Vaush vs Destiny Debate - Morality of Kyle Rittenhouse
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- Опубліковано 7 чер 2024
- Date streamed: 8/26/2020
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Timestamps:
00:00 - Introductions
01:58 - Morality of First Gun Shots
14:36 - Open vs Concealed Carrying Firearms
23:32 - Life in Threat + Intent
30:48 - Lethal Defense
38:14 - Behavior on Stream
40:24 - Morality of Second Gun Shots
46:52 - Ahmaud Arbery
50:42 - Mob Rule
01:05:48 - Analogy to School Shooting
01:10:39 - Conclusion
01:18:04 - Reviewing Debate
Produced by Render
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Music:
►OUTRO: / cc6-mastered-3-conflict
"If you open carry, you should expect to get attacked, and can't use your weapon to defend yourself" - Vaush basically
It's like when the media made that Sandman kid famous then went "It wasn't libel and slander because he's famous". Somehow it's your fault for what they did.
Watch him change his tune when a proud boy menaces a trans activist whose open carrying
Imagine chasing someone with a gun and being surprised when you get shot.
Thanks. I thought i went crazy... to me vaushs position sounds like "If you open carry you already escalated the situation to the extent that anyone can feel threatens by you and thus attack you",
maybe im too german to get the american perspective, but if you or your property gets threatened you have the right to defend it. And even if the thing you have to protect you is a minigun, you have the right to do so. But as soon as the perceived attacker turn their back on you you are a coward to continue to attack and loose your right to self defence.....
You are right.But could you really live a conscience free life after killing a person?
@@tarhunta2111 If I truly felt my life was in danger? YES. Their life is not more important than my own and they are the one actually putting both at risk.
@@tarhunta2111 not really, but better than being attacked and not defending yourself
@@tarhunta2111 of course you can, the only problem is dipshits like this guy who try to convince you and everyone else that you did something morally wrong when you didn't.
Vaush taking a sec, thinking about it, and deciding "yes, you should submit to the mob" is the pinnacle of tribal politics.
Vaush is a monster who would use "The Greater Good" to justify anything.
Well let's be clear Vash doesn't mind if a person is beaten nearly to death
@@RediTtora-sx1hbwell, he does if they’re black and the people doing the beating aren’t black, lol
Right because it's his mob. Destiny tried to demonstrate to him that if the mob had pointy white hats vaush would be singing a different tune. And vaush is so dishonest there's no getting thru.
The "Mob" back on the day lynched many black people....
To think that a chat full of people agree with Vaush is scary
Not really they'll never fight back.
Thankfully they're all twelve year olds with zero friends and real world experience. Luckily most of them will figure out how stupid he is by the time they're 16 whereas vaush hasn't grown at all since he was 12.
@@HapCollins23lol
@@HapCollins23😂😂😂
Anyone agreeing with destiny is a clown lmao
“You have to wait until the aggressor kills you before you can defend yourself” for about 90 minutes.
@@SeasoningTheObese The prosecution LITERALLY said this. "You thought he was going to shoot you his gun, and that's why you shot him? Did he shoot you?" I wish I was joking, I may be paraphrasing slightly but he definitely asked Kyle "But he didn't shoot you?" in a way to imply that Kyle couldn't have known he was in danger because he didn't get shot.
@@Winasaurus don’t you know it’s only ok to defend yourself if a nuclear warhead drops on your head
@@Islamphobe "Mr Rittenhouse, you know that Mr Rosenbaum wasn't on a 25 kill streak, so there's no way he had the tactical nuke yet, is there? He had a harrier or chopper gunner at most, and you STILL shot him?"
@@Winasaurus can’t believe are judges let white supremacists like him get away truly disgusting
@@Islamphobe
The “You play Call of Duty right?” angle was frickkn hilarious.
The evil video games made him do it…😂😂😂
Here’s a cool stat, 100% of the people that didn’t try to physically assult a guy with a rifle that night, didn’t get merk’d
One of the people had a gun. What would you think if he had shot Kyle instead of putting his hands up and he was the one in court pleading self defense? Was that his mistake, bringing a gun to a gunfight but not shooting when he had the chance?
@@Hedning1390 in the video where gaige approached kyle and asked what happened, kyle told him he was going to the police. Gaige had no business trying to disarm kyle. Kyle gad said he was going to the police, at the time he said it, he was running in the direction of the police. The mob could have followed him and made sure he turned himself in. But instead, gaige and a bunch of people who had only “heard” he shot somebody took the law into their own hands. They fucked around and they found out.
To answer your question, no, in that situation I would still say gaige is in the wrong, kyle admitted he shot someone to gaige and was going to the police. However, gaige had no idea about the first shooting. Sure, kyle said he shot someone but gaige had no idea if that shooting was self defense or not, so he STILL had no business trying to disarm kyle nor did anyone there.
@@ihavequestions6302 There is never going to be a trial before anyone does anything on an active scene, including almost every time cops intervene. How many videos does not exist where cops mess up based on bad or incomplete information? And they are trained professionals. Not knowing the facts as well as you would after a trial does not mean you are forbidden to intervene. They heard he shot someone which was true. It wasn't a rumor or false information. They were reasonable in their assumptions believing Rittenhouse was malicious. In another universe where the facts preceding were slightly different Gagie could have been the "good guy with a gun". However does any of that matter? If he's being threatened he can respond with deadly force according to the law.
@@SnekChrmr And that does not apply to Rittenhouse, trying to be a vigilante? And I am not talking about sniping Kyle in the back, but shooting when Kyle threatened him with his gun.
@@SnekChrmr What basis do you have for saying Kyle showing restraint and intentionally shoot him in the arm? I think this just proves that you are extremely biased. I don't know what training is required to get a gun license, but any trainer will tell you never to aim at arms and legs in a life and death situation. Aiming at an arm at point blank range in a scuffle is not restraint, that is stupidity. But in this case it was neither restraint nor stupidity, it's just where the shot went by random luck. The other guy was shot in the chest in pretty much the exact same close range situation. That was not due to a lack of restraint. There's no time to aim here. You are assigning purpose to a random event, proving your bias.
I don't know what you think a vigilante is. To me what he did absolutely qualifies. Protecting the public from rioters because he deemed the regular law enforcement to be inadequate is almost a citation of the dictionary definition. Obviously there's no authority on what words mean and can mean different things to different people.
Yes, he aimed and then stopped aiming and then got shot. Both people had guns. Flipping the movements and outcome is very easy to imagine. The question is if you are consistent in your interpretation of self defense. I believe that morally (read different from law) neither person should have shot, or even brought guns to where they were. I don't believe that you should be allowed to claim self defense if you provoked the situation. My opinion is clearly contradicted by the law and I recognize that, but whether discussing law or morality I try to be consistent. That is most important.
Vaush has clearly never been in a fight. He’s the epitome of a dude that lives online and doesn’t know how things play out in real life.
Real.
And you think destiny isn’t
@@Somedude8853 Destiny is more of a regular dude than Vaush is. Destiny had a life before internet, Vaush did not.
@@Divinemakyr i think thats true I enjoy both of them but i think we can all agree if your in the debate community to the extent of these two your a little autistic
@@Somedude8853 fair point, but Destiny isn’t applying mental gymnastics to a common sense second grade question. Captain virginity is making redidulous claims that we need to be backed up by real world experience. I could flush this point out for 10 minutes but I think we all get the point
The “a woman doesn’t know if she’s going to be raped and murdered so she should just submit to the rape and hope she isn’t murdered instead of taking the life of the precious murderer” summation by Destiny was SPOT ON
@@theagnosticphilosopher6873just out of curiosity what do you appreciate about Vaush? So far I’ve just seen him argue on bad faith and he virtue signals a lot. I’ve also seen him make many assumptions and assert them as facts when he doesn’t do proper research. But I’m curious what you like about him, because maybe I’m missing somethingZ
That “Z” is supposed to be a period🤣
Unlike a woman being raped, you can actually make the argument that a gunman is being provocative by pointing a weapon at people. So much for a "beautiful" analogy lol
@@godhimself1128 Kyle wasn't randomly pointing it at people.
I know you want to garggle Vaush's balls but he's into children, not grown ass men treating him like an internet daddy.
@@godhimself1128 Typically most people who get guns pointed at them go away or submit. You can also get turned into swiss cheese. Kyle wasn't pointing his rifle at anybody either so, only time he did was when he smoked those wackjobs. Though the idea that you should "Let people kill you because you don't want to kill somebody" is just wrong. Only a useless unappreciative person would want to die or for others to.
"Don't turn this rape into a murder."
- Vaush, probably
Low iq interpretation.
Vaush legitimately thinks people are morally required to coinflip their own life rather than defend themselves LOL
If they have killed people they are not justified in defending themselves against people trying to stop a murderer.
@@lostinthewoods2201 but killing someone who attacks you first isn't murder
@@lostinthewoods2201 They are justified in defending themselves against a group of people trying to attack him after defending himself.
@@cmmagamers absolutly not. If you defend yourself against 1 attacker and others try to stop you mistaking you for OG attacker you can't just kill the entire town beacuse tecnicaly you were justified 74 kills ago.
@@lostinthewoods2201 If those townspeople are chasing you down and trying to attack you or kill you for it, then you can stand a pile of corpses a mile high and still be justified.
I can't believe he literally thinks you're morally obligated to submit yourself to the mob.
I guarantee Vaush would be the first to shoot if he was about to be attacked. Guaranteed
He doesn't, he just is so mixed up in the RIGHT bad LEFT good mentality. Basically he's a disingenuous prick.
It's especially scary because people like him actually believe they wouldn't be part of lynching mobs if they were alive 200 years ago, but if you can't stand up to the mob now then there's reason to believe you would in any point in history
It's beyond pathetic honestly
@@Aaron-kj8dvaaaaaa
Vaush - the kid will get convicted if i understand the law
Narrator - *He did not understand the law*
Holy shit. Destiny literally guessed the exact situation before he even knew what happened.
I think the only thing he was wrong about was the bottle being glass.
It was all on video. Non-retarded people saw those videos that night or the next day. ALL the clips were on Twitter.
Not really, within the first week we had video of him running away being chased, and defending himself.
We also had 2 people confirm he did not cross a border with a gun. (One being kyle, and the other being the guy who sold it to him)
All things which were ignored by people for months, sometimes years.
I got banned from severa "news" forums clarifying to people, that several witnesses said "he didn't cross a border with a gun."
Almost all of this information about the case was public an hour or so after it happened
@@samlastname1662Rosenbaums antics earlier in the night and the fire kyle put out took a little longer to reach news
I love how much of the stuff Vaush dismissed as unrealistic or unlikely are things that we now know actually happened from evidence presented in court
@@wontonschannel Not really.
Exactly. Destiny should react to this and gloat a little, respectfully.
@@wontonschannel The guy is not even remotely close to "the best"... He's actually the worst.
No doubt. That is what happens when you are deluded and make irrational assumptions based on your ideology.
@@wontonschannel no.. It happens to ideologically deluded wannabes.
Vaush: 'I'm ok with the vigilante act of a mob with guns chasing down 1 smaller person to possibly kill them. But not the vigilante act of that outnumbered pursued person defending their life' insane. Absolutely insane.
I always come back here now and again to remind myself how sheltered and dishonest vaush is
Fr
He's also just flat out a complete moron. He's so stupid i don't even know that I believe he's being dishonest. I think he believes he's actually making points.
yuri bezmenov perfectly describes vaushs mentality
He can't carter to it due to his "conservatives gonna overglorify him" attitude
Lol
Within 5 minutes Vaush goes from “the guy aiming his pistol at Kyle was simply trying to apprehend him” to “they need to display intent” ... WTF do you call aiming a pistol in somebody’s face?
You can only defend yourself once the bullet leaves the barrel.
@@LesterBrunt Right you can never shoot first by his logic.
People trying to smash your skull with a skateboard is definitely displaying intent.Rosenbaum clearly displayed intent by trying to grab Kyle’s rifle.
@@yankees29 I already know Vaush would come back at that with "Do you think a mass murderer is justified in defending themselves if someone tries to disarm them?"
A conversation with someone like that will never progress anything, he will simply disagree with the premise leaving you talking to a very hyperbolic wall. It's a strategy he uses consistently.
48 Laws of Power | Robert Greene | The Cult | ua-cam.com/video/a2PoKFuNX_0/v-deo.html ?vd sada
“Lets say the unarmed guy said ‘I’m gonna fucking kill you.’”
Destiny quoted Rosenbaum a year before the quote was openly disclosed.
The video was available of him saying it around this time, but I don’t think they knew but he did call it😂
Most of the videos shown in court were on the internet within a week of the shootings.
The amount of people who had never seen the footage until it was shown in court was quite a black pill to swallow.
to be fair, it doesn't even have to be said. If you charge a guy openely carrying a gun trying to run away, you are either a psychopath with concern for your own safety or an idiot.
@@Trazynn my lord, Orikan broke the Horus Heresy collection again.
Vaush is the kind of guy that thinks bears are nice and cuddly and only attack people when the person has attacked the bear first
funny how relevant your comment has become
A rational actor does not chase a person running away with a firearm. A rational actor does not throw things at a person running away with a firearm. It is an escalation to chase someone. It is a valid threat to your life to be chased in a riot. It's literally a situation of mob mentality.
Vaush is 100 percent arguing in bad faith. Destiny is spot on when he says Vaush was figuring out his opinion on this subject in real time.
He always argues in bad faith. It's his whole schtick.
Vaush comes out looking like a idiot i bet he didnt even watch the clip how can you forget what hapend in a clip that you ar talking about
@@shanbannan17 he literally said... ".... Uh.... I think i saw the clip...... "
😆
That's Vaush MO.
48 Laws of Power | Robert Greene | The Cult | ua-cam.com/video/a2PoKFuNX_0/v-deo.html ?vds adsfa
Vaush: “On the legal framing, I’m pretty sure that this kid’s going to be convicted from what I understand of the law.”
That didn’t age well.
Aged like fine milk.
"from what I understand of the law." Apparently not much lol
I mean his understanding of the law was very limited.
@@Brian-us2xz IS*
@@Brian-us2xz "Muh state borders, muh age restriction, muh premeditated self defense"
It's so funny to go back and see how Vaush was 10000% wrong 😂
Vaushs standard for self defense is literally you have to wait until lethal force is acted upon you for you to respond, meaning you have to wait and see if you were killed to justify lethal force
Yeah, it's like killing a grizzly bear in BC. If you're hunting deer and you get charged by a grizzly and shoot it they'll call you a poacher and throw you in jail.
You literally have to wait for the bear to take a bite out of you to prove your life was in danger.
@@Jake-bt3fcThat's crazy. God help Canadians!
Lol vaush seems to think that self defense requires verbal consent.
He’s sheltered and spends too Much time online surrounded by other people who spend too much time online
@@scarletcrusade77 spends too much time online with only people who agree with him. He has a false sense of his righteousness.
Lol
He doesn't think that, he's just mad 3 of his comrades got shot and Rittenhouse has right libertarian views.
that's so accurate, holy shit
This whole debate tells me vaush has never went outdoors.
A whole new meaning to “touch grass”. Lol
If the political associations were reversed, Vausch would be praising Kyle.
That's truly what this was all about
@@Gamewar5OOO it’s so common but it really bums me out.
If the political associations were reversed, I would be condemning Kyle 😁 Instead, he's my hero!
@@lilben4184 nah, self defense is self defense. Closest the left has was when that psycho hunted down a guy wearing a maga hat then lied and said he was protecting someone from being stabbed. If you have an actual example of self defense let me know.
I've recently dipped my toe into watching debates like this (for some reason!) and it's so refreshing to see someone so quick-brained to call out Vaush on his pivots before he even gets to the end of his sentence. Vaush is a terrifying combination of a good speaker and a bad faith debater. Well done on not letting him get away with it, because he usually does.
Same! Vaush is completely bad faith
Dude it's crazy, whenever I listen to vosh I feel like I'm just listening to a really good actor play his part in a movie. It's like this character he's created almost holds up, but not against someone like Destiny who has no problem keeping up with his logical fallacies
Vosh is the absolute worst bad faith debater imaginable.
Vaush has a lot of clever tricks.
He makes analogies that don't make sense to confuse the person and the audience
He'll often answer for them then pivot right away
He makes up lies knowing people rarely fact check in real time
He talks over people to frustrate them, there was one point where Destiny hit him with like 5 facts in a row and each time Vaush got him to stop and yell at him for talking over him
One way where he fucks up is not only does he need to win every argument but he needs to win every micro argument as well so it's easy to throw bait out there to get him to contradict himself
@@Aaron-kj8dvHe may be the worst in regards to the tendency to argue in Bad Faith of ANY political commentator.
Given Binger's "you lose the right to self defense if you're the one who brought the gun" line, I think the prosecution may be Vaush fans.
Indeed. Also Krauss' "sometimes we all have to take a beating", Vaush literally made this point.
@@frazzleface753 omg….I haven’t had frazzles for AGES. I’m in Australia, but I’m English. Now…. I’m going to crave them. 😋
Bingers misunderstandings of basic rights and law... And willingness to political prosecute....
I don't doubt it at all... 😆
@@frazzleface753 except the jury unanimously shot down that argument.
48 Laws of Power | Robert Greene | The Cult | ua-cam.com/video/a2PoKFuNX_0/v-deo.html ?vdsa dsfdsafda
why is destiny streaming in a forever 21 changing room?
Forever 21 inches tall
You never know when a debate may strike
@WAFFEN COLLIDER true theyre just normal cubicals with a mirror
@WAFFEN COLLIDER no one does but that's the joke because you can imagine lmao
He's at his gf/ fake fiance's in some other country..
I feel bad for all the people donating money to Vaush during this thinking he was right just to find out legally he was wrong all along.
None of them care. I’m betting it just entrenched them deeper somehow in their cognitive dissonance
@@nokiot9 yeah you probably right
It's easy to judge when you're not being chased by people threatening your life. Vaush probably doesn't have even half the courage of that kid, that's what bothers him.
Yeah, I don't know how the whole "submit to the mob" people's brains work. Would they be arguing that line of thinking if it was a black guy running away from a mob of racist Neo Not-sees?
Vaush's entire premise is that chasing someone doesn't demonstrate more aggression than running away from someone. How can a brain work like this?
Brain?
Great point!
Liberalism destroys logic.
@@osdreadlord3205 vaush isn't a liberal. Destiny is. I don't think you know what liberalism is
@@osdreadlord3205 Do you know what liberal means?
vaush's version of a "credible threat" is so specific and requires telepathy.
@Complete Lettuce does vaush look like he's ever been in a violent confrontation in his life?
@@ddawg3230
With his exwife for sure he did
Ten bucks he’s made the “violent words” argument in the past.
@Complete Lettuce >This guy is wrong because he is not a harcore badass youtube commenter like me.
@@at5203 Yes
That Vaush dude is well spoken for someone with really horrible logic.
Sounds great saying nothing.
I actually don’t understand how Vausch’s logic would allow for a woman to defend herself from an aggressor in an alley
It wouldn't, and that's exactly what makes this a rare Vaush W. If a woman chooses to be in a place outside the home secluded from any witnesses within earshot of her screaming, it's because she gets off to being graped and subconsciously hopes it will happen, therefore she abdicates any right to sympathy.
*crowd yelling “kill him! kill him!”
Vaush: “But how did he know they had lethal intent????”
So at a Trump rally when people have Obama on a noose, Trump should be responsible right?
@@keithtorrence2487 what kind of analogy is that?
@@keithtorrence2487 Upvoting your own comment is kinda cringe
@@keithtorrence2487 Weirdest whataboutism
Did they even say that? I watched all the videos never picked that up.
Either way, if person A is running at you and person B is standing off to the side, I don’t think person B yelling “kill him” is an indication of what person A is intending. Everyone involved could have different intentions.
"That's the coin flip" Please God never let Vaush get near power.
When Vaush said, "That's what mobs do, they chase murderers" I almost fell out my chair. Vaush stance that Mobs are inherently a good thing most times speaks to his inability to understand real world scenarios and History. Most mobs, from history, have turned into violent storms. The unknown of what a Mob will do makes a mob more of a threat than 1 man brandishing (not aiming) but holding a weapon like a gun. Vaush lives a life of privilege and will not understand.
Using Vaush’s logic, you can never morally defend yourself because “DURR ANYONE CAN KILL YOU BRO”
It is very much like the prosecutors line of reasoning in the actual case as well.
Cut from the same stone I imagine...
Vaush has never been outside or had a human interaction in real life
@unknowning unknown My dude "2 GFs" you say that as if that would be an accomplishment in some kind of way :D
@unknowning unknown Roblox girlfriends don't count hate to break it to you
@unknowning unknown he used marvel movies like they're real life situations or any indication of a real life situation, no matter how many gf he says he had, he's still an antisocial freak that can't differentiate reality from fiction.
But he has seen lots of Marvel movies and is a super lefty = real American 🙄
@unknowning unknown made your way over here from Vaush's channel, eh?
I honestly don't understand how anyone on the planet can agree with vaush here. dude is literally advocating for mob rule LOL
Sadly most of his audience still agrees with him on this every time this gets brought up. I can't believe how people don't realize how bad faith vaush is.
Yeah, he's a communist.
I think the disagreement in terms of mob rule is destiny thinks the mob it trying to disarm and kill him, where as vaush thinks the mod is going to disarm him and hold him for the police to arrest him.
@@willquoikapor Destiny makes the argument that kyle has no way of knowing whether the mob wants to kill him or subdue him for police. Whereas vaush is not even concerned with the uncertainty kyle's life is being faced with.
@@jeremyashcraft2053 especially because the mob is trying to take him out.... before he can make it to the police line.
Vaush would 100% have shot the 3 people if he were in Rittenhouse's position
No Kyle actually had good trigger discipline vaush would probably mag dump into the crowd
Everyone remember that one time vaush confidently asserted he understands "the law"?
Destiny is debating from a kidney farm in Russia
Otha Bojangles bruh😂🤣😂🤣
Thank you for the laugh, I needed it.
im glad they made him a privacy cubicle
Destiny streaming from his grandmas bathroom
Rather a basement in Stockholm.
@@Teadon86 Ye.
The fact that Vaush uploaded this debate a day sooner is proof that worker co-ops work better
To be fair Destiny had to turn his audio off for this debate because Vaush is permabanned on Twitch. Vaush just had to clip the video and Destiny has to sync the video of Vaush, the audio, and the video of him.
Q.E.D.
@@PK-uk1vd You mean Destiny's editor.
But Destiny has timestamps.
PepeLaugh
Neckbeard cant handle being wrong. He probably still thinks he was right even after the AQUITTAL
"im pretty sure this kid is going to be convicted" - Vaush L take.
Vaush is literally saying “if you open carry you don’t have the right to defend yourself”
He is literally not.
Did you even watch the video?
@@frankwalker4428 that’s exactly what he’s saying dude.
@@frankwalker4428 He literally is though because he's not talking about legality, he's talking about morality. His argument is that if something happens while you're open carrying, you're responsible for it making self defense almost impossible in such a scenario because you'd be perceived as the perpetrator. Get off the champagne socialist kool aid
This is pretty close to accurate. He's pretty much saying that if you open carry you have to wait until there's a gun aimed at your head, because that's the only time he believes you would be justified if you were conceal carrying... because he assumes you would never draw you concealed gun until death was imminent.
You don't know what literally means. Go back to 3rd grade.
Vaush is just a rich kid that has never had to face any kind of adversity in his life.
To be fair, he once ran out of rasberry ripple!
He grew up in Beverly Hills. He rarely admits it that I know of.
He has little actual life experience. He has obviously had a fairly easy upbringing in Beverly Hills, and I would hazard a guess that games, video games, then playing games on the internet, became his “life” experience. He’s never been in an adversarial position face to face, with another human being. I would put good money on Vaush never being in a fight….good money.
@@pommiebears he 100% sounds like a person who’s not been punched in the face or even threatened with being punched in the face
And I’m not even talking about as an adult
@@FJaypewpew It's painfully obvious that Vaush has never experienced or even been around actual violence in real life. He seems to have no concept of how dangerous a grown man is even when unarmed, much less how insanely dangerous a whole crowd of armed men is. It all happens so quickly that you don't get time to think about anything. If Rittenhouse had hesitated any longer than he did then they would have killed him.
I love Vaush saying that his logic leads to more innocent people being saved when his logic is why two more people were shot after the first
How is, "I've seen a lot of Marvel movies," an argument? Does he really think that life is like a Marvel movie?
This aged so poorly for Vaush. Anyone who says that when someone is potentially about to attack you, you have a moral duty to say “I’m about to shoot you” has frankly just never faced any adversity or dealt with any situation when you have to do quick decision making. Like I guarantee Vaush has never even played a team sport lol
I was on the anti-kyle side unfortunately because I fell for a lot of bullshit. After reviewing the evidence and (of course) considering he was cleared by a jury, I believe Kyle was completely innocent and in the right. This wasn't about politics, it was a simple case of self-defense.
He is beyond reality with his world views. He thinks that since he watched enough Marvel movies he is right about the matter shows you next level out of touch Vaush is. It also shows you how dumb his followers are.
@@cl570 Had Kyle not shown up there, nobody would have died. Had Kyle shown up without a gun, nobody would have died.
@@smaakjeks lol
Run at a guy with a gun, do it for the meme
@@smaakjeks If Rosenbaum hasn't attacked Kyle he wouldn't be dead. If the other two hadn't attacked Kyle, they wouldn't have gotten shot. You're doing the same thing racists do to justify mistreatment of black people just for being in their neighbourhood.
Watching this nearly 2 years later after the not guilty verdict is gold
Da fuck? Interesting you had nearly the same time frame to watch this. Just looking for the vids, V-Star is looking the worst possible rn.
Right here with ya lol
Had Rittenhouse never travelled out of state, bringing firearms to "protect businesses", no one would have died. Rittenhouse is inherently the aggressor. Anyone still defending this just want as many justifications as possible to murder people. The dude was going for lethal shots.
The verdict was bullshit. You don’t have the right to defend yourself till the mob beats you to death…..Then you can defend yourself. 😂
@@Sil3ntKn1ght just don't chase people with a gun, is not that hard.
Watched about an hour.
As a Trump supporter, I find Destiny to be someone who argues in good faith, and even though I don't agree on some topics, I still appreciate his candor and intelligence.
He really does argue for the sake of searching for the truth, and not for argument's sake.
Vaush feels more like a highschooler in a debate team, who wants to win on the merit of his high-ability to dance with words, but if you listen intently, you realize he does not always have a solid ground to stand on, and a firm grasp of his own opinions.
Destiny, on the other hand, does.
Ikr I think destiny wants what's best. Not that he knows what's best. Everyone has different opinions.
destiny is a classic educated liberal (very rare)
@@lowcountryadventures5549almost as rare as an intelligent conservative.
@@carlosa4852Haha funny adhom. Fucking reprobate.
Yep. Agree on what you’re saying, just with different people. Destiny is good on a lot of topics, this one not so much. Plus it’s excruciating watching grown adults like Vaush having to babysit this guy. It’s like a child going through tantrums. You agree with me, great. You don’t? Then you’re a bad faith actor. WTF. Grow up destiny.
Vaush: "my mobs are good. Submit to them."
To be fair to Vaush, I feel exactly the same way, it's just that he's wrong about which mob. My *right-wing* mobs are the only good mobs. If Kyle wasn't White I'd be calling for him to be woodchipped, but he is so instead he's my hero 😁
“Hi, we’re a mob. We believe you did something wrong. Come with us now.”
Justice in Vaush’s world.
There was no mob.
@@zach.0 There was no mass shooting of a mob either. But Vaush certainly argued that he was "taught" at university to mob-rush anyone wielding a gun (at around 9:20). Apparently he thinks "man with gun" is the same as "active shooter on campus." Because of course he does.
@@zach.0 A bunch of people weren't chasing Rittenhouse? Guess the video I saw was a work, then.
@@Jagonath At the end of the day... Can we not all agree that if you chase a crazy right winger kid with a rifle you're probably stupid, and police should probably apprehend rogue fucking children with rifles who don't live in the city they're brandishing rifles in... Like is this THAT hard an argument?? Am I missing something?
@@Destabilise15 Yes. You're missing the fact that police are supposed to enforce the law, not invent laws, and the current law explicitly states that people can carry rifles. As bad as I think gun ownership is in general, the cops can't arrest people for carrying items that other people might find provocative. They can't apprehend rogue Christian priests for brandishing a cross at a Satanist rally for example, or vice versa. Would it be dumb to carry such a thing, at such a time? Well I sure as hell wouldn't. is it Illegal? No, quite the opposite - it's illegal to try and stop them.
At some point, the responsibility for committing overt acts of aggression has to rest on the shoulders of the aggressor.
Vaush is the perfect example of a person who put all of their mental energy into learning how to speak and the tactics of debate but didn’t bother to learn anything about any topic on earth whatsoever.
he used the word implicit wrong multiple times in the first 10 minutes. If you show that you have a gun, you are explicitly showing lehtal force not implicit lol
not a terrible thing to pursue the art of rhetoric, but you're right in saying it falls far short of being useful. to be useful you have to leverage your knowledge of rhetoric to articulate well informed points.
The amount of time he spends online and still fell for the Rittenhouse hoax removes any credibility he had, if he had any. I remember the very next morning watching all the dozens of videos of it happening and then Richie McGinniss explaining what happened when it started and it was clear as day justified.
@@mattreef3379 having a gun on your person and brandishing a weapon with intent to use is different though. If I have a gun on my person that’s visible while we talk that’s implicit, if I lift my shirt in an argument so you can see my blicky that’s explicit. But I do agree vaush is as effective as a jello loaded water gun.
@@Jm-dx9tl having a gun on ur hip that everyone can see is explicity telling people he has lethal force. I am not sure what u are saying is implicit about that?
He really said that someone with a pistol is not displaying lethal intent until they fire the pistol💀. So I can't defend myself until I've already been shot???
Vaush's argument aged like milk with all the details lmao
V:"He was literally sitting on his ass shooting into a crowd"
D:"Lets watch the video because I don't know wtf youre talking about"
V:"Oh just before we watch it even if he didn't do that im still right"
This totally proves he just makes stuff up in an attempt to be right. Like all the time he does this.
Seriously I've no clue how does he have such a great fan following am I Missing something???
@@porassrivastava8242 By great do you mean big or quality? And to be clear I'm not going to get upset by either reply I'm just curious which you meant
I mean technically that's a fine thing to do. It does imply that he was being knowingly disingenuous when he made the first point though.
@@porassrivastava8242 It's because he sometimes has reasonable takes for a leftist.
Coming back to this video after the verdict, vaush arguments seem more dishonest lol
He probabaly friended and hired binger as his personal lawyer
isn't that his whole niche?
He’s always been dishonest. Even outside of this debate.
Imagine thinking that how the trial ended changes the reality of Rittenhouse being a neo nazi murderer.
@@TheSpartanS196 imagine believing kyle was neo nazi 😂learn facts dude
It probably shouldn't be, but it is astounding to me that Vaush's perception of how people should behave when facing the threat of a violent mob is based on Marvel movies. JFC...
I swear i was thinking the same thing. This man must be thinking this is looney toons or something where you can get hit with a bat and walk away singing 2 seconds later.
Vaush is such an ignorant emotional child 😂
Turns out that the "hypothetical situation“ where Rosenbaum threatened to kill Rittenhouse shortly before attacking him has been confirmed in court to be the "actual situation“.😅
Those videos were going around literally the day after it happened showing Rosenbaum threatening him and the crowd calling for his head. It's insane to me that so many people actually learned new things from the trial. I think the only new bit of evidence was Rittenhouse saying he wasn't clearing a jam when he lowered his weapon after Grosskreutz raised his hands in the air.
Destiny: The kid is obviously retreating.
Vaush: Nah, he’s running strategically
It's weird he's talking about these 20 marvel movies when there's close to 0 instances of his example actually happening in a marvel movie lol.
this debate has aged poorely especially vaush side as court proved all of his claims as false.
The virgin marvel movie vs the chad liveleak
Imagine unironically basing your moral argument on motherfucking IRON MAN instead of real life.
Tim Pool moment
Timestamp?
@@shreddedavocado2649 1:16:59
lol
This aged very well. Never let Vaush forget this
Nooo but he rly wants to immediately forget it
Vaush won this debate and is still in the right. Regardless of the court decision.
@@labc133 wrong
@@labc133 in what way did he win this debate. His entire argument is based on the assumption that if someone is trying to fight you with the knowledge that you have a gun on you, you aren't allowed to use that gun unless they say they are going to kill you and happened to be the one to start the confrontation. Neither of those things have to be met for it to be morally justified.
1.) regardless of who starts escalating the scenario, the classic "he hit me first" thing that kids do doesn't apply here when one of them is a holding a gun. If the person holding the gun is running away, which shows that they do not want to get into a physical altercation or use the firearm, is still chased by the other person. The other person is either completely uncaring about their own safety (which is a dangerous person) or knows so little about what a physical altercation with a firearm entails that they genuinely think they can just have a normal fight where both people walk away (highly unlikely or sheltered), both of these scenarios don't care about who started the fight at all, just let him run away. If you then are going to argue that the optimal way to stop a firearm is to close the distance, you are missing the fact that if the person with the firearm wants to kill you, they would of just used it in the first place, not ran away. And then if you are going to argue that since he doesn't know which of the scenarios are happening he can't use lethal force, then you are essentially saying he morally has to put his life in the hands of the other persons intent, since once he knows for 100% certain the intent of the other person, it may be too late.
2.) The other person doesn't have to verbalize lethal intent, since this ties to what I said in number 1. With the possibility of lethal intent being very high when a gun is involved, it is unreasonable for the person with the gun to have to wait until they themselves are in mortal danger to have certainty and fire.
So what is the correct response from the guy with the bottle? Just don't chase him, instead if you truly believe he is a danger then run away. If you believe that it is your duty to stop the danger for some reason even without the proper means to do so, then you should either stop reading comic books, or accept that your life might be taken away. And that case would only apply if Kyle was some evil killer who was out to kill them, which the evidence didn't show.
@@labc133I think you commented under the wrong video. You must have watched a different debate and accidentally commented here after
Vaush literally citing Marvel movies as a contrast to real-world violence and mob behavior
There's no way on earth Vaush actually believes this "submit to the mob" rule. He was just advancing it to win the argument. I'm saying this because he's perfectly demonstrated himself to be capable of derailing conversations and arguing in really bad faith just to avoid conceding even the simplest points.
Destiny: "If a guy is chasing you with a bottle and a bag and he says he wants to kill you then you have a right to defend yourself and kill him"
Other guy: "wait so you're saying that you're allowed to kill someone if they have a bottle and a bag?"
Lmao, "other guy"
Also 5 seconds later vaush says you can kill a guy with a handkerchief.
Vaush in a nutshell XD
Well no since we dunno the context of the situation.
kinda reminds me of that Jordan peterson debate lol
“Plastic bottles with undetermined contents aren’t lethal!”
TSA has entered the chat...
Lolol underrated comment.
Dead 🤣🤣
Nice one. Don't know if there is any relation but at Wembly stadium they make you take caps of the bottles.
@is fish Could also be what he used to start the dumpster fire.
Pretty sure you can beat someone to death with a full Pepsi bottle.
This take did not age well for Vaush btw. LOL
Im late to the party but Vaush is disgustingly sheltered and stupid on this topic
Its so amazing how accurately right Destiny was like literally almost everything point by point was validated on the trial.
I believe the public had little information of the video at the time as well
@@President.ballsdick They watched the video
@@SeasoningTheObese i watched the vast majority of it basically live...the info was out there almost immediately...the left was curated shit info and was completely shocked at the outcome...
Imagine thinking that the verdict of a trial shapes reality. Rittenhouse was and still is a neo nazi murderer whatever the judge says
@@TheSpartanS196 Keep at it buddy, if you keep believing it it might become reality someday.
1:12:24 Wait, Vaush totally contradicts himself here.
He said a a girl suspecting a rape is imminent has the right to shoot their aggressor, but earlier said in a scenario where either one person dies, or the victim submits to aggressor and both live, it should be the latter.
He can’t even be consistent in his beliefs.
Nah it’s just Vaush believes rape is worse than death.
He literally clarified this seconds after he said that. He put first that without the knowledge of who is the aggressor, he would opt for the one with less death. Not even a minute after, when Destiny said that the unarmed person was the aggressor, he clarified that the armed person has the right to defend themselves.
@@connermorris7294 I’m not even talking about a contradiction at that particular juncture, but more about a general contradiction throughout the debate. Vaush is inconsistent throughout when presented with different scenarios. His view is incongruent with believing Rittenhouse is in the wrong.
@@naschylobo you gave a time stamp, you were clearly talking about a particular juncture. In The juncture you’re talking about, you misrepresent the full statement of Vaush. As far as I can tell his views are consistent, if highly passive and utilitarian.
@@connermorris7294 well the timestamp is where he most starkly contradicts his previous views, but yeah, they're out of whack the whole discussion.
Vaush goes from saying a black dude should submit to a beating in a lynching situation (le non-lethal variety) rather than retaliate, to adding clauses to what circumstance a rpe victim could use lethal force. His litmus test for self-defense is ludicrous. He's inconsistent the entire time. Seems to me he just wants to argue from bad-faith because presumably Rittenhouse falls on the other side of the political spectrum.
The rittenhouse situation really showed us who people really are and vausch really showed his color
It is a no brainer. If I was carrying any kind of weapon and someone is chasing AFTER me knowing I have a weapon. And he keeps chasing me, then I am going use whatever to end the threat.
"Surrender yourself to mobs"
-Vaush.
“People should be able to kill someone who is threatening their lives/done harm to them”
-me
"its only a clear threat of your life when you're within an inch of it"
-Vaush
Pop Danish “I felt threatened your honor that why I killed the blind man with a weapon(walking stick) in self defense”
-You
@E Rebull
Kyle Rittenhouse was a victim.
Stop supporting mob mentality, and mob violence.
@@popdanish4969 "you should always bet your life on a coin flip"
-Vaush
I fucking died when he said “in the marvel movies I’ve seen”
Can u time stamp it, it always give me a good laugh
@@Yoshsterpalooza sure thing pal 1:16:59
What a moronic take. Comparing Captain America to a 17 year old is the most unrealistic analogy he could make as an argument. LOL
You heard him. Marvel movies are exactly representative of reality!
Lmaoo if you not defend yourself from the mob in my country, they'll kill you. Not even kidding. When around 20 people kick you senselessly chances are you get severe brain damage.
After knowing he was not guilty on all counts I found it funny when I heard vaush say “I think he’s getting convicted”
Who do you think killed Nicole Brown Simpson and Ron Goldman?
@@pinkystenis8247 no clue who either of those people are and I fail to see the relevance
Vaush’s entire world view is that people with guns should have less rights, it’s as simple as that for him
"Now if they were coming at them with pitchforks, then the lethal reprisal would be justified because then that would be a very obvious clear and present threat to their life" ---Vaush (1:04:00)
A skateboard, a glass bottle and bag being actively used as makeshift weapons, hell even a pistol drawn and pointed directly at you from only a few feet away still isn't enough to meet Vaush's threshold for being a clear and present threat to your life...
...but if those bastards have pitchforks
Meanwhile, if Vaush were being chased by a raging unarmed man, Vaush would be absolutely terrified and would undoubtedly shoot the guy dead to save his own life. These regressive scumbags love to play jeopardy with other peoples' lives.
I guess Kyle should have just crossed his fingers and hoped it wasn’t a brick that connected with his skull. Remember when black men were hitting white and Asian people over the head with bricks?
Yeah, I noticed that too. Having a pistol pointed at you from 2 or so feet away isn't a threat of lethal violence, however makeshift weapons can't? That's dumb logic.
Vaush is scaring the shit out of me with these terrible arguments.
that's who he really is, genius.
Even worse, there are actual people buying what vaush is selling
@@holoesheit5497 is there any right wing UA-camrs who have owned him?
@@marker52 I wouldn't say "good" he just uses impassable arguments.
@@fb2551 actual justice warrior guy but he's pretty annoying imo. Vaush is kind of just an annoying person to debate
Vaush, "that's what mobs do, we chase murderers". 🤣🤣🤣
Pitchforks, skateboards 💁
Vaush point is ridiculous here IMO 19:30.
If you are OPEN CARRYING, fleeing the scene and then another person is actively trying to engage you, actively trying to harm you when they know you have a gun and they do not, then this is 100% on the person trying to engage.
This is very similar of me going to open sea near sharks, knowing there are sharks, knowing they can attack me, and then me actively trying to engage them. If they bite my leg off, is not the sharks fault. Maybe this is not the best analogy, but you get my point.
Is Vaush physically incapable of being honest or intelligent?
So surprised he doesn’t have a fedora on.
Destiny: "You're really going to do this?"
Vaush, with zero self-awareness and his smug at full capacity: "Uh, yeah."
Because he is a communist neck beard. I dunno.
Chat demands it.
Man unironically referenced marvel movies as an argument 💀
An innocent mob, is that an oxymoron lol
Vaush has never been in a fight. This is relevant because he has no context for how quickly things can change in a fistfight, let alone a situation with a firearm.
Yeah, when you chase someone thats clearly armed with lethal force, you intent to fucking kill them. Why would you want to disarm a guy thats running away
@@kklap3219 not arguing in good faith but, what if someone just robbed you for your gun when they were unarmed
@@AquaPrince27 shit, think my reply wasnt sent. Shoot them.
Your comment shows you have never been in a situation where you are trying to de escalate a situation.
I’ve been around someone with a gun who was threatening to shoot someone and can explain what we all did.
Please don’t ever be a police officer.
@@poerava "Your comment shows you have never been in a situation where you are trying to de escalate a situation.
I’ve been around someone with a gun who was threatening to shoot someone and can explain what we all did.
Please don’t ever be a police officer." Irrelevant, because kyle was not threatening those people that chased him. Thats like trying to disarm a guard in the club just to "deescalate" the situation.
I’m lost on how people still debate this entire thing after the court trial. Boggles my mind
Vaush is somehow always wrong. He made Destiny looks good.
"That's what mobs do! They chase murderers!" Wait...what? Since when?
I mean potentially they "Could" get the correct judgement on a scenario. However no one is honestly gonna put faith in them innately to accomplish this. Cause why would anyone? It just seems there is a really insane level of charitability going into this.
@Starwars Fan360 I agree hence why I think its a weird stance on vaush point. Overall there is so much room for error that would make no one actually go along with this proposition in practice. Its a mob for a reason and the worst thing here is. I think Vaush's crowd love to try to distinguish the "moral" mob vs the regular "mob." Which I think is really really dangerous waters to go into.
Movies. Lol
“Mobs are only good when I agree with them”. That’s why these morons will never understand how immoral social justice mobs are. They will continue their slow march embracing fascist methods until well beyond they are self aware and never stop until they are dismantled or get what they want.
The mob originally attacked Kyle because he put a dumpster fire out...
For being a supposed anarchist, Vaush seems to refer to the law for moral guidance a lot lol
For the sake of taking the high ground here even though I think Vaush's position is insane, he referred to the law not because he thinks the law defines morality, but to argue that his morality was nothing extreme and is somewhat normal.
@@professionalmemeenthusiast2117 As if the morality derived from laws are normal.
Vaush has shown to be willing to spin whatever he can to support his pre packaged narrative instead of standing on any universal principle. It is literally ok to be violent to "fascists" in his book, except you can pretty much call anyone a fascist, effectively dehumanizing them, and suppress them with violence.
@@Hack3r91 nah, fascists are very human, that's why's it so critical to suppress them.
@@Chopstewie Yeah but the point is that if you can pretty much call anyone a fascist to justify political violence then your principles are non existent and you're just using a quick way to suppress dissidents.
legally, if I assaulted you, you could kill me and that would be self defense. If I assaulted you, and you brandished a firearm which caused me to run away, and then you chased me and attempted to kill me and I ended up killing you, I would be protected by the law of self defense. Even if Kyle had provoked Jo prior to being chased, once Kyle began retreating he ceased being the aggressor.
This was hilarious. If you ever thought Vaush had any intelligence, you found out that you were wrong over two hours.
Guy doesn't even know the definition of murder. The simple act of killing someone isn't murder. That's the entire reason why they differentiate between manslaughter and murder.
He wasn't charged with manslaughter. He was charged with first-degree intentional homicide, first-degree reckless homicide, and attempted homicide.
Cool Cat so is the system broken or is it not? If you think it’s broken then who cares what they charged him with. If you don’t think it’s broken then why don’t we wait and see what happens?
Based on eye witness testimony from all the “protestors” out there they probably found grounds to charge him with murder. But now with video evidence, I don’t see how any reasonable jury or judge could come close to murder.
From a moral standpoint, you can’t justify anybody running at anybody and claiming that Kyle didn’t have the right to defend himself. Unless you want to be an absolute brainlet like Vaush and argue in complete bad faith from a clearly partisan perspective. This is coming from a Canadian btw so it’s not even about right or left for us up here.
thejobloshow cool story bro. Let’s see what charges actually stick.
That's the reason we have the word homicide and murder... what Kyle did was homicide because he killed those people but it was justifiable homicide because they were attacking Kyle when they were killed
@@stevemasterson7776 >it was justifiable homicide because they were attacking Kyle when they were killed
Hold up, Atticus Finch. That hasn't been decided yet.