For next week, we played up through the Macalania Temple. I don't know if we'll actually get that far in the conversation, but I stopped after fighting the boss there.
You should edit this comment to point out that there is a point of no return before the Macalania temple that makes exploring Spira more difficult. Once you go left out of the Macalania travel agency you get locked into the next act and cannot freely roam until the last act and still have to fight the Dark Aeons to get to some places. This is mostly only relevant to the Jecht spheres but should still be pointed out.
38:40 The Moonflow, like many beautiful things, is also quite haunting if you think about it. So far in the game, we have been shown pyreflies when you kill a fiend, or when Yuna performs a sending. The reason the moonflow is so beautiful is because there is an entire city which has sunk to the bottom. 1000’s of dead bodies lie in the moonflow. The pyreflies rise from those people’s final resting place.
Rikku ends up being one of the most thematically impact full characters imo. She is an excellent foil for Tidus and the player. In this particular part of the game I think Rikkus introduction is masterfully placed. She introduced you to the world and now that you've seen enough to catch your bearings and begin questioning things Rikku appears to remind the character that they aren't the only one In this way, Rikku acts as a bridge between two segments of Spira and how they address the core struggle of their world The Al Bhed reject Yevon and actively look for alternatives which ends up becoming relevant later in a lot of ways and Rikku is that constant connection for the player and the party to a lesser extent As the youngest member of the party and an outcast in the world at large Rikku carries a lot of the themes of the story in addition to being a very strong person in general. Her dogged persistence in the face of a cruel world and readiness change tactics and plans in the face of any new information parallels Tidus' and the players in contrast to the more static approach of other characters who are grounded in the worlds norms, Waka and Luku for example. Consider how quickly she is willing to go from attempted kidnapper to guardian(made even more remarkable when we learn her connections to a certain party member later) In that way, Rikku(much like Tidus and perhaps the player) sees the world as it could be, not as it is and has an opened minded approach regarding how to achieve this. Tidus and Rikku collaborate in this manner in several key parts of the game. Because of all this Rikku ends up being one of the most relatable and endearing characters in the story while embodying the themes of resistance to entrenched ways of being in pursuit of an independent life
In regards to Wakka's racism against the Al Bhed while not knowing anything about them, that's kind of how it works. People hate things they don't understand and are ignorant of. It's not people who are fully understanding of other races/cultures that are racist, it's people that know little to nothing about them besides stereotypes and false information.
You bring up a great point. In my understanding of ancient Sanskrit there is no word for evil. There is the concept of ignorance as one of the three modes of material nature (the Gunas, the other two being goodness and passion). Ignorance is frequently related to darkness but it's not the notion of fundamental evil, but simply a fact of life that must be overcome.
Wakka *isn't* much of a racist to begin with. His issue is religious; he considers the Al Bhed a group of heretics. The fact that they're an ethnic group is almost coincidental, he only knows them as "those guys with the machina."
I played FFX for the first time when I was 10 years old. Hard to believe it still is such a big part of my life 21 years later and I’m still learning and gaining new perspective on this game. One of the greatest stories ever told and you guys break it down perfect.
One thing Lulu mentions in the discussion of the ancient machina war is that the people built stronger and stronger weapons until they made weapons so powerful they could destroy the whole world, referencing our own world's nuclear weapons and making the Godzilla parallel even clearer.
From what I can tell, when Auron joins the party and says "I wish to become your guardian, do you accept?" and he follows it up with "He comes too" meaning Tidus, that's really the only indication that Tidus is now officially a guardian as well. Since the only other plan was to leave Tidus in Luca to join a blitz-team, it stands to reason that from that point on either Tidus would be officially a guardian, or they would've left him behind. It's not much, but I guess it's something.
@@mikec5400 If I recall correctly, she brings it up and the rest of the party shoots the idea down. I think that cutscene ends with a "well, were all going the same direction anyway, so he may as well tag along" but no real conclusion either way with guardianship.
This is without a doubt my favourite podcast. You guys have enriched my life so much since I found this a month ago. Ive always felt silly about my intrigue on these worlds video game developers made for our enjoyment, Final Fantasy Tactics and 10 are the ones Ive researched the most, and I still learn new things from your guys's perspective. Thank you so much for your work. You make me feel normal lol.
When you meet him at the Moonflow, Maechen tells you about the Hypello and why they're not represented in Blitzball. "Their lackadaisical disposition draws them toward less strenuous pastimes". Also the machina bosses at Luca and in the Moonflow are actually different, the Luca one is the Oblizerator and the Moonflow one is the Extractor. They are similar and they share the same base saucer thing with the robot legs, but the upper half is different. It could be like a modular machine where they swap the top half depending on what tools they need.
My favorite useless fact in today’s episode: the monkeys outside Djose Temple follow Auron around while he’s outside. Shoutout to Kyou, the best blitzball player 🤙
For the first time since this series started I've managed to play a game with the podcast and pretty perfectly sync it at that. Its a lot of fun, especially as I've not revisited X in a long time. Thanks for the experience guys!
This might be a spoiler but... The hide-in-plain-sight subtlety of Yevon banning the use of machina for war was great storytelling. They tell the populace that machina are banned because otherwise Sin will wipe everyone out, but even a casual observer will notice Sin does not ONLY attack those using machina. Yevon uses this spiritual fear to prevent the populous from learning about Yevon's deception and rising up to overthrow them. Bevelle certainly doesn't have a problem using machina for war, after all. They somehow managed to turn Sin into both a tool of "god" to punish heresy and sinners, and also the bad guy summoners need to defeat. Great distraction so they can continue to rule and suppress right out in the open.
You're exactly right, and I'm hoping the guys will discuss this before the end, though I'm sceptical... Sin/Yu Yevon isn't really the primary villain of this story in my opinion, but rather Bevelle and the Maesters. They use their fake religion to manipulate the people into perpetuating their own demise to maintain absolute power over the world. This is an exact mirror of our "real" world.
Love the discussion regarding Jecht and the Shoopuf. So much that can be interpreted from just a simple story and the wider context. *Spoilers* Spira changed Jecht through the Pilgrimage. Traveling with Jecht and Braska changed Auron. Then traveling with Auron and Yuna changed Tidus, and then Tidus changed Spira and the Pilgrimage. The story comes full circle in such a satisfying way.
The “Yevon” pronunciation might actually be justified through a deep-cut historical katakana pronunciation reference. Up until recently in the history of Japanese, the katakana「エ」(much like, as far as I understand, all /e/s and /we/s) was pronounced as /ye/ - this is why, in many historical sources, Edo (modern-day Tōkyō) was referred to as “Yedo” or “Jedo” (with the Latin representing a /y/ sound). In fact, it may have been originally intended for the Japanese「エボン」to have been read as “ye-bo-n”, but Japanese people often have trouble pronouncing historical kana sounds and end up approximating them with current ones (observable in the frequent transformation of「ゐ/ヰ」/wi/ into /i/ and「を/ヲ」/wo/ into /o/ in speech) The translators might have picked up on the Yevon - YHWH connection and known about the linguistic background for it, or maybe it was in the liner notes if it really was the original, intended name for the church. Either that or they wanted to go for an older pronunciation to enhance the fantasy vibe.
@@Mason_van_Bike Yes, that’s right. The /e/ and (historical) /we/ sounds were pronounced as /ye/ up until around the 1750s, long after the initial Euro-Japanese contact. So, the coin got brought over to the west as the “yen” rather than modern Japanese “en”.
It's interesting that Jeckt became a drunkard while in Zarnakand, the city of earthly pleasures and decadence, and quits drinking once Braska lets go of all their earthly wealth. Interesting that he than becomes an embodiment of Sin and returns back to his cave so to speak, where he makes contact with Tidus. Of course Tidus first sees Sin while hanging upside down with his arms spread out, basically in the shape of an upside down cross above the technological controlled water sphere, the ultimate display of decadence and Sin while all of Zarnakand cheers for him and reveres him. Yet hanging upside down above the waters is also like Odin or the Hanged Man looking into the waters below to uncover the hidden knowledge through self reflection, which is the moment Tidus' own journey to conquer Sin begins.
Luzzu and Gatta have another scene near the end of the game if you return to Besaid. I think they're near the monument where people pray for safe travel. It's a cool little scene that shows Tidus' character development.
On Jecht: I can see why Tidus would hate his dad even more, but I always interpreted that moment as a turning point for him. I always assumed Jecht already knew what awaited them at the end of the pilgrimage, and probably thought very highly of the two. I'd even say he was in awe of them that they would move forward so readily knowing what was to come. So after he went off the deep end and true to Japanese culture, he didn't just embarrass himself he embarrassed Braska who brought him on as a representative of his Resolve to defeat Sin. I don't think Jecht could let that slide without seeing things right and that meant being more than a meat head that could kill real good. He had to commit to his role and that meant being better than he ever thought he could be as a person. On Wakka: dead ass he's just prejudice. He's never met an AL Bhed. Like truly met and talked to one. He heard stories and saw one-sided examples, then lump that in with the machina that killed his brother and you got yourself a perfect scapegoat for his hatred. I might be making myself sound naive, but I don't believe you can hate people you never met. Actual racism would entail meeting them, having a positive experience with them and STILL choosing to hate knowing full well they're not all what you've been told they are. Cognitive dissonance at its finest
The term Wakka uses is sand-blasted grease-monkeys. It sounds like a slur because of the word monkey and Spoiler (the Al-Bhed live in the desert), but both terms have their own individual meanings. Sandblasting is a practice used to clean surfaces by blasting them with substances or even just using compressed air. I assume it's called that because the surface looks like sandpaper after the procedure. Grease-monkey is just a slang for a mechanic. So it not only sounds like a slur, but it refers to them as people who like to mess around with machines, which to a follower of Yevon, it may very well be a slur. Don't know what it was in Japanese, but it's a pretty effective adaptation from the translation team if you ask me.
27:00 The Fayth would know who the summoner does and does not consider to be their guardian. I don't think Dona was trying to get Yuna in trouble with the church but with the Fayth itself. (Edited for spelling)
@@adrenalineunlimited3376 Exactly this, it's end-game spoiler territory. But it's mentioned in Besaid Temple either by Wakka, Lulu, or one of the priests that interference by outside parties can cause issues between the Summoner and the Fayth.
Ho. Ly. Shit. That etymology background on Yevon from Casen was WAY more mind-blowing I thought. Thanks so much for that trivia deep dive that's what's so fantastic about this podcast.
Haven't watched this episode yet so idk if you two or someone else has touched on this but here goes: I think the devs knew exactly what they were doing when they made Auron's non-sword arm the one that slips out of his kimono. He's a tank character and his bracer goes on that arm. So for his fighting style it's more important that he get his blocking arm out in a flash, not necessarily his sword weilding arm. Not a big deal or anything, just something I wanted to share with yall. This series is so amazing, gives me all the feels of playing this 20 years ago. And to learn even more about it is exceptionally awesome. Thank you very much for this.
About the shoopuf story with Jecht. I loved that analysis. Everyone else sees it as, “Wow, he realized how his drinking really affects others, so he stopped.” Meanwhile, Tidus sees it as, “yeah, but he didn’t stop drinking for me, when it affected me.”
26:22 Regarding the "So Tidus is just a guardian now?" It's implied that Tidus officially became her guardian when Auron became one. FFX does this thing where in-battle quotes from characters are specific to which parts of the story you're at. Two of Tidus' battle quotes on the Mi'ihen Highroad are a taunt like "I'm a guardian now, so watch out!", as well as a tease to Auron saying "Don't break any bones, old man!" if both him and Auron are in the party at the start of a fight.
Summoners comes from a place. Donna comes from Kilika, they were the least clothed characters so far. Issaru is from Luca the colors scheme fits with Luca.
Also Yunalesca wears barely anything and she is the motherly saint of there religion. So I don’t think Donna appearance has much to do with her lack of knowledge about Auron.
I like the fact some characters don't show up again, it highlights how the pilgrimage is a constant move towards the final goal and you can't look behind you, even if you want to help the people you find along the path. I always pronounced Tidus - Tide us, it seemed to fit with the water theme of the game. Tides eb and flow like a dream, and Tidus is a manifestation of dreams.
More insight from FFX-2: Donna leaves the church of Yevon. That could corroborate the idea that she is on the Summoner's Pilgrimage for more selfish reasons. Barthello, her guardian, stays with Yevon, and the split in their relationship is sort of a microcosm of one of the bigger story lines in the game. FFX-2 is a not-great, weird duck of a game, but I think it's underrated and I wish it got more love. If I had to make a pitch for its legitimacy, it would have to be this. FFX uses the tropes and structures of a folk tale or myth making to show a world trapped in a spiral that needs something new. FFX-2 explores the question of what this new world should look like while using the tropes and structures of an idol anime. Is that a great idea? Probably not. But arguably the use of more modern tropes plays into the theme of a world struggling with modernity. The game doesn't take itself too seriously, which is nice for a JRPG, and it has some nice character moments, specifically for Yuna and Wakka. You guys are doing great. I'm here for as many parts of this as there can be.
FFX-2 is indeed difficult to describe, but apart from the assignments that have little to no logic, the game does tell you more about Spira and its inhabitants. In addition, it had options that FFX itself unfortunately missed, such as a real new game plus.If anyone wants some tips for that 100% feel free to ask. 👍😼
Dona left Yevon for the same reason that many others did. When Yuna revealed to Spira that Yevon had spent the last 1,000 years lying to everyone. That Yevon only existed on the foundations of lies, corruption and murdering those who dared to question their teachings. Dona is hot headed and not the forgiving type. She's the type of person who understandably would have been very angry, hurt and betrayed to discover that Yevon knew her pilgrimage would have resulted in her dying for absolutely nothing. She left Yevon in disgust. Barthello is a much calmer and more forgiving person than Dona. He chose New Yevon because he was prepared to give them the benefit of the doubt and wanted to give them a second chance.
Just wanna say as a long time viewer of this channel and someone who's always appreciated your work here. This game discussion podcast series is truly something special. Can't find discussions about the games I love in a more clean and well thought out format than this. Thank you sincerely!
You two make magnificient, fun and insightful commentary to one of my childhood's most important gaming experiences. Praise be to the State of the Arc guys.
Loving this podcast!! Really like how long each episode is - feel like I can really settle in to enjoy it. So excited to hear all the deep analysis at the end but I also don’t want this podcast to end at all.
I think Wakka is more of a sheltered country bumpkin racist. Coming from besaid he probably has very little interaction with albhed other then when he travels for blitzball. That's probably why he can't recognize an Al bhed that's not fully decked out in the goggles mask's, diving gear ect. Also out of every town spira besaid is nothing but twig huts and tents. The temple is the only thing they have I imagine besaid is an extremely devout village. With everything that happened with chapu imagine if the only people who didn't share your beliefs openly used machina, the whole reason taught for sins existence. It would be much easier to point the finger at them for the world's problems then the unstoppable force that is sin. Also I always thought of Rikkus eyes as a symbol that the Al bhed are the only race collectively that see the unending spiral of sin, death and yevon as the bullshit it truly is.
Just a silly idea but I think there's no temple in Luca because there are too many people gathered there and that makes it a big target for Sin. If Sin attacked Luca, the summoners would lose the ability to defeat Sin if it destroyed the temple.
Dona's character always struck me as the reality of someone mirroring the ideal image of Yunalesca. While she may be presenting herself from a similar position and in a similar light (and with a similar fashion sense), her character cannot reflect the ideal image that the religion has created of Yunalesca's character, that of a saint.
I’m way late to this, but my interpretation of Wakka not knowing Rikku was Al Bhed is because in my head I didn’t interpret Al Bhed as a race, but rather a variation of religion. For example, there are different variations of Christianity (some of which have fought) but because it’s not like a race (which you could identify if you saw someone) so you wouldn’t know if someone subscribed to a belief that you hate unless you asked them. I just finished this episode so maybe you touch on it later, but that part really stuck out to me because even as a kid my real world connection was “ok so Yevon is like Christianity in this world and the Al Bhed are maybe like the Jewish equivalent based on how they’re treated, and you may have no idea someone has that religious belief unless it comes up in conversation.”
I don't think I realized the first time playing this that the reason Jecht chose to become Braska's final aeon and not Auron, given that Auron had fewer attachments in the world, is that Tidus's drive is built on Jechts absence, and that drive eventually leads to the freeing of Spira. If Jecht had returned to dream Zanarkand, it would have changed Tidus, who would have had no reason to go to Spira and kill Sin. Instead, Yuna likely would have either successfully completed her pilgrimage ensuring the cycle continues, or fell victim to Seymour's plotting, ending all life in Spira. That was a really well done plot point.
The one thing that I love about you guys (and I’ve been following you for almost a decade now) is that you’re just two best friends who’ve known each other for so long and yet you talk about video games like you probably did twenty years ago (well, probably more elaborate now ahah). Reminds me of my friends and I back then. Take care, boys. Always a pleasure to listen to your podcasts!
Something easily missed in the next section (Guadosalam): iirc Lulu says she doesn't want to see anyone at the farplane the first time you talk to her there. Of course, there might be something to do with Chappu, Wakka, whatever. What I'm on is this really missable scene when you are supposed to go to the next area but take a quick trip back to the farplane, then you can see a Lulu trying to see someone there but the person won't appear. (There's also a cool scene where you get to listen to Wants there) Spoilers: Lulu is trying to see Lady Ginnem, the summoner she had guarded previously, who you can meet in the Cavern of the Stolen Fayth. She doesn't appear as she's roaming as an unsent.
I agree with your point about Jecht quitting drinking during Braska's pilgrimage. Maybe Jecht grew up a bit in their journey together, and in a way, took steps to redeem himself in his son's eyes. Meeting Braska's daughter probably made him miss Tidus too. This also mirrors the personal growth that Tidus experiences in his adventure with Yuna and her guardians.
In Luca before the entrance to the Mi'ihen Highroad, Auron asks Yuna to become her guardian and she accepts. When Lulu asks why, he explains "I promised Braska", meaning that he promised Braska he would become Yuna's guardian should she become a summoner. After Yuna accepts his offer, he grabs Tidus by the arm, pulls him to the front and says "And... he comes too". He then explains "This one I promised Jecht", meaning that he promised Jecht he would protect Tidus. There is also a second, albeit hidden, meaning to this relating to Auron and Jecht's secret plan to defeat Sin once and for all which involves Tidus playing a key part in this. Whilst there is never any specific mention of Tidus becoming a guardian during this scene, it is the actual moment when he becomes Yuna's guardian. If you speak to Lulu after this scene has finished (just before the laugh scene), she says "You're a real guardian now, so no mistakes. Understood?". This confirms that Tidus became Yuna's guardian during the previous scene.
I cannot believe that I’m +9 hours deep into this and I’m dreading when it’s going to end. I love the depth of analysis and dissecting the historical and religious references.
Hey guys! As you guys mentioned the Hypello playing Blitzball, just wanted to let you know that if you talk to Maechen before riding the Shoopuf and ask him about the Hypello he will say; ''You'd think they'd make admirable players of blitzball. But their lackadaisical disposition draws them to less strenuous pastimes.'' LOL! Also thanks again for shouting out the Final Fantasy Union FFX Facts video a few episodes back. I am the main Video Editor and footage provider for that channel so it was cool to get a shout out :D Keep up the amazing work! Looking forward to the next episode! :)
I played FF X when it first came out two decades ago. This podcast brings back so many good memories from that time. Thank you guys for this wonderful and extensive analysis! Also, I would love to see you cover Chrono Cross or any of the other Final Fantasy games.
Auron feels guilty over what he perceives to be his failure to prevent Braska from dying when defeating Sin and Jecht giving his life to become the final aeon. At the end of Braska's pilgrimage, Auron wavered and wanted to defeat Sin for good but where no one would have to die doing so. Instead, he lost his 2 best friends to a meaningless process whilst Sin returned a year later. Auron became known as the "legendary guardian" but he secretly hates this praise of him as he believes himself to be a failure. He doesn't believe himself to be worthy of any recognition or praise. Barthello is 24 during the events of the game so was only 14 when Braska defeated Sin. He grew up in awe of the "legendary guardian" and was inspired to become a guardian just like him so he could play his part in helping a summoner to defeat Sin. It's only natural that when he meets Auron for the first time he becomes a bit star struck at having met his hero, a man whom he greatly admires and respects. When he asks to shake Auron's hand it's both in part for helping Braska to defeat Sin and for inspiring him to follow the same path. Apart from a respectful chuckle in recognition of Barthello's dedication and loyalty towards his summoner, he doesn't say anything other than offer his hand after being asked to shake it. This is not because Auron dislikes Barthello or is dismissive of him. On the contrary, he honours his request and respects him. Auron's silence and demeanour stems from his feelings of failure so instead he allows Barthello to have the moment he deserves but without allowing it to drag on from longer than it should.
Spoilers for those who haven't completed the game about Luzzu and Gatta: . . . After gaining control of the Fahrenheit airship, your party can return to Besaid and find either Luzzu or Gatta training a new group of Crusaders, ever vigilant in the face of Sin. Also, depending on Tidus' decision during Operation Mi'ihen, Yuna's party will see either Luzzu or Gatta as one of the fallen Crusaders in The Nucleus area of Sin, depending on who survived and who died. After Yuna's party defeats Sin, either Gatta or Luzzu joins the cheering Besaid villagers, depending on which one survived.
Eagerly waiting for the next episodes. Really enjoy this. The first episode inspired me to do another play through- of course I couldnt put it down and already blasted through it, but the story is so rich and never gets old. I love how everything has meaning in this game
Yessssss, something I found out the other day , when the party falls to the bottom of lske macalania, they are actually on sins back , look at the mini city on his back it’s the same buildings
I really enjoyed the discussion surrounding Wakka's understanding and views on the Al Bhed. I don't know how to describe it -- maybe oblivious racism? We've seen countless examples of him not knowing what an Al Bhed is. As much as he dislikes them, he can't tell you who they are, only what they're associated with (machina). And his outlook on them -- being heretics -- is driven by his religion. Take dogma (Yevon) out of the equation, and Wakka doesn't have those blinders. This becomes evident when he meets Rikku, as stated in the episode. He should know she's an Al Bhed, but doesn't because the one thing he's taught to hate -- the use of machina -- is not present when he meets her. Adding another layer to this, Wakka should be skeptical of Tidus when he first meets him. Blonde hair is a common feature with Al Bhed -- how many characters with blonde hair are not Al Bhed in the story? Tidus, an outsider, has blonde hair and his wardrobe is not far off from the distinctive colorful bodysuits we see Al Bhed people wear. But Wakka doesn't see that, and his introduction to Tidus is seeing this talented blitzball star kick a ball across Besaid. And why is this relevant? Because blitzball is Wakka's *other* religion, and you could argue he knows it better than the religion of Yevon.
My mind exploded when you guys briefly commented about the history that they've been told and the relationship to the theocracy. Even the shoopuf, and the crossing, like I find FFX is the best at being the most joe shmo adventure love story while being the most thoughtful and thematic final fantasy story ever.
It's been a while since I've played through FFX, so I am having a hard time remembering. Up until this point of the game, has there been any Al Bhed that Wakka has been in contact with who can speak English (or whichever language you were playing in) instead of the Al Bhed language? If not, maybe that is another thing that makes him not realize Rikku is an Al Bhed...because she speaks in English. IDK, just something I thought about while listening. And also, has it already been revealed at that point that Yuna's mother is Al Bhed? Or did you guys just prematurely mention that? All of these questions are making me want to replay the game. Gotta go check if it's on sale now...
The ironic part about the parable about the sunken city brought to ruin by being built above a river is that Kilika is also built above the water out of like, wood. But no one seems to care because it's existence doesn't seem to be based around machina. There's also another thing ironic about this but it's late game spoilers.
the thing with tidus and jecht really feels like a different take of squall and his father. squall never knew his father so when he sees flashbacks with laguna he just sees some idiot he keeps dreaming about. tidus knew his father very well and is conflicted as others saw him differently then he did.
At one point square wanted to make a game based on auron, braska and jecht but they eventually made X-2 and I honestly would’ve loved to see how braskas journey would’ve been like. Love what you guys do, I keep one headphone in listening to these while I work and it makes the day faster
I always saw jecht quitting drinking showed his growth as a person during his time in spira. I didn't see the perspective you guys saw through tidus before. Interesting.
I think Wakka’s obliviousness to Rikku being Al Bhed is another way they are trying to show just how forcibly Yevon keeps its followers in the dark. They hate things that they can’t even identify or explain.
Im pretty sure the tree inside Sin is a Macalania tree. In fact that whole area iirc is full of landmarks from Spira implying that their Jechts memories of those areas. Also the dead people are there because Sin absorbs pyreflies. Tidus even remarks that Seymour was absorbed by Sin.
Just found you guys so I need to go back to watch the first 6 episodes. Concerning Barthello meeting Auron, there is a supplemental novella(?) that goes into Auron’s thinking about his plan and goals. It states that he hates being recognized and honored because he feels like a failure as a guardian following Jecht and Braska dying. X-2 spoiler: The different locations have independent stories in that game and the Besaid story ends with the birth of Lulu and Wakka’s baby, Vidina. Al-Bhed for “future” and named by Wakka
Jecht became a better person because he did something selfless, by helping Braska and he saved Aurons life because if Auron were Braskas only guardian, he would become the final summon. Besides that Jecht went on this journey because defeating SIN gave his life new meaning. Jecht wasn't happy in Zanarkand at all
As for the conversation of when Tidus becomes a guardian before Djose, it was definitely at the end of Luca. Whenever Auron joins he shoves Tidus forward and says “he comes too” or something like that.
In regard to character dress its worth noting that all of the characters who wear less clothing grew up on tropical islands while Isaru is originally from the Northern city of Bevel. Even Yuna somewhat subscribes to this rule although your point about modesty still holds (although to a lesser extent than Seymour and Donna).
I feel like, in the church aspect, when you bring a non-devout person in and vouch for them, and they too admit to now being part of that faith, it is usually enough unless they break some rules. Which Tidus was doing before he had Auron and (as Yuna says refers to the group at the third temple with Tidus there as: Her Guardians) Yuna's team vouch for him as an actual Guardian. Wakka, I felt, couldn't believe Rikku was an Al Bhed because of the fact she saved Tidus's life. He couldn't associate, or allow himself to associate such a good act with the Al Bhed in his mind. Also, it is so nice when Lulu's sharp tongue is directed at enemies instead of allies haha
Just have to comment on this ep since you're loving the engagement. Honestly can't describe how much these episodes get me through my working week. Thanks so much both of you. Really enjoying the series.
I started playing this game again a month before discovering this channel. In the month since I have restarted my playthrough and have found a new appreciated for the game. I wish there were more podcasts in this format.
57:00 Tidus challenging Wakka actually makes a ton of sense in a cultural sence. Wakka challenging the machina city is also a challenge to Zanarkand, which is a challenge to Tidus. It would be like if you went over seas and you overheard someone bad mouthing something very common in your country. Even if it was something a little silly, you'd still want to defend it because it's part of your country, and they probably don't understand why it's important.
Hey great work as always! one thing you are correct Al Bhed genetic traits are blonde hair, green eyes, and the spiral pattern in the pupils (according to the FF ultimania archive volume 3 page 37)
I would totally subcribe to Patreon for a deep dive into the comments. As long as I scroll down, there's another cool thing to find. It's really astounding to see all of the great ideas and connections that people find, and I think it really points to how loved this game is by it's fans. Every single time I hear anything about this game, it's something new that I've never heard of before, and I absolutely love that I'm not the only person that thinks this is an amazingly well crafted story, and deserves to be on more top 10 lists than it is in. I also cannot wait for more on this Mandela. With all this symbolism you guys are pointing out, I am really feeling like I need to pick the game up again and play through with you guys.
i thought Tidus was a guardian at the end of Luca when Auron joined. after Auron joins the fellowship, he does say "this one comes too" meaning Tidus. it seems becoming a guardian is no more than asking if a person will and said person saying yes or no.
Yeah, and I think it's pretty easy to tell if someone's an interloper or not simply by whether the team vouches. I don't think it's normal behavior for a Summoner to lie or be duplicitous considering their role and what they represent. Hits to their reputation could knock them off their pilgrimage in a heartbeat, so they'd be stupid to allow some random fanboy to ruin that
Yep I have a parent that drinks and they have told me the same exact line that they can "quit at any time". I said okay do it now and they said nope I don't want to. Definitely can relate because they are both the most loving person and hateful person towards me in my life, often at random times they switch in between. Its a brutal experience having to deal with it. Also an NPC says the hypellos are great swimmers but don't have any interest in blitzball
what they were talking about with the Jecht scene and the Shoopuf and the beginning of Jecht's growth I love. I wish more of the game was a balance between Jecht's experience through Spira growing at the same time Tidus was experiencing it. Jecht continuing the cycle while Tidus works to break the cycle. We see some of this with the flashbacks of the Auron spheres but I think it could have been more intricately woven into the story the whole time. Like as Tidus discovers something then later you flashback and see Braska's party and what their interaction with that thing was like. And at the end of the game when they meet again it would be less of an "I hate you" "I know" but more of maybe an "I hated you but I've learned about what you've done and I'm glad you're doing better". anyway I did love that scene but that's my two cents on how I might have done things in hindsight.
Ffx-2 has its share of issues, but there is a bit more world building that helps with the understanding of FFX. Is it worth getting 100% on ffx-2 to get them? No, that's what UA-cam is for. But it does add the the narrative of FFX in subtle ways.
Just because of the time when this game came out, it’s hard to not draw parallels between the Al Bhed and the people of the Middle East. After 9/11, there was a lot of anti-Middle Eastern and anti-Muslim sentiment in the world. The world became afraid of this terroristic boogeyman that was operating in the shadows and could strike at any time. The reality, of course, is that we were generalizing, at the time, almost a billion people because of something they practiced that we didn’t even understand, all just because a series of corrupt, authoritarian leaders and cultural influencers that they were powerless to stop from rising to power lashed out against the US. There’s a lot more nuance to the situation than is warranted for this comment, but I couldn’t help but see this oddly-timed parallel. Especially considering the game came out in Japan several months prior to 9/11 anyway.
I always just assumed the sunken city was just a city that, due to some shit happening with Sin, was flooded and sunk. Sin clearly has enough destructive power to affect topography and if it's been sunken for a thousand years that sort if lines up with the first appearance of Sin.
Hello guys. I love your podcast of ffx, which is my favorite game. I have one theory about Dona, that I have only thought about after my 5th or 6th time playing the game (it can cointain one small SPOILER later in the mid-game for those who haven't played yet). You remember that we meet her the first time in the Kilika Temple a short time after the sending. Which means that when Sin came and destroid the village, she was there. And when Yuna had the sending ceremony, she was also there. The fact that the villagers came to Yuna and not her must have been too painful, especially knowing she is from Kilika. In her point of view, the villagers prefered to request the sending from this inexperienced summoner instead of the more experienced and local one, because Yuna is the High Summoner's daughter. I think this is why Dona always attacks Yuna for her status (seemingly for no reason). We could also argue that Dona was in the Temple praying to the Fayth and was not available at the moment. In this case, Dona just sees in Yuna the person to whom direct her frustrations for not having been available to do what she was trained and prepared for (since Sin can attack any place at any time), in the service of her fellow villagers who passed away, some of which may have been relatives. She feels betrayed by her own people, illustrated by the quote from the Bible "no prophet is accepted in his hometown" something that will also apply to Yuna later on. That is not to say that Dona is justified in doing what she does, but I think it brings more humanity and depth to this character, beyond the simple image of the "disrespectful rival". I really love the fact that even after many playthroughs, this game has still so much to offer if we are willing to search.
Just wanna say I have a podcast rotation for when I go out Doordashing and Wednesdays are the best. Between Frame Trap, Into the Aether, and this I'm always looking forward to that day, thank you guys I've been enjoying this as well as catching up on previous ones.
Regarding the summoners and the blitz tournament: I actually don't think that the Al Bhed were ever even attempting to get them to forfeit the game at all, but that the party ASSUMED this is why they kidnapped Yuna, having no idea about their true intentions. I don't know if it's actually concretely implied that they provided a random note or whatever, or that they would have had time to do that. This also makes sense considering the Aurochs are the worst team in the league. It IS in fact weird that they would try and get them to throw the game, because that's not what they were doing in the slightest. But it's the only reason that the party could come up with for their behavior. This does re-introduce the weirdness of the "not taking chances" comment but I think it makes a lot of sense that they would jump to the conclusion that the Psyches were willing to manipulate the game, based on their pre-conceived notions about those people.
I believe the reason Jecht quit drinking was not because he brought shame and humiliation to himself, but rather Braska. As Braska's Guardian, his actions reflect on his Summoner, and so him attacking the Shoopuff brought shame and humiliation to Braska, and at this point in the journey, his friend.
Hi! Thanks for this episode; it is as always a real treat! Regarding the Al Bhed question (how much are they different from non-Al Bhed people) I recall seeing a video speaking partially about that. Based on the "Final Fantasy X-2.5: Price of Eternity" novel and lots of messages and symbols in the Iutycyr tower (from "Final Fantasy X-2: Last Mission"), it crafted a very interesting analysis linking Al Bheds to alchimy (we see you there Rikku!). I don't really know if it is ok for me to say more about this in this comment, fearing to spoil something for anybody, but it is also quite coherent with their way to see machinas and could add some depths to their relation with Yevon. Loving the show! o/
Edit your comment saying spoilers in the comments and then please place the spoiler stuff inside your comment, that way people will know there is a spoiler inside your comments. Interested to hear your thoughts
@@bennieboi20 Sure thing. o/ Well, I'll place the spoilers in this answer then, so it's cleanly separated from the first comment. Keep in mind it is a study done in a video from the Zelant channel; I did not do the researches myself. Also I hope my english will not be too bad! The Iutycyr tower is the main building explored in "Final Fantasy X-2: Last Mission". According to the people who discovered the place before requesting the help of Yuna and her party, it is supposed to be even older than Zanarkand. We can find at its base what could be seen as residential quarters but the more we climb the tower the more it becomes technological (even monsters get replaced to a certain degree by machines), up to an hydra guardian and a broken mechanic device on its top. The name given to the tower and the signs on the house at its bottom are linked to the Al Bhed language ("Iutycyr" means "Eidolon" in Al Bhed). Most of the signs are just merchant stuff, but one of them can be translated as Yadonoki >> Maboroshi >> Dream, Illusion, Ghost (which has a direct link with the Eidolon definition). In addition to this the tower has an additional name (which could be the original name before its re-discovery at the time of X-2?), which can be found in the Final Fantasy Art Museum Trading Cards: Abrasanym Tower (meaning "Ephemeral" in Al Bhed). Now on another topic there is another lexical field linked to this tower: Ouroboros (the cycle of life and death, the idea of eternity): - On the broken device at the top of the tower, the circle around the central floating sphere can be interpreted as a snake trying to get its tail; - On the seal around the hydra guardian when its waking up, saying "Each death brings the promise of another life, each life brings the promise of another death, the circle remains uninterrupted." In addition to that snakes are very present in the last stages of the tower (with the hydra, on the walls, through statues...). Now, Ouroboros is about life and death but it also an important component of the Alchimy occult science. It "defines" the cycle through which matter goes when we try to transform it. In this cycle we can find three major steps linked to a colour each: Nigredo, Rubedo and Albedo. Albedo which in japanese has the orthograph of Al Bhed, linked to the colour white and opposed to the ebony colour behind Yevon. Talking about Alchimy, we know it exists in Spira based on Rikku's Overdrive. There is also an Alchimist class in X-2. This thema is reinforced by a big glyph (serving as a canvas in Alchimy for matter transformation operations) floating in around the tower when we climb it up to its last stages. That's it for the lexical fields around the tower but remains the question of what all this structure's purpose is. When the mechanism at the top of the tower finally gets working at the end of Last Mission, it creates a water-like double helix, the universal symbol of DNA and an element we usually link to the concept of life itself. Now there is a lot of principles and rules in Alchimy around the universe and matter themas, but kind of a golden rule comes when we speak about life: it is forbidden to create life through Alchimy. It could result in creating imperfect entities doomed to live painful existences, making this practice a sin. Entities created through Alchimy are called homunculus. Taking then "Final Fantasy X-2.5: Price of Eternity". A little bit before the apparition of Sin, a scientist called Alb tried to find a solution to avoid to see more humans being killed by the Great War. Without having much details on it, it seems he's been able to create synthetic soldiers replacing humans on the battlefield. However, those soldiers were quite dense to spiritual energy and so were unable to use magic. In response to that they were more in charge of machine based equipments, becoming their specialty through the ages. As things evolved during the War, people who thought those synthetic soldiers were machines themselves discovered they were bleeding and even dying: behind their armors they were just flesh and bones like any other human. Artificial humans created in a laboratory by Alb. Those creations were called "Bedohl" at the time. We could imagine that after Sin striked and Yevon took advantage of the situation to spread its anti-machine politics, killing most of the Bedohls in the process, the "Alb" and "Bedohl" terms were merged into "Albedohl", then the previously defined "Albedo" leading to our "Al Bheds". Making Al Bheds homunculus from a type of occult science forgotten through ages. This gives the whole social fight of Al Bheds a new colour, insisting on their DNA differences and the repercutions it had on the perception people (and organizations like Yevon) had on them. A tool trying to keep its expertise relevant regarding machines but also people trying to find their place in a world demonizing them under the Yevon reign. It also allows to see Last Mission a little differently: now that Yevon is no more at the top of the game and that people are ready to live together, society has now some time to gain knowledge on its history. People re-discover places, interrogate themselves and find up to the Iutycyr Tower, potentially Alb's laboratory. It does not answer everything and it is possible that my traduction from Zelant's video (which is in french) made things a little unclear but I hope you had a good time reading those thoughts, and that it stimulated you to learn always more about this fantastic world! o/
My reading of how Donna's costume design reflects her inner character is that she's not a very complex, deep, or closed-off kind of person and I think her lack of clothes bears that out to the audience. They're shallow, vain, and often petty and they go through no effort to hide their disdain for their competition. And I think it makes sense that their costume design reflects this.
I want to get into how expertly FFX’s story mirrors and rhymes with itself but I do think that’s best saved for the finale. You really start to see a lot of it in this part of the game, as a lot of it has to do with the dichotomy of Tidus and Yuna’s stories.
I also feel Like Most of Spira has a limited drinking culture as well due to the religious presence. That could have helped Jecht cut back in general as where in Zanarkand it's just what alot of ppl do. Side note: Yes Lulu is Pregnant with Wakka in X-2.
Auron's comment about Spira resisting change is a nice touch; outsiders think it's weird that the place doesn't change. But even if the people don't strive to make changes in their world, you'd think natural selective forces would create those changes anyway. The biggest thing is that, despite sea-borne attacks from Sin, people still mostly live on the coast. You'd think that would have been forcibly changed by Sin. Or even that the attacks would have gotten rid of cities entirely, and people would be nomadic! And it's odd to me that summoning has not gotten any better over time. It's the most important technology in their world--and one that doesn't bring down Sin's wrath, either! But it seems like there are very few summoners relative to how important they are. I don't remember that ever being explained.
I think that you missed a scene here. After the battle against Rikku's Machina, if you see her lying on the ground and Don't approach her, she will beret you for trying to leave her, shouting you while her face is down to the ground.
For next week, we played up through the Macalania Temple. I don't know if we'll actually get that far in the conversation, but I stopped after fighting the boss there.
You should edit this comment to point out that there is a point of no return before the Macalania temple that makes exploring Spira more difficult. Once you go left out of the Macalania travel agency you get locked into the next act and cannot freely roam until the last act and still have to fight the Dark Aeons to get to some places. This is mostly only relevant to the Jecht spheres but should still be pointed out.
Auron _"Don't tell Yuna that you know about Sin and Jecht."_
Tidas _"Woah, I gotta tell Yuna"_
Auron _"I said_ not _to tell Yuna."_
Haha nice one.
38:40
The Moonflow, like many beautiful things, is also quite haunting if you think about it.
So far in the game, we have been shown pyreflies when you kill a fiend, or when Yuna performs a sending.
The reason the moonflow is so beautiful is because there is an entire city which has sunk to the bottom.
1000’s of dead bodies lie in the moonflow.
The pyreflies rise from those people’s final resting place.
Rikku ends up being one of the most thematically impact full characters imo. She is an excellent foil for Tidus and the player. In this particular part of the game I think Rikkus introduction is masterfully placed. She introduced you to the world and now that you've seen enough to catch your bearings and begin questioning things Rikku appears to remind the character that they aren't the only one
In this way, Rikku acts as a bridge between two segments of Spira and how they address the core struggle of their world
The Al Bhed reject Yevon and actively look for alternatives which ends up becoming relevant later in a lot of ways and Rikku is that constant connection for the player and the party to a lesser extent
As the youngest member of the party and an outcast in the world at large Rikku carries a lot of the themes of the story in addition to being a very strong person in general. Her dogged persistence in the face of a cruel world and readiness change tactics and plans in the face of any new information parallels Tidus' and the players in contrast to the more static approach of other characters who are grounded in the worlds norms, Waka and Luku for example. Consider how quickly she is willing to go from attempted kidnapper to guardian(made even more remarkable when we learn her connections to a certain party member later) In that way, Rikku(much like Tidus and perhaps the player) sees the world as it could be, not as it is and has an opened minded approach regarding how to achieve this. Tidus and Rikku collaborate in this manner in several key parts of the game.
Because of all this Rikku ends up being one of the most relatable and endearing characters in the story while embodying the themes of resistance to entrenched ways of being in pursuit of an independent life
Rikku and Wakka are my favorite characters from the main party.
This podcast saves me every wednesday during my long shifts, easily the best gaming podcasftout there. Thanks guys!!!
I have listened to this podcast every single Wednesday since they came back with it. I daresay State of the Arc is my favorite podcast!
Same! 10 hour days… but this makes it a little easier
Hands down. With this and Triple KO I have both of my favorite genres covered each week.
When I first read your comment, I thought you said a different , but similar word than your long "shifts" 😄
In regards to Wakka's racism against the Al Bhed while not knowing anything about them, that's kind of how it works. People hate things they don't understand and are ignorant of. It's not people who are fully understanding of other races/cultures that are racist, it's people that know little to nothing about them besides stereotypes and false information.
Yeh pretty classic bigotry in my experience
You bring up a great point. In my understanding of ancient Sanskrit there is no word for evil. There is the concept of ignorance as one of the three modes of material nature (the Gunas, the other two being goodness and passion). Ignorance is frequently related to darkness but it's not the notion of fundamental evil, but simply a fact of life that must be overcome.
Wakka *isn't* much of a racist to begin with. His issue is religious; he considers the Al Bhed a group of heretics. The fact that they're an ethnic group is almost coincidental, he only knows them as "those guys with the machina."
@@Msoulwing That is a form of racism
@@debrucey Borderline. Make them a purely ideological group and nothing about Wakka's stance changes.
I played FFX for the first time when I was 10 years old. Hard to believe it still is such a big part of my life 21 years later and I’m still learning and gaining new perspective on this game. One of the greatest stories ever told and you guys break it down perfect.
One thing Lulu mentions in the discussion of the ancient machina war is that the people built stronger and stronger weapons until they made weapons so powerful they could destroy the whole world, referencing our own world's nuclear weapons and making the Godzilla parallel even clearer.
Also spoilers for FFX-2, this is exactly the kind of weapon Vegnagun is, one of the greatest weapons of all time
From what I can tell, when Auron joins the party and says "I wish to become your guardian, do you accept?" and he follows it up with "He comes too" meaning Tidus, that's really the only indication that Tidus is now officially a guardian as well. Since the only other plan was to leave Tidus in Luca to join a blitz-team, it stands to reason that from that point on either Tidus would be officially a guardian, or they would've left him behind. It's not much, but I guess it's something.
There's an in-battle line that Tidus says at the Highroad (I think you need to swap him in to hear it) where he says, "Watch out, I'm a Guardian now."
doesnt Yuna ask him to be a guardian in kilika
@@mikec5400 If I recall correctly, she brings it up and the rest of the party shoots the idea down. I think that cutscene ends with a "well, were all going the same direction anyway, so he may as well tag along" but no real conclusion either way with guardianship.
This is without a doubt my favourite podcast. You guys have enriched my life so much since I found this a month ago. Ive always felt silly about my intrigue on these worlds video game developers made for our enjoyment, Final Fantasy Tactics and 10 are the ones Ive researched the most, and I still learn new things from your guys's perspective. Thank you so much for your work. You make me feel normal lol.
When you meet him at the Moonflow, Maechen tells you about the Hypello and why they're not represented in Blitzball. "Their lackadaisical disposition draws them toward less strenuous pastimes".
Also the machina bosses at Luca and in the Moonflow are actually different, the Luca one is the Oblizerator and the Moonflow one is the Extractor. They are similar and they share the same base saucer thing with the robot legs, but the upper half is different. It could be like a modular machine where they swap the top half depending on what tools they need.
My favorite useless fact in today’s episode: the monkeys outside Djose Temple follow Auron around while he’s outside. Shoutout to Kyou, the best blitzball player 🤙
For the first time since this series started I've managed to play a game with the podcast and pretty perfectly sync it at that. Its a lot of fun, especially as I've not revisited X in a long time. Thanks for the experience guys!
This might be a spoiler but...
The hide-in-plain-sight subtlety of Yevon banning the use of machina for war was great storytelling. They tell the populace that machina are banned because otherwise Sin will wipe everyone out, but even a casual observer will notice Sin does not ONLY attack those using machina. Yevon uses this spiritual fear to prevent the populous from learning about Yevon's deception and rising up to overthrow them. Bevelle certainly doesn't have a problem using machina for war, after all.
They somehow managed to turn Sin into both a tool of "god" to punish heresy and sinners, and also the bad guy summoners need to defeat. Great distraction so they can continue to rule and suppress right out in the open.
You're exactly right, and I'm hoping the guys will discuss this before the end, though I'm sceptical... Sin/Yu Yevon isn't really the primary villain of this story in my opinion, but rather Bevelle and the Maesters. They use their fake religion to manipulate the people into perpetuating their own demise to maintain absolute power over the world. This is an exact mirror of our "real" world.
Love the discussion regarding Jecht and the Shoopuf. So much that can be interpreted from just a simple story and the wider context.
*Spoilers*
Spira changed Jecht through the Pilgrimage. Traveling with Jecht and Braska changed Auron. Then traveling with Auron and Yuna changed Tidus, and then Tidus changed Spira and the Pilgrimage.
The story comes full circle in such a satisfying way.
The “Yevon” pronunciation might actually be justified through a deep-cut historical katakana pronunciation reference. Up until recently in the history of Japanese, the katakana「エ」(much like, as far as I understand, all /e/s and /we/s) was pronounced as /ye/ - this is why, in many historical sources, Edo (modern-day Tōkyō) was referred to as “Yedo” or “Jedo” (with the Latin representing a /y/ sound). In fact, it may have been originally intended for the Japanese「エボン」to have been read as “ye-bo-n”, but Japanese people often have trouble pronouncing historical kana sounds and end up approximating them with current ones (observable in the frequent transformation of「ゐ/ヰ」/wi/ into /i/ and「を/ヲ」/wo/ into /o/ in speech)
The translators might have picked up on the Yevon - YHWH connection and known about the linguistic background for it, or maybe it was in the liner notes if it really was the original, intended name for the church. Either that or they wanted to go for an older pronunciation to enhance the fantasy vibe.
Is this how 円 became “Yen” with a Y when transcribed into English?
@@Mason_van_Bike Yes, that’s right. The /e/ and (historical) /we/ sounds were pronounced as /ye/ up until around the 1750s, long after the initial Euro-Japanese contact. So, the coin got brought over to the west as the “yen” rather than modern Japanese “en”.
It's interesting that Jeckt became a drunkard while in Zarnakand, the city of earthly pleasures and decadence, and quits drinking once Braska lets go of all their earthly wealth. Interesting that he than becomes an embodiment of Sin and returns back to his cave so to speak, where he makes contact with Tidus. Of course Tidus first sees Sin while hanging upside down with his arms spread out, basically in the shape of an upside down cross above the technological controlled water sphere, the ultimate display of decadence and Sin while all of Zarnakand cheers for him and reveres him. Yet hanging upside down above the waters is also like Odin or the Hanged Man looking into the waters below to uncover the hidden knowledge through self reflection, which is the moment Tidus' own journey to conquer Sin begins.
I love that Al-Bhed have Dreamcast eyes
Luzzu and Gatta have another scene near the end of the game if you return to Besaid. I think they're near the monument where people pray for safe travel. It's a cool little scene that shows Tidus' character development.
On Jecht: I can see why Tidus would hate his dad even more, but I always interpreted that moment as a turning point for him. I always assumed Jecht already knew what awaited them at the end of the pilgrimage, and probably thought very highly of the two. I'd even say he was in awe of them that they would move forward so readily knowing what was to come. So after he went off the deep end and true to Japanese culture, he didn't just embarrass himself he embarrassed Braska who brought him on as a representative of his Resolve to defeat Sin. I don't think Jecht could let that slide without seeing things right and that meant being more than a meat head that could kill real good. He had to commit to his role and that meant being better than he ever thought he could be as a person.
On Wakka: dead ass he's just prejudice. He's never met an AL Bhed. Like truly met and talked to one. He heard stories and saw one-sided examples, then lump that in with the machina that killed his brother and you got yourself a perfect scapegoat for his hatred.
I might be making myself sound naive, but I don't believe you can hate people you never met. Actual racism would entail meeting them, having a positive experience with them and STILL choosing to hate knowing full well they're not all what you've been told they are. Cognitive dissonance at its finest
You're on the right path regarding wakka. He's not racist by any means, he's prejudices are born from the death of Chapu
The term Wakka uses is sand-blasted grease-monkeys.
It sounds like a slur because of the word monkey and Spoiler (the Al-Bhed live in the desert), but both terms have their own individual meanings. Sandblasting is a practice used to clean surfaces by blasting them with substances or even just using compressed air. I assume it's called that because the surface looks like sandpaper after the procedure. Grease-monkey is just a slang for a mechanic. So it not only sounds like a slur, but it refers to them as people who like to mess around with machines, which to a follower of Yevon, it may very well be a slur.
Don't know what it was in Japanese, but it's a pretty effective adaptation from the translation team if you ask me.
27:00 The Fayth would know who the summoner does and does not consider to be their guardian. I don't think Dona was trying to get Yuna in trouble with the church but with the Fayth itself.
(Edited for spelling)
oh, interesting. But then why didn't she get in trouble?
@@adrenalineunlimited3376 Exactly this, it's end-game spoiler territory.
But it's mentioned in Besaid Temple either by Wakka, Lulu, or one of the priests that interference by outside parties can cause issues between the Summoner and the Fayth.
Ho. Ly. Shit. That etymology background on Yevon from Casen was WAY more mind-blowing I thought. Thanks so much for that trivia deep dive that's what's so fantastic about this podcast.
Haven't watched this episode yet so idk if you two or someone else has touched on this but here goes: I think the devs knew exactly what they were doing when they made Auron's non-sword arm the one that slips out of his kimono. He's a tank character and his bracer goes on that arm. So for his fighting style it's more important that he get his blocking arm out in a flash, not necessarily his sword weilding arm. Not a big deal or anything, just something I wanted to share with yall. This series is so amazing, gives me all the feels of playing this 20 years ago. And to learn even more about it is exceptionally awesome. Thank you very much for this.
About the shoopuf story with Jecht. I loved that analysis. Everyone else sees it as, “Wow, he realized how his drinking really affects others, so he stopped.” Meanwhile, Tidus sees it as, “yeah, but he didn’t stop drinking for me, when it affected me.”
26:22 Regarding the "So Tidus is just a guardian now?"
It's implied that Tidus officially became her guardian when Auron became one. FFX does this thing where in-battle quotes from characters are specific to which parts of the story you're at. Two of Tidus' battle quotes on the Mi'ihen Highroad are a taunt like "I'm a guardian now, so watch out!", as well as a tease to Auron saying "Don't break any bones, old man!" if both him and Auron are in the party at the start of a fight.
Summoners comes from a place. Donna comes from Kilika, they were the least clothed characters so far. Issaru is from Luca the colors scheme fits with Luca.
Also Yunalesca wears barely anything and she is the motherly saint of there religion. So I don’t think Donna appearance has much to do with her lack of knowledge about Auron.
I like the fact some characters don't show up again, it highlights how the pilgrimage is a constant move towards the final goal and you can't look behind you, even if you want to help the people you find along the path.
I always pronounced Tidus - Tide us, it seemed to fit with the water theme of the game. Tides eb and flow like a dream, and Tidus is a manifestation of dreams.
More insight from FFX-2: Donna leaves the church of Yevon. That could corroborate the idea that she is on the Summoner's Pilgrimage for more selfish reasons. Barthello, her guardian, stays with Yevon, and the split in their relationship is sort of a microcosm of one of the bigger story lines in the game.
FFX-2 is a not-great, weird duck of a game, but I think it's underrated and I wish it got more love. If I had to make a pitch for its legitimacy, it would have to be this. FFX uses the tropes and structures of a folk tale or myth making to show a world trapped in a spiral that needs something new. FFX-2 explores the question of what this new world should look like while using the tropes and structures of an idol anime. Is that a great idea? Probably not. But arguably the use of more modern tropes plays into the theme of a world struggling with modernity. The game doesn't take itself too seriously, which is nice for a JRPG, and it has some nice character moments, specifically for Yuna and Wakka.
You guys are doing great. I'm here for as many parts of this as there can be.
FFX-2 is indeed difficult to describe, but apart from the assignments that have little to no logic, the game does tell you more about Spira and its inhabitants.
In addition, it had options that FFX itself unfortunately missed, such as a real new game plus.If anyone wants some tips for that 100% feel free to ask. 👍😼
Dona left Yevon for the same reason that many others did. When Yuna revealed to Spira that Yevon had spent the last 1,000 years lying to everyone. That Yevon only existed on the foundations of lies, corruption and murdering those who dared to question their teachings. Dona is hot headed and not the forgiving type. She's the type of person who understandably would have been very angry, hurt and betrayed to discover that Yevon knew her pilgrimage would have resulted in her dying for absolutely nothing. She left Yevon in disgust.
Barthello is a much calmer and more forgiving person than Dona. He chose New Yevon because he was prepared to give them the benefit of the doubt and wanted to give them a second chance.
Just wanna say as a long time viewer of this channel and someone who's always appreciated your work here. This game discussion podcast series is truly something special. Can't find discussions about the games I love in a more clean and well thought out format than this.
Thank you sincerely!
You two make magnificient, fun and insightful commentary to one of my childhood's most important gaming experiences. Praise be to the State of the Arc guys.
Loving this podcast!! Really like how long each episode is - feel like I can really settle in to enjoy it. So excited to hear all the deep analysis at the end but I also don’t want this podcast to end at all.
I absolutely love this podcast! So much lore and so many life lessons that were buried beneath the surface to me.
I think Wakka is more of a sheltered country bumpkin racist. Coming from besaid he probably has very little interaction with albhed other then when he travels for blitzball. That's probably why he can't recognize an Al bhed that's not fully decked out in the goggles mask's, diving gear ect. Also out of every town spira besaid is nothing but twig huts and tents. The temple is the only thing they have I imagine besaid is an extremely devout village. With everything that happened with chapu imagine if the only people who didn't share your beliefs openly used machina, the whole reason taught for sins existence. It would be much easier to point the finger at them for the world's problems then the unstoppable force that is sin. Also I always thought of Rikkus eyes as a symbol that the Al bhed are the only race collectively that see the unending spiral of sin, death and yevon as the bullshit it truly is.
Wrong. Wrong in your assumptions and wrong about wakka being racist
Just a silly idea but I think there's no temple in Luca because there are too many people gathered there and that makes it a big target for Sin. If Sin attacked Luca, the summoners would lose the ability to defeat Sin if it destroyed the temple.
the temples being so far apart from eachother shows this might be the case.
Dona's character always struck me as the reality of someone mirroring the ideal image of Yunalesca. While she may be presenting herself from a similar position and in a similar light (and with a similar fashion sense), her character cannot reflect the ideal image that the religion has created of Yunalesca's character, that of a saint.
I’m way late to this, but my interpretation of Wakka not knowing Rikku was Al Bhed is because in my head I didn’t interpret Al Bhed as a race, but rather a variation of religion. For example, there are different variations of Christianity (some of which have fought) but because it’s not like a race (which you could identify if you saw someone) so you wouldn’t know if someone subscribed to a belief that you hate unless you asked them.
I just finished this episode so maybe you touch on it later, but that part really stuck out to me because even as a kid my real world connection was “ok so Yevon is like Christianity in this world and the Al Bhed are maybe like the Jewish equivalent based on how they’re treated, and you may have no idea someone has that religious belief unless it comes up in conversation.”
I don't think I realized the first time playing this that the reason Jecht chose to become Braska's final aeon and not Auron, given that Auron had fewer attachments in the world, is that Tidus's drive is built on Jechts absence, and that drive eventually leads to the freeing of Spira.
If Jecht had returned to dream Zanarkand, it would have changed Tidus, who would have had no reason to go to Spira and kill Sin. Instead, Yuna likely would have either successfully completed her pilgrimage ensuring the cycle continues, or fell victim to Seymour's plotting, ending all life in Spira.
That was a really well done plot point.
The one thing that I love about you guys (and I’ve been following you for almost a decade now) is that you’re just two best friends who’ve known each other for so long and yet you talk about video games like you probably did twenty years ago (well, probably more elaborate now ahah). Reminds me of my friends and I back then. Take care, boys. Always a pleasure to listen to your podcasts!
Something easily missed in the next section (Guadosalam):
iirc Lulu says she doesn't want to see anyone at the farplane the first time you talk to her there. Of course, there might be something to do with Chappu, Wakka, whatever.
What I'm on is this really missable scene when you are supposed to go to the next area but take a quick trip back to the farplane, then you can see a Lulu trying to see someone there but the person won't appear. (There's also a cool scene where you get to listen to Wants there)
Spoilers:
Lulu is trying to see Lady Ginnem, the summoner she had guarded previously, who you can meet in the Cavern of the Stolen Fayth. She doesn't appear as she's roaming as an unsent.
I agree with your point about Jecht quitting drinking during Braska's pilgrimage. Maybe Jecht grew up a bit in their journey together, and in a way, took steps to redeem himself in his son's eyes. Meeting Braska's daughter probably made him miss Tidus too.
This also mirrors the personal growth that Tidus experiences in his adventure with Yuna and her guardians.
In Luca before the entrance to the Mi'ihen Highroad, Auron asks Yuna to become her guardian and she accepts. When Lulu asks why, he explains "I promised Braska", meaning that he promised Braska he would become Yuna's guardian should she become a summoner. After Yuna accepts his offer, he grabs Tidus by the arm, pulls him to the front and says "And... he comes too". He then explains "This one I promised Jecht", meaning that he promised Jecht he would protect Tidus. There is also a second, albeit hidden, meaning to this relating to Auron and Jecht's secret plan to defeat Sin once and for all which involves Tidus playing a key part in this.
Whilst there is never any specific mention of Tidus becoming a guardian during this scene, it is the actual moment when he becomes Yuna's guardian. If you speak to Lulu after this scene has finished (just before the laugh scene), she says "You're a real guardian now, so no mistakes. Understood?". This confirms that Tidus became Yuna's guardian during the previous scene.
I cannot believe that I’m +9 hours deep into this and I’m dreading when it’s going to end.
I love the depth of analysis and dissecting the historical and religious references.
Hey guys! As you guys mentioned the Hypello playing Blitzball, just wanted to let you know that if you talk to Maechen before riding the Shoopuf and ask him about the Hypello he will say;
''You'd think they'd make admirable players of blitzball. But their lackadaisical disposition draws them to less strenuous pastimes.'' LOL!
Also thanks again for shouting out the Final Fantasy Union FFX Facts video a few episodes back. I am the main Video Editor and footage provider for that channel so it was cool to get a shout out :D
Keep up the amazing work! Looking forward to the next episode! :)
I played FF X when it first came out two decades ago. This podcast brings back so many good memories from that time. Thank you guys for this wonderful and extensive analysis!
Also, I would love to see you cover Chrono Cross or any of the other Final Fantasy games.
Auron feels guilty over what he perceives to be his failure to prevent Braska from dying when defeating Sin and Jecht giving his life to become the final aeon. At the end of Braska's pilgrimage, Auron wavered and wanted to defeat Sin for good but where no one would have to die doing so. Instead, he lost his 2 best friends to a meaningless process whilst Sin returned a year later. Auron became known as the "legendary guardian" but he secretly hates this praise of him as he believes himself to be a failure. He doesn't believe himself to be worthy of any recognition or praise.
Barthello is 24 during the events of the game so was only 14 when Braska defeated Sin. He grew up in awe of the "legendary guardian" and was inspired to become a guardian just like him so he could play his part in helping a summoner to defeat Sin. It's only natural that when he meets Auron for the first time he becomes a bit star struck at having met his hero, a man whom he greatly admires and respects. When he asks to shake Auron's hand it's both in part for helping Braska to defeat Sin and for inspiring him to follow the same path. Apart from a respectful chuckle in recognition of Barthello's dedication and loyalty towards his summoner, he doesn't say anything other than offer his hand after being asked to shake it. This is not because Auron dislikes Barthello or is dismissive of him. On the contrary, he honours his request and respects him. Auron's silence and demeanour stems from his feelings of failure so instead he allows Barthello to have the moment he deserves but without allowing it to drag on from longer than it should.
49:00 There it is. Thought about it in the last one, and you hit the nail on the head.
I love both interpretations of Jecht quitting drinking.
Spoilers for those who haven't completed the game about Luzzu and Gatta:
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After gaining control of the Fahrenheit airship, your party can return to Besaid and find either Luzzu or Gatta training a new group of Crusaders, ever vigilant in the face of Sin.
Also, depending on Tidus' decision during Operation Mi'ihen, Yuna's party will see either Luzzu or Gatta as one of the fallen Crusaders in The Nucleus area of Sin, depending on who survived and who died.
After Yuna's party defeats Sin, either Gatta or Luzzu joins the cheering Besaid villagers, depending on which one survived.
Eagerly waiting for the next episodes. Really enjoy this. The first episode inspired me to do another play through- of course I couldnt put it down and already blasted through it, but the story is so rich and never gets old. I love how everything has meaning in this game
Yessssss, something I found out the other day , when the party falls to the bottom of lske macalania, they are actually on sins back , look at the mini city on his back it’s the same buildings
I really enjoyed the discussion surrounding Wakka's understanding and views on the Al Bhed. I don't know how to describe it -- maybe oblivious racism? We've seen countless examples of him not knowing what an Al Bhed is. As much as he dislikes them, he can't tell you who they are, only what they're associated with (machina). And his outlook on them -- being heretics -- is driven by his religion. Take dogma (Yevon) out of the equation, and Wakka doesn't have those blinders. This becomes evident when he meets Rikku, as stated in the episode. He should know she's an Al Bhed, but doesn't because the one thing he's taught to hate -- the use of machina -- is not present when he meets her. Adding another layer to this, Wakka should be skeptical of Tidus when he first meets him. Blonde hair is a common feature with Al Bhed -- how many characters with blonde hair are not Al Bhed in the story? Tidus, an outsider, has blonde hair and his wardrobe is not far off from the distinctive colorful bodysuits we see Al Bhed people wear. But Wakka doesn't see that, and his introduction to Tidus is seeing this talented blitzball star kick a ball across Besaid. And why is this relevant? Because blitzball is Wakka's *other* religion, and you could argue he knows it better than the religion of Yevon.
It's not racism. Case closed. You Americans are kinda dumb regarding discrimination
My mind exploded when you guys briefly commented about the history that they've been told and the relationship to the theocracy. Even the shoopuf, and the crossing, like I find FFX is the best at being the most joe shmo adventure love story while being the most thoughtful and thematic final fantasy story ever.
Khimari's smile might also be a Terminator 2 reference.
These FFX analysis videos have seriously become the highlight of my week.
It's been a while since I've played through FFX, so I am having a hard time remembering. Up until this point of the game, has there been any Al Bhed that Wakka has been in contact with who can speak English (or whichever language you were playing in) instead of the Al Bhed language? If not, maybe that is another thing that makes him not realize Rikku is an Al Bhed...because she speaks in English. IDK, just something I thought about while listening. And also, has it already been revealed at that point that Yuna's mother is Al Bhed? Or did you guys just prematurely mention that? All of these questions are making me want to replay the game. Gotta go check if it's on sale now...
The ironic part about the parable about the sunken city brought to ruin by being built above a river is that Kilika is also built above the water out of like, wood. But no one seems to care because it's existence doesn't seem to be based around machina. There's also another thing ironic about this but it's late game spoilers.
the thing with tidus and jecht really feels like a different take of squall and his father.
squall never knew his father so when he sees flashbacks with laguna he just sees some idiot he keeps dreaming about.
tidus knew his father very well and is conflicted as others saw him differently then he did.
At one point square wanted to make a game based on auron, braska and jecht but they eventually made X-2 and I honestly would’ve loved to see how braskas journey would’ve been like. Love what you guys do, I keep one headphone in listening to these while I work and it makes the day faster
I always saw jecht quitting drinking showed his growth as a person during his time in spira. I didn't see the perspective you guys saw through tidus before. Interesting.
Oh wow I haven't been here in a while. Man the production value has gone way up! Great video!
I think Wakka’s obliviousness to Rikku being Al Bhed is another way they are trying to show just how forcibly Yevon keeps its followers in the dark. They hate things that they can’t even identify or explain.
They do a callback to Kimahri's smile and Tidus's reaction in the FF7 remake with Red XIII and Barrett too while they're in the highway chase
Im pretty sure the tree inside Sin is a Macalania tree. In fact that whole area iirc is full of landmarks from Spira implying that their Jechts memories of those areas. Also the dead people are there because Sin absorbs pyreflies. Tidus even remarks that Seymour was absorbed by Sin.
Just found you guys so I need to go back to watch the first 6 episodes.
Concerning Barthello meeting Auron, there is a supplemental novella(?) that goes into Auron’s thinking about his plan and goals. It states that he hates being recognized and honored because he feels like a failure as a guardian following Jecht and Braska dying.
X-2 spoiler:
The different locations have independent stories in that game and the Besaid story ends with the birth of Lulu and Wakka’s baby, Vidina. Al-Bhed for “future” and named by Wakka
Jecht became a better person because he did something selfless, by helping Braska and he saved Aurons life because if Auron were Braskas only guardian, he would become the final summon. Besides that Jecht went on this journey because defeating SIN gave his life new meaning. Jecht wasn't happy in Zanarkand at all
As for the conversation of when Tidus becomes a guardian before Djose, it was definitely at the end of Luca. Whenever Auron joins he shoves Tidus forward and says “he comes too” or something like that.
Enjoyed it fellas, can't wait for the next " fetching" video 👊👍
In regard to character dress its worth noting that all of the characters who wear less clothing grew up on tropical islands while Isaru is originally from the Northern city of Bevel. Even Yuna somewhat subscribes to this rule although your point about modesty still holds (although to a lesser extent than Seymour and Donna).
I like that we got some of the mike and casen origin story here today. 😆
I feel like, in the church aspect, when you bring a non-devout person in and vouch for them, and they too admit to now being part of that faith, it is usually enough unless they break some rules. Which Tidus was doing before he had Auron and (as Yuna says refers to the group at the third temple with Tidus there as: Her Guardians) Yuna's team vouch for him as an actual Guardian.
Wakka, I felt, couldn't believe Rikku was an Al Bhed because of the fact she saved Tidus's life. He couldn't associate, or allow himself to associate such a good act with the Al Bhed in his mind.
Also, it is so nice when Lulu's sharp tongue is directed at enemies instead of allies haha
Fully intended to just play through to keep up week to week, but managed to play through the game in 3 days lol. Beautiful wonderful game.
Just have to comment on this ep since you're loving the engagement. Honestly can't describe how much these episodes get me through my working week. Thanks so much both of you. Really enjoying the series.
I started playing this game again a month before discovering this channel. In the month since I have restarted my playthrough and have found a new appreciated for the game. I wish there were more podcasts in this format.
for the record i also read the jecht/shoopuf story the same way casen did. loving this series!
I've been waiting for your podcast for the whole week, thanks guys, greetings from Germany
57:00 Tidus challenging Wakka actually makes a ton of sense in a cultural sence. Wakka challenging the machina city is also a challenge to Zanarkand, which is a challenge to Tidus.
It would be like if you went over seas and you overheard someone bad mouthing something very common in your country. Even if it was something a little silly, you'd still want to defend it because it's part of your country, and they probably don't understand why it's important.
Hey great work as always! one thing you are correct Al Bhed genetic traits are blonde hair, green eyes, and the spiral pattern in the pupils (according to the FF ultimania archive volume 3 page 37)
I would totally subcribe to Patreon for a deep dive into the comments. As long as I scroll down, there's another cool thing to find.
It's really astounding to see all of the great ideas and connections that people find, and I think it really points to how loved this game is by it's fans. Every single time I hear anything about this game, it's something new that I've never heard of before, and I absolutely love that I'm not the only person that thinks this is an amazingly well crafted story, and deserves to be on more top 10 lists than it is in.
I also cannot wait for more on this Mandela. With all this symbolism you guys are pointing out, I am really feeling like I need to pick the game up again and play through with you guys.
i thought Tidus was a guardian at the end of Luca when Auron joined. after Auron joins the fellowship, he does say "this one comes too" meaning Tidus. it seems becoming a guardian is no more than asking if a person will and said person saying yes or no.
Yeah, and I think it's pretty easy to tell if someone's an interloper or not simply by whether the team vouches.
I don't think it's normal behavior for a Summoner to lie or be duplicitous considering their role and what they represent. Hits to their reputation could knock them off their pilgrimage in a heartbeat, so they'd be stupid to allow some random fanboy to ruin that
I think joining the guardians is more of a formality than anything.
Agreed. I think Donna tossing Tidus in was supposed to have maybe gotten Tidus hurt or something like that. As opposed to getting Yuna in trouble.
Yep I have a parent that drinks and they have told me the same exact line that they can "quit at any time". I said okay do it now and they said nope I don't want to. Definitely can relate because they are both the most loving person and hateful person towards me in my life, often at random times they switch in between. Its a brutal experience having to deal with it.
Also an NPC says the hypellos are great swimmers but don't have any interest in blitzball
what they were talking about with the Jecht scene and the Shoopuf and the beginning of Jecht's growth I love. I wish more of the game was a balance between Jecht's experience through Spira growing at the same time Tidus was experiencing it. Jecht continuing the cycle while Tidus works to break the cycle. We see some of this with the flashbacks of the Auron spheres but I think it could have been more intricately woven into the story the whole time. Like as Tidus discovers something then later you flashback and see Braska's party and what their interaction with that thing was like. And at the end of the game when they meet again it would be less of an "I hate you" "I know" but more of maybe an "I hated you but I've learned about what you've done and I'm glad you're doing better". anyway I did love that scene but that's my two cents on how I might have done things in hindsight.
Ffx-2 has its share of issues, but there is a bit more world building that helps with the understanding of FFX. Is it worth getting 100% on ffx-2 to get them? No, that's what UA-cam is for. But it does add the the narrative of FFX in subtle ways.
Just because of the time when this game came out, it’s hard to not draw parallels between the Al Bhed and the people of the Middle East. After 9/11, there was a lot of anti-Middle Eastern and anti-Muslim sentiment in the world. The world became afraid of this terroristic boogeyman that was operating in the shadows and could strike at any time. The reality, of course, is that we were generalizing, at the time, almost a billion people because of something they practiced that we didn’t even understand, all just because a series of corrupt, authoritarian leaders and cultural influencers that they were powerless to stop from rising to power lashed out against the US. There’s a lot more nuance to the situation than is warranted for this comment, but I couldn’t help but see this oddly-timed parallel. Especially considering the game came out in Japan several months prior to 9/11 anyway.
I always just assumed the sunken city was just a city that, due to some shit happening with Sin, was flooded and sunk. Sin clearly has enough destructive power to affect topography and if it's been sunken for a thousand years that sort if lines up with the first appearance of Sin.
Great podcast guys! Great approach on taking RPGs serious as a book club format.
Hello guys. I love your podcast of ffx, which is my favorite game. I have one theory about Dona, that I have only thought about after my 5th or 6th time playing the game (it can cointain one small SPOILER later in the mid-game for those who haven't played yet). You remember that we meet her the first time in the Kilika Temple a short time after the sending. Which means that when Sin came and destroid the village, she was there. And when Yuna had the sending ceremony, she was also there. The fact that the villagers came to Yuna and not her must have been too painful, especially knowing she is from Kilika. In her point of view, the villagers prefered to request the sending from this inexperienced summoner instead of the more experienced and local one, because Yuna is the High Summoner's daughter. I think this is why Dona always attacks Yuna for her status (seemingly for no reason). We could also argue that Dona was in the Temple praying to the Fayth and was not available at the moment. In this case, Dona just sees in Yuna the person to whom direct her frustrations for not having been available to do what she was trained and prepared for (since Sin can attack any place at any time), in the service of her fellow villagers who passed away, some of which may have been relatives. She feels betrayed by her own people, illustrated by the quote from the Bible "no prophet is accepted in his hometown" something that will also apply to Yuna later on. That is not to say that Dona is justified in doing what she does, but I think it brings more humanity and depth to this character, beyond the simple image of the "disrespectful rival". I really love the fact that even after many playthroughs, this game has still so much to offer if we are willing to search.
Just wanna say I have a podcast rotation for when I go out Doordashing and Wednesdays are the best.
Between Frame Trap, Into the Aether, and this I'm always looking forward to that day, thank you guys I've been enjoying this as well as catching up on previous ones.
Regarding the summoners and the blitz tournament: I actually don't think that the Al Bhed were ever even attempting to get them to forfeit the game at all, but that the party ASSUMED this is why they kidnapped Yuna, having no idea about their true intentions. I don't know if it's actually concretely implied that they provided a random note or whatever, or that they would have had time to do that. This also makes sense considering the Aurochs are the worst team in the league. It IS in fact weird that they would try and get them to throw the game, because that's not what they were doing in the slightest. But it's the only reason that the party could come up with for their behavior.
This does re-introduce the weirdness of the "not taking chances" comment but I think it makes a lot of sense that they would jump to the conclusion that the Psyches were willing to manipulate the game, based on their pre-conceived notions about those people.
Master Micah and Maechen also have that pyrefly symbol on their clothing.
I believe the reason Jecht quit drinking was not because he brought shame and humiliation to himself, but rather Braska. As Braska's Guardian, his actions reflect on his Summoner, and so him attacking the Shoopuff brought shame and humiliation to Braska, and at this point in the journey, his friend.
I've played this game twice and so much just went over my head
Hi! Thanks for this episode; it is as always a real treat!
Regarding the Al Bhed question (how much are they different from non-Al Bhed people) I recall seeing a video speaking partially about that. Based on the "Final Fantasy X-2.5: Price of Eternity" novel and lots of messages and symbols in the Iutycyr tower (from "Final Fantasy X-2: Last Mission"), it crafted a very interesting analysis linking Al Bheds to alchimy (we see you there Rikku!). I don't really know if it is ok for me to say more about this in this comment, fearing to spoil something for anybody, but it is also quite coherent with their way to see machinas and could add some depths to their relation with Yevon.
Loving the show! o/
Edit your comment saying spoilers in the comments and then please place the spoiler stuff inside your comment, that way people will know there is a spoiler inside your comments.
Interested to hear your thoughts
@@bennieboi20 Sure thing. o/
Well, I'll place the spoilers in this answer then, so it's cleanly separated from the first comment. Keep in mind it is a study done in a video from the Zelant channel; I did not do the researches myself. Also I hope my english will not be too bad!
The Iutycyr tower is the main building explored in "Final Fantasy X-2: Last Mission". According to the people who discovered the place before requesting the help of Yuna and her party, it is supposed to be even older than Zanarkand. We can find at its base what could be seen as residential quarters but the more we climb the tower the more it becomes technological (even monsters get replaced to a certain degree by machines), up to an hydra guardian and a broken mechanic device on its top.
The name given to the tower and the signs on the house at its bottom are linked to the Al Bhed language ("Iutycyr" means "Eidolon" in Al Bhed). Most of the signs are just merchant stuff, but one of them can be translated as Yadonoki >> Maboroshi >> Dream, Illusion, Ghost (which has a direct link with the Eidolon definition). In addition to this the tower has an additional name (which could be the original name before its re-discovery at the time of X-2?), which can be found in the Final Fantasy Art Museum Trading Cards: Abrasanym Tower (meaning "Ephemeral" in Al Bhed).
Now on another topic there is another lexical field linked to this tower: Ouroboros (the cycle of life and death, the idea of eternity):
- On the broken device at the top of the tower, the circle around the central floating sphere can be interpreted as a snake trying to get its tail;
- On the seal around the hydra guardian when its waking up, saying "Each death brings the promise of another life, each life brings the promise of another death, the circle remains uninterrupted."
In addition to that snakes are very present in the last stages of the tower (with the hydra, on the walls, through statues...).
Now, Ouroboros is about life and death but it also an important component of the Alchimy occult science. It "defines" the cycle through which matter goes when we try to transform it. In this cycle we can find three major steps linked to a colour each: Nigredo, Rubedo and Albedo. Albedo which in japanese has the orthograph of Al Bhed, linked to the colour white and opposed to the ebony colour behind Yevon.
Talking about Alchimy, we know it exists in Spira based on Rikku's Overdrive. There is also an Alchimist class in X-2.
This thema is reinforced by a big glyph (serving as a canvas in Alchimy for matter transformation operations) floating in around the tower when we climb it up to its last stages.
That's it for the lexical fields around the tower but remains the question of what all this structure's purpose is.
When the mechanism at the top of the tower finally gets working at the end of Last Mission, it creates a water-like double helix, the universal symbol of DNA and an element we usually link to the concept of life itself. Now there is a lot of principles and rules in Alchimy around the universe and matter themas, but kind of a golden rule comes when we speak about life: it is forbidden to create life through Alchimy. It could result in creating imperfect entities doomed to live painful existences, making this practice a sin. Entities created through Alchimy are called homunculus.
Taking then "Final Fantasy X-2.5: Price of Eternity". A little bit before the apparition of Sin, a scientist called Alb tried to find a solution to avoid to see more humans being killed by the Great War. Without having much details on it, it seems he's been able to create synthetic soldiers replacing humans on the battlefield. However, those soldiers were quite dense to spiritual energy and so were unable to use magic. In response to that they were more in charge of machine based equipments, becoming their specialty through the ages. As things evolved during the War, people who thought those synthetic soldiers were machines themselves discovered they were bleeding and even dying: behind their armors they were just flesh and bones like any other human. Artificial humans created in a laboratory by Alb. Those creations were called "Bedohl" at the time. We could imagine that after Sin striked and Yevon took advantage of the situation to spread its anti-machine politics, killing most of the Bedohls in the process, the "Alb" and "Bedohl" terms were merged into "Albedohl", then the previously defined "Albedo" leading to our "Al Bheds". Making Al Bheds homunculus from a type of occult science forgotten through ages.
This gives the whole social fight of Al Bheds a new colour, insisting on their DNA differences and the repercutions it had on the perception people (and organizations like Yevon) had on them. A tool trying to keep its expertise relevant regarding machines but also people trying to find their place in a world demonizing them under the Yevon reign. It also allows to see Last Mission a little differently: now that Yevon is no more at the top of the game and that people are ready to live together, society has now some time to gain knowledge on its history. People re-discover places, interrogate themselves and find up to the Iutycyr Tower, potentially Alb's laboratory.
It does not answer everything and it is possible that my traduction from Zelant's video (which is in french) made things a little unclear but I hope you had a good time reading those thoughts, and that it stimulated you to learn always more about this fantastic world! o/
Such a great breakdown of a classic FF game. Much appreciated!
My reading of how Donna's costume design reflects her inner character is that she's not a very complex, deep, or closed-off kind of person and I think her lack of clothes bears that out to the audience. They're shallow, vain, and often petty and they go through no effort to hide their disdain for their competition. And I think it makes sense that their costume design reflects this.
I want to get into how expertly FFX’s story mirrors and rhymes with itself but I do think that’s best saved for the finale. You really start to see a lot of it in this part of the game, as a lot of it has to do with the dichotomy of Tidus and Yuna’s stories.
I also feel Like Most of Spira has a limited drinking culture as well due to the religious presence. That could have helped Jecht cut back in general as where in Zanarkand it's just what alot of ppl do.
Side note: Yes Lulu is Pregnant with Wakka in X-2.
Auron's comment about Spira resisting change is a nice touch; outsiders think it's weird that the place doesn't change. But even if the people don't strive to make changes in their world, you'd think natural selective forces would create those changes anyway. The biggest thing is that, despite sea-borne attacks from Sin, people still mostly live on the coast. You'd think that would have been forcibly changed by Sin. Or even that the attacks would have gotten rid of cities entirely, and people would be nomadic! And it's odd to me that summoning has not gotten any better over time. It's the most important technology in their world--and one that doesn't bring down Sin's wrath, either! But it seems like there are very few summoners relative to how important they are. I don't remember that ever being explained.
I think that you missed a scene here. After the battle against Rikku's Machina, if you see her lying on the ground and Don't approach her, she will beret you for trying to leave her, shouting you while her face is down to the ground.
Enjoying the coverage, each week I love reliving this gem of a game.