When the Sabbath keepers betrayed and murdered Christ, the Lord of the Sabbath, they ended the Old Covenant. They also polluted the Sabbath beyond repair. After the crucifixion of Christ, the Sabbath became a reminder of the betrayal and murder of Christ, when He laid in the tomb and the Apostles *mourned.* and wept instead of rested. The death of Christ had ended the old covenant for good. It wasn't until Sunday that the disciples rejoiced and rested in Christ. Noticeably, no disciple worked that day but worshiped Christ. And, we who are baptized are baptized into His Death, that we should be raised with Christ on Sunday and bring forth fruit. Rom 7:2 For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband. 3 So then if, while her husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress: but if her husband be dead, she is free from that law; so that she is no adulteress, though she be married to another man. 4 Wherefore, my brethren, *ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another,* even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God. What did Adventist are trying to do is make you be a spiritual adulterer by becoming married to the old covenant by the preaching of Moses* *Those who return to the old covenant have forsaken the new covenant salvation through Christ and Christ Himself for Moses* And, now there remains no more sacrifice for them!! Hebrews 10: 26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, 27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries. 28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses: 29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people. 31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.
Keep up the good work, however withholding the tithe is not an option period, do we have other options? Got couple ???s. 1. REDIRECTING is it sin? 2. Did EGW redirect at any point 3. Did Jesus collect for His leadership in the church, or His own self-supporting ministry . PLEASE DON'T IGNORE my simple direct ???s. Anyone?
Jesus was watching!! For me , one of the important lessons for us as last day Christians is that Nothing escapes the watchful eye of God. The woman’s heart was fully, unreservedly involved in her giving. Concerning the return of the tithes, we are to return ALL of it : a faithful tithe, and of course offerings too. God says that all the tithe of the land is His and to be used as He directs and not as we please. True SDA Christians know what God’s will is concerning the tithe. The tithe is one of the small requirements placed on us to address the natural selfishness of the heart, which is really the mind of fallen humanity. May God help us to cooperate with Him in His work of the great plan of salvation on our behalf.
Dr Vine is not about title and offering he was about Religious Liberty and Wokeness, thats the apostasy he was addressing , tithe and offering are a side but related issue. If the leaders can address the key core issues tithe and offering should be intact. We have gone off course to divert attention. Because in the end the NAD is the largest title and offering contributor so the GC will not address the core issues. Should we not address the insidious problems creeping into the church because of money?
There is no need to doubt, to be fearful that the work will not succeed. God is at the head of the work, and He will set everything in order. If matters need adjusting at the head of the work God will attend to that, and work to right every wrong. Let us have faith that God is going to carry the noble ship which bears the people of God safely into port. - Selected Messages 2:390 (1892).
Conrad Vine you say was concerned about apostasy. Can I ask you would you consider a preacher or pastor teaching mystical Spiritual Formation an apostate?? Because if you do then Conrad Vine better first look in the mirror as he has some explaining to do. This will be long but it is the truth: . I will break up my response into several posts if you don’t mind. I don’t want it to be so lengthy it because tiresome to follow. Here is an excerpt from his dissertation that was part of his degree requirements at Andrew’s University: I found the article both online and in his website. Digital Commons @ Andrews University Professional Dissertations DMin Graduate Research ABSTRACT APPLYING THE BIBLICAL PRACTICE OF MEDITATION AMONG ADVENTIST FRONTIER MISSION EMPLOYEES by Conrad Athelstan Raymond Vine Adviser: Benjamin C. Maxson • digitalcommons.andrews.edu “Loyola suggested entering a biblical scene and experiencing it with one's senses, an idea akin to the concept of contemplation in the writings of Ellen G. White (see Chapter 2).” This is a sneaky way of Conrad Vine trying to reconcile what Sister White wrote with Ignatius Loyola’ s mystic contemplation. She never mentions using the five senses during imagination. Doing so would be no longer imagination which is the ability of the brain/mind to form mental pictures. Visualization is a the use of the others senses ALONG with imagination to make things that are not present in the physical world appear real and feel real. Visualization is what New Ayers, Buddhist monks, hypnotherapists, Jesuit teachers, guided relaxation therapists, mystics and spiritual formation teachers use to pray and mediate. Science has now produced evidence that visualization can lead to altered states of mind, self hypnosis and in some cases even episodes of psychosis. It is dangerous and simply swapping out imagery for Bible texts and stories doesn’t make it godly or safe. Vine never mentions this distinction between Sister White and Loyola as he teaches Loyola’s techniques himself as evidenced in his meditation model in the article as well as in some sermons. Vine has also suggested this kind of sensory imagination in a sermon at Mentone SDA church. He used the same language and techniques used by both ancient and modern Christian mystics. In this dissertation he offered a 56 day model for meditation that in his own words were among many other “recommendations “: Here are just a few: “8. For cross-cultural missionaries to both understand and model biblical meditation as outlined in the enclosed meditation model in order to have a suitable alternative for new converts who are leaving religions with alternate meditation models. 9. To promote and model the meditation model described in this document for helping new SDA converts experience the reality of a relationship with God. 10. To include the meditation model described in this document in the initial training program for all new AFM cross-cultural missionaries.” I will follow up with a copied and pasted page of one or two of these devotional days along with the steps he recommends. His dissertation does state al lot of truths but the dangerous part is that it also contains falsehoods and takes Sister White’s statements as support but when you read her statement s carefully you see that he changed what she intended. Finally for this post I will paste a copy of the myriad of statements made from modern day Spiritual Formation writers and followers of Ignatius Loyola, the founder of the Jesuit order and Catholic mystic. By the way Loyolas’s steps to meditation are the same as what Vine suggests. From Ignatian spirituality.com:: “Ignatius was convinced that God can speak to us as surely through our imagination as through our thoughts and memories. In the Ignatian tradition, praying with the imagination is called contemplation. In the Exercises, contemplation is a very active way of praying that engages the mind and heart and stirs up thoughts and emotions.” “Ignatian contemplation is suited especially for the Gospels. In the Second Week of the Exercises, we accompany Jesus through his life by imagining scenes from the Gospel stories. Let the events of Jesus' life be present to you right now. Visualize the event as if you were making a movie. Pay attention to the details: sights, sounds, tastes, smells, and feelings of the event. Lose yourself in the story; don't worry if your imagination is running too wild. At some point, place yourself in the scene. Contemplating a Gospel scene is not simply remembering it or going back in time. Through the act of contemplation, the Holy Spirit makes present a mystery of Jesus' life in a way that is meaningful for you now. Use your imagination to dig deeper into the story so that God may communicate with you in a personal, evocative way” This just what Vine calls for in his dissertation meditation model and weaved into preaching as well.
@@JohnEricho-wj8zr I am concerned how most people are not aware of articles written by Vine that show what he really believes. He is definitely a teacher and supporter of Spiritual Formation even though he doesn’t use those exact words. He has sympathized and endorsed with false teachers including Elmer L. Towns, Dietrich Bonhoeffer, Jon Dybhahl , and many others while criticizing Adventist and Non Adventist authors that expose the dangers and falsehoods of Spiritual Formation. Vine even likened Ignatius Loyola’s mystic meditation to the Biblical meditation Ellen White described. Read his dissertation for his doctoral degree from Andrews on meditation for yourselves. Read his article on journaling (another emergent Church “discipline “ of Spiritual Formation and his article on “fasting” which endorses Town’s deceptive refashioning of true Biblical fasting. Towns is a false teacher of spirituality. Many who have heard Vine’s sermons lack discernment and when he instructs the congregation to use all their “senses” to imagine Bible stories when meditating, they think it is very harmless and even godly. What they don’t realize is that he is teaching them, whether intentionally or not I don’t know, visualization which is dangerous. His dissertation included a 56 day meditation model that follows the pattern and techniques for “meditating” found in many Jesuit, Catholic and Emergent church ministries. I fear people become attached to pet preachers and speakers and fail to be true Bereans and do not look closer at what is being presented to see whether it passes the Biblical test.
What is very puzzling to me is the consistent oversight that Vine did not call to withhold tithe, but to give it to a faithful conference. We must take time and dissect what we hear. Be very careful of crowd think, see the examples in the Bible. Korah and company, and Jesus' crucifixion
why does the preacher imagine God cannot work through people, God has worked with human beings before, He used prophets in he bible, He used David who Killed Goliath and someone's prayer was anwered. Dr. Vine Can also be used of God, why do you imagine it's only TW who God can use, when he has clearly led an organisation against God's will and freedom of conscience; is that God's
The sincerity of Dr Vine or whether God is using him or not is not being questioned. That's not for any of us to decide. However, the idea of the para church is what was taught as being a disastrous idea in this message, unsubstantiated by God's word.
@@portchestersda before the existence of SDA, where do you put the christians that worshipped God in truth and spirit.i find the theology that SDA organisation is substantiated by God's word very misleading
May we be awakened to God's truth! "And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed." Romans 13:11
@@portchestersda l said that because of your statement in your sermon on Dr Vine. I have been in the SDA church for over 25 plus yrs and never hear them teaching diet, dress, music etc reform. Until the lock down and opening up back we went to our local conference in the Cayman island and bought Testimony to the church 9 valums. This was when l learnt about dress reform and a young man in Africa Devaney Hupt of Messengers of Present truth Ministry gave a good teaching on it. Now the diet came about when one of the Elders put out some books for people to read its called Temperance. After reading and realizing diet was a salvation issue l quit eating animal dead carcasses 8 plus yrs ago. My point is the church is not teaching as they ough to to prepair us for what is about to come and being there for so many yrs as a spiritually blind individual was a crying shame. Many things world celebrates my church at the time celebrates it on the Sabbath. Its easy to follow the world but difficult to adhere to God's commandments. You will have to read Ellen White writings for yourself to know what is coming as the church refuses to teah present truth messages as they have joined hands with the man of sin. Many will be lost as the prophetess says in the SDA church because of their leaders. What Mr Vine said is true. Question why was the logo changed? Why do they ordained women as Elders and pastors which goes against God's order? Why is there homo female and male pastors in the church. La Sierra university has gay section on campus and graduation on the holy Sabbath day? When its a day for giving God worship and not doing our own pleasure Isaiah 58:13. Young man this is why l say you will soon get a rude awakening. I had to resort to home church because of all these ungodly worshipping in the house of God. Many people knows wrong from wright.
Was the woman aware of any corruption going on and are we not responsible for how our tithe are used? Redirection of tithe is allowed if the immediate church is misusing it for wrong purposes. Redirection of tithe is different from withholding of tithe. Lots of conferences are with fault in the regards to apostate policies like women ordination,LGBT,even the tithe method is not correct going by pp. We are responsible not just God.the government that you give to will have to use it appropriately,you are to hold your leaders to account. You feel your God should come down to turn the money changers table and drove out the thief when Christ have practically shown you how you are to practically correct this practice of your false leaders......... God will not help you if you choose not to do it and your assumption of God blessing you even if your leaders are using this money to support the LGBT community is funny. Question to you-- if your earthly father gave you money to pay off your tuition and you end up gambling with that money and lose,don't you think your dad will be expecting your end result and will you be able to write or participate in that exam? Conclusion:God's money should be treated with care because we are to give an account like the unfaithful servant
I notice that Vine said 'IF' the GC sides with the government mandates that prevent freedom of conscience and religious liberty then members are within their rights to redirect tithes. How about we start holding the GC accountable instead of listening to these pastors who are putting forth a straw-man argument?
Whether you like it or not, the TRUTH is the TRUTH. The BIBLE says, "Don't give that which is holy to the swine". "If we sin willfully after that were have received the knowledge of the TRUTH, there remained no more sacrifice for sin, but a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation which shall devour the adversary". If you know something is wrong and willing to support it, you committed SIN. We should now start thinking like CHRIST. "Let this mind be in you which was also in CHRIST JESUS". STUDY to shew thyself approved unto God , a workman that needed not to be ashamed, RIGHTLY dividing the WORD of TRUTH" God Bless ❤🙏
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When the Sabbath keepers betrayed and murdered Christ, the Lord of the Sabbath, they ended the Old Covenant. They also polluted the Sabbath beyond repair. After the crucifixion of Christ, the Sabbath became a reminder of the betrayal and murder of Christ, when He laid in the tomb and the Apostles *mourned.* and wept instead of rested. The death of Christ had ended the old covenant for good. It wasn't until Sunday that the disciples rejoiced and rested in Christ. Noticeably, no disciple worked that day but worshiped Christ. And, we who are baptized are baptized into His Death, that we should be raised with Christ on Sunday and bring forth fruit.
Rom 7:2 For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband.
3 So then if, while her husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress: but if her husband be dead, she is free from that law; so that she is no adulteress, though she be married to another man.
4 Wherefore, my brethren, *ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another,* even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God. What did Adventist are trying to do is make you be a spiritual adulterer by becoming married to the old covenant by the preaching of Moses* *Those who return to the old covenant have forsaken the new covenant salvation through Christ and Christ Himself for Moses* And, now there remains no more sacrifice for them!!
Hebrews 10:
26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:
29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.
31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.
Could the Jewish temple be telling us about the fate of the General Conference?
What about the fate of the Jewish temple you would say would be likened to the fate of the GC?
Amen. God doesn't need our money. He needs our obedience and our love to him.
Amen! May we be faithful to Him
Neither as being lords over God's heritage, but being ensamples to the flock.
What started as a bottom up organization, has become a top down one.
Interesting thought! We spoke about this at divine worship today
What a smart and bless young man.Keep up the good work under GOD.
Praise the Lord. We appreciate your words
Keep up the good work, however withholding the tithe is not an option period, do we have other options? Got couple ???s.
1. REDIRECTING is it sin?
2. Did EGW redirect at any point
3. Did Jesus collect for His leadership in the church, or His own self-supporting ministry .
PLEASE DON'T IGNORE my simple direct ???s. Anyone?
Jesus was watching!!
For me , one of the important lessons for us as last day Christians is that Nothing escapes the watchful eye of God. The woman’s heart was fully, unreservedly involved in her giving. Concerning the return of the tithes, we are to return ALL of it : a faithful tithe, and of course offerings too. God says that all the tithe of the land is His and to be used as He directs and not as we please. True SDA Christians know what God’s will is concerning the tithe.
The tithe is one of the small requirements placed on us to address the natural selfishness of the heart, which is really the mind of fallen humanity. May God help us to cooperate with Him in His work of the great plan of salvation on our behalf.
Amen, thanks for sharing!
But really its time for our leaders to be accountable .. because knowledge is increasing
Yes, each leader must take accountability for any action thats contrary to God's will.
Wonderful lesson study review , I have been blessed by it .😊❤
Praise the Lord, Happy you were blessed!
Dr Vine is not about title and offering he was about Religious Liberty and Wokeness, thats the apostasy he was addressing , tithe and offering are a side but related issue. If the leaders can address the key core issues tithe and offering should be intact. We have gone off course to divert attention. Because in the end the NAD is the largest title and offering contributor so the GC will not address the core issues. Should we not address the insidious problems creeping into the church because of money?
There is no need to doubt, to be fearful that the work will not succeed. God is at the head of the work, and He will set everything in order. If matters need adjusting at the head of the work God will attend to that, and work to right every wrong. Let us have faith that God is going to carry the noble ship which bears the people of God safely into port. - Selected Messages 2:390 (1892).
Conrad Vine you say was concerned about apostasy. Can I ask you would you consider a preacher or pastor teaching mystical Spiritual Formation an apostate??
Because if you do then Conrad Vine better first look in the mirror as he has some explaining to do.
This will be long but it is the truth:
. I will break up my response into several posts if you don’t mind. I don’t want it to be so lengthy it because tiresome to follow.
Here is an excerpt from his dissertation that was part of his degree requirements at Andrew’s University: I found the article both online and in his website. Digital Commons @ Andrews University
Professional Dissertations DMin
Graduate Research
ABSTRACT
APPLYING THE BIBLICAL PRACTICE OF MEDITATION AMONG ADVENTIST FRONTIER MISSION EMPLOYEES
by
Conrad Athelstan Raymond Vine
Adviser: Benjamin C. Maxson
• digitalcommons.andrews.edu
“Loyola suggested entering a biblical scene and experiencing it with one's senses, an idea akin to the concept of contemplation in the writings of Ellen G.
White (see Chapter 2).”
This is a sneaky way of Conrad Vine trying to reconcile what Sister White wrote with Ignatius Loyola’ s mystic contemplation. She never mentions using the five senses during imagination. Doing so would be no longer imagination which is the ability of the brain/mind to form mental pictures.
Visualization is a the use of the others senses ALONG with imagination to make things that are not present in the physical world appear real and feel real. Visualization is what New Ayers, Buddhist monks, hypnotherapists, Jesuit teachers, guided relaxation therapists, mystics and spiritual formation teachers use to pray and mediate.
Science has now produced evidence that visualization can lead to altered states of mind, self hypnosis and in some cases even episodes of psychosis. It is dangerous and simply swapping out imagery for Bible texts and stories doesn’t make it godly or safe.
Vine never mentions this distinction between Sister White and Loyola as he teaches Loyola’s techniques himself as evidenced in his meditation model in the article as well as in some sermons.
Vine has also suggested this kind of sensory imagination in a sermon at Mentone SDA church. He used the same language and techniques used by both ancient and modern Christian mystics.
In this dissertation he offered a 56 day model for meditation that in his own words were among many other “recommendations “: Here are just a few:
“8. For cross-cultural missionaries to both understand and model biblical meditation as outlined in the enclosed meditation model in order to have a suitable
alternative for new converts who are leaving religions with alternate meditation models.
9. To promote and model the meditation model described in this document for helping new SDA converts experience the reality of a relationship with God.
10. To include the meditation model described in this document in the initial training program for all new AFM cross-cultural missionaries.”
I will follow up with a copied and pasted page of one or two of these devotional days along with the steps he recommends.
His dissertation does state al lot of truths but the dangerous part is that it also contains falsehoods and takes Sister White’s statements as support but when you read her statement s carefully you see that he changed what she intended.
Finally for this post I will paste a copy of the myriad of statements made from modern day Spiritual Formation writers and followers of Ignatius Loyola, the founder of the Jesuit order and Catholic mystic. By the way Loyolas’s steps to meditation are the same as what Vine suggests.
From Ignatian spirituality.com::
“Ignatius was convinced that God can speak to us as surely through our imagination as through our thoughts and memories. In the Ignatian tradition, praying with the imagination is called contemplation. In the Exercises, contemplation is a very active way of praying that engages the mind and heart and stirs up thoughts and emotions.”
“Ignatian contemplation is suited especially for the Gospels. In the Second Week of the Exercises, we accompany Jesus through his life by imagining scenes from the Gospel stories. Let the events of Jesus' life be present to you right now.
Visualize the event as if you were making a movie. Pay attention to the details: sights, sounds, tastes, smells, and feelings of the event. Lose yourself in the story; don't worry if your imagination is running too wild. At some point, place yourself in the scene.
Contemplating a Gospel scene is not simply remembering it or going back in time. Through the act of contemplation, the Holy Spirit makes present a mystery of Jesus' life in a way that is meaningful for you now. Use your imagination to dig deeper into the story so that God may communicate with you in a personal, evocative way”
This just what Vine calls for in his dissertation meditation model and weaved into preaching as well.
He said also others can go underground which definitely called for division of flock over mistakes by leadership class
@@JohnEricho-wj8zr I am concerned how most people are not aware of articles written by Vine that show what he really believes. He is definitely a teacher and supporter of Spiritual Formation even though he doesn’t use those exact words. He has sympathized and endorsed with false teachers including Elmer L. Towns, Dietrich Bonhoeffer, Jon Dybhahl , and many others while criticizing Adventist and Non Adventist authors that expose the dangers and falsehoods of Spiritual Formation. Vine even likened Ignatius Loyola’s mystic meditation to the Biblical meditation Ellen White described.
Read his dissertation for his doctoral degree from Andrews on meditation for yourselves. Read his article on journaling (another emergent Church “discipline “ of Spiritual Formation and his article on “fasting” which endorses Town’s deceptive refashioning of true Biblical fasting. Towns is a false teacher of spirituality.
Many who have heard Vine’s sermons lack discernment and when he instructs the congregation to use all their “senses” to imagine Bible stories when meditating, they think it is very harmless and even godly. What they don’t realize is that he is teaching them, whether intentionally or not I don’t know, visualization which is dangerous.
His dissertation included a 56 day meditation model that follows the pattern and techniques for “meditating” found in many Jesuit, Catholic and Emergent church ministries.
I fear people become attached to pet preachers and speakers and fail to be true Bereans and do not look closer at what is being presented to see whether it passes the Biblical test.
What is very puzzling to me is the consistent oversight that Vine did not call to withhold tithe, but to give it to a faithful conference.
We must take time and dissect what we hear. Be very careful of crowd think, see the examples in the Bible. Korah and company, and Jesus' crucifixion
Who gives Dr.Vine or anyone else the authority to divert tithes or recommends that this be done?.
Two issues at hand is:
1. A withholding of tithe from certain conferences
2. A redirection of tithe by a parachurch.
Sabbath school lesson guides that you were quoting from are from Jesuit New Age Bible versions.
The speaker uses the King James version when presenting. I'm not sure which version you are referring to?
Who wrote the lesson? Mark Finley? Do you see my poimt
Principles shared are within God's word. However, man's word, if of any value, echoes the words of God.
Mark Ginley did not write this lesson
Finley
@@claudettebarry4697you're right. Thomas R Sherperd wrote it.
Mark Finley wrote the Q2 lesson.
My apology.
It's C Goldsteen a inside jesuit
She might not know what's was going on either.
Could be so, however Jesus knew what was going on and didn't condemn her or redirected her.
Dr.
Happy to have you on!
why does the preacher imagine God cannot work through people, God has worked with human beings before, He used prophets in he bible, He used David who Killed Goliath and someone's prayer was
anwered. Dr. Vine Can also be used of God, why do you imagine it's only TW who God can use, when he has clearly led an organisation against God's will and freedom of conscience; is that God's
The sincerity of Dr Vine or whether God is using him or not is not being questioned. That's not for any of us to decide. However, the idea of the para church is what was taught as being a disastrous idea in this message, unsubstantiated by God's word.
@@portchestersda before the existence of SDA, where do you put the christians that worshipped God in truth and spirit.i find the theology that SDA organisation is substantiated by God's word very misleading
Hello 👋
Nice having you on 👋
Young man you will soon get a rude awakening on what time it is.
May we be awakened to God's truth!
"And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed." Romans 13:11
@@portchestersda l said that because of your statement in your sermon on Dr Vine. I have been in the SDA church for over 25 plus yrs and never hear them teaching diet, dress, music etc reform. Until the lock down and opening up back we went to our local conference in the Cayman island and bought Testimony to the church 9 valums. This was when l learnt about dress reform and a young man in Africa Devaney Hupt of Messengers of Present truth Ministry gave a good teaching on it.
Now the diet came about when one of the Elders put out some books for people to read its called Temperance. After reading and realizing diet was a salvation issue l quit eating animal dead carcasses 8 plus yrs ago. My point is the church is not teaching as they ough to to prepair us for what is about to come and being there for so many yrs as a spiritually blind individual was a crying shame.
Many things world celebrates my church at the time celebrates it on the Sabbath. Its easy to follow the world but difficult to adhere to God's commandments.
You will have to read Ellen White writings for yourself to know what is coming as the church refuses to teah present truth messages as they have joined hands with the man of sin. Many will be lost as the prophetess says in the SDA church because of their leaders. What Mr Vine said is true.
Question why was the logo changed?
Why do they ordained women as Elders and pastors which goes against God's order?
Why is there homo female and male pastors in the church. La Sierra university has gay section on campus and graduation on the holy Sabbath day?
When its a day for giving God worship and not doing our own pleasure Isaiah 58:13. Young man this is why l say you will soon get a rude awakening.
I had to resort to home church because of all these ungodly worshipping in the house of God. Many people knows wrong from wright.
Was the woman aware of any corruption going on and are we not responsible for how our tithe are used?
Redirection of tithe is allowed if the immediate church is misusing it for wrong purposes.
Redirection of tithe is different from withholding of tithe.
Lots of conferences are with fault in the regards to apostate policies like women ordination,LGBT,even the tithe method is not correct going by pp.
We are responsible not just God.the government that you give to will have to use it appropriately,you are to hold your leaders to account.
You feel your God should come down to turn the money changers table and drove out the thief when Christ have practically shown you how you are to practically correct this practice of your false leaders......... God will not help you if you choose not to do it and your assumption of God blessing you even if your leaders are using this money to support the LGBT community is funny.
Question to you-- if your earthly father gave you money to pay off your tuition and you end up gambling with that money and lose,don't you think your dad will be expecting your end result and will you be able to write or participate in that exam?
Conclusion:God's money should be treated with care because we are to give an account like the unfaithful servant
I notice they did not respond to your comment the only one
@@AnnmarieBlair not true they did not respond to mine too
I notice that Vine said 'IF' the GC sides with the government mandates that prevent freedom of conscience and religious liberty then members are within their rights to redirect tithes. How about we start holding the GC accountable instead of listening to these pastors who are putting forth a straw-man argument?
Exactly @@smangelenondonga1241
Please, please , why some people misrepresent what Dr Vine said?
Time to shut down Vine and bring in a new leader.
While i don't agree with Vine and his sympathizers i think there are Christlike ways to deal with this issue.
The message from Conrad Vine was sent to wake up a sleepy church being presided over by a vaccinated administration!
Whether you like it or not, the TRUTH is the TRUTH. The BIBLE says, "Don't give that which is holy to the swine". "If we sin willfully after that were have received the knowledge of the TRUTH, there remained no more sacrifice for sin, but a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation which shall devour the adversary". If you know something is wrong and willing to support it, you committed SIN. We should now start thinking like CHRIST. "Let this mind be in you which was also in CHRIST JESUS". STUDY to shew thyself approved unto God , a workman that needed not to be ashamed, RIGHTLY dividing the WORD of TRUTH"
God Bless ❤🙏
Correct, there are divine ways to handle situations instead of human devised ways.
@@portchestersda That right! And that is by calling sin by its right name. Because God is not a respector of person.