In school, the vice principal told me I was lying because I looked up and to the right. While asking me to describe some schoolyard incident, I would need to imagine myself in a different position to be able to describe what they were asking for. Imagining yourself moving around in a 3D scene is a construction, but this lady seemed to think all constructed images are lies
@@shiro1744 Ooohhhh... an opportunity.😁 Could you describe the "access" of such a memory for you? I don't actually DO anything to recall. I get contextual flashes, almost like an amalgam of "clips" of me and my first car. So I just reference the color from those. Or even the registration may flash in my head and I see "gray" that was written on it for the body color.
Demon masculine Si on my part is also shocked it took her so long. I immediately would’ve launched off into, “Oh, it was a grey car, because I was going to get a white car, but when I got to the dealership the salesman convinced me to buy the other one, and I regretted getting the grey car as soon as I made the purchase. And then for the next month I told the story to all of my friends and they got tired of me ranting about my grey car. That was back in… November 2013, I think? It might have been December. No, it was November- yes! It was November because I remember picking my best friend up in the grey car for the first time, and we were going to a Thanksgiving party…” and so on and so forth. (I made up that story now. I’m sixteen and I don’t have my own car yet- I’ve only just learned to drive. Though it does sound like something that I would do, and if it had happened, that’s exactly how I’d recall it.)
@@sophiaredwood5825 Well Ne lead for sure! But... Your Ne is giving us a possibility of a future... when this was about recollecting the ACTUAL past. How sure can you be on the "though it does sound like something that I would do?" For example, what was the first book you read in high school? What happened when you recollected that? - Probably the same exact story you gave before with the car:D Also... Ne/Ti?
@@gooddaygene8355 Behold my attempt to quickly type out my unfiltered response to your question: What was the first book I read in high school? Hmm. I haven’t read too much recently- I used to devour books all the time, but lately I’ve found that I haven’t devoted much time to reading at all. Anyway, I’m not sure if I- oh, wait, I don’t know if this counts. But for summer reading before freshman year I had to read both A Wizard of Earthsea and another book out of a list of options. (I ended up picking Percy Jackson: The Lightning Thief because by some miracle, that was on the list. I hadn’t been allowed to read that book as a kid for faith-related reasons, but I was able to slip it by my parents and reclaim my childhood if I told them that the book was school required reading). Anyway, I read both of those throughout the summer (and read The Lightning Thief multiple times, since I wanted to fully enjoy the story before going back to annotate it). However, I read those before high school officially started, so I don’t know if those count. At the beginning of freshman year, I remember my English class wanted to do something where we read a book of our choice in class every Friday, so I picked up Rob Chernow’s biography of Alexander Hamilton, though the Friday reading didn’t last and I never finished it. Then the required reading for class was The Odyssey, which I read and loved. (I was the only one in class who actually read the book and didn’t go to Sparknotes instead.) The Lotus-eater chapter was my favorite. More irrelevant info: There was a written project we had to do on The Odyssey where we had to rewrite chapters in a modern-day setting with modern-day circumstances. As someone who writes in her free time, I was so excited for the project. I daydreamed and conceptualized my ideas for ages… but put off actually doing the writing until the day it was due. My entire paper was thousands of words long and I got a 97, but I always felt I deserved far less because it didn’t live up to the standard in my head. I wanted it to be so much better. I still have that project document open on my school Chromebook to this day- and it’s been about two years, I think. I feel ashamed of the grade I got and hope to rewrite that project. (-Which is an Fi thing, I’d have to guess. Internal standard always comes first, haha.) ^^So that’s that. Though I’m still IN high school, so it wasn’t that long ago. Demon masculine Si creates a timeline of my life. It’s so vivid and easy to pull from, and I often make it a game with myself to see how many details I can remember. When I got into OP, the first thing I was sure of before anything else was that I had masculine Si. (Though I have to admit, I’ve since met the SAVIOR masculine Si people, and those people genuinely terrify me with their memories. My masculine Si is a fun tool I can pull out every so often, but the organization they do is a conscious responsibility for them. They forget nothing!! It’s crazy.) The paragraph I wrote before was me trying to mimic my own thought processes and “I remember” tangents that I always seem to go on. (Which you now have a fair demonstration of.) Though I suppose you’re right when you say it’s more Ne than anything else, haha. Also, yep, lead Ne! Self-typed MM Ne/Fi CS/P(B). Apologies for the long tangents, though I hope they help in showing how I use my Si, haha.
@@Simon-kr2uu in the video, they are observing her physical movements, especially the eyes and where directly the face is looking, and as I understand it, the visual modalities are observable traits a cognitive function expresses body language (though not the only way).
Ive labeled myself as having unreasonably high standards. But watching this I now understand that it comes from the highly detailed visual projection in my head, sigh...
This is reminding of how in School, I'd have a plan for a Project/Assignment and the final product is not what I envisioned. And I still get a good review back and I'm confused because I feel it wasn't what I wanted. But then I had to learn to tell myself that people don't see what I see. So when I get a good grade back even though it's not my vision I must still be proud of it. -- not that I got many good grades.
This makes sooo much sense!! I feel bad for those who are in conversation with me because I try my best to maintain eye contact but struggle due to having to look up especially when trying to express myself in a way as to not offend others. I also tend to look down when I am “working through” something lol
I typed myself audio and you guys typed me audio but I love consuming and creating visual art. One thing that I was always fascinated by was how if I tried to pre-visualize something I was drawing it would turn out as an absolute disaster. The visualization part of my brain never really hooked up well to the doing part of my brain. So, to draw better, I had to learn to just let the textures and patterns form themselves without trying to dictate the final result. Another area that has stood out to me is that while my memories have a visual component, I often remember the visuals incorrectly. I will misremember a blue book being red or walk through a place I have been through for decades only to just realize a visual detail that I never noticed before. That said, I still feel pretty visual compared to most people. I feel like I worked out my visual muscle a lot as a child and I made it a second language. Shaved #MFNeFiCPBS
What you said about needing to let the drawing sort of flow out of you instead of planning first felt like masculine sensory to me, the audio is for feminine N right? So that would fit. I guess I'm seeing it from the opposite angle. I'm a composer and love working with audio, but when I play an instrument and just follow my hands the result is very elementary. I've had the exact opposite experience where I find that planning out my pieces is a lot more natural for me. I liked how you said it's like your visual brain has less processing power, because I guess we each have to find a process where we have more energy, and that's exactly how I feel now that I'm doing a lot more analysis and planning. It's really not even music anymore, it's just data science stuff, but I have so much more energy to do it.
She isn't looking at memories with her minds eye, she is looking *AWAY* from the person so the human in front of her doesn't distract from trying to remember. I do this all the time.
@@shiro1744 as a decider, you don’t want the tribe member to continue socializing with you, distracting you from the information you’re trying to retrieve from your mind.
@@shiro1744 I need a blank piece of something in order to visualise things, visualising a car (or any other object) on someone's body just seems weird 🤣
In my personal experience, I find that masculine sensors often get kinda mad if I'm not looking at them while talking becoz I'm looking up at the image.
I think I have masculine intuition. I study interior architecture and recently I’ve just been given a brief to design a bar. And I instantly started experiencing different visuals for what the bar could look like in my mind (before I’ve visited the site) but I said to myself don’t picture things too much yet as I need more information before I start to visualise what this place is going to look like, and I don’t want to get too set with a visual idea that’s not going to really end up being created. So I think what you guys were sort of suggesting about how it’s hard for us to sometimes let go of a visual idea is an interesting observation.
I'm a fantasy writer with masculine sensory (I think, if I understand it correctly) and this reminds me of what George R.R. Martin calls the "architect" vs "gardening" style of writing. Meaning the architect (Rowling) already knows what's going to happen and sets it up to fit the vision, while the gardener (Martin) plants lots of potential seeds and during the writing process some unfold organically...but this runs the risk of never finishing the damn book haha. I would say I'm definitely more of a "gardener" and my writing process reminds me of how Dave was talking about setting up a room.
That's super interesting! I'm a fiction writer too, but I'm definitely the architect type. I've noticed I write top down as opposed to bottom up, I only write if I know where it's going to go, the concept is already in my head and I write to give it physical shape. I'm really bad at expressing myself with poetry and such because that's bottom up, just start where you are right now and see where you go is not easy for me, and I get annoyed because I don't see an endpoint, and then double annoyed because to me spontaneity is never as strong writing as having a plan first that you then execute, so it's hard, there's no end in sight so it's pointless, and the end product will be crap anyway. Just giving my raw monkey brain judgements I'm Te Ni blast sleep, consume play. I assume my writing style matches my functions, the Te is wide and then the Ni narrows it down so that's why I'm a top-down thinker and learner.
@@frogjackethuman781 That's funny, poetry is the easiest type of writing for me and sometimes my book turns into too much of a poetry-like blob without much structure haha! Knowing the end point kills my momentum and that's why all the threads of my book are so disorganized. Total opposite problem. I'm Fi Ne consume sleep play (I think).
@@jeanette2475 I can see how it would turn out to be a blob! I wonder if writing in your style is like how my mom is with physical objects especially clothing and jewellery and shoes and purses, she's Fi Se so shes gather gather all the pretty things and fills the house! :)
This is interesting. I also write, and I thought I was masculine sensor, but watching again I think I'm feminine sensor. But in writing I'm more of a gardener, or even "gardener with a vision" if you will. My best writing happens when I have a clear goal/vision/concept in mind, but the path gets made as I go. Probably FM Fi-Si, and a notorious mumbler.
This is really interesting to me because I was noticing that Rowling is an architect. It startled me because I was trying to figure out why her books were so good, because I would look at the concrete details and see how undeveloped they were, but couldn't deny how interesting the universe she built it. The observer functions seem really relevant to art, but I'm still conflicted because it seems like my approach might be the opposite of what my type would be good at. It seems that I have M S but Savior N. So I get a lot more energy from using my N and being an architect, but I guess I still have to find a way to be a gardener and let my M S go for a walk. This all comes down to the inspiration itself, which for me, as a savior masculine Fi user, is that function. I've only recently started to understand it, but I think the essence of Fi is the shape of the self as a measure of all external things. So I have to develop a creative process that perfectly matches my type in order to be successful. I guess it's a lot easier for people who's types naturally match the archetype of whatever they want to be, but my type is in between them.... The animals complicate things, because I guess someone could be savior NT and savior Fi depending on the order. I guess they'd be sleep blast something something...
wow yeah, that worked fast. 15 minutes after I watched this video, I found myself disengage from staring up and to the right. I immediately remembered this video and asked myself what I was picturing. I was describing something as being metaphorically "like a hurricane", and picturing that kind of physically and kind of abstractly in the same image. This was over within a second, and the instant after-effect was something equally visual. I guess I still had the eidetic image of corner of the room I was staring at in my head, after I had looked away from it. And I think the eidetic memory in physical vision and the hurricane visualization in psychological vision kind of melded together. I had a faint mental image of my hardwood floor going distantly to the door, and it kind of looked like a sea. And crossed with that was the hurricane: the image was of a dark and stormy ocean extending outward. It mixed both the lightness of the room and the darkness of the hurricane in what seemed like the same picture. Like the way an area can appear to be both dark and indistinct and yet also brightly lit at the same time when lightning strikes. Your brain is used to the sun or street lamps lighting things, so shadows are in places it doesn't expect them to be, and aren't in places it does expect them to be. The effect can be... darkbright. That's the closest I can describe it: like lightning striking out in the sea at night: bright and striking, but still dark and endless. Although it was a faint picture, the image still felt very enveloping and isolating and dreamlike. It was like the image being faint didn't mean that physical images from my actual vision were penetrating through it, as if it had been a reflection on your windshield that you can only faintly see over the actual road. It was faint in the sense that all I could really see when I tried to picture it was blackness mixed a brighter but still very dreamy image: it was very visually absorbing to pay attention to, despite being ethereal and fairly indistinct
I have been watching your vids for quite some time now (since 2020?) and I feel like I know enough to understand the concepts, but I keep on watching your vids because there might be some new concepts to be learned AHAHAHAHA. Good thing Dave is funny and Shan's laugh is making me laugh so I guess everyone is happy?
M Se here, I measure all my furniture and the room, make shapes to scale in PowerPoint and only when I decide what works by doing that will I start to move stuff
Regarding mumbling, I'm Blast last, CS, FF, Decider. So I reckon I'm doomed to being unable to promote my book. With feminine sensory, I can't even remember what's in my book even though I've been working on it for 20 years. And all this gets misinterpreted as failure to master the material, whereas dimwit blasters get misinterpreted as having mastered their material. Therefore, I think the OP system really needs a remedial section. Someone needs to research ways to help people who are weak in an important area. Dave and Shan give little tips, but that's lame. It needs to be serious and deep. I can imagine a community situation or a retreat where someone who is blast last, for example, walks around with a sign dangling on their chest saying, "BLASTER". Then every time someone passes them by, they are pushed and helped to blast something. Also, each strength should be investigated. For example, someone should ask blasters how they do it. What do they feel before and during a blast session? What are they thinking before and during a blast session? Drill down to the details.
loled a bit when Dave tryed to recall the memory of this guy at 3:16 and he moved he´s eyes like in the diagram... Now I´ll just space out from hearing people so I can focus and look to where they send their eyes when talking so I can recall the diagram ahahahaha...
That last part is me listening to Kanye's rant 7 years later after what he said has happened and being like, "oh, now I get it, y'all were to hard on him" Or listening to clips.
Oh wow, idk what type I am in this system but I do know one thing, I'm very visual! I'm always looking around when thinking and talking, I'm so bad at expressing things concisely. I'm always asking things like "ya know?" "If that makes any sense?" I'm always forgetting words too, I guess talking to me is a bit of a game of charades sometimes😅
If you ask someone to imagine the floor being a different colour they will quickly look up and then commonly look down and at the floor kinda like its a different colour When I point out a person glanced up quickly they will often say they didn't, followed by 'oh maybe I did', followed by 'how do you notice this stuff' When I do it this way I might even suggest to someone not to look up, and ask them why they looked up when I asked them not to (Like a playful rib if that's if they enjoy that kind of thing) And it because they need to do that before they can project out in front of them (typically with defocused eyes)
Rely on audio/visual pretty heavily. Anytime I think about physics concepts, I prefer to visualize it and gravitate towards geometrical intuition over algebraic. The hardest physical concepts are the ones that gets so abstract that physical intuition is lost (usually moves to mathematical intuition only). Quantum Mechanics, entropy, principle of stationary action are some of my most feared concepts in physics because there is too little physical intuition
… ever thought of drawing a floor plan on a sheet of paper?!… with measurements… and then put the outlines of the furniture proportionally on to that drawing?…
Maybe unrelated but I really relate to the clip in the beginning in the sense that if someone asked me what my favorite book was in the last year I would have a hard time recalling because of my feminine demon Fi, so if you ask me what my favorite of anything is I have no clue and find it extremely hard for me to answer such a direct question about my feelings, then of course people want you to expand and give a full sentence but I don't know what else to say it took all my energy just to come up with finding what I liked! Now you're asking me why, I have to dip into my Fi again?! Haha So as a Ni savior when I was younger at one point I tried to think of all the questions that someone could possibly ask me about everything I like, favorite food, favorite movie, favorite music, etc, so that if it ever came up in real conversation I could just pull the prepared files that was easier for me than actually recalling it live haha. I still struggle today!
I sooo relate to this. I don't get attached to things easily, so usually there isn't any depth to what I like (it's kind of a binary thing, i either like it or i don't). Worst part is when someone asks, name 5 things, and I can't even recall 5 things of anything. Writing a list helps, but unfortunately tastes change over time 😅
I really still cannot figure it out. I am visual since I remember everythjg through pictures, I am an observer and I do care about things and yes I get mad at thigs and sometimes smash when I feel like the world is conspiring against me xD. So, I feel like I am a masculine Se but at the same time I am visual which is Feminine modality. My intuition at some points can be masculine but as a double decider i usually see things from different sides and not rigidly and I do care about the facts... someone helps😢
Hmm, new terminology for me to learn. I don't get clear pictures in the sensory world. I would probably decorate in layers, but I wouldn't necessarily measure exactly for each piece. Room size is X. Okay couch is x feet long and x feet wide. I like it, I buy it. Figure out the rest as I go.😀
The visual vs audio/kinesthetic thing is still strange to me. I feel like I'm really high on both. I'm leaning to the conclusion that it's masculine sensory, and that my visual memories and imaginations are a sensory thing rather than an intuitive thing. The way you describe the masculine N thing, where you imagine something that doesn't match reality, further suggests to me that I'm masculine sensory, since my spatial awareness of spaces tends to be spot-on. I can look at an object and visually estimate at centimeter level whether it would fit in that room on the other side of the building. I'm pretty sure I'm Ti/Ni MM, so maybe that's why my sensory experiences have such an intuitive feel about them? Provided my self-typing is correct, I would roughly describe it as the Ni and Se blending together all double-observerly, with the Ni being the slightly more assertive of the two, but since it's feminine it's all "insecure" and "collaborative" so it respects everything the Se is saying, while the Se confidently trusts the Ni to handle the conclusions and overhead, even though the Ni doesn't trust itself, but it accepts the masculine confidence from the Se. They seem like quite the dynamic duo together, making it hard to logically pull them apart. At least that's roughly how I'd explain that they somehow both seem masculine. This perspective also seems pretty compatible with the whole concept of double-observers handling the observing so easily, if this is how smoothly the functions work together and encourage each other. I thought for a very long time that I was Ni at the top (in part because MBTI doesn't have enough coins so it dumps all the sleep-first behaviors into the IJ archetype) because it seemed like the most competent function and I guess all the Se aspects felt like part of the Ni because they're so merged. After a long time it was the M/F energies that allowed me to (Ti...) eliminate all the wrong options and crack the puzzle to end up at MM-Ti/Ni-SC/P(B). Anyway, just thinking out loud. Again.
I relate to this a lot. I always assumed I had masculine N because I have so many classic IJ traits, but most of those have to do with actual concrete things. Trash has to be thrown away, things have to be in their place, etc. I also know that I'm audio, not visual, and all of this is leading me to think I might have F Ni M Se. What you said about double observing really makes sense in that context, because I am extremely confident in what I observe, but people also notice that I like weird things, or will be wrong and not admit it. I'm extremely stubborn, which I thought was M N, but maybe it's M Di, because I feel that people notice that they can't argue with me, which is true, but just show me the facts and I will instantly change my mind...
Lmfao this sounds so bad like my image recalling. MNi is a bch when it recreates badly. Someone asks me something causing me to recall and I instantly get a picture I’m looking at but a big issue with that is both - is it currently accurate- or is the image I’m seeing from a different time than they’re asking? Or is it really like that at all??? If there is ANY gap within the visual information my Ni is ON IT to fill it in with whatever the ladida it wants- I have to refer to visual and mental thought landmarks of time to decide if I’m recalling accurately or need to try to cycle through images of the state I’ve seen it in - but if I don’t have those landmarks my Ni is doing fxk all like this is it bro you gotta trust me- and people end up looking at me like 😠 you lied! Why would you leave this info out or why would you lie about this??? Suspect FF NiFi SCBP
Ohh okey then i have feminine intuition somewhere. My dad is good with physical stuff (esfp) and builds a real thing just like he created it too look like in his head. And im like, wait even if he has ni inferior, how can he create this picture? I'm like i like visualizing a lot, but the real thing will always change and im fine with that, for me its totally normal that imagining and reality is not the same. Are masculine intuitives if they watch porn or want mimic their inner picture just like they wish a danger?
Shes a 6, and you guys are seeing a lot of motivation micro expressions that have nothing to do with cognition, like her fear expression of eyes moving all over.
What the fuck I had a burgundy car and then I crashed it at like 10 mph btw, my ISTJ dad put the original engine into the same make and model made a year later and it was green. I crashed my burgundy car and it turned green. Hold on I need to back up the video I just got distracted tryna write this stupid comment.
Wish you had an easy to digest formula.. maybe put it into colour format..or maybe give your terms more intuitive names… like Jesus for Fe.. or Karen for Fi..
@@nataliefluckiger6568 If Jesus had Fi then he would necessarily also have Te… So his understanding of the bible would of been shallow, but all of his mission was about interpreting the times (Ni) and a deeper understanding of the laws (Ti)… He also couldn’t be an introvert because then he couldn’t do justice to his followers if they become many… imagine Jesus having an introvert burnout before having to deliver a speech to a congregation…
In school, the vice principal told me I was lying because I looked up and to the right. While asking me to describe some schoolyard incident, I would need to imagine myself in a different position to be able to describe what they were asking for. Imagining yourself moving around in a 3D scene is a construction, but this lady seemed to think all constructed images are lies
One would call such people dumb, because that’s exactly what they are, but those working in a school (nearly) always are dumb, so.
Asking an ENTJ an Si detail such as first car's color... laughter ensues😂🤣😂
And stupid me with masc Si is just flabbergasted that it took her thirty seconds to remember something so incredibly simple….
@@shiro1744 Ooohhhh... an opportunity.😁 Could you describe the "access" of such a memory for you?
I don't actually DO anything to recall. I get contextual flashes, almost like an amalgam of "clips" of me and my first car. So I just reference the color from those. Or even the registration may flash in my head and I see "gray" that was written on it for the body color.
Demon masculine Si on my part is also shocked it took her so long. I immediately would’ve launched off into, “Oh, it was a grey car, because I was going to get a white car, but when I got to the dealership the salesman convinced me to buy the other one, and I regretted getting the grey car as soon as I made the purchase. And then for the next month I told the story to all of my friends and they got tired of me ranting about my grey car. That was back in… November 2013, I think? It might have been December. No, it was November- yes! It was November because I remember picking my best friend up in the grey car for the first time, and we were going to a Thanksgiving party…” and so on and so forth.
(I made up that story now. I’m sixteen and I don’t have my own car yet- I’ve only just learned to drive. Though it does sound like something that I would do, and if it had happened, that’s exactly how I’d recall it.)
@@sophiaredwood5825 Well Ne lead for sure! But... Your Ne is giving us a possibility of a future... when this was about recollecting the ACTUAL past. How sure can you be on the "though it does sound like something that I would do?"
For example, what was the first book you read in high school? What happened when you recollected that? - Probably the same exact story you gave before with the car:D
Also... Ne/Ti?
@@gooddaygene8355 Behold my attempt to quickly type out my unfiltered response to your question:
What was the first book I read in high school? Hmm. I haven’t read too much recently- I used to devour books all the time, but lately I’ve found that I haven’t devoted much time to reading at all. Anyway, I’m not sure if I- oh, wait, I don’t know if this counts. But for summer reading before freshman year I had to read both A Wizard of Earthsea and another book out of a list of options. (I ended up picking Percy Jackson: The Lightning Thief because by some miracle, that was on the list. I hadn’t been allowed to read that book as a kid for faith-related reasons, but I was able to slip it by my parents and reclaim my childhood if I told them that the book was school required reading). Anyway, I read both of those throughout the summer (and read The Lightning Thief multiple times, since I wanted to fully enjoy the story before going back to annotate it).
However, I read those before high school officially started, so I don’t know if those count. At the beginning of freshman year, I remember my English class wanted to do something where we read a book of our choice in class every Friday, so I picked up Rob Chernow’s biography of Alexander Hamilton, though the Friday reading didn’t last and I never finished it. Then the required reading for class was The Odyssey, which I read and loved. (I was the only one in class who actually read the book and didn’t go to Sparknotes instead.) The Lotus-eater chapter was my favorite.
More irrelevant info:
There was a written project we had to do on The Odyssey where we had to rewrite chapters in a modern-day setting with modern-day circumstances. As someone who writes in her free time, I was so excited for the project. I daydreamed and conceptualized my ideas for ages… but put off actually doing the writing until the day it was due. My entire paper was thousands of words long and I got a 97, but I always felt I deserved far less because it didn’t live up to the standard in my head. I wanted it to be so much better. I still have that project document open on my school Chromebook to this day- and it’s been about two years, I think. I feel ashamed of the grade I got and hope to rewrite that project. (-Which is an Fi thing, I’d have to guess. Internal standard always comes first, haha.)
^^So that’s that. Though I’m still IN high school, so it wasn’t that long ago.
Demon masculine Si creates a timeline of my life. It’s so vivid and easy to pull from, and I often make it a game with myself to see how many details I can remember. When I got into OP, the first thing I was sure of before anything else was that I had masculine Si. (Though I have to admit, I’ve since met the SAVIOR masculine Si people, and those people genuinely terrify me with their memories. My masculine Si is a fun tool I can pull out every so often, but the organization they do is a conscious responsibility for them. They forget nothing!! It’s crazy.)
The paragraph I wrote before was me trying to mimic my own thought processes and “I remember” tangents that I always seem to go on. (Which you now have a fair demonstration of.) Though I suppose you’re right when you say it’s more Ne than anything else, haha.
Also, yep, lead Ne! Self-typed MM Ne/Fi CS/P(B). Apologies for the long tangents, though I hope they help in showing how I use my Si, haha.
Excellent video. Don’t get discouraged new ppl… it takes a while to click but then you see it everywhere! Thanks Dave and Shan.
Someone care to explain what visual modalities actually is? all they’re doing as usual is just rambling on and on lol
@@Simon-kr2uu in the video, they are observing her physical movements, especially the eyes and where directly the face is looking, and as I understand it, the visual modalities are observable traits a cognitive function expresses body language (though not the only way).
Who was this lord of the rings guy? I woke up at 3 in the morning and was trying to google it. It’s stuck on my brain.
@@Simon-kr2uu yea these video really have become bad
Ive labeled myself as having unreasonably high standards. But watching this I now understand that it comes from the highly detailed visual projection in my head, sigh...
Would you be more specific, i think i might be the same way, but i didn’t understand all of it.
Do you mean having a crystal clear vision of what the end product "must" look like that reality keeps on failing to live up to that vision?
Everything should be the way you imagine it
wow this is me
This is reminding of how in School, I'd have a plan for a Project/Assignment and the final product is not what I envisioned.
And I still get a good review back and I'm confused because I feel it wasn't what I wanted. But then I had to learn to tell myself that people don't see what I see.
So when I get a good grade back even though it's not my vision I must still be proud of it.
-- not that I got many good grades.
This makes sooo much sense!! I feel bad for those who are in conversation with me because I try my best to maintain eye contact but struggle due to having to look up especially when trying to express myself in a way as to not offend others. I also tend to look down when I am “working through” something lol
Mubler... I never acknowledge that I'm one, I'm just literally acting out my definition of "thinking out loud".
I typed myself audio and you guys typed me audio but I love consuming and creating visual art. One thing that I was always fascinated by was how if I tried to pre-visualize something I was drawing it would turn out as an absolute disaster. The visualization part of my brain never really hooked up well to the doing part of my brain. So, to draw better, I had to learn to just let the textures and patterns form themselves without trying to dictate the final result.
Another area that has stood out to me is that while my memories have a visual component, I often remember the visuals incorrectly. I will misremember a blue book being red or walk through a place I have been through for decades only to just realize a visual detail that I never noticed before.
That said, I still feel pretty visual compared to most people. I feel like I worked out my visual muscle a lot as a child and I made it a second language.
Shaved #MFNeFiCPBS
What you said about needing to let the drawing sort of flow out of you instead of planning first felt like masculine sensory to me, the audio is for feminine N right? So that would fit. I guess I'm seeing it from the opposite angle.
I'm a composer and love working with audio, but when I play an instrument and just follow my hands the result is very elementary. I've had the exact opposite experience where I find that planning out my pieces is a lot more natural for me. I liked how you said it's like your visual brain has less processing power, because I guess we each have to find a process where we have more energy, and that's exactly how I feel now that I'm doing a lot more analysis and planning. It's really not even music anymore, it's just data science stuff, but I have so much more energy to do it.
She isn't looking at memories with her minds eye, she is looking *AWAY* from the person so the human in front of her doesn't distract from trying to remember.
I do this all the time.
So why would looking at someone else distract you from your memory?
@@shiro1744 as a decider, you don’t want the tribe member to continue socializing with you, distracting you from the information you’re trying to retrieve from your mind.
Yea I have aphantasia (no minds eye) and I look away for that reason.
@Max Mutzi wha? no I didn’t, I have experienced this myself.
@@shiro1744 I need a blank piece of something in order to visualise things, visualising a car (or any other object) on someone's body just seems weird 🤣
I literally don't know anything else about my personality other than the fact that I have this.🙃
No doubt... ahm.. hm.. yeah
Ten chairs and a TRAPEZIUS? 😂
I’m very concerned about what is happening in that room.
Yeah those shoulder muscles take up a lot of space. 😆
In my personal experience, I find that masculine sensors often get kinda mad if I'm not looking at them while talking becoz I'm looking up at the image.
Wow, that could actually be real
0:30 i love Shan cringing at Dave's spelling mistake xd
I think I have masculine intuition. I study interior architecture and recently I’ve just been given a brief to design a bar. And I instantly started experiencing different visuals for what the bar could look like in my mind (before I’ve visited the site) but I said to myself don’t picture things too much yet as I need more information before I start to visualise what this place is going to look like, and I don’t want to get too set with a visual idea that’s not going to really end up being created.
So I think what you guys were sort of suggesting about how it’s hard for us to sometimes let go of a visual idea is an interesting observation.
JK Rowling was a Mubble all along.
😂
Hahahaha
I'm a fantasy writer with masculine sensory (I think, if I understand it correctly) and this reminds me of what George R.R. Martin calls the "architect" vs "gardening" style of writing. Meaning the architect (Rowling) already knows what's going to happen and sets it up to fit the vision, while the gardener (Martin) plants lots of potential seeds and during the writing process some unfold organically...but this runs the risk of never finishing the damn book haha. I would say I'm definitely more of a "gardener" and my writing process reminds me of how Dave was talking about setting up a room.
That's super interesting! I'm a fiction writer too, but I'm definitely the architect type. I've noticed I write top down as opposed to bottom up, I only write if I know where it's going to go, the concept is already in my head and I write to give it physical shape.
I'm really bad at expressing myself with poetry and such because that's bottom up, just start where you are right now and see where you go is not easy for me, and I get annoyed because I don't see an endpoint, and then double annoyed because to me spontaneity is never as strong writing as having a plan first that you then execute, so it's hard, there's no end in sight so it's pointless, and the end product will be crap anyway. Just giving my raw monkey brain judgements
I'm Te Ni blast sleep, consume play. I assume my writing style matches my functions, the Te is wide and then the Ni narrows it down so that's why I'm a top-down thinker and learner.
@@frogjackethuman781 That's funny, poetry is the easiest type of writing for me and sometimes my book turns into too much of a poetry-like blob without much structure haha! Knowing the end point kills my momentum and that's why all the threads of my book are so disorganized. Total opposite problem. I'm Fi Ne consume sleep play (I think).
@@jeanette2475 I can see how it would turn out to be a blob! I wonder if writing in your style is like how my mom is with physical objects especially clothing and jewellery and shoes and purses, she's Fi Se so shes gather gather all the pretty things and fills the house! :)
This is interesting. I also write, and I thought I was masculine sensor, but watching again I think I'm feminine sensor. But in writing I'm more of a gardener, or even "gardener with a vision" if you will.
My best writing happens when I have a clear goal/vision/concept in mind, but the path gets made as I go.
Probably FM Fi-Si, and a notorious mumbler.
This is really interesting to me because I was noticing that Rowling is an architect. It startled me because I was trying to figure out why her books were so good, because I would look at the concrete details and see how undeveloped they were, but couldn't deny how interesting the universe she built it.
The observer functions seem really relevant to art, but I'm still conflicted because it seems like my approach might be the opposite of what my type would be good at. It seems that I have M S but Savior N. So I get a lot more energy from using my N and being an architect, but I guess I still have to find a way to be a gardener and let my M S go for a walk.
This all comes down to the inspiration itself, which for me, as a savior masculine Fi user, is that function. I've only recently started to understand it, but I think the essence of Fi is the shape of the self as a measure of all external things. So I have to develop a creative process that perfectly matches my type in order to be successful. I guess it's a lot easier for people who's types naturally match the archetype of whatever they want to be, but my type is in between them....
The animals complicate things, because I guess someone could be savior NT and savior Fi depending on the order. I guess they'd be sleep blast something something...
wow yeah, that worked fast. 15 minutes after I watched this video, I found myself disengage from staring up and to the right. I immediately remembered this video and asked myself what I was picturing. I was describing something as being metaphorically "like a hurricane", and picturing that kind of physically and kind of abstractly in the same image.
This was over within a second, and the instant after-effect was something equally visual. I guess I still had the eidetic image of corner of the room I was staring at in my head, after I had looked away from it. And I think the eidetic memory in physical vision and the hurricane visualization in psychological vision kind of melded together.
I had a faint mental image of my hardwood floor going distantly to the door, and it kind of looked like a sea. And crossed with that was the hurricane: the image was of a dark and stormy ocean extending outward. It mixed both the lightness of the room and the darkness of the hurricane in what seemed like the same picture. Like the way an area can appear to be both dark and indistinct and yet also brightly lit at the same time when lightning strikes. Your brain is used to the sun or street lamps lighting things, so shadows are in places it doesn't expect them to be, and aren't in places it does expect them to be. The effect can be... darkbright. That's the closest I can describe it: like lightning striking out in the sea at night: bright and striking, but still dark and endless.
Although it was a faint picture, the image still felt very enveloping and isolating and dreamlike. It was like the image being faint didn't mean that physical images from my actual vision were penetrating through it, as if it had been a reflection on your windshield that you can only faintly see over the actual road. It was faint in the sense that all I could really see when I tried to picture it was blackness mixed a brighter but still very dreamy image: it was very visually absorbing to pay attention to, despite being ethereal and fairly indistinct
Can you talk about appearance and personalities? You have mentioned it a few times, I'd like to know more
You'd probably need to pay for their classes where I'm guessing they already covered it, these videos are basically just excerpts from them
I have been watching your vids for quite some time now (since 2020?) and I feel like I know enough to understand the concepts, but I keep on watching your vids because there might be some new concepts to be learned AHAHAHAHA. Good thing Dave is funny and Shan's laugh is making me laugh so I guess everyone is happy?
You don’t have to be happy to be happy..
Something similar is happening to me, is this a consume last struggle?
SC/CS = Mope xD xD xD I'm dyingggggg xDDDD
Billie eilish Looking up all the time ends up being MM 👀
M Se here, I measure all my furniture and the room, make shapes to scale in PowerPoint and only when I decide what works by doing that will I start to move stuff
I just experienced that in an interview. But once I got started I was fine 😁
Love this.
"Handsome ESTJ guy in 'Lord of the Rings'" -- I'm ashamed that I can't figure it out based on this description alone.
I'm pretty sure it's boromir
It's Gimli, of course!
Gotta be Sean Bean yeah
It's Viggo Mortensen.
@@georgecataloni4720 lol
Regarding mumbling, I'm Blast last, CS, FF, Decider. So I reckon I'm doomed to being unable to promote my book. With feminine sensory, I can't even remember what's in my book even though I've been working on it for 20 years. And all this gets misinterpreted as failure to master the material, whereas dimwit blasters get misinterpreted as having mastered their material. Therefore, I think the OP system really needs a remedial section. Someone needs to research ways to help people who are weak in an important area. Dave and Shan give little tips, but that's lame. It needs to be serious and deep. I can imagine a community situation or a retreat where someone who is blast last, for example, walks around with a sign dangling on their chest saying, "BLASTER". Then every time someone passes them by, they are pushed and helped to blast something. Also, each strength should be investigated. For example, someone should ask blasters how they do it. What do they feel before and during a blast session? What are they thinking before and during a blast session? Drill down to the details.
loled a bit when Dave tryed to recall the memory of this guy at 3:16 and he moved he´s eyes like in the diagram...
Now I´ll just space out from hearing people so I can focus and look to where they send their eyes when talking so I can recall the diagram ahahahaha...
I used to drive a Ford Escapade back in 2009, before it was a status symbol to ride your bike everywhere.
That last part is me listening to Kanye's rant 7 years later after what he said has happened and being like, "oh, now I get it, y'all were to hard on him" Or listening to clips.
Oh wow, idk what type I am in this system but I do know one thing, I'm very visual! I'm always looking around when thinking and talking, I'm so bad at expressing things concisely. I'm always asking things like "ya know?" "If that makes any sense?" I'm always forgetting words too, I guess talking to me is a bit of a game of charades sometimes😅
That is Me to the T
Not sure my type either I keep getting lost with all this information and trying to figure it out
random question, but have you considered making any playlists in your channel for the theory videos?
Shan did it she looked up and left to recall then right to draw
If you ask someone to imagine the floor being a different colour they will quickly look up and then commonly look down and at the floor kinda like its a different colour
When I point out a person glanced up quickly they will often say they didn't, followed by 'oh maybe I did', followed by 'how do you notice this stuff'
When I do it this way I might even suggest to someone not to look up, and ask them why they looked up when I asked them not to (Like a playful rib if that's if they enjoy that kind of thing)
And it because they need to do that before they can project out in front of them (typically with defocused eyes)
Rely on audio/visual pretty heavily. Anytime I think about physics concepts, I prefer to visualize it and gravitate towards geometrical intuition over algebraic. The hardest physical concepts are the ones that gets so abstract that physical intuition is lost (usually moves to mathematical intuition only). Quantum Mechanics, entropy, principle of stationary action are some of my most feared concepts in physics because there is too little physical intuition
Imo meditation builds physical intuition in the later areas you mentioned
@@John-vc8qr how would one meditate?
i literally tested why gravity was a vector by doing an experiment and just presumed this
… ever thought of drawing a floor plan on a sheet of paper?!… with measurements… and then put the outlines of the furniture proportionally on to that drawing?…
The ENTJ Aux Ni goal. Now, that Ni has it, Te will take the lead .
so, what is staring straight ahead while blinking your eyes?
Lol, my Ni is so very masculine. Some of my nastiest relationship fights have been over paint color. Or couches.
Imagine Derren Brown mastering this eye movement stuff. He will be able to mindread 🧠
Can you guys look at some kobe Bryant videos and do his blast sleep play order? Was he Ni te or ni fi?
Great video 😂
Maybe unrelated but I really relate to the clip in the beginning in the sense that if someone asked me what my favorite book was in the last year I would have a hard time recalling because of my feminine demon Fi, so if you ask me what my favorite of anything is I have no clue and find it extremely hard for me to answer such a direct question about my feelings, then of course people want you to expand and give a full sentence but I don't know what else to say it took all my energy just to come up with finding what I liked! Now you're asking me why, I have to dip into my Fi again?! Haha
So as a Ni savior when I was younger at one point I tried to think of all the questions that someone could possibly ask me about everything I like, favorite food, favorite movie, favorite music, etc, so that if it ever came up in real conversation I could just pull the prepared files that was easier for me than actually recalling it live haha. I still struggle today!
I sooo relate to this. I don't get attached to things easily, so usually there isn't any depth to what I like (it's kind of a binary thing, i either like it or i don't).
Worst part is when someone asks, name 5 things, and I can't even recall 5 things of anything.
Writing a list helps, but unfortunately tastes change over time 😅
When I do that with my eyes I get distracted by what’s under my brow
Please do a video on Ryan Hughes. Look him up on UA-cam. Professional Dirt Bike Racer. Dave would absolutely love this guy
@objectivepersonality
Can you pls make a video about ENTJ in mariage/ relationship with ENFP? I would really love some info about it.
I really still cannot figure it out. I am visual since I remember everythjg through pictures, I am an observer and I do care about things and yes I get mad at thigs and sometimes smash when I feel like the world is conspiring against me xD. So, I feel like I am a masculine Se but at the same time I am visual which is Feminine modality. My intuition at some points can be masculine but as a double decider i usually see things from different sides and not rigidly and I do care about the facts... someone helps😢
Is it possible to have visual memory and be masculine sensory?
Hmm, new terminology for me to learn. I don't get clear pictures in the sensory world. I would probably decorate in layers, but I wouldn't necessarily measure exactly for each piece. Room size is X. Okay couch is x feet long and x feet wide. I like it, I buy it. Figure out the rest as I go.😀
Definitely (Se or Ne) gather over organise(Si or Ni)
@@hollo0o583 I'm INFJ, so I guess that would be Se.😊
The visual vs audio/kinesthetic thing is still strange to me. I feel like I'm really high on both. I'm leaning to the conclusion that it's masculine sensory, and that my visual memories and imaginations are a sensory thing rather than an intuitive thing. The way you describe the masculine N thing, where you imagine something that doesn't match reality, further suggests to me that I'm masculine sensory, since my spatial awareness of spaces tends to be spot-on. I can look at an object and visually estimate at centimeter level whether it would fit in that room on the other side of the building.
I'm pretty sure I'm Ti/Ni MM, so maybe that's why my sensory experiences have such an intuitive feel about them? Provided my self-typing is correct, I would roughly describe it as the Ni and Se blending together all double-observerly, with the Ni being the slightly more assertive of the two, but since it's feminine it's all "insecure" and "collaborative" so it respects everything the Se is saying, while the Se confidently trusts the Ni to handle the conclusions and overhead, even though the Ni doesn't trust itself, but it accepts the masculine confidence from the Se. They seem like quite the dynamic duo together, making it hard to logically pull them apart. At least that's roughly how I'd explain that they somehow both seem masculine.
This perspective also seems pretty compatible with the whole concept of double-observers handling the observing so easily, if this is how smoothly the functions work together and encourage each other. I thought for a very long time that I was Ni at the top (in part because MBTI doesn't have enough coins so it dumps all the sleep-first behaviors into the IJ archetype) because it seemed like the most competent function and I guess all the Se aspects felt like part of the Ni because they're so merged. After a long time it was the M/F energies that allowed me to (Ti...) eliminate all the wrong options and crack the puzzle to end up at MM-Ti/Ni-SC/P(B).
Anyway, just thinking out loud. Again.
I relate to this a lot. I always assumed I had masculine N because I have so many classic IJ traits, but most of those have to do with actual concrete things. Trash has to be thrown away, things have to be in their place, etc. I also know that I'm audio, not visual, and all of this is leading me to think I might have F Ni M Se. What you said about double observing really makes sense in that context, because I am extremely confident in what I observe, but people also notice that I like weird things, or will be wrong and not admit it. I'm extremely stubborn, which I thought was M N, but maybe it's M Di, because I feel that people notice that they can't argue with me, which is true, but just show me the facts and I will instantly change my mind...
Is the ability to visualize clearly masculine then? Since feminine is movable it would make sense then that visualizing would be harder.
So I'm confused. Would masculine Se remember visual details with great accuracy? Or is that feminine.
Lmfao this sounds so bad like my image recalling. MNi is a bch when it recreates badly. Someone asks me something causing me to recall and I instantly get a picture I’m looking at but a big issue with that is both - is it currently accurate- or is the image I’m seeing from a different time than they’re asking? Or is it really like that at all??? If there is ANY gap within the visual information my Ni is ON IT to fill it in with whatever the ladida it wants- I have to refer to visual and mental thought landmarks of time to decide if I’m recalling accurately or need to try to cycle through images of the state I’ve seen it in - but if I don’t have those landmarks my Ni is doing fxk all like this is it bro you gotta trust me- and people end up looking at me like 😠 you lied! Why would you leave this info out or why would you lie about this???
Suspect FF NiFi SCBP
Where's this from
Interrogators working for the FBI and MI5 etc, get a baseline first for eye movements because everyone is different.
But it looks marvelous
0:18 that isn’t even that bad! It’ll be interesting sending in my typing video cuz you guys will probably be cracking up the whole time
why am i getting called out (CS/blast third) ISTP
My mom tried to put me in a speech class because she said I mumbled to badly. If I had a nickel for every time I heard “ARTICULATE YOUR WORDS”. 😒
Ohh okey then i have feminine intuition somewhere. My dad is good with physical stuff (esfp) and builds a real thing just like he created it too look like in his head.
And im like, wait even if he has ni inferior, how can he create this picture?
I'm like i like visualizing a lot, but the real thing will always change and im fine with that, for me its totally normal that imagining and reality is not the same. Are masculine intuitives if they watch porn or want mimic their inner picture just like they wish a danger?
I care stop fing with the tribe Dave 😂😂😂JK
Please please PLEASE ORGANIZE YOUR CONTENT!!!! 😭😭😣😣😣😭😭😭😭😭 You have such greeeat stuff but its HELL making sense of it or referring anyone here!!!
you could make your own playlists of their stuff. but it would be nice having their stuff already organized and on their channel!
Shes a 6, and you guys are seeing a lot of motivation micro expressions that have nothing to do with cognition, like her fear expression of eyes moving all over.
Who is the handsome ESTJ guy?
Aragorn
Viggo Mortensen, aka Aragorn :)
Wow this video was made specifically to make fun of me 🤣
Pretty sure they're talking about Boromir. Let me know if this is true.
No, it's Viggo.
@@shiro1744 It's the beautiful uruk'hai of the white hand.
Great guess, but it's Viggo Mortensen who they typed as #FMTeSiBSCP, my exact type opposite.
@@IndieAuthorX ahhh I see 🤔. People so often assume he is ISTP I wonder why. Really isn't any display of tribe out to get me syndrome.
They're talking about Viggo Mortensen (Aragorn)
MUBILERS. come on. :)
What the fuck I had a burgundy car and then I crashed it at like 10 mph btw, my ISTJ dad put the original engine into the same make and model made a year later and it was green. I crashed my burgundy car and it turned green.
Hold on I need to back up the video I just got distracted tryna write this stupid comment.
Is he trying to spell mumbler?
Rowling's Ti is so prominent
oj tak byczq
Oh it's time for the worst mubilers video xd
Mumblers lol
What are you even talking about?
Speaking in code, all these letters and crap
Very convinced that these two aren’t even human, just two objective aliens seeing humans for what they actually are, they are mocking us, nice try
Wish you had an easy to digest formula.. maybe put it into colour format..or maybe give your terms more intuitive names… like Jesus for Fe.. or Karen for Fi..
Jesus has Fi. Not surprised you wouldn't know because you're Not Jesus.
@@nataliefluckiger6568 I believe Jesus was ENFJ… FeNiSeTi
@@nataliefluckiger6568 If Jesus had Fi then he would necessarily also have Te…
So his understanding of the bible would of been shallow, but all of his mission was about interpreting the times (Ni) and a deeper understanding of the laws (Ti)…
He also couldn’t be an introvert because then he couldn’t do justice to his followers if they become many… imagine Jesus having an introvert burnout before having to deliver a speech to a congregation…
You wish you had as much talent & creativity as J.K. Rowling, not to mention money! 💰💰💰
WORST MUBILERS