This was a tough one to do, mostly because I don't want people to think that I prefer one side over the other BUT I don't think Donut's initial experience with Subaru's is that....out of this world. After all, how often do we see marketplace ads with Subaru's mentioning rebuilds or ringlands? At the same time, Donut Media maybe had duplicated issues because they didn't have the experience required to build these cars. But at the end of the day, they're just Subaru's. Right? it shouldn't be that difficult, or is that exactly the problem? It IS difficult to work on them..Would love to hear your thoughts below on this and hope you have an incredible day! ✅ Subscribe here - bit.ly/3kXgWr0 🔥MartiniWorks DISCORD BB - bit.ly/3XhEV5z 😊$39 Heavyweight Hoodie - bit.ly/3XcECIU
The issue is exactly as you said, sunabus are a more complex engine to work on and noone will admit it until they get more expensive and it's only looked after by bigger shops and people with more money to take care of the cars better, that with shortcuts made by Subaru themselves doesn't make it too great for a beginner enthusiast
Every forester I owned was reliable but I was insane on keeping the timing belt, water pump, head gasket among other things changed well before I was supposed to….but donut has built plenty of engines that worked fine….seems like it’s a weird thing that the subies went to sh*t easy. I mean they broke an axel and the engine broke?
I own a 2010 Subaru forester & I’ve been a technician for Honda for 10+ years… believe me when I tell you that this vehicle is more difficult than my wife and kids put together.
I think one thing we have to remember is that the Donut guys never claim to be experts on everything. Some are certified mechanics, and James is literally a comedian. That's part of the charm, they're kinda just normal guys, like most of us are.
I like Smeedia's videos but it should say something about Subarus when he has been able to pump out multiple videos every week for months on end of him fixing solely the catastrophic problems on his cars... One of his most recent videos he mentioned how out of the 6 cars they have, only 1 works. LOL
@@stupidgingers100hhh its kinda on him 😅 Choosing to turbocharge a naturally aspirated Flat 6 designed for economy, pushing over 40 PSI on a STi swapped WRX…. No sane person would do this to themself with one of the cars alone 😂
Pointing fingers is one of the most toxic traits of the Subaru community. And I never knew who was right until it happened to me. I have a 2013 FR-S that I bought quite a few years ago with very low mileage. It was never tracked, rarely pushed, and regularly maintained. It was my daily driver and seemed really reliable for a long time. I would also like to add that I never got the valve spring recall done, because of the fear of excessive RTV clogging the pickup tube. One day randomly on my way to work, it spun a rod bearing. It had 93000 miles. I posted some videos on it and right away, I started receiving comments that I didn't take care of it and the oil was probably low (it wasn't). Everyone pointed fingers at me. As someone who actually cares about his cars, it kinda sucks to receive the blame when you put in extra work to make sure it would never happen in the first place. Nobody in the community wants to accept that these engines just aren't reliable.
If subaru engines were so great, enthusiasts will be swapping them into other cars all over the place. Yet, K-swaps abound. LS swaps abound. The fact that subarus require more caution and attention is a disadvantage, not an advantage. The only subbie engine have going for it is flat motor novelty. Internal combustion engines have existed for more than a hundred years now, and legendary engines like the 2JZ, LS, K20/K24 etc. have existed for a while now. There is no excuse for Subaru to be producing finicky engines in 2023.
I don't think it is so much a matter of people not wanting to admit they are harder to work on than it is that people don't want to admit they have some ridiculous failure points that have to be addressed IMMEDIATLY for a platform marketed as a sports car. At the end of the day I believe Donut's representation was 100% accurate. If your average Joe picked up a WRX with the intention of REALLY driving it this is the learning curve they would be met with. They have a reputation for a reason, somebody didn't just start spreading rumors that they blow up really easy one day and it stuck lol.
My friends had 3 STI’s throughout the years. 2 were boosted slightly above stock with bolt ons and both motors blew fast. 3rd one was new stock from a dealer and has been fine for 2 years
Like most higher performance platforms there’s a grenade under the hood. G60 - super charger Corvette C6Z06 - valve drop WRX glitter in the oil - ringland There’s always something just do your best to research and avoid them by confronting them.
The thing about those cars is, every bit of needed information is already out there. All in one nice place, As someone who has owned some older impreza's (sold one with 220k, and 363k), and now a 05 wrx with 178k original motor and trans working minty. Before I committed to the buy, I did a quick search on negatives, and its honestly user error for the most part. Buying used is always risky, but you have to consider what you believe the previous owner would of done as well. As for Donuts car, well, anything goes when you go hard on the motor. Lets just say there is a reason race teams rebuild the motors after races... All these cars are first and foremost built to drive on the streets, not raced around. Which is why you add supporting mods, and tune them better handle that kind of driving.
when I watched the series, to me, it showed how difficult it would be if your would build a WRX even with the money, it still showed the hurdles that you'll have to jump to. Why blame donut? if a random person does the same thing, shit is still on them for not knowing? the comparison to a Rotary is spot on.
Yup. My brother blew the motor on his evoX way back. Spent dumb amounts of money on top of the line parts... car barely lasted longer than a year and didn't even make as much power as his previous car despite being heavily modified Sold it at a loss and got a truck.
Kinda funny the irony that none of the Subaru defenders were saying Donut could have experienced similar on any platform given how true it is, especially when you're modifying cars that aren't straight out of the factory so there's years of abuse before taking it well beyond the original use case, plenty youtubers have had similar luck with Nissan SR20s for instance Suppose the Subaru headgasket meme didn't just spawn out of nowhere either though
Hit the nail on the head with the rotary comparison. Most down to earth subaru owners will admit that the platform is finicky, AND the stock form is underbuilt as hell for its "desired" applications. Much respect for those willing to thread the subaru needle, but Hi/Lo works on a simple premise (normal enthusiast building street-able HPDE cars).
Its a common joke in the subaru community that you arent a 'real' subaru guy until you've had to pull the engine at least once. So pretty clearly everyone knows that subarus need more work and attention to detail to stay reliable. Also wtf subaru install baffles in your factory WRX oil pans for the love of christ
I think it should show as a warning. This can and will happen, and sometimes it unavoidable with this specific platform. Just means its not the best platform for beginners who want to hop in, and rat out. Just goes to show this can happen to anyone. Great video Alex!
Well yeah, but they certainly didn’t really give those engines a chance, they just threw them out on track without even braking them in. I’m not a Subaru guy, I’m more in to Volvo’s (“old” Volvo’s not the infuriating cars they are building these days), but seeing them not braking in those engines was painful and made me a bit angry.
I think the main appeal of Donut media is that they are relatable to most audience. I can relate more with people who tried to modify a car but break it instead, rather than a group of car experts who know everything in advance and make very few mistakes. Try out and find out, that is fun part of their project series. That being said, if a machine requires you to be super knowledgeable and make very few mistakes, is it a good machine?
"That being said, if a machine requires you to be super knowledgeable and make very few mistakes, is it a good machine?" ... Well just because someone doesn't know how to fly doesn't mean that planes are somehow bad
@@codemy666 not quite… airplanes are never designed to be piloted by the masses. However, airplanes that crash or require engine overhaul (*wink) because of the slightest pilot’s mistake still suck.
@@codemy666 sure, but I would say a car that can be is more appealing to me than a car that can’t. Like if I’m going to be modifying a car, I would prefer a platform that is forgiving over one that will blow up with the slightest mistake
I honestly think donut just showed a perfect example of how a new owner to a subie feels. I'm sure donut put research and clearly time into their builds but ultimately didn't know as much as the subaru community. I don't own a subie bc of how finicky they are, love the cars but I can't justify the time investment of picking up someone else's rebuild
You hit the nail right on the head. My buddy had an STI and he had to be on top of everything to make the car reliable. They are bad cars since the majority of Subaru problems are specific to Subarus. The people who say you just need to know what you are doing are already on their 3rd engine
I had the same exact takeaway from the Donut series. Still think they are a great platform, but for being the type of car they are marketed as you shouldn’t have to be a Subaru expert just to enjoy the car at a track.
I don’t consider the money spent “wasted”, I found it highly entertaining throughout, ESPECIALLY when “Subaru things” kept popping up and throwing a spanner in the works
Was watching this while rebuilding my Saabaru and I took comfort in the shared suffering of the issues they ran into. Guess it’s just something that comes with the car!
Being in the Subaru community for 10 years now you absolutely nailed it. They are extremely temperamental and are much less forgiving. But they are lots of fun when done right.
@1upJeCK they are really cheap to buy for the most part. Some of the more sought after STI's are getting up there but a normal wrx is pretty cheap. Especially if it's already broken lol. Now modifying, building and maintaining? Not so much.
I wonder how much research Donut did before they jumped into this platform. I think they should have done Civics for time attack cars. Not cause Subarus are bad, but because they demand more attention and care than most platforms.
😂 I own a b5 s4 and what you said about it is 100% accurate… I’ve been building cars since I was 16 and this is my favourite/most hate car I’ve owned. Like you said when it’s working it’s the best car… when it’s not I am crying (most of the time)
As a new to the platform subaru guy, I have to say, a big reason I even felt confident enough to get into the scene is because one of my best friends is already a Subaru certified tech. If I didn’t have him all the work we’ve done on my car and a lot of the things I’ve had to fix would have been so much more daunting and frustrating. So my advice to anyone wanting to work on WRX’s or STI’s is to have a friend who someone in your town who knows the platform well and is willing to help you learn.
Facts. I went from not being able to change my oil a few years ago and with the help of a couple friends and smeedia / motoIQ's vids I'm building my first engine soon. If you're willing to learn, building subarus and maintaining them is easy
tbh if your experts shared so much information it would have been nice to have a technical section where we get some of that expert info relayed to us.
As someone who loves subaru and doughnut, this video was extremely well worded. Side note, hope to bring my mk8 golf r to some meets this year, I live in Sheboygan.
From my perspective, just as a car enthusiast, former Subaru owner, and former mechanic/dealership trade in manager, donut kinda should’ve known better. Subarus are known to be extremely fickle beasts so I wasn’t surprised at all that they went through so many engines. I’ve experienced the purest joy of Subaru ownership (a blown engine while basically stock) myself and said never again will I invest in this platform. It’s kinda like how I love rotaries but understand I’m going to have to do a rebuild every so often if I ever get an FD. The subie community also shouldn’t hate on donut for showcasing what reality is like for ~20 years of ej owners lol
People are just salty and inhaling compium. Cause Subaru's haven't been reliable since the Colin Mcrae rally days. And even though the whole car itself was durable as hell. The head gaskets and other small problems would probably still be frequent. Especially if abused anywhere near that level.
Honestly A lot of performance cars are fickle things. Going from the Toyota 86 platform to the subaru every car is just a luck of the draw. I've heard of people blowing engines at stocked and some people who defie the laws of logic and some how dont blow their engines. And buying someone elses project can be a dangerous thing because people love to beat their shit till they get tired of it. So in the long run its luck you got a proper built one out of factory or a proper taken cared of one.
@@brenton490 The bottom line is that it typically costs a significant amount of money to go fast reliably and consistently. 90's vehicles designed manufactured in Japan sort of spoiled most of us - they were essentially low maint high beat down machines... now vehicles are just a lot more complex - and so is the risk...
@@brenton490 Also need to keep in mind that probably almost all used WRXs have been abused to one extent, or a large extent by some 20 year old. Having bought one from new, and properly cared for it, it has been extremely reliable for 10 years.
I was going to write the same. Subaru is a wonderful platform, for some people. I never worked on one because of all of the things that you explained and stirred me towards other Japanese or European brands..
Thank you sir! I tried my best to keep it fair and open. I want people to maybe see the bigger underlining "issue" vs. just blaming one side or another!
Basically argument of the Subaru community: "Donut doesn't know what they're doing because they didn't know all the special little bits of information about how this car breaks if you put parts on it"
It's indeed like rotaries. But I think the difference is that rotary guys know it's not always an ideal platform but they accept it and it actually makes them more motivated. While I feel a lot of subbie guys don't like when their car is seen as bad. Kinda like that meme with the guy crying but with a mask over it vs the blonde Chad guy that just accepts it.
These are assumptions based on the fact that this is happening. All people with a subbie I met irl are all amazing and I'm sure they're just passionate about their car.
All you have to do is watch the shmeedia video about this situation to realize you are 100% correct. Those dudes defend theses cars SO hard for no reason. I mean the amount of deflection was insane. Should donut Media have installed baffled pans and broken the motors in? Well, yea. But let's be honest, would you expect a Rallie inspired AWD car to have oil starvation issues this bad? Absolutely not, but they'll defend that "it's not a bad design" all day...
@@Saltyoldguy-hey are just misunderstood, and that goes for both Doritos and subies. They can both be reliable, and they can both make power. The problem, is that it is VERY hard to do both at the same time. The oil starvation is well known, and standard to change oil pan for better pickup. So is apex seals, which you help by premix oil in tank. Now talk about their non turbo engines, the ej22 and 13b non turbos go for quarter million miles every day. Turbos are the Bain of both plataforms
Yeah, we rotary guys know what we're getting into. And any mistakes are mostly ours because of how finicky they are. Complete oposite of binmer guys XD
@@oliviervankleef1358 If subaru engines were so great, enthusiasts will be swapping them into other cars all over the place. Yet, K-swaps abound. The fact that subarus require more caution and attention is a disadvantage, not an advantage. The only subbie engine have going for it is flat motor novelty.
This nails it really well, especially on comparison to the B5 S4 and the RX7. All VERY touchy and finnicky cars- if you know what you're doing in respect to the platform, you're golden. But if you expect it to be easy, or expect to be able to treat it like literally anything else on the road, it'll bite back.
How much of a psychopath does someone need to be to see Donut Media go through like 5 engines and say "The problem must be that they don't know what they're doing" Ignoring the fact that they work out of a shop with a lot of professional mechanics, we've seen them do a bunch of different builds....if a Subaru is too difficult for them then my only take away is that 99% of the people out there shouldn't touch the brand since it's just so insanely complicated. The reality is that these aren't new cars and we're seeing why a common failure point is called a COMMON failure point. Some bad engineering doesn't help either, but I guess we should just be thankful the Pontiac Fiero doesn't have "passionate" fans.
At what point do you call a platform bad for the enthusiast community? Turboed Subarus are "amazing" except you have to do several expensive X, Y, and Z modifications to get them to survive any sort of turning. Also they have crappy piston rings and a top mounted intercooler. You can throw a lot of money and time addressing their shortcomings and, if you do the slightest thing wrong (or not, Subarus be Subarus), they will blow up again and again. Yeah. Sounds like a great platform to me!
I’ve spent some time with the donut team and they are not incompetent by any means.Subarus boxer platform is sensitive and requires a bit more work. I believe the series donut produced exposed those weak points that an average enthusiast may see first hand.
@@PhantasmPhoton And let's be honest, The Donut boys are not 'regular people'. They're race car drivers (Adam, Nolan), enthusiasts, people with degrees in mechanical engineering, people who have built PLENTY of engines and cars over the years. Just not Subaru specifically, and that goes to show that Subarus require you to know about Subarus, not just about cars. Of course all cars and platforms have their own quirks and pros and cons, but these guys aren't just regular people. The platform has problems. Problems that can be mitigated, sure, but it shouldn't require a PHD to simply track a car a few times without it dying. They were having engine issues before they really modded the engine at all. If you want to say 'Oh well, after they put on a big turbo and flashed it, sure, anything can happen then.' but these were essentially EXTREMELY mild mods at first and they still grenaded. I take other issues with the series, such as saying that the cheap turbo was 'worse' simply because it made less peak power without actually giving the specs of the turbos purchased, but that's neither here nor there.
The unfortunate truth is that EJs need a hell of a lot of “preparation” to be reliable on track. It’s likely Donut chose that platform mostly because it has a large number of dedicated followers to ensure clicks. Scooby owners are die hards, they accept all the conditions that come with the platform. The problem with a lot of these automotive channels is that they are run by people who like cars at a superficial level, casual fans if you will. The EJ25 doesn’t suit that kind of attitude.
I was done with Subaru when our 2009 Legacy blew up trying to get up to highway speeds one day. We did the headgasket job the year prior, had no warning lights and no other indicators that would tell us that what was coming. Of course, we just lost our dog a month before that so needless to say, we didn't have the money to fix it and ended up buying a 2008 VW Rabbit. Even with all that car's problems, we love that thing and it hasn't tried to kill itself yet.
I bought a low millage single owner Subaru Legacy with my savings from a part-time job a a year ago.the car had no issues but the engine on it blew up on my trip from Saskatchewan to Alberta . The trip was completely ruined and had to pay a lot of money to the tow it back to Saskatchewan only to realise it needs an engine replacement. Insurance in my province wouldn't cover it unless the damage is related to a crash,theft or vandalism.All of my money totally wasted and I only had the car for a month. From that day onwards i swore that I would rather spend my money on drugs than buy another Subaru.
I have a Subaru legacy 3.0r spec.b with the original engine at 230xxx kilometres. Engine has never had any issues, and is now taking a turbocharger pushing 10psi / 400HP to the wheels
@@johnmcgovern1418 that's cool and all, but that 6cyl isn't even in the same engine family so I'd imagine there would be a whole different set of issues.
I personally think you hit the head on the nail with this response they don’t take more knowledge to be done right and aren’t the easiest to work on but they are definitely still great cars I have heard plenty of nightmare stories and as well as it’s the best car ever stories and the differences between the two people is the amount of time they have put into finding out how to properly take care of them
I don’t get how so many people missed that they said they had baffled oil pans the whole time. It was later in the series that they noted it, but they said they had them on the whole time because they knew!!!!!
They’re temperamental cars. I’m running equal headers, Cobb 20g turbo and cooling mods. Have to watch engine temps, oil and accessport readings before getting on it. Demands a lot of attention and you have to have everything in order such as quality parts and fueling. Can’t skip out on anything.
Same here! Havent had any issues at alll but i will admit the initial cost and the amount of research i did just to get it right would land me a bachelors degree in EJ257
There is a shop near me that specializes and races Subarus. They flat out told me if I ever planned on buying a STi, and want to do anything beyond a bolt on car, I should budget $20k for a proper build to make it reliable. Even then, high chance something will go wrong if driven hard. They recommended a baffled oil pan and pickup on even a bone stock car if you plan on tracking or doing any extended canyon carving.I love Subarus, but when you start pricing things out, you have to have an obsession with them for it to make sense compared to other platforms for that kind of money.
Donut embarrassed themselves with this series and it is genuinely harmful to the car community by reinforcing internet memes instead of good info and reducing the chances we even get more performance Subaru models. Yes, we Subaru people get upset, because this is not helpful to anyone and it's solely for the sake of views. Subaru has flaws, but so does every brand. In Vermont I see Subaru vehicles get abused and driven hard daily without constant failures. I'll leave it at that.
My buddy sold his STI because it would randomly pull 10 degrees of timing, and apparently that’s just normal for EJ’s to do. My buddy couldn’t take the stress of dealing with all of the “quirks” Subarus have Most people will talk about how you need to know how to take care of these cars, but won’t acknowledge that pretty much any other car doesn’t have these problems. Also every Subaru owner I know is on at least their 2nd engine, so even if you know what they are doing they will die on you anyway
@@deadheadcentral2514 My fried just put in his 3rd engine. This time went with a IAG block as the local shop has had grate luck with them. Just put down 483 on a mustang dyno at 26 psi. Looking for more power this summer as they only could get the fuel to E68.
@@802Garage Dude was running an off the shelf COBB stage 1 tune with all of the supporting mods. He took it to two separate Subaru shops they both said nothing was wrong and that it’s normal for that to happen. There’s just too many issues unique to Subarus only for them to be good cars
Subaru fanboys are missing the point entirely. Your platform shouldn't be this easy to break. The 350z wasn't, and that's made by a company that uses rubber bands for a transmission.
I ended up on the Audi platform, knowing full well it can be expensive. Doing your research and having a fundamental understanding of what problems can affect each production run is key to keeping your money in your wallet.
Dude if an engine requires you too have the knowledge of a mechanic for a specific engine design that only one platform uses and even having it u still blow up the engine just by taking it one's to the track. That's not a good engine, it's just a bad design that Subaru keeps putting in cars, because they refuse too invest in a complete engine design replacement. If you need too change half the part's in engine that's in a performance car just too be able to take it too the track it's a shit engine.
I have to agree with most of what you said. Any compent build is going to take a sizable amount of cash & patience...and let's be honest. Most enthusiasts can be short on both. Stock Subies are cool cars, beyond stock tho I feel it gets sketch If you're not fully vested long haul
Even the new ones aren't all that great. My bud still blew an axle on his 22 at 160 miles another at 2500 and 1st and 2nd at 5000 miles. To be fair, he wasn't easy on it, but for a manual sports car it should have taken the abuse. He wasn't beating on it half as hard as the 94 mustang gt he drove before it, and that car lasted 220k miles until it sucked water in the intake. And even after that, the damn thing ran for 2 weeks before it reluctantly stopped hot starting. Still ran until the engine was pulled lmao 302s are indestructible.
Rotary Chads: We know our cars break down a lot. Subaru Betas: No, it's not a shitbox, i ain't coping for paying a ridiculous amount of money for such an unreliable car.
The global community just needs to see older Subarus like they do with the rotary and it would be fine. Imagine If there was a video response for every rx8 that blew up in a UA-camrs video.
The difference is rotaries have NEVER been considered super mega reliable. Subaru built their rep on bulletproof reliability bullshit. And they never were. Ok a leone or a thelike were decent but when they came to libertys and imprezzas they fell over big time but still flog on about being tough and reliable.
@@sugarnadsyou nailed it on the head. Subaru puts out an image of reliability. And to be fair, their daily commute cars that aren’t being pushed to redline do make it to 200k a lot of the time. But with a Rotary I know the Apex seals won’t make it much farther past 80k. I know what to expect in terms of reliability. I’m also not worried I’m going to blow a Dorito at the track smacking redline. They are reliable enough to make it. Subarus on the other hand just don’t seem to like doing high revs too much. My friend got his dream car, an old bug eye WRX. Drove it for a few months, not super hard but he did get in it from time to time. Just like anyone would in a sporty car. Engine popped. He didn’t track it. Wasn’t taking hard corners to let the oil slosh around. It just blew going in a straight line. He was devastated
I think it's a little ridiculous that a car marketed as a "performance" car can't be driven as such without modifications to keep it from blowing up. I loved my bugeye WRX. I got it in a trade for my 8th gen Si that I was definitely not a fan of. The WRX was fun to drive, made decent power, handled really well and looked awesome on coilovers with wide black RPF1s...but I always felt like I was on borrowed time. I knew that if it blew up, it would cost a fortune to get an engine done right. ThatDudeinBlue had an excellent video on what it really takes to have an EJ rebuilt correctly for longevity and power. Seeing that, I can see that probably 95% of people won't do what it really takes.. either because of cost or the effort involved. I knew that if mine blew up, I didn't want to half ass it and I couldn't afford it to be done 100% right...and I would lose my butt on the car having a shell I couldn't sell or an endless project. I made an effort to sell the car while it was in tip top running condition with all the awesome parts I installed and cash out ASAP.
Right! But you can take a stock Corolla or Civic and beat the shit out of it and if there is always some oil on the dipstick, it's going to live forever!
This video is fantastic! Having gone from an Impreza to an SRT-4 to a FiST, I’ve learned that every car platform needs needs 3 different thing from you as the owner. Patience, a willingness to learn, and enthusiasm. If you skip any of these things, you’re in for a bad time.
As a fellow FiST owner we're pretty spoiled though. Not much wrong with these cars besides learning to love the *click* *click* *click* *click* from constantly shearing the teeth on our blend door actuators
I haven't even watched the whole video but I'll drop this. Subaru's are GARBAGE. And I've owned both a 2011 WRX and a 2013 sit and a 2003 JDM Forester. The forester was the best, hands down. The reason that they're garbage is because everyone who buys them thinks that they can make MASSIVE power just by adding an intake, exhaust, a shit COBB tune and maybe some wheels, tires and suspension. And then they rat bag these cars and pass them on to the public after being absolutely destroyed. My WRX lasted 2000 kms and then the engine left the chat...and I'll be honest when I say I didn't drive it that hard. It was cruising at 60 mph when it decided to die. My STi, the previous owner had decided to put "lowering springs" on it and completely ruin the alignment causing me to go through two sets of front tires in the span on ONE YEAR of ownership. Yes, we all want them to be cool, we all want to be Ken Block or Colin McCrae or Petter Solberg.....but we need to realize the work that it takes to make those cars that good and stop thinking just because we buy an accessport that that will happen....never mind the clutch on my STi that I had to replace after a couple months. The forester was bulletproof after 200k kms. I miss that car daily. And it's only because it wasn't modified and it was taken care of. 225 hp is enough. Thanks for coming to my Ted Talk.
I think most people don't realise once you finish building a engine you have to "run-in" the engine again for about 1000miles to be on the safe side. If you don't and rev the balls off it, it can lead to a long list of issues that are irrepairable without pulling the engine back apart.
A base wrx is honestly more comparable to an Audi A4 than a S4. I don't get why people think that a wrx is anywhere comparable to an STI in terms of being a performance car. The Wrx is what the Civic SI is to the Type R, it's just a souped up Impreza not a bargain race car.
I just don't like Suburu guys because they all have the same beard. And after watching that hi/lo, I lost all respect for the platform. I would literally never own one. I own a 370z and it's been an amazing first sports car experience. It's a 2009 with almost 120k on the odo. Not a single thing on it has failed, ever. I've upgraded things just to upgrade them, never because they were broken. Watch the hi/lo they did with the 350z and compare it to the shitshow that was the WRX series.
If Subarus were a pain AND awesome, that would be one thing. M/AMG/LS7/Voodoo engines are less troublesome than Subie engines and special enough to actually be worth the effort. A turbo K24 will do everything an EJ25 will do, but better. Plus, if you fix the known problems on most engines, they'll run forever; a Subie engine could be fully built and still grenade for no reason.
Haha exactly what I'm thinking. If people want to bash and not try out the platform then that just makes them cheaper for those who really do appreciate it.
This is completely accurate. It's not that the guys don't know what they're doing, it's that you shouldn't have to worry about your fucking oil pickup. You shouldn't have a performance vehicle outside of the 1900s that doesn't have a baffle in the oil pan. You shouldn't have an engine that can frag itself so easily. That has a massive lack of crankcase ventilation. That has oil consumption issues. Oil consumption issues on engines that are considered modern. It's just a bad platform and if you fix everything it'll work but most people will not fix everything and they will have issues
Donut turbo’d used VQ’s and a junkyard LS and a completely fresh LS and didn’t have any of these issues. And one of the blown engines on the subaru was a car they literally just bought to replace the wrecked car. No track time no nothing and completely stock. There is literally zero excuse. Not to mention the STI is supposed to be the track focused model. All these kids on maximum cope mode trying to blame donut just prove how cultish and blind people are just based off internet hype. But they never learn. There are so many cars that are cheaper, faster, have more modding potential, look better, and don’t blow up. It is 0 IQ to sit there and try to act like they aren’t trash.
As a WRX owner I agree, they are more temperamental but still a great car. I also agree with what some others have said, want to have a great, reliable experience with a WRX? Leave is stock or just do some aesthetics. Getting into the powertrain requires a lot of knowledge and being prepared for things to be harder.
I watched Mr. Subaru's video and he makes quite a few moronic claims, namely that the wrx is perfectly fine you just have to swap out half the parts since they are street parts, really? I thought the wrx is supposed to be a rally car, you can't possibly claim it's a fine car you just have to change out the entire transmission and immediately swap out the oil pan, it's like claiming yeah, cars with the infamous iron duke are perfectly fine and reliable, you just have to swap out the iron duke, or imagine claiming the Porsche 911 is reliable unless you push it or it will totally break down, because that was what Mr. Subaru said about the wrx, reliable on the road, but if you push it on the track it will break down because of the lack of baffling, WRX stands for World Rally Experimental, if it can't handle a track it sure as hell can't handle rallying.
The challenge here is that reputation DRIVES how much research people do. If a platform has a reputation for being reliable, they won't feel the need to do a ton of deep dive research. Admitting they're complex to modify SHOULD be their reputation. When fans won't accept reality as the cars rep, that's what leads to incomplete understanding by new owners.
I like Subaru's from a distance. Hell, I'm still looking for a nice quality Manual Forester because of your videos mentioning them. I was looking at them for my first car even! I just feel in this age, making one mistake (buying the wrong car) is very frustrating because it feels like too much of a set back. Which is why people want to get it so right the first time. I don't think a Subi is a "get it right the first time" car. If you do, you're lucky. I will give them props where it's due, I don't think there is a better sounding 4cyl out there. And, not EVERY car can/will be amazing. Some have to be a learning experience. Love your stuff Alex
The only way to truly "get it right the first time" is to either build the motor right to a "T", or don't build the motor at all. Obviously some people would get mad at the second option but that's what I chose, and I am fine with it. I hope you do get your Forester one day, it really is a nice platform. I don't think there is any car that's perfect, they all have there issues.
Garbage engines yielded garbage results who could've thought. I invite anyone with a turbocharged EJ to hook up a oil pressure gauge to your turbo oil feed and have a buddy watch it at idle and at like 4500rpm and see how little oil pressure your turbo gets at idle and at higher RPMs its why EJs consume turbos like they're poptarts. Theres a reason Subaru cannot wait to get away from the EJ motor.
I was hoping that you would break down the information that you'd received from the subaru heads you'd talked to in relation to what Donut had "done wrong" on their Hi-Lo series. Instead we got some rambles and vague guesses. You ended up saying, "the people who complained had good and bad comments on donut... and the subaru guys had good and bad comments on donut... but if donut knew all these things in the end, then theyd do better." then you just monologued generally about if you know about issues then you would avoid them???? what is this video dude.... There was nothing of substance to encourage people to get into this platform and you did a horrible job explaining any kind of real issues of this platform.
I think it’s crazy how specialist defend their car, when the car as is, is a POS. In a general sense, not everyone is gonna know the kinks of a car, and as general mechanics donut media had every right to shit on Subaru. It’s ok if you like them, but at least acknowledge it’s a shit car you love to deal with. Most cars don’t blow up when drive them for 200 miles regardless of issues they deal with. But Subarus do
Agreed Alex, great synopsis. I bought a 2003 SRX that had been converted to STI with the 2004 engine and trans. I loved that car, loved the way it looked, loved the way it sounded, loved the attention it garnered, until it broke...twice. I blew the first motor at streets of willow, oil pump failed. Spent 10k having a local LA subaru builder rebuild it, even had to install a new turbo after the original one failed on the dyno, not the cars fault (it turned out to be a cheap chinese knock off). Drove and tracked the car a few more years and then blew another motor. I never looked into why it failed as at that point I figured it was going to take 15K to get the car to where I wanted and I just didnt want to spend that much on that car. I sold if with the blown motor for $3500 and bought a 2013 Ford Focus ST. I have tracked this car at least as much as the Suby and have only had to replace the failed rear sway bar mounts. Subarus definitely take some special knowledge and just dont think they take power-adding parts unless you spend ALOT of money. JMHO.
I had an 04 WRX with the EJ205 and 5 speed manual for my first "performance" car. Reliability wise, it took 4 years of hard driving for something to finally break, 2nd gear on a hard launch. Sure, the clutch burned up, but then again doing a 180 in the snow and trying to clutch drop going back the other way will do that to an OEM clutch. Blown out suspension, I probably shouldn't have been jumping it. Out of all the vehicles I have owned, the WRX was the toughest damn car I've owned, any issues it had were my own damn fault.
It's a more realistic representation of what normal guys would go through modding their cars. If the platform is difficult than maybe it was best for this series to be seen by would be Subaru owners. Not a bad car by any means. But most Hondas would laugh at those mods and keep humming like a sewing machine. There is a reason why Hondas are usually the best starter build cars. More forgiving platforms help grow young tuners without discouraging them.
Subie bois: "Subarus are great ........ proceeds to give a long list of everything you should do just to keep it reliable. " And yet they wonder why people make fun of both Subaru and the drivers, ironic
Subaru isn't great.. what's new? No matter who comes in to defend it, they aren't the best. Donut experienced what every other regular person would experience if they tried the same stuff. Don't be a Subaru guy and don't own a Subaru, who doesn't know this..?
As someone who owns a VA WRX, and a N/A 2002 Forester, I still think they're both good platforms, but taking good care of them and reading more information about them is key to make your EJ/FA Subaru reliable.
The problem with Subarus isn't the cars, It's the owners. The only people who think Subarus are good/reliable are the fan boys. The are cool cars but are they well designed? NOPE!
I raced this guy who was driving a Subaru sti. His car is a 2019. I drive a Veloster N. When we started racing we were neck and neck until his car bogged down and white smoke started coming out of his car. I ended up pulling over and I backed up my car until I was close to his car. I didn’t know the guy, but I also didn’t want to leave him stuck on the side of the interstate. Turns out his engine blew. I felt so bad for him. I waited with him until the tow truck came and I ended up giving him a ride home. We ended up becoming friends.
Yo Alex i think you've been hacked. I got a reply from UA-cam saying it was you, and I won a grand prize. And to contact them on a chat app. They felt insulted by a modified suspension question. Then they wanted naked pics.
I wanted a WRX for my first projects and decided to get a Civic SI instead because I new they’d be easier for a novice to own. I’ll still own a WRX or STI though. They seem like really fun platforms.
Let’s be real hear they have done this series with plenty of vehicles that weren’t even half this problematic. Everyone wants blame them or say they should have done this or that. The reality is they went through 5 motors within a few months which is insane. Sure boxers require a lot more work but it’s also the reason most car manufacturers done use them. They are temperamental by design and not set up for success. Most of the issues they ran into are things Subaru should have addressed. It’s definitely not a bolt on friendly platform by any means. If you compare it to other platforms they just fall short in a lot of areas imo. That being said I think Subarus have communities with some of the coolest people.
I am the 3rd owner of a fully built 15 sti. It was scary at first but I did the research, had it PROFESIONALLY looked at by a shop that I trust and even got the build list and contacted the previous owner. I LOVE IT. Not even a Subaru guy, just a car guy with a subaru. And honestly, I think they're great cars and LOVED donut media series on it. They really don't deserve the hate.
Just bought a 15 WRX with pretty low miles, I was the 3rd owner but it was sold by a pretty good dealer in TX. I feel like most people don't really have issues unless you're doing something really crazy to it or sending her too hard.
@@VB_Bryan It depends how well you take care of them. I'm the 2nd owner of my STI and it was on its 3rd engine before the car hit 100,000 miles. 2nd motor blew up before I had the car for a year, so both of the failures were probably because of the first owner. I've taken care of the 3rd motor since the beginning, and it's been fine since.
I've researched a lot and if you want a Fast Reliable Subaru engine you must first install a Oil Catch can system Then forged engine build, basically spend 15k
So if you want to buy a Subaru you're going to have to spend extra just to bring it to reliable operation level...would say find a platform that operates how it should out of the box (I own a c63 btw I've learnt my lesson the hard way)
I think entusiasts should be more willing to admit that their car is unreliable. I mean that's part of the fun isn't it? The reason you own it is because if you put in the time to get over the reliability issues the car is super rewarding. I own an RX-8 and see a lot of similarities in the rotary community and subaru community. People seem to think that admitting their car is unreliable is some kind of sign of weakness when in fact it's the opposite. Fuck yeah I own an unreliable car, but I work on it and maintain it as much as necessary so that when people get in they can't tell that it's unreliable.
The biggest thing i got out of the situation is like you said " subarus are harder to work on" and as long as you keep it stock and dont "abuse" the car you will be fine. If you are going to track it in any way. You better do all the supporting mods!
This was a tough one to do, mostly because I don't want people to think that I prefer one side over the other BUT I don't think Donut's initial experience with Subaru's is that....out of this world. After all, how often do we see marketplace ads with Subaru's mentioning rebuilds or ringlands? At the same time, Donut Media maybe had duplicated issues because they didn't have the experience required to build these cars.
But at the end of the day, they're just Subaru's. Right? it shouldn't be that difficult, or is that exactly the problem? It IS difficult to work on them..Would love to hear your thoughts below on this and hope you have an incredible day!
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The issue is exactly as you said, sunabus are a more complex engine to work on and noone will admit it until they get more expensive and it's only looked after by bigger shops and people with more money to take care of the cars better, that with shortcuts made by Subaru themselves doesn't make it too great for a beginner enthusiast
Every forester I owned was reliable but I was insane on keeping the timing belt, water pump, head gasket among other things changed well before I was supposed to….but donut has built plenty of engines that worked fine….seems like it’s a weird thing that the subies went to sh*t easy. I mean they broke an axel and the engine broke?
Great video Alex, agree with pretty much everything. Great comparison with S4B5.
I own a 2010 Subaru forester & I’ve been a technician for Honda for 10+ years… believe me when I tell you that this vehicle is more difficult than my wife and kids put together.
overdrive studios bananaru was the better build
I think one thing we have to remember is that the Donut guys never claim to be experts on everything. Some are certified mechanics, and James is literally a comedian. That's part of the charm, they're kinda just normal guys, like most of us are.
Sometimes we need to see people’s setbacks and struggles learning from others’ mistakes is just as helpful
My thoughts exactly. I thought the high vs low show was to showcase what the normal car enthusiast could expect in each price point.
There isn’t anything charming about donut media
@@canchume I'd say their 7.8 million subscribers would disagree with you.
@@robmitchell3039 people like Andrew tate, doesn’t mean he is right or even remotely funny
Smeedia is the goat imo, glad you talked to him
I like Smeedia's videos but it should say something about Subarus when he has been able to pump out multiple videos every week for months on end of him fixing solely the catastrophic problems on his cars...
One of his most recent videos he mentioned how out of the 6 cars they have, only 1 works. LOL
@@stupidgingers100hhh its kinda on him 😅
Choosing to turbocharge a naturally aspirated Flat 6 designed for economy, pushing over 40 PSI on a STi swapped WRX….
No sane person would do this to themself with one of the cars alone 😂
Pointing fingers is one of the most toxic traits of the Subaru community. And I never knew who was right until it happened to me. I have a 2013 FR-S that I bought quite a few years ago with very low mileage. It was never tracked, rarely pushed, and regularly maintained. It was my daily driver and seemed really reliable for a long time. I would also like to add that I never got the valve spring recall done, because of the fear of excessive RTV clogging the pickup tube. One day randomly on my way to work, it spun a rod bearing. It had 93000 miles. I posted some videos on it and right away, I started receiving comments that I didn't take care of it and the oil was probably low (it wasn't). Everyone pointed fingers at me. As someone who actually cares about his cars, it kinda sucks to receive the blame when you put in extra work to make sure it would never happen in the first place. Nobody in the community wants to accept that these engines just aren't reliable.
They're not total dog water. They're temperamental, and pretty much everything outside of an LS is at various levels.
If subaru engines were so great, enthusiasts will be swapping them into other cars all over the place.
Yet, K-swaps abound. LS swaps abound. The fact that subarus require more caution and attention is a disadvantage, not an advantage. The only subbie engine have going for it is flat motor novelty. Internal combustion engines have existed for more than a hundred years now, and legendary engines like the 2JZ, LS, K20/K24 etc. have existed for a while now. There is no excuse for Subaru to be producing finicky engines in 2023.
I don't think it is so much a matter of people not wanting to admit they are harder to work on than it is that people don't want to admit they have some ridiculous failure points that have to be addressed IMMEDIATLY for a platform marketed as a sports car.
At the end of the day I believe Donut's representation was 100% accurate. If your average Joe picked up a WRX with the intention of REALLY driving it this is the learning curve they would be met with. They have a reputation for a reason, somebody didn't just start spreading rumors that they blow up really easy one day and it stuck lol.
My friends had 3 STI’s throughout the years. 2 were boosted slightly above stock with bolt ons and both motors blew fast. 3rd one was new stock from a dealer and has been fine for 2 years
Like most higher performance platforms there’s a grenade under the hood.
G60 - super charger
Corvette C6Z06 - valve drop
WRX glitter in the oil - ringland
There’s always something just do your best to research and avoid them by confronting them.
The thing about those cars is, every bit of needed information is already out there. All in one nice place, As someone who has owned some older impreza's (sold one with 220k, and 363k), and now a 05 wrx with 178k original motor and trans working minty. Before I committed to the buy, I did a quick search on negatives, and its honestly user error for the most part. Buying used is always risky, but you have to consider what you believe the previous owner would of done as well. As for Donuts car, well, anything goes when you go hard on the motor. Lets just say there is a reason race teams rebuild the motors after races... All these cars are first and foremost built to drive on the streets, not raced around. Which is why you add supporting mods, and tune them better handle that kind of driving.
I have a wrx sti and you nailed it. Great video
when I watched the series, to me, it showed how difficult it would be if your would build a WRX even with the money, it still showed the hurdles that you'll have to jump to. Why blame donut? if a random person does the same thing, shit is still on them for not knowing? the comparison to a Rotary is spot on.
I liked donuts hi lo series on the Subaru because it shows all of what can go wrong with modding cars and how frustrating it can be
I love their “Cars Are Pain” merch
Yup. My brother blew the motor on his evoX way back. Spent dumb amounts of money on top of the line parts... car barely lasted longer than a year and didn't even make as much power as his previous car despite being heavily modified
Sold it at a loss and got a truck.
Kinda funny the irony that none of the Subaru defenders were saying Donut could have experienced similar on any platform given how true it is, especially when you're modifying cars that aren't straight out of the factory so there's years of abuse before taking it well beyond the original use case, plenty youtubers have had similar luck with Nissan SR20s for instance
Suppose the Subaru headgasket meme didn't just spawn out of nowhere either though
Hit the nail on the head with the rotary comparison. Most down to earth subaru owners will admit that the platform is finicky, AND the stock form is underbuilt as hell for its "desired" applications. Much respect for those willing to thread the subaru needle, but Hi/Lo works on a simple premise (normal enthusiast building street-able HPDE cars).
Subaru fanbois are kings and queens of deflection. At least rotary enthusiasts admit that rotaries cost more to make reliable power.
Its a common joke in the subaru community that you arent a 'real' subaru guy until you've had to pull the engine at least once. So pretty clearly everyone knows that subarus need more work and attention to detail to stay reliable.
Also wtf subaru install baffles in your factory WRX oil pans for the love of christ
@@Yugophoto they finally did on the new ones
@@Yugophoto also they thought it was a good idea to have plastic pickup tubes???. Finicky? No that's just terrible engineering
As a non-car enthusiast (average guy) but also likes nice cars, Donut Media got me back into cars after years of forgetting the scene existed.
I think it should show as a warning. This can and will happen, and sometimes it unavoidable with this specific platform. Just means its not the best platform for beginners who want to hop in, and rat out. Just goes to show this can happen to anyone. Great video Alex!
Great Comment Dillon!
It's certainly no Miata
Well yeah, but they certainly didn’t really give those engines a chance, they just threw them out on track without even braking them in.
I’m not a Subaru guy, I’m more in to Volvo’s (“old” Volvo’s not the infuriating cars they are building these days), but seeing them not braking in those engines was painful and made me a bit angry.
Totally agree! Thank you very much sir!
@@klaspeppar5619 It did for a lot of people. Following proper break in is crucial, I can't really defend that bit
I think the main appeal of Donut media is that they are relatable to most audience. I can relate more with people who tried to modify a car but break it instead, rather than a group of car experts who know everything in advance and make very few mistakes. Try out and find out, that is fun part of their project series.
That being said, if a machine requires you to be super knowledgeable and make very few mistakes, is it a good machine?
"That being said, if a machine requires you to be super knowledgeable and make very few mistakes, is it a good machine?" ... Well just because someone doesn't know how to fly doesn't mean that planes are somehow bad
@@codemy666 not quite… airplanes are never designed to be piloted by the masses. However, airplanes that crash or require engine overhaul (*wink) because of the slightest pilot’s mistake still suck.
@@rezhaadriantanuharja3389 Cars aren't built to be modified by clueless teenagers either
@@codemy666 they sure aren’t. However, some can be modified by them, which makes those cars great tuner cars
@@codemy666 sure, but I would say a car that can be is more appealing to me than a car that can’t. Like if I’m going to be modifying a car, I would prefer a platform that is forgiving over one that will blow up with the slightest mistake
I honestly think donut just showed a perfect example of how a new owner to a subie feels. I'm sure donut put research and clearly time into their builds but ultimately didn't know as much as the subaru community. I don't own a subie bc of how finicky they are, love the cars but I can't justify the time investment of picking up someone else's rebuild
Also they have production deadlines, so time wasn’t on their side
Exactly
Donut got help from at least 2x Subaru WRX/STI experts to get along those 2projects. They did more anyone else to get the things right.
You hit the nail right on the head. My buddy had an STI and he had to be on top of everything to make the car reliable. They are bad cars since the majority of Subaru problems are specific to Subarus. The people who say you just need to know what you are doing are already on their 3rd engine
@@deadheadcentral2514 yep, there are 3 things you never ask, A girl her age, a man his salary and a subbie how much he spend on the engine.
I had the same exact takeaway from the Donut series. Still think they are a great platform, but for being the type of car they are marketed as you shouldn’t have to be a Subaru expert just to enjoy the car at a track.
I don’t consider the money spent “wasted”, I found it highly entertaining throughout, ESPECIALLY when “Subaru things” kept popping up and throwing a spanner in the works
The issue is that they want to build time attack cars. What series can the hi car meaningfully participate in? Well at least not the GTS or gridlife
Was watching this while rebuilding my Saabaru and I took comfort in the shared suffering of the issues they ran into. Guess it’s just something that comes with the car!
@@plaguebomb2712 cope
Being in the Subaru community for 10 years now you absolutely nailed it. They are extremely temperamental and are much less forgiving. But they are lots of fun when done right.
The part where is said "they're incredibly affordable" is crazy tho
@1upJeCK they are really cheap to buy for the most part. Some of the more sought after STI's are getting up there but a normal wrx is pretty cheap. Especially if it's already broken lol. Now modifying, building and maintaining? Not so much.
On point .. “when done right”
I wonder how much research Donut did before they jumped into this platform. I think they should have done Civics for time attack cars. Not cause Subarus are bad, but because they demand more attention and care than most platforms.
Hmmm, you might be onto something, civics are harder to screw up.
Subarus are garbage for anything other than daily driving.
We can assume next to no research
They probably were asked to do Subaru's tbh. It's such a popular platform ya know?
@@AlexMartini. makes sense, I just feel they should have done some homework on the whole platform before jumping into it.
😂 I own a b5 s4 and what you said about it is 100% accurate… I’ve been building cars since I was 16 and this is my favourite/most hate car I’ve owned. Like you said when it’s working it’s the best car… when it’s not I am crying (most of the time)
As a new to the platform subaru guy, I have to say, a big reason I even felt confident enough to get into the scene is because one of my best friends is already a Subaru certified tech. If I didn’t have him all the work we’ve done on my car and a lot of the things I’ve had to fix would have been so much more daunting and frustrating. So my advice to anyone wanting to work on WRX’s or STI’s is to have a friend who someone in your town who knows the platform well and is willing to help you learn.
true, plus the subaru scene is sooo large and friendly, they are out there
Facts. I went from not being able to change my oil a few years ago and with the help of a couple friends and smeedia / motoIQ's vids I'm building my first engine soon. If you're willing to learn, building subarus and maintaining them is easy
I’m getting certified at my school for Subarus and I believe Subaru have a lot of potential, Subarus have always been my favorite cars growing up
That is exactly how I feel about my mk4 gti build. I never would have considered a vw if my buddy wasn't a German car wiz
I got mine bc my dad is a master tech and MN has a great subie fb group filled with knowledge lol
tbh if your experts shared so much information it would have been nice to have a technical section where we get some of that expert info relayed to us.
As someone who loves subaru and doughnut, this video was extremely well worded. Side note, hope to bring my mk8 golf r to some meets this year, I live in Sheboygan.
Hope to see you in May for the Season Opener sir!
Damn is Alex from Wisconsin?
So where tf is that then
From my perspective, just as a car enthusiast, former Subaru owner, and former mechanic/dealership trade in manager, donut kinda should’ve known better. Subarus are known to be extremely fickle beasts so I wasn’t surprised at all that they went through so many engines. I’ve experienced the purest joy of Subaru ownership (a blown engine while basically stock) myself and said never again will I invest in this platform. It’s kinda like how I love rotaries but understand I’m going to have to do a rebuild every so often if I ever get an FD. The subie community also shouldn’t hate on donut for showcasing what reality is like for ~20 years of ej owners lol
And don’t forget the shit show 5 speed…
People are just salty and inhaling compium. Cause Subaru's haven't been reliable since the Colin Mcrae rally days. And even though the whole car itself was durable as hell. The head gaskets and other small problems would probably still be frequent. Especially if abused anywhere near that level.
Honestly A lot of performance cars are fickle things. Going from the Toyota 86 platform to the subaru every car is just a luck of the draw. I've heard of people blowing engines at stocked and some people who defie the laws of logic and some how dont blow their engines. And buying someone elses project can be a dangerous thing because people love to beat their shit till they get tired of it. So in the long run its luck you got a proper built one out of factory or a proper taken cared of one.
@@brenton490 The bottom line is that it typically costs a significant amount of money to go fast reliably and consistently. 90's vehicles designed manufactured in Japan sort of spoiled most of us - they were essentially low maint high beat down machines... now vehicles are just a lot more complex - and so is the risk...
@@brenton490 Also need to keep in mind that probably almost all used WRXs have been abused to one extent, or a large extent by some 20 year old. Having bought one from new, and properly cared for it, it has been extremely reliable for 10 years.
Alex, you nailed this. You did a fantastic job being objective here, which is something that very few other people can claim. Great job!
Agreed
I was going to write the same.
Subaru is a wonderful platform, for some people.
I never worked on one because of all of the things that you explained and stirred me towards other Japanese or European brands..
Thank you sir! I tried my best to keep it fair and open. I want people to maybe see the bigger underlining "issue" vs. just blaming one side or another!
Basically argument of the Subaru community: "Donut doesn't know what they're doing because they didn't know all the special little bits of information about how this car breaks if you put parts on it"
It's indeed like rotaries.
But I think the difference is that rotary guys know it's not always an ideal platform but they accept it and it actually makes them more motivated.
While I feel a lot of subbie guys don't like when their car is seen as bad.
Kinda like that meme with the guy crying but with a mask over it vs the blonde Chad guy that just accepts it.
These are assumptions based on the fact that this is happening.
All people with a subbie I met irl are all amazing and I'm sure they're just passionate about their car.
All you have to do is watch the shmeedia video about this situation to realize you are 100% correct. Those dudes defend theses cars SO hard for no reason. I mean the amount of deflection was insane.
Should donut Media have installed baffled pans and broken the motors in? Well, yea.
But let's be honest, would you expect a Rallie inspired AWD car to have oil starvation issues this bad?
Absolutely not, but they'll defend that "it's not a bad design" all day...
@@Saltyoldguy-hey are just misunderstood, and that goes for both Doritos and subies.
They can both be reliable, and they can both make power. The problem, is that it is VERY hard to do both at the same time.
The oil starvation is well known, and standard to change oil pan for better pickup. So is apex seals, which you help by premix oil in tank.
Now talk about their non turbo engines, the ej22 and 13b non turbos go for quarter million miles every day. Turbos are the Bain of both plataforms
Yeah, we rotary guys know what we're getting into. And any mistakes are mostly ours because of how finicky they are. Complete oposite of binmer guys XD
@@oliviervankleef1358 If subaru engines were so great, enthusiasts will be swapping them into other cars all over the place.
Yet, K-swaps abound. The fact that subarus require more caution and attention is a disadvantage, not an advantage. The only subbie engine have going for it is flat motor novelty.
If a Team of UA-camrs can't do it 95% of Us would be Screwed too.
This nails it really well, especially on comparison to the B5 S4 and the RX7. All VERY touchy and finnicky cars- if you know what you're doing in respect to the platform, you're golden. But if you expect it to be easy, or expect to be able to treat it like literally anything else on the road, it'll bite back.
How much of a psychopath does someone need to be to see Donut Media go through like 5 engines and say "The problem must be that they don't know what they're doing"
Ignoring the fact that they work out of a shop with a lot of professional mechanics, we've seen them do a bunch of different builds....if a Subaru is too difficult for them then my only take away is that 99% of the people out there shouldn't touch the brand since it's just so insanely complicated.
The reality is that these aren't new cars and we're seeing why a common failure point is called a COMMON failure point. Some bad engineering doesn't help either, but I guess we should just be thankful the Pontiac Fiero doesn't have "passionate" fans.
Collector Car Feed said it best in their Hard Truth WRX video: Subaru's are special needs cars.
+1 for Collector Car Feed and their WRX video. And all their other videos, too
Based collector car feed knowledge
Subaru's are special needs cars: in other words, they are disable! lol
Glad I'm not the only one who made that connection.
Abort them before they blow an engine
At what point do you call a platform bad for the enthusiast community? Turboed Subarus are "amazing" except you have to do several expensive X, Y, and Z modifications to get them to survive any sort of turning. Also they have crappy piston rings and a top mounted intercooler. You can throw a lot of money and time addressing their shortcomings and, if you do the slightest thing wrong (or not, Subarus be Subarus), they will blow up again and again.
Yeah.
Sounds like a great platform to me!
I’ve spent some time with the donut team and they are not incompetent by any means.Subarus boxer platform is sensitive and requires a bit more work. I believe the series donut produced exposed those weak points that an average enthusiast may see first hand.
My main criticism of Donut during that series, is after the second failure they should have brought a subaru expert onboard to help them out.
I think "driven media" make difference they with their series and proven Subarus aren't bad platform but they make middle ground
@@Yugophoto I disagree I think it was valuable to show how bad the cars are when a regular person tries to work on them
@@PhantasmPhoton translation "when you don't do your research"
It's actually kind of insane that you argue donut intentionally made mistakes
@@PhantasmPhoton And let's be honest, The Donut boys are not 'regular people'. They're race car drivers (Adam, Nolan), enthusiasts, people with degrees in mechanical engineering, people who have built PLENTY of engines and cars over the years. Just not Subaru specifically, and that goes to show that Subarus require you to know about Subarus, not just about cars. Of course all cars and platforms have their own quirks and pros and cons, but these guys aren't just regular people. The platform has problems. Problems that can be mitigated, sure, but it shouldn't require a PHD to simply track a car a few times without it dying. They were having engine issues before they really modded the engine at all. If you want to say 'Oh well, after they put on a big turbo and flashed it, sure, anything can happen then.' but these were essentially EXTREMELY mild mods at first and they still grenaded. I take other issues with the series, such as saying that the cheap turbo was 'worse' simply because it made less peak power without actually giving the specs of the turbos purchased, but that's neither here nor there.
The unfortunate truth is that EJs need a hell of a lot of “preparation” to be reliable on track. It’s likely Donut chose that platform mostly because it has a large number of dedicated followers to ensure clicks. Scooby owners are die hards, they accept all the conditions that come with the platform. The problem with a lot of these automotive channels is that they are run by people who like cars at a superficial level, casual fans if you will. The EJ25 doesn’t suit that kind of attitude.
I was done with Subaru when our 2009 Legacy blew up trying to get up to highway speeds one day. We did the headgasket job the year prior, had no warning lights and no other indicators that would tell us that what was coming. Of course, we just lost our dog a month before that so needless to say, we didn't have the money to fix it and ended up buying a 2008 VW Rabbit. Even with all that car's problems, we love that thing and it hasn't tried to kill itself yet.
I bought a low millage single owner Subaru Legacy with my savings from a part-time job a a year ago.the car had no issues but the engine on it blew up on my trip from Saskatchewan to Alberta . The trip was completely ruined and had to pay a lot of money to the tow it back to Saskatchewan only to realise it needs an engine replacement. Insurance in my province wouldn't cover it unless the damage is related to a crash,theft or vandalism.All of my money totally wasted and I only had the car for a month. From that day onwards i swore that I would rather spend my money on drugs than buy another Subaru.
The cars service history was in the glove box and it was well maintained from the looks of it.
I have a Subaru legacy 3.0r spec.b with the original engine at 230xxx kilometres. Engine has never had any issues, and is now taking a turbocharger pushing 10psi / 400HP to the wheels
@@johnmcgovern1418 that's cool and all, but that 6cyl isn't even in the same engine family so I'd imagine there would be a whole different set of issues.
@@johnmcgovern1418 You turbo charged a car that has 230k kilometers without doing an engine rebuild?
I personally think you hit the head on the nail with this response they don’t take more knowledge to be done right and aren’t the easiest to work on but they are definitely still great cars I have heard plenty of nightmare stories and as well as it’s the best car ever stories and the differences between the two people is the amount of time they have put into finding out how to properly take care of them
I'd say this is spot on 🔥 Killed it my man 🫡
Thanks man! Appreciate all the support you gave on the topic! Truly helped me out a TON!
@@AlexMartini. anytime good sir 🫡
I don’t get how so many people missed that they said they had baffled oil pans the whole time. It was later in the series that they noted it, but they said they had them on the whole time because they knew!!!!!
They’re temperamental cars. I’m running equal headers, Cobb 20g turbo and cooling mods. Have to watch engine temps, oil and accessport readings before getting on it. Demands a lot of attention and you have to have everything in order such as quality parts and fueling. Can’t skip out on anything.
Someone who is doing it right!!!!
Same here! Havent had any issues at alll but i will admit the initial cost and the amount of research i did just to get it right would land me a bachelors degree in EJ257
There is a shop near me that specializes and races Subarus. They flat out told me if I ever planned on buying a STi, and want to do anything beyond a bolt on car, I should budget $20k for a proper build to make it reliable. Even then, high chance something will go wrong if driven hard. They recommended a baffled oil pan and pickup on even a bone stock car if you plan on tracking or doing any extended canyon carving.I love Subarus, but when you start pricing things out, you have to have an obsession with them for it to make sense compared to other platforms for that kind of money.
that...really doesn't sound like fun.
That sounds like total fuckimg bullshit i hate having to keep my AP plugged in really kills the joy being paranoid about shit
Donut embarrassed themselves with this series and it is genuinely harmful to the car community by reinforcing internet memes instead of good info and reducing the chances we even get more performance Subaru models. Yes, we Subaru people get upset, because this is not helpful to anyone and it's solely for the sake of views. Subaru has flaws, but so does every brand. In Vermont I see Subaru vehicles get abused and driven hard daily without constant failures. I'll leave it at that.
Looking at the scrap pile at the local Subaru tuning shop, I would say the EJ has its fair share of issues 🤣
My buddy sold his STI because it would randomly pull 10 degrees of timing, and apparently that’s just normal for EJ’s to do. My buddy couldn’t take the stress of dealing with all of the “quirks” Subarus have
Most people will talk about how you need to know how to take care of these cars, but won’t acknowledge that pretty much any other car doesn’t have these problems. Also every Subaru owner I know is on at least their 2nd engine, so even if you know what they are doing they will die on you anyway
@@deadheadcentral2514 My fried just put in his 3rd engine. This time went with a IAG block as the local shop has had grate luck with them. Just put down 483 on a mustang dyno at 26 psi. Looking for more power this summer as they only could get the fuel to E68.
@@deadheadcentral2514 That's not an engine flaw it's a tuning flaw and yes the factory tune is designed to be safer.
@@802Garage Dude was running an off the shelf COBB stage 1 tune with all of the supporting mods. He took it to two separate Subaru shops they both said nothing was wrong and that it’s normal for that to happen. There’s just too many issues unique to Subarus only for them to be good cars
@@therealpofo The IAG blocks are really nice, that’s what our local Subaru shop uses. 483 in an AWD Subaru is gonna feel like a rocketship
Subaru fanboys are missing the point entirely. Your platform shouldn't be this easy to break. The 350z wasn't, and that's made by a company that uses rubber bands for a transmission.
I ended up on the Audi platform, knowing full well it can be expensive. Doing your research and having a fundamental understanding of what problems can affect each production run is key to keeping your money in your wallet.
Dude if an engine requires you too have the knowledge of a mechanic for a specific engine design that only one platform uses and even having it u still blow up the engine just by taking it one's to the track. That's not a good engine, it's just a bad design that Subaru keeps putting in cars, because they refuse too invest in a complete engine design replacement. If you need too change half the part's in engine that's in a performance car just too be able to take it too the track it's a shit engine.
I have to agree with most of what you said. Any compent build is going to take a sizable amount of cash & patience...and let's be honest. Most enthusiasts can be short on both. Stock Subies are cool cars, beyond stock tho I feel it gets sketch If you're not fully vested long haul
In their defense no one that buys a Subaru knows how to take care of it
Even the new ones aren't all that great. My bud still blew an axle on his 22 at 160 miles another at 2500 and 1st and 2nd at 5000 miles. To be fair, he wasn't easy on it, but for a manual sports car it should have taken the abuse. He wasn't beating on it half as hard as the 94 mustang gt he drove before it, and that car lasted 220k miles until it sucked water in the intake. And even after that, the damn thing ran for 2 weeks before it reluctantly stopped hot starting. Still ran until the engine was pulled lmao 302s are indestructible.
Got to love honda's. Drop the car from the moon and it still runs.
Exactly, I'm seriously considering to sell my C63 to get the new Type R, looks like an absolute menace.
Rotary Chads: We know our cars break down a lot.
Subaru Betas: No, it's not a shitbox, i ain't coping for paying a ridiculous amount of money for such an unreliable car.
1.9tdi Sigmas: What does an oil change mean?
The global community just needs to see older Subarus like they do with the rotary and it would be fine. Imagine If there was a video response for every rx8 that blew up in a UA-camrs video.
The difference is rotaries have NEVER been considered super mega reliable.
Subaru built their rep on bulletproof reliability bullshit.
And they never were.
Ok a leone or a thelike were decent but when they came to libertys and imprezzas they fell over big time but still flog on about being tough and reliable.
@@sugarnads Except they were, as in the CARS were reliable. Not the engines. YOU idiots keep failing to make the distinction.
@@sugarnadsyou nailed it on the head. Subaru puts out an image of reliability. And to be fair, their daily commute cars that aren’t being pushed to redline do make it to 200k a lot of the time. But with a Rotary I know the Apex seals won’t make it much farther past 80k. I know what to expect in terms of reliability. I’m also not worried I’m going to blow a Dorito at the track smacking redline. They are reliable enough to make it. Subarus on the other hand just don’t seem to like doing high revs too much. My friend got his dream car, an old bug eye WRX. Drove it for a few months, not super hard but he did get in it from time to time. Just like anyone would in a sporty car. Engine popped. He didn’t track it. Wasn’t taking hard corners to let the oil slosh around. It just blew going in a straight line. He was devastated
Perfect take with nuance. The rotary comparison is spot on
I think it's a little ridiculous that a car marketed as a "performance" car can't be driven as such without modifications to keep it from blowing up. I loved my bugeye WRX. I got it in a trade for my 8th gen Si that I was definitely not a fan of. The WRX was fun to drive, made decent power, handled really well and looked awesome on coilovers with wide black RPF1s...but I always felt like I was on borrowed time. I knew that if it blew up, it would cost a fortune to get an engine done right. ThatDudeinBlue had an excellent video on what it really takes to have an EJ rebuilt correctly for longevity and power. Seeing that, I can see that probably 95% of people won't do what it really takes.. either because of cost or the effort involved. I knew that if mine blew up, I didn't want to half ass it and I couldn't afford it to be done 100% right...and I would lose my butt on the car having a shell I couldn't sell or an endless project. I made an effort to sell the car while it was in tip top running condition with all the awesome parts I installed and cash out ASAP.
Right! But you can take a stock Corolla or Civic and beat the shit out of it and if there is always some oil on the dipstick, it's going to live forever!
This video is fantastic! Having gone from an Impreza to an SRT-4 to a FiST, I’ve learned that every car platform needs needs 3 different thing from you as the owner. Patience, a willingness to learn, and enthusiasm. If you skip any of these things, you’re in for a bad time.
Which one of thoes 3 were your favorite , I love the srt4 but I think the fist is better as a daily
As a fellow FiST owner we're pretty spoiled though. Not much wrong with these cars besides learning to love the *click* *click* *click* *click* from constantly shearing the teeth on our blend door actuators
I haven't even watched the whole video but I'll drop this. Subaru's are GARBAGE. And I've owned both a 2011 WRX and a 2013 sit and a 2003 JDM Forester. The forester was the best, hands down. The reason that they're garbage is because everyone who buys them thinks that they can make MASSIVE power just by adding an intake, exhaust, a shit COBB tune and maybe some wheels, tires and suspension. And then they rat bag these cars and pass them on to the public after being absolutely destroyed. My WRX lasted 2000 kms and then the engine left the chat...and I'll be honest when I say I didn't drive it that hard. It was cruising at 60 mph when it decided to die. My STi, the previous owner had decided to put "lowering springs" on it and completely ruin the alignment causing me to go through two sets of front tires in the span on ONE YEAR of ownership. Yes, we all want them to be cool, we all want to be Ken Block or Colin McCrae or Petter Solberg.....but we need to realize the work that it takes to make those cars that good and stop thinking just because we buy an accessport that that will happen....never mind the clutch on my STi that I had to replace after a couple months.
The forester was bulletproof after 200k kms. I miss that car daily. And it's only because it wasn't modified and it was taken care of. 225 hp is enough.
Thanks for coming to my Ted Talk.
I think most people don't realise once you finish building a engine you have to "run-in" the engine again for about 1000miles to be on the safe side. If you don't and rev the balls off it, it can lead to a long list of issues that are irrepairable without pulling the engine back apart.
It all depends on how it's built. I.e. like race motors, if the car doesn't even see 1000miles a year how will it ever be broken in?
A base wrx is honestly more comparable to an Audi A4 than a S4. I don't get why people think that a wrx is anywhere comparable to an STI in terms of being a performance car. The Wrx is what the Civic SI is to the Type R, it's just a souped up Impreza not a bargain race car.
I just don't like Suburu guys because they all have the same beard.
And after watching that hi/lo, I lost all respect for the platform. I would literally never own one. I own a 370z and it's been an amazing first sports car experience. It's a 2009 with almost 120k on the odo. Not a single thing on it has failed, ever. I've upgraded things just to upgrade them, never because they were broken. Watch the hi/lo they did with the 350z and compare it to the shitshow that was the WRX series.
Quality,unbiased and educational are just some of the good things to say about this video
If Subarus were a pain AND awesome, that would be one thing. M/AMG/LS7/Voodoo engines are less troublesome than Subie engines and special enough to actually be worth the effort. A turbo K24 will do everything an EJ25 will do, but better. Plus, if you fix the known problems on most engines, they'll run forever; a Subie engine could be fully built and still grenade for no reason.
I’m really loving your investigative journalism in the car community. I really hope you keep finding stories to dig into.
I appreciate that man, i'm trying! There's so many stories I wanna talk about so PLEASE tell me if there's something out there that you love!
USDM Turbo Subarus are hot garbage, there’s a reason why the aftermarket industry is selling thousands of engines a year.
This should help keep prices down
Haha exactly what I'm thinking. If people want to bash and not try out the platform then that just makes them cheaper for those who really do appreciate it.
This is completely accurate.
It's not that the guys don't know what they're doing, it's that you shouldn't have to worry about your fucking oil pickup. You shouldn't have a performance vehicle outside of the 1900s that doesn't have a baffle in the oil pan.
You shouldn't have an engine that can frag itself so easily. That has a massive lack of crankcase ventilation. That has oil consumption issues. Oil consumption issues on engines that are considered modern.
It's just a bad platform and if you fix everything it'll work but most people will not fix everything and they will have issues
Maybe if they vaped and read hentai they subaru gods wouldve come down and bless them with a reliable engine
Donut turbo’d used VQ’s and a junkyard LS and a completely fresh LS and didn’t have any of these issues. And one of the blown engines on the subaru was a car they literally just bought to replace the wrecked car. No track time no nothing and completely stock. There is literally zero excuse. Not to mention the STI is supposed to be the track focused model. All these kids on maximum cope mode trying to blame donut just prove how cultish and blind people are just based off internet hype. But they never learn. There are so many cars that are cheaper, faster, have more modding potential, look better, and don’t blow up. It is 0 IQ to sit there and try to act like they aren’t trash.
As a WRX owner I agree, they are more temperamental but still a great car. I also agree with what some others have said, want to have a great, reliable experience with a WRX? Leave is stock or just do some aesthetics. Getting into the powertrain requires a lot of knowledge and being prepared for things to be harder.
“Pay to play” on these platforms forsure. As an FA20 owner the tune itch is real but gotta have that rebuild money set aside first
5th engine guy reporting for duty XD ✋
I watched Mr. Subaru's video and he makes quite a few moronic claims, namely that the wrx is perfectly fine you just have to swap out half the parts since they are street parts, really? I thought the wrx is supposed to be a rally car, you can't possibly claim it's a fine car you just have to change out the entire transmission and immediately swap out the oil pan, it's like claiming yeah, cars with the infamous iron duke are perfectly fine and reliable, you just have to swap out the iron duke, or imagine claiming the Porsche 911 is reliable unless you push it or it will totally break down, because that was what Mr. Subaru said about the wrx, reliable on the road, but if you push it on the track it will break down because of the lack of baffling, WRX stands for World Rally Experimental, if it can't handle a track it sure as hell can't handle rallying.
The challenge here is that reputation DRIVES how much research people do. If a platform has a reputation for being reliable, they won't feel the need to do a ton of deep dive research. Admitting they're complex to modify SHOULD be their reputation. When fans won't accept reality as the cars rep, that's what leads to incomplete understanding by new owners.
I like Subaru's from a distance. Hell, I'm still looking for a nice quality Manual Forester because of your videos mentioning them. I was looking at them for my first car even!
I just feel in this age, making one mistake (buying the wrong car) is very frustrating because it feels like too much of a set back. Which is why people want to get it so right the first time.
I don't think a Subi is a "get it right the first time" car. If you do, you're lucky.
I will give them props where it's due, I don't think there is a better sounding 4cyl out there.
And, not EVERY car can/will be amazing. Some have to be a learning experience.
Love your stuff Alex
The only way to truly "get it right the first time" is to either build the motor right to a "T", or don't build the motor at all. Obviously some people would get mad at the second option but that's what I chose, and I am fine with it.
I hope you do get your Forester one day, it really is a nice platform. I don't think there is any car that's perfect, they all have there issues.
Garbage engines yielded garbage results who could've thought.
I invite anyone with a turbocharged EJ to hook up a oil pressure gauge to your turbo oil feed and have a buddy watch it at idle and at like 4500rpm and see how little oil pressure your turbo gets at idle and at higher RPMs its why EJs consume turbos like they're poptarts.
Theres a reason Subaru cannot wait to get away from the EJ motor.
Bro, lemme fix your hair real quick -Alex’s Cat
He cleaned me up good for the video ofc.
I was hoping that you would break down the information that you'd received from the subaru heads you'd talked to in relation to what Donut had "done wrong" on their Hi-Lo series. Instead we got some rambles and vague guesses. You ended up saying, "the people who complained had good and bad comments on donut... and the subaru guys had good and bad comments on donut... but if donut knew all these things in the end, then theyd do better." then you just monologued generally about if you know about issues then you would avoid them???? what is this video dude....
There was nothing of substance to encourage people to get into this platform and you did a horrible job explaining any kind of real issues of this platform.
Excellent take and episode
HiLow Season 3 is a cautionary tale that not all build will go as expected and to research your ish.
I think it’s crazy how specialist defend their car, when the car as is, is a POS. In a general sense, not everyone is gonna know the kinks of a car, and as general mechanics donut media had every right to shit on Subaru. It’s ok if you like them, but at least acknowledge it’s a shit car you love to deal with. Most cars don’t blow up when drive them for 200 miles regardless of issues they deal with. But Subarus do
Agreed Alex, great synopsis. I bought a 2003 SRX that had been converted to STI with the 2004 engine and trans. I loved that car, loved the way it looked, loved the way it sounded, loved the attention it garnered, until it broke...twice. I blew the first motor at streets of willow, oil pump failed. Spent 10k having a local LA subaru builder rebuild it, even had to install a new turbo after the original one failed on the dyno, not the cars fault (it turned out to be a cheap chinese knock off). Drove and tracked the car a few more years and then blew another motor. I never looked into why it failed as at that point I figured it was going to take 15K to get the car to where I wanted and I just didnt want to spend that much on that car. I sold if with the blown motor for $3500 and bought a 2013 Ford Focus ST. I have tracked this car at least as much as the Suby and have only had to replace the failed rear sway bar mounts. Subarus definitely take some special knowledge and just dont think they take power-adding parts unless you spend ALOT of money. JMHO.
I had an 04 WRX with the EJ205 and 5 speed manual for my first "performance" car. Reliability wise, it took 4 years of hard driving for something to finally break, 2nd gear on a hard launch. Sure, the clutch burned up, but then again doing a 180 in the snow and trying to clutch drop going back the other way will do that to an OEM clutch. Blown out suspension, I probably shouldn't have been jumping it. Out of all the vehicles I have owned, the WRX was the toughest damn car I've owned, any issues it had were my own damn fault.
I like Subarus, but I wasn't mad. EJ25s blow up, I've killed one myself and I was just driving on the highway. It's part of the ownership experience.
Subaru people - the only people that refer to engine replacements as a mod
they refer to engine replacements as 'regular maintenance'
"blown head gasket? i havent had one of those in weeks" - average subaru dickrider
It's a more realistic representation of what normal guys would go through modding their cars. If the platform is difficult than maybe it was best for this series to be seen by would be Subaru owners. Not a bad car by any means. But most Hondas would laugh at those mods and keep humming like a sewing machine. There is a reason why Hondas are usually the best starter build cars. More forgiving platforms help grow young tuners without discouraging them.
Subie bois: "Subarus are great ........ proceeds to give a long list of everything you should do just to keep it reliable. "
And yet they wonder why people make fun of both Subaru and the drivers, ironic
The list is very short actually, don't mod it.
Sometimes I wonder what they put in their vapes
@unoPara this is all about modding cars. Missed the whole point.
@@ryanwilliams5904 Modding cars is decrasing the reliability on any car, especailly if you have no clue what you are doing, just like donut did.
@unoPara proceeds to need a baffled oil pan just to prevent oil starvation
Subaru isn't great.. what's new? No matter who comes in to defend it, they aren't the best. Donut experienced what every other regular person would experience if they tried the same stuff.
Don't be a Subaru guy and don't own a Subaru, who doesn't know this..?
As someone who owns a VA WRX, and a N/A 2002 Forester, I still think they're both good platforms, but taking good care of them and reading more information about them is key to make your EJ/FA Subaru reliable.
The problem with Subarus isn't the cars, It's the owners. The only people who think Subarus are good/reliable are the fan boys. The are cool cars but are they well designed? NOPE!
One of the only people in the car industry to hit the nail on the head with this one.
I raced this guy who was driving a Subaru sti. His car is a 2019. I drive a Veloster N. When we started racing we were neck and neck until his car bogged down and white smoke started coming out of his car. I ended up pulling over and I backed up my car until I was close to his car. I didn’t know the guy, but I also didn’t want to leave him stuck on the side of the interstate. Turns out his engine blew. I felt so bad for him. I waited with him until the tow truck came and I ended up giving him a ride home. We ended up becoming friends.
Great video! Your becoming the go to channel on anything cars for me
Yo Alex i think you've been hacked. I got a reply from UA-cam saying it was you, and I won a grand prize. And to contact them on a chat app. They felt insulted by a modified suspension question. Then they wanted naked pics.
I wanted a WRX for my first projects and decided to get a Civic SI instead because I new they’d be easier for a novice to own. I’ll still own a WRX or STI though. They seem like really fun platforms.
Let’s be real hear they have done this series with plenty of vehicles that weren’t even half this problematic. Everyone wants blame them or say they should have done this or that. The reality is they went through 5 motors within a few months which is insane. Sure boxers require a lot more work but it’s also the reason most car manufacturers done use them. They are temperamental by design and not set up for success. Most of the issues they ran into are things Subaru should have addressed. It’s definitely not a bolt on friendly platform by any means. If you compare it to other platforms they just fall short in a lot of areas imo. That being said I think Subarus have communities with some of the coolest people.
I am the 3rd owner of a fully built 15 sti. It was scary at first but I did the research, had it PROFESIONALLY looked at by a shop that I trust and even got the build list and contacted the previous owner. I LOVE IT. Not even a Subaru guy, just a car guy with a subaru. And honestly, I think they're great cars and LOVED donut media series on it. They really don't deserve the hate.
Just bought a 15 WRX with pretty low miles, I was the 3rd owner but it was sold by a pretty good dealer in TX. I feel like most people don't really have issues unless you're doing something really crazy to it or sending her too hard.
@@VB_Bryan It depends how well you take care of them. I'm the 2nd owner of my STI and it was on its 3rd engine before the car hit 100,000 miles. 2nd motor blew up before I had the car for a year, so both of the failures were probably because of the first owner. I've taken care of the 3rd motor since the beginning, and it's been fine since.
You listened, and we as a car community appreciate that, thank you! All I have to say!
Thank you so much!
I've researched a lot and if you want a Fast Reliable Subaru engine you must first install a Oil Catch can system Then forged engine build, basically spend 15k
Mrsubaru himself put it in the easiest terms for people to understand: "the most unreliable thing about subarus, are the drivers."
So if you want to buy a Subaru you're going to have to spend extra just to bring it to reliable operation level...would say find a platform that operates how it should out of the box
(I own a c63 btw I've learnt my lesson the hard way)
I'm personally glad everyone is scared of them right now. Might be able to pick one up for cheap before everyone realizes they're not that bad.
I think entusiasts should be more willing to admit that their car is unreliable. I mean that's part of the fun isn't it? The reason you own it is because if you put in the time to get over the reliability issues the car is super rewarding.
I own an RX-8 and see a lot of similarities in the rotary community and subaru community. People seem to think that admitting their car is unreliable is some kind of sign of weakness when in fact it's the opposite. Fuck yeah I own an unreliable car, but I work on it and maintain it as much as necessary so that when people get in they can't tell that it's unreliable.
The biggest thing i got out of the situation is like you said " subarus are harder to work on" and as long as you keep it stock and dont "abuse" the car you will be fine. If you are going to track it in any way. You better do all the supporting mods!
There are 3 things you should never ask. A woman her age, a man his salary, and a subbie owner money spent on the engine.