PSA REVEAL: 1988 Fleer Basketball! Jordan, Pippen, Rodman 🔥🔥
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- Опубліковано 29 сер 2024
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Nearly one year ago Geoff opened a box of 1988 Fleer Basketball. Now the grades are finally back from PSA. Did we get any 10s? Tune in to find out. .
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Moral of the story ---> 21:38 🏀
Gum review ---> 21:49
Value of a factory sealed box of 1990 skybox NBA cards.
A Larry Bird 9 is something to get excited over.
This video made me decide on not getting my cards graded thank you
Well at least whatever you lost on the value from cracking open the box you probably at least broke even in UA-cam revenue with over a Million views. Hope you do more of these vintage pack openings. Not to much interest in the new cards but older cards got me to watch and subscribe and even opened an 1991 upper deck box I got for 50 bucks
Brutal. It's these shenanigans that makes me wonder if PSA will ever regain its throne when they come back.
They still the top lol
I cant believe how stupid this is.....all of these 20 years ago would have gotten 9s and 10s I'm 100% positive
@@dr.fauci_tortured_n_killed5034 So you're mad that PSA has gotten more strict with their standards? You preferred when cards with flaws got 10s? For sure.
@@kamb8s I'm Mad that flawless cards straight from the pack are 7s and 8s when I know for a fact that 20 years ago when I was in the hobby the same cards would have gotten 10s and 9s this grading discrepancy should totally crash the prices on old slabs idk how this hasnt tanked psa
@@dr.fauci_tortured_n_killed5034 I agree completely. Everyone with orders at PSA are going to get rekt.
You should resubmit all of that to all the different grading companies and do separate videos LOL
Hi my love
Exactly what I was thinking.
Psa is an absolute joke. Biggest scammers
They don’t give out 10s unless your Logan Paul
They don't give out 10s unless you are running thousands of cards through them. I would like to send them a known beckett 10 and see what they grade it.
I’ve subbed over a thousand cards with PSA, so I know what has a chance to gem, mint, etc. with that being said, I submitted all the bigger cards from my 1986-1989 fleer sets, all being in mint+ condition. My 86 fleer got all 5’s and 6’s. I got one 9, out of almost 100 cards. Some were badly off centered but my well centered ones got 6’s. I cracked all the big ones and sent it to BGS. Never subbing to PSA again
Exaxtly I would bust all those out and never again sub to psa
PSA is absolutely horrible
PSA is SHAKING in their boots, SOBBING that you're no longer a customer. What will they do?
@@ja1720 would love to hear back on what bgs grades them
@@platinumbphilms3736 I will. I should have them back sometime in July
These videos are sure making SGC look better and better!
Sgc cases are ugly
SGC is the hit legit. Their grading system is more accurate at the top end with its "9.5 Mint +" grade. And I rather like the newer "tuxedo" cases. I'd pick them over PSA every time, both for submissions and on the secondary.
@@WhyScales23 I think the black matte makes the card look so much better. I'd only change the font used.
CSG
There's got to be a PSA 10 in one of those Jordans. I think I'll migrate to SGC, fair grades imho. PSA is starting to piss me off
SGC is the way of the future.
agreed the new graders there have made it a random lottery.
I am not saying there was any 10’s but thought a lot more 9’s.
@@longlostsonicsfan I am been buying SGC for the past 6 months and got 2 SGC submissions back.
@@jasonhipkins I think they can make several upgrades to their slabs, but besides that I’m a huge fan.
This is why BGS is a better option for these cards. With PSA you'll never know why they gave the grade they did. At least with BGS you can pin point where they found the flaw and how it added up to it's grade.
Love the color tiers of the plaque, silver, gold and the rare black.
I just got my 200 card sub back recently. I split it in half to see what would happen. My first 100 cards had a gem rate of 84% and my other 100 had a gem rate of 23%! I got multiple cards back with finger prints on the surface as well. I wear gloves when I prepped my cards and thoroughly checked for any finger prints and surface issues. This was really disappointing and grading is a total crapshoot. PSA is not to be trusted with grading our cards.
How do you afford it when it's 20-30 bucks a card to get these graded? 100 cards at once...
@@mcshreddy submitted over a year and a half ago…
Old news......PSA is a joke , BGS holds no value in comparison. Sorry this is pure facts . Using PSA in person at card shows was fair in the 90s. Honestly , that was the only time I felt it was fair. The values weren't insane back then , now they are, this is all rigged now. Mailing them in now? This is all a setup , you wont get any fair grades , they'll never grade these 88 Fleer Basketball cards fairly. Huge waste of money , and time. Dont fall for this scam !
Different employees on different days. That’s probably a big part of the issue. Someone’s not doing their job
@@kfiscal01 you can trust sgc a bit more than psa
That was brutal. When I watching this being opened I was surprised with how decent the centering was on most of these. I can't see the surface of course but most of these looked much better than the grades received.
Seriously, a lot of these that were graded out as 8's seemed like 9.5 or 10's. Centered, sharp edges and corners, no surface damage, etc. Also, not sure which grading service it is, but it lists the 4 grades, so you can see why it wouldn't have scored a 9 or a 10. Kind of messed up that PSA doesn't do that.
Yep I agree. PSA too stringent on these wax cards. Just brutal grading, those Jordan All Star cards looked pretty good imo. Centering wise it deserved a 9 at least in one of them.
The gum eating was a PSA 10!
📈
The fact that it was over a year since the rip, is very sad on PSA’s part
They waited over a year to get screwed lol
Not nearly as sad as the atrocious grading they recieved not just bordering on scandalous but straight out corrupt
AI grading companies like AGS can grade cards really fast since the process is automated.
Brutally tough and unfair. Grader must've been having a terrible day. I saw the box break and thought how beautiful most of these cards looked.
"Grader was having a bad day" , you all repeat this lame statement . No, PSA purposely keeps the population of high grades low. This keeps values insane, and people chasing . Fall for this scam if you want . If they 9 and 10'd properly, thered be no value in them , and people would stop using PSA. So they'll just keep playing everyone who keeps falling for the scam. Have fun yall 😂
Wow, PSA is brutal with these grades! I remember watching the opening video and there were a few cards I thought looked really nice(especially the centering considering this year has some centering issues).
Makes the PSA 9’s look like bargains
I cracked open every Topps Tiffany set ever made and sent about 20 cards for super express and got back no 10’s. A lot of 8’s, like 3 9’s. It was a total joke. Cards were gem mint. Prob will never submit vintage, 80’s or 90’s to PSA again. This was just this week.
Baseball - including an 89 Bowman and 2 86 Topps traded
@@wafdawg PSA is drunk at this point
@@jusbeazy28 Honestly can’t believe I paid over $6k for super express just to get totally robbed
@@wafdawg I have a Jeter SP foil and 2 of his Topps rookies I’m just sitting on because of PSA. They are so inconsistent
@@jusbeazy28 The sad part is that they are the only one that has the true resale value so it’s not like you want to send to Beckett or SGC. Although lately I think BGS 9.5’s are criminally undervalued.
HOT TIP! I have noticed a trend when multiples of the same card or a stack from the same set are submitted, they seem to nearly all get the same grade. It seems to me that the graders will use a shortcut to get through them. Then randomly change a grade so it doesnt look like they are short cutting but after seeing tons of reveals a pattern seems to emerge.
Yep I noticed that too with my last submission!
untrue I submit thousands and thousands a year. there is no trick or special secret.
It seemed like PSA did a great job to me.....understandable WHY each and every card rec'ved the grade given......very consistent and that's what we want => unbiased and impartial grading.
IMO => FOR PSA it's all about the corners (70%), then 15% L-R, 10% T-B, 5% everything thing/anything else. It's WRONG but THEY ARE VERY CONSISTENT ABOUT IT.
PSA is terrible about FOCUS DIFFERENCES, COLOR DIFFERENCES, PRINT DEFECTS, PRESSING, TILT. But 100% on MISCUTS, creases, wrinkles, min size requirements, altered/colored and paper loss.
They occasionally MISS TRIMMING.
So you'll know i'm not THEIR GUY => MOST CARDS LOOK BETTER IN SGC HOLDERS
If you actually suspect this and continue to send cards to PSA I don’t even know what to tel you
That's why I've been looking at alternatives. They're backed up, and there's a lot of different card graders now. From established graders like BGS to AI graders like AGS.
Why would I send my brand new, fresh pulled, perfect centered card to psa just so they can tell me it's not a good card.. what in the scam heck is going on... do they even read they own grading standards?
Yup....this is horrible
@@paddyb456 sickos I believe it
These grades from PSA were brutal, so many PSA 7's. I would love to see these cards resubmitted to SGC.
Anyone hear that? Sounds like pop control to me
Those grades were brutal. I thought for sure you had a couple 10s. Your friends knowledge of late 80s basketball and cards is pretty awesome. I'd happily watch him Crack open vintage basketball.
Hey I'm Irish black I've been in the sports card trading business for a few years now 2016 to be exact. I thank you for pushing the business to the next level like you have. There are card breakers like Badger breaks Pull Wax Cajun Breakers and host of others that really put in work out here.You Guys put us where we are today. Thank you
The '88 Fleer set is notorious for getting low grades with all the 3rd party companies...severe centering issues...not only left-right but also top-bottom on a majority of the cards manufactured
You would think paying for a service they would provide reasoning on why your card received the overall grade. At least provide details on if it was surface, corners, edges, or centering. Grading companies should be as transparent as possible. Otherwise it looks rather shady that pop counts are being manipulated.
Man that was brutal...good to know as I have several of these to submit, double thinking it now.
Dont do it
Im in the same boat. What should we do?
I've been waiting on this. Let's go Geoff and Mark.
They should be required to supply a description on why the grade was what it was.
PSA is trash, just like CGC for comics
Grading needs regulations and standardization. There's too much HUMAN subjective grading in the hobby.
#AIforGrading
Thank you for sharing.
They literally spent millions of dollars to acquire an AI grading company to help facilitate an increased amount of standardization. What more do you want? Grading is inherently subjective. You're not going to have perfect AI grading anytime during your lifetime.
@@kamb8s Computers drive cars now, I think they will be able to pull off taking a picture of cardboard from a children's hobby.
AI grading will allow more fakes and altered cards thru once scammers figure out the tolerances
@@cardsandcomics You do understand that AI grading does not mean that the cards are not seen by humans, correct?
@@kamb8s using it the way people are wanting such as corners and edges will make trimming easier as humans won't be judging those aspects or why even have software
Ridiculous if ask me. Definitely a few 9s were in there that got 8s if go by the standards of past grading.
Lost my whole childhood collection . This channel make me smile and cry 😭
Good vids guys! It was tough to see your excitement fade slowly through the video! Keep up the good work.
Y'all are giving PSA too much credit. I've seen balled up, completely rounded corner Jordans that were 6s and 7s. There wasn't anything wrong with those cards except centering. PSA doesn't want high pop counts due to the massive influx of cards. The more high graded cards they give, the greater supply, the more useless their service. Hell at least they slabbed your cards. They sent mine back as altered and trimmed. 🤣 And I wouldn't dare take a scalpel to my cards; I barely wanted to touch them to put in Card Savers. I was trembling the entire time. Time to put the middle finger up to PSA
Shouldn't a grading result like this drive down the price of unopened boxes?
Of course. The prior video where these guys "opened" the packs said the box was worth 10k. That box was worth more like 1,500 at best
The whole industry is a joke. 5 years ago I got a 1989 score football box for $250. Now it’s worth $2k. Fuck that.
You went to SGC, they took it personally 😂
Honestly, that was some tough grading...perfect edges, corners, surface, just always a very slight imperfection on the centering, I thought a lot of those 8s, even a Jordan all-star and a Reggie looked more centered than the 9 Barkley, which was ever so slightly up and left. That's tough.
Seriously everyone, you don’t think there’s a correlation between a company that refuses to post subgrades and has a serious inconsistency record? Gimme a break!
You can't just start grading cards harder all of a sudden. Reeks of protection of investments of owners of PSA.
Can you guys switch up the camera view for revealing the cards? The blurr is straining my eyes lol.
The close-up camera work is even worse than the PSA grading here
resend all of them and you will for sure get many 10`s . PSA have changed alot in 3 years . this was back when they graded the cards , and not just pumping out 10`s to get more cards sent in , like today .
Man,I bought a whole set of these with the stickers 10 years ago for 20 bucks.
Ill give you 40
Mark flood you're funny. Good luck finding a set for that.
How much is this whole set now?
Damn makes me not want to send mine in now. Great video!
Me too.. I have some ‘88 Fleets I want to send in but that’s ridiculous
Maybe mass market will realize the buying opportunity we re in right now on 9 and 10 slabs.
Massive deals on the various platforms.
Love it!! I went back to watch the box opening first- made it much more exciting. Thanks for fun content!
Top to bottom centering on the Jordan 7's, imho, is what made them 7's....so if it's even off ever so slightly left to right, the grade is gonna be taken way down.
Lots of good lessons here. They are definitely tougher on grading. Existing PSA 9/10 of older cards are way under valued (and over graded), and 8s and 9s are not bad grades for older cards. I just had a 1990s card sub that weirdly had 24 PSA 8.5s out of 108 cards. Seems like pop control to me.
This is why it’s good to have more than 1 or 2 grading options . Love the hobby tho ripping packs is extremely fun 🔥
Yep, can't wait for more options and innovations like AI grading to become more popular.
Watching you guys eat that gum was a bigger highlight than the reveal and that was impressive to beat!
PSA has all the 10s.... They sent you back the 8s..... There 10s will be for sale on ebay for 4000 5000 each. Thanks for sending them in!!!
Guys a psa 5 should have VERY NOTICEABLE flaws ......if this doesnt show how bad psa is idk what will
The 5’s were WAY off center. The 7’s and 8’s had pretty decent centering, so I wonder what held them back. I’m guessing it was still the centering, as it wasn’t 50/50.
That crunch! Wish you guys got some more 9s but still another great video!
Exactly why I like BGS any day over PSA. Sub grades let you know what you got in each of the 4 areas of grading. When I started out with cards BGS was the number #1 for grading and I hope it goes back to that.
PSA isn't the same. There graders are all over the board completely random grades now. Time to pass the torch.
My favorite part of this video was how you stacked up your slabs after each grade reveal. :D
Yes Geoff you and Mark are right in my opinion. I had a 88 fleer box as well and I just recently sold it for 5k. Now I'm wishing I had another one lol. I recommend anyone who has this box as I did to hang on to it. Growing up with this particular product we all knew most of these cards were mostly off centered. But yes anyone who has this 88 fleer basketball hang on to it and don't open it.
The crunch of that gum sounded Like a kettle cooked potato chip. I’m dying laughing here.
Bro I've been waiting for this
The crunch on the gum rivals anything that you could pull from a fresh Doritos bag.
Keep in mind guys The appreciation of this set and the past few months definitely works in your favor. Thanks for the amazing content I look forward to more of your journeys 🎉🤝💯🍻
I’m crying that’s how hard I was laughing with the sound effects and the boiling anger I know they’re feeling inside 😅 PSA was not in a good mood that day grading cards 😂
4 straight 7's on Rodman cards? I pray that personal feelings are NEVER a part of the graders scores on cards. Enjoy that gum guys! #geoffsgumface
pop control incoming
7:12 the guy on the right is like: "Oops, that was being recorded, I'm such a baby and I'm 59". LMAO
We’ve all been there. You were good sports about it
The only problem I have is everyone says submit somewhere else(I sent to sgc).. But then when you go to try SELL your SGC, everyone changes their tune and you can barely give it away sometimes. I've had a lamelo for sale half the year for like half the price of a similar PSA, and not even a single best offer has come in, nobody even TRIES to buy them, and it's not just him, sgc resale plus eBay fees it's hard to make profit
I did something very similar, and got similar results. I then resubmitted the cards, but only 1-3 at a time. All of them, with the exception of one, graded at least one point higher. (I did not get any stickers graded).
Why don’t they give you explanations on why they grade it a certain way. Just like quick notes would be so helpful.
And that last Rodman looked way better than the others .
Marks back! let’s goooo 🔥🔥
I have a bunch of cards from that Fleer '88 set, including two nice looking Jordans. I guess I should send them into HGA or SGC.
And I just sent a 1985 Jordan Jewel Prism card to PSA on SATURDAY!!!!!
I actually watched you open this whole box and I'm surprised that you only got two nines out of that whole box amazing
That Jordan All-Star card is just so iconic. The only graded basketball card that I own is that in an SGC 7.5. But centering top to bottom on both front and back is really tough. So I wouldn't be all that surprised/disappointed by the grades you got. And I agree that they were worth submitting to have authenticated even if PC.
PSA ain’t controlling nothing! You have to pick better cards
This helps make up my mind on sending my Jordan's to PSA.
Ouch! That hurts, I can definitely sympathize with the grades from past experiences with my PSA bulk submissions.
Wow those grades are absolutely brutal... grader must be having a terrible day. Can't wait for AI grading services like AGS to take off so we don't have to deal with these inconsistencies.
Yeah, AI grading seems to be much more consistent than manual. I will definitely look into AGS now.
That first Jordan looked so nice, was thinking 9 or even maybe more.
I would bust out ALL of those and send them into somewhere else no lie
That is a good example there of psa controlling pop count, one 9 out of the entire box. How is it 10s was graded a long time ago. Has the grading changed even though on there website it has remained the same. Collectors need to wake up and stop using psa. 60 40 centering is a 10 so it says. It appears unless it is 50 50 now and perfeact all along with it get a 10. Psa either needs to change there grading scale to reflect there grades otherwise they will be in the past. I have seen this numerous times on my cards being graded by them along with numerous other. I for one will never use them again esp. with there outrageous price struture now as well. So long PSA welcome other grading companies.
I will not use them either. I just sent some cards to sgc. They are great for vintage baseball and have great turn around times.
Exactly. That was a good box I thought and looked well kept. To have one 9 in a box. Bullshit.
I used to eat that vintage gum in front of the kids in my card shop back in the day...it was like a comedy routine...it's basically compressed dust by then...
That was tough to watch, I just watched the opening today and was hoping you guys got some 10s in there, certainly thought I saw a few in there, hopefully you resubmitted a good portion of those cards and got better grading on em
I thought you guys were gonna get at least one Jordan 9 from watching the original video and to get a whole bunch of 7’s for the Rodman rookies was surprising to me too. PSA was tough on their grading for sure lol.
That’s why I prefer BGS...at least you know what the sub grades are and you aren’t guessing
This is perfect. It shows how naive the new hobby people are, expecting things coming straight from the pack to be Gems. PSA was not super hard on these, this guy just sent cards that were not gonna be Gems or 9's. Especially Fleer basketball where entire runs were cut badly and dinged before they were packed out. Also, is it any coincidence that ebay selling/listing has gone to shit now that this clown is involved with them? I think not
These days I think it's always better keeping them boxed. But there's always that chance of getting that 1 card that changes everything 🤣
I think PSA is grading harder recently, but I haven't experienced it personally thankfully. Just received back two 1988 Fleer a week ago and I got a PSA 9 Pippen and and PSA 10 Rodman. Both were purchased raw off of eBay!
Mark's legendary comb over. PSA 10!!!!!!!!
Please send to SGC as a service to your community. we'll start a go fund me!
Finally been waiting for.this video
I think your video had something to do with the value going up. Increased popularity.
Ok, I think it’s finally time someone said it. The ‘88 Fleer Jordan has got to be one of the worst looking cards in existence. Yes, the design of the 1988 Fleer set absolutely sucks. Everyone gets that. But the shot of Jordan himself. I mean, come ON. At the time this card was issued, Jordan was already the most popular player on the planet, near the absolute height of his abilities, with an endless supply of highlight reel photos to choose from. And Fleer ends up with this trash? A half torso mess that looks like Jordan is getting mugged or something? If it weren’t for the Bulls jersey, you might not even be able to tell he was playing basketball.
Totally agree! Most photographed player on the planet and they come up with that shit house photo
Yeah I bought a box of 1989 for 225 just before the chaos started. Got lot of nice ones but certainly no 10s I'd say maybe 5 9s at best and that between all cards maybe 1 psa 9 Jordan base maybe
Flawless, out of packaging, almost 30 years later and these 7 rankings. Can you submit to others?
That crunch was brutal
Wow... My last two submission were not that bad then. At least I hit four 9s out of 20 cards on my 1988 cards.
Most folks don't see surface issues on cards. It's all part of the difficulty of getting high grades. Late 80's card manufacturing was prehistoric. I opened three boxes of 88 Fleer and the centering was pretty hit and miss.
The crunch of the gum was awesome
I noticed in the box break video that most cards in the box had fraying on the top of the card edges. I wonder if this caused these grades.
I GOT SO MANY OFF CENTERED CARDS THAT GOT 8, 8.5, AND 9. SO THE CENTERING ISNT GOING TO GET YOU 8 OR 7 ON THESE PERFECT CARDS. PLEASE PLEASE 🙏 GET THESE REGRADED WITH CGC.
I've heard a lot of people say that they're sending their stuff to other graders because of psa's Pop count control if psa doesn't want any problems they should start specifying what's wrong with the cards when they send them back
Given the amount of extra time it would take to do that there's no chance that ever happens. Although, it would be nice!
@@birdsonthebat9452 it shouldn't take extra time while they're grading it their writing everything down
@@ericmartin2111 I don't think that's actually true (I'm actually fairly certain they don't do that). Each card gets a cursory look of no more than 30 seconds, it's a much faster process than you'd think. To provide some kind of written report with every card would probably triple the processing time of their backlog. It's just not realistic.
@@birdsonthebat9452 the grading process is different stages it's not just 30 seconds and the cards graded and I'm not saying they do it I'm saying they should do it to provide closure on their grading scales
@@ericmartin2111 It's incredibly fast. And while I don't disagree that that would be ideal, for sure, it's just not feasible, especially with their current backlog :/.
Wrapped and certified by who? I have some sealed boxes and sets I want to do this but psa and bgs don’t grade those. You suggested BB something but I could not make out exactly.... where can I get these sets graded as a box?
Baseball Card Exchange grades unopened boxes.
@@stevendelavega7670 🙏 thanks