I've really come to love that quote "Kill your darlings" because I really tried revamping an old story idea with characters I was really attached to because they were my first OCs. And after years of having an idea of how they were going to be and some plot points and things, I ended up scraping most of everything that sounded like a 10-14 year old came up with it. Now most of the characters are different, play different roles, and do different things in the story and it felt good to really sit down and say "Alright, to the bin with everything that doesn't make a lick a sense and hello to a better story"
Noxiia It's true, growing up can be a factor in this, as we mature and our perspective changes, we can grow out of some older ideas. It's important not to hold on to those if they aren't working.
Did the same thing with a story I had been working on for almost 7 years, it sounded too much like some kids fanfiction because I was just adding a lot of things that were cool on paper but didn't really have much tying them together. Best part is, because how much of a huge jumbled mass of ideas the original was, I ended up turning it into 2 separate stories that almost everybody I tell ends up liking
I've had this character in mind since I was like 14, and I'm constantly thinking of them, who they are, and the world they live in. Originally, they were named "Scythe", they used a scythe, and the story was also called "Scythe." The character had no real personality, and was more just a vessel or an object, with really stupid powers that made no sense. Now, several years later, I've given them an actual name, thought up a hard magic system and based their abilities around that, and given them an actual personality in which they try to act cool, but are actually insecure. I've been trying more and more to make my story feel real, and not like some edgy kid's power fantasy. Some of the decisions I've made were really tough, but shit I'm glad I made them.
I have managed to keep using most of my first oc's even though I will admit a lot of them are very different then what they were like when I first made them and I'm glad I changed their personalities because I have been able to make way better stories with them
Ideas can only get better. You're not really getting rid of your ideas, they're just metamorphosing into a butterfly. So no time was really wasted, it was just spent improving.
I dunno... I feel like I subconsciously agree with you but, consciously, I'm kind of resistant. Characters and ideas I've had for years have definitely evolved and changed over time to completely different things, but I can't recall ever really killing a concept (maybe benching an idea in case I need again, but never throwing it out completely). I find myself to be a very sentimental person so I really cringe at and rebel against the concept of "killing your darling" (never! lol). I wouldn't say that this is an unwarranted or undeserved lesson. I think there's complete merit and necessity for it in some cases and may be what someone needs to do. I just think, for who I am and where I am with my projects, it's not a concept I warm up to quickly, least not consciously.
SuperFlashfish I get where you're coming from, but even tabling the idea for later like you say you're doing, is a healthy practice! There's themes and running ideas that I've always been interested in that make it into my work, I don't think something that broad needs to be completely done away with.
I have altered stories a lot over the years. I had characters in 8th grade and thought they were amazing and never wanted to change anything but as I got older and kept learning new things, story techniques and knowledge, the characters and stories drastically changed for the sake of a good coherent story. This happened a lot with my friends. I would make stories and they would add characters to it, but most character didnt fit (either the backstory was weak or they were too OP/mary-sues) or didnt work at all, but because they were my friends I didnt want to hurt their feelings. Now I really dont care if they get pissy with me over extensively changing the character much less cutting them from the story entirely. Its part of the process.
I feel you Cupcake Wolf. I'm 23 and I still feel this way about my characters. But as with any real parent, our babies must sometimes be disciplined. Think about it, when parents just let their kids have everything they want and never set any ground rules, it usually results in really spoiled rotten kids. The same applies to characters. Except for them it comes in the form of throwing some hardships or challenges their way every now and then. It's crucial in making your character sympathetic. Think of people you know in real life who you think have everything handed to them, do you like them very much? Most would say no. Showing your character loosing or struggling every once and a while allows us to sympathise with them. It doesn't have to be Game of Thrones or even Harry Potter level struggling, but there needs to be some sort of conflict to drive the plot along. Don't feel bad, this is something I'm still struggling with when it comes to my own "darlings." Let's face it, I'm no George R.R Martin. They're my babies, I don't want them to suffer. But they have to, at least a little. You know what they say "it builds character." I've had to wean myself into torturing them lol. Another harsh lesson I've had to learn and you will too is not every element we are attached to can make it in your finished product. Or else you're left with a huge, convoluted mess the width of the bible of scenes that go no where and characters that make no difference. I have a ton of characters I wanted to use and the way I've restructured the story I no longer know if they'll make it into the final product. I originally wanted my story to be an ensemble series where everyone would share the spotlight. It would just flip flop around to different communities and casts of characters and it didn't make much sense. Now I'm debating whether or not I should just make the plot just flip flop between two main characters who are best friends rather than 5 who barely see each other aside from that two because they live to far away. On one hand it would be easier over all, and flow much better. Unfortunately that means the other old mains will either have to be downgraded to just reoccurring characters or not be there at all. It sucks, but it's looking more and more like that's what will work best for the story. It's all part of being a writer. It's a constant learning process. Keep working at it. Like a fine wine, writing skill only improves with age.
Character design and world building are my favorite parts of the creative process. I also think this helps makes stories more believable as real life isn't as deterministic as a structured plot.
I also see this as good advice within a story as well. No matter how much you are attached to the characters you are creating, don't be afraid to make them suffer a bit. If it requires you to kill them, do it (but make sure it adds to the story).
I have this one oc that has been with me since I started trying to make a story and he has changed alot he was supposed to be the main character and it hurt when I changed his role to be part of the main cast but it was a better decision in the long run and I recently finished designing the new main and I'm much happier with the story as a whole
I learned this the hard way, as I've been developing a story idea for about six years, and I didn't make significant progress until I axed a certain character that was litterally in every prior draft.
I use to have a character who was an absolute mess of inspirations. After a while I was like, "wow... this is not very concise. There's too much going on." So I changed what they were like, keeping some of the base, not shitty ideas and it was really satisfying.
This applies to GMs or DMs who are running a homebrew world as well. "Kill your darling concepts" about how the world works, and always try to flow with player suggestions if they're not picking up what you're putting down. Getting too caught up in your concept will stifle player fun and engagement, because what you think is neat won't always spark joy in others, and that's okay too. Just improvise when needed.
What I usually do, is I save my ideas for when I come up with a story that they would actually be much better in, and then completely change them to fit the new story instead
Yeah I used to have a hard time letting go of OCs. Took me realising a lot of them had no substance to them and I was more so afraid of losing what I already had than willing to try making something better
We definately (as creative people)need to put less permanence on our ideas/situations/characters. "At what point does it stop being CPR and start being necrophilia..." -Joss Whedon Sometimes a dead idea cannot be polished. That quote is borderline crude but paints an accurate picture for sure.
thanks, I really needed to hear this today! I have been hesitant to make major changes in my story just cuz i've had such a set idea of what it is for so long.. even after I got some really useful feedback from a skilled writer that I admire I have come up with all sort of excuses to not make changes! But its dumb and not gonna get me anywhere, so its time to get working, change and edit my comic!
I have a protagonist that I started drawing this year, and has already been through three different iterations, as his role and purpose in the story has changed. Each iteration has a different design, or draw inspiration from different things.
Thanks for the video! I actually had been in a moment where the story I was creating didn't seem to really feel like it was actually going anywhere I wanted. Slowly I was realizing that a few things didn't really click with each other and, as absurd as the setting may be, it actually was not making too much sense yet I didn't want to delete them simply because I liked them. Gonna try redo my story, this time trying to be more objective about whether they should or shouldn't be a part of it when put into context. Also: is that an Ekko figure I see?
Oh. This video is just about revision. That is it. If UA-cam thinks this is too controversal, then it is overreacting big time. Revision is fine. It is a normal part of the creative process. If anything it is a good thing due to inproving the story. I have been working on a story. I have written the rough draft. I have make huge changes. I haven't written the second draft yet, but I look forward to it. I originally had the story be like Phantom of the Opera but set in America in the early 1970s. There is a phantom of the music studio. Then I radically change it. I mix in Beauty and the Beast and Hunchback of Notre Dame. Those two stories along with Phantom of the Opera. All involve creepy French boyfriends. I also throw in werewolves and Victorian psychology. The story is better because it is a lot more creative. I can go deeper into themes as well. The changes are huge. The setting changes to some kind of fantasy world. It resbles Victorian era and France. I get attatched to my two main characters. I don't really "Kill" them per se. I just heavilly change them. They still involve a pretty lady and a creepy boyfriend having a romance. They are just different. There is a pretty lady as the protagonist. In the rough draft, she was a white woman named Pauline. In the revision she is a Romani woman named Renee. A race change is a big one. The pretty lady changes drasticly in appearence due to a race change. Skin color, hair color, eye shape and even clothing are different. Another difference is that Renee has to put up with racism. That helps her relate to the the creepy boyfriend and what he has to deal with. Having a pretty Romani lady as a major character is something I got from Hunchback of Notre Dame. The other character is the creepy boyfriend. He is the love interest. In the rough draft, he is a phantom named Angel. He is not really a supernatural phantom, but he is referred to as a phantom. He is a man with a burn scar. He wears a mask to cover the scar. In the revision the character is a werewolf named Beau. He is one that can change between wolf and human. He spends most of the story in wolf form. I have a werewolf partially because I like werewolves in general. They are my favorite horror monster. I also like a creepy boyfriend better if he was some kind of animal. Having a animal boyfriend is something I got from Beauty and the Beast. I don't know what kind of animal the beast is, but wolf would be my best guess. My story is so different that there is hardly anything similar. There are only three similarieties. One is that there is a romance between pretty lady and creepy boyfriend. Two is that he takes her to his home, which is an underground castle. Three is that she has a career in singing and he teaches her how to do it. I will need to write the whole story all over again, but it is so worth it.
I think the greatest difficulty here is when one realizes that the things they enjoy aren't worth-while ideas to pursue, and so the process of elimination creates a feedback loop where you create things you enjoy, those things aren't worth pursuing, and therefor the things you create aren't worth pursuing. Creation at its core is rendered pointless.
Focus group type feedback can be invaluable. In my songwriting days, I loved using Open Mic nights to test new material. You just have to have thick skin for all the heckles 😂
It's not that you shouldn't make things you think are cool. The challenge however is getting people to see WHY these things are cool. When you edit and rewrite and delete the excess, you find that your idea does not lose meaning but rather, the meaning actually becomes clearer.
Usually I try to make my duders more vague, so they could fit into a variety of settings. Speaking of which got any tips for strictly non-anthropomorphic characters? I know it's rarer in media but for some settings animals need to just be animals, and I find a lotta people, myself included having trouble keeping them from being too personified.
Is there already a video that helps with making characters coexist/cooperate/become-friends or just have general interactions while keeping it believable? If not, could you make one?
I'm working on a story that I wanna animate one day and honestly, I can't see myself ever dumping them no matter how little it makes sense. I think it's mainly because they were made when I didn't really have any friends and they sort of became a way to not feel as lonely i guess. Anyways they are constantly changing, but despite developing them for a couple of years now, I still feel like the story and the characters are just simply boring but I can't really figure out what makes it feel that way. Some characters I'm having more trouble developing then others. It's just a bunch of problems I can't seem to work out
I think plenty of people get wrapped up in the "All it takes is dedication, and you make anything!" but they don't realize that there are more aspects like time constraints, skill and knowledge requirements, monetary restrictions, and level of concept appeal. They have an idea that would be great if released, but it's highly unlikely that the work will ever be finished and released.
I know that I've done this. My first OCs have matured and grown as I have. But at the moment their story is still on the backburner because the beginning part of the story is more the main character being pulled along rather than her taking her own initiative and unfortunately I don't have many people around me that are effective idea-bouncers. So at the moment, it's me working on other projects. But just the amount the stories and the characters have changed since I initially created them is impressive. Even so, I'm willing to scrap a lot of the plot for another if I can think of a better solution. I think I like Ditch Your Darlings better than Kill if only for the small alliteration it gives.
i stopped making a story that took me a year to work on cuz it was just not working and now i think im making better stories and before i was just stuck on that story that was going no where
I think it's best to "ditch your darlings"after rewriting. I learned that the hard way. Once, I read this advice from an author and tore up a fully illustrated book I had written, intending to reboot it but I'm still re-writing the story, nowhere near a fully illustrated book, and no longer have the old one. Don’t make the same mistake, fellow artists!
It gets hard to “kill your darlings” when there are more than one people working on something, say I wanna change something about a character or the story, I’m fine with it but someone else working on the story isn’t a fan. They’re the other persons darling in their current state. I can change whatever I want that’s mine yeah, but it gets hard when you think person b would be disappointed or dissatisfied on the inside.
Would UA-cam really be stupid enough to demonetize a video just for being called "Kill Your Darlings", in the event that you did go through with it as a title, without actually watching the video and knowing what it's about? I get that handling something as big as UA-cam has you being a total busy bee, but, demonetization over a title would be too far-fetched. Still, I'm going to watch this video.
Oh, well, sorry I took that way too seriously, although I did have ground on the fact that UA-cam's basically been drunk-driving the way they handle the site now.
Not everyone has the patience to go through every video with a suspicious title just to see whether it should be demonetised or not. People on UA-cam usually don't actually care about the videos if they're going around demonetising things.
I've actually just finished my third draft of a story lore which is about 12 pages long. I decided after finishing it just to leave it for now just to let it all sink in and come back to it later to see if it is any good. Most likely I'll come back in a couple of months and just go "Hum... this needs completely redoing." xD
Hey, what program do you recommend to use besides anything without a monthly prescription, e.g. Photoshop. I'm a beginner and am looking into art, animation, and other creative, drawing hobbies and I need something to just buy and use. This would be extremely helpful because i have art project I'm doing, on paper, and would like to transport it to digital or at least try to. Thank you so much in advance. 😁
I actually thought this video was going to be about avoiding Mary Sues or at least a character that's only be not liked a handful of times by other characters
I just realized how you can get people to not make movies out of your writing! Make a REALLY visually boring world with an EPIC story and characters. Movies rely too much on visuals for them to want to make a movie out of something like that.
I think my problem is not knowing how to NOT ditch ideas. Like, seriously, I have never finished a single goddamn thing aside from one 26-page fancomic.
An iteration of a story, an idea, or a character that you as the creator are particularly fond of, but that harms the overall flow, pacing or cohesiveness of your story.
Nah i am already a person who can't finish their story without killing at least two or three character as my logic work make the reader love them with many screen time with some flash back here and there and even make the character say they found their happiness then screw the whole mc group
I feel like "ditch your darlings" is a better metaphor than "kill your darlings" if you're trying to make a certain type of story. Obviously, you're not going to include a cowboy in a sci-fi story. Although you may love that western-themed character you created, it's not going to fit in a pure science fiction story. However, just because that cowboy can't fit in a pure science fiction story, that doesn't mean you should kill the character off completely and never use him at all. I honestly can't remember if I ever created a character before. I've created multiple works of writing throughout my life, but I've never ever created a character before.
I fine this to be hard to do for 2 reasons. 1, I love the original idea so much and aren't willing to compromise it and 2, if I have an idea for a drawing and it might have problems with it, i'll just finish it. I don't like redrawing things to get a more ''correct'' version of it because I get bored of trying to perfect it.
This video is speaking to both of those things. If it's relevant to your situation, you have to think about the overall quality of the finished product.
O.o Even many of the people who said it helped to hear this video openly admitted to knowing info/advice this already. I'm curious, who wouldn't know this, especially if they've already begun practicing writing? I'm not commenting this about the video itself, but really because based off the hundreds of creative individuals I've known throughout my life I had previously thought it'd be common sense material. Interesting, guess I learned something today. But really, I only commented to ask something - do you have anything to say about when NOT to ditch a tough or hard to design project? Not because I necessarily think it's important for my own purposes, I'm just curious as to your thoughts. Those "tough" projects have a habit of turning out the best in the end, you've just gotta know which ones to stick to and which ones to let go, hehe... ^^;
gLItcHyGeAR Someone's born every minute that hasn't heard of the Flinstones. For those that may have already heard this advice at some point, the aim was to motivate or serve as a reminder, something we all need from time to time.
... That's an unexpected response. I guess it makes sense, if you ignore my second paragraph I mean, but I wasn't saying the literal "I didn't know people need this, so I learned something" but rather "no one I've personally known has ever needed this advice, even when starting out, so I'm surprised people do". I've known plenty active writers, artists, animators and the like within multiple creative industries, always have, and most of them have given me the opposite advice - DON'T just blindly give up on ideas when the going gets tough, even many of those childish ones from when you were five, they usually become your best in the end. But, at the same time, there legitimately are plenty projects you'll need to give up on, so: What would you say is the dividing line between a project you need to give up on and a project that instead merely requires more effort? As in, "I've been working on this a very long time, and it's gotten really difficult to finish, so what would make you decide whether or not I should drop the project?" I really only commented to directly ask you this question, it seems you have a very different take on creative projects than I'm used to (much of your advice is very different from the vein of creative know-how I tend to get, there is no right way to tell a story after all), and I love hearing different people's takes on things. Like I said I'm just curious... ^^;
I've really come to love that quote "Kill your darlings" because I really tried revamping an old story idea with characters I was really attached to because they were my first OCs. And after years of having an idea of how they were going to be and some plot points and things, I ended up scraping most of everything that sounded like a 10-14 year old came up with it. Now most of the characters are different, play different roles, and do different things in the story and it felt good to really sit down and say "Alright, to the bin with everything that doesn't make a lick a sense and hello to a better story"
Noxiia It's true, growing up can be a factor in this, as we mature and our perspective changes, we can grow out of some older ideas. It's important not to hold on to those if they aren't working.
Did the same thing with a story I had been working on for almost 7 years, it sounded too much like some kids fanfiction because I was just adding a lot of things that were cool on paper but didn't really have much tying them together. Best part is, because how much of a huge jumbled mass of ideas the original was, I ended up turning it into 2 separate stories that almost everybody I tell ends up liking
I've had this character in mind since I was like 14, and I'm constantly thinking of them, who they are, and the world they live in. Originally, they were named "Scythe", they used a scythe, and the story was also called "Scythe." The character had no real personality, and was more just a vessel or an object, with really stupid powers that made no sense. Now, several years later, I've given them an actual name, thought up a hard magic system and based their abilities around that, and given them an actual personality in which they try to act cool, but are actually insecure. I've been trying more and more to make my story feel real, and not like some edgy kid's power fantasy. Some of the decisions I've made were really tough, but shit I'm glad I made them.
I have managed to keep using most of my first oc's even though I will admit a lot of them are very different then what they were like when I first made them and I'm glad I changed their personalities because I have been able to make way better stories with them
Ideas can only get better. You're not really getting rid of your ideas, they're just metamorphosing into a butterfly. So no time was really wasted, it was just spent improving.
I dunno...
I feel like I subconsciously agree with you but, consciously, I'm kind of resistant. Characters and ideas I've had for years have definitely evolved and changed over time to completely different things, but I can't recall ever really killing a concept (maybe benching an idea in case I need again, but never throwing it out completely). I find myself to be a very sentimental person so I really cringe at and rebel against the concept of "killing your darling" (never! lol). I wouldn't say that this is an unwarranted or undeserved lesson. I think there's complete merit and necessity for it in some cases and may be what someone needs to do. I just think, for who I am and where I am with my projects, it's not a concept I warm up to quickly, least not consciously.
SuperFlashfish I get where you're coming from, but even tabling the idea for later like you say you're doing, is a healthy practice! There's themes and running ideas that I've always been interested in that make it into my work, I don't think something that broad needs to be completely done away with.
I have altered stories a lot over the years. I had characters in 8th grade and thought they were amazing and never wanted to change anything but as I got older and kept learning new things, story techniques and knowledge, the characters and stories drastically changed for the sake of a good coherent story. This happened a lot with my friends. I would make stories and they would add characters to it, but most character didnt fit (either the backstory was weak or they were too OP/mary-sues) or didnt work at all, but because they were my friends I didnt want to hurt their feelings. Now I really dont care if they get pissy with me over extensively changing the character much less cutting them from the story entirely. Its part of the process.
B-but, I'm in 8th grade, and my characters are my babies. :o
Well, that sounded weird...
I feel you Cupcake Wolf. I'm 23 and I still feel this way about my characters. But as with any real parent, our babies must sometimes be disciplined. Think about it, when parents just let their kids have everything they want and never set any ground rules, it usually results in really spoiled rotten kids. The same applies to characters. Except for them it comes in the form of throwing some hardships or challenges their way every now and then. It's crucial in making your character sympathetic. Think of people you know in real life who you think have everything handed to them, do you like them very much? Most would say no. Showing your character loosing or struggling every once and a while allows us to sympathise with them. It doesn't have to be Game of Thrones or even Harry Potter level struggling, but there needs to be some sort of conflict to drive the plot along. Don't feel bad, this is something I'm still struggling with when it comes to my own "darlings." Let's face it, I'm no George R.R Martin. They're my babies, I don't want them to suffer. But they have to, at least a little. You know what they say "it builds character." I've had to wean myself into torturing them lol. Another harsh lesson I've had to learn and you will too is not every element we are attached to can make it in your finished product. Or else you're left with a huge, convoluted mess the width of the bible of scenes that go no where and characters that make no difference. I have a ton of characters I wanted to use and the way I've restructured the story I no longer know if they'll make it into the final product. I originally wanted my story to be an ensemble series where everyone would share the spotlight. It would just flip flop around to different communities and casts of characters and it didn't make much sense. Now I'm debating whether or not I should just make the plot just flip flop between two main characters who are best friends rather than 5 who barely see each other aside from that two because they live to far away. On one hand it would be easier over all, and flow much better. Unfortunately that means the other old mains will either have to be downgraded to just reoccurring characters or not be there at all. It sucks, but it's looking more and more like that's what will work best for the story. It's all part of being a writer. It's a constant learning process. Keep working at it. Like a fine wine, writing skill only improves with age.
same, i changed my characters a lot as i grow up.
The OP Mary Sue thing is such an easy trap to fall into when you start out, I haven't met anyone who hasn't made at least one
Character design and world building are my favorite parts of the creative process. I also think this helps makes stories more believable as real life isn't as deterministic as a structured plot.
..."Kill Your Darlings" could be a name for an anime...
... and I know what it would be about...
／人◕ ‿‿ ◕人＼ ?
Its called kill la kill
Added with Darling in the Franxx
Also Kill me baby
I also see this as good advice within a story as well. No matter how much you are attached to the characters you are creating, don't be afraid to make them suffer a bit. If it requires you to kill them, do it (but make sure it adds to the story).
Don't worry, I already do that plenty. I have a problem.
I have this one oc that has been with me since I started trying to make a story and he has changed alot he was supposed to be the main character and it hurt when I changed his role to be part of the main cast but it was a better decision in the long run and I recently finished designing the new main and I'm much happier with the story as a whole
I learned this the hard way, as I've been developing a story idea for about six years, and I didn't make significant progress until I axed a certain character that was litterally in every prior draft.
Well... I know what I need to do. Goodbye most of my work from 2014.
Cut Grass totally been there! It's not easy, but you thank yourself later!
Brookes Eggleston - Character Design Forge Already feeling better, honestly! Thanks for the video, man!
I use to have a character who was an absolute mess of inspirations. After a while I was like, "wow... this is not very concise. There's too much going on." So I changed what they were like, keeping some of the base, not shitty ideas and it was really satisfying.
This applies to GMs or DMs who are running a homebrew world as well. "Kill your darling concepts" about how the world works, and always try to flow with player suggestions if they're not picking up what you're putting down. Getting too caught up in your concept will stifle player fun and engagement, because what you think is neat won't always spark joy in others, and that's okay too. Just improvise when needed.
What I usually do, is I save my ideas for when I come up with a story that they would actually be much better in, and then completely change them to fit the new story instead
these videos are really helping me with creating my story and characters. they are also very inspiring. thank you.
Ohhh, I've only heard this as "kill your babies" LOL. "Ditch your darlings" certainly sounds a lot less extreme.
Mmhmm! I came up with a pseudonym for it just to be safe, UA-cam doesn’t understand metaphors 😄
Yeah I used to have a hard time letting go of OCs. Took me realising a lot of them had no substance to them and I was more so afraid of losing what I already had than willing to try making something better
We definately (as creative people)need to put less permanence on our ideas/situations/characters. "At what point does it stop being CPR and start being necrophilia..." -Joss Whedon
Sometimes a dead idea cannot be polished. That quote is borderline crude but paints an accurate picture for sure.
Do you have any tips for making creepy characters or horror characters?
thanks, I really needed to hear this today!
I have been hesitant to make major changes in my story just cuz i've had such a set idea of what it is for so long..
even after I got some really useful feedback from a skilled writer that I admire I have come up with all sort of excuses to not make changes! But its dumb and not gonna get me anywhere, so its time to get working, change and edit my comic!
I have a protagonist that I started drawing this year, and has already been through three different iterations, as his role and purpose in the story has changed. Each iteration has a different design, or draw inspiration from different things.
Thanks for the video! I actually had been in a moment where the story I was creating didn't seem to really feel like it was actually going anywhere I wanted. Slowly I was realizing that a few things didn't really click with each other and, as absurd as the setting may be, it actually was not making too much sense yet I didn't want to delete them simply because I liked them. Gonna try redo my story, this time trying to be more objective about whether they should or shouldn't be a part of it when put into context.
Also: is that an Ekko figure I see?
Oh. This video is just about revision. That is it. If UA-cam thinks this is too controversal, then it is overreacting big time. Revision is fine. It is a normal part of the creative process. If anything it is a good thing due to inproving the story. I have been working on a story. I have written the rough draft. I have make huge changes. I haven't written the second draft yet, but I look forward to it. I originally had the story be like Phantom of the Opera but set in America in the early 1970s. There is a phantom of the music studio. Then I radically change it. I mix in Beauty and the Beast and Hunchback of Notre Dame. Those two stories along with Phantom of the Opera. All involve creepy French boyfriends. I also throw in werewolves and Victorian psychology. The story is better because it is a lot more creative. I can go deeper into themes as well. The changes are huge. The setting changes to some kind of fantasy world. It resbles Victorian era and France. I get attatched to my two main characters. I don't really "Kill" them per se. I just heavilly change them. They still involve a pretty lady and a creepy boyfriend having a romance. They are just different. There is a pretty lady as the protagonist. In the rough draft, she was a white woman named Pauline. In the revision she is a Romani woman named Renee. A race change is a big one. The pretty lady changes drasticly in appearence due to a race change. Skin color, hair color, eye shape and even clothing are different. Another difference is that Renee has to put up with racism. That helps her relate to the the creepy boyfriend and what he has to deal with. Having a pretty Romani lady as a major character is something I got from Hunchback of Notre Dame. The other character is the creepy boyfriend. He is the love interest. In the rough draft, he is a phantom named Angel. He is not really a supernatural phantom, but he is referred to as a phantom. He is a man with a burn scar. He wears a mask to cover the scar. In the revision the character is a werewolf named Beau. He is one that can change between wolf and human. He spends most of the story in wolf form. I have a werewolf partially because I like werewolves in general. They are my favorite horror monster. I also like a creepy boyfriend better if he was some kind of animal. Having a animal boyfriend is something I got from Beauty and the Beast. I don't know what kind of animal the beast is, but wolf would be my best guess. My story is so different that there is hardly anything similar. There are only three similarieties. One is that there is a romance between pretty lady and creepy boyfriend. Two is that he takes her to his home, which is an underground castle. Three is that she has a career in singing and he teaches her how to do it. I will need to write the whole story all over again, but it is so worth it.
I think the greatest difficulty here is when one realizes that the things they enjoy aren't worth-while ideas to pursue, and so the process of elimination creates a feedback loop where you create things you enjoy, those things aren't worth pursuing, and therefor the things you create aren't worth pursuing. Creation at its core is rendered pointless.
Focus group type feedback can be invaluable. In my songwriting days, I loved using Open Mic nights to test new material. You just have to have thick skin for all the heckles 😂
It's not that you shouldn't make things you think are cool. The challenge however is getting people to see WHY these things are cool. When you edit and rewrite and delete the excess, you find that your idea does not lose meaning but rather, the meaning actually becomes clearer.
Usually I try to make my duders more vague, so they could fit into a variety of settings. Speaking of which got any tips for strictly non-anthropomorphic characters? I know it's rarer in media but for some settings animals need to just be animals, and I find a lotta people, myself included having trouble keeping them from being too personified.
now that you said it, i can't remember a single story like that sooo.... i have no advices, glhf
Not an artist but love writing and designing characters. Your video was in my recommended section and i'm glad it was, subscribed!
Is there already a video that helps with making characters coexist/cooperate/become-friends or just have general interactions while keeping it believable? If not, could you make one?
I'm working on a story that I wanna animate one day and honestly, I can't see myself ever dumping them no matter how little it makes sense. I think it's mainly because they were made when I didn't really have any friends and they sort of became a way to not feel as lonely i guess. Anyways they are constantly changing, but despite developing them for a couple of years now, I still feel like the story and the characters are just simply boring but I can't really figure out what makes it feel that way. Some characters I'm having more trouble developing then others. It's just a bunch of problems I can't seem to work out
I have never related to a comment as much as I relate to this
I think plenty of people get wrapped up in the "All it takes is dedication, and you make anything!" but they don't realize that there are more aspects like time constraints, skill and knowledge requirements, monetary restrictions, and level of concept appeal. They have an idea that would be great if released, but it's highly unlikely that the work will ever be finished and released.
I know that I've done this. My first OCs have matured and grown as I have. But at the moment their story is still on the backburner because the beginning part of the story is more the main character being pulled along rather than her taking her own initiative and unfortunately I don't have many people around me that are effective idea-bouncers. So at the moment, it's me working on other projects. But just the amount the stories and the characters have changed since I initially created them is impressive. Even so, I'm willing to scrap a lot of the plot for another if I can think of a better solution.
I think I like Ditch Your Darlings better than Kill if only for the small alliteration it gives.
How do you create color pallets for your characters? And do you choose contrasting colors for the back ground?
Thanks, dude. I was just struggling to decide whether should I kill my darling from 2013 or not. (Look at my pic.) Enough is enough! ~w~
Bigbeater Kioshi For the Greater Good! 😄 I'm glad this helped!
You will not believe how many characters that did not make it through production.
I call it "The pile of the Abandoned"
i stopped making a story that took me a year to work on cuz it was just not working and now i think im making better stories and before i was just stuck on that story that was going no where
I think it's best to "ditch your darlings"after rewriting. I learned that the hard way. Once, I read this advice from an author and tore up a fully illustrated book I had written, intending to reboot it but I'm still re-writing the story, nowhere near a fully illustrated book, and no longer have the old one. Don’t make the same mistake, fellow artists!
It gets hard to “kill your darlings” when there are more than one people working on something, say I wanna change something about a character or the story, I’m fine with it but someone else working on the story isn’t a fan. They’re the other persons darling in their current state. I can change whatever I want that’s mine yeah, but it gets hard when you think person b would be disappointed or dissatisfied on the inside.
Would UA-cam really be stupid enough to demonetize a video just for being called "Kill Your Darlings", in the event that you did go through with it as a title, without actually watching the video and knowing what it's about?
I get that handling something as big as UA-cam has you being a total busy bee, but, demonetization over a title would be too far-fetched. Still, I'm going to watch this video.
Pete Madrona it's a little bit of a joke, friend. It'll be ok.
Oh, well, sorry I took that way too seriously, although I did have ground on the fact that UA-cam's basically been drunk-driving the way they handle the site now.
It's probably a computer that decides what might be "bad".
Not everyone has the patience to go through every video with a suspicious title just to see whether it should be demonetised or not. People on UA-cam usually don't actually care about the videos if they're going around demonetising things.
Nikku4211 Well, Google should only hire the people who do and they probably do. But that doesn't stop people from mass reporting.
Your videos are so helpfull! Thank you for making them :)
I've actually just finished my third draft of a story lore which is about 12 pages long. I decided after finishing it just to leave it for now just to let it all sink in and come back to it later to see if it is any good.
Most likely I'll come back in a couple of months and just go "Hum... this needs completely redoing." xD
I do have a few retired characters, which is probably for the best because i have OVER 25 OCS
sorry about that
Pretty sure I've got a few more than you. Don't feel bad ;)
I have about 29 active OCs at the moment
Hey, what program do you recommend to use besides anything without a monthly prescription, e.g. Photoshop. I'm a beginner and am looking into art, animation, and other creative, drawing hobbies and I need something to just buy and use. This would be extremely helpful because i have art project I'm doing, on paper, and would like to transport it to digital or at least try to. Thank you so much in advance. 😁
Photoshop is available as a one time purchase if you get CS6!
So Fail Faster right?
Dude. You're amazing friend :) I love your videos.
What kind of digital drawing pad/software do you use?
new subscriber here! glad I found this channel
how can i read your comics????
I actually thought this video was going to be about avoiding Mary Sues or at least a character that's only be not liked a handful of times by other characters
nice hair
Thank you for the tips, I just wish I knew people who will give constructive criticism to my ideas...
Novice Bard critiques at patreon.com/bageldenizen are in place for just that! Make sure to take advantage of it
Thank you for the link.
I Took a old self insert character, and made them into a new character with there own flaws and personality!
I just realized how you can get people to not make movies out of your writing! Make a REALLY visually boring world with an EPIC story and characters. Movies rely too much on visuals for them to want to make a movie out of something like that.
I think my problem is not knowing how to NOT ditch ideas.
Like, seriously, I have never finished a single goddamn thing aside from one 26-page fancomic.
What's a darling?
An iteration of a story, an idea, or a character that you as the creator are particularly fond of, but that harms the overall flow, pacing or cohesiveness of your story.
I've tried re-writing the same story 3-4 times, and eventually changed practically everything about the protagonist, including the gender. :P
Unless you don't care about anyone else seeing your personal story. Or having a good story. For some of us we just have our fun stories for ourselves.
I learned this a while ago :D
2nd?
AmberMoon yes
Nah i am already a person who can't finish their story without killing at least two or three character as my logic work make the reader love them with many screen time with some flash back here and there and even make the character say they found their happiness then screw the whole mc group
"Kill your darlings" that's a good title for a book or a video game
In short......stop being an old idea hoarder
Goodbye my dearest oc…😢
I feel like "ditch your darlings" is a better metaphor than "kill your darlings" if you're trying to make a certain type of story. Obviously, you're not going to include a cowboy in a sci-fi story. Although you may love that western-themed character you created, it's not going to fit in a pure science fiction story.
However, just because that cowboy can't fit in a pure science fiction story, that doesn't mean you should kill the character off completely and never use him at all.
I honestly can't remember if I ever created a character before. I've created multiple works of writing throughout my life, but I've never ever created a character before.
For the algorithm.
I fine this to be hard to do for 2 reasons. 1, I love the original idea so much and aren't willing to compromise it and 2, if I have an idea for a drawing and it might have problems with it, i'll just finish it. I don't like redrawing things to get a more ''correct'' version of it because I get bored of trying to perfect it.
This video is speaking to both of those things. If it's relevant to your situation, you have to think about the overall quality of the finished product.
Ok how *_DARE YOU_*
O.o Even many of the people who said it helped to hear this video openly admitted to knowing info/advice this already. I'm curious, who wouldn't know this, especially if they've already begun practicing writing? I'm not commenting this about the video itself, but really because based off the hundreds of creative individuals I've known throughout my life I had previously thought it'd be common sense material. Interesting, guess I learned something today.
But really, I only commented to ask something - do you have anything to say about when NOT to ditch a tough or hard to design project? Not because I necessarily think it's important for my own purposes, I'm just curious as to your thoughts. Those "tough" projects have a habit of turning out the best in the end, you've just gotta know which ones to stick to and which ones to let go, hehe... ^^;
gLItcHyGeAR Someone's born every minute that hasn't heard of the Flinstones. For those that may have already heard this advice at some point, the aim was to motivate or serve as a reminder, something we all need from time to time.
... That's an unexpected response. I guess it makes sense, if you ignore my second paragraph I mean, but I wasn't saying the literal "I didn't know people need this, so I learned something" but rather "no one I've personally known has ever needed this advice, even when starting out, so I'm surprised people do". I've known plenty active writers, artists, animators and the like within multiple creative industries, always have, and most of them have given me the opposite advice - DON'T just blindly give up on ideas when the going gets tough, even many of those childish ones from when you were five, they usually become your best in the end. But, at the same time, there legitimately are plenty projects you'll need to give up on, so:
What would you say is the dividing line between a project you need to give up on and a project that instead merely requires more effort? As in, "I've been working on this a very long time, and it's gotten really difficult to finish, so what would make you decide whether or not I should drop the project?" I really only commented to directly ask you this question, it seems you have a very different take on creative projects than I'm used to (much of your advice is very different from the vein of creative know-how I tend to get, there is no right way to tell a story after all), and I love hearing different people's takes on things. Like I said I'm just curious... ^^;
6,666 views?😱😱😱
the original zootopia story was far better.
+Erik Papps How so?
"Kill your darlings..."
OK! *gets out keyboard to make super-duper angsty death scenes*
PLZ DON'T TAKE THIS LITERALLY THIS IS JUST A JOKE.
I Took a old self insert character, and made them into a new character with there own flaws and personality!