I just subscribed to your channel. You have great content here! It was a shocking moment when I learned about what happened to Susan's family, but what struck me more was learning about Susan no longer a friend of Narnia. For me, her story is our story. Her journey is my journey, too. Being young and innocent, our faith is unwavering. We believe and live in a world full of possibilities. Growing up, we get caught in tangles of "stuff" that we deemed as more important than family, friendship, and relationship. I may have gone through a path similar to Susan's. A road of partying and spending, and superficial connections, then of pain, suffering, and loneliness. I'm holding on to what was mentioned that Susan's story isn't yet over as ours. We are to write her journey. And I know it's overflowing with hope. Thank you for this video.
I’ve thought about this a lot recently and while I am not using this as any metaphor, Susan can fall back on what Aslan said himself, “Once a king or queen of Narnia, always a king or queen of Narnia.” I believe that Susan would have had an experience, either directly with Aslan or a near death experience or something equivocal which would have helped regain her belief in Aslan, in Narnia, and even in herself.
This was a fabulous commentary, and a reassurance (backed up by that quote from Lewis himself) that the author's intentions for Susan were much more subtle than could be conveyed by the end of a children's story arc. The best solution was to describe her status ambivalently, from the perspective of others who had passed into glory (Narnia's version), but did not yet know her final fate.
I'd say mine is the minority voice on the matter. Much more time and energy has been devoted to the opposite argument in the last decade, wouldn't you agree? It seems to be a popular fad these days to misconstrue and malign authors of the past, and Lewis is certainly no exception.
@Into The Wardrobe, on a totally unrelated topic, I’d hoping to ask this to anyone who is knowledgeable about CON, The Silver Chair to be exact. Caspian is anywhere between and ninety years old and Prince Rilian is between 20-30 years old. Means that Caspian would have had to have Rilian between 50-70 years old. It completely baffles me why in the world the king and queen would have waited decades to produce an heir when that is a top priority of a ruling king.
The REAL Problem with Susan is that C.S. Lewis did not want to go into it, he knew her story was more complex and she had one of her own that would take the readers right out of the fantasy, but he did not feel like writing it because he knew he would not do it justice, so he didn't. He even encouraged one of the readers that sent him a letter about it to write her story and elaborate on it.
I'm working on mine - and I'm including her having some sort of reuniting with the Scrubbs. I don't think they would've been pleasant to her after what happened and would've brought up how 'tiresome and commonplace Eustace had become' thanks to 'those Pevensie children', so I'm envisioning some tearful scenes where blame is thrown all over the place, and then a few scenes where at the very least they're civil to each other, maybe with some affection as they are still relatives but that they'll never say it out loud because they aren't quite like that.
@@itsjkforreal I assume their sources come from one of the letters Lewis wrote to a child in 1960, and said,"Not because I have no hope of Susan ever getting to Aslans's country, but because I have a feeling that the story of her journey would be longer and more like a grown-up novel than I wanted to write. But I may be mistaken. Why not try it yourself?"
@@rebekahWalton Alright Walton, I'll Google the quote and try to find the source myself. I'm from the generation called slackers but we all work now. Please hold. Narniaweb “I could not write that story myself. Not that I have no hope of Susan’s ever getting to Aslan’s country; but because I have a feeling that the story of her journey would be longer and more like a grown-up novel than I wanted to write. But I may be mistaken. Why not try it yourself?” Collected Letters of CS Lewis Volume 3
Susan's fate reminds me of a quote from C.S Lewis: "When I was ten, I read fairy tales in secret and would have been ashamed if I had been found doing so. Now that I am fifty I read them openly. When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up.” I think Lewis was trying to explain that trying to grow up was the most childish thing you can do, but who knows maybe I'm wrong, maybe I'm missing something.
The message what I got is that it's ok to be mature but it's also ok to never give up and abandon your inner child despite being grown up. Embrace your sense of wonder in the world. 😊
From a purely pragmatic perspective, Susan was the only one who did not have a developmental arc in the series. Thus her arc was saved for last, to take place afterwards. As stated, "Once a king or queen of Narnia, always a king or queen of Narnia", so her salvation is assured. Lewis' gift to his readers is giving us the beginning and the end of Susan's journey, and leaving the middle up to us.
Yes! I was thinking of that very quote. Being adopted as a queen, and a well loved queen at that, it's no small matter. Susan may momentarily have forgotten Narnia, but I doubt that Narnia will have forgotten her. She could have chosen the same path back to Narnia as 'The Friends of Narnia' did. But it's an important distinction that she chose not to do so. She's clouded her own vision of that world. So, until she chooses to clear it. Her path back there will be out of her sight. But I suspect that C S Lewis fully intended her to find it again. He just wants us to figure out how for ourselves.
If that was the intent then it was executed poorly. There was no empathy or hope in the way the Narnia stories ended for her. It was dismissive and tone was insulting so the reader take the intent of the book as dismissive for her. CS Lewis wrote to a little girl that asked him about Susan saying "...there is plenty of time for her to mend, and perhaps she will get to Aslan’s country in the end" he could have written that kind of hope into the book. Also see his letter says "perhaps" so her salvation is not assured. No ones salvation is assured.
I never thought her being into lipstick and clothes and parties and growing up was the thing that was wrong with her. It was that she ONLY cared about those things and lost sight of what was really important. She thought she would find true happiness in the things of the world and saw the faith she once had as childish and silly. She stopped believing. She stopped wanting to go to Narnia. That was her problem, not becoming a woman or being girly or beautiful. It was her unbelief. But I love how Lewis left the story open. Growing up I thought that meant she went to Hell, but now I'm so happy to hear that's not what happened, that she still has hope and it's very likely she will one day return to Narnia.
Exactly. Even as a teen atheist I could understand what Lewis meant by the way he wrote about her. I really enjoyed Gaiman's stories and generally would put him on a pedestal above Lewis. But reading his short story made me question his literary intelligence.
@@oddish4352 I agree she definitely needed to grow up for real. The things she thought of as growing up weren't really. She needed to grow up in her heart instead of just outwardly. As for many paths to Heaven, I don't think all or even many paths lead there. As a Christian I believe there is only one and that is through Jesus. Just like in the story I don't think Susan would have gotten to Aslan's country by a different way other than her faith she once had in Aslan. I don't think all these other philosophies and other things of the world would have gotten her there. I think she needed to ultimately go to the source to get to the source, which was Aslan himself. The same is true for us in this world. We can't reach Heaven without Jesus. All roads don't lead to the same place. But, I think Susan would eventually find her faith in Aslan again, and get back to where she once believed. I believe she had a happy ending once she found the true path again. And that is something for both children and grown-ups alike. Like you said, she didn't have to be a child to believe in Narnia. She could do that as an adult, and that was truly the mature, grown-up thing to do. 🦁☀️
@@karisgranger6013 Certainly, Jesus is the one way to Heaven. But there are many paths a person can follow that will lead to Him. Lucy's steady faith and true heart might be the most admirable, but remember Edmund's greed and treachery, Eustace's excessive pragmatism, Jill's repeated failures... they all made it in the end. Susan's tale is cautionary as well, but there is a part in the Great Story for her to play.
Susan was the reader personified. Most of us remember those fantasy worlds we fell in love with as a child, something that felt so real at one time. But like a lot of people, Susan was hit with reality and had to face it, no longer pining for those fantasy worlds or dreams of what was. I would even take it a step further and say that she blamed Narnia for what to her siblings, thus choosing to not be a friend of Narnia and grieving in her own way. Like many people, when something so tragic and sudden happens, we look to blame or justify why it happened. Susan was meant to be the real life anecdote to the fantasy world we were all reading about. I think in time, with much healing, Susan would come to realize that Narnia wasn’t to blame and will cling on to those “child” memories of her and her siblings and that’s how she will be reunited.
Sort of like what Lewis said in his dedication to Lucy Barfield, that she was now too old for fairy tales but some day may be old enough to read them again. Susan may be one day say 'yes it was a childish game, but it wasn't silly to them, and it wasn't to me either.'
I like the thought that Susan is the reader personified. Her story is left untold as the reader's story is yet to happen after reading these books. And as readers we are given a task like what was given to Lucy and Edmund at the end of The Voyage of the Dawn Treader. When Lucy and Edmund asked about returning to Narnia soon and that they wanted to come back to see Aslan, Aslan tells them he is in their world too. "But there I have another name. You must learn to know me by that name. This was the very reason why you were brought to Narnia, that by knowing me here for a little, you may know me better there." I think Susan's story is like Lewis' story and like the reader's stories. We each have our own journey to find out who Aslan is in our own world. I think Susan does have a story, but it may likely be like yours or like mine in how we come to Christ. So in some ways it is nice that her story is not written in that her story may be ours. :)
@@markhoffman9655 reminds me of daughter Zion in the bible taking punishments for things she hadnt done(yet) plus she only ended up doing bad things due to being blamed/ scapegoated/ abused/ accused while innocent( causes hurt and anger and distrust)
No, Lewis demonstrated people really growing up with Peter, Edmund and Lucy when they could no longer enter Narnia. Susan was falling into a false sense of maturity that dismisses what really matters as childish - a sign of immaturity is an inordinate reverence for things perceived as "grown up". And she could hardly blame Narnia for what happened to her siblings before they even died.
Susan's story is rooted in tragedy and grief, and it's a story that Lewis didn't feel comfortable writing, given the more innocent and childlike nature of the other books in the series. In a letter to a fan concerned about Susan's future, Lewis had this to say: "I could not write that story myself. Not that I have no hope of Susan ever getting into Aslan's country, but because I have a feeling that the story of journey would be longer and more like a grown-up novel than I wanted to write."
I feel like people tend to misread the part about Susan's fate. They jump to the lipstick part and completely ignore that Susan is basically wrapped up in a false sense of maturity. She became what she thought was an adult: dressing up, going to parties, and putting away the fairy tales. It's a very childish interpretation of adulthood ironically enough. It's fitting that Lewis had Polly point this out, she had lived as a grown woman before returning to Narnia and saw that Susan wasn't nearly as mature as she believed herself to be.
A little like Lasaraleen, Aravis's friend in Calormen, the gossipy talkative one who helped her escape from Calormen event hough she couldn't understand why she wanted to go. I always sort of saw her 'darlings' and talking about houses and dresses as 'a teenage girl playing at being a grown-up, it happens all the time'.
Yeah, Lewis wrote elsewhere about how the desire to appear very grown-up and the denial of simple joys in favour of sophisticated amusements is itself a form of childishness - or perhaps teenageness - a healthy and natural phase in its time, but something to be outgrown in its turn, allowing you to once again embrace life's simple pleasures. "When I was ten, I read fairy tales in secret and would have been ashamed if I had been found doing so. Now that I am fifty, I read them openly. When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up." Or the dedication to LWW: "I wrote this story for you, but when I began it I had not realized that girls grow quicker than books. As a result you are already too old for fairy tales, and by the time it is printed and bound you will be older still. But some day you will be old enough to start reading fairy tales again. You can then take it down from some upper shelf, dust it, and tell me what you think of it. I shall probably be too deaf to hear, and too old to understand a word you say, but I shall still be your affectionate Godfather, C. S. Lewis."
@@rmsgrey I was originally going to have that quote but I couldn't find a clean place for it. And yes, that's why I tend to go with the false maturity interpretation over the unfortunately popular "Susan is in Hell for wearing lipstick" interpretation.
They focused on the lipstick because it make it seems as if her fate was to harsh for just loving lipstick. If you put her fate by the side of the real reason she was "punished" it make it seems less harsh of a punishment and that's not what they want.
So basically, Susan became an Instagram 'Influencer'.. A millennial-aged Tik-Tocker? cringe. Yeah, I would label that as, 'Silly behavior for a young woman,' for sure!
Without a doubt your best video yet. I would argue that "once a King or Queen..." is part of the Deep Magic and she was chosen because she will find her way. Rather than the 'problem of Susan' we should speak of the 'hope of Susan'.
I love how C.S Lewis ended Susan's story because it is relatable. There are so many of us that for whatever reason fall away & lose sight of it all. By not finishing her story & leaving the possibility of her return up to her choice it gives hope for us. We might have fallen away or made bad choices but it's never to late to make the choice to return & "become a friend of Narnia". I see Susan's story as relatable & a story of hope.
Interesting that you say she fell away and lost sight of it all. It's easy to say this for someone whose been to Narnia. How could someone choose to forget Narnia? Or pretend it never happened? But in real life it's pretty dismissive to say that for someone who say, for example, left Christianity. It's not as black and white as people make it out to be. Just a thought.
@@EPICNE55 I am a Christian & the experiences I have had as a Christian for me I could never forget them same as I feel Susan going to Narnia. I almost left my relationship with God during the hardest time of my life but even then I couldn't deny nor forget Gods existence nor my experiences. My husband however who has had similar experiences as me did leave the Lord & also me. He is now living life as if he never knew God but knowing the experiences he has had, I find it hard to believe he has forgotten but more simply "lost sight". I've experience of what I originally commented & so that's why I commented what I did. It wasn't emptily written ❤️
@@HopeWren I totally understand that. I thought the same way when I was a Christian. How could I ever choose to "forget" these experiences? How could I ever see the world in a different way? But a lot has changed in my understanding and knowledge, making me feel disillusioned with my foundational beliefs, perhaps like Susan.
I always thought Susan's bitterness toward Narnia was from feeling rejected by it and by Aslan, when he said she and Peter were too old and couldn't go back. If I was Susan, I would've been horribly upset over that as well.
Peter, Edmund, and Lucy were also told by Aslan that they were too old to return to Narnia, yet they remained “friends of Narnia.” So why should Susan feel more upset about it than they did? No, her problem is different.
That actually makes so much sense why she then lost herself in the idea of being "a grown-up" and convinced herself that Narnia was just a childish dream. Because being told that the reason why Narnia adventures are over for her is really that she's grown too old for it, I can't blame her for coming to the conclusion that she has to leave Narnia behind, because obviously it was just for being a child and therefore must have just been a childish dream, in her head. Sad.
@@rizerez7982 Yes. Because being told you'll always be a queen, you suddenly get kicked out because you aged out of Narnia - Aslan really mucked up here. And unfortunately Susan never found out that Professor Kirk had witnessed the creation of Narnia, which included three grownups (not counting the witch) ending up there. So that she was too old makes no sense at all. But that's what she was told. So trying to shield herself from a festering heart ache, she tried so hard to move on and forget about her adventures in Narnia. I would've done the same thing. Maybe never got interested in the same sorts of things, but I would've found something to occupy my time.
All the arguments above forgot about one major thing; Narnia is REAL to them. It wasn't a childish dream like how Susan mentioned it to Lucy. It wasn't because she aged up that she were left out; if those were the arguments then Diggory and Plummer wouldn't even be there at all. The core of Susan's problem is not in gender or growing up or any of it; it was the problem of her belief. Susan is the grim reminder to us the readers. When we were child we believe in ideal world, in ideal life or in ideal way of living life. But after life pressed us down and offers us its convenience and persuades us to follow its will, we lose sight of what we believe and who we were meant to be. 'Once a king and queens of Narnia, always kings and queens of Narnia.' Susan were one of Aslan's chosen, and she would always be that. But unlike how Aslan shows love to her family that was taken away from her, she was spared from the fate so she, like Aslan mentioned to Lucy, 'Learned to know me by it (His other name)'.
In the Bible, it is written that we, as spiritual beings cannot only have milk to grow. We need real solid food. I feel like this connects well to the comment. Aslan and they walk side by side as they began but now as they grew up, they have to live in the 'real' world where despite not having the access to go back there and live that sweet spiritual life where they're led and guided by Aslan (despite the wars and so on), they have to learn to live by themselves yet continually have faith. That's the only way we can truly exercise our free will where we CHOSE to believe despite the 'absence'. We know for sure that God still remains with us.
I've always had the notion that it wasn't the nylon, lipstick, or parties than were in and of themselves the issue, but her fixation on them. She cannot have two gods in her life, and, in that point of her life, chose one over the other. I do appreciate that Lewis /did/ leave her potential return open, and didn't make it a closed case of her remaining lost forever.
This is my thought exactly, because in Christianity, you have false idols which distract you from the True God, and the lipsticks and parties became an idol for her.
@@lilshorty5986 I was thinking the same thing----Christianity is about separating yourself from the world but the things that Susan got into were very worldly and she forgot the wonderful things that come from God. You can't serve two masters
This exactly. It wasn’t liking these things that was a problem, but liking them to the exclusion of God. The problem was treating Aslan and Narnia (obvious analogues to God and faith and heaven) as children’s stories and falling away from them. She wasn’t taken to Aslan’s country literally because she CHOSE not to go with her siblings. Because she did not want to go. She is still alive, and has plenty of years to change her mind.
Remind me of the Bible verse of how we can't serve two masters or else we will end up loving and revering one and rejecting and hating the other. Just as Yahuah and Yahusha warn about not being lured into worshipping idols of pagan gods, traditions or doctrines of men which are vain and lesser things, and not being deceived by philosophy and false knowledge which leads away from Yahuah the most high.
Whereas my view was always that Susan was the only one of the four children who actually stayed true to Aslan. Aslan was very clear when He told them they weren't allowed to come back to Narnia and that they should be living their lives in their own world. The other three defied Aslan's word and went after the rings. The other three judged Susan, because they were self-righteous hypocrites who held on to the memory of the journey, but forgot the literal word of God and the mission they'd been given. Aslan forgave them for both defying Him and misjudging Susan, as an act of grace.
I have always taken comfort in the assurance from Aslan: Once a King of Queen of Narnia, ALWAYS a King or Queen of Narnia. Susan is not lost. She simply has a different story from the others. I for one think it would make a FASCINATING story to read about Susan's journey back to faith and eventually, perhaps as a very old woman surrounded by her children, grand-children, and great-grandchildren, back to Aslan's Country.
My thought exactly, Michael. I think having children in her life and sharing fairy tales with them could be a potential key for her. Fairy tales are filled with fantasy, but they are still very much about our world. The same as Lewis' good friend Prof Tolkein and his world. Maybe that will remind Susan of Narnia, and memories will flood back, until she can't deny any longer that they really did happen.
Getting to “Aslan’s Country” happens later for some…Who says she couldn’t change later on? She was not part of this story as her story here wasn’t over! No one said she went to hell. We don’t know the full story, like in The Horse and His Boy, we don’t hear another person’s story, just our own. Thanks for the video!
Besides, Aslan didn't say she was lost to Narnia. He said 'Once a king or queen of Narnia, always a king or queen of Narnia'. I would've liked to have seen how Lewis would've told the story, but I like the idea of her finding her own way back to Narnia.
Your conclusion is similar to the one I had as a teenager when I read the series again. I can certainly see the sexist interpretation now that you brought it to my attention. However, for me as a child and young adult, it was about the fact that people lose faith. It is a serious struggle in CS Lewis life, and all of ours, to keep trusting in God when our life here is day in day out. Lewis himself was raised Christian but after many years of sorrow he became Athiest. He, like a lot of us who don't have faith, focus solely on his ambitious goals and treated scripture as a text of fairytales about a God that doesn't care. Later on he refound his faith and remembered God. Susan, I am sure, represents that part of all of us who fear death and see this life as it. Many of us as children couldn't wait to gain "freedom" as an adult, and as an adult try desperately to recapture that simplicity of childhood. As an adult, I saw Susan as the Woman at the Well. A woman who thought she knew God, but a twisted one made NY religious discord in her country, and did not feel loved. She tried her best to find it in man but each one used her and cast her out. Only when she met the Messiah, did she know and accept real love. I also see, as my personal interpretation, that Susan represents what happens to us that do believe when we let our minds dwell not on God and heavenly things but on earthly matters and delights. Which it is harder to break out of that prison when you once trusted than it is for those who never trusted at all.
True.. Same problem... It was only simplified as not being a friend of Narnia but it is in fact just losing faith, losing that sense of belief in that certain reality.
I have given Susan's story a little thought. At first I felt her story was one of falling away from faith. But that does not make sense since she personally knew Aslan and had witnessed his sacrifice and resurrection. It would be harder to completely separate herself from Aslan due to this personal history. Another person mentioned that Susan is the reader personified. This is an interesting thought as then her story becomes our story. At the end of the Voyage of the Dawn Treader Lucy and Edmund are being sent home and are wanting to return to Narnia soon and see Aslan again. Aslan tells them that he is in their world too. "But there I have another name. You must learn to know me by that name. This was the very reason why you were brought to Narnia, that by knowing me here for a little, you may know me better there." So perhaps Susan's unfinished tale is how she must learn who Aslan is in her world after her family dies. Perhaps... I read somewhere that C.S. Lewis did plan to write a book about Susan of Narnia, but am not sure this is true. There are collection of C.S. Lewis letters put into books and one letter goes like this: “I could not write that story myself. Not that I have no hope of Susan’s ever getting to Aslan’s country; but because I have a feeling that the story of her journey would be longer and more like a grown-up novel than I wanted to write. But I may be mistaken. Why not try it yourself?” What I am seeing from the Narnia books and a couple of C.S. Lewis' letters, is that Susan's focus had changed post Narnia. And she was striving to be a contemporary version of a 21 year old young women with a superficial and selfish existence that lives only for the moment. I can easily imagine her trying to imitate Hollywood artists in her fashion and surrounding herself with other young people like herself. But then the train wreck happens and Susan's whole life is changed in an instant. I imagine that the people Susan had thought were her friends were probably a bit superficial and were uncomfortable with Susan's grief. I imagine Susan ends up feeling very much alone and lost. With grief and pain of this magnitude, she will be faced with a choice of blaming God and turning to Him for strength. Because Susan personally knew Aslan, so I see her ultimately turning towards God and becoming a person of strength for others - especially outsiders and the lonely and grieving souls. I can see her story arch being a bit similar to Edmund the Just. I see her changing her life from a superficial one, to a life of service. I can see her no longer wanting to choose a life of comfort and ease. I can see her having many incredible adventures on earth due to her convictions and faith. Perhaps she becomes a missionary. Or perhaps her adventures are closer to home but she is still an ambassador for Christ. Perhaps she works some as a nurse or a teacher. Susan Pevensie does have a story that is worth being told. I very much see her taking a similar path of having fallen away from faith as an adolescent like C.S. Lewis did and coming back to faith in a stronger way after the pain she goes through. Perhaps she becomes a writer and ends up writing about her childhood adventures in Narnia with her family. I picture her as an old woman responding to letters like Lewis did. And perhaps in one letter she explains how she returned to her faith. Then after writing this letter, she lays down to go to sleep, she appears to start to dream of Aslan, of the Real Narnia, and she sees her family. She embraces Aslan and her family with tears of joy. Then Aslan tells her she will never have to leave again and that she is now home in the Real Narnia. As Professor Kirke said at the end of the Loin, the Witch, and the Wardrobe, "Once a King (or Queen) in Narnia, always a King (or Queen) in Narnia." Susan's story I believe can be one of redemption and hope (much like C.S. Lewis' real life story is).This is how I picture her story.
Yes, Hannah. It's very much a 'Find The World but Lose Faith' situation with Susan. It happens that way with some people. Others are caught up in Faith that The World doesn't matter any more. But there are those who find balance. They love this world and all the good in it. But they also know that there is far more than this world can offer, and that is found through Faith. The Friends of Narnia have learned this. Polly and Diggory are especially awe inspiring. Imagine how long it is since they were in the Newborn Narnia. And yet, even with all their years living in this world, they have still held onto the equally real world of Narnia. But as many of us have said. There is much hope for Susan. Not only was she a beloved queen in Narnia, but she and Lucy witnessed Aslan's Resurrection at The Stone Table. Such a memory is surely tucked away, deep in her memory, waiting to be found again. It's just a matter of when and how.
Her story could still make a good film as she learns to be aNarnian Warrior Queen again. She did become a women and was probably dating men or not. Perhaps her memories were confused from trauma. Trauma does powerful things to the brain you see things differently.
What troubles me about Susan is that Aslan rejected her first. She fought beside Narnians to defeat Jadis, then returned when Caspian needed help. Then, both Peter and Susan were told to not come back. In a real situation, how do you deal with that? How do you fall in love with a place, spend 15 years as a co-ruler, to return to childhood, be called back yet again, and then told to carry on in the mundane world and not return? Peter may have stayed hopeful, but I can see how a heartbroken Susan would have grieved by trying to forget everything. When your world loses its color, maybe lipstick and nylons are the best you can do. I always found it cruel of Lewis to make her an orphan. I understand that tragedy can bring your eyes back to God, but as one of the two who cried over Aslan’s sacrificed body, that was harsh.
I can appreciate that Susan, with the limited worldview we all wrestle with, might have felt rejected. But we learn that it wasn't a rejection at all, but a call to know Him better in this world. Losing her entire family in one stroke might have seemed cruel, I suppose, but it is also perhaps a pretty good reflection of reality. Many people suffer greatly, and I'd say in most cases, the suffering is independent of whether they deserve it. And perhaps all the grief she works through becomes the catalyst for her to reach for Him again.
They really need to make a BBC miniseries that tells of Susan’s grief of the loss of her family after the train accident, how she coped with her grief, and how it helps her rediscover her belief in Narnia and Aslan. For it to be good though, the producers are going to have to do A LOT of research on this by exploring her character and how C.S. Lewis himself overcame his own grief and rediscovered his belief in God.
I wouldn’t trust the current BBC to get any of that right. Susan would become a modern feminist, seeking revenge against Aslan (a stand-in for oppressive religious patriarchy) because he murdered her family. And one of the siblings would need to be played by a black actor or actress, either for realistic relatability or because this is a fantasy and doesn’t need to be realistic.
@@hayleybartek8643 I love how you had to go into histrionics about race, that's totally not telling on yourself there. Your script would be an unironic improvement.
That would make a really moving series or movie. Because, I think C S Lewis was right that it wouldn't fit into the ambiance of these children's stories. But I think it could take inspiration from Lewis' own journey.
Susan was always and still is my favorite. Mostly because she is more similar to myself. In my faith It too comes and goes. But each time it comes back, it's stronger than before. Even when I read the Last Battle as a kid. I was sad at first my favorite did not return. But I was also glad she did not die early like the others. And as Aslan said to them. "Once a king or queen of Narnia, akways a king or queen of Narnia." If Susan would not one day return to Aslan's Country, than he would not have said that. Also, in most cases of individuals that loose their entire family at once. They tend to find something they shared with them to hang on to. And well in her case, Narnia.
I always thought, even as a child reading the series, that it was Susan's choice to turn her back on Narnia - not the other way around and I always hoped she found her way back.
Hey, wouldn't it be funny if Susan, while sitting in a church after her friends had died, met a man named "Clive Lewis," and they got to talking, and Susan told him a wild tale - a tale she swore was true - about her childhood, and going to another world. A world where time passed differently from our own, with magic and talking animals and giants, dwarves, fauns and other mythical creatures ruled by a Great Lion - and all the adventures she and her brothers and sister and their friends had there fighting against a Wicked White Witch and becoming Kings and Queens and growing up in that magical land - and it turned out THAT was the source and inspiration for "The Chronicles of Narnia"?
I always took it to mean she had grown up and become preoccupied with all the things that were expected of her as an adult, and nothing more. Lucy was still young enough that she could get away, and the boys were men, so they didn't have the same expectations of planning parties and attending social events out of seeming necessity of "social ethics". But Susan couldn't escape those expectations, so she had been swallowed up by the worldly cares that didn't make her an enemy of Aslan, but just estranged from him.
That's how I've read it too. She's been through a lot of trauma (they all have) what with the wars (in England and in Narnia), becoming a fully-grown adult with power only to be a young woman in 1940s England again. Being forced out of the only place she'd ever really have much power or deep-seated respect because she's "too old". I've always thought that of the three, Susan was the most adept at diplomatic relations, is it no wonder she throws herself into being a socialite to distance herself from what must surely be bittersweet memories? As you said, Peter and Edmund are men, they had mobility and respect she could not have at that time. And Lucy was young enough that she was considered a child still. I think Susan's response to the life she's been thrown into a again is, while not the healthiest choice, one that makes sense for her character and is consistent. Of all the siblings, I adore her and Edmund the most. I hope she was able to find healing somehow. I like the headcanon (obviously not true) that in-universe, Susan is writing under the psuedonym C.S. Lewis, and that the books are her way of coming to terms of what happened.
This is the solid analysis we've been waiting for! You make a good point -- the Pevensies weren't being callous, because they didn't know about the accident yet. When they do find out, they're swept up in the experience of heaven, and are too distracted to ponder Susan's fate back in the Shadowlands. Anyway, as for that line about "lipstick, nylons, and invitations", I always took that to mean that Susan had become a typical teenager, which is hardly an unforgivable offense. The books don't even touch on the consequences, but it's safe to say that the massive trauma of losing her family would shock Susan out of her selfish, vain lifestyle and attitude, and would lead to much soul-searching. I agree that her story would be more mature in nature. I gave a basic outline in an earlier comment, but I'll recap -- The Last Battle mentions that the magic rings were dug up and in the possession of the Friends of Narnia when the accident occurred. Susan being next-of-kin would naturally inherit those rings, bringing her to the Wood Between Worlds. That must be what's intended, otherwise the book wouldn't go out of its way to tie up that loose end. There she would find Narnia's puddle dried up, since that world ended, and maybe she'd blow her horn and meet Aslan in the wood. I think Aslan would reassure her that if he forgave her brother Edmund for treason, surely she can be forgiven for losing faith. I don't think she would return to Narnia, because while Narnian time flows differently, it's never depicted flowing backwards. The window to enter that world was from 1900-1950, and that window closed. However, there are countless other worlds, and I think Aslan would direct her to a different puddle, and tell her that she has a key role to play in that world, and that she could get to know him there, but not in the form of a lion. As for the rest, it's very open-ended. A few more things to say. Neil Gaiman's take on this was an absolute travesty. I respect him quite a bit as an artist, but his talents lie elsewhere, in other kinds of stories. Narnia is supposed to be a fairytale, and dark/edgy/subversive content simply doesn't belong there. I also don't think Susan would grow old and bitter in our world, rather she would embark on a new adventure, and I believe she would eventually be redeemed and make it to Aslan's Country, which as we're told intersects with all worlds. Pardon me for the long comment, I had alot to cover. One final point, going off on a tangent -- I think the most supremely ironic thing about the Chronicles of Narnia is that the books end with the world destroyed and most characters dead, yet it's a happy ending.
I understand the real point about Susan, she isn't there because she gave up her faith - and, more pragmatically, because she didn't believe in Narnia and Aslan, she also simply wasn't on the train and thus didn't die. But at the same time I do think the level of disdain in the comments from other characters about her focus on nylons, lipstick, and wanting to stay in a "silly" time of life muddled the message. It does make it sound like enjoying/being interested in those things in and of themselves is a sign of a faithless person. Especially since two of the three things mentioned pretty much only bring female associations to mind, the idea that they might be a "bad sign" has unfortunate implications. I don't think that was the intent, but I also think the actual point would be clearer if left at "she's no longer a friend of Narnia and has stopped believing," possibly noting directly that she'd become conceited like in the letter he wrote later. But I think tying particular, very feminine details to the explanation was a choice that it might have been better not to make.
Finally! Some who truly understands "The Problem of Susan" the way C.S. Lewis intended us to interpret it. She may be lost now, but Susan is always welcome into Aslan's Country once she returns to her childlike faith and believes in Narnia once again. Because once a king or queen of Narnia, always a king or queen. 🏹❤️ Thank you so much for making this video!
Thank you for this video, I've seen a lot of folks on some websites claim that what happened to Susan was because Lewis was sexist (not so far from what Rowling said in hindsight), but when you consider that Lucy is one if not the most important character in his books (having found the wardrobe and being the one to believe the most in Narnia and Aslan), and that she grew up and in the end returned to Narni too, that doesn't hold. It's interesting to see that you came to a similar conclusion as mine: that Susan will eventually return to Narnia, but that she need to find her own way back. And just like you said, she most likely mirrors Lewis' own story. Personnally, I assume that Susan lost her "faith" in Narnia because she was always the most pragmatic and logic-driven of the siblings, and she may not have accepted what happened to Narnia and the Narnias she knew during LWW and her ultimate depature at the end of PC as well as her siblings. According to wikipedia (the source being a somewhat autobiography of Lewis), Lewis described his young self as "very angry with God for not existing" and "equally angry with him for creating a world". Now, take into consideration that Susan may be mirroring Lewis, and these two sentences could very well apply to her too. Imagine living 15 years in a world, growing up as an adult, then returning 1300 years later to that same world, with all the people you knew being long dead, having been powerless to do anything about it, probably, deep down, not understanding why Aslan didn't do anything to change this (while at the same time knowing why he wasn't there), and then having to leave it for good. After all, Susan was the gentle queen, maybe I'm reaching a bit but I can see her having chosen to distance herself from Narnia because she cared a lot about her subjects, and the grief of losing people you knew and never returning to that place ever again was too hard to accept if she remembered it as something that was real. So to have an easier time dealing with her emotions, she chose to pretend it was just a childish memory. But I don't think she ever forgot about it, merely that she lost faith in Narnia and/or Aslan, just like Lewis lost faith in God for (what I intepret his words as) creating the world but not being an active part of it. And if Lewis found his way back to faith, I have no doubt that he knew that Susan would find her way back to Narnia.
Susan isn`t like this because the author was sexist, but he still was. You can`t ignore the slightly sexist parts of the book. That doesn`t make the books bad or the author, but we also can`t ignore simple facts.
Susan is us: those of us who have seen the goodness of Narnia and Aslan but for one reason or another lose faith in them and our way. But as has been said a lot lately "Just because someone stumbles and loses their way doesn't mean they're lost forever". It is my profound hope that although she now had a much more difficult path to get there that Susan (like CS Lewis and us) found her way back to Aslan's Country and became a friend of Narnia once again. Once a King and Queen of Narnia, always a King and Queen of Narnia.
I actually love Susan story I think this is what makes her a multidimentional character I think her story is what keeps the Chronicles open for adults who now can relate so much her journey . Beyond the religious part we at some point lost that innocence part of us, growing up is hard her story is not over yet and after all like you said, once a queen she will be forever a queen.
I firmly believe this video will be quoted and shown in the following days,weeks, months, and years , to give the real problem of Susan. It took until the second decade of the 21st century for Into The Wardrobe explain us the truth. Thanks to Stuart and the team.
This was a Wonderful video! I'm so glad that Narnia is finally being discussed again in such a thoughtful manner. I've never understood the 'problem of Susan' because there is no problem in my eyes. Susan rejected Narnia and Aslan upon returning to earth, so why would he take her away from the life she had chosen, and into the life that she actively tried to reject? Of course, Susan would be emotionally devastated by such a loss, but her family had chosen to remain friends of Narnia. Why should they be denied access to Aslans country because of the choices of Susan? I also think people misunderstand what is being implied by the whole 'nylons, parties, and lipstick' issue. They don't represent her femininity or sexuality, they represent the reason why she rejected Narnia in the first place. She wanted to appear grown up and uninterested in childish things, such as Narnia, so lipstick and nylons are just used as examples of the 'grown up' things Susan has rejected narnia in favour of.
This is what makes “Prince Caspian” one of my favorite Narnia books. In the chapter “The Lion Roars” we see the characterization CS Lewis already placed in Susan; a most-slow-to-believe spirit. I especially relate to this passage, when Aslan calls her name and says, “you have listened to fears, child.”
In some ways, I find Susan's story to be CS Lewis's version of St. Thomas; someone who places the "truths" of this world about the Truth. "Because thou hast seen [the Risen Christ], thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed." I definitely agree that her implicit journey back to Salvation is one of the clearest links or calls to action for the audience; you do not need to go on these incredible adventures to reach Heaven, you only need to believe.
I wouldn’t find the ending for Susan so distasteful if Lewis hadn’t written her “epilogue” in a condescending tone, vilifying girly things like many sexists do. It would’ve sufficed to say that she had been engrossed with mundane stuff and therefore wasn’t willing to face the fantasy of Narnia anymore, instead of bringing up what the author thinks are examples of this
I think JK Rowling's comment about Susan demonstrated a complete lack of understanding of that character and of the Narnia books in general. You've hit the nail on the head. It wasn't that she liked lipstick (or sex), it's that she rejected Narnia. We've all know "that teen" that's obsessed with fashion, the opposite sex, and partying. Sometimes there are also multiple sexual partners, sometimes substance abuse. Very often, that kind of high-risk lifestyle leads to grief--or at least a medical scare. Regardless, for most people, they have to outgrow that lifestyle. They eventually have to make a living rather than partying most nights. Showing up to work with a hangover isn't a good way to hang on to your job. Nor is addiction. The partying dries up as the rest of the crowd grows up, moves away, or has to go to rehab. They eventually learn that a committed relationship, or singlehood with solid friendships, bring a lot more happiness and security than lots of short and shallow relationships. Sometimes all of that happens in the normal course of maturity, sometimes shock or grief brings it on. Every once in a while, someone doesn't seem to outgrow that state. Depending on their socioeconomic status, they may end up constantly in the tabloids, constantly be checking in and out of rehab, or end up on the street. But I think you're right, Susan would have been strongly affected by the loss of her family, and she was always too smart and practical to be a party girl forever. I agree, she would have eventually returned to Narnia.
Maybe the reason we empathize with Susan so much is because we are also Susan. We are apart from Narnia and struggling with earthly trials. Maybe it's meant for us as well to hopefully find our way back. What a beautiful video!
I think that Susan's problem for the first time is described in "Prince Caspian" - she started listening to her fears and in that way she lost her faith in Aslan. Then, meeting with the Lion helped her, but after that she had to leave Narnia. And I know that it was the last time in Narnia for Peter as well, but he didn't have the same problem as Susan - he kept his faith in Aslan and Narnia, so after the train accident he was sent to Aslan's Realm.
I think this is the most sensible study of the so called problem of Susan. Refreshing to hear commonsense prevail. Stuart talks about the REAL problem of Susan. Congratulations on superb video addressing a delicate subject.
@@IntotheWardrobe Welcome. I think analysis of Susan in LWW and PC ( foreshadowing ) will help get a clearer understanding of why she was not a friend of Narnia. Textual criticism.
I never connected that part about Susan's horn but that just goes to show how truly beautiful these books were and what careful intention C.S. Lewis showed in writing them. Will you go over other Lewis books too, like the Space Trilogy?
THANK YOU. It's so frustrating when people take the most uncharitable interpretation of Susan's story arc. Finally a video explaining the facts of the situation.
This video struck a deep chord with me. In my youth (I'm 32), I found Christ. I had a friend who was attending a church. I decided to attend with him, and I found I enjoyed it. The music, the fellowship, the youth group. I started attending regularly. I attended until I was 18, and left for college. I had a hard time finding a replacement church. Ultimately, that's one of many factors I could say that put me in a path to falling out of love with Christ. I was becoming an adult. I was more cynical, I was losing my child-like faith. I was not raised Christian. I came to church of my own accord. Still...over the next few years, I was exposed to college, and experimented, and fell further and further away. I attended a Christian school in 2012, to 2015. I wanted so badly to be a missionary. After my internship fell apart...I lost hope. This was truly the beginning of the end of my optimistic faith. I no longer held hope. I left school for a time, and could not return, due to accrued debt. I'm going to pay it off this year, but still. To this very day, while I cling with my white knuckles to the edge...part of me wants to give up my faith. But I know there is purpose for me out there. He has purpose for me. I'm trying to regain my flame, my hope. These days especially, it is hard. So I identify with Susan and C.S. Lewis in their personal journeys. Except I'm trying to try. I sin daily, but the Lord is there...in the back of my mind. I don't forget Him.
The ending has no empathy. It makes sense she didn't make it to Aslan country given her character arc but the lack of empathy and dismissive tone is what the story conveys. None of the friends of Narnia care about Susan's fate and so the readers are told they to should not care. I agree it not an attack on the unbelief its a celebration of believing but in that celebration there was no empathy for unbelief even for a previous main character like Susan.
Thank you. You have nailed it on the head entirely, understanding C. S. Lewis's purpose and beliefs. If Susan believed Narnia to be a myth, when she appeared in Aslan's country she would have, like the dwarves, not correctly seen and understood everything around her. How awful would that have been for her and the Seven Friends for her to be in paradise and be unable to see it and understand where she was! C. S. Lewis gives Susan a second chance to remember what is really important, doing to her similar things to what happened to him in real life: his mother died when he was a child and as an adult, he experienced the horrors of WWI.
Thank you for pointing out that Susan's path in life was most likely meant to mirror that of C.S. Lewis. And it's not an uncommon path. I've seen several people, who were brought up in the church, sometimes since birth, fall away later in life. Usually during teenage years. Some stay away, some return to their faith, but I think ultimately many of us, who were raised in Christian homes from a young age, needed to figure out if we believe all of it because we were told to or because we truly do believe it.
Susan is basically Lewis and Lewis saw himself as the prodigal son when he became an atheist as a youth before Tolkien helped convert him to Christianity albeit he became a Protestant instead Catholic which disappointed Tolkien
THIS VIDEO IS AMAZING! I never noticed the parallels between Susan and C.S Lewis & now it seems so obvious! Seriously one of my favourite videos you've made.
@@allison3852Caspian’s marriage & son are in “The Silver Chair”, only his marriage is mentioned at the very end of “Dawn Treader”. The romantic slant to Caspian is one of the main objections fans have to the Disney movies. While Caspian had grown up, Lucy was definitely still a child on the Dawn Treader & Susan wasn’t there at all.
What I think is that... "Susan" is so much related to all of us... Sometimes we fall out of grace because of our choices... But we are never been left behind by Aslan... He's just waiting for us to come back and be the a Queen of Narnia.
I just wanted to say thank you for your explanation of Susan. You really explained it well, and gave it justification. As a friend of Narnia, I’m going with your explanation of Susan. It makes the most sense. Yes, once a king or queen of Narnia, always a king or queen! That includes Susan. One day, she will return…..
Aslan said that they would know him a little here so to know him more there (their world). This leaves the way open for Susan to know Jesus in her world and thus get to Aslan's land (Heaven). After reading the series 4 times I too felt should would make it in the end.
@@Provocative-K Of course Aslan is Christ. Jesus is, after all, the Lion of Judah. And Aslan is also portrayed as a Lamb towards the end of The Voyage of the Dawn-Treader... And He's cooking breakfast... Admittedly this is in the book
I always viewed Susan's story line/arc as like the "Prodigal Son" and the train wreck of her family and true friends is/will be the start of her low point. What I find telling is that, in PC if I recall, as they were sent back to our world Aslan gave them a "directive" to find Him in our world and learn more of Him.
Very nicely done. I've read The Last Battle twice. Once when my parents bought me the boxed set when I was ten, and again in my later teens when I had had setbacks in my faith. I, in some ways, had lost my own Narnia, much as Susan had lost hers. Mine was not so much lost through intent as it was through . . . I'll say the choices of others based on my own wild, if joyful, actions, because it's a long explanation otherwise. I remember little of the book because I hated it. I hated the twist of the ending (even more when one of my best friends was killed in a car accident months later) and the loss of Narnia. I didn't even remember that Susan was not among the four Pevensies in the book, but nor did I remember that any others from our world were in the book either. The story hurt me deeply as a youth, and even the brief reference to it in this video hurts me now as a man in my fifties. But this is about Susan, so on to it. As I remind people at times, no one cares about me, not even me oftentimes. Susan's loss of Narnia was (like mine to what had been my real world equal) self-inflicted, as referenced in the video about the passage from Prince Caspian. She seemed to suffer from insecurity and tried to act like the people she admired in the real world, who acted like grown-ups. Even in Dawn Treader Susan was the one Pevensie who got to go on the lecture tour with their parents as it was said that she would get the most out of the trip. What she got, seemingly, was reinforcement of the idea to discard the things that the outer world didn't value and embrace the things the outer world did value. How different her future might have been if she had had to spend her holidays at the Scrubbs! I would say that Susan's path is the harder one partly because it took her away from Narnia. Her punishment is, ironically enough, to survive instead of to die. And I see value in the theory that Susan is on the same sort of path that C.S. Lewis was through his twenties and early thirties. Whether this was an intentional plan of Jack Lewis is not for us to know: we are only told our own stories, no one else's. I wonder who she would meet that might have been for her what Tolkien was to Lewis: a guide back to her own more pure and positive beliefs in deep spiritual things that matter instead of ephemeral worldly things that do not matter. Perhaps I'll write my own story about it someday. But once a King or Queen in Narnia, always a King or Queen in Narnia, as Aslan told them ever so long ago, and I believe the lion. It is my own belief that Susan will have her opportunities to make her way back to being a friend of Narnia and to once again, in the proper time, be with her brothers and sister as Kings and Queens in Narnia. But I wish I had made the same wise choice that my little sister did years, decades, ago when she borrowed my books. She has never read The Last Battle. "Why?" I asked her. "Because as long as I don't read it, then the stories haven't ended." she replied. She's much wiser than I am, and I regret having read this book still.
I was young enough (6) the first time I heard the story that I was disappointed in Susan, but never gave the matter much thought beyond that at the time. A few years later, when re-reading the story, I thought a bit more deeply about it and concluded that Susan would eventually make it back to Narnia in the end, but that it would probably take a lifetime. This has been my position ever since, bolstered by encountering the same account of Lewis' letter to a fan concerning Susan's potential fate. However, I had never thought of the direct parallel between Susan and Lewis himself.
Even though it's controversial, the idea that she was so distraught that she changed her name and became Jane Studdock of Lewis's book "That Hideous Strength" is a favorite fringe theory of mine (And head canon for me personally.)
Ooh, I like this thought. My sister's take was that she ended up repressing everything and going to college, and then a painting of a lion speaks to her and she freaks out because she thinks she's going nuts. So she goes and asks a trusted professor for advice. Said professor turns out to be CS Lewis, and that's how he got the idea to write the stories. Now I'm not sure which take I like better, yours or hers.
What a wonderful video! I remember being so shocked when I first found out about Susan, reading those lines as a child and just being confused why they even included them in the first place. But taking 20 years to grow I understand it. Part of growing up is realizing that it isn't something that happens automatically, really growing and learning happens every moment of your life. I enjoy your rather positive take on her fate, and I'm glad to see Lewis didn't have as grave intentions for her as I initially thought
Once a king or queen of Narnia, ALWAYS a king or queen of Narnia. Aslan doesn't give up on his people, and neither does Jesus. Susan may have pushed her faith away but she'll find it again eventually, and when she does it'll be greater than anyone else's.
Another spanner in the works here is that Lucy, the younger and more trusting sister, is often interpreted as being Susan's "opposite" and so a lot of fans thought Lewis saw younger girls as more likable than their older counterparts. I don't believe that - they're just different, like all siblings/group members and the stories would be much less enjoyable if they weren't. PS I once came up with a fanfiction where an adult Susan became the "Professor Kirke" to a new generation of children having an adventure in another world. They would eventually discover that 'their' world is another watched over by Aslan (with a different name and form) and Susan would actually die at the end, her spirit rising clad in the robes and armour of a queen with her bow and horn in her hands. A gateway appears with shining figures beyond it and Susan asks one of the kids how she looks - although the child is heartbroken because they have to say goodbye, their answer is "You look ready". Smiling and fearless, Susan's spirit walks through the gateway and the children hear her greet the shining figures with names like "Ed" and "Lu" as they fade away.
And plus leaving Susan alive at the end kinda makes sense because Lucy was the day 1 believer, Peter was the high king and Edmund was the traitor turned good guy who became became a just king when he ruled Narnia
you did a great job at integrating c.s. lewis' beliefs and life struggles into this. i know that this series is faith inspired but kudos to you for not shying away from openly talking about that aspect. keep up the good work
i always felt Susan's story was so sad and kind of unfair. i understand the purpose of not having her join Aslan's country just yet, as she is not ready, but all the other characters seem so mean. I Think her life is just so full of suffering. When she came to Narnia for the first time she was just a teenager, and was developing her personality. After they defeat the witch she grows up in a world of happiness and peace. But she is suddenly forced to go back to our world, to re-adjust to being a teenager AGAIN, and to deal with so much conflict and problems, it was WWII after all. i can't imagine the pain that can bring. She must have felt like her life was stolen. I believe that in order to cope she convinced herself it was just make-believe. In order to be able to live in our world she had to let go of all her good memories of Narnia. That's why she is so dismissive and lost her belief. I just wish the others had more compassion for her.
The others do have compassion for her because they all literally went through the exact same thing. They all had the same experiences as Susan. The only difference is how they all chose to handle it. Susan has no excuse. The others chose to keep their faith throughout all the pain and challenges while Susan chose to lose her faith. This is the same choice that we are all given during our time on earth, and we will all be held accountable for our choices. There is a difference between offering compassion to someone, and completely excusing someone of all responsibility for their own bad behavior. They aren't mean to her or uncompassionate. But they aren't going to pretend that she made a good decision either. Everyone has to be held accountable for their own choices. The compassion and forgiveness is that the door is always open for her to come back. It wasn't slammed on her, and it never will be. If she walks through, she'll be welcomed with open arms. The only reason why she's not there is because she's refusing to walk through or even see the door. That's what it means to be unrepentant. It's that choice that they rightfully call out as being misguided and silly. Hell/unrepentance is a place where a person dying of thirst (Susan) can be offered water as an act of compassion from others (her family trying to remind her of Narnia). But if you are unrepentant, you will just knock that water out of their hand and curse them for offering it to you (Susan dismissing it all as make-believe). If those people who tried to help later say that the person knocking the water away was a foolish decision, that's not being uncompassionate. That's calling out the situation for what it is. The responsibility is on Susan not her family. You can not save somebody who refuses to be saved.
@@BlackNemesis13 you make a valid point and i agree with the second part of your opinion. But my opinion starts from the premise that Susan's experience was completely different from the start than that of her siblings. Maybe i didn't put it very well into words in my first comment. Of course, all the others chose to believe and be faithful to Narnia, but i can't believe it would be the same for Peter who was more mature both in age and mind, and Lucy who was much younger. These two would be the extremes of the age gap. I think for Susan it was already an extremely vulnerable moment in her life when Narnia appeared in their lives, compared to the others.
@@annaana350 I understand where you're coming from, but disagree. Susan was the second eldest of the Pevensie children. There was only one year's difference between her and Peter. Why would her experience be more difficult than her siblings?
@@chizzieshark thank you for your reply! I understand your point but have you ever seen siblings who are that similar that events influence them in the same way? I've never seen siblings, no matter how close in age that are similar in personality and traits. And i know we're speaking about fictional characters, but let's take the setting again. They're in UK where the WWII was particularly difficult for people, they had to be sent away from their home to survive, not being bombed overnight, worried sick about their parents, not knowing how long the war will last or if they will have famine on their hands to deal with. On top of that, she is 12 years old when sent away, at the beginning of her teenage years, which is a struggle by itself. Then.. they were blessed by being brought to Narnia where they could be strong, the heroes of that world. I believe they were brought to Narnia so they could take a break from the world and learn to hope and dream so when they come back they can face the challenges. After they defeat the witch they become kings and queens and reach maturity in Narnia, enjoy long lasting peace and being surrounded by friends. And at this sweetest moment they're brought right back to England, war, bombing and so on. Oh and they're teenagers again. I can't imagine how difficult it would be to have the experience and mind if an adult and being put into a 12 year old's body. And i believe her later behaviour started from all this. Sorry for the long explanation.
I really appreciate you taking the time to write out your thoughts here. You've expressed them well. I think there's one key factor in the equation that we have to keep in mind: Aslan. Aslan told all the children that he brought them to Narnia so that they would know him by another name in their world. Aslan loved and cared for each individual child according to their own individual personalities, strength, and weaknesses. To say that in the end Susan's personal disadvantages weren't enough to overcome her doubts is to say that Aslan was the one that failed her in the end. I suppose one person may see it one way and another may see it differently, but based on what we know about Aslan and his counterpart in this world I believe it makes more sense to say that Susan failed herself...at least for the time being.
Years ago, I had the idea of Susan...wracked by grief and guilt...having a breakdown and being institutionalized for several years. Then, two things occur. The first is that she hears a whispering voice telling her that the Lord of second chances has an adventure for her. The second is she receives a visit from Mark and Jane Studdock who have come from St Anne's and are part of the Logres. (from "That Hideous Strength") Jane has had a vision that she needs to go to the institution to rescue a queen. Now, I'm no writer, but I could see a story where Susan (who is the only one left in the world who has talked directly with Maleldil - in the form of Aslan) eventually after many adventures and trials becomes the director of St Anne's, the Pendragon and the Queen of the Logres, replacing the former director (Elwin Ransom) who left earth for a home on Perelandra (Venus), and restoring her relationship with Maleldil. From there, I could see a whole new "Chronicles of the Logres" books and at some point a very old Susan lays down her office and finally goes to Aslan's country.
I’m going to be honest with you. I’m not a Christian, am not a Narnia fan despite reading the books and seeing the movies, and you answered a lot of my criticism about the way Susan is written in the Last Battle. You’ve given me something to think about and I may reread the books to see if my mind changes. I only ask that you don’t ask me to Chuck out my Pullman books if I change my mind about Narnia lol.
@@IntotheWardrobe Have you done a video on why the kids aged out of Narnia? Like at the end of Prince Caspian when Aslan tells Peter and Edmund they are too old to return to Narnia, yet other humans like Telmarines are born, live, and become adults while living in Narnia. That never made sense to me.
I personally believe Jack (CS Lewis's nickname) did gave us the answer of Susan's fate, in his last book, Till We Have Faces, through the protagonist Orual. Like Susan, Orual has a troubling relationship with the Divine, loved and envied her young sister Psyche, but hated the Gods most of all for taking Psyche away from her. Its not until her dying days when she has a vision of her soul descending into the underworld to face judgment..... only for Psyche to find her and guide her out in to a sunlit field. In that knowledge, Orual's redemption is the mature and complex answer to Susan's salvation.
Yes, this is the best explanation for me. I always knew Susan made it to Narnia in the end, but I knew it would be different from the way her siblings got there. A lot of us lose our way and think we know what’s more important in life, but in the end, hopefully, we all make it back home.
The real problem is people don't realize how much of himself C.S. Lewis put into Susan. When you read the story of Lewis' own conversion you see it. Susan is him.
Wow...absolutely loved this take on Susan's life. I am 44 and I am just now finishing up the books, but it makes me want to re-read them again and see things I missed. But I have genuinely loved reading through these stories and seeing so many Biblical truth nuggets throughout. I cried at so many parts because it reminded me of times with God in my own story. I love hearing about how C.S. Lewis grew up in the faith and then became and atheist, only to come back to faith full on later and how similar that could be to Susan's life. I think it's great that there are not complete answers to it all because it does leave it open. I really enjoy your channel and it's fun since I have been reading through the stories with my kids.
Christianity gets the bad rap because people on the outside see Grace and Mercy as instant erasers that wipe away all the bad. They don’t see how Grace lends strength and courage in times of trouble, but there is still trouble. And Mercy forgives, but does not deny the crime was committed. I love the analogy of Susan as a reflection of Lewis’s own path through life. I’ve had many friends who were believers as children and then went through a time of doubt and disillusionment that led them astray. Sometimes personal tragedy led them into doubt, sometimes it was just poor decisions; whatever the cause, I always remember my mom saying, “Keep praying for them.” So rather than vilifying Narnia, let’s keep praying that Susan finds her way back to the path and home to her friends, family and Aslan.
@@girlypop22299 in a way yes. False Christians. Christian’s who dont actually follow Gods word but ignore it or take a few parts of it and try to make their own rules with it. But not all of us are fakes.
I love how you ended it with stuff about how Susan could follow C.S Lewis' path. The honestly made me tear up. And then the very end where you said, "Once a king/queen of Narnia, ALWAYS a king/queen of Narnia.
Her fall was her vanity, which is made very clear in the quote at the beginning. She came to only care about looking good, and being popular. It's pretty heavily implied just from the quotes about her that she's acting immature and not using her beauty correctly. Her rushing to "the silliest time in her life, and trying to stay there," shows she doesn't want to be beautiful for goodness, and to have good, healthy relationships. She wants to be beautiful because it gives her power and she enjoys that power. She's a silly immoral person, and hopefully can find her way back, but that isn't the issue. The real issue is people with similar flaws and sins feeling uncomfortable with their condemnation.
This is really interesting. I like how Susan's story is a little bit of a cliff hanger. The "what if's" flow from uncertainty. It almost is a way of pushing a descision to the reader. What are we going to choose? Friend of Narnia, or Forgetter of Narnia? Not only is Lewis putting his story into Narnia, but he is inviting us to go along with him.
Fantastic point. There's so much power in allowing the reader to make the choice. It forces the question to be addressed: which path is the better one? Love it so much, thanks for sharing.
Thank you for posting this video! This video has done justice for Susan. I was wondering when you will get to discuss about Susan. Susan has been one of my favorite character. I was sad that she didn't enter into Narnia. I had a feeling that she either represent unbelief or Lewis himself. I am glad that she was more like Lewis himself and the tragedies that he faced in his life. I do believe that Susan will get into Narnia one day.
I think reducing Susan’s absence to being concerned with lipstick simply didn’t age well. She was a woman in the 40s. What were her other options in the world in which she found herself? Surely it wasn’t just vanity or frivolity. I think Lewis’s perspective was purely of it’s time. Her fate was written in a way that makes the reader feel that she fell from grace and even committed some kind of betrayal for trying to survive as a woman of her era. It’s not just about makeup. She had to grow up. It wasn’t some failure of her own.
Plenty of women in the 40s weren't into lipstick or nylons. The point isn't that Susan liked those things - it's that she vainly pursued materialistic things and denied the existence of Narnia. As the video points out, the issue isn't that Susan grows up - it's that she thinks she has grown up, but is ironically stuck in a childish mindset.
I read a quote from C S Lewis about him reading fairy tales again in his 50s, and learning to not want to be 'too grown up'. Maybe that will happen with Susan? If she becomes a mother and hopefully a grandmother. Will she tell her little ones tales of Narnia? Maybe initially because she fancies that she's remembering childhood games with her siblings. But then, guided by her children's imagination, perhaps she'll begin remembering more details. It will slowly dawn on her that yes, these things really happened, and she'll long to see Narnia again. Maybe, her most desperate longing will come in the months before her death. And one day, someone in New Narnia will blow the horn and call Queen Susan The Gentle home again.
I think part of the problem readers have is that the way it’s written makes it sound like Susan is no longer a friend of Narnia *because* she became what is implied to be shallow and vain and no other reason, because of the way people talk about her.
Thank you so much for creating this, and I loved how you correlated Susan’s life with C.S. Lewis’ and gave hope at the end about “Once a king or queen in Narnia, always a king or queen in Narnia.” Beautiful job and keep up the great work! ☺️😊❤️
Part of what always bothered me about how Susan's fate was handled is that everybody just drags her for her choices. I think it would have felt less like she was being condemned for the mentioned things if ANYONE in the group had said that there was still hope for her. Is it supposed to be implied? Perhaps, but it was obviously missed by many readers.
This hit me just now so I thought I'd share it 1. Matthew 18:1-5 2. Proverbs 31:30-31 3. Matthew 16:19 4. Romans 5:3-5 To grow up does not mean abandoning the spirit of childhood but improving upon it. Femininity is not an excuse to leave spirituality but a cause to embrace it. Hell and all earthly things are a state of eternal separation from the Lord. Suffering makes us stronger and molds us into people worthy of God's grace.
I agree with this analysis. Reading the books for the first time I thought it was weird that Susan was described as no longer being a "friend of Narnia" at the end of the series. However, upon reflection I saw this as a great way for the author to give his audience (primarily children) a warning that just because you believe when you are a child does not mean your belief will not be seriously challenged as you grow up in a skeptical world which has very different priorities. Additionally, the fact that C.S. Lewis chose for that character to be the only survivor at the end of the book demonstrates that he did not intend for this to be (necessarily) the final state of Susan's faith. Rather, it was a way to warn his readers about how they choose to regard their own faith in a world that seeks to either distract from or outright discourage believe. In that way, Susan's fate is no more sealed than that of those reading his novels.
I loved Susan’s ending. It completely broke me down, I bawled and bawled when I read the Last Battle. If I could change one thing about the last battle, it would be a chapter, where Susan goes home to Lucy’s house, after the train accident. She cries cause she’s lost her whole family, and she starts going through Lucy’s old diaries. Lucy has been writing down all their adventures in Narnia, and through Lucys stories, Susan begins to remember.
This is a really great video, and hits the nail on the head! If we think about it, Susan's story and "problem" is one that happens in real life over and over, to very real people. In fact, for a moment, pretend with me that instead of this being a fantasy story written by C.S. Lewis, let's imagine that Susan is a REAL person, someone we know personally, and is a close friend of ours. And this friend just recently experienced the loss of her entire family, and as a result has lost faith in God. Wouldn't we who are Christians want to come along beside her, love her. And grieve with her for her loss? And wouldn't we pray even that much more for her, that God would lead her back into faith? Of course we would. And that's exactly why her story is written as it is. To leave open the possibility of love, prayer and faith, which really involves so many more than just one person, all by God's grace. Thank you for this video!
I've been re-reading the narnia books, and I was ecstatic when I found your channel. I'd love to see you go into detail about the Horse and his Boy, since it's my personal favorite in the series (Even when I was a young boy) and I think it could use some more love.
I think the intent and execution were two completly different things. We can all see what was meant to be portrayed. Susan stopped believing in Aslan/God and as such wasn't accapted into heaven. But in execution it sounds more like a cult propaganda, the believers of Aslan were killed to be accepted into heaven, trash talked her sister who was grieving after then irl and implied that she wasn't there because she was materialistic and some other sexist bs. When looking at it from perspective of Susan its even worse because she was kinda forced into that position, she was basicly their mother who had to conform to standards of femininity to be accepted in 1960's world. It all comes accros as sexist and unaware of stuff that Susan had to go through and I understand why so many people found the ending to be awful and felt horrible for Susan.
I see where you're coming from. Most of the criticisms I've seen seem to look at Susan's ordeal in shallow manner, often to reinforce their own biases. However, I'm no expert on Lewis and I haven't read anything of his in long time, so take my opinion with a grain of salt. To me, the story of Susan makes more sense when looked at through the lens of Lewis's apologetic works. With her, he seems to be addressing some of the toughest questions such as problem of pain. There is a lot of underlying theology built into her and her family's story. Of course the idea that Susan is an analog for Lewis himself further reinforces that.
@@seltin1988 Lewis cant express his beliefs? If you don’t like it don’t read it. Everyone expresses their beliefs in books I could complain about all the horrible things atheists wrote like how Darwin thought African Americans were just dumb apes and hoped that they would die. Lewis wasn’t in a cult he was a Christian which in the Bible it tells Christians to be wary of cults and taught how to handle that situation.
Thanks for the video. The fate of Susan Pevensie has been bothering me since the first time I read The Last Battle 30 years ago. I'm happy to know there is more to her story than just bitter hearsay about her in the last book.
Your last point makes so much sense. I think that the end of her family's story is the beginning of her return to being a friend of Narnia. She'll remember how much the place and Aslan meant to her siblings and friends. The road back will definitely be hard for her, and the pain might drive her further away initially, but I think it's the start of her path back to Narnia. Once a King or Queen of Narnia, always a King or Queen. It's a clever set up for her story.
I tend to think that Lewis did not approve of the concept of the "teenager" that was appearing in the mid-1950s: the adolescent that had his or her own culture, neither adult nor child. I didn't think of Susan being singled out as sexist; if the four Pevensie children had been Peter, Simon, Edmund and Lucy, then "Simon" could have become obsessed with motorbikes, guitars etc. As someone who is, in some sense, a "Susan" - someone who used to be a Christian and isn't now - I feel uncomfortable with the way some Christians regard the character, and what they infer from the story. I've seen comments online that basically just blame her alone for what happened, but we don't know what had happened to her between the beginning of "The Voyage Of The Dawn Treader" and the end of "The Last Battle". As for the real world, the situation is even harder. Susan actually - PHYSICALLY - met Aslan. I don't know of anyone who has actually, PHYSICALLY, met Jesus, and when Christians talk about their "relationship with God" they're particularly vague. For some, it seems to be more about a relationship with a book (the Bible) than with a person. For others, they talk about some sort of feeling which they attribute to the nudge of the Holy Spirit, but it's always ambiguous and could be just their own feelings. As an autistic person, things have to be clear and make sense to me in order for me to believe them. That's just the sort of mind I have. Perhaps the off-the-shelf form of faith, which is just right for neurotypical people, is not the right form for me; and perhaps it wasn't right for Susan either - she was always the "voice of reason". I get really fed up of being patronised by (arguably) well-meaning Christians who invariably quote John 3:16 as if I've never heard it before. If there were a "quick fix", I would have found it long ago. And rather than looking down on Susan as the poor relation in spiritual terms, maybe she discovers things about Aslan along the way that blows her siblings' minds when she does get to his country.
I always viewed this ending as C S Lewis's warning towards those who having once had faith/knowledge in their Savior, would then cast it aside and turn away from Him going after things of the world, valuing them more than a relationship with God. He was saying that we should always be striving in building our relationship with God and strengthening our faith, choosing Him continually over the pomp and false allures of the world. I always felt that though Susan missed out on being taken straight away into Aslan's country with all the others, eventually she might find her way there as she "grew up" and realized what really mattered most.
Wow thank you for this. I wasn't expecting to feel an emotional response, but I guess I've grieved the loss of Narnia myself. Narnia formed me more than any other story.
The problem with Susan is that she abandoned her faith, and turned instead to worship the idols of materialism and vanity. It happens to all of us. We all have different 'idols' we struggle with, and this is where JK Rowling failed to understand. Susan's exclusion from Narnia had nothing to do with her finding sex or becoming a woman, but with the simple fact that she valued worldly things over the truth of God.
By "Growing Up" in this case of Susan is that she stopped believing. Cause there are two terms for the phrase "Grew Up". One is that they embraced having to mature and live the life of an adult. But in other cases such as hers they become a Non-Believer. And sadly throughout the Chronicles of Narnia Susan exemplified that on more then one occasion.
In a way it's like the note C. S. Lewis had at the beginning of LWW when he wrote to his goddaughter Lucy Barfield and admitted: "You are now too old to read fairy-tales, and by the time this book is printed and bound, you will be older still. But some day you will be old enough to read fairy tales again." There's the growing up stage of avoiding all 'childish' things, and then there's the growing up stage where you can come back to the childish things and appreciate them for what they are or were rather than just dismissing them as 'silly' or 'childish.
What hit me in this what the people said about Susan when they did not know that they were dead and that Susan was still alive. I have been marred twice. My first marriage failed when I returned to a ship that was at the same place I left it 9years before. when I left it had not even been commission. One of my jobs was to see that every one who just reported on board to my department got their safety equipment. There were tow men just out of boot camp, and one of them stayed on that ship for all those years; he ragged me to death. Because of this he drove to men, me and the guy who was just under me, out of the Navy. In the middle of this my wife asked for a devastated. I ended up in a mental forced out of the Navy lost my family, every thing. I went to see the man who interceded us and his wife would not let me in the house. Thank you when I needed a little grace, but you had none.
I just subscribed to your channel. You have great content here! It was a shocking moment when I learned about what happened to Susan's family, but what struck me more was learning about Susan no longer a friend of Narnia.
For me, her story is our story. Her journey is my journey, too.
Being young and innocent, our faith is unwavering. We believe and live in a world full of possibilities.
Growing up, we get caught in tangles of "stuff" that we deemed as more important than family, friendship, and relationship.
I may have gone through a path similar to Susan's. A road of partying and spending, and superficial connections, then of pain, suffering, and loneliness.
I'm holding on to what was mentioned that Susan's story isn't yet over as ours. We are to write her journey. And I know it's overflowing with hope.
Thank you for this video.
Thank you for sharing a part of your story, and for your beautiful post. Welcome to the channel!
I’ve thought about this a lot recently and while I am not using this as any metaphor, Susan can fall back on what Aslan said himself, “Once a king or queen of Narnia, always a king or queen of Narnia.” I believe that Susan would have had an experience, either directly with Aslan or a near death experience or something equivocal which would have helped regain her belief in Aslan, in Narnia, and even in herself.
This was a fabulous commentary, and a reassurance (backed up by that quote from Lewis himself) that the author's intentions for Susan were much more subtle than could be conveyed by the end of a children's story arc. The best solution was to describe her status ambivalently, from the perspective of others who had passed into glory (Narnia's version), but did not yet know her final fate.
I'd say mine is the minority voice on the matter. Much more time and energy has been devoted to the opposite argument in the last decade, wouldn't you agree? It seems to be a popular fad these days to misconstrue and malign authors of the past, and Lewis is certainly no exception.
@Into The Wardrobe, on a totally unrelated topic, I’d hoping to ask this to anyone who is knowledgeable about CON, The Silver Chair to be exact. Caspian is anywhere between and ninety years old and Prince Rilian is between 20-30 years old. Means that Caspian would have had to have Rilian between 50-70 years old. It completely baffles me why in the world the king and queen would have waited decades to produce an heir when that is a top priority of a ruling king.
The REAL Problem with Susan is that C.S. Lewis did not want to go into it, he knew her story was more complex and she had one of her own that would take the readers right out of the fantasy, but he did not feel like writing it because he knew he would not do it justice, so he didn't. He even encouraged one of the readers that sent him a letter about it to write her story and elaborate on it.
I'm working on mine - and I'm including her having some sort of reuniting with the Scrubbs. I don't think they would've been pleasant to her after what happened and would've brought up how 'tiresome and commonplace Eustace had become' thanks to 'those Pevensie children', so I'm envisioning some tearful scenes where blame is thrown all over the place, and then a few scenes where at the very least they're civil to each other, maybe with some affection as they are still relatives but that they'll never say it out loud because they aren't quite like that.
This is interesting to me. Will you share your sources?
@@itsjkforreal I assume their sources come from one of the letters Lewis wrote to a child in 1960, and said,"Not because I have no hope of Susan ever getting to Aslans's country, but because I have a feeling that the story of her journey would be longer and more like a grown-up novel than I wanted to write. But I may be mistaken. Why not try it yourself?"
@@rebekahWalton I wonder if that child ever did come up with a story of her own about Susan?
@@rebekahWalton Alright Walton, I'll Google the quote and try to find the source myself. I'm from the generation called slackers but we all work now. Please hold.
Narniaweb
“I could not write that story myself. Not that I have no hope of Susan’s ever getting to Aslan’s country; but because I have a feeling that the story of her journey would be longer and more like a grown-up novel than I wanted to write. But I may be mistaken. Why not try it yourself?”
Collected Letters of CS Lewis Volume 3
Susan's fate reminds me of a quote from C.S Lewis:
"When I was ten, I read fairy tales in secret and would have been ashamed if I had been found doing so. Now that I am fifty I read them openly. When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up.”
I think Lewis was trying to explain that trying to grow up was the most childish thing you can do, but who knows maybe I'm wrong, maybe I'm missing something.
Exactly the quote I was thinking of! Thanks Jude.
I'd just rephrase it as trying to feel or be seen as grown up, i.e. having it be motivated by insecurity.
Spot on! "Except ye be converted and become as little children, ye shall not enter the kingdom of Heaven" 😊
The message what I got is that it's ok to be mature but it's also ok to never give up and abandon your inner child despite being grown up. Embrace your sense of wonder in the world. 😊
I agree! I was going to say something similar
From a purely pragmatic perspective, Susan was the only one who did not have a developmental arc in the series. Thus her arc was saved for last, to take place afterwards. As stated, "Once a king or queen of Narnia, always a king or queen of Narnia", so her salvation is assured. Lewis' gift to his readers is giving us the beginning and the end of Susan's journey, and leaving the middle up to us.
We’ll said. Some of the story was left to us.
Well said!
Yes! I was thinking of that very quote. Being adopted as a queen, and a well loved queen at that, it's no small matter. Susan may momentarily have forgotten Narnia, but I doubt that Narnia will have forgotten her.
She could have chosen the same path back to Narnia as 'The Friends of Narnia' did. But it's an important distinction that she chose not to do so.
She's clouded her own vision of that world. So, until she chooses to clear it. Her path back there will be out of her sight.
But I suspect that C S Lewis fully intended her to find it again. He just wants us to figure out how for ourselves.
If there's ever a netflix adaptation, someone ought to do an optional final story, "Chronicles of Narnia: Aftermath" or something. Take a stab at it.
If that was the intent then it was executed poorly. There was no empathy or hope in the way the Narnia stories ended for her. It was dismissive and tone was insulting so the reader take the intent of the book as dismissive for her. CS Lewis wrote to a little girl that asked him about Susan saying "...there is plenty of time for her to mend, and perhaps she will get to Aslan’s country in the end" he could have written that kind of hope into the book.
Also see his letter says "perhaps" so her salvation is not assured. No ones salvation is assured.
I never thought her being into lipstick and clothes and parties and growing up was the thing that was wrong with her. It was that she ONLY cared about those things and lost sight of what was really important. She thought she would find true happiness in the things of the world and saw the faith she once had as childish and silly. She stopped believing. She stopped wanting to go to Narnia. That was her problem, not becoming a woman or being girly or beautiful. It was her unbelief. But I love how Lewis left the story open. Growing up I thought that meant she went to Hell, but now I'm so happy to hear that's not what happened, that she still has hope and it's very likely she will one day return to Narnia.
this all the way!
Exactly. Even as a teen atheist I could understand what Lewis meant by the way he wrote about her. I really enjoyed Gaiman's stories and generally would put him on a pedestal above Lewis. But reading his short story made me question his literary intelligence.
She needed to grow up for real, rather than do what she thought of as growing up. There are plenty of paths to Heaven for grown-ups in our world.
@@oddish4352 I agree she definitely needed to grow up for real. The things she thought of as growing up weren't really. She needed to grow up in her heart instead of just outwardly. As for many paths to Heaven, I don't think all or even many paths lead there. As a Christian I believe there is only one and that is through Jesus. Just like in the story I don't think Susan would have gotten to Aslan's country by a different way other than her faith she once had in Aslan. I don't think all these other philosophies and other things of the world would have gotten her there. I think she needed to ultimately go to the source to get to the source, which was Aslan himself. The same is true for us in this world. We can't reach Heaven without Jesus. All roads don't lead to the same place. But, I think Susan would eventually find her faith in Aslan again, and get back to where she once believed. I believe she had a happy ending once she found the true path again. And that is something for both children and grown-ups alike. Like you said, she didn't have to be a child to believe in Narnia. She could do that as an adult, and that was truly the mature, grown-up thing to do. 🦁☀️
@@karisgranger6013 Certainly, Jesus is the one way to Heaven. But there are many paths a person can follow that will lead to Him. Lucy's steady faith and true heart might be the most admirable, but remember Edmund's greed and treachery, Eustace's excessive pragmatism, Jill's repeated failures... they all made it in the end. Susan's tale is cautionary as well, but there is a part in the Great Story for her to play.
Susan was the reader personified. Most of us remember those fantasy worlds we fell in love with as a child, something that felt so real at one time. But like a lot of people, Susan was hit with reality and had to face it, no longer pining for those fantasy worlds or dreams of what was. I would even take it a step further and say that she blamed Narnia for what to her siblings, thus choosing to not be a friend of Narnia and grieving in her own way. Like many people, when something so tragic and sudden happens, we look to blame or justify why it happened. Susan was meant to be the real life anecdote to the fantasy world we were all reading about. I think in time, with much healing, Susan would come to realize that Narnia wasn’t to blame and will cling on to those “child” memories of her and her siblings and that’s how she will be reunited.
Sort of like what Lewis said in his dedication to Lucy Barfield, that she was now too old for fairy tales but some day may be old enough to read them again. Susan may be one day say 'yes it was a childish game, but it wasn't silly to them, and it wasn't to me either.'
I like the thought that Susan is the reader personified. Her story is left untold as the reader's story is yet to happen after reading these books.
And as readers we are given a task like what was given to Lucy and Edmund at the end of The Voyage of the Dawn Treader. When Lucy and Edmund asked about returning to Narnia soon and that they wanted to come back to see Aslan, Aslan tells them he is in their world too. "But there I have another name. You must learn to know me by that name. This was the very reason why you were brought to Narnia, that by knowing me here for a little, you may know me better there."
I think Susan's story is like Lewis' story and like the reader's stories. We each have our own journey to find out who Aslan is in our own world. I think Susan does have a story, but it may likely be like yours or like mine in how we come to Christ. So in some ways it is nice that her story is not written in that her story may be ours. :)
I think your timeline is out - how could Susan have blamed Narnia for the train crash when nobody in the story knows yet that it happened?
@@markhoffman9655 reminds me of daughter Zion in the bible taking punishments for things she hadnt done(yet) plus she only ended up doing bad things due to being blamed/ scapegoated/ abused/ accused while innocent( causes hurt and anger and distrust)
No, Lewis demonstrated people really growing up with Peter, Edmund and Lucy when they could no longer enter Narnia. Susan was falling into a false sense of maturity that dismisses what really matters as childish - a sign of immaturity is an inordinate reverence for things perceived as "grown up". And she could hardly blame Narnia for what happened to her siblings before they even died.
Susan's story is rooted in tragedy and grief, and it's a story that Lewis didn't feel comfortable writing, given the more innocent and childlike nature of the other books in the series. In a letter to a fan concerned about Susan's future, Lewis had this to say:
"I could not write that story myself. Not that I have no hope of Susan ever getting into Aslan's country, but because I have a feeling that the story of journey would be longer and more like a grown-up novel than I wanted to write."
I feel like people tend to misread the part about Susan's fate. They jump to the lipstick part and completely ignore that Susan is basically wrapped up in a false sense of maturity. She became what she thought was an adult: dressing up, going to parties, and putting away the fairy tales. It's a very childish interpretation of adulthood ironically enough.
It's fitting that Lewis had Polly point this out, she had lived as a grown woman before returning to Narnia and saw that Susan wasn't nearly as mature as she believed herself to be.
A little like Lasaraleen, Aravis's friend in Calormen, the gossipy talkative one who helped her escape from Calormen event hough she couldn't understand why she wanted to go. I always sort of saw her 'darlings' and talking about houses and dresses as 'a teenage girl playing at being a grown-up, it happens all the time'.
Yeah, Lewis wrote elsewhere about how the desire to appear very grown-up and the denial of simple joys in favour of sophisticated amusements is itself a form of childishness - or perhaps teenageness - a healthy and natural phase in its time, but something to be outgrown in its turn, allowing you to once again embrace life's simple pleasures.
"When I was ten, I read fairy tales in secret and would have been ashamed if I had been found doing so. Now that I am fifty, I read them openly. When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up."
Or the dedication to LWW:
"I wrote this story for you, but when I began it I had not realized that girls grow quicker than books. As a result you are already too old for fairy tales, and by the time it is printed and bound you will be older still. But some day you will be old enough to start reading fairy tales again. You can then take it down from some upper shelf, dust it, and tell me what you think of it. I shall probably be too deaf to hear, and too old to understand a word you say, but I shall still be your affectionate Godfather, C. S. Lewis."
@@rmsgrey I was originally going to have that quote but I couldn't find a clean place for it.
And yes, that's why I tend to go with the false maturity interpretation over the unfortunately popular "Susan is in Hell for wearing lipstick" interpretation.
They focused on the lipstick because it make it seems as if her fate was to harsh for just loving lipstick. If you put her fate by the side of the real reason she was "punished" it make it seems less harsh of a punishment and that's not what they want.
So basically, Susan became an Instagram 'Influencer'.. A millennial-aged Tik-Tocker? cringe. Yeah, I would label that as, 'Silly behavior for a young woman,' for sure!
Without a doubt your best video yet. I would argue that "once a King or Queen..." is part of the Deep Magic and she was chosen because she will find her way. Rather than the 'problem of Susan' we should speak of the 'hope of Susan'.
Absolutely. What a powerful line. Thanks for posting.
Excellent response
I love this!
Well put, Ed! I like that.
Very well articulated
I love how C.S Lewis ended Susan's story because it is relatable. There are so many of us that for whatever reason fall away & lose sight of it all. By not finishing her story & leaving the possibility of her return up to her choice it gives hope for us. We might have fallen away or made bad choices but it's never to late to make the choice to return & "become a friend of Narnia". I see Susan's story as relatable & a story of hope.
Same. Relatable and a sign of hope among a sea of shiny golden apples
@@LordWyatt What I mean is relatable for people who might not have found things as straightforward & east as others & who have struggled.
Interesting that you say she fell away and lost sight of it all. It's easy to say this for someone whose been to Narnia. How could someone choose to forget Narnia? Or pretend it never happened? But in real life it's pretty dismissive to say that for someone who say, for example, left Christianity. It's not as black and white as people make it out to be. Just a thought.
@@EPICNE55 I am a Christian & the experiences I have had as a Christian for me I could never forget them same as I feel Susan going to Narnia. I almost left my relationship with God during the hardest time of my life but even then I couldn't deny nor forget Gods existence nor my experiences. My husband however who has had similar experiences as me did leave the Lord & also me. He is now living life as if he never knew God but knowing the experiences he has had, I find it hard to believe he has forgotten but more simply "lost sight". I've experience of what I originally commented & so that's why I commented what I did. It wasn't emptily written ❤️
@@HopeWren I totally understand that. I thought the same way when I was a Christian. How could I ever choose to "forget" these experiences? How could I ever see the world in a different way? But a lot has changed in my understanding and knowledge, making me feel disillusioned with my foundational beliefs, perhaps like Susan.
I always thought it was realistic to have a character who “loses faith.” That’s how life is
I always thought Susan's bitterness toward Narnia was from feeling rejected by it and by Aslan, when he said she and Peter were too old and couldn't go back. If I was Susan, I would've been horribly upset over that as well.
Peter, Edmund, and Lucy were also told by Aslan that they were too old to return to Narnia, yet they remained “friends of Narnia.” So why should Susan feel more upset about it than they did? No, her problem is different.
That actually makes so much sense why she then lost herself in the idea of being "a grown-up" and convinced herself that Narnia was just a childish dream. Because being told that the reason why Narnia adventures are over for her is really that she's grown too old for it, I can't blame her for coming to the conclusion that she has to leave Narnia behind, because obviously it was just for being a child and therefore must have just been a childish dream, in her head.
Sad.
@@rizerez7982 Yes. Because being told you'll always be a queen, you suddenly get kicked out because you aged out of Narnia - Aslan really mucked up here. And unfortunately Susan never found out that Professor Kirk had witnessed the creation of Narnia, which included three grownups (not counting the witch) ending up there. So that she was too old makes no sense at all. But that's what she was told. So trying to shield herself from a festering heart ache, she tried so hard to move on and forget about her adventures in Narnia. I would've done the same thing. Maybe never got interested in the same sorts of things, but I would've found something to occupy my time.
All the arguments above forgot about one major thing; Narnia is REAL to them. It wasn't a childish dream like how Susan mentioned it to Lucy. It wasn't because she aged up that she were left out; if those were the arguments then Diggory and Plummer wouldn't even be there at all. The core of Susan's problem is not in gender or growing up or any of it; it was the problem of her belief.
Susan is the grim reminder to us the readers. When we were child we believe in ideal world, in ideal life or in ideal way of living life. But after life pressed us down and offers us its convenience and persuades us to follow its will, we lose sight of what we believe and who we were meant to be.
'Once a king and queens of Narnia, always kings and queens of Narnia.' Susan were one of Aslan's chosen, and she would always be that. But unlike how Aslan shows love to her family that was taken away from her, she was spared from the fate so she, like Aslan mentioned to Lucy, 'Learned to know me by it (His other name)'.
In the Bible, it is written that we, as spiritual beings cannot only have milk to grow. We need real solid food.
I feel like this connects well to the comment. Aslan and they walk side by side as they began but now as they grew up, they have to live in the 'real' world where despite not having the access to go back there and live that sweet spiritual life where they're led and guided by Aslan (despite the wars and so on), they have to learn to live by themselves yet continually have faith. That's the only way we can truly exercise our free will where we CHOSE to believe despite the 'absence'. We know for sure that God still remains with us.
I've always had the notion that it wasn't the nylon, lipstick, or parties than were in and of themselves the issue, but her fixation on them. She cannot have two gods in her life, and, in that point of her life, chose one over the other. I do appreciate that Lewis /did/ leave her potential return open, and didn't make it a closed case of her remaining lost forever.
This is my thought exactly, because in Christianity, you have false idols which distract you from the True God, and the lipsticks and parties became an idol for her.
@@lilshorty5986 I was thinking the same thing----Christianity is about separating yourself from the world but the things that Susan got into were very worldly and she forgot the wonderful things that come from God. You can't serve two masters
This exactly. It wasn’t liking these things that was a problem, but liking them to the exclusion of God. The problem was treating Aslan and Narnia (obvious analogues to God and faith and heaven) as children’s stories and falling away from them. She wasn’t taken to Aslan’s country literally because she CHOSE not to go with her siblings. Because she did not want to go. She is still alive, and has plenty of years to change her mind.
Remind me of the Bible verse of how we can't serve two masters or else we will end up loving and revering one and rejecting and hating the other.
Just as Yahuah and Yahusha warn about not being lured into worshipping idols of pagan gods, traditions or doctrines of men which are vain and lesser things, and not being deceived by philosophy and false knowledge which leads away from Yahuah the most high.
Whereas my view was always that Susan was the only one of the four children who actually stayed true to Aslan. Aslan was very clear when He told them they weren't allowed to come back to Narnia and that they should be living their lives in their own world. The other three defied Aslan's word and went after the rings.
The other three judged Susan, because they were self-righteous hypocrites who held on to the memory of the journey, but forgot the literal word of God and the mission they'd been given. Aslan forgave them for both defying Him and misjudging Susan, as an act of grace.
I have always taken comfort in the assurance from Aslan: Once a King of Queen of Narnia, ALWAYS a King or Queen of Narnia. Susan is not lost. She simply has a different story from the others. I for one think it would make a FASCINATING story to read about Susan's journey back to faith and eventually, perhaps as a very old woman surrounded by her children, grand-children, and great-grandchildren, back to Aslan's Country.
Why would she be lost
My thought exactly, Michael. I think having children in her life and sharing fairy tales with them could be a potential key for her.
Fairy tales are filled with fantasy, but they are still very much about our world. The same as Lewis' good friend Prof Tolkein and his world.
Maybe that will remind Susan of Narnia, and memories will flood back, until she can't deny any longer that they really did happen.
@@allison3852
She was no longer a friend of Narnia.
I always felt sorry for Susan - losing her whole family in the fatal train crash 😕
Getting to “Aslan’s Country” happens later for some…Who says she couldn’t change later on? She was not part of this story as her story here wasn’t over! No one said she went to hell. We don’t know the full story, like in The Horse and His Boy, we don’t hear another person’s story, just our own. Thanks for the video!
Besides, Aslan didn't say she was lost to Narnia. He said 'Once a king or queen of Narnia, always a king or queen of Narnia'. I would've liked to have seen how Lewis would've told the story, but I like the idea of her finding her own way back to Narnia.
'Asian's country'
-hehe
@@decembersbitch7694 blame auto correct. I battle it daily. Will fix if I can.
@@tomklock568 oof
Your conclusion is similar to the one I had as a teenager when I read the series again. I can certainly see the sexist interpretation now that you brought it to my attention. However, for me as a child and young adult, it was about the fact that people lose faith. It is a serious struggle in CS Lewis life, and all of ours, to keep trusting in God when our life here is day in day out.
Lewis himself was raised Christian but after many years of sorrow he became Athiest. He, like a lot of us who don't have faith, focus solely on his ambitious goals and treated scripture as a text of fairytales about a God that doesn't care. Later on he refound his faith and remembered God.
Susan, I am sure, represents that part of all of us who fear death and see this life as it. Many of us as children couldn't wait to gain "freedom" as an adult, and as an adult try desperately to recapture that simplicity of childhood.
As an adult, I saw Susan as the Woman at the Well. A woman who thought she knew God, but a twisted one made NY religious discord in her country, and did not feel loved. She tried her best to find it in man but each one used her and cast her out. Only when she met the Messiah, did she know and accept real love.
I also see, as my personal interpretation, that Susan represents what happens to us that do believe when we let our minds dwell not on God and heavenly things but on earthly matters and delights. Which it is harder to break out of that prison when you once trusted than it is for those who never trusted at all.
Spot on. Thank you for the wonderfully thoughtful post.
@@IntotheWardrobe no thank you for giving me a wonderful community to talk about my favorite book series outside of scripture!
Well said. Thank you for sharing.
Very interesting and thought-provoking. Thanks for sharing.
True.. Same problem... It was only simplified as not being a friend of Narnia but it is in fact just losing faith, losing that sense of belief in that certain reality.
I have given Susan's story a little thought.
At first I felt her story was one of falling away from faith. But that does not make sense since she personally knew Aslan and had witnessed his sacrifice and resurrection. It would be harder to completely separate herself from Aslan due to this personal history.
Another person mentioned that Susan is the reader personified. This is an interesting thought as then her story becomes our story. At the end of the Voyage of the Dawn Treader Lucy and Edmund are being sent home and are wanting to return to Narnia soon and see Aslan again. Aslan tells them that he is in their world too. "But there I have another name. You must learn to know me by that name. This was the very reason why you were brought to Narnia, that by knowing me here for a little, you may know me better there." So perhaps Susan's unfinished tale is how she must learn who Aslan is in her world after her family dies. Perhaps... I read somewhere that C.S. Lewis did plan to write a book about Susan of Narnia, but am not sure this is true. There are collection of C.S. Lewis letters put into books and one letter goes like this: “I could not write that story myself. Not that I have no hope of Susan’s ever getting to Aslan’s country; but because I have a feeling that the story of her journey would be longer and more like a grown-up novel than I wanted to write. But I may be mistaken. Why not try it yourself?”
What I am seeing from the Narnia books and a couple of C.S. Lewis' letters, is that Susan's focus had changed post Narnia. And she was striving to be a contemporary version of a 21 year old young women with a superficial and selfish existence that lives only for the moment. I can easily imagine her trying to imitate Hollywood artists in her fashion and surrounding herself with other young people like herself.
But then the train wreck happens and Susan's whole life is changed in an instant. I imagine that the people Susan had thought were her friends were probably a bit superficial and were uncomfortable with Susan's grief. I imagine Susan ends up feeling very much alone and lost. With grief and pain of this magnitude, she will be faced with a choice of blaming God and turning to Him for strength.
Because Susan personally knew Aslan, so I see her ultimately turning towards God and becoming a person of strength for others - especially outsiders and the lonely and grieving souls. I can see her story arch being a bit similar to Edmund the Just. I see her changing her life from a superficial one, to a life of service. I can see her no longer wanting to choose a life of comfort and ease. I can see her having many incredible adventures on earth due to her convictions and faith. Perhaps she becomes a missionary. Or perhaps her adventures are closer to home but she is still an ambassador for Christ. Perhaps she works some as a nurse or a teacher. Susan Pevensie does have a story that is worth being told. I very much see her taking a similar path of having fallen away from faith as an adolescent like C.S. Lewis did and coming back to faith in a stronger way after the pain she goes through.
Perhaps she becomes a writer and ends up writing about her childhood adventures in Narnia with her family. I picture her as an old woman responding to letters like Lewis did. And perhaps in one letter she explains how she returned to her faith. Then after writing this letter, she lays down to go to sleep, she appears to start to dream of Aslan, of the Real Narnia, and she sees her family. She embraces Aslan and her family with tears of joy. Then Aslan tells her she will never have to leave again and that she is now home in the Real Narnia. As Professor Kirke said at the end of the Loin, the Witch, and the Wardrobe, "Once a King (or Queen) in Narnia, always a King (or Queen) in Narnia." Susan's story I believe can be one of redemption and hope (much like C.S. Lewis' real life story is).This is how I picture her story.
Yes, Hannah. It's very much a 'Find The World but Lose Faith' situation with Susan. It happens that way with some people. Others are caught up in Faith that The World doesn't matter any more. But there are those who find balance. They love this world and all the good in it. But they also know that there is far more than this world can offer, and that is found through Faith.
The Friends of Narnia have learned this. Polly and Diggory are especially awe inspiring. Imagine how long it is since they were in the Newborn Narnia. And yet, even with all their years living in this world, they have still held onto the equally real world of Narnia.
But as many of us have said. There is much hope for Susan. Not only was she a beloved queen in Narnia, but she and Lucy witnessed Aslan's Resurrection at The Stone Table.
Such a memory is surely tucked away, deep in her memory, waiting to be found again. It's just a matter of when and how.
Her story could still make a good film as she learns to be aNarnian Warrior Queen again. She did become a women and was probably dating men or not. Perhaps her memories were confused from trauma. Trauma does powerful things to the brain you see things differently.
I love your version of the story and I've preserved it so I can read it in the future whenever I read the books. :)
this is so lovely!!
Your idea is beautiful, I wish I could read it as a full story. ❤
What troubles me about Susan is that Aslan rejected her first. She fought beside Narnians to defeat Jadis, then returned when Caspian needed help. Then, both Peter and Susan were told to not come back. In a real situation, how do you deal with that? How do you fall in love with a place, spend 15 years as a co-ruler, to return to childhood, be called back yet again, and then told to carry on in the mundane world and not return? Peter may have stayed hopeful, but I can see how a heartbroken Susan would have grieved by trying to forget everything. When your world loses its color, maybe lipstick and nylons are the best you can do.
I always found it cruel of Lewis to make her an orphan. I understand that tragedy can bring your eyes back to God, but as one of the two who cried over Aslan’s sacrificed body, that was harsh.
I can appreciate that Susan, with the limited worldview we all wrestle with, might have felt rejected. But we learn that it wasn't a rejection at all, but a call to know Him better in this world.
Losing her entire family in one stroke might have seemed cruel, I suppose, but it is also perhaps a pretty good reflection of reality. Many people suffer greatly, and I'd say in most cases, the suffering is independent of whether they deserve it. And perhaps all the grief she works through becomes the catalyst for her to reach for Him again.
We all deal with trauma and maturing differently. I love the take that Susan is meant to represent Lewis and therefore us. Great video!
They really need to make a BBC miniseries that tells of Susan’s grief of the loss of her family after the train accident, how she coped with her grief, and how it helps her rediscover her belief in Narnia and Aslan. For it to be good though, the producers are going to have to do A LOT of research on this by exploring her character and how C.S. Lewis himself overcame his own grief and rediscovered his belief in God.
I wouldn’t trust the current BBC to get any of that right. Susan would become a modern feminist, seeking revenge against Aslan (a stand-in for oppressive religious patriarchy) because he murdered her family. And one of the siblings would need to be played by a black actor or actress, either for realistic relatability or because this is a fantasy and doesn’t need to be realistic.
@@hayleybartek8643 oh that sounds really cool actually
@@hayleybartek8643 Wait, where did anyone get the idea that it was Aslan who caused the train accident?
@@hayleybartek8643 I love how you had to go into histrionics about race, that's totally not telling on yourself there.
Your script would be an unironic improvement.
That would make a really moving series or movie. Because, I think C S Lewis was right that it wouldn't fit into the ambiance of these children's stories. But I think it could take inspiration from Lewis' own journey.
Susan was always and still is my favorite. Mostly because she is more similar to myself. In my faith It too comes and goes. But each time it comes back, it's stronger than before. Even when I read the Last Battle as a kid. I was sad at first my favorite did not return. But I was also glad she did not die early like the others.
And as Aslan said to them. "Once a king or queen of Narnia, akways a king or queen of Narnia." If Susan would not one day return to Aslan's Country, than he would not have said that. Also, in most cases of individuals that loose their entire family at once. They tend to find something they shared with them to hang on to. And well in her case, Narnia.
I always thought, even as a child reading the series, that it was Susan's choice to turn her back on Narnia - not the other way around and I always hoped she found her way back.
Hey, wouldn't it be funny if Susan, while sitting in a church after her friends had died, met a man named "Clive Lewis," and they got to talking, and Susan told him a wild tale - a tale she swore was true - about her childhood, and going to another world. A world where time passed differently from our own, with magic and talking animals and giants, dwarves, fauns and other mythical creatures ruled by a Great Lion - and all the adventures she and her brothers and sister and their friends had there fighting against a Wicked White Witch and becoming Kings and Queens and growing up in that magical land - and it turned out THAT was the source and inspiration for "The Chronicles of Narnia"?
I always took it to mean she had grown up and become preoccupied with all the things that were expected of her as an adult, and nothing more. Lucy was still young enough that she could get away, and the boys were men, so they didn't have the same expectations of planning parties and attending social events out of seeming necessity of "social ethics". But Susan couldn't escape those expectations, so she had been swallowed up by the worldly cares that didn't make her an enemy of Aslan, but just estranged from him.
That's how I've read it too. She's been through a lot of trauma (they all have) what with the wars (in England and in Narnia), becoming a fully-grown adult with power only to be a young woman in 1940s England again. Being forced out of the only place she'd ever really have much power or deep-seated respect because she's "too old". I've always thought that of the three, Susan was the most adept at diplomatic relations, is it no wonder she throws herself into being a socialite to distance herself from what must surely be bittersweet memories? As you said, Peter and Edmund are men, they had mobility and respect she could not have at that time. And Lucy was young enough that she was considered a child still. I think Susan's response to the life she's been thrown into a again is, while not the healthiest choice, one that makes sense for her character and is consistent. Of all the siblings, I adore her and Edmund the most. I hope she was able to find healing somehow. I like the headcanon (obviously not true) that in-universe, Susan is writing under the psuedonym C.S. Lewis, and that the books are her way of coming to terms of what happened.
This is the solid analysis we've been waiting for! You make a good point -- the Pevensies weren't being callous, because they didn't know about the accident yet. When they do find out, they're swept up in the experience of heaven, and are too distracted to ponder Susan's fate back in the Shadowlands. Anyway, as for that line about "lipstick, nylons, and invitations", I always took that to mean that Susan had become a typical teenager, which is hardly an unforgivable offense. The books don't even touch on the consequences, but it's safe to say that the massive trauma of losing her family would shock Susan out of her selfish, vain lifestyle and attitude, and would lead to much soul-searching.
I agree that her story would be more mature in nature. I gave a basic outline in an earlier comment, but I'll recap -- The Last Battle mentions that the magic rings were dug up and in the possession of the Friends of Narnia when the accident occurred. Susan being next-of-kin would naturally inherit those rings, bringing her to the Wood Between Worlds. That must be what's intended, otherwise the book wouldn't go out of its way to tie up that loose end. There she would find Narnia's puddle dried up, since that world ended, and maybe she'd blow her horn and meet Aslan in the wood. I think Aslan would reassure her that if he forgave her brother Edmund for treason, surely she can be forgiven for losing faith. I don't think she would return to Narnia, because while Narnian time flows differently, it's never depicted flowing backwards. The window to enter that world was from 1900-1950, and that window closed. However, there are countless other worlds, and I think Aslan would direct her to a different puddle, and tell her that she has a key role to play in that world, and that she could get to know him there, but not in the form of a lion. As for the rest, it's very open-ended.
A few more things to say. Neil Gaiman's take on this was an absolute travesty. I respect him quite a bit as an artist, but his talents lie elsewhere, in other kinds of stories. Narnia is supposed to be a fairytale, and dark/edgy/subversive content simply doesn't belong there. I also don't think Susan would grow old and bitter in our world, rather she would embark on a new adventure, and I believe she would eventually be redeemed and make it to Aslan's Country, which as we're told intersects with all worlds.
Pardon me for the long comment, I had alot to cover. One final point, going off on a tangent -- I think the most supremely ironic thing about the Chronicles of Narnia is that the books end with the world destroyed and most characters dead, yet it's a happy ending.
Maybe she goes to a newly built world and becomes it's first queen. There she grows old, dies and enters Aslan's country.
I understand the real point about Susan, she isn't there because she gave up her faith - and, more pragmatically, because she didn't believe in Narnia and Aslan, she also simply wasn't on the train and thus didn't die. But at the same time I do think the level of disdain in the comments from other characters about her focus on nylons, lipstick, and wanting to stay in a "silly" time of life muddled the message. It does make it sound like enjoying/being interested in those things in and of themselves is a sign of a faithless person. Especially since two of the three things mentioned pretty much only bring female associations to mind, the idea that they might be a "bad sign" has unfortunate implications.
I don't think that was the intent, but I also think the actual point would be clearer if left at "she's no longer a friend of Narnia and has stopped believing," possibly noting directly that she'd become conceited like in the letter he wrote later. But I think tying particular, very feminine details to the explanation was a choice that it might have been better not to make.
Finally! Some who truly understands "The Problem of Susan" the way C.S. Lewis intended us to interpret it.
She may be lost now, but Susan is always welcome into Aslan's Country once she returns to her childlike faith and believes in Narnia once again. Because once a king or queen of Narnia, always a king or queen. 🏹❤️
Thank you so much for making this video!
I don't get why people don't get that
@@agenttheater5I guess because they ignore the obvious Christian theology that Susan represents
@@agenttheater5because atheists always interpret things in the worst possible way because they don't understand Christianity
Thank you for this video, I've seen a lot of folks on some websites claim that what happened to Susan was because Lewis was sexist (not so far from what Rowling said in hindsight), but when you consider that Lucy is one if not the most important character in his books (having found the wardrobe and being the one to believe the most in Narnia and Aslan), and that she grew up and in the end returned to Narni too, that doesn't hold.
It's interesting to see that you came to a similar conclusion as mine: that Susan will eventually return to Narnia, but that she need to find her own way back. And just like you said, she most likely mirrors Lewis' own story. Personnally, I assume that Susan lost her "faith" in Narnia because she was always the most pragmatic and logic-driven of the siblings, and she may not have accepted what happened to Narnia and the Narnias she knew during LWW and her ultimate depature at the end of PC as well as her siblings. According to wikipedia (the source being a somewhat autobiography of Lewis), Lewis described his young self as "very angry with God for not existing" and "equally angry with him for creating a world". Now, take into consideration that Susan may be mirroring Lewis, and these two sentences could very well apply to her too. Imagine living 15 years in a world, growing up as an adult, then returning 1300 years later to that same world, with all the people you knew being long dead, having been powerless to do anything about it, probably, deep down, not understanding why Aslan didn't do anything to change this (while at the same time knowing why he wasn't there), and then having to leave it for good. After all, Susan was the gentle queen, maybe I'm reaching a bit but I can see her having chosen to distance herself from Narnia because she cared a lot about her subjects, and the grief of losing people you knew and never returning to that place ever again was too hard to accept if she remembered it as something that was real. So to have an easier time dealing with her emotions, she chose to pretend it was just a childish memory. But I don't think she ever forgot about it, merely that she lost faith in Narnia and/or Aslan, just like Lewis lost faith in God for (what I intepret his words as) creating the world but not being an active part of it. And if Lewis found his way back to faith, I have no doubt that he knew that Susan would find her way back to Narnia.
Susan isn`t like this because the author was sexist, but he still was. You can`t ignore the slightly sexist parts of the book. That doesn`t make the books bad or the author, but we also can`t ignore simple facts.
@@ttzzzzzzz8543 how was he sexist there in no evidence for it I’ve read the books and I didn’t see any evidence of it.
Susan is us: those of us who have seen the goodness of Narnia and Aslan but for one reason or another lose faith in them and our way. But as has been said a lot lately "Just because someone stumbles and loses their way doesn't mean they're lost forever". It is my profound hope that although she now had a much more difficult path to get there that Susan (like CS Lewis and us) found her way back to Aslan's Country and became a friend of Narnia once again. Once a King and Queen of Narnia, always a King and Queen of Narnia.
I actually love Susan story I think this is what makes her a multidimentional character I think her story is what keeps the Chronicles open for adults who now can relate so much her journey .
Beyond the religious part we at some point lost that innocence part of us, growing up is hard her story is not over yet and after all like you said, once a queen she will be forever a queen.
I firmly believe this video will be quoted and shown in the following days,weeks, months, and years , to give the real problem of Susan. It took until the second decade of the 21st century for Into The Wardrobe explain us the truth.
Thanks to Stuart and the team.
Very well-said!
This was a Wonderful video! I'm so glad that Narnia is finally being discussed again in such a thoughtful manner. I've never understood the 'problem of Susan' because there is no problem in my eyes. Susan rejected Narnia and Aslan upon returning to earth, so why would he take her away from the life she had chosen, and into the life that she actively tried to reject? Of course, Susan would be emotionally devastated by such a loss, but her family had chosen to remain friends of Narnia. Why should they be denied access to Aslans country because of the choices of Susan? I also think people misunderstand what is being implied by the whole 'nylons, parties, and lipstick' issue. They don't represent her femininity or sexuality, they represent the reason why she rejected Narnia in the first place. She wanted to appear grown up and uninterested in childish things, such as Narnia, so lipstick and nylons are just used as examples of the 'grown up' things Susan has rejected narnia in favour of.
Yes. Sadly, this obvious interpretation is no longer obvious to all.
Exactly! Well said
This is what makes “Prince Caspian” one of my favorite Narnia books. In the chapter “The Lion Roars” we see the characterization CS Lewis already placed in Susan; a most-slow-to-believe spirit. I especially relate to this passage, when Aslan calls her name and says, “you have listened to fears, child.”
Except she was actually in Narnia as a grown woman. A queen with many suitors.
"You've just been Dreaming, Lucy." A perfect summation of her problem.
In some ways, I find Susan's story to be CS Lewis's version of St. Thomas; someone who places the "truths" of this world about the Truth. "Because thou hast seen [the Risen Christ], thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed."
I definitely agree that her implicit journey back to Salvation is one of the clearest links or calls to action for the audience; you do not need to go on these incredible adventures to reach Heaven, you only need to believe.
Great points. Thanks for sharing.
I wouldn’t find the ending for Susan so distasteful if Lewis hadn’t written her “epilogue” in a condescending tone, vilifying girly things like many sexists do. It would’ve sufficed to say that she had been engrossed with mundane stuff and therefore wasn’t willing to face the fantasy of Narnia anymore, instead of bringing up what the author thinks are examples of this
I think JK Rowling's comment about Susan demonstrated a complete lack of understanding of that character and of the Narnia books in general. You've hit the nail on the head. It wasn't that she liked lipstick (or sex), it's that she rejected Narnia.
We've all know "that teen" that's obsessed with fashion, the opposite sex, and partying. Sometimes there are also multiple sexual partners, sometimes substance abuse. Very often, that kind of high-risk lifestyle leads to grief--or at least a medical scare. Regardless, for most people, they have to outgrow that lifestyle. They eventually have to make a living rather than partying most nights. Showing up to work with a hangover isn't a good way to hang on to your job. Nor is addiction. The partying dries up as the rest of the crowd grows up, moves away, or has to go to rehab. They eventually learn that a committed relationship, or singlehood with solid friendships, bring a lot more happiness and security than lots of short and shallow relationships. Sometimes all of that happens in the normal course of maturity, sometimes shock or grief brings it on.
Every once in a while, someone doesn't seem to outgrow that state. Depending on their socioeconomic status, they may end up constantly in the tabloids, constantly be checking in and out of rehab, or end up on the street. But I think you're right, Susan would have been strongly affected by the loss of her family, and she was always too smart and practical to be a party girl forever.
I agree, she would have eventually returned to Narnia.
Maybe the reason we empathize with Susan so much is because we are also Susan. We are apart from Narnia and struggling with earthly trials. Maybe it's meant for us as well to hopefully find our way back. What a beautiful video!
This is perfect! The internet needed an insight from someone who actually cares about narnia on this topic!
God of Narnia
I think that Susan's problem for the first time is described in "Prince Caspian" - she started listening to her fears and in that way she lost her faith in Aslan. Then, meeting with the Lion helped her, but after that she had to leave Narnia. And I know that it was the last time in Narnia for Peter as well, but he didn't have the same problem as Susan - he kept his faith in Aslan and Narnia, so after the train accident he was sent to Aslan's Realm.
I think this is the most sensible study of the so called problem of Susan.
Refreshing to hear commonsense prevail. Stuart talks about the REAL problem of Susan.
Congratulations on superb video addressing a delicate subject.
So thankful for your help researching this topic!
@@IntotheWardrobe Welcome.
I think analysis of Susan in LWW and PC ( foreshadowing ) will help get a clearer understanding of why she was not a friend of Narnia. Textual criticism.
I never connected that part about Susan's horn but that just goes to show how truly beautiful these books were and what careful intention C.S. Lewis showed in writing them. Will you go over other Lewis books too, like the Space Trilogy?
How about The Screwtape Letters?
I will definitely discuss the Ransom trilogy one of these days. There's so much to Wade through here!
@@IntotheWardrobe absolutely! I look forward to it! 😁
THANK YOU.
It's so frustrating when people take the most uncharitable interpretation of Susan's story arc. Finally a video explaining the facts of the situation.
You're quite welcome. Honestly, it seems like the line is usually crossed from uncharitable into just plain untrue, doesn't it?
This video struck a deep chord with me. In my youth (I'm 32), I found Christ. I had a friend who was attending a church. I decided to attend with him, and I found I enjoyed it. The music, the fellowship, the youth group. I started attending regularly. I attended until I was 18, and left for college. I had a hard time finding a replacement church. Ultimately, that's one of many factors I could say that put me in a path to falling out of love with Christ. I was becoming an adult. I was more cynical, I was losing my child-like faith. I was not raised Christian. I came to church of my own accord. Still...over the next few years, I was exposed to college, and experimented, and fell further and further away. I attended a Christian school in 2012, to 2015. I wanted so badly to be a missionary. After my internship fell apart...I lost hope. This was truly the beginning of the end of my optimistic faith. I no longer held hope. I left school for a time, and could not return, due to accrued debt. I'm going to pay it off this year, but still. To this very day, while I cling with my white knuckles to the edge...part of me wants to give up my faith. But I know there is purpose for me out there. He has purpose for me. I'm trying to regain my flame, my hope. These days especially, it is hard. So I identify with Susan and C.S. Lewis in their personal journeys. Except I'm trying to try. I sin daily, but the Lord is there...in the back of my mind. I don't forget Him.
Praying for you tonight, friend. Thanks so much for sharing your story thus far. The story isn't over yet!
Sorry if I went overboard, folks. I'm both impressed and embarrassed with myself.
@@Rojaniel It’s all good.
The ending here was beautiful. It’s not even intended as an attack on unbelief. It is Lewis telling his own story in Susan.
This. This is it. If you want the ending to Susan’s story, read a biography of CS Lewis.
The ending has no empathy. It makes sense she didn't make it to Aslan country given her character arc but the lack of empathy and dismissive tone is what the story conveys. None of the friends of Narnia care about Susan's fate and so the readers are told they to should not care.
I agree it not an attack on the unbelief its a celebration of believing but in that celebration there was no empathy for unbelief even for a previous main character like Susan.
Thank you. You have nailed it on the head entirely, understanding C. S. Lewis's purpose and beliefs. If Susan believed Narnia to be a myth, when she appeared in Aslan's country she would have, like the dwarves, not correctly seen and understood everything around her. How awful would that have been for her and the Seven Friends for her to be in paradise and be unable to see it and understand where she was! C. S. Lewis gives Susan a second chance to remember what is really important, doing to her similar things to what happened to him in real life: his mother died when he was a child and as an adult, he experienced the horrors of WWI.
Thank you for pointing out that Susan's path in life was most likely meant to mirror that of C.S. Lewis. And it's not an uncommon path. I've seen several people, who were brought up in the church, sometimes since birth, fall away later in life. Usually during teenage years. Some stay away, some return to their faith, but I think ultimately many of us, who were raised in Christian homes from a young age, needed to figure out if we believe all of it because we were told to or because we truly do believe it.
My previous Pastor was like that.
Susan is basically Lewis and Lewis saw himself as the prodigal son when he became an atheist as a youth before Tolkien helped convert him to Christianity albeit he became a Protestant instead Catholic which disappointed Tolkien
THIS VIDEO IS AMAZING! I never noticed the parallels between Susan and C.S Lewis & now it seems so obvious! Seriously one of my favourite videos you've made.
susan and caspain kiss in the movie but then he marries liliandil / caspain is married in the book and has a son i never read the books
@@allison3852Caspian’s marriage & son are in “The Silver Chair”, only his marriage is mentioned at the very end of “Dawn Treader”.
The romantic slant to Caspian is one of the main objections fans have to the Disney movies. While Caspian had grown up, Lucy was definitely still a child on the Dawn Treader & Susan wasn’t there at all.
What I think is that...
"Susan" is so much related to all of us...
Sometimes we fall out of grace because of our choices...
But we are never been left behind by Aslan...
He's just waiting for us to come back and be the a Queen of Narnia.
I just wanted to say thank you for your explanation of Susan. You really explained it well, and gave it justification. As a friend of Narnia, I’m going with your explanation of Susan. It makes the most sense. Yes, once a king or queen of Narnia, always a king or queen! That includes Susan. One day, she will return…..
Aslan said that they would know him a little here so to know him more there (their world). This leaves the way open for Susan to know Jesus in her world and thus get to Aslan's land (Heaven). After reading the series 4 times I too felt should would make it in the end.
Great point. Wish I had explicitly stated that line in the video. Appreciate you adding it here!
Aslan also says, at least once in the films that He is known by a different name in our world, and that they must come to know Him by that name...
@@johncunningham6928that name is Jesus Christ.
@@Provocative-K Of course Aslan is Christ. Jesus is, after all, the Lion of Judah. And Aslan is also portrayed as a Lamb towards the end of The Voyage of the Dawn-Treader... And He's cooking breakfast...
Admittedly this is in the book
@@johncunningham6928 yep Aslan behave exactly like Christ whether it's anger joy or sadness.
First Narnia movie makes it very clear.
I always viewed Susan's story line/arc as like the "Prodigal Son" and the train wreck of her family and true friends is/will be the start of her low point. What I find telling is that, in PC if I recall, as they were sent back to our world Aslan gave them a "directive" to find Him in our world and learn more of Him.
Very nicely done.
I've read The Last Battle twice. Once when my parents bought me the boxed set when I was ten, and again in my later teens when I had had setbacks in my faith. I, in some ways, had lost my own Narnia, much as Susan had lost hers. Mine was not so much lost through intent as it was through . . . I'll say the choices of others based on my own wild, if joyful, actions, because it's a long explanation otherwise.
I remember little of the book because I hated it. I hated the twist of the ending (even more when one of my best friends was killed in a car accident months later) and the loss of Narnia. I didn't even remember that Susan was not among the four Pevensies in the book, but nor did I remember that any others from our world were in the book either. The story hurt me deeply as a youth, and even the brief reference to it in this video hurts me now as a man in my fifties.
But this is about Susan, so on to it. As I remind people at times, no one cares about me, not even me oftentimes.
Susan's loss of Narnia was (like mine to what had been my real world equal) self-inflicted, as referenced in the video about the passage from Prince Caspian. She seemed to suffer from insecurity and tried to act like the people she admired in the real world, who acted like grown-ups. Even in Dawn Treader Susan was the one Pevensie who got to go on the lecture tour with their parents as it was said that she would get the most out of the trip. What she got, seemingly, was reinforcement of the idea to discard the things that the outer world didn't value and embrace the things the outer world did value. How different her future might have been if she had had to spend her holidays at the Scrubbs!
I would say that Susan's path is the harder one partly because it took her away from Narnia. Her punishment is, ironically enough, to survive instead of to die. And I see value in the theory that Susan is on the same sort of path that C.S. Lewis was through his twenties and early thirties. Whether this was an intentional plan of Jack Lewis is not for us to know: we are only told our own stories, no one else's. I wonder who she would meet that might have been for her what Tolkien was to Lewis: a guide back to her own more pure and positive beliefs in deep spiritual things that matter instead of ephemeral worldly things that do not matter. Perhaps I'll write my own story about it someday.
But once a King or Queen in Narnia, always a King or Queen in Narnia, as Aslan told them ever so long ago, and I believe the lion. It is my own belief that Susan will have her opportunities to make her way back to being a friend of Narnia and to once again, in the proper time, be with her brothers and sister as Kings and Queens in Narnia.
But I wish I had made the same wise choice that my little sister did years, decades, ago when she borrowed my books. She has never read The Last Battle. "Why?" I asked her. "Because as long as I don't read it, then the stories haven't ended." she replied. She's much wiser than I am, and I regret having read this book still.
I was young enough (6) the first time I heard the story that I was disappointed in Susan, but never gave the matter much thought beyond that at the time. A few years later, when re-reading the story, I thought a bit more deeply about it and concluded that Susan would eventually make it back to Narnia in the end, but that it would probably take a lifetime. This has been my position ever since, bolstered by encountering the same account of Lewis' letter to a fan concerning Susan's potential fate. However, I had never thought of the direct parallel between Susan and Lewis himself.
Even though it's controversial, the idea that she was so distraught that she changed her name and became Jane Studdock of Lewis's book "That Hideous Strength" is a favorite fringe theory of mine (And head canon for me personally.)
Ooh, I like this thought.
My sister's take was that she ended up repressing everything and going to college, and then a painting of a lion speaks to her and she freaks out because she thinks she's going nuts. So she goes and asks a trusted professor for advice. Said professor turns out to be CS Lewis, and that's how he got the idea to write the stories.
Now I'm not sure which take I like better, yours or hers.
@@katherinec2759 What's funny is, in either take she's talking to a professor. Lewis or Ransom (Who's very clearly meant to be JRR Tolkien.)
What a wonderful video! I remember being so shocked when I first found out about Susan, reading those lines as a child and just being confused why they even included them in the first place. But taking 20 years to grow I understand it. Part of growing up is realizing that it isn't something that happens automatically, really growing and learning happens every moment of your life. I enjoy your rather positive take on her fate, and I'm glad to see Lewis didn't have as grave intentions for her as I initially thought
So heartbreaking. There’s always hope that she will remember and return to Aslan’s Country when her time is right🥲
Once a king or queen of Narnia, ALWAYS a king or queen of Narnia.
Aslan doesn't give up on his people, and neither does Jesus. Susan may have pushed her faith away but she'll find it again eventually, and when she does it'll be greater than anyone else's.
Another spanner in the works here is that Lucy, the younger and more trusting sister, is often interpreted as being Susan's "opposite" and so a lot of fans thought Lewis saw younger girls as more likable than their older counterparts. I don't believe that - they're just different, like all siblings/group members and the stories would be much less enjoyable if they weren't.
PS I once came up with a fanfiction where an adult Susan became the "Professor Kirke" to a new generation of children having an adventure in another world. They would eventually discover that 'their' world is another watched over by Aslan (with a different name and form) and Susan would actually die at the end, her spirit rising clad in the robes and armour of a queen with her bow and horn in her hands. A gateway appears with shining figures beyond it and Susan asks one of the kids how she looks - although the child is heartbroken because they have to say goodbye, their answer is "You look ready". Smiling and fearless, Susan's spirit walks through the gateway and the children hear her greet the shining figures with names like "Ed" and "Lu" as they fade away.
That sounds nice where can i read it
@@renskevanleeuwen3512 Need to actually post it somewhere first (classic problem, I never have time to put it out into the world)
And plus leaving Susan alive at the end kinda makes sense because Lucy was the day 1 believer, Peter was the high king and Edmund was the traitor turned good guy who became became a just king when he ruled Narnia
you did a great job at integrating c.s. lewis' beliefs and life struggles into this. i know that this series is faith inspired but kudos to you for not shying away from openly talking about that aspect. keep up the good work
i always felt Susan's story was so sad and kind of unfair. i understand the purpose of not having her join Aslan's country just yet, as she is not ready, but all the other characters seem so mean. I Think her life is just so full of suffering. When she came to Narnia for the first time she was just a teenager, and was developing her personality. After they defeat the witch she grows up in a world of happiness and peace. But she is suddenly forced to go back to our world, to re-adjust to being a teenager AGAIN, and to deal with so much conflict and problems, it was WWII after all. i can't imagine the pain that can bring. She must have felt like her life was stolen. I believe that in order to cope she convinced herself it was just make-believe. In order to be able to live in our world she had to let go of all her good memories of Narnia. That's why she is so dismissive and lost her belief. I just wish the others had more compassion for her.
The others do have compassion for her because they all literally went through the exact same thing. They all had the same experiences as Susan. The only difference is how they all chose to handle it. Susan has no excuse. The others chose to keep their faith throughout all the pain and challenges while Susan chose to lose her faith. This is the same choice that we are all given during our time on earth, and we will all be held accountable for our choices. There is a difference between offering compassion to someone, and completely excusing someone of all responsibility for their own bad behavior. They aren't mean to her or uncompassionate. But they aren't going to pretend that she made a good decision either. Everyone has to be held accountable for their own choices. The compassion and forgiveness is that the door is always open for her to come back. It wasn't slammed on her, and it never will be. If she walks through, she'll be welcomed with open arms. The only reason why she's not there is because she's refusing to walk through or even see the door. That's what it means to be unrepentant. It's that choice that they rightfully call out as being misguided and silly. Hell/unrepentance is a place where a person dying of thirst (Susan) can be offered water as an act of compassion from others (her family trying to remind her of Narnia). But if you are unrepentant, you will just knock that water out of their hand and curse them for offering it to you (Susan dismissing it all as make-believe). If those people who tried to help later say that the person knocking the water away was a foolish decision, that's not being uncompassionate. That's calling out the situation for what it is. The responsibility is on Susan not her family. You can not save somebody who refuses to be saved.
@@BlackNemesis13 you make a valid point and i agree with the second part of your opinion. But my opinion starts from the premise that Susan's experience was completely different from the start than that of her siblings. Maybe i didn't put it very well into words in my first comment. Of course, all the others chose to believe and be faithful to Narnia, but i can't believe it would be the same for Peter who was more mature both in age and mind, and Lucy who was much younger. These two would be the extremes of the age gap. I think for Susan it was already an extremely vulnerable moment in her life when Narnia appeared in their lives, compared to the others.
@@annaana350 I understand where you're coming from, but disagree. Susan was the second eldest of the Pevensie children. There was only one year's difference between her and Peter. Why would her experience be more difficult than her siblings?
@@chizzieshark thank you for your reply! I understand your point but have you ever seen siblings who are that similar that events influence them in the same way? I've never seen siblings, no matter how close in age that are similar in personality and traits. And i know we're speaking about fictional characters, but let's take the setting again. They're in UK where the WWII was particularly difficult for people, they had to be sent away from their home to survive, not being bombed overnight, worried sick about their parents, not knowing how long the war will last or if they will have famine on their hands to deal with. On top of that, she is 12 years old when sent away, at the beginning of her teenage years, which is a struggle by itself. Then.. they were blessed by being brought to Narnia where they could be strong, the heroes of that world. I believe they were brought to Narnia so they could take a break from the world and learn to hope and dream so when they come back they can face the challenges. After they defeat the witch they become kings and queens and reach maturity in Narnia, enjoy long lasting peace and being surrounded by friends. And at this sweetest moment they're brought right back to England, war, bombing and so on. Oh and they're teenagers again. I can't imagine how difficult it would be to have the experience and mind if an adult and being put into a 12 year old's body. And i believe her later behaviour started from all this. Sorry for the long explanation.
I really appreciate you taking the time to write out your thoughts here. You've expressed them well.
I think there's one key factor in the equation that we have to keep in mind: Aslan. Aslan told all the children that he brought them to Narnia so that they would know him by another name in their world. Aslan loved and cared for each individual child according to their own individual personalities, strength, and weaknesses. To say that in the end Susan's personal disadvantages weren't enough to overcome her doubts is to say that Aslan was the one that failed her in the end. I suppose one person may see it one way and another may see it differently, but based on what we know about Aslan and his counterpart in this world I believe it makes more sense to say that Susan failed herself...at least for the time being.
Years ago, I had the idea of Susan...wracked by grief and guilt...having a breakdown and being institutionalized for several years. Then, two things occur. The first is that she hears a whispering voice telling her that the Lord of second chances has an adventure for her. The second is she receives a visit from Mark and Jane Studdock who have come from St Anne's and are part of the Logres. (from "That Hideous Strength") Jane has had a vision that she needs to go to the institution to rescue a queen.
Now, I'm no writer, but I could see a story where Susan (who is the only one left in the world who has talked directly with Maleldil - in the form of Aslan) eventually after many adventures and trials becomes the director of St Anne's, the Pendragon and the Queen of the Logres, replacing the former director (Elwin Ransom) who left earth for a home on Perelandra (Venus), and restoring her relationship with Maleldil.
From there, I could see a whole new "Chronicles of the Logres" books and at some point a very old Susan lays down her office and finally goes to Aslan's country.
The Chronicles of Narnia really are the great parable of Christianity in our modern age. I love it immensely.
I’m going to be honest with you. I’m not a Christian, am not a Narnia fan despite reading the books and seeing the movies, and you answered a lot of my criticism about the way Susan is written in the Last Battle. You’ve given me something to think about and I may reread the books to see if my mind changes. I only ask that you don’t ask me to Chuck out my Pullman books if I change my mind about Narnia lol.
Please check back in and let me know how it goes!
@@IntotheWardrobe Have you done a video on why the kids aged out of Narnia? Like at the end of Prince Caspian when Aslan tells Peter and Edmund they are too old to return to Narnia, yet other humans like Telmarines are born, live, and become adults while living in Narnia. That never made sense to me.
That's a great idea. I'll add it to the list. Thanks so much!
I personally believe Jack (CS Lewis's nickname) did gave us the answer of Susan's fate, in his last book, Till We Have Faces, through the protagonist Orual.
Like Susan, Orual has a troubling relationship with the Divine, loved and envied her young sister Psyche, but hated the Gods most of all for taking Psyche away from her. Its not until her dying days when she has a vision of her soul descending into the underworld to face judgment..... only for Psyche to find her and guide her out in to a sunlit field.
In that knowledge, Orual's redemption is the mature and complex answer to Susan's salvation.
Yes, this is the best explanation for me. I always knew Susan made it to Narnia in the end, but I knew it would be different from the way her siblings got there.
A lot of us lose our way and think we know what’s more important in life, but in the end, hopefully, we all make it back home.
The real problem is people don't realize how much of himself C.S. Lewis put into Susan. When you read the story of Lewis' own conversion you see it. Susan is him.
The crazy thing is I FINISHED THE LAST BATTLE TODAY!!! I have officially finished the Chronicles of Narnia.
Wow...absolutely loved this take on Susan's life. I am 44 and I am just now finishing up the books, but it makes me want to re-read them again and see things I missed. But I have genuinely loved reading through these stories and seeing so many Biblical truth nuggets throughout. I cried at so many parts because it reminded me of times with God in my own story. I love hearing about how C.S. Lewis grew up in the faith and then became and atheist, only to come back to faith full on later and how similar that could be to Susan's life. I think it's great that there are not complete answers to it all because it does leave it open. I really enjoy your channel and it's fun since I have been reading through the stories with my kids.
Christianity gets the bad rap because people on the outside see Grace and Mercy as instant erasers that wipe away all the bad. They don’t see how Grace lends strength and courage in times of trouble, but there is still trouble. And Mercy forgives, but does not deny the crime was committed. I love the analogy of Susan as a reflection of Lewis’s own path through life. I’ve had many friends who were believers as children and then went through a time of doubt and disillusionment that led them astray. Sometimes personal tragedy led them into doubt, sometimes it was just poor decisions; whatever the cause, I always remember my mom saying, “Keep praying for them.” So rather than vilifying Narnia, let’s keep praying that Susan finds her way back to the path and home to her friends, family and Aslan.
Christianity gets a bad rap because of Christian’s
@@girlypop22299 in a way yes. False Christians. Christian’s who dont actually follow Gods word but ignore it or take a few parts of it and try to make their own rules with it. But not all of us are fakes.
I love how you ended it with stuff about how Susan could follow C.S Lewis' path. The honestly made me tear up. And then the very end where you said, "Once a king/queen of Narnia, ALWAYS a king/queen of Narnia.
Her fall was her vanity, which is made very clear in the quote at the beginning. She came to only care about looking good, and being popular. It's pretty heavily implied just from the quotes about her that she's acting immature and not using her beauty correctly. Her rushing to "the silliest time in her life, and trying to stay there," shows she doesn't want to be beautiful for goodness, and to have good, healthy relationships. She wants to be beautiful because it gives her power and she enjoys that power. She's a silly immoral person, and hopefully can find her way back, but that isn't the issue. The real issue is people with similar flaws and sins feeling uncomfortable with their condemnation.
This is really interesting. I like how Susan's story is a little bit of a cliff hanger. The "what if's" flow from uncertainty. It almost is a way of pushing a descision to the reader. What are we going to choose? Friend of Narnia, or Forgetter of Narnia? Not only is Lewis putting his story into Narnia, but he is inviting us to go along with him.
Fantastic point. There's so much power in allowing the reader to make the choice. It forces the question to be addressed: which path is the better one? Love it so much, thanks for sharing.
Thank you for posting this video! This video has done justice for Susan. I was wondering when you will get to discuss about Susan. Susan has been one of my favorite character. I was sad that she didn't enter into Narnia. I had a feeling that she either represent unbelief or Lewis himself. I am glad that she was more like Lewis himself and the tragedies that he faced in his life. I do believe that Susan will get into Narnia one day.
I think reducing Susan’s absence to being concerned with lipstick simply didn’t age well. She was a woman in the 40s. What were her other options in the world in which she found herself? Surely it wasn’t just vanity or frivolity. I think Lewis’s perspective was purely of it’s time. Her fate was written in a way that makes the reader feel that she fell from grace and even committed some kind of betrayal for trying to survive as a woman of her era. It’s not just about makeup. She had to grow up. It wasn’t some failure of her own.
It was no failure whatsoever. Getting into Aslan's country (AKA believing in a Christian afterlife) is just not tenable.
Plenty of women in the 40s weren't into lipstick or nylons. The point isn't that Susan liked those things - it's that she vainly pursued materialistic things and denied the existence of Narnia. As the video points out, the issue isn't that Susan grows up - it's that she thinks she has grown up, but is ironically stuck in a childish mindset.
Did you even watch the video?
I read a quote from C S Lewis about him reading fairy tales again in his 50s, and learning to not want to be 'too grown up'. Maybe that will happen with Susan?
If she becomes a mother and hopefully a grandmother. Will she tell her little ones tales of Narnia? Maybe initially because she fancies that she's remembering childhood games with her siblings. But then, guided by her children's imagination, perhaps she'll begin remembering more details. It will slowly dawn on her that yes, these things really happened, and she'll long to see Narnia again.
Maybe, her most desperate longing will come in the months before her death. And one day, someone in New Narnia will blow the horn and call Queen Susan The Gentle home again.
Love this! 👍🏼
This is lovely ❤
I think part of the problem readers have is that the way it’s written makes it sound like Susan is no longer a friend of Narnia *because* she became what is implied to be shallow and vain and no other reason, because of the way people talk about her.
Thank you so much for creating this, and I loved how you correlated Susan’s life with C.S. Lewis’ and gave hope at the end about “Once a king or queen in Narnia, always a king or queen in Narnia.” Beautiful job and keep up the great work! ☺️😊❤️
Part of what always bothered me about how Susan's fate was handled is that everybody just drags her for her choices. I think it would have felt less like she was being condemned for the mentioned things if ANYONE in the group had said that there was still hope for her. Is it supposed to be implied? Perhaps, but it was obviously missed by many readers.
This hit me just now so I thought I'd share it
1. Matthew 18:1-5
2. Proverbs 31:30-31
3. Matthew 16:19
4. Romans 5:3-5
To grow up does not mean abandoning the spirit of childhood but improving upon it. Femininity is not an excuse to leave spirituality but a cause to embrace it. Hell and all earthly things are a state of eternal separation from the Lord. Suffering makes us stronger and molds us into people worthy of God's grace.
I agree with this analysis. Reading the books for the first time I thought it was weird that Susan was described as no longer being a "friend of Narnia" at the end of the series. However, upon reflection I saw this as a great way for the author to give his audience (primarily children) a warning that just because you believe when you are a child does not mean your belief will not be seriously challenged as you grow up in a skeptical world which has very different priorities. Additionally, the fact that C.S. Lewis chose for that character to be the only survivor at the end of the book demonstrates that he did not intend for this to be (necessarily) the final state of Susan's faith. Rather, it was a way to warn his readers about how they choose to regard their own faith in a world that seeks to either distract from or outright discourage believe. In that way, Susan's fate is no more sealed than that of those reading his novels.
I loved Susan’s ending. It completely broke me down, I bawled and bawled when I read the Last Battle.
If I could change one thing about the last battle, it would be a chapter, where Susan goes home to Lucy’s house, after the train accident.
She cries cause she’s lost her whole family, and she starts going through Lucy’s old diaries.
Lucy has been writing down all their adventures in Narnia, and through Lucys stories, Susan begins to remember.
That's a lovely bit of gymnastics and apologia. C.S. Lewis did this. He wasn't forced to. He made this choice.
This is a really great video, and hits the nail on the head! If we think about it, Susan's story and "problem" is one that happens in real life over and over, to very real people. In fact, for a moment, pretend with me that instead of this being a fantasy story written by C.S. Lewis, let's imagine that Susan is a REAL person, someone we know personally, and is a close friend of ours. And this friend just recently experienced the loss of her entire family, and as a result has lost faith in God. Wouldn't we who are Christians want to come along beside her, love her. And grieve with her for her loss? And wouldn't we pray even that much more for her, that God would lead her back into faith? Of course we would.
And that's exactly why her story is written as it is. To leave open the possibility of love, prayer and faith, which really involves so many more than just one person, all by God's grace.
Thank you for this video!
Very beautifully written. That last line made me cry tears of joy that I've not cried in years.
This is blowing my mind. I’ve thought about Susan a lot but I’d never connected her with Lewis himself! Brilliant!
I've been re-reading the narnia books, and I was ecstatic when I found your channel. I'd love to see you go into detail about the Horse and his Boy, since it's my personal favorite in the series (Even when I was a young boy) and I think it could use some more love.
I think the intent and execution were two completly different things.
We can all see what was meant to be portrayed. Susan stopped believing in Aslan/God and as such wasn't accapted into heaven.
But in execution it sounds more like a cult propaganda, the believers of Aslan were killed to be accepted into heaven, trash talked her sister who was grieving after then irl and implied that she wasn't there because she was materialistic and some other sexist bs. When looking at it from perspective of Susan its even worse because she was kinda forced into that position, she was basicly their mother who had to conform to standards of femininity to be accepted in 1960's world. It all comes accros as sexist and unaware of stuff that Susan had to go through and I understand why so many people found the ending to be awful and felt horrible for Susan.
I see where you're coming from. Most of the criticisms I've seen seem to look at Susan's ordeal in shallow manner, often to reinforce their own biases. However, I'm no expert on Lewis and I haven't read anything of his in long time, so take my opinion with a grain of salt. To me, the story of Susan makes more sense when looked at through the lens of Lewis's apologetic works. With her, he seems to be addressing some of the toughest questions such as problem of pain. There is a lot of underlying theology built into her and her family's story. Of course the idea that Susan is an analog for Lewis himself further reinforces that.
yeah i agree, it's a nice series but it does make it more of a cult/religion propaganda... can see that more clear now that im old :)
@@seltin1988 Lewis cant express his beliefs? If you don’t like it don’t read it. Everyone expresses their beliefs in books I could complain about all the horrible things atheists wrote like how Darwin thought African Americans were just dumb apes and hoped that they would die. Lewis wasn’t in a cult he was a Christian which in the Bible it tells Christians to be wary of cults and taught how to handle that situation.
Thanks for the video. The fate of Susan Pevensie has been bothering me since the first time I read The Last Battle 30 years ago. I'm happy to know there is more to her story than just bitter hearsay about her in the last book.
The life of Susan left unexplained is like Pandora's open box - only hope remains. Brilliant choice by C.S. Lewis.
Your last point makes so much sense. I think that the end of her family's story is the beginning of her return to being a friend of Narnia. She'll remember how much the place and Aslan meant to her siblings and friends. The road back will definitely be hard for her, and the pain might drive her further away initially, but I think it's the start of her path back to Narnia. Once a King or Queen of Narnia, always a King or Queen. It's a clever set up for her story.
I tend to think that Lewis did not approve of the concept of the "teenager" that was appearing in the mid-1950s: the adolescent that had his or her own culture, neither adult nor child. I didn't think of Susan being singled out as sexist; if the four Pevensie children had been Peter, Simon, Edmund and Lucy, then "Simon" could have become obsessed with motorbikes, guitars etc.
As someone who is, in some sense, a "Susan" - someone who used to be a Christian and isn't now - I feel uncomfortable with the way some Christians regard the character, and what they infer from the story. I've seen comments online that basically just blame her alone for what happened, but we don't know what had happened to her between the beginning of "The Voyage Of The Dawn Treader" and the end of "The Last Battle". As for the real world, the situation is even harder. Susan actually - PHYSICALLY - met Aslan. I don't know of anyone who has actually, PHYSICALLY, met Jesus, and when Christians talk about their "relationship with God" they're particularly vague. For some, it seems to be more about a relationship with a book (the Bible) than with a person. For others, they talk about some sort of feeling which they attribute to the nudge of the Holy Spirit, but it's always ambiguous and could be just their own feelings. As an autistic person, things have to be clear and make sense to me in order for me to believe them. That's just the sort of mind I have. Perhaps the off-the-shelf form of faith, which is just right for neurotypical people, is not the right form for me; and perhaps it wasn't right for Susan either - she was always the "voice of reason". I get really fed up of being patronised by (arguably) well-meaning Christians who invariably quote John 3:16 as if I've never heard it before. If there were a "quick fix", I would have found it long ago. And rather than looking down on Susan as the poor relation in spiritual terms, maybe she discovers things about Aslan along the way that blows her siblings' minds when she does get to his country.
I always viewed this ending as C S Lewis's warning towards those who having once had faith/knowledge in their Savior, would then cast it aside and turn away from Him going after things of the world, valuing them more than a relationship with God. He was saying that we should always be striving in building our relationship with God and strengthening our faith, choosing Him continually over the pomp and false allures of the world. I always felt that though Susan missed out on being taken straight away into Aslan's country with all the others, eventually she might find her way there as she "grew up" and realized what really mattered most.
One of the most important and relevant videos in CS Lewis studies.
Should be turned into a book.
Wow thank you for this. I wasn't expecting to feel an emotional response, but I guess I've grieved the loss of Narnia myself. Narnia formed me more than any other story.
You also got to remember that at the end of Prince Caspian when Aslan said they couldn’t go back well then she forgot about it
The problem with Susan is that she abandoned her faith, and turned instead to worship the idols of materialism and vanity. It happens to all of us. We all have different 'idols' we struggle with, and this is where JK Rowling failed to understand. Susan's exclusion from Narnia had nothing to do with her finding sex or becoming a woman, but with the simple fact that she valued worldly things over the truth of God.
By "Growing Up" in this case of Susan is that she stopped believing. Cause there are two terms for the phrase "Grew Up". One is that they embraced having to mature and live the life of an adult. But in other cases such as hers they become a Non-Believer. And sadly throughout the Chronicles of Narnia Susan exemplified that on more then one occasion.
In a way it's like the note C. S. Lewis had at the beginning of LWW when he wrote to his goddaughter Lucy Barfield and admitted: "You are now too old to read fairy-tales, and by the time this book is printed and bound, you will be older still. But some day you will be old enough to read fairy tales again." There's the growing up stage of avoiding all 'childish' things, and then there's the growing up stage where you can come back to the childish things and appreciate them for what they are or were rather than just dismissing them as 'silly' or 'childish.
What hit me in this what the people said about Susan when they did not know that they were dead and that Susan was still alive. I have been marred twice. My first marriage failed when I returned to a ship that was at the same place I left it 9years before. when I left it had not even been commission. One of my jobs was to see that every one who just reported on board to my department got their safety equipment. There were tow men just out of boot camp, and one of them stayed on that ship for all those years; he ragged me to death. Because of this he drove to men, me and the guy who was just under me, out of the Navy. In the middle of this my wife asked for a devastated. I ended up in a mental forced out of the Navy lost my family, every thing. I went to see the man who interceded us and his wife would not let me in the house. Thank you when I needed a little grace, but you had none.