Thanks for posting this. I had been wondering if I ever was gonna hear or watch it. I'm a huge fan of Tom Wright's work and the questions you raised have been an interest of mine. I am a Ghanaian and from my experience growing up in Pentecostal/Charismatic circles and a culture where almost people never question the existence of demonic forces I face different challenges from what happens in the West. I also spent part of my childhood in the West so I can also appreciate where you guys are coming from. The problem here is the fear of evil forces and not why evil happens. God is hardly ever seen as responsible. The demons who do not want to follow God's will are the ones who cause them. (Wow this comment is becoming longer than necessary but I am so excited.) I do not mean people believe every single bad thing is the devils fault but the absolute goodness and power of God is never in question. People are worried about how they can win the battle against these evil forces. There is a lot of talk about it but i do not know any preacher in my context who has a full biblical theology of the demonic. I better pause here but great work. If the next time you are discussing this. If you can get a person from my part of the world to talk about this it would really help.
That's the sort of thing I'd say to hear if it sounds reasonable and like something I'd want to hang my hat on, but in truth it's not something you can know for sure Frank, given no one actually knows HTF our universe came to exist or WTF "life" actually is. The fact that we can see the universe DOES exist and that we actually ARE alive should not be confused with an explanation for how and what they are.
This is very interesting to me growing up Pentecostal in the west we always heard about how common and out in the open “supernatural” things were way over in the African countries. It’s been some years since you made this comment, have you had any evolving in your thoughts and perceptions about this topic?
Unfortunately only 17,433 people have watched this video. Being thrust into this battle in the late 80’s I was blessed to receive some sound teaching before encountering this battle first hand. Tom’s statement on his psychrist friend who found some instances where something dark was at hand is quite true. Demonized people are out there suffering and the Lord is faithful where He can to direct these suffering souls to a Christian who can minister to them. Most denominations don’t want to believe it’s among us let alone enter into helping such people. Most times they demonic spirit can be dealt with without fanfare. Education and sound teaching should be sought before trying to help someone thought to be in this kind of trouble. Messy things can happen, as Tom eludes to.
Beck nails it identifying patronization and paternalism as essential attributes of arrogance and not a meaningful way to engage Christians that don't share your worldview. If we care about ministry we are called to be humble. Instead, intellectual arrogance often leads to condescension. Fun program.
Something that always puzzled me.... People use the word "satan" like "he" is omnipresent, tempting everybody everywhere at the same exact time. This gives "satan" the same power as God. It just doesn't make a lot of sense. Thoughts?
What is truly missing from this debate is the folks in deliverance ministry that Bishop Wright spoke about. So much of this is theological theorizing, why not have folks that deal with these realities on a day to day basis especially those that help people get delivered from the occult. Greg Boyd's experience with the 15-year-old girl is revealing about his belief in the demonic realm but Greg still has to be condescending toward those that actually engage in deliverance ministry and their methods. Greg Boyd has a deliverance ministry at his church but at the same time, they also have yoga classes at the church so he is still must be confused about idolatry and the demonic. It seems that the biggest fear of members of this panel is appearing to be a "fundie."
Bad Question! The knuckle head with the beard sitting at the end of the Table next to the Guest Speaker N. T. Wright! Relax!!! I know your not perfect like me, but don't cut your Guest off!! Especially Him. Having said that , your a good Dude!
This is an absolute trial to try and listen to. Wish it could be edited to NT Wright commentary only. The rest of the "panel" are total twits who try way too hard to be clever and funny. Give them orange slices and Capri Suns and have them sit in the corner. Let NT speak.
I just enjoyed people enjoying their friends’ company and discussing something meaningful. It stuck out to me that when NT Wright joined, the others toned it down a bit out of respect and it was then Wright throwing out the occasional zinger.
Great podcast - NT Wright and Richard Becks = awesome!
I wish I could attend an event like this with Tripp, Greg, and Tom!
Thanks for posting this. I had been wondering if I ever was gonna hear or watch it. I'm a huge fan of Tom Wright's work and the questions you raised have been an interest of mine. I am a Ghanaian and from my experience growing up in Pentecostal/Charismatic circles and a culture where almost people never question the existence of demonic forces I face different challenges from what happens in the West. I also spent part of my childhood in the West so I can also appreciate where you guys are coming from. The problem here is the fear of evil forces and not why evil happens. God is hardly ever seen as responsible. The demons who do not want to follow God's will are the ones who cause them. (Wow this comment is becoming longer than necessary but I am so excited.) I do not mean people believe every single bad thing is the devils fault but the absolute goodness and power of God is never in question. People are worried about how they can win the battle against these evil forces. There is a lot of talk about it but i do not know any preacher in my context who has a full biblical theology of the demonic. I better pause here but great work. If the next time you are discussing this. If you can get a person from my part of the world to talk about this it would really help.
No gods devils, demons, angels ,spirits, heavens, fire'y pits ,all products of overactive imaginations .
Nope.
That's the sort of thing I'd say to hear if it sounds reasonable and like something I'd want to hang my hat on, but in truth it's not something you can know for sure Frank, given no one actually knows HTF our universe came to exist or WTF "life" actually is. The fact that we can see the universe DOES exist and that we actually ARE alive should not be confused with an explanation for how and what they are.
This is very interesting to me growing up Pentecostal in the west we always heard about how common and out in the open “supernatural” things were way over in the African countries.
It’s been some years since you made this comment, have you had any evolving in your thoughts and perceptions about this topic?
Can we get another devilpalooza in 2024?! This was so good
Unfortunately only 17,433 people have watched this video. Being thrust into this battle in the late 80’s I was blessed to receive some sound teaching before encountering this battle first hand. Tom’s statement on his psychrist friend who found some instances where something dark was at hand is quite true. Demonized people are out there suffering and the Lord is faithful where He can to direct these suffering souls to a Christian who can minister to them. Most denominations don’t want to believe it’s among us let alone enter into helping such people. Most times they demonic spirit can be dealt with without fanfare. Education and sound teaching should be sought before trying to help someone thought to be in this kind of trouble. Messy things can happen, as Tom eludes to.
great podcast
Beck nails it identifying patronization and paternalism as essential attributes of arrogance and not a meaningful way to engage Christians that don't share your worldview. If we care about ministry we are called to be humble. Instead, intellectual arrogance often leads to condescension. Fun program.
Something that always puzzled me.... People use the word "satan" like "he" is omnipresent, tempting everybody everywhere at the same exact time. This gives "satan" the same power as God. It just doesn't make a lot of sense. Thoughts?
"and friends" is hot
Never heard of a Church of Christ have musical instruments before.
There is a entire group that uses them.
Cool and super nerdy!
What is truly missing from this debate is the folks in deliverance ministry that Bishop Wright spoke about. So much of this is theological theorizing, why not have folks that deal with these realities on a day to day basis especially those that help people get delivered from the occult. Greg Boyd's experience with the 15-year-old girl is revealing about his belief in the demonic realm but Greg still has to be condescending toward those that actually engage in deliverance ministry and their methods. Greg Boyd has a deliverance ministry at his church but at the same time, they also have yoga classes at the church so he is still must be confused about idolatry and the demonic. It seems that the biggest fear of members of this panel is appearing to be a "fundie."
Bad Question! The knuckle head with the beard sitting at the end of the Table next to the Guest Speaker N. T. Wright! Relax!!! I know your not perfect like me, but don't cut your Guest off!! Especially Him. Having said that , your a good Dude!
This is an absolute trial to try and listen to. Wish it could be edited to NT Wright commentary only. The rest of the "panel" are total twits who try way too hard to be clever and funny. Give them orange slices and Capri Suns and have them sit in the corner. Let NT speak.
I just enjoyed people enjoying their friends’ company and discussing something meaningful. It stuck out to me that when NT Wright joined, the others toned it down a bit out of respect and it was then Wright throwing out the occasional zinger.
How about you listen to one of his lectures on UA-cam instead then?
Oh and if and when you meet your first demon remember Jesus Lord!
Whose the knuckle head with the beard!
the guy whose podcast it is
sad to see identity by how much you know here. Good info though.