► Play Thronefall: store.steampowered.com/app/2239150/Thronefall/ ► Get 50% Full Time Game Dev for Black Friday: www.fulltimegamedev.com/full-time-game-black-friday ► Learn how to become a full time game dev, free: www.clkmg.com/fulltimegamedev/webinar
That opening topic with prototyping, you hit the nail on the head saying its not just games its core business praxis. In particular the book "the lean startup" by eric reis talks a lot about "validated learning" which is that same idea of not investing in hunches without getting data. make a guess/hypothosis... then test it, re-evaluate, run new experiment. The more you survey the land before you jump, the less risky the fall will be.
Yup, in every field it’s the same concept. It’s called Popperian epistemology. Post the problem, guess multiple solutions, test those solutions against reality
I am totally here for all these vids. I know you said you didn’t read UA-cam comments, but on the off chance that you see this, Thomas - thank you for keeping me excited and enthused for my solo dev journey. Keep up with the incredible content!
Holy cow I've never been so happy to have a backlog of dev interviews to listen to and watch. Great job on these Thomas, and thanks for being awesome, Jonas!
Thank you so much for this content man, this was already my favorite podcast but you uping the ante lately with all the huge names! Super insightful, thanks a lot
Having following Jonas for... so long (I can't even recall), that was nice to see you 2 sitting down and talking. Gratz Jonas on the really big launch btw!
Finishing a commercial game takes hero level discipline. Passion is crucial to fuel this discipline. If your passion is to get financially rich, then good for you. Most people who make games get passion from the games they want to play. We live in a world that rewards you for more money and it's a necessity nowadays. Wish more people would view/follow/be attracted to other indie devs who don't have the sales numbers. The machine wants the best and highest. Even this channel is looking for the most views, so will interview the games/channels with the most views. Sucks, but true. Thanks for sharing!
35:40 Another way to approach feedback is through humility. In my line of work (which is not game dev, but regular computer systems dev), I have to take feedback all the time and I see some coworkers always justifying themselves instead of shut up and listen. And the good part is that even if I listen to the feedback I don't always implement it because it goes back to what he's saying, understand the problem first and line up with the project goals. I had to interact with a lot of people to figure this out and I'm surprised he understood it at a young age. A trend that I see in these podcasts is that all successful game devs share high maturity levels that help them understand people's feelings.
Damn back to back hits, thanks Thomas 🙂 cant wait to get home and watch this. Jonas is one of my all time fav gamedev, i used to watch his videos when he was a small youtuber. Damn time flies and it feels so good to see Jonas at this stage, guy is just built different 🫡 Thomas chirstmas is not here yet but you sure brought us gifts earlier 😃❤ many thanks.
It’s kinda hilarious, because for the first 15 mins he described ‘popperian epistemology’. As his secret for success. Basically the idea that in every field, knowledge/success is achieved by 1) identify the problem 2) creatively guess solutions and, 3) test those guesses against reality.
This recent interview series feels like a therapy session for Thomas, helping him process his doubts about the possible failure of his game. He doesn’t seem confident about his project, though it looks like there will be an early access release in the future!
@@thomasbrush Like many viewers, I find the concept of Twisted Tower both fun and engaging! As Jonas said, just filter the feedback from others and trust your vision. Looking forward to your game!
I think the gold Jonas is handing out i missed from Thomas. Its not a step wise process validating along the path it's a extensive search for the optimal solution use the seintific principle. As a startup founder im going to show this video to my coach. Jonas you are awsome and thank ypu Thomas for a great interview.
Thomas, some interviewing advice, once your guest takes the time to explain something, do not repeat it back to them in your words. They just explained it for us, they understand it and you understand it. As is, you basically answer all your own questions and while repetition is fine for learning, you get a lot less info out of each guest because you could have asked other questions. 👍
In Thomas defense I would say I think what Thomas is doing is more like trying to synchronize his thoughts, repeating them back to see if the guest agrees with the reworded summary. I think it's a good strategy if you want to understand something correctly and avoid misunderstandings.
In my defense I would say I think what I am doing is more like trying to synchronize my thoughts, and repeating them back to guest to see if they agree. I think it’s a good strategy to avoid misunderstanding.
In the first video of my channel, some people got angry with me when I said that “the first 6 months of game development should be dedicated to research and learning”. I'm glad to see that successful people think like me.
I mean no disrespect, but what makes this interview so good, it’s that what Thomas doesn’t know, pulls out the details from Jonas. Rapid prototyping should be standard. Fail fast and find the fun. This is at the heart of not building your dream game. You have no idea if it’s even anyone else’s ok game.
Regarding pitching StarWars... it's not about making something simple but something that can easily communicate its appeal. That's very different. A poster of StarWars is enough to describe the fantasy it's selling you without needing to understand what you're looking at
Jonas just out here explaining iterative human/user-centered design to folks. He's correct, though; this is how we used to make software; it's a shame that "Move fast and break things" has set us back in so many ways.
Dude went from indie game dev to rich. Well, even $10m in revenue probably "only" results in $1.5m post 30% store cut, sales tax, publisher fee, corporate tax, splitting with cofounders and then income tax. Crazy really, and that's from a pretty big hit. Makes you wonder how anyone can start a company and make it work.
You forgot refunds, the fact the most people buy at a discount, and the fact that we launched at a much lower price point. (But all in all I won't complain.)
@@JonasTyroller Hopefully the money keeps trickling in for a while though? Either way, keep expenses reasonable and you can keep making games for the rest of your life without a financial care in the world, congrats! I'm getting there myself but from regular wage jobs, hoping of maybe doing some of that game dev when I'm set :)
I just want to hook into one point: "The one thing that makes a Game Feedback a positiv feedback is Money, if you get much money, the game is good" Thats not always true. There are alot of games which do micro transactions and lootboxes etc. which make alot of money without respecting the player and not offering a great game.
The problem is making too gimicky games, that try to be different for the sake of being different. That's not how you stand out. You stand out by making good games. And if you want to be successful, I think you should make systemic games, or games with good mechanics, not story driven games. Do you want to make a game or a movie? You want to tell a story? Show, don't tell. Make the world tell the story, don't lock the player up to a story on rails. Rail-shooter? Rail-story. Am I playing a game or am I just pushing x/space to progress in your planned-out pre-determined sequence? Of course, personal preference.
Lol, I literally called that Thomas was thinking of Jonas when discussing steam algo vs marketing with Chris here: ua-cam.com/video/CM-dXRF-DrM/v-deo.html Love to see Jonas sharing his perspective here.
Suffocating podcast for Indies 🤣 this is the most suffocating on channel. it feels like he crossed the tunnel and explaining us how suffocating it is from other end of tunnel. and Thomas is just making it more intense...
► Play Thronefall: store.steampowered.com/app/2239150/Thronefall/
► Get 50% Full Time Game Dev for Black Friday: www.fulltimegamedev.com/full-time-game-black-friday
► Learn how to become a full time game dev, free: www.clkmg.com/fulltimegamedev/webinar
Thanks for having me. Podcast is on fire lately!
Thanks for coming on the heels of Jonathan Blow and Mark Brown. That takes GUTS.
Very articulate and well thought out philosophy. More helpful (to me) than Jonathan Blow and Mark Brown. Thanks for doing this!
@@almostalwaysadamJonas is one of the best, definitely. His success is no luck at all.
Ok I think it's official now. This is the best game dev podcast series hands down!
Thank you for all this Thomas!
Glad you like them!
Stop it Thomas, you're spoiling us
That opening topic with prototyping, you hit the nail on the head saying its not just games its core business praxis. In particular the book "the lean startup" by eric reis talks a lot about "validated learning" which is that same idea of not investing in hunches without getting data. make a guess/hypothosis... then test it, re-evaluate, run new experiment. The more you survey the land before you jump, the less risky the fall will be.
Yup, in every field it’s the same concept. It’s called Popperian epistemology. Post the problem, guess multiple solutions, test those solutions against reality
I am totally here for all these vids.
I know you said you didn’t read UA-cam comments, but on the off chance that you see this, Thomas - thank you for keeping me excited and enthused for my solo dev journey.
Keep up with the incredible content!
@@SirCalalot this comment is devistating. I’m officially in a spiral. I’m a fraud. I don’t know if I can make another video
@@thomasbrush OhYou.gif
Holy cow I've never been so happy to have a backlog of dev interviews to listen to and watch. Great job on these Thomas, and thanks for being awesome, Jonas!
Just finished watching the Marc Brown episode, and you've already dropped a Jonas? Awesome!
Make that 960,001 copies sold. 🎉
*960,002
🤣🤣
I love to live in the dimension where thomas brush became the indie industry podcaster, awesome as always!
Well deserved, Jonas is such a great dev! Congrats!
Thank you so much for this content man, this was already my favorite podcast but you uping the ante lately with all the huge names! Super insightful, thanks a lot
Having following Jonas for... so long (I can't even recall), that was nice to see you 2 sitting down and talking. Gratz Jonas on the really big launch btw!
This is the third interview of yours I've watched. Great stuff. Subbed.
Finishing a commercial game takes hero level discipline. Passion is crucial to fuel this discipline. If your passion is to get financially rich, then good for you. Most people who make games get passion from the games they want to play. We live in a world that rewards you for more money and it's a necessity nowadays. Wish more people would view/follow/be attracted to other indie devs who don't have the sales numbers. The machine wants the best and highest. Even this channel is looking for the most views, so will interview the games/channels with the most views. Sucks, but true. Thanks for sharing!
Wow. So much content in the last week. That's awesome.
Banger guest!
You should get Laura Fryer on next!
Thomas you are slaying us with these freakin' podcasts man. It's just too much goodness to take in
Damn this is like a dev glowup for Jonas! Nice!
35:40 Another way to approach feedback is through humility. In my line of work (which is not game dev, but regular computer systems dev), I have to take feedback all the time and I see some coworkers always justifying themselves instead of shut up and listen. And the good part is that even if I listen to the feedback I don't always implement it because it goes back to what he's saying, understand the problem first and line up with the project goals. I had to interact with a lot of people to figure this out and I'm surprised he understood it at a young age. A trend that I see in these podcasts is that all successful game devs share high maturity levels that help them understand people's feelings.
Damn back to back hits, thanks Thomas 🙂 cant wait to get home and watch this. Jonas is one of my all time fav gamedev, i used to watch his videos when he was a small youtuber. Damn time flies and it feels so good to see Jonas at this stage, guy is just built different 🫡
Thomas chirstmas is not here yet but you sure brought us gifts earlier 😃❤ many thanks.
It’s kinda hilarious, because for the first 15 mins he described ‘popperian epistemology’. As his secret for success. Basically the idea that in every field, knowledge/success is achieved by 1) identify the problem 2) creatively guess solutions and, 3) test those guesses against reality.
Absolutely chopping it up with the guests lately my man. Good job 🔥
Thank you, Thomas, for these amazing podcasts.
You're welcome!
This recent interview series feels like a therapy session for Thomas, helping him process his doubts about the possible failure of his game. He doesn’t seem confident about his project, though it looks like there will be an early access release in the future!
No early access! But yes, plenty of doubts
@@thomasbrush Like many viewers, I find the concept of Twisted Tower both fun and engaging! As Jonas said, just filter the feedback from others and trust your vision. Looking forward to your game!
These are soooo good, I can't keep up, can't wait to watch this one tho!!!
Hope you enjoy!
I think the gold Jonas is handing out i missed from Thomas. Its not a step wise process validating along the path it's a extensive search for the optimal solution use the seintific principle. As a startup founder im going to show this video to my coach. Jonas you are awsome and thank ypu Thomas for a great interview.
Thomas, some interviewing advice, once your guest takes the time to explain something, do not repeat it back to them in your words. They just explained it for us, they understand it and you understand it. As is, you basically answer all your own questions and while repetition is fine for learning, you get a lot less info out of each guest because you could have asked other questions. 👍
In Thomas defense I would say I think what Thomas is doing is more like trying to synchronize his thoughts, repeating them back to see if the guest agrees with the reworded summary. I think it's a good strategy if you want to understand something correctly and avoid misunderstandings.
In my defense I would say I think what I am doing is more like trying to synchronize my thoughts, and repeating them back to guest to see if they agree. I think it’s a good strategy to avoid misunderstanding.
@@thomasbrush LMAO
I absolutely love this channel as a solo developer I’m exited to show off my demo
In the first video of my channel, some people got angry with me when I said that “the first 6 months of game development should be dedicated to research and learning”. I'm glad to see that successful people think like me.
DAMN, BACK TO BACK TO BACK BANGERS
wooaaaahhhh🤩
Thomas is firing all cylinders!
My God! I can't keep up with all this awesome content you've thrown out lately! It's like you don't even care!
That's the goal!
Awesome, another Jonas and Thomas crossover episode!
I mean no disrespect, but what makes this interview so good, it’s that what Thomas doesn’t know, pulls out the details from Jonas.
Rapid prototyping should be standard.
Fail fast and find the fun.
This is at the heart of not building your dream game. You have no idea if it’s even anyone else’s ok game.
Amazing slew of episodes Thomas ! Jonas Tyroller is the boss.
I am going to add Thomas to the credits of my game
What about your royalty distributions?
Alright I'm calling it, Pontypants is next!
Regarding pitching StarWars... it's not about making something simple but something that can easily communicate its appeal. That's very different. A poster of StarWars is enough to describe the fantasy it's selling you without needing to understand what you're looking at
Thomas is on fire with these podcasts.
Dani next?!
Hideo Kojima?!
Bro when will I find the time to watch them all now that you are dropping one every other day 😄
You'll never catch up
no lo entiendo, esto es increíble, primero Jhonathan Blow, luego Chris y Mark y ahora a Jonas Tyroller, quien sigue, Dani? este podcast es increíble
JONAS, THE GOAT
Really love those! Very cool!
so good podcasts
30 days presents Christmas calendar from Thomas
Jonas should make IRL vlogs while he is off from game dev. I'd take it even if it's his computer room, doing some cool AI stuff.
I'm making a game and my pitch is just: Fantasy Tavern Online
So grateful for you guys! I watch you both 🫂
Jonas just out here explaining iterative human/user-centered design to folks. He's correct, though; this is how we used to make software; it's a shame that "Move fast and break things" has set us back in so many ways.
If you spam the zero key, you'll get my reaction to this episode👏
Is this on apple or Spotify?
I’m gonna get these episodes up next week
Dude went from indie game dev to rich. Well, even $10m in revenue probably "only" results in $1.5m post 30% store cut, sales tax, publisher fee, corporate tax, splitting with cofounders and then income tax. Crazy really, and that's from a pretty big hit. Makes you wonder how anyone can start a company and make it work.
You forgot refunds, the fact the most people buy at a discount, and the fact that we launched at a much lower price point. (But all in all I won't complain.)
@@JonasTyroller Hopefully the money keeps trickling in for a while though? Either way, keep expenses reasonable and you can keep making games for the rest of your life without a financial care in the world, congrats! I'm getting there myself but from regular wage jobs, hoping of maybe doing some of that game dev when I'm set :)
I just want to hook into one point: "The one thing that makes a Game Feedback a positiv feedback is Money, if you get much money, the game is good" Thats not always true. There are alot of games which do micro transactions and lootboxes etc. which make alot of money without respecting the player and not offering a great game.
Somebody needs to fix the exploits in capitalism. Patch pls.
Really love them is it possible to get like a student from full time game dev on one of these?
blackthornprod next? 🤔🤔
99% sure he is from germany...^^
he sounds like me...
You got me.
The problem is making too gimicky games, that try to be different for the sake of being different. That's not how you stand out. You stand out by making good games. And if you want to be successful, I think you should make systemic games, or games with good mechanics, not story driven games. Do you want to make a game or a movie? You want to tell a story? Show, don't tell. Make the world tell the story, don't lock the player up to a story on rails. Rail-shooter? Rail-story. Am I playing a game or am I just pushing x/space to progress in your planned-out pre-determined sequence? Of course, personal preference.
I think Chris Zukowski will agree with you.
@@JonasTyroller That's the marketing guy? Hm, marketing don't sell games, good games sell games. 😁
Lol, I literally called that Thomas was thinking of Jonas when discussing steam algo vs marketing with Chris here: ua-cam.com/video/CM-dXRF-DrM/v-deo.html
Love to see Jonas sharing his perspective here.
Suffocating podcast for Indies 🤣 this is the most suffocating on channel.
it feels like he crossed the tunnel and explaining us how suffocating it is from other end of tunnel. and Thomas is just making it more intense...