Hyde lived there to the end of the show and likely beyond since Red and Kitty decided not to move to Florida and Hyde used the money Red put aside as a savings for him to buy Red Packer seasons tickets.
Like Ritchie leaving Happy Days...they stayed around the Cunningham farm for Fonzie. How Happy days limped on for 10 years to become that 70s Show itself is beyond me. Made it all the way to Back to the Future's version of 1955. This is a very similar bro setup to Happy Days. Eric, Hyde, Kelso, Fez Richie, Fonz, Potsy, Ralph
It's really a domino effect to the awful way they ruined the story of Eric. When you took his character and having him reject Donna at the wedding then you totally changed the dynamic.
100% everything that happened in season 8 would have made WAY more sense if DONNA had stood up Eric instead of what we got. She could have given the "I just had a feeling we were making a bug mistske" speech to Eric and kept her in control of her life and relationship with Eric and kept their dynamic. And things from then would have made WAY more sense. Eric going Africa and then not really calling/talking to Donna? Makes sense, he's heartbroken. Kitty mad at Donna? Makes sense, she broke Eric's heart and made him leave to Africa. Donna dating guys that werent nornally her type? Makes sense, she thought she was making a huge mistake with Eric and was trying to find out. They could have made her realize how badly she messed up and would have made her reunion with Eric seem like 2 people coming back together instead of this woman who couldn't function without a guy going back to the guy who basically did everything to show he didn't care about her. And that's where we come to your point. Neither of those characterizations I just described fit either of them. Eric had been in love with her for years. He definitely cared about her. There's no way the Donna we've had the entire time would go back to a guy who treated her the way Eric did. That doesn't fit her personality either. The decisions they gave to Eric made no sense based on the character they had built and ssme with Donna. It was like the writer's room forgot which character they were writing for and switched them.
@@Mewse1203 yeah they could have written him off the show in a respectable manner, instead they botched his and Donna's character which I'd say is pretty damn disrespectful to Laura Prepon tbh.
@@zeableunam Me too having Eric be stood up would have been typical. Its the nice guy finishes lasts thing that we really don't need more of. Everybody seems to forget this takes place in the 70s when some people started moving away from traditional marriage. Him going to Africa was the best thing for him, and i guess for the show too, because its like what, 8 seasons? Yeah thats a good run for a show, no need to prolong it. But they did anyways with one extra season not many wanted...to me theres only 7 seasons, after Eric left the show it felt...empty.
@@TheMegaGamingWizard Yeah I watched season 8 it left me with a sour taste, so I don't acknowledge the last season. In some runs I'll just skip after season 7 to the series finale..
They should have switched Eric and Donna's roles in the wedding walk out. Make it where Donna stands up Eric. It would have made her the one in control like always. She could have given him the "made a big mistake" speech and ot would have made the Kitty/Donna tension make more sense. It would have been a fantastic reason for Eric to go to Africa and that time apart would have her realizing she made a big mistake and it would have made her getting back together at the end with Eric make so much more sense.
Agreed, it makes way more sense that way. The writers probably didn't want to risk damaging Donna's likability. Since Donna (Laura) was staying on the show and Eric(Thoper) was leaving it.
I think they decided against it to avoid making another "Donna left" storyline, but they definitely drove themselves into a corner by making Donna and Eric get engaged in the first place.
Me neither, apparently Laura dyed her hair blonde for her role in "Karla", but they weakly explained the change in universe as Donna changing her hair colour because Jackie thought that her red hair was ugly.
@@trinaq yeah I remember that!Then the show did the oh you're blonde now and way hotter thing. Super lame. She's the biggest reason I like redheads so much lol 😆
never in my life has anyone called Donna a "manic-pixie-dream girl" type...she's supposed to be what she literally is, the "girl next door", the hot one everyone wants to date cuz she's also cool.
She fits the manic pixie dream girl trope in the sense that she propelled Eric's character. But that's it, she had dreams and goals outside of Eric at least in the beginning.
Manic Pixie Girl just means "cool attractive girl with eccentric personality" I don't understand why people find the idea that a woman like that can exist and guys would want that so offensive lol
@@Vivi_9 there's more to it than that. The manic pixie dream girl archetype also represents something that a man wants so bad but can never truly have because they always run away / disappear / lose interest. It's finding this impossibly interesting, quirky, and attractive woman, becoming smitten and often never ending up with them... just being left with the memories to ruminate over and think "if only" or "what if"
They also really messed up what Hyde and Jackie had. If they had just broke up and were on good terms that would have made more sense than having Hyde despise Jackie.
I would love if you guys made the same video but with Jackie! Her character is discussed so little but she actually went through a lot of the same nonsensical changes that Donna did in season 8.
I liked Donna at the beginning, but there were times when she would be completely irrational towards Eric, and everyone else would automatically take her side. She blasted Eric for having two dates with another girl when they were broken up, conveniently forgetting that she had slept with Kelso's brother around the same time.
Nothing women do is wrong, that's why she can justify actual sex after their breakup but not him only going on dates with no physical contact whatsoever.
She never had sex with Casey cause Hyde kept pulling the fire alarm. Her being with Casey makes sense, he was a suave smooth talker that was able to smooth things over, LIKE MANY SHITTY MEN. Which is the whole point to that arc, was Donna learning Casey isn’t good for her.
The problem is the only reason Donna stayed in Point Place was because she wanted to be with Eric and Eric wanted to help out after Red's heart attack. Unfortnately, Topher Grace left but Laura Prepon stayed, and since the show is set in Point Place that's where Donna stayed, even though it didn't make any sense.
It's been years since I've seen the show so maybe they did what I'm about to suggest and I just don't remember it, but it seems to me like they could've spun that into a narrative thread about Donna being (or feeling) stuck in Point Place as a result of sticking around to be with Eric/help out after the heart attack, and use that to explore how Donna got screwed over by that whole situation. As I recall, Donna's an empathetic and altruistic character, so the show could've used that situation to explore that side of her more deeply and explore her mixed feelings of being obligated to help Red and Kitty versus her desire to leave to pursue her dreams and her feelings of resentment that she's stuck in that situation. I think that would've been a perfectly cromulent way to work with the situation where Grace was gone but Prepon was still around.
@@thunder____ kinda off point op pretty much explained it she didn't decide to stay bc of Eric's parents she chose to stay bc she didn't want to leave Eric I mean even when Eric decided to not go off to college so he could help his parents after Red's heart attack Donna still wanted to go to college
Topher Grace actually ruined the entire plotline because he selfishly opted out of a contractual obligation. It's one thing to lose Kelso as a character, they can recover from that, but to lose the lead actor in the final season where the previous season's plotline relies heavily on him being there, the end result is the shitfest we were given for the final season. Topher ruined the entire storyline. They couldn't simply recast him, the backlash would have been bigger than it was although looking back on it, it might have been the best choice for the storyline to continue and make sense. lol
@@panspermiapancakes To be fair to Topher, I can see why he would be ready to leave. After Eric got cold feet at the wedding, it felt like he just meandered all of season 7 until he decided to be a teacher and go to Africa. And while it looks great in comparison to season 8, season 7 isn't really that good in my opinion.
Its interesting how almost every That 70's show actor had a better career after the show than Topher Grace, while he was always the center of the show and it completely fell apart in season 8 because he left to go do bigger things
Agreed, well, aside from Danny Masterson, for obvious reasons. But Topher honestly seems to be doing alright for himself, having a lead role in "Home Economics", and set to return for "That 90's Show" in a guest role.
I always felt like his character needed closure. Now every time we see him on screen he's still Eric Forman, perhaps because he never really finished the character.
@@t221000 That's true, but Michael wasn't really the main character of the show, or at least the central one. I'd say Jim was probably the closest of a main character as he fit the "everyday man" stereotype.
They should have spun off that 70's show instead. Have Hyde, Jackie, Fez, and Donna all move to a bigger city. Jackie and Donna in College as roomates, Fez and Hyde work at the store at first until Fez gets fired/quits and becomes a hair dresser. Randy is hired as the local Jackie or Donna has started dating. Randy now is the local showing evryone around and we can have him introduce his weird friends.
Honestly dude every character was kneecapped. Fez the most. He was kinda pervy before but in season 8 they turned him into an irredeemable perv in my opinion. Everyone just seemed like summaries of themselves.
Which ig is true to how he has been irl. Just a creepy dude. But yea, hated his character sooo much by the end. He always rubbed me the wrong way & I hated how they dismissed his behavior bc he wasnt from there, but by the end I had to skip parts he was in. He never learned
There are TV pervs in lots of shows, Howard in Big Bang, Alan in 2.5 men, and those pervs come across way more pathetic then funny. The difference is Fez the pervert was hilarious, generally came out of nowhere, and Balderama knew how to seem somehow harmless at the same time. Mainly because Fez the perv seemed mostly preoccupied with "solo" acts, and the hints he dropped showed that Fez was so horny he would do almost anything, so long as he was alone.
So true, season 8 was miserable in every sense, character, writing decision. BUT the finale was so good. It's like they threw every stupid idea out the window and wrapped up the series the way it was meant to be. Almost like an apology for the previous episodes of that season and a perfect farewell to an amazing show.
Except it ended wrong. The last thing you should hear, think about what Kelso had to do & why he grabed the helmet, was Hyde say; "Wow, Red really can put his foot up Kelso's ass!"
Well now I’m just reminded how Donna had a sister who was just kind of…disappeared. Such a weird way to get rid of a character. They even acknowledge in the show how she was written off and never mentioned again.
It was season 1. Most shows (especially during that time) would mention a side character (typically a sibling to one of the main’s) but their existence for that episode is just to see how well they fit in & if they take too much attention from the main characters’. She was quite unnecessary & there were so many other characters to get into. Same in Boy Meets World (sibling & other characters), Family Matters and many other shows (gg,glee etc.)
@@robgronotte1 yeah but she was around for a while and then she left. Donna’s sister appeared a single time and then was simply never mentioned after a certain point. They just pretended she never existed, whereas Eric’s sister was actually given a reason as to why she wasn’t around anymore.
@@rusticgiraffe4262 I probably never saw Donna's sister then. They did give a reason for Eric's sister to leave, but then they barely mentioned her, until she suddenly reappeared for awhile. The worst example of this was in Happy Days, where a sibling disappeared after the second season, with no reason given, and was never mentioned again.
@@j.m251yeah sometimes either due to an actor not being available or the show going in a different direction, very minor characters such as siblings who only show up once are phased out.
I'm glad someone finally mentioned that Donna stayed home from college for Eric and then like a year later Eric leaves her and doesn't call her back. Like wut tf that's not Eric.
When I heard that they were going to do a season 8 without Eric I knew it would be a disaster. The Eric-Donna relationship is the very core of the show. Each season can be summed up in terms of it: 1- They start dating 2- They have sex 3- They become official boyfriend-girlfriend 4- They break up 5- They get back together 6- They get engaged 7- They either get married or split for good A season 8 simply has no where to go. And it didn't..
They should have had everyone leave and go to another city to work at one of Hyde's dads record stores. Leave Angie to run the one in Point Place and do a spin off with Hyde, Donna, Fez, Jackie, and have Randy join the cast as the local showing them around.
@@dimunnpabebet7040 We spent most of S8 with Red and Kitty planning to move. Could have started the season with everyone moving to Florida instead. They still could have done all the plot points (except the stupid Hyde/Jackie breakup) they did in S8. But Randy wouldn't have felt out of place if he's the local. Leo could still have shown up randomly. And it would have let them explore some of the bigger city 70's tropes they hadn't done yet.
My wife and I were friends who grew up in the 70’s. She didn’t live next door, we didn’t start dating until we reconnected a few years later. Donna always reminded me her. When the 70s show came on our kids were watching it. Dona was one of my favourite TV Characters. My 70’s girl and I have been married for over 35 years.
@@Ted_Sheckler If you want to avoid reading pointless stories, why are you even visiting UA-cam? How can you complain about something you did that's entirely voluntary?
i think it would have made more sense for Donna to become super angry at Eric eventually because she realizes that she stalled her life for him. And her and Red becoming closer as she and Kitty became estranged.
I think the writers kept a tight leash on the dynamic between Red and Donna, it was father-daughter type stuff but Red never got too chummy with any kid, the only exception being Hyde. Red seemed to have actual respect for Hyde, and they pretty much related man to man. Unlike Eric, who Red rode like a mule, all in an effort trying to make him - well, more like Hyde.
I like it, because in reality, it kinda makes sense (runner-chaser relationship dynamics), and it makes sense Kitty falls into a mother-like role for Donna, since her mother left
She totally wore the pants in their relationship up until he proposed again. Then it slowly transitioned a bit toward him. Ultimately him leaving at the alter and her taking him back shifted their relationship.
Easy. The first 4 years of that show had brilliant scripts and equally brilliant acting. The last four varied from okay to brutally awful scripts. When they were awful the actors knew it,…so their performances suffered. Those first 2 years were incredible because somehow,…despite never experiencing the 70’s themselves, the “kids” captured the essence of the 1970’s perfectly.
I really hated the jokes where every character implies that Eric is far out of Donna's league. Eric may be dorky, but he's still conventionally attractive and friendly, so it just comes off as more mean spirited than funny.
Ion like this. I like it but I don’t. Conventionally unattractive, sure. Eric pursued his life and that’s kind of amazing. I don’t like how they pretended Donna wasn’t a strong character with defining traits of her own, when that’s ALL SHE WAS.
It was a well written way to get us not to completely die inside when the show ended: slowly making us, the spectators to stop watching it on our own or at least being glad it’s over. Bravo to the writers and thanks 😊
Donna was always the character I related to the most. I basically was Donna growing up. Tall, red hair, laid back, unsure of what I wanted, had feminist tendencies and a rocker/lumberjack aesthetic... I even eventually got to marry the StarWars nerd down the street. So you can imagine how I feel about that last season. In my humble opinion, that's really not how her story was supposed to go. They should have ended the show in the 7th season before they lost their characters.
It sounds ridiculous but her no longer being a redhead seems to have turned into a dumb blonde stereotype by the show's end, even if she still maintained some aspects of her personality
Them having Eric abandon Donna, and using it as the reason Kitty also abandons her, was the worst thing they could have done. Having Donna end up with Eric after doing the same thing to her that her mom did was outrageous.
I've watched this show more times than I can count. I'm more familiar with it than I am with any other show. After a while I've come to the conclusion that donna and eric were a very toxic relationship. It was one based on a shared past growing up together, but they both wanted different futures. They both constantly sacrificed the things they wanted just to be together to the point where neither of them were really happy. They weren't nice to each other either. Eric frequently disregarded her feelings but she pretended he was the nicest guy ever, and donna frequently and unfairly got mad at eric at things out of his control, or treated him like garbage, or just generally mean to him, and yet eric and every other character acts like she was the best thing that ever happened to him just because she's more attractive than he is. I like that eric left, and I don't like that they got back together in that last scene. And as a side note about season 8, even though the jackie and fez relationship was extremely stupid, there's a lot of good episodes in season 8, it'sfar from abysmal. The episode where they steal fatso the clown is probably the single funniest episode in the entire show.
Hard agree with everything in this. I just finished the whole show for the 4th time, and I was able to ignore how much I hated Randy in the 8th season. The fatso episode is easily one of my favorites in the whole show. Personally I used to like the Fez/Jackie relationship because it seemed like her character had grown into a better understanding of love, but on rewatch I admit it does seem pretty forced. Plus she didn't seem to emotionally mature beyond that considering her reaction to Fez initially rejecting her.
I agree with your take on their relationship. I think it's not necessarily toxic (that word gets overused. Most things are just bad and yet ppl still want to describe them as toxic), but just a dead horse at this point in their lives. Why would she get back with him a 3rd time when he didn't invite her with him to go to Africa, especially after he stood her up and gave her a half-ass reason why. I don't think they were toxic together, but they definitely shouldn't have offended up BACK together. _That_ ruined their respective character growths. The writers really undid the growth for all of w the characters. It's frustrating because the show goes back to having no direction again. Not the way you want to end an event.
@@MikeyGryder I think that constant intermingling between the friend group is what's really toxic. With how often they broke up and got black together/dated one another, there's no way they'd all still hang out as friends in 5 yrs from when they w were in high school.
Yeah, with the excess of remakes and reboots or whatnot nowadays, I'm not holding my breath. Maybe even 5 years ago I would have been looking forward to it since while not a fan of the show I did watch it when I was in high school. But seeing how the later seasons felt sluggish I think it may flop. Then they are going to add 2020s sensibilities to a show about the 90s, an era in which plenty of us grew up in. I can already guarantee it.
@@rockoorbe2002 Yep and SO many of w these reboots are unnecessary trash. They're just not good. Shows are often a lighting in a bottle, nostalgiafest that can't be recreated.
The problem for me was the lack of verisimilitude in the last few seasons. Donnas actions make less and less sense to where she seems like she's having a nightmare and we're all watching it.
I love watching That 70's show over and over again 🥰 I tend to skip most of season 8 though for all of the reasons you added. It was such an awesome show, I wish it had ended in that way too.
Donna was awesome in the earlier seasons, such a breathe of fresh air and she later grew more miserable and her storylines became more sad...always depending on Eric or another man
In hindsight, I thought the perfect ending for the show was season 5 ep1, especially with the last scene dialogue: "Do you have any idea how much trouble you're in?" "Oh yeah, but it was worth it.". Sure there were a lot of good episodes still, but ending it there would have been such a nice bow to wrap up some arcs while also leaving the mystery for "how does that play out?" for new things it introduced to let you wonder and speculate on your own.
I think the last season should have been spent with Donna rediscovering herself and trying to build her own legacy outside of just 'loving Eric' since that was a stand-out issue they had.
Thank you for breaking down why I dislike the last season of this wonderful show. Donna was always my favorite character and they should have done so much better for her.
This should be called, "The problem with the last season of that 70's show." Every aspect of the show suffered, not just Donna's character arc. I can't blame the writers for not knowing what to do, they should have just ended the show when Topher left. I feel like they actually did Topher a favor by keeping the show going for one more season after he left. If they had just ended the show when he left, they could have pushed the blame onto Topher for leaving. But with the route they took, the show runners got the majority of the heat from fans, even though most fans realize now that Topher leaving was the cause of the awful last season.
I always found it sad that she ruined her future to be with Eric and then they had him ditch her to go worry about his own future. They should have found a way for them to support each other and not have the female character sacrifice everything only to be ditched by the random whims of the guy. That's too much like how real life tends to play out. Donna was all about feminism in the start of the show and then she just suddenly was like "sure boy who I've never let control me or stop me from doing anything, I'll put my entire life on hold for you. Oh, you changed your mind. Cool, I'll just wait here for you to come back"
Honestly I would have written Donna out when she went to California. Donna was always the "I have big dreams" character while Eric was always the "settle down and start a family like Red" character. I think they were good together during the high school years but they were headed in very different directions. Too many shows u-turn on a character's natural exit point because the actor has to stick around and so they try to cram them back into the spot they've outgrown.
In my view of Donna character, I like to think that she moved away from Point Place and went to the college she wanted to go to. She took "hot Donna" and went to California, met an amazing man that didn't make Star Wars references every 5 seconds annnndddd the two of them live happily ever after THE END😊
I still haven't finished the last season of That 70's Show. I saw the first few episodes and skipped the rest, but I did watch the series finale. The last season was just too much. Definitely jumped the shark.
Eric and donna are simply the "will they won't they" couple of that 70s show. Every sitcom has them and they are always over dramatized, otherwise they'd have been together already or thered be no question about their relationship. Its a tv trope that will never go away because humans love drama
When it comes to the show, seasons 1-3 is canon in my mind and I ignore the rest. I love Donna’s strong sense of self and the fact that she always protected her future plans and ambition above all else
Seasons 1-3 are SO GOOD. I loved that their relationship wasn’t perfect and eventually they would reach an impasse where it was going to work. But season 4 ruined the rest of the show for me upon rewatch.
Donna is the girlfriend a lot of us wish we had. And it was really nice how Donna and Foreman's relationship developed in those early seasons. They had the teen relationship a lot of us wish we had. Then the show ruined everything! I will never forgive this show for turning Foreman into a jerk and leaving Donna hanging. WTH??? One other thing, Donna was NEVER a manic pixie dream girl! Zooey Deschanel, I think not. Indeed, sir!
Donna was my favorite tv character growing up Not for any deep, elaborate reason, I just thought she was so funny and great! She’s hardly ever talked about so I’m glad you’ve highlighted her character in a video 😊
One of my favorite moments with Donna was when she was high in the smoke circle and she thought her hands were as big as boxing gloves, and when it cuts to Kelso, you see her fist pop him in the face. Hilarious!
Season 8 could not be saved without Donna and Eric together. But it would have helped to have Donna go back to her natural red hair. I understand that Laura was doing the Karla movie in S7. But why keep her blonde in S8? Big mistake IMO.
Sometimes life happens that way. Maybe Donna was left wanting Eric for who he was. She was his rock, and then he didn't need her anymore. Made her realize she needed him. He loved her and took it all away. That kind of thing breaks you with no tears because you knew it would happen anyway.
I never thought of it like that, you are absolutely right. After Eric and Kelso left, the show went crap. I don't know which was worse trying to replace two characters with one guy or trying to replace Charlie Harper with some weird guy that shows up out of nowhere on Two and a Half Men and tries to save the show. Both failed completely.
I think showing Donna as more vulnerable during the marriage thing was actually a nice change-up for her, because it was something you didn't get it a lot from her. She - like many other characters - was aimless during the last season.
Thought 'That 70 Show' should have been one of those sitcoms that ended with a movie. If you had Topher Grace and Ashton Kutcher two of your heaviest hitters leaving the show then the first thought would have been to end with one more season and close it off with a film it's not like they didn't have the money for it. Just felt like the rest of the series dragged until there was nothing left to finish with.
I don't know about this. Perfect character development is nice on paper, but that's not life. A person who "takes charge" most of the time in life encounter a period where "life takes charge," to see a character struggle with that is quite relatable.
I'm glad I'm not the only one who thought they royally f*cked up the show beyond repair by the end. I definitely would have gone in a completely different direction with the finale season. As much as I love That 70's Show, the finale was sadly just nowhere near up to par with the rest of the show..
wow watching this makes me realize that in ever actually saw the final season. I think i saw a couple episodes but the whole entire narrative of the show just completely fell apart. It went from good to bad quickly
I actually appreciated the fact that several characters left, because that actually happens in real life. People move away and go on with their lives, and you have to go on, too. Also, I don’t see what’s wrong with a character losing their way and acting uncharacteristically when stressful things happen. Uncertainty can really throw you off base, and when you’re young that’s doubly true. Not to mention people just changing over time, after interacting with new people and learning new things. Sometimes people go “backwards” and sometimes they go “forwards” in life. But I never dug the randy character lool
I think its less of "what if she dated Randy" and more of "What if we just replace the main character with this dude named Randy" Even if Donna and Randy never dated, the show still would have gone to flop. But it is a shame they ruined Donna in the process. Honestly, she could have been the one to save the show had they allowed her to be the main character instead of replacing with Randy. She was so independent, she could have run for office or something, or gotten a big name job. Something to drive the plot without just letting everyone fizzle out.
i think donna (and of course the great acting of laura prepon) created an amazing mashup between girl next door and tomboy/one of the boys. like, she was that cool hot girl that liked all the rock bands, a little rebellious, but at the same time she didn't feel the need to dress all girly (as the girl next door trope usually portrays them in a hyperfeminine vibe), she genuinely liked silly jokes and pranks, she was a little taller. i feel like they never tried to push her as the dream girl that was popular and everyone wanted, but she was different and cool and hot and people liked her in a more natural way. i felt a lot for her ending, because she was a strong feminist icon and they stripped down those characteristics and gave her this sad ending, no college, a boyfriend that did not match her personality at all, basically no family. i hated it, but they getting back together in the ends makes sense ONLY CONSIDERING that eric 100% lowered her self steem and expectations by not showing up to their wedding, not calling her after moving to africa, avoiding her but keeping her hanging on, she had already given up on college because of him, so by the end she was so sad and lonely and with no real goals anymore that she rushed at the slightest sign of affection that eric gave her. this would happen in real life for sure, but it only makes sense here because they put her character in this position, instead of giving her a storyline moving on with her life.
I am so glad for me ended the series after season 7. I always liked Donnas Character, even when she was irrational. But what I don't understand why the writes broke up Hyde and Jackie. In my headcanon they are still together and rocking the place😀
The show did got boring in the end, but let's face it, it's absolutely possible and real to see someone be something for yeara and then something happens and an 180 happens, it's very very common to see people that lead become the ones that follow, or hide, because of insecurities, failure to launch, heartbreak, etc... I've seen many times, expectations became a burden and people throw away everything and run, and on the other hand the people that stay sometimes became lost for some time, the show only last a couple years after he left, give Donna a break, and some time to find herself, also, nobody needs to have the same type for the rest of their life, and stuff that you dislike when you are a teen might be what attracts you when you grow a bit, and even if someone hurts you sometimes what they where to you before is just enough, specially if she understands that he was just lost and afraid. What I'm saying is that the show might have gotten a bit boring, but it wasn't because it was a bad plot to work with, but because they work it badly instead.
It's obvious that Eric and Donna would eventually get back together on That '90s Show, which makes EVERYTHING that happened in Season 8 of That '70s Show seem like a dream! A horrible dream!
It's EZ, just make her take over Eric Foreman's role as the voice of reason, instead of carrying water for his ghost. I think you even could have her still date Randy, but only as a "she was running away from the Eric type, and kinda fell for him BECAUSE he reminds him of her father, but then their breakup happens because she comes to her senses and remembers the last thing she wants is to be with someone like her father" Thanks for all your work on this video. It provided a lot of insight. If I never have the money to put out my own stuff, hopefully someone can use this.
Man, you’re right it’s crazy how people don’t stay the exact same people they are, when they’re in high school versus when they’re in adult and experiencing life outside of just their circle of friends and their high school. You are so right they ruin this character by allowing her to evolve out of the little box that they created in the first few seasons into an actual human being, who has real flaws and counter emotions to the emotions that she either does feel or should be feeling, it’s crazy it’s like they almost turned her into a human being instead of a TV character😂
Idk what you're talking about him doing Spiderman 3 was a highlight and don't blame the actor for wanting to explore other options that's the show runners fault for the lower quality of last seasons
I absolutely hated that season and I detested Randy. That show was ruined for me. You very well summed it all up. Donna was also my favorite character on the show.
The analysis here is pretty spot on and it reminds me how I really started almost hating the show towards the end. That being said, I am still excited to look back and see how they do with the Netflix sequel revival...
I loved energy between Donna and Eric, I liked that she was taller, stronger and more brave than him, I kinda end up in simillar relationship, lol. Donna and Hyde were my favourite characters but I stopped watching it in the middle of 6 or 7th season so yeah I'm glad that I never finnished this show, I wish I would do the same with How I met your mother...
The moment that Eric left her at the altar it shook her entire sense of security. She had been the one with the power their entire relationship. She thought he was a sure thing. It was a shift in power dynamics. Now that she has lost the power psychologically she would be desperate to gain back that sense of security. With Eric gone it made sense that she went for someone that everyone said it was better than Eric but it fell flat so she ended up getting back with Eric when he came back
Jackie and fezz was perfect because it showed her transition from a superficial rich girl to a fully formed determined young woman who decided fez was the one who always cared about her the most.
Man, I would love to see more videos on That 70s Show. I love Friends and The Office as much as anyone, but I'd happily trade some videos on Mondler and the fall of he last seasons of The Office for a video on what happened to Donna's mom, the Evolution of Jackie or the failed love triangle with Eric, Hyde and Donna. That'd be badass, man! Keep up the Good job
Some excellent insights about the Donna character. Off topic question. Was Fez the worst friend in the world to Eric? I know it's a comedy but I can't think of a single instance where he helped Eric but can think of multiple times he undercut him.
I think all of this was so unsatisfying because it was too CLOSE to reality and not enough of the fantasy we expect from TV relationships. We expect things to make sense in TV, but in real life things rarely do, especially in entities as complex as romantic relationships.
I think I would've had her fall out of love with Eric after the first time he really hurts her. They'd make up, but they wouldn't date; they'd just stay friends. After that I feel like it'd be cool to explore more of her independent nature and have her focus on something career-related. And have her find someone who is truly her equal and cares about her that is completely disconnected from the main group. Let me know what you guys think 🤷🏾♀️.
While watching this I noticed two bloopers right at the 2:03 mark. In the first shot of him holding up a beer you can't see the label. Then they cut to a different angle and you can not only see the label but it is upside down !
Y'all KNOW they're all coming back (well, except Masterson/Hyde...for obvious reasons) for That 90's Show, right? They've already wrapped filming the 10 episodes and it's supposed to air on Netflix sometime next year.
@@alexk9295 i thought the guy who played Red passed away? And why would they be the regular reoccurring characters, and not the main cast? Wouldn't they be too old by that point?
Nah Donna and Hyde are the first ppl I think about when I think of this show. The last season felt was a completely different show. Unfortunately. If you notice, her hair gets lighter and lighter while her character slowly dies up to when she went full blonde.
This is so silly of me but… I think they went to see Ted Nugent, not Todd Rundgren. I remember the ‘Tad Nugent’ failed bootleg shirts they made. Would have been based for them to see Rundgren though
The final season shouldn’t have happened. I’m glad that it did but after watching this, I didn’t even think about it this deep. That final season didn’t need to happen.
Zoey 101 weirdly did the exact same thing, replacing Chase with that Gary Stu character that immediately dates Zoey til Chase returns in the last episode.
Zoey 101 was horrible. Who is Zoey? Zoey is a perfect, wonderful person who has no real flaws except for, maybe, she is too nice and perfect. Everyone loves her and if you don't like her, then you are a bad person. It was a stupid show.
That 70's Show was my second favorite TV show of all time. It was ruined by Danny and how most of the other actors reacted to him being locked up. I have respect for her, Kurtwood and Topher, but the rest of the main cast can eff off.
She was part of the Scientology clique that made it possible for Masterson to do what he did for so long. Topher Grace was the only normal adult of the gang.
Other than Hyde, I never got why is everyone still hanging out at Eric's house if he isn't even there
Because Hyde lived there
Hyde lived there to the end of the show and likely beyond since Red and Kitty decided not to move to Florida and Hyde used the money Red put aside as a savings for him to buy Red Packer seasons tickets.
these questions might be answered in the coming 90s show
Like Ritchie leaving Happy Days...they stayed around the Cunningham farm for Fonzie. How Happy days limped on for 10 years to become that 70s Show itself is beyond me. Made it all the way to Back to the Future's version of 1955.
This is a very similar bro setup to Happy Days.
Eric, Hyde, Kelso, Fez
Richie, Fonz, Potsy, Ralph
Donna was the difference in the setup. Donna was the smart one. She made things happen. She was the magic character.
It's really a domino effect to the awful way they ruined the story of Eric. When you took his character and having him reject Donna at the wedding then you totally changed the dynamic.
100% everything that happened in season 8 would have made WAY more sense if DONNA had stood up Eric instead of what we got. She could have given the "I just had a feeling we were making a bug mistske" speech to Eric and kept her in control of her life and relationship with Eric and kept their dynamic. And things from then would have made WAY more sense.
Eric going Africa and then not really calling/talking to Donna? Makes sense, he's heartbroken. Kitty mad at Donna? Makes sense, she broke Eric's heart and made him leave to Africa. Donna dating guys that werent nornally her type? Makes sense, she thought she was making a huge mistake with Eric and was trying to find out.
They could have made her realize how badly she messed up and would have made her reunion with Eric seem like 2 people coming back together instead of this woman who couldn't function without a guy going back to the guy who basically did everything to show he didn't care about her.
And that's where we come to your point. Neither of those characterizations I just described fit either of them. Eric had been in love with her for years. He definitely cared about her. There's no way the Donna we've had the entire time would go back to a guy who treated her the way Eric did. That doesn't fit her personality either. The decisions they gave to Eric made no sense based on the character they had built and ssme with Donna.
It was like the writer's room forgot which character they were writing for and switched them.
@@Mewse1203 yeah they could have written him off the show in a respectable manner, instead they botched his and Donna's character which I'd say is pretty damn disrespectful to Laura Prepon tbh.
I dunno, I liked that he rejected Donna..
@@zeableunam Me too having Eric be stood up would have been typical. Its the nice guy finishes lasts thing that we really don't need more of. Everybody seems to forget this takes place in the 70s when some people started moving away from traditional marriage. Him going to Africa was the best thing for him, and i guess for the show too, because its like what, 8 seasons? Yeah thats a good run for a show, no need to prolong it. But they did anyways with one extra season not many wanted...to me theres only 7 seasons, after Eric left the show it felt...empty.
@@TheMegaGamingWizard Yeah I watched season 8 it left me with a sour taste, so I don't acknowledge the last season. In some runs I'll just skip after season 7 to the series finale..
this show not only ruined donna's character but everyone's in the final season smh.
They reversed everyone’s character development
@@noelle2k3 yep like clockwork.
I agree. it ruined everybody’s character development
Fox tends to do that ....look how mad tv went out ....they yank the big budget and make them figure it out with less cash lol
Hyde marrying a stripper would be expected in the Allier seasons but in the last season it just feels misplaced
They should have switched Eric and Donna's roles in the wedding walk out. Make it where Donna stands up Eric. It would have made her the one in control like always. She could have given him the "made a big mistake" speech and ot would have made the Kitty/Donna tension make more sense. It would have been a fantastic reason for Eric to go to Africa and that time apart would have her realizing she made a big mistake and it would have made her getting back together at the end with Eric make so much more sense.
Ya that definitely flows alot better.
Agreed, it makes way more sense that way. The writers probably didn't want to risk damaging Donna's likability. Since Donna (Laura) was staying on the show and Eric(Thoper) was leaving it.
This feels like Eric being the one not showing up was a typo.
I think they decided against it to avoid making another "Donna left" storyline, but they definitely drove themselves into a corner by making Donna and Eric get engaged in the first place.
If only they did that. Now if she gets back with Eric she'll seem whipped because Eric turned out to be a douche.
Still haven't gotten over her getting rid of the red hair 🥲
Me neither, apparently Laura dyed her hair blonde for her role in "Karla", but they weakly explained the change in universe as Donna changing her hair colour because Jackie thought that her red hair was ugly.
@@trinaq yeah I remember that!Then the show did the oh you're blonde now and way hotter thing. Super lame. She's the biggest reason I like redheads so much lol 😆
This.
Yeah, Donna went blonde while Lily on “How I Met Your Mother” went brunette. It was quite sad for guys like me who have a thing for redheads. 😢
I thought she looked best as a blonde and hated her as a brunette on OITNB. She also looked great as a red head.
never in my life has anyone called Donna a "manic-pixie-dream girl" type...she's supposed to be what she literally is, the "girl next door", the hot one everyone wants to date cuz she's also cool.
She fits the manic pixie dream girl trope in the sense that she propelled Eric's character. But that's it, she had dreams and goals outside of Eric at least in the beginning.
Manic Pixie Girl just means "cool attractive girl with eccentric personality" I don't understand why people find the idea that a woman like that can exist and guys would want that so offensive lol
@@faycoleman9023 Having 1 characteristic of the criteria doesn't mean she fits it. 😂
@@Vivi_9 "eccentric" being the key word there. Donna's more like "the cool girl", not like indifferent & quirky the way manic pixie dream girls are.
@@Vivi_9 there's more to it than that. The manic pixie dream girl archetype also represents something that a man wants so bad but can never truly have because they always run away / disappear / lose interest. It's finding this impossibly interesting, quirky, and attractive woman, becoming smitten and often never ending up with them... just being left with the memories to ruminate over and think "if only" or "what if"
They also really messed up what Hyde and Jackie had. If they had just broke up and were on good terms that would have made more sense than having Hyde despise Jackie.
And brought a whole new level of emotional investment growth and maturity to Hyde
They actually *were* supposed to get married. Season 8? What's that? Doesn't exist.
He always did so they only went where they started
I would love if you guys made the same video but with Jackie! Her character is discussed so little but she actually went through a lot of the same nonsensical changes that Donna did in season 8.
i agree. Jackie’s whole character growth arc was her choosing to be with Fez. Which seemed weak.
Greenfield High because like she was actually 14 when this started
@@hankkingsley9300 Jackie was not 14 though, Mila was, plus that makes no sense as being the reason why they ruined her character later in the series.
Jackie was my favorite
I liked Donna at the beginning, but there were times when she would be completely irrational towards Eric, and everyone else would automatically take her side. She blasted Eric for having two dates with another girl when they were broken up, conveniently forgetting that she had slept with Kelso's brother around the same time.
Her with kelsos brother didn’t make sense to me
She was also a bad influence on Erik, always convincing him to do things he didnt want to do lol
Nothing women do is wrong, that's why she can justify actual sex after their breakup but not him only going on dates with no physical contact whatsoever.
She never had sex with Casey cause Hyde kept pulling the fire alarm. Her being with Casey makes sense, he was a suave smooth talker that was able to smooth things over, LIKE MANY SHITTY MEN. Which is the whole point to that arc, was Donna learning Casey isn’t good for her.
Tf are you idiots talking about she didn't fuck Casey Kelso (Hyde stopped it from happening).
The problem is the only reason Donna stayed in Point Place was because she wanted to be with Eric and Eric wanted to help out after Red's heart attack. Unfortnately, Topher Grace left but Laura Prepon stayed, and since the show is set in Point Place that's where Donna stayed, even though it didn't make any sense.
It's been years since I've seen the show so maybe they did what I'm about to suggest and I just don't remember it, but it seems to me like they could've spun that into a narrative thread about Donna being (or feeling) stuck in Point Place as a result of sticking around to be with Eric/help out after the heart attack, and use that to explore how Donna got screwed over by that whole situation. As I recall, Donna's an empathetic and altruistic character, so the show could've used that situation to explore that side of her more deeply and explore her mixed feelings of being obligated to help Red and Kitty versus her desire to leave to pursue her dreams and her feelings of resentment that she's stuck in that situation. I think that would've been a perfectly cromulent way to work with the situation where Grace was gone but Prepon was still around.
@@thunder____ kinda off point op pretty much explained it she didn't decide to stay bc of Eric's parents she chose to stay bc she didn't want to leave Eric I mean even when Eric decided to not go off to college so he could help his parents after Red's heart attack Donna still wanted to go to college
Topher Grace actually ruined the entire plotline because he selfishly opted out of a contractual obligation. It's one thing to lose Kelso as a character, they can recover from that, but to lose the lead actor in the final season where the previous season's plotline relies heavily on him being there, the end result is the shitfest we were given for the final season. Topher ruined the entire storyline. They couldn't simply recast him, the backlash would have been bigger than it was although looking back on it, it might have been the best choice for the storyline to continue and make sense. lol
@@panspermiapancakes To be fair to Topher, I can see why he would be ready to leave. After Eric got cold feet at the wedding, it felt like he just meandered all of season 7 until he decided to be a teacher and go to Africa.
And while it looks great in comparison to season 8, season 7 isn't really that good in my opinion.
yep for all the little clever twists on the genre it's basically a sitcom with 3 or 4 settings and it stayed true to that.
Its interesting how almost every That 70's show actor had a better career after the show than Topher Grace, while he was always the center of the show and it completely fell apart in season 8 because he left to go do bigger things
Agreed, well, aside from Danny Masterson, for obvious reasons. But Topher honestly seems to be doing alright for himself, having a lead role in "Home Economics", and set to return for "That 90's Show" in a guest role.
He's great ik the Black Klansmen
It's funny how this was his biggest role while the guys from a CW show stayed on for many many years, leading them to lose roles such as the Avengers.
I always felt like his character needed closure. Now every time we see him on screen he's still Eric Forman, perhaps because he never really finished the character.
Dv
It was another case of "They should've ended the show after the main actor leaves".
The Office had so many funny supporting characters that it was still good after Carell quit. But not in this show.
@@t221000 That's true, but Michael wasn't really the main character of the show, or at least the central one. I'd say Jim was probably the closest of a main character as he fit the "everyday man" stereotype.
Probably the channel forced them to do another season due to whatever contract they had with the creators and producers of the show
They should have spun off that 70's show instead. Have Hyde, Jackie, Fez, and Donna all move to a bigger city. Jackie and Donna in College as roomates, Fez and Hyde work at the store at first until Fez gets fired/quits and becomes a hair dresser. Randy is hired as the local Jackie or Donna has started dating. Randy now is the local showing evryone around and we can have him introduce his weird friends.
@@kyleellis1825 they should have done that because they really needed to get out of that basement. But the writers took the lazy route instead
Eric's leaving wasn't so bad but when Kelso left, it became sad. The whole Fez, Jackie thing was the worst part of it.
Yeah that 70s show became really desperate.
Hah! Out of all her relationships Fez was the only one that could control Jackie. That's the part I found hilarious.
The worst part was Randy
Honestly dude every character was kneecapped. Fez the most. He was kinda pervy before but in season 8 they turned him into an irredeemable perv in my opinion. Everyone just seemed like summaries of themselves.
Which ig is true to how he has been irl. Just a creepy dude.
But yea, hated his character sooo much by the end. He always rubbed me the wrong way & I hated how they dismissed his behavior bc he wasnt from there, but by the end I had to skip parts he was in. He never learned
@@j.m251 they should just delete season 8
There are TV pervs in lots of shows, Howard in Big Bang, Alan in 2.5 men, and those pervs come across way more pathetic then funny. The difference is Fez the pervert was hilarious, generally came out of nowhere, and Balderama knew how to seem somehow harmless at the same time. Mainly because Fez the perv seemed mostly preoccupied with "solo" acts, and the hints he dropped showed that Fez was so horny he would do almost anything, so long as he was alone.
So true, season 8 was miserable in every sense, character, writing decision. BUT the finale was so good. It's like they threw every stupid idea out the window and wrapped up the series the way it was meant to be. Almost like an apology for the previous episodes of that season and a perfect farewell to an amazing show.
Oh man,that Randy dude? Ruined the show.
@Kathy Yore it's like they put out an open call in Hollywood for the most douchey looking guy ever, and then cast the winner
Except they make the entire season before they release the first episode goofball.
The only good thing in season 8 was Bob vs Fatso burger
Except it ended wrong. The last thing you should hear, think about what Kelso had to do & why he grabed the helmet, was Hyde say; "Wow, Red really can put his foot up Kelso's ass!"
Well now I’m just reminded how Donna had a sister who was just kind of…disappeared. Such a weird way to get rid of a character. They even acknowledge in the show how she was written off and never mentioned again.
It was season 1. Most shows (especially during that time) would mention a side character (typically a sibling to one of the main’s) but their existence for that episode is just to see how well they fit in & if they take too much attention from the main characters’. She was quite unnecessary & there were so many other characters to get into. Same in Boy Meets World (sibling & other characters), Family Matters and many other shows (gg,glee etc.)
Eric's sister disappeared too, and she was a major role in the beginning.
@@robgronotte1 yeah but she was around for a while and then she left. Donna’s sister appeared a single time and then was simply never mentioned after a certain point. They just pretended she never existed, whereas Eric’s sister was actually given a reason as to why she wasn’t around anymore.
@@rusticgiraffe4262 I probably never saw Donna's sister then. They did give a reason for Eric's sister to leave, but then they barely mentioned her, until she suddenly reappeared for awhile.
The worst example of this was in Happy Days, where a sibling disappeared after the second season, with no reason given, and was never mentioned again.
@@j.m251yeah sometimes either due to an actor not being available or the show going in a different direction, very minor characters such as siblings who only show up once are phased out.
I'm glad someone finally mentioned that Donna stayed home from college for Eric and then like a year later Eric leaves her and doesn't call her back. Like wut tf that's not Eric.
When I heard that they were going to do a season 8 without Eric I knew it would be a disaster. The Eric-Donna relationship is the very core of the show. Each season can be summed up in terms of it:
1- They start dating
2- They have sex
3- They become official boyfriend-girlfriend
4- They break up
5- They get back together
6- They get engaged
7- They either get married or split for good
A season 8 simply has no where to go. And it didn't..
They should have had everyone leave and go to another city to work at one of Hyde's dads record stores. Leave Angie to run the one in Point Place and do a spin off with Hyde, Donna, Fez, Jackie, and have Randy join the cast as the local showing them around.
@@kyleellis1825wouldve made more sense
@@dimunnpabebet7040 We spent most of S8 with Red and Kitty planning to move. Could have started the season with everyone moving to Florida instead.
They still could have done all the plot points (except the stupid Hyde/Jackie breakup) they did in S8. But Randy wouldn't have felt out of place if he's the local.
Leo could still have shown up randomly. And it would have let them explore some of the bigger city 70's tropes they hadn't done yet.
My wife and I were friends who grew up in the 70’s. She didn’t live next door, we didn’t start dating until we reconnected a few years later. Donna always reminded me her. When the 70s show came on our kids were watching it.
Dona was one of my favourite TV Characters. My 70’s girl and I have been married for over 35 years.
What a terrible, pointless story. I regret having read it.
@@Ted_Sheckler If you want to avoid reading pointless stories, why are you even visiting UA-cam? How can you complain about something you did that's entirely voluntary?
So?we don't care old man
Long distance fictional historical comedy sitcom relationships are hard.
Aint that the truth
"I wrote that country song!"
i think it would have made more sense for Donna to become super angry at Eric eventually because she realizes that she stalled her life for him. And her and Red becoming closer as she and Kitty became estranged.
I think the writers kept a tight leash on the dynamic between Red and Donna, it was father-daughter type stuff but Red never got too chummy with any kid, the only exception being Hyde. Red seemed to have actual respect for Hyde, and they pretty much related man to man. Unlike Eric, who Red rode like a mule, all in an effort trying to make him - well, more like Hyde.
I like it, because in reality, it kinda makes sense (runner-chaser relationship dynamics), and it makes sense Kitty falls into a mother-like role for Donna, since her mother left
Donna thought she was in control but never really had control over anything. Thinking Eric wasn't in control was her biggest downfall.
She totally wore the pants in their relationship up until he proposed again. Then it slowly transitioned a bit toward him. Ultimately him leaving at the alter and her taking him back shifted their relationship.
I never understood how Randy was constantly hanging out in the Foremans basement while not even knowing Eric
Easy.
The first 4 years of that show had brilliant scripts and equally brilliant acting. The last four varied from okay to brutally awful scripts. When they were awful the actors knew it,…so their performances suffered.
Those first 2 years were incredible because somehow,…despite never experiencing the 70’s themselves, the “kids” captured the essence of the 1970’s perfectly.
You gotta remember at that point in time, Hyde was living with the Foreman's still, which is why the basement was still the main hangout spot
I really hated the jokes where every character implies that Eric is far out of Donna's league. Eric may be dorky, but he's still conventionally attractive and friendly, so it just comes off as more mean spirited than funny.
I don't understand where they got that from, she isn't anything amazingly special... like she had a golden vagina or something
Ion like this. I like it but I don’t. Conventionally unattractive, sure. Eric pursued his life and that’s kind of amazing. I don’t like how they pretended Donna wasn’t a strong character with defining traits of her own, when that’s ALL SHE WAS.
He is not conventionally attractive. He's not ugly or anything but that's... a little too generous.
She's also not all that lol
A lot of the jokes on That ‘70s Show were mean spirited. That was kind of the point.
It was a well written way to get us not to completely die inside when the show ended: slowly making us, the spectators to stop watching it on our own or at least being glad it’s over. Bravo to the writers and thanks 😊
Donna was always my favorite character. They sure screwed up her character in the end. I hated it when she went blonde
Donna was always the character I related to the most. I basically was Donna growing up. Tall, red hair, laid back, unsure of what I wanted, had feminist tendencies and a rocker/lumberjack aesthetic... I even eventually got to marry the StarWars nerd down the street. So you can imagine how I feel about that last season. In my humble opinion, that's really not how her story was supposed to go. They should have ended the show in the 7th season before they lost their characters.
"Feminist tendencies" yikes lol
@@anthonygarcia8749 "had."
Hopefully you weren't as much of a selfish bitch as her
This is still one of the best romances on television.
It sounds ridiculous but her no longer being a redhead seems to have turned into a dumb blonde stereotype by the show's end, even if she still maintained some aspects of her personality
Them having Eric abandon Donna, and using it as the reason Kitty also abandons her, was the worst thing they could have done. Having Donna end up with Eric after doing the same thing to her that her mom did was outrageous.
I've watched this show more times than I can count. I'm more familiar with it than I am with any other show. After a while I've come to the conclusion that donna and eric were a very toxic relationship. It was one based on a shared past growing up together, but they both wanted different futures. They both constantly sacrificed the things they wanted just to be together to the point where neither of them were really happy. They weren't nice to each other either. Eric frequently disregarded her feelings but she pretended he was the nicest guy ever, and donna frequently and unfairly got mad at eric at things out of his control, or treated him like garbage, or just generally mean to him, and yet eric and every other character acts like she was the best thing that ever happened to him just because she's more attractive than he is. I like that eric left, and I don't like that they got back together in that last scene. And as a side note about season 8, even though the jackie and fez relationship was extremely stupid, there's a lot of good episodes in season 8, it'sfar from abysmal. The episode where they steal fatso the clown is probably the single funniest episode in the entire show.
Hard agree with everything in this. I just finished the whole show for the 4th time, and I was able to ignore how much I hated Randy in the 8th season. The fatso episode is easily one of my favorites in the whole show. Personally I used to like the Fez/Jackie relationship because it seemed like her character had grown into a better understanding of love, but on rewatch I admit it does seem pretty forced. Plus she didn't seem to emotionally mature beyond that considering her reaction to Fez initially rejecting her.
“See you there lard ass!!” 🤣🤣
I agree with your take on their relationship. I think it's not necessarily toxic (that word gets overused. Most things are just bad and yet ppl still want to describe them as toxic), but just a dead horse at this point in their lives. Why would she get back with him a 3rd time when he didn't invite her with him to go to Africa, especially after he stood her up and gave her a half-ass reason why.
I don't think they were toxic together, but they definitely shouldn't have offended up BACK together. _That_ ruined their respective character growths.
The writers really undid the growth for all of w the characters. It's frustrating because the show goes back to having no direction again. Not the way you want to end an event.
@@MikeyGryder I think that constant intermingling between the friend group is what's really toxic. With how often they broke up and got black together/dated one another, there's no way they'd all still hang out as friends in 5 yrs from when they w were in high school.
Wholeheartedly with the Eric n Donna part. Vehemently disagree with the Season 8 part.
I hope That '90s Show throws a good amount of shade at season 8.
Yeah, with the excess of remakes and reboots or whatnot nowadays, I'm not holding my breath. Maybe even 5 years ago I would have been looking forward to it since while not a fan of the show I did watch it when I was in high school. But seeing how the later seasons felt sluggish I think it may flop. Then they are going to add 2020s sensibilities to a show about the 90s, an era in which plenty of us grew up in. I can already guarantee it.
@@rockoorbe2002 Yep and SO many of w these reboots are unnecessary trash. They're just not good. Shows are often a lighting in a bottle, nostalgiafest that can't be recreated.
The problem for me was the lack of verisimilitude in the last few seasons. Donnas actions make less and less sense to where she seems like she's having a nightmare and we're all watching it.
You only used that word so I would have to Google it. Well played...
One of my favourite shows growing up
I love watching That 70's show over and over again 🥰 I tend to skip most of season 8 though for all of the reasons you added. It was such an awesome show, I wish it had ended in that way too.
I still want to know what happened to Donna's little sister. We met her once then she was gone forever.
Donna was awesome in the earlier seasons, such a breathe of fresh air and she later grew more miserable and her storylines became more sad...always depending on Eric or another man
In hindsight, I thought the perfect ending for the show was season 5 ep1, especially with the last scene dialogue: "Do you have any idea how much trouble you're in?" "Oh yeah, but it was worth it.".
Sure there were a lot of good episodes still, but ending it there would have been such a nice bow to wrap up some arcs while also leaving the mystery for "how does that play out?" for new things it introduced to let you wonder and speculate on your own.
Season 8 hurt in so many different ways. I could never get over that last episode
I think the last season should have been spent with Donna rediscovering herself and trying to build her own legacy outside of just 'loving Eric' since that was a stand-out issue they had.
Thank you for breaking down why I dislike the last season of this wonderful show. Donna was always my favorite character and they should have done so much better for her.
This should be called, "The problem with the last season of that 70's show." Every aspect of the show suffered, not just Donna's character arc. I can't blame the writers for not knowing what to do, they should have just ended the show when Topher left. I feel like they actually did Topher a favor by keeping the show going for one more season after he left. If they had just ended the show when he left, they could have pushed the blame onto Topher for leaving. But with the route they took, the show runners got the majority of the heat from fans, even though most fans realize now that Topher leaving was the cause of the awful last season.
I always found it sad that she ruined her future to be with Eric and then they had him ditch her to go worry about his own future. They should have found a way for them to support each other and not have the female character sacrifice everything only to be ditched by the random whims of the guy. That's too much like how real life tends to play out. Donna was all about feminism in the start of the show and then she just suddenly was like "sure boy who I've never let control me or stop me from doing anything, I'll put my entire life on hold for you. Oh, you changed your mind. Cool, I'll just wait here for you to come back"
Well she did it was the mentality of the mid century back then
They're only kids, they have their entire lives to get things together. Not like college is only accessible to 18 year olds
Because feminists are cool? Good god.
Man, I loved this show so much! Until the later seasons 😢
_"Donna Pinciotti might not be the first character you think of when you picture That 70s Show."_ -0:42
In what world?
Honestly I would have written Donna out when she went to California. Donna was always the "I have big dreams" character while Eric was always the "settle down and start a family like Red" character. I think they were good together during the high school years but they were headed in very different directions.
Too many shows u-turn on a character's natural exit point because the actor has to stick around and so they try to cram them back into the spot they've outgrown.
In my view of Donna character, I like to think that she moved away from Point Place and went to the college she wanted to go to. She took "hot Donna" and went to California, met an amazing man that didn't make Star Wars references every 5 seconds annnndddd the two of them live happily ever after THE END😊
I still haven't finished the last season of That 70's Show. I saw the first few episodes and skipped the rest, but I did watch the series finale. The last season was just too much. Definitely jumped the shark.
Eric and donna are simply the "will they won't they" couple of that 70s show. Every sitcom has them and they are always over dramatized, otherwise they'd have been together already or thered be no question about their relationship. Its a tv trope that will never go away because humans love drama
When it comes to the show, seasons 1-3 is canon in my mind and I ignore the rest.
I love Donna’s strong sense of self and the fact that she always protected her future plans and ambition above all else
Seasons 1-3 are SO GOOD. I loved that their relationship wasn’t perfect and eventually they would reach an impasse where it was going to work. But season 4 ruined the rest of the show for me upon rewatch.
I always felt this way !! Donna was always my favorite characters and looked up to her so much growing up. Thank you for this video !!! 💜💜💜
Donna is the girlfriend a lot of us wish we had.
And it was really nice how Donna and Foreman's relationship developed in those early seasons. They had the teen relationship a lot of us wish we had.
Then the show ruined everything! I will never forgive this show for turning Foreman into a jerk and leaving Donna hanging. WTH???
One other thing, Donna was NEVER a manic pixie dream girl! Zooey Deschanel, I think not. Indeed, sir!
Donna was my favorite tv character growing up Not for any deep, elaborate reason, I just thought she was so funny and great! She’s hardly ever talked about so I’m glad you’ve highlighted her character in a video 😊
One of my favorite moments with Donna was when she was high in the smoke circle and she thought her hands were as big as boxing gloves, and when it cuts to Kelso, you see her fist pop him in the face. Hilarious!
Season 8 could not be saved without Donna and Eric together. But it would have helped to have Donna go back to her natural red hair. I understand that Laura was doing the Karla movie in S7. But why keep her blonde in S8? Big mistake IMO.
Sometimes life happens that way. Maybe Donna was left wanting Eric for who he was. She was his rock, and then he didn't need her anymore. Made her realize she needed him. He loved her and took it all away. That kind of thing breaks you with no tears because you knew it would happen anyway.
I never thought of it like that, you are absolutely right. After Eric and Kelso left, the show went crap. I don't know which was worse trying to replace two characters with one guy or trying to replace Charlie Harper with some weird guy that shows up out of nowhere on Two and a Half Men and tries to save the show. Both failed completely.
I think showing Donna as more vulnerable during the marriage thing was actually a nice change-up for her, because it was something you didn't get it a lot from her. She - like many other characters - was aimless during the last season.
Thought 'That 70 Show' should have been one of those sitcoms that ended with a movie. If you had Topher Grace and Ashton Kutcher two of your heaviest hitters leaving the show then the first thought would have been to end with one more season and close it off with a film it's not like they didn't have the money for it. Just felt like the rest of the series dragged until there was nothing left to finish with.
I don't know about this. Perfect character development is nice on paper, but that's not life. A person who "takes charge" most of the time in life encounter a period where "life takes charge," to see a character struggle with that is quite relatable.
When I was watching this show, Donna was the love of my life. She still is. I'd be lucky to have a girlfriend/wife like her.
Touch some grass bro
5:44 - we're just going to ignore the missing windscreen?
I'm glad I'm not the only one who thought they royally f*cked up the show beyond repair by the end. I definitely would have gone in a completely different direction with the finale season. As much as I love That 70's Show, the finale was sadly just nowhere near up to par with the rest of the show..
wow watching this makes me realize that in ever actually saw the final season. I think i saw a couple episodes but the whole entire narrative of the show just completely fell apart. It went from good to bad quickly
I actually appreciated the fact that several characters left, because that actually happens in real life. People move away and go on with their lives, and you have to go on, too.
Also, I don’t see what’s wrong with a character losing their way and acting uncharacteristically when stressful things happen. Uncertainty can really throw you off base, and when you’re young that’s doubly true. Not to mention people just changing over time, after interacting with new people and learning new things. Sometimes people go “backwards” and sometimes they go “forwards” in life.
But I never dug the randy character lool
Your analysis of Donna was brilliant, and right on point!
I think its less of "what if she dated Randy" and more of "What if we just replace the main character with this dude named Randy"
Even if Donna and Randy never dated, the show still would have gone to flop. But it is a shame they ruined Donna in the process. Honestly, she could have been the one to save the show had they allowed her to be the main character instead of replacing with Randy. She was so independent, she could have run for office or something, or gotten a big name job. Something to drive the plot without just letting everyone fizzle out.
i think donna (and of course the great acting of laura prepon) created an amazing mashup between girl next door and tomboy/one of the boys. like, she was that cool hot girl that liked all the rock bands, a little rebellious, but at the same time she didn't feel the need to dress all girly (as the girl next door trope usually portrays them in a hyperfeminine vibe), she genuinely liked silly jokes and pranks, she was a little taller. i feel like they never tried to push her as the dream girl that was popular and everyone wanted, but she was different and cool and hot and people liked her in a more natural way. i felt a lot for her ending, because she was a strong feminist icon and they stripped down those characteristics and gave her this sad ending, no college, a boyfriend that did not match her personality at all, basically no family. i hated it, but they getting back together in the ends makes sense ONLY CONSIDERING that eric 100% lowered her self steem and expectations by not showing up to their wedding, not calling her after moving to africa, avoiding her but keeping her hanging on, she had already given up on college because of him, so by the end she was so sad and lonely and with no real goals anymore that she rushed at the slightest sign of affection that eric gave her. this would happen in real life for sure, but it only makes sense here because they put her character in this position, instead of giving her a storyline moving on with her life.
Inolvidables, todos los personajes de That 70s Show. Gracias por el recuerdo!!!
I am so glad for me ended the series after season 7.
I always liked Donnas Character, even when she was irrational.
But what I don't understand why the writes broke up Hyde and Jackie. In my headcanon they are still together and rocking the place😀
They were actually supposed to get married.
The show did got boring in the end, but let's face it, it's absolutely possible and real to see someone be something for yeara and then something happens and an 180 happens, it's very very common to see people that lead become the ones that follow, or hide, because of insecurities, failure to launch, heartbreak, etc... I've seen many times, expectations became a burden and people throw away everything and run, and on the other hand the people that stay sometimes became lost for some time, the show only last a couple years after he left, give Donna a break, and some time to find herself, also, nobody needs to have the same type for the rest of their life, and stuff that you dislike when you are a teen might be what attracts you when you grow a bit, and even if someone hurts you sometimes what they where to you before is just enough, specially if she understands that he was just lost and afraid.
What I'm saying is that the show might have gotten a bit boring, but it wasn't because it was a bad plot to work with, but because they work it badly instead.
It's obvious that Eric and Donna would eventually get back together on That '90s Show, which makes EVERYTHING that happened in Season 8 of That '70s Show seem like a dream! A horrible dream!
I had a crush on Donna because of her red hair; when she went blonde,crush gone….. just like the show
I never would have had Donna stay in point place. She would've gotten on that bus and went to college like she always planned!
Eric and Donnas relationship,if it were a real life one, would have been doomed to fail.
It's EZ, just make her take over Eric Foreman's role as the voice of reason, instead of carrying water for his ghost.
I think you even could have her still date Randy, but only as a "she was running away from the Eric type, and kinda fell for him BECAUSE he reminds him of her father, but then their breakup happens because she comes to her senses and remembers the last thing she wants is to be with someone like her father"
Thanks for all your work on this video. It provided a lot of insight. If I never have the money to put out my own stuff, hopefully someone can use this.
Man, you’re right it’s crazy how people don’t stay the exact same people they are, when they’re in high school versus when they’re in adult and experiencing life outside of just their circle of friends and their high school. You are so right they ruin this character by allowing her to evolve out of the little box that they created in the first few seasons into an actual human being, who has real flaws and counter emotions to the emotions that she either does feel or should be feeling, it’s crazy it’s like they almost turned her into a human being instead of a TV character😂
Donna worked as a character cause she played so well off Eric Forman. Without him on the show her character changed for the worse
Topher Grace leaving ruined that 70s show and Spiderman. Worst career decision ever made. Seems like they tried to turn Donna into her mom.
Idk what you're talking about him doing Spiderman 3 was a highlight and don't blame the actor for wanting to explore other options that's the show runners fault for the lower quality of last seasons
I absolutely hated that season and I detested Randy. That show was ruined for me. You very well summed it all up. Donna was also my favorite character on the show.
Donna is one of the best sitcom waifus ever. Fact.
The analysis here is pretty spot on and it reminds me how I really started almost hating the show towards the end.
That being said, I am still excited to look back and see how they do with the Netflix sequel revival...
I loved energy between Donna and Eric, I liked that she was taller, stronger and more brave than him, I kinda end up in simillar relationship, lol. Donna and Hyde were my favourite characters but I stopped watching it in the middle of 6 or 7th season so yeah I'm glad that I never finnished this show, I wish I would do the same with How I met your mother...
The moment that Eric left her at the altar it shook her entire sense of security. She had been the one with the power their entire relationship. She thought he was a sure thing. It was a shift in power dynamics. Now that she has lost the power psychologically she would be desperate to gain back that sense of security. With Eric gone it made sense that she went for someone that everyone said it was better than Eric but it fell flat so she ended up getting back with Eric when he came back
Jackie and fezz was perfect because it showed her transition from a superficial rich girl to a fully formed determined young woman who decided fez was the one who always cared about her the most.
I’ve been rewatching the show and have been wanting this exact video!!!!!!
As a teenager in the early 2000s, there was nothing at all wrong with Donna.
You can NEVER go wrong with a readhead. Especially not Laura Prepon :)
Man, I would love to see more videos on That 70s Show. I love Friends and The Office as much as anyone, but I'd happily trade some videos on Mondler and the fall of he last seasons of The Office for a video on what happened to Donna's mom, the Evolution of Jackie or the failed love triangle with Eric, Hyde and Donna. That'd be badass, man! Keep up the Good job
Some excellent insights about the Donna character.
Off topic question.
Was Fez the worst friend in the world to Eric? I know it's a comedy but I can't think of a single instance where he helped Eric but can think of multiple times he undercut him.
I think all of this was so unsatisfying because it was too CLOSE to reality and not enough of the fantasy we expect from TV relationships. We expect things to make sense in TV, but in real life things rarely do, especially in entities as complex as romantic relationships.
I think I would've had her fall out of love with Eric after the first time he really hurts her. They'd make up, but they wouldn't date; they'd just stay friends.
After that I feel like it'd be cool to explore more of her independent nature and have her focus on something career-related. And have her find someone who is truly her equal and cares about her that is completely disconnected from the main group.
Let me know what you guys think 🤷🏾♀️.
While watching this I noticed two bloopers right at the 2:03 mark. In the first shot of him holding up a beer you can't see the label. Then they cut to a different angle and you can not only see the label but it is upside down !
Y'all KNOW they're all coming back (well, except Masterson/Hyde...for obvious reasons) for That 90's Show, right? They've already wrapped filming the 10 episodes and it's supposed to air on Netflix sometime next year.
I believe only Red and Kitty will be regulars with rest of the old cast making occasional appearances?
@@alexk9295 i thought the guy who played Red passed away?
And why would they be the regular reoccurring characters, and not the main cast? Wouldn't they be too old by that point?
@@katelynbrown98 i believe one of the main characters is the grand daughter of Red and Kitty
@@alexk9295 that is correct, the daughter of Eric and Donna
I really hope you guys do an episode on How to Get Away with Murder as it’s a really interesting and underrated show
Nah Donna and Hyde are the first ppl I think about when I think of this show.
The last season felt was a completely different show. Unfortunately.
If you notice, her hair gets lighter and lighter while her character slowly dies up to when she went full blonde.
God she was absolutely gorgeous.
This is so silly of me but… I think they went to see Ted Nugent, not Todd Rundgren. I remember the ‘Tad Nugent’ failed bootleg shirts they made. Would have been based for them to see Rundgren though
They did. Donna did an interview with Ted on her radio show.
No, it was Todd Rundgren. Ted Nugent was a later season.
The final season shouldn’t have happened. I’m glad that it did but after watching this, I didn’t even think about it this deep. That final season didn’t need to happen.
Zoey 101 weirdly did the exact same thing, replacing Chase with that Gary Stu character that immediately dates Zoey til Chase returns in the last episode.
Zoey 101 was horrible. Who is Zoey? Zoey is a perfect, wonderful person who has no real flaws except for, maybe, she is too nice and perfect. Everyone loves her and if you don't like her, then you are a bad person.
It was a stupid show.
@@rosesweetcharlotte looking back Zoey is a trash character, but I still think it's a good show overall.
That 70's Show was my second favorite TV show of all time. It was ruined by Danny and how most of the other actors reacted to him being locked up. I have respect for her, Kurtwood and Topher, but the rest of the main cast can eff off.
She was part of the Scientology clique that made it possible for Masterson to do what he did for so long. Topher Grace was the only normal adult of the gang.