Це відео не доступне.
Перепрошуємо.
The Pagan Side of American Christianity
Вставка
- Опубліковано 18 сер 2024
- In this clip from episode 564, Skye argues that much of American Christianity is actually Pagan, but masquerades as Christianity. At the heart of the Bible is an important message we can't forget - God doesn't need us, He wants us.
@HolyPost - THIS is why the question “what does God need with a space ship” is the second best line in any Star Trek movie EVER.
You are teaching my lesson. I did not call it paganism, but taught it was erroneous thinking. I have said the church is superstitious. THE Church needs to be set free from "every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness..."
That concept of God needing us is especially evident in thr Religious Right Domionist mindset that we are building the Kingdom for Christ. What arrogance. This is the error behind the Word of Faith heresy, and positive declarations and decrees to obtain what we desire. Some churches are teaching their congregants how to hear the voice of God by sitting, doing deep breathing, centering, imagining a favorite setting, visualize Jesus, and what is He saying to you? I don't imagine He's saying anything corrective. Another man who is popular in this circuit teaches people to just sit with paper and pen, imagine Jesus, and write what you hear. That's God's voice. What could possibly go wrong? I was invited to a woman's house who shared the video of this man's presentation, and when I suggested that this felt like a way of conjuring Christ,as if we could call Him up at will, elicited a fury towards me. Obviously I left. This is old occultism. When I pointed this out, I was told by a pastor's wife, No, the New Agers stole it from. The church. We are taking it back for God. The level of deception is astonishing. Jesus is a genie in a bottle that we can market and sell. So yes, idolatry and paganism are what the people want. It puts them in control, like their rituals, or positive confessions force God's hand. This stuff is rampant.
All the Christian networks do this. All of mainstream popular modern day Christianity is corrupted then. Millions upon untold mIllions are fooling themselves daily into thinking god approves of what they do and say. A pity we are in for such a rude awakening. Heaven has an echo.
Another prominent and un-Christian thought process I see is thinking the work one does for God can make up for sins of lust, anger and/or pride. Any excuses for bad behavior that center on how much someone has done (or is trying to do) for God or a Christian organization is VERY antithetical to what the Bible says. It is probably due to people thinking God needs us, needs us enough to overlook sinful patterns. He doesn't. I think of how God punished David for his sin with Bathsheba and Uriah. There is probably no one currently living that has done more for God, considering the historical context, than David did. Few give more signs of real devotion to God (so many psalms!). Still, God pointed out and punished his sin. To think a man can accomplish enough that it is worth overlooking serious sin is not Biblical.
I find it interesting that his concept of paganism paints with such a broad brush and lack of both nuance and of being fully informed on the subject. His implication is "anything that isn't my view of Christianity is pagan."
Paganism is "such a broad" term. It literally encompasses everything that falls outside of the big 4 ( arguably, 2 or even 1, depending on what century you define it and who you ask)...And I think his use of it, in this statement, is fair.
No pagans were harmed in the filming of this clip.
Justin, Duh! These modern mainstream Christian writers have zero talent and tact these days.
Which denomination ? because there is over 1,000 different denominations and they all have different traditions. And, they all say they are Christians.
All have come short. The Bible even says most who believe, believe in vain. Most are not saved at all. A lot of christians everyday when they die wonder why they woke up in the wrong place. Matt 7:21-23.
There are not anywhere near “1,000 different Christian denominations”.
@@patrickc3419 Lol, You'd be very surprised.
Try almost 40,000 denominations.
still processing this and will re-watch, but it's true, we have to remind ourselves that there's a difference between praying to Jesus as opposed to ritual like thinking. You have to let God do the heavy lifting. You offer up your burden to the Lord, but that's about it. When God answers your prayers, His reply to you is wholistic and covers all the bases. Grace is all inclusive. Stay humble, open your heart to God's blessing. But mostly, you have to accept that everyone in the situation will benefit from your prayers- not just you and your friends - but even your enemies will be blessed through your prayers. We are ALL washed in God's mercy through prayer and there is no place for hatred and vengeance in any of that. That's the difficult message. You have to love everyone.
Sorry, misspelled "Dominionist."
I've never heard anyone say "putting the 10 Commandments in classrooms will end school shootings." I have heard them say that school shootings are a downstream effect of an increasingly nihilistic culture and Christianity provides a remedy to that. Maybe their policy prescription is wrong, but that's a shameful strawman.
When someone says that they ought to bring back prayer in schools, I say that I went to a non-praying (public) and a praying school (Catholic) and I did not notice any difference in how I was treated. I was bullied and teased in both. And in both, nobody ever stepped up to defend me. On the contrary, I was the one who was punished. Now the public school, maybe those kids didn't know any better because religion had been taken out of it, but what was the excuse for the Catholic school, where we went to Mass EVERY DAY? It left me with a bad taste in my mouth regarding religion.
If one TRULY cares about their religion, they will oppose efforts to force it on others. All forcing kids to say prayers or read the Bible or go to church does is to teach them how to jump through hoops. And if that is all that religion is supposed to do--provide an avenue of social control, as many nonbelievers and even some believers claim--then yes, go for it. It's just another empty ritual that society uses as a unifying force. It doesn't matter if it is literally true or not. Arguing over whether kids should be taught creationism versus evolution is a waste of time (it is anyway, it is not generally something that is going to make you more or less employable, employers don't care). Just go with the flow.
Now, if religion is only a framework for socialization, then yes I can see where not having it can lead to societal breakdown--but again, I go back to my experience with the two school systems. When all is said and done there really wasn't much difference in how those who were socially awkward were treated--which, if the proponents of school prayer are to believe, shouldn't have been the case! There should have been a MARKED difference. But there wasn't and isn't. I think the question we ought to be asking ourselves is why did Christianity start declining all across the board? It wasn't because of a Supreme Court decision almost 70 years ago.
Yup, you're right. 10 Commandments are not an amulet, they are the obligatory rule book.
I think this is well said, and puts an interesting spin on the old counter-question of "If God is so powerful and loves us so much, why did he let BAD THING happen [for so long]?" I think the implication, assuming the above is accurate, is that BAD THING was always going to be won through the power of God, but he didn't NEED The Chosen One TM to show up and do it. He used what was there, when appropriate in His eyes. Possibly clunkily said, but I think it has significant implications for apologism.
Also if you say the right words something good will happen or conversely, if you say the wrong words, something bad will happen.
yeah like God needs to bless us finacially so we can give it for minstry
Growing up evangelical made my transition to paganism not only easy, but worth it.
There are many who really don't believe the Cross is powerful. If they did, they would not say what they say, believe what they do, or do what they do.
The second point, about humans existing to serve the gods, I'd agree that's a pagan thing. But the first one is just magical thinking, and saying that that's a pagan thing isn't correct, I don't think. That sort of stuff pops up in every religion. It's usually not official doctrine, but the second the priests or rabbis or monks aren't looking, folk magical beliefs and practices tend to crop up. Assigning it to just one cluster of faiths (and calling it stupid) is wishful thinking ... and a bit disrespectful, frankly.
Be highly suspicious of anyone who's says "unpack" in this context
Skye shouldnt really xall that Christianity pagan, but it makes sense if taken as he is speaking to concervative Christians. Its really just idolatry. Holding up idols in place of God.
I understand what you are saying about putting up a thing and expect a blessing, I get it.
But putting verses in your house and elsewhere,.is scriptural
Coming Soon from SKYE Jethani: What if God Ain't Dumb?
YES PLEASE! I would buy 10 of those!
I doubt modern pagans would agree with your assessment. I know some Pagans. They're not that hard to find.
No, not at all. Very easy. Paganism (Wicca, pantheistic religions, etc) are actually the fastest growing religions in America. Very wicked, spiritually lost souls who need Christ and who need grace.
He is not talking about modern paganism. He is talking about the Greco-Roman religion and the polytheistic religions of the people in the Levant that were actively practiced during Biblical times.
Skye for the win! He is absolutely right!! Mic drop! ❤
How many pagan holidays or pagan traditions do most churches not all but most follow , why would anyone think that an Eminet being that spoke the world into existence needs anything from us ? I don't know, I believe people just don't spend enough time studying the Bible and don't know what it says, they read it but don't absorb it, so they don't know if the sermon there being taught is good or bad , the Bible instructs me as the congregation to use my Bible to hold the preacher and church accountable if I don't study ask God for discernment I've not done my part , a hard look needs to be taken at the institutions that are giving these young men there education have the Christian Universities , become like any other, college and just not very good anymore ?
1:10-1:30 What the heck? The his guy does not know his Bible. “Go ye therefore into all nations baptizing them in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. And lo, I am with you always. Even to the end of the age.” “And we know that in all things God works for the good of those who love him, who have been called according to his purpose. For those God foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brothers and sisters. And those he predestined, he also called; those he called, he also justified; those he justified, he also glorified.”
I recommend reading God: An Anatomy by Francesca Stavrakopoulou.
In a like vein, it sometimes seems to me as if (some? most?) Christians worship the Bible in place of God. They ignore how the Holy Spirit might move a fellow Christian while judging that person's behavior against an understanding of what "... the Bible says". Paganism? Perhaps, but it clearly borders on idolatry.
What about putting lambs’ blood on the door way? Wasn’t that a type of totem?
You're so on point.
Blows my mind that Christians do not comprehend every Christian holiday has a pagan basis. We don't celebrate Christmas when Jesus was actually born we celebrate a pagan holiday Saturnalia, the pagan Roman winter solstice festival, as we now know Jesus was born in the spring not winter so why do Christians still celebrate Christmas on a pagan holiday instead of the spring? Easter...pagan holiday celebrating Astarte or Oestre the pagan fertility goddess and where the whole easter egg (fertility-egg) thing came from.
Our Christian version of Christmas and Easter were originally tied to these pagan festivals to help the pagans who celebrated them see there was something bigger than their pagan gods -- so celebrating the Light of the World coming into the world at the darkest time of year made sense. As did celebrating the Resurrection during the time of year that means rebirth (and there the timing is based on Passover, so it's not off, it's just that the early Christians in some places used the opportunity of the pagan ceremonies to introduce the Light and the Life to the pagans).
As a Christ-follower, I don't celebrate Saturnalia. I do have a Christmas tree and decorations, but that's just because it has become our tradition, it's not in celebration of anything pagan. Same with Easter. I let my kid hunt Easter eggs when he was little because it was fun, not because we were worshipping any pagan fertility goddesses. God knows our hearts. I think there's a far worse danger in celebrating consumerism at Christmas than in putting up a decorated tree in your house. Again -- God knows our hearts. He knows we are celebrating Him, not any pagan gods or goddesses. Now, if I were to start going to a pagan shrine at those times of year and leaving sacrifices or saying prayers to pagan deities or whatever, yes, that would be very problematic. But if I can place my focus and that of my family's on Jesus, then I don't see the problem. The non-Christian world doesn't care, anyway. They're much more interested in how we're being divisive about the things that don't matter in the long run. "Matters of dispute" Paul called them, and he said not to focus on them.
Sounds like a good book if you ever get around to writing it. Jesus said He made the Sabbath for humanity, not humans for the Sabbath.
A lot of that pagan thinking also influences atheists (especially those who left Christianity) and their thinking about religion in general and Christians. Hence a lot of their strawman arguments and their reification of science and scientists. It seems a lot of our discourse today are two types of “pagans” arguing with each other about which amulets to put up. (None of which are actual Neo-Pagans, of course.)
I wonder if God does choose to use us because he choose to share. When I see a pretty flower my friend overlooks I Choose to share the experience with them. I don't need to. I believe in the OT a man (Balaam?) is asked to deliver a message for God and there is some relational conflict. God responds by allowing a donkey to speak. God doesn't NEED us to complete his work. He could just as easily use a donkey. I am thinking, maybe wrongly, he shares and maybe we will humbly worship him for it. Is it pagan to share with your infant child the wonder in the world? I hope not. Wonder would still exist had you no child at all.
@HolyPost Animism is in every religion. Even Christianity. If you believe God is in all things and people, if the power of Christ is in the cross around your neck, that's Animism. So, not necessarily pagan.
Paganism doesn't view that we were put here to serve the gods. That is false. Sorry. So, you start off misrepresenting paganism right off the bat. Not good.
Human sacrifices is paganism virgin births Are pagan God is not a man God is not even immortal Christianity messed with the Original Scriptures added and subtracted😮
How about ISLAM 😅
No one is saying that putting the ten commandments up in schools is magically going to solve all these problems like some magic totem. What people mean is that teaching people about God, the bible, and christian values In schools instead of outright banning God and the Bible in schools would make a positive impact on society. I think you probably understand that. You're misrepresenting what people mean when they say we should put the 10 commandments in schools.
I’m having a hard time thinking that this is a sound doctrine. I mean, God used Moses to complete a mission to take them away from Ramases. How in the world is this being a pagan? We are called by God to do His work.
You might have missed the very nuanced point that yes, God can CALL us to do something, to include us in His work, but He doesn't NEED us to do it. If God wants to reach Muslims for Christ, He can do it using visions and dreams (which is actually happening). But He wants us to have the joy of working alongside Him in His work, so He calls some people to go into the Muslim world to minister to those people to point them to Him. He doesn't NEED us to do the work, He's all-powerful, all-creative, etc., But He wants to include us because it blesses us, and it gives other humans a human connection.
What kind of a hot take is this? This is just as ridiculous as saying I oppose people who advocate removing the 10 commandments and prayer from schools because they believe religion causes violence and school shootings. I agree with the conclusion, but your argument can be made better without the straw man.
It's not "just as ridiculous as..." anything. It's not the other side of the argument, it's an entirely *different* argument.
God's not going to overlook something just because a room put a sign up? What's your take on the PASSOVER? I'm not saying putting the 10 Commandments in classrooms will have that effect, but I've also never heard anyone claim that it will. This man strikes me as both Biblically and culturally illiterate.
That was a specific command of God's for a very specific purpose, and it was also before Christ's sacrifice on the cross. Getting superstitions about items magically causing God to act in the way we want him to is pagan and wrong.
“How stupid do you think God is” sounds so patronizing for a book title. No wonder the younger generation is running away from church in groves. Why is it these modern Christian writers sound so plastic these days?
This guy goes too far! So, saying that Jesus needs us to evangelize the world is paganism? That is BS, and the guy who said that sounds like the pagan. Ridiculous! He is cherry picking his verses to show that God doesn't need us. He has chosen just one way to reach the world and that is through people. We are people, so in that sense God does need us. Otherwise, let's all eat, drink and be merry, and do our own thing, because God doesn't need us. We are called to serve Christ and live for Him, there is nothing clearer in the NT and this guy doesn't know what he is talking about. I know God doesn't need us to exist and flourish, but He does need us to win people to Himself. He called his disciples to do just that, which is very clear. Matthew 28:18-20, Then Jesus came to them and said, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. 19 Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.”
Rolling around "Easter eggs" is from paganistic roots for sure.
Religion is for fearful people that can't accept life's eternal mysteries. Embrace the unknown. Read Richard Dawkins the God delusion. The truth will set you free.