Great interview, fantastic to listen to one of THE experts, thanks for sharing Keston and yes I must also add I completely concur about the grading system.
Loved this video! Gary is brilliant and nailed this topic. I would love to hear much more from Gary on all things comics. BTW, I just hit my 50th anniversary of my first ever comic book purchase.
Kenny! Good to hear from you my friend. I've got at least a couple more Gary videos coming out in the next couple weeks. Interesting stories and advice, of course. Congrats on the 50th anniversary of your first purchase. What is/was the book?
Two thoughts about Gary’s point about Marvel cover stock and Marvel chipping, which comes up around the 5:50 mark… The cover stock used for some of the early ‘50s EC comics was ridiculously thin, so much that covers will gradually split from ordinary reading today. Also, I think it’s worth considering that there may have been variations in the quality of one batch of materials to the next, and it’s possible that comic book publishers occasionally issued books that were somehow a bit different from the norm, in terms of materials. Example: I have a 1962 issue of Millie the Model that has weird gray staples. They look completely untouched by rust and appear to be original. What’s that about? Some kind of company experiment that didn’t pan out? Maybe the bindery folks ran out of regular staples and used something different? Does every copy of this issue have the strange gray staples? I have no answers.
Funny, now that you mention it, I recall the same weird staples when rereading some silver age, don't recall which issues, but certainly remember thinking something was on these staples, but not rusty.
Great question, Tom. I think your general assumption is a good one. As Gary was relaying to me, these early producers of comics did everything on the cheap. Quality control was not a high priority. It wouldn't surprise me if they changed some materials midway through a print run.
@@kestonsoldschoolcomicbooks6842- inferior quality metals, added to whatever the manufacturer normally would use, also the supplier may have switched manufacturers temporarily. who knows, when it comes to the publishers back then. It was like Gotham, without "The Bats." - in some regards.
Hi, Tom. I thought I had responded to your comment but it looks like it was lost. Interesting comment. I hadn't heard about the gray-staple issue but that doesn't surprise me. In another bit, Gary says that the single answer to most comic book history questions is money. If publishers could save a fraction of the penny they would, and it doesn't sound like those gray staples were premium...haha!
I was involved in a fan organization with Gary called the AACC at the time that CGC was first approaching dealers and collectors and at the time our group which included other people like Jon Berk, Micheal Naiman and so many others were very critical of 3rd party grading. Some of the AACC guys were the graders for the Sotheby's auction before cgc was in exsistence, Gary asked me if I wanted to be a grading alternate and of course I jumped at the chance but never got the oppurtunity. CGC and Steve Borok who was presenting the idea to dealers hated to hear the AACC were in the building because we (mostly) were so against the idea, especially the 10 point grading system that was based on a system that Metropolis comics had developed. It was a very interesting time to be involved in the hobby and I have never enjoyed it as much as I did in those days. Thanks Gary-Shawn Hamilton
Thanks for the story, Robert. I think many collectors these days have no idea of a world before CGC and the 10-point grading system. It must have been amazing to be part of an evolving hobby.
Fantastic interview. Gary's ideas about researching everything associated with the production of comics by the different publishers would be an amazing thesis for someone in grad school. Alas, for me, that ship sailed a long time ago. A big take-away from this video for new collectors (and more seasoned ones) is buy what appeals to you. I am still slowly understanding grading after getting back into collecting after a 30 year hiatus and one thing I have not budged on, despite something being labeled as a high grade (i.e. NM- , etc..), are spine ticks. They visually just don't appeal to me. Of course, the older the books get, I have been a bit more lenient but in the end, eye appeal is important. Just like Gary's Superman example. Looking forward to the next video Keston. Thanks!
Thanks Fenimore for the excellent comment. You're a clean spine guy, I see. Comic book grades moderately correlate with what I find appealing in a comic book. I'm on a personal quest to refine my own sense of eye appeal. Agree that Gary's Superman example is superb.
Would love to see more interviews with Gary. I was fortunate enough to find some issues of Comic Book Marketplace and they're great to read for the historical insights in comic book collecting.
Thanks for the kind comment, Steve, and I appreciate your subscribing to the channel! Ben and i will host more interviews in the near future with more movers and shakers in the hobby. And, I'm hoping we can get Gary back some day too. In the meantime, I was able to make a couple other Gary videos from the most recent interview. The next one is coming out tomorrow.
If it wasn't for Gary (and many others) our great hobby would be much worse off! His passion for comics and all the aspects of Fandom help shape so many of us. I really miss the CBM!!!! I could write all day about what he has done for the hobby and, especially, me! Thanks for a fantastic interview!!!!! 👍❣
Thanks, Steve. It was a pleasure hosting Gary. He had Ben and me laughing the entire interview. Would love to have you on the show, btw, to hear your old school stories.
Keston's new subscriber, this was excellent, my friend. Thank you so much. Kinda my feelings as well, out of control on a lot of variables with this hobby. ( The G Man Totely approves 😉👊) But like me and to the rest of the Kings & Queens out ther always searching for the best in our hobby, The Quest never Ends.....👊
Great interview and discussion. He raises a lot of the same concerns I have with current comic book grading. My stance on not buying graded books makes more and more sense every day.
This is why I never feared buying color touch on rather expensive books. It saves a ton of money and the book has about the exact desirability for most people especially for me.
Hi Hofftimus. I hear you. Some people can't stand any amount of restoration, but I'm with you. I own a grail that would have been out of reach otherwise.
Great insight. For me it is eye appeal. I want the main image to be clear, clean and devoid of defects. I can forgive edges, spines and interior damage - as long as stories are intact. I like low grades with honest wear as readers…but I will admit, that I do like my favourite covers high grade.
Good to hear from you, Murray! Happy to hear you have been working out what good "eye appeal" means to you. That's critically important. Thanks for sharing the details.
I think most of us remember our first book bought off the comic stands. The one I cherish the most was Amazing Spider-man 39 (a great cover!). Along with that great book there was a Daredevil 18 and a Tales of Suspense 89. It was 1966. Can't wait to see what Gary's first book was. Looks like a Showcase 4 (or was that click bait?).
New subscriber - Highly interesting, insightful, informative - and entertaining. Much appreciated - some of the best comic content in a long time. Thank you - if Gary is selling as you mentioned please share the appropriate link/appreciate it.
Hi, JSS! Glad to have you on board. Yeah, Gary is all those things. I don't think he sells much anymore at least not at public forums. If I talk with him again I'll ask though.
I need to hear Gary's thoughts on combo grades. Such an interesting topic. Should a vg/fn that looks better than a VG but worse than a FN be considered VG? Curious his perspective.
Well combo grades do seem strange to someone who came from the good fine mint era of comic grades Seems like grading standards have fallen when it comes to "good" comics over time Great insights and always loved his Marketplace articles That was a fine magazine
Thanks, Chet. I agree. Good point about the grading system. Myself included, I think many of us are most comfortable in the system we grew up with. CBM! Definitely, I hope this video sparks some new interest in the publication.
there's flippers defects. not from the resale of comics, but from the customers who flip through your boxes, with their toes. if you know, you know. never open a shop in Bedrock.
Awesome interview! Here is my question. With the lack of good writing these days and selling books pretty much off of variant covers only, how much longer can the hobby as we know it survive? Disney really messed up Marvel.
Great interview. There are a number of items that make grade numbering less than useful. Dust shadows and faded covers result in little to no change in a book grade but make a book look like a lesser grade. Page quality - brittle books should not be graded above a 1.8, while slightly brittle books should be less than 3.0. Of course ungraded books that are described by sellers as, let us say, a Very Good book but has a 5” spine split. Consider any additional description as a qualified book, look up associated grading and lower the actual grade to a 1.5. The veteran collecting community knows to do this, but the new collectors may not and will be turned off by the less than honest sellers.
Hi, Alex. I appreciate your thoughts. You bring up some of the trickiest grading issues imho. What is the highest grade you can get for slightly brittle or brittle pages. At what point to you provide a qualified label as opposed to the blue label? Does it even make sense to provide a qualified label. And, as Gary alluded to, should grading standards be applied differently depending on the age/printing process/binding of a book? And, as you mention, how the hell do you factor in these variables to price?
I agree with Gary on grading it is very subjective especially on mid grade books. I’m 7 years younger than Gary and started buying comics at 8 years of age. I did get comics when I was younger from my older brother after he and his friends were done with them. Back then it seemed every kid read comics but very few collected them. A big variable for me is color strike. Leaving fading out, some comics have brighter and deeper colors than others. Action 252 for example the shades of blue of Superman and Supergirl’s costumes goes from a dull almost grayish blue to a deep bright blue. How much of that is fading or color strike? I’ve also noticed that many of the silver age pence Marvels have deeper brighter colors than the American issues.
Hi Ken, Thanks so much for sharing your story. What a great age to enjoy comic books. Agree with you regarding color strike. I'll likely interview Matt Nelson again in a few months. I'll ask him how to distinguish between bad color strike and fading.
Hi Onion. Funny enough I had never heard of Amalgam Comics before. B/C of your post I checked it out. Cool concept of merging Marvel and D.C. heroes! Good luck finding the comics you are searching for.
How about adding a display grade? A grade of how the book looks just as a display piece - which it is in a slab. I bet CGC would add a small fee to add that.
Hi GX. Similar to that concept, I know a couple of companies that provide a sticker that conveys good eye appeal for the grade. Thanks for the comment.
Misfolded books annoy me. I see tons of New Mutants #98 graded by CGC as 9.8 that you can see the back cover on the front or vice-versa. They say it is fine because manufacturing issue. To hell with that i say, that is not a 9.8 to me. On the other hand is foxxing does not bother me that much, but CGC will drastically lower a grade for it.
Hi, James. Thanks for the comment and sharing your perspective on eye appeal. I'm more of a golden age guy so I can't be too picky about the misfolds b/c they are so common. Some of the books I have are also badly miscut! Quality control was so poor back in the day. One thing that I have learned is NEVER buy a book that bugs you. Whatever that defect is, it will be the first thing you see every time you look at the book.
Best example is Marvel Chipping or who used color and paper stock. Best example was poor paper stock by MJL. Mr.Gaines had contact with paper stock.DC bought out All American due to paper stock. As I tell people buy what You like not what is hot.
His position is no one can grade anything because they don't know the provenance of the paper sources. While I will say slabbing a comic is the antithesis of the hobby, I can follow a bouncing ball on how it's graded. And I get why it caught on. He had several ideas that he needed to justify.
Hi, Chris. After talking with him a little more, I didn't take away that he was completely anti-grading (he co-wrote one of the first grading guides) but rather he believes it is impossible to extract all subjectivity out of the process. Your points are well taken. Thank you.
These are all fantastic points. But unfortunately, anyone who is going to encapsulate their books and essentially turn them into pieces of furniture, aren’t going to care about any of it.
Hi, Ron. Thanks for sharing your thoughts. The furniture comment is funny. I will say that I do have quite a few slabbed books and do care about Gary's comments!
Hi 6thface. I guess what I'm getting it is what does it look like for comic grading to be completely objective. Would it be that six expert graders could independently arrive at the same grade for all books they graded? I don't thin that will ever be the case. Further, there is subjectivity in making up the grading rules. On the other hand, complete subjectivity would be the case where each individual person's perception of what grades mean is so different that no standards could ever be developed. And/or if there were standards, that people's interpretation of standards would be so different that grades would be meaningless. I'm of the opinion that the current grading standards are reasonable -- albeit not exactly how I would do it -- and that professional graders can be reasonably consistent. However, there is certainly some subjectivity / inconsistency in the process. The objective/subjective debate is an interesting one to me.
@@kestonsoldschoolcomicbooks6842 In my experience, people who claim grading is subjective like to charge too much for the books they have. Also, give me a break about that 6 different pro graders produce 6 different grades garbage. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.
@@6thface Cool. Thanks for responding. The point I was trying to make is there is some gray area between being objective and subjective. It sounds like you have some strong opinions on the topic. I'd love to hear your thoughts. Perhaps you can make a video on the topic. Best, -Keston
This is one of the worst opinions on comic book collecting I’ve ever seen. It’s rooted in no fact. And I don’t care how old the guy is, it doesn’t give him credibility. They were grading stamps and coins before he was born with the exact same grading system. And as someone who’s graded over 7-8k books, the grading is accurate and thorough the LARGE majority of the time. And books don’t get damaged. This is more nonsense pushed about the grading system by people that don’t grade books or understand how to use the grading system. It’s become a ridiculous narrative to keep alive in the comic book community. The ten point grading system is literally the VG/VF/NM grading system just broken down to be more detailed.
Hi, Voodoo. Thanks for your opinion. And, for the most part, I agree with you that most grading by experts is reasonably good. Check out my other videos and you can see the number of slabbed books I have (mostly CGC). While I disagree with some of Gary's opinion's myself, I enjoy hearing his perspective. Credibility? To me, a guy who amassed one of the most complete DC collections in the world, co-wrote the first Overstreet Grading book with Bob Overstreet, and served as the editor for Comic MarketPlace...gets my attention and respect.
He is obviously correct about all the facts, but I don't know how he doesn't come to the conclusion that therefore professional grading is a scam and we should not buy into it!
![CGC and Comic Book Rarity [Featuring Matt Nelson]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/DdLPgcPTR0Y/mqdefault.jpg)
![CGC and Comic Book Rarity [Featuring Matt Nelson]](/img/tr.png)
This is one of the most interesting comic discussions I've seen in a while.
Thanks, Jeremy. I was ecstatic to get the interview with Gary. More coming soon.
same here.
Loved having The Great Gary Carter on the interview! Thanks Gary and Keston for the fun times.
Thanks, Ben! Awesome to have you and Gary on the show!
Thanks for sharing this with us! So great to hear from Gary perspective.
Thanks, Dan. He's certainly got strong, well-informed opinions!
Great interview, fantastic to listen to one of THE experts, thanks for sharing Keston and yes I must also add I completely concur about the grading system.
Thanks, Cap! Yeah, I always enjoy hearing well thought-out opinions.
Coming from an OG of comic collecting this is worth its weight in gold. Everyone should take this to heart and head his advice.
Thanks, Lee. Definitely a rich video. I loved the in-the-trenches stories!
agreed my freind 👊
Loved this video! Gary is brilliant and nailed this topic. I would love to hear much more from Gary on all things comics. BTW, I just hit my 50th anniversary of my first ever comic book purchase.
Kenny! Good to hear from you my friend. I've got at least a couple more Gary videos coming out in the next couple weeks. Interesting stories and advice, of course. Congrats on the 50th anniversary of your first purchase. What is/was the book?
@@kestonsoldschoolcomicbooks6842 I’ll give you a hint: it’s a key that was released in the summer of’74.
@@kenny_numbers hmmm....Dr. Strange 1?
@@kestonsoldschoolcomicbooks6842 Bigger than that.
@@kenny_numbers Hi, Kenny...I recall your having a Hulk 181. Did that actually hit the newsstands in the late summer?
Always bringing us top notch content! Thanks Keston for organizing this. Very cool interview!
Thanks, Drew! It was fun to have Gary on the show.
Brilliant. Kudos to Gary for sharing his knowledge.
Thants, Brett! BTW: Is your avatar Sandman? Love that character!
Two thoughts about Gary’s point about Marvel cover stock and Marvel chipping, which comes up around the 5:50 mark…
The cover stock used for some of the early ‘50s EC comics was ridiculously thin, so much that covers will gradually split from ordinary reading today.
Also, I think it’s worth considering that there may have been variations in the quality of one batch of materials to the next, and it’s possible that comic book publishers occasionally issued books that were somehow a bit different from the norm, in terms of materials. Example: I have a 1962 issue of Millie the Model that has weird gray staples. They look completely untouched by rust and appear to be original. What’s that about? Some kind of company experiment that didn’t pan out? Maybe the bindery folks ran out of regular staples and used something different? Does every copy of this issue have the strange gray staples? I have no answers.
Funny, now that you mention it, I recall the same weird staples when rereading some silver age, don't recall which issues, but certainly remember thinking something was on these staples, but not rusty.
Great question, Tom. I think your general assumption is a good one. As Gary was relaying to me, these early producers of comics did everything on the cheap. Quality control was not a high priority. It wouldn't surprise me if they changed some materials midway through a print run.
@@kestonsoldschoolcomicbooks6842- inferior quality metals, added to whatever the manufacturer normally would use, also the supplier may have switched manufacturers temporarily. who knows, when it comes to the publishers back then. It was like Gotham, without "The Bats." - in some regards.
Hi, Tom. I thought I had responded to your comment but it looks like it was lost. Interesting comment. I hadn't heard about the gray-staple issue but that doesn't surprise me. In another bit, Gary says that the single answer to most comic book history questions is money. If publishers could save a fraction of the penny they would, and it doesn't sound like those gray staples were premium...haha!
Fantastic insight on the rise of comic book collecting.
Thanks, TJ! Nice to see you on the channel.
Gary is fantastic. I could listen to him for hours.
You and me both! Thanks for stopping by, RCBC.
I was involved in a fan organization with Gary called the AACC at the time that CGC was first approaching dealers and collectors and at the time our group which included other people like Jon Berk, Micheal Naiman and so many others were very critical of 3rd party grading. Some of the AACC guys were the graders for the Sotheby's auction before cgc was in exsistence, Gary asked me if I wanted to be a grading alternate and of course I jumped at the chance but never got the oppurtunity. CGC and Steve Borok who was presenting the idea to dealers hated to hear the AACC were in the building because we (mostly) were so against the idea, especially the 10 point grading system that was based on a system that Metropolis comics had developed. It was a very interesting time to be involved in the hobby and I have never enjoyed it as much as I did in those days. Thanks Gary-Shawn Hamilton
Thanks for the story, Robert. I think many collectors these days have no idea of a world before CGC and the 10-point grading system. It must have been amazing to be part of an evolving hobby.
Phenomenal video, very interesting thoughts and compelling discussion. We need more from Gary
Hi Back in the Game! Thanks for the comment. I’m posting a new Gary video, tomorrow.
Great video, thanks you to all involved.
Thanks, Bobo for the comment and the kind words!
Fantastic interview. Gary's ideas about researching everything associated with the production of comics by the different publishers would be an amazing thesis for someone in grad school. Alas, for me, that ship sailed a long time ago. A big take-away from this video for new collectors (and more seasoned ones) is buy what appeals to you. I am still slowly understanding grading after getting back into collecting after a 30 year hiatus and one thing I have not budged on, despite something being labeled as a high grade (i.e. NM- , etc..), are spine ticks. They visually just don't appeal to me. Of course, the older the books get, I have been a bit more lenient but in the end, eye appeal is important. Just like Gary's Superman example.
Looking forward to the next video Keston. Thanks!
Thanks Fenimore for the excellent comment. You're a clean spine guy, I see. Comic book grades moderately correlate with what I find appealing in a comic book. I'm on a personal quest to refine my own sense of eye appeal. Agree that Gary's Superman example is superb.
Would love to see more interviews with Gary. I was fortunate enough to find some issues of Comic Book Marketplace and they're great to read for the historical insights in comic book collecting.
Thanks, Raph. Definitely. Glad this video is bringing attention to this excellent resource!
It’s great to see and hear from the older generation (Gary) and also the newer generation (Ben). More please (subscribed)!
Thanks for the kind comment, Steve, and I appreciate your subscribing to the channel! Ben and i will host more interviews in the near future with more movers and shakers in the hobby. And, I'm hoping we can get Gary back some day too. In the meantime, I was able to make a couple other Gary videos from the most recent interview. The next one is coming out tomorrow.
Absolutely great interview
Thank you ,CB 62. Gary was fun interviewee.
Great interview!
Appreciate it, VV!
Thanks for the great information guys
You're welcome. Thanks for the comment, Knives!
If it wasn't for Gary (and many others) our great hobby would be much worse off! His passion for comics and all the aspects of Fandom help shape so many of us. I really miss the CBM!!!! I could write all day about what he has done for the hobby and, especially, me! Thanks for a fantastic interview!!!!! 👍❣
Thanks, Steve. It was a pleasure hosting Gary. He had Ben and me laughing the entire interview. Would love to have you on the show, btw, to hear your old school stories.
Keston's new subscriber, this was excellent, my friend. Thank you so much. Kinda my feelings as well, out of control on a lot of variables with this hobby. ( The G Man Totely approves 😉👊) But like me and to the rest of the Kings & Queens out ther always searching for the best in our hobby, The Quest never Ends.....👊
Thank you, GMAN. Great to have you on board! Yeah, man -- it's great to bring some of this old school knowledge into the UA-cam community.
Very informative, thank you for this. Lots of food for thought from a seasoned collector
Thanks Mastadon. Glad you enjoyed it!
Appreciate this man tremendously.
Thanks for the comment Dumballa! I share your admiration.
Great information!
Thanks Darrell! I appreciate the kind words.
I don't think I ever heard of Gary Carter. I thought I was in post-grad, and now I know I'm still in pre-school.
Heh, heh. Gary pushed me back a few grades as well :-)
You should win an Emmy for Best Editing in a Non-Fictional Short on UA-cam.
Ahh....Thanks Bianchi. That means a lot.
Enjoy interview and content good job
Thanks Jesse. Glad you enjoyed it!
Great interview and discussion. He raises a lot of the same concerns I have with current comic book grading. My stance on not buying graded books makes more and more sense every day.
Thanks GAGG for checking out the video!
This is why I never feared buying color touch on rather expensive books. It saves a ton of money and the book has about the exact desirability for most people especially for me.
Hi Hofftimus. I hear you. Some people can't stand any amount of restoration, but I'm with you. I own a grail that would have been out of reach otherwise.
Very interesting! Ty for the video
I'm glad you enjoyed it, Jim!
Great insight. For me it is eye appeal. I want the main image to be clear, clean and devoid of defects. I can forgive edges, spines and interior damage - as long as stories are intact. I like low grades with honest wear as readers…but I will admit, that I do like my favourite covers high grade.
Good to hear from you, Murray! Happy to hear you have been working out what good "eye appeal" means to you. That's critically important. Thanks for sharing the details.
Good! More
Hi, Summoner. I do have a couple more Gary videos in the queue. Likely late August/early September.
I think most of us remember our first book bought off the comic stands. The one I cherish the most was Amazing Spider-man 39 (a great cover!). Along with that great book there was a Daredevil 18 and a Tales of Suspense 89. It was 1966. Can't wait to see what Gary's first book was. Looks like a Showcase 4 (or was that click bait?).
Wow. ASM 39 --- what a fantastic early book to enjoy. Show 4? You nailed it!
New subscriber - Highly interesting, insightful, informative - and entertaining. Much appreciated - some of the best comic content in a long time. Thank you - if Gary is selling as you mentioned please share the appropriate link/appreciate it.
Hi, JSS! Glad to have you on board. Yeah, Gary is all those things. I don't think he sells much anymore at least not at public forums. If I talk with him again I'll ask though.
I need to hear Gary's thoughts on combo grades. Such an interesting topic. Should a vg/fn that looks better than a VG but worse than a FN be considered VG? Curious his perspective.
Hi Zach. Good question. What if a book looks to be right in between a VG and Fn? What do you do?
Well combo grades do seem strange to someone who came from the good fine mint era of comic grades Seems like grading standards have fallen when it comes to "good" comics over time Great insights and always loved his Marketplace articles That was a fine magazine
Thanks, Chet. I agree. Good point about the grading system. Myself included, I think many of us are most comfortable in the system we grew up with. CBM! Definitely, I hope this video sparks some new interest in the publication.
there's flippers defects. not from the resale of comics, but from the customers who flip through your boxes, with their toes. if you know, you know. never open a shop in Bedrock.
Thanks, Geoffrey. Yeah, I've heard that many comics have been compromised due to the "toe flippers"!
Awesome interview! Here is my question. With the lack of good writing these days and selling books pretty much off of variant covers only, how much longer can the hobby as we know it survive? Disney really messed up Marvel.
Good question, FZ. I hope that comics in paper form have a resurgence. I'd hate for the hobby to simply be a retrospective.
Great interview. There are a number of items that make grade numbering less than useful. Dust shadows and faded covers result in little to no change in a book grade but make a book look like a lesser grade. Page quality - brittle books should not be graded above a 1.8, while slightly brittle books should be less than 3.0. Of course ungraded books that are described by sellers as, let us say, a Very Good book but has a 5” spine split. Consider any additional description as a qualified book, look up associated grading and lower the actual grade to a 1.5. The veteran collecting community knows to do this, but the new collectors may not and will be turned off by the less than honest sellers.
Hi, Alex. I appreciate your thoughts. You bring up some of the trickiest grading issues imho. What is the highest grade you can get for slightly brittle or brittle pages. At what point to you provide a qualified label as opposed to the blue label? Does it even make sense to provide a qualified label. And, as Gary alluded to, should grading standards be applied differently depending on the age/printing process/binding of a book? And, as you mention, how the hell do you factor in these variables to price?
I agree with Gary on grading it is very subjective especially on mid grade books. I’m 7 years younger than Gary and started buying comics at 8 years of age. I did get comics when I was younger from my older brother after he and his friends were done with them. Back then it seemed every kid read comics but very few collected them. A big variable for me is color strike. Leaving fading out, some comics have brighter and deeper colors than others. Action 252 for example the shades of blue of Superman and Supergirl’s costumes goes from a dull almost grayish blue to a deep bright blue. How much of that is fading or color strike? I’ve also noticed that many of the silver age pence Marvels have deeper brighter colors than the American issues.
Hi Ken, Thanks so much for sharing your story. What a great age to enjoy comic books. Agree with you regarding color strike. I'll likely interview Matt Nelson again in a few months. I'll ask him how to distinguish between bad color strike and fading.
PSA is going to have licensed graders? what type of plastic material does CGC and CBCS uses for their SLABS?
Hi, Wayne. Good question. I don't know the answers on those. If I find out, I'll let you know.
@@kestonsoldschoolcomicbooks6842 Thanks try to ask around because I think PSA is going to change the grading industry to be licensed and registered.
Glad to see some of the Old Timers its been sixty years of N.Y. Comicon.
Hi, Arthur. Indeed. It's tough to talk about old school comics without some Old Timer insight :-). Thanks for the comment, my friend.
This guy is on point
Appreciate the comment ComicKeeper.
I'm looking for a solid copy
Of Amalgam Comics
Instant classic
Iron Lantern
Hi Onion. Funny enough I had never heard of Amalgam Comics before. B/C of your post I checked it out. Cool concept of merging Marvel and D.C. heroes! Good luck finding the comics you are searching for.
How about adding a display grade? A grade of how the book looks just as a display piece - which it is in a slab. I bet CGC would add a small fee to add that.
Hi GX. Similar to that concept, I know a couple of companies that provide a sticker that conveys good eye appeal for the grade. Thanks for the comment.
Misfolded books annoy me.
I see tons of New Mutants #98 graded by CGC as 9.8 that you can see the back cover on the front or vice-versa.
They say it is fine because manufacturing issue.
To hell with that i say, that is not a 9.8 to me.
On the other hand is foxxing does not bother me that much, but CGC will drastically lower a grade for it.
Hi, James. Thanks for the comment and sharing your perspective on eye appeal. I'm more of a golden age guy so I can't be too picky about the misfolds b/c they are so common. Some of the books I have are also badly miscut! Quality control was so poor back in the day. One thing that I have learned is NEVER buy a book that bugs you. Whatever that defect is, it will be the first thing you see every time you look at the book.
I think a cigarette burn in the center of the book is now allowable in a CGC 9.8.
Perhaps, but it's an open question about whether that type of defect is acceptable for a 9.9. Haha.
Veteran has seen through CGCs bullshit and into the grading matrix.
50 years ago, collectors were literally binding floppies into their personal omnibi.
True. That happened often.
I like colors that PoP
Thanks, Wowster. Definitely. Sometimes a 2.5 or 3.0 can be quite handsome with popping colors.
Best example is Marvel Chipping or who used color and paper stock. Best example was poor paper stock by MJL. Mr.Gaines had contact with paper stock.DC bought out All American due to paper stock. As I tell people buy what You like not what is hot.
Those are great examples, Arthur!
His position is no one can grade anything because they don't know the provenance of the paper sources. While I will say slabbing a comic is the antithesis of the hobby, I can follow a bouncing ball on how it's graded. And I get why it caught on. He had several ideas that he needed to justify.
Hi, Chris. After talking with him a little more, I didn't take away that he was completely anti-grading (he co-wrote one of the first grading guides) but rather he believes it is impossible to extract all subjectivity out of the process. Your points are well taken. Thank you.
These are all fantastic points. But unfortunately, anyone who is going to encapsulate their books and essentially turn them into pieces of furniture, aren’t going to care about any of it.
Hi, Ron. Thanks for sharing your thoughts. The furniture comment is funny. I will say that I do have quite a few slabbed books and do care about Gary's comments!
The great grading scom . Glad i never got hooked!
I like when kids wrote their names on books 50+ years ago.
I am partial to them as well. A more innocent time of comic collecting.
There are not different grading standards. YOU CAN GRADE C0MICS OBJECTIVELY.
Hi, 6thface. I do think that modern grading has evolved into something more exact. What do you mean by objective? Thanks for the comment.
@@kestonsoldschoolcomicbooks6842 I mean grading is not subjective, as your guest insinuates.
Hi 6thface. I guess what I'm getting it is what does it look like for comic grading to be completely objective. Would it be that six expert graders could independently arrive at the same grade for all books they graded? I don't thin that will ever be the case. Further, there is subjectivity in making up the grading rules. On the other hand, complete subjectivity would be the case where each individual person's perception of what grades mean is so different that no standards could ever be developed. And/or if there were standards, that people's interpretation of standards would be so different that grades would be meaningless. I'm of the opinion that the current grading standards are reasonable -- albeit not exactly how I would do it -- and that professional graders can be reasonably consistent. However, there is certainly some subjectivity / inconsistency in the process. The objective/subjective debate is an interesting one to me.
@@kestonsoldschoolcomicbooks6842 In my experience, people who claim grading is subjective like to charge too much for the books they have. Also, give me a break about that 6 different pro graders produce 6 different grades garbage. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.
@@6thface Cool. Thanks for responding. The point I was trying to make is there is some gray area between being objective and subjective. It sounds like you have some strong opinions on the topic. I'd love to hear your thoughts. Perhaps you can make a video on the topic. Best, -Keston
Grading hurt collecting. It’s to subjective. It has allowed speculators to manipulate the market
Thanks for the comment salvagemonster. I certainly have bought and seen many over-graded raw books over the years.
I would take the cigarette because it is more interesting. That is what separates the talent form the plebs.
Haha. Thanks for checking out the video, Bobo.
Hmm..this video is meh..,Keston’s other videos are way better. I have heard so of this before
Hi, AJ! Great to hear from you. Sorry this video didn't resonate you but I appreciate the overall kind words.
This is one of the worst opinions on comic book collecting I’ve ever seen. It’s rooted in no fact. And I don’t care how old the guy is, it doesn’t give him credibility. They were grading stamps and coins before he was born with the exact same grading system. And as someone who’s graded over 7-8k books, the grading is accurate and thorough the LARGE majority of the time. And books don’t get damaged. This is more nonsense pushed about the grading system by people that don’t grade books or understand how to use the grading system. It’s become a ridiculous narrative to keep alive in the comic book community. The ten point grading system is literally the VG/VF/NM grading system just broken down to be more detailed.
Hi, Voodoo. Thanks for your opinion. And, for the most part, I agree with you that most grading by experts is reasonably good. Check out my other videos and you can see the number of slabbed books I have (mostly CGC). While I disagree with some of Gary's opinion's myself, I enjoy hearing his perspective. Credibility? To me, a guy who amassed one of the most complete DC collections in the world, co-wrote the first Overstreet Grading book with Bob Overstreet, and served as the editor for Comic MarketPlace...gets my attention and respect.
He is obviously correct about all the facts, but I don't know how he doesn't come to the conclusion that therefore professional grading is a scam and we should not buy into it!
Hi, Crab. Thanks for sharing. I took Gary's comments as being that grading is complicated and it is difficult to gain consensus across collectors.