracks it in the first place, so it would be a matter of simply displaying the variance value.
Hello, Yes, a lot of manufactures have scan tool PIDs that will show you cam/crank variation, which can be useful for diagnosis. The problem that I have ran into, is some manufactures default the variance data as soon as a code sets. I have seen this on a lot of GMs. But other vehicles like Volkswagen, the data can be very useful. Good Question! ~Ryan
@@GoTechTraining Is there a PID that owners of these vehicles could reference (assuming the code hasn't set)? Kind of a health check. And it would be good for used car hunting, too.
Hello, Yeah, it will be called something different depending on vehicle and scan tool. It is usually found in the engine or VVT system data and called something like cam/crank variance, cam/crank sync, or cam/crank offset. ~Ryan
Hey Nasir, are you talking about trying to force feed the PCM to ensure it's able to read for a diagnotic process? Or are you talking about fooling the PCM long term? If I were trying to see if the PCM can read a singal, i'd try to steal it from somewhere else. Take the intake cam signal from bank 1 and jump the wire into bank 2, ensuring the PCM can read it. I do it ALL the time with ABS sensors making sure the harness and everything is good...just as a diag though, never longterm. Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
It for long term. Got two Renaults with dc4 disk clutch nightmare of a gearbox in there. Thinking of either converting to manual or faking the readout to pcm.
Hmmm not sure on that. Maybe theres a company that makes a sensor to send a spoofed signal. That would be my only guess. Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Great video series Mike!!! Always informative. Quick question tho. Did you check the timing with the vvt solenoids unplugged or still plugged in? Which do you recommend or are there times where you would want to check it unplugged vs plugged in? For example to verify vvt solenoid actuation perhaps? Thanks for sharing your knowledge with us Mike. Always appreciated. On my way to the survey now, and can I have that bees autograph? It's famous now. Lol.
Hey Mike, thanks man! So typically you want to check with them unplugged. These were plugged in. I'm relitively sure they don't phase at idle though, on this engine. Not certain though. In best practice, unplug vvt's :) Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
I have a scope trace of all four cam sensors off a Buick I put a remanufactured 3.6 into. I forgot to document which sensors were on which channel, but it does show each of the intake cam signals being identically timed while the exhaust cam signals were off a tad. It never threw a code, so I assume it's a known good. If you want a screen shot or the actual snap on file, which can be viewed on shop stream, I'd be happy to email it to you. If you want it, drop an email address and I'll send it when I have a moment.
Hey Shaun, interesting that it's slightly different. The engine has some "wiggle room" but I wonder if that chain is slightly longer or something? Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
helo mike my question is what if the pcm Advance or retarded timing at idle or at different temperature that will change mi time because i have scope this engine and they are a little different i looking to find a good test, good video thank you.
Part 1: 2011 Chevy Traverse 3.6L With MAJOR Engine Failure! Now What?! ua-cam.com/video/hE9E3pzenR0/v-deo.htmlsi=o-ZENCQ9KQjsp8yR Part 2: How To Replace Timing Chain On Chevy / GM 3.6L V6 - Full Length Removal and Install - With Tips! ua-cam.com/video/BhDs1GcwRCs/v-deo.htmlsi=66M5AAnGOkmJzXzn Part 3: How To Test GM 3.6L Timing Chain Problems With A Labscope - P0008, P0016, P0017 and more ua-cam.com/video/jHciEodt7lY/v-deo.htmlsi=8VfVlLQO1FLof77z
Too bad the original engine had a sight window on the side of the block because it would have been nice to see if that engine had a worn/stretched chain to check and compare those signals to a known good signals.
Hey Frank, I have to "assume" the old engine was in time considering the chains were installed by some other shop only 2 monthes prior and there was no complaint of a check engine light prior to the BOOM. Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
I can't even imagine what goes on in the " cave man " shops . And putting in low end aftermarket parts just adds to the disaster . I would not own these boat anchor engines . You would think if you don't know what you are doing , it's hands off . Putting in a " good used " engine may not get you that far . The only insurance might be conservative synthetic oil changes - and a lot of luck . Great series and information . I guess those " cave man " shops get service data from Tic Tock !
I still think it's time for all manual vehicles and hand signals. LOL how many drivers now days watch for and see hand signals, let alone brake lights and turn signals? I have given up on using turn indicators and would rather downshift with minimal braking to reverse mind-screw them all back. I very rarely talk on phone or use one at all while driving and all the clowns with their faces buried into said idiot devices makes me want to blow gaskets :))
![OH DEAR! TIMING CHAIN CHECK [BMW N47 Timing Chain Noise and PicoScope 2204A] | Mechanic Mindset](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/g8U6l_7f-WM/mqdefault.jpg)
Just discovered this channel by accident and am glad I did! you deserve WAY more subs for sure. Excellent video quality, excellent presentation, and great material.
Really good!!
Thanks a ton Matt! Hope you find something useful :) ~Mike
I like how you've spread this series out Mike. It's allowed me to reflect on what you've shown which has helped my learning. I appreciate your hard work!
Ohhh man, I'm glad you didn't mind. It's not ideal, but my current workload didn't let me get the editing done very quickly lol
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Great to see you again, dude. But we don't see these videos nearly enough these days.
Hey, thanks! I know, i'm working on it :)
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
@@GoTechTraining Nice. 👍
Nice job staying cool with “a very large bumblebee” looming in the shop.
Hey Kevin, cool under pressure, haha!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Happy to see you again. 👍👍👍
Hey Carsten, thanks for watching!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
That bee is probably a master tech by now
Hahah could bee 😂
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Thanks for teaching Mike 🙏
Hey Salvador, thanks for watching!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Yes, Sir. Watched & waited, Waited & watched, thru' the series... Always, educational - No Doubt, Your, Expertise :)
Missing links, could be - What was the mileage? On the original engine? Why were chains replaced?
A Post-mortem of That failure, would've been... Million views?
You didn't wanna go there? Knock on The Door? At Midnight? Not a good ad for GM?... FM? :)
Love all videos using the Pico. It seems I don't use mine enough!
Hey Emmett, thanks for watching! I definitly use a 10mm socket more but that's not very interesting. Sharing my PICO diag videos seems to garner more attention. ;)
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Man, Ima have to get a scope. Good stuff Mike...as usual. Thanks
Well done. I don't own a scope yet. But your videos make me want one .
Hey Nelson, thanks for watching! It's really a great tool. Can't go wrong with any scope!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
@@GoTechTraining thanks Mike. I love to alwsy get with new methods to help diagnose and repairs.
Go tech all ways nice and clean video, thank you. Habib Auto all day way from Ghana
Awesome videos like always, great job
Hey Luis, thanks for watching!!!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Hi Mike
Great to see you, hope all is well, watch out for the bees! LOL!
Nice scope patterns. Definitely keepers for techs working on those vehicles!
Hey Mike, thanks for watching! Next video will need one of those cool electronic fly swatter deals!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Keep it up bro 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
Thank you, will do!
Good job, i need a scope for sure, thanks for sharing
Hey Carlos, thanks for watching! A scope is a fantastic tool!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
hey :) nice videos .. Do we have to unplug the vct or vvti actuator when checking the cam and crank correlation ??
Survey DONE ✅
I want a damn T-Shirt MIKE!!.
Need more evap & electrical diagnostic videos
Paul, Eric, & Ivan can’t be the only ppl I watch everyday 😆
Awesome man! Good luck on winning :) I'm working on more vids 😀
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Who is Paul? Drawing a blank! Never mind! Danner is the answer. Thanks anyway.
@@markinkster9257 Paul Danner Scanner Danner
Keep up the good work.
Hey Jordano, thanks for watching!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
U have live videos to to win tshirts u are very good in telling us what u doing in each diagnosis
great video mike...
Thanks a ton!!!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Always good to see you Mike. Hope you and the family are well.
Hey John, thanks, all is well here! Hope the same for you :)
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Great series, thanks. Question on scopes - I'm a DIY mechanic, always wanted to invest in a scope but not able to justify Pico pricing. Are there cheaper options worth having? I know Pico is the gold standard.
Which cam sensor is used to synchronize the spark and fuel timing? I have a no start engine and the only defect found is a bad? Left bank exhaust phaser.
This was live.? Sorry Mike, didn't get my morning warning text from you. Lol. Great Stuff as usual buddy. Always great to see you at work. Cheers Brother. 😉👍🍻
Hey dude, just a premier, not truely live. Thanks man! Cheers!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
@@GoTechTraining Ya ya...kinda what I thought. Just found it funny that it had the live chat box as if it was live. Besides, I figured it was a good reason to give ya crap anyways for not texting me... Live or not. 😂😂😂😂👍🍻
one thing i didnt hear, whether i wasnt paying attention or you didnt say was to disconnect the vvt solenoids so as to get base timing just in case the computer is trying to work the phasers.
That's right Richard! I did forget to mention it.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Interesting video! It would be interesting to redo the test with the sensors unplugged to see if it changes the results. I am totally unfamiliar with these engines. Can you determine if the chains are stretched by looking at live data with a scan tool? Or with bidirectional control, for example call for some amount of advance, perhaps full advance and see what you actually get?
great tips. i am an auto tech in Nevada
Thanks for watching!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
I have a lone p0420 code no driveability issues. Should I get my mechanic to do this test to rule out improper timing as cause of p0420?
Nice one mike. Is there a website where one can check good wave forms when drawing out scope analysis. Am pretty sure this timing wave pattern varies across each brand of vehicles. So in a case where you have an over advanced timing what would the cam signals look like. Would they be coming to the extreme left. Educative I must say
Hey Mayowa, check out Diag.net or the Automotive Waveform group on Facebook for known goods. As far as advance timing, yes, it would shift to the left on the scope.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
You tgink this possible to do timing check on this engine with two channel im guessing you have to do each cam to crank one at a time ?
Hi Mike, I need your help. I got a 2008 Buick Enclave with a 3.6 engine. It was driving fine, but out of nowhere, while pulling the driveway to park the car, it died on me. The vehicle had been maintained with oil changes every 5K miles. I thought it was security system as I got a new key cut but I used the original one and it cranks but no start. Then I thought it might be a fuel pump but I can hear it and I tested the fuel rail pressure, and it was 50-52. I did scan the car before I took the battery for replacement, and I can share the scan report. I checked all fuses and relays under the hood, and nothing was wrong.
I need to ask you for guidance to figure out the car is not starting, please.
Thank you in advance.
Nice to see you again.
Hey, thanks :)
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
would like to see more videos and training using first look pulse sensor thatd be great.
Hey, I don't have a First Look sensor. I have the PICO pressure transducer though. What kind of stuff are you looking to see? In cylinder pressure?
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
i got a 2009 3.6 acadia in with 94k with this same exact pattern both banks and its throwing a p0008 perf. dtc for b1 same thing where the exh does not cross with the missing tooth of the crank im thinking this is not how these are but b1 stretches first due to oiling schematics. and the car you scoped its not far at all from setting a dtc. this seems to be common with these engines on the back/right bank (b1)
Hi Mike. Excellent video. Do you happen to do paid consultations? I have a complex problem with my vehicle. Thanks!
Hi mike I sent you an email. What would the wave pattern look like with a bad timing tensioner. Mine isn’t meeting up with the teeth on the crankshaft when I sync with the exhaust cam. Would a bad tensioner make the cam not meet up with the expected teeth from the left
Hey Mayowa, Yep I got it! Sorry it's been a busy day. I'll work on getting you a response as soon as I can!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
What are the data PIDs you could look at in lieu of a scope? Seems like there would be some PIDs that could provide a smoking gun. Clearly the computer tracks it in the first place, so it would be a matter of simply displaying the variance value.
Hello,
Yes, a lot of manufactures have scan tool PIDs that will show you cam/crank variation, which can be useful for diagnosis. The problem that I have ran into, is some manufactures default the variance data as soon as a code sets. I have seen this on a lot of GMs. But other vehicles like Volkswagen, the data can be very useful.
Good Question!
~Ryan
@@GoTechTraining Is there a PID that owners of these vehicles could reference (assuming the code hasn't set)? Kind of a health check. And it would be good for used car hunting, too.
Hello,
Yeah, it will be called something different depending on vehicle and scan tool. It is usually found in the engine or VVT system data and called something like cam/crank variance, cam/crank sync, or cam/crank offset.
~Ryan
Hi, Is it possible to fake a signal to get past and error or missing component?
Hey Nasir, are you talking about trying to force feed the PCM to ensure it's able to read for a diagnotic process? Or are you talking about fooling the PCM long term? If I were trying to see if the PCM can read a singal, i'd try to steal it from somewhere else. Take the intake cam signal from bank 1 and jump the wire into bank 2, ensuring the PCM can read it. I do it ALL the time with ABS sensors making sure the harness and everything is good...just as a diag though, never longterm.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
It for long term. Got two Renaults with dc4 disk clutch nightmare of a gearbox in there. Thinking of either converting to manual or faking the readout to pcm.
Hmmm not sure on that. Maybe theres a company that makes a sensor to send a spoofed signal. That would be my only guess.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Sir how are you sir I am a professional mechanics I want to buy a pico scope which model should I buy please.
Great video series Mike!!! Always informative. Quick question tho. Did you check the timing with the vvt solenoids unplugged or still plugged in? Which do you recommend or are there times where you would want to check it unplugged vs plugged in? For example to verify vvt solenoid actuation perhaps? Thanks for sharing your knowledge with us Mike. Always appreciated. On my way to the survey now, and can I have that bees autograph? It's famous now. Lol.
Hey Mike, thanks man! So typically you want to check with them unplugged. These were plugged in. I'm relitively sure they don't phase at idle though, on this engine. Not certain though. In best practice, unplug vvt's :)
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
I have a scope trace of all four cam sensors off a Buick I put a remanufactured 3.6 into. I forgot to document which sensors were on which channel, but it does show each of the intake cam signals being identically timed while the exhaust cam signals were off a tad. It never threw a code, so I assume it's a known good. If you want a screen shot or the actual snap on file, which can be viewed on shop stream, I'd be happy to email it to you. If you want it, drop an email address and I'll send it when I have a moment.
Hey Shaun, interesting that it's slightly different. The engine has some "wiggle room" but I wonder if that chain is slightly longer or something?
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
I need a pico
Hey Eduardo, they really are a great too!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
So if the engine will fore up but won't run this is no good for checking if timing chain is out, causing the engine not to run!!
helo mike my question is what if the pcm Advance or retarded timing at idle or at different temperature that will change mi time because i have scope this engine and they are a little different i looking to find a good test, good video thank you.
Part 1:
2011 Chevy Traverse 3.6L With MAJOR Engine Failure! Now What?!
ua-cam.com/video/hE9E3pzenR0/v-deo.htmlsi=o-ZENCQ9KQjsp8yR
Part 2:
How To Replace Timing Chain On Chevy / GM 3.6L V6 - Full Length Removal and Install - With Tips!
ua-cam.com/video/BhDs1GcwRCs/v-deo.htmlsi=66M5AAnGOkmJzXzn
Part 3:
How To Test GM 3.6L Timing Chain Problems With A Labscope - P0008, P0016, P0017 and more
ua-cam.com/video/jHciEodt7lY/v-deo.htmlsi=8VfVlLQO1FLof77z
Too bad the original engine had a sight window on the side of the block because it would have been nice to see if that engine had a worn/stretched chain to check and compare those signals to a known good signals.
Hey Frank, I have to "assume" the old engine was in time considering the chains were installed by some other shop only 2 monthes prior and there was no complaint of a check engine light prior to the BOOM.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
I can't even imagine what goes on in the " cave man " shops . And putting in low end aftermarket parts just adds to the disaster . I would not own these boat anchor engines . You would think if you don't know what you are doing , it's hands off . Putting in a " good used " engine may not get you that far . The only insurance might be conservative synthetic oil changes - and a lot of luck . Great series and information . I guess those " cave man " shops get service data from Tic Tock !
Those d#mn 3.6 always throwing timing codes. I've done so many timing chain.kits on those.
Yeh...they are just a little bit of a problem!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
I need a scope🤦♂️
For sure! Any scope is better than no scope!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
@@GoTechTraining agreed👍
I still think it's time for all manual vehicles and hand signals. LOL
how many drivers now days watch for and see hand signals, let alone brake lights and turn signals? I have given up on using turn indicators and would rather downshift with minimal braking to reverse mind-screw them all back. I very rarely talk on phone or use one at all while driving and all the clowns with their faces buried into said idiot devices makes me want to blow gaskets :))