I need to explain something!
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- Опубліковано 5 чер 2024
- Tonight I'm explaining some things from a video I saw recently!
0:00 Intro
1:38 Ambient Sounds Plotted as Pitch
2:27 Acoustic Space
4:32 Resonant Frequencies
6:43 Error in his Analysis
8:13 The Verdict
11:12 Conclusion
14:01 It’s Just Data
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Stop explaining, don't feed the trolls. You're doing fine, Fil, and most of us know it.
Agreed. I feel Fil will end up spending half his time explaining at this rate.
It feels like he has to continually argue with flat earthers.
Fil went to some lengths to say he doesn’t see this creator as a troll. I don’t think he’s compelled to defend himself but rather he sees it through a teacher’s lenses. He is using this back and forth as a chance to educate.
Totally agree...don't worry or explain.
@@Wee162Very well said! I couldn't agree with you more!!! ✌️
We know you’re right. I wouldn’t give this person any more of your valuable time. Thanks Fil.
I STRONGLY AGREE
Most definitely agree. Do not feed the trolls.
I hate that you seem to have to defend yourself so often. Hang in there, you are knowledgeable and kind in your teaching. We appreciate you!
I think what's happening is that pitch correction has a negative connotation. One way or another people want to fight about whether or not it's there. Pitch correction ought to just die except for when it's used as a special effect.
You have a huge audience and you care about your audience so I understand you're frustration. But any criticism you get is a minuscule compared to the support. You're doing great
I think the guy criticising started his journey inspiring from Fil anyway. Does he criticise very harshly? I don't think so. As Fil says he just criticised one video.
One of the kindest rebuttals I've ever heard on UA-cam. You are a noble soul, Fil.
Thanks for the compliment and the donation!
Best comment. Although I'm interested in the material on this channel, mostly I just like Fil's wholesome repertoire.
"people aren't going round, pitch correcting police cars. That's just how sound works". Brilliant 😂
yes one of Fil's best. .😂
Yes!!!
So good! 😂
And it is Not quite correct. The Doppler Effect would change the pitch of the siren only in the moment when the car passes by, given its own velocity stays the same.
I recreated the scenario of phone recording with crowd and reverb on it and the pitch pretty much remained the same...
You are so professional and at the same time so humble!
yep a professional commenting on a thing he does for a living, verses an amateur and he still try's to make sure everyone get the right information 👍👍
I liked this before watching it because you are one of the most reliable and honest and transparent music analysts online. Those who want the honest truth know it comes from you.
@larry4111... Excellent comment Larry. you got my thumb up. 👍
@@drewpall2598Thank you so much. In a sea of clickbait we have Fil with a breath of authenticity.
I did not click bait tho. I actually recreated the scenario of phone recording with crowd and reverb and the pitch remained the same...
@@dishonestcomposerreactsMy comment had nothing to do with you. I was comparing what Fil does to what a lot of other UA-camrs do.
I don't always care about pitch correction, but when I do, I listen to Wings of Pegasus.
🍻 😂
lmao! Best comment!
There’s nothing wrong with showing someone where they made an error. Comes down to real facts are facts. Although I’m new here to the channel. I’ve yet to see you say anything close to malicious. Great work! 👍
Welcome! Fil is the furthest from malicious you will find on YT.
@@QueenoftheBlackCoast There's a strong argument to be made to the contrary but I'm not dying on that hill within this echo chamber.
@@Reginaldborington I don't want you to die on any hills, but I would like you to state just one example of Fil being malicious. Keeping in mind that a malicious attack on someone is meant to cause pain or distress, and comes from a place of hate. And I will read it with an open mind. I think he's a good person, a thoughtful person, and a caring person, so if he ever said anything that seemed very out of character, it would jump out at me, like if he was actually being hateful towards somebody.
@@Terri_MacKay That would be the proverbial dying on the hill though, because I can't really state what I'm referring to without giving context, background and an explanation, and this can come across as a big wall of text reading like a premeditated hate campaign when in reality it's nothing like that. But its basically all about what this youtube channel stands for. But I genuinely can't write out what I mean without it being dozens of lines long and too much to read.
Fil I love how patient you are in explaining and how nice you are to the other UA-camr
I think you're being extremely fair. As a sound nerd, I find your explanation very informative.
"People aren't going around pitch correcting police cars" LOL! What a good example and amusing way to wrap up that example.
You don’t owe any explanation. Your knowledge of music is amazing.
Thank you for being transparent, honest, and for really caring that your audience is as informed as possible! Keep up the great work, Fil!
Don't have them chasing your tail Fil. We love you and appreciate everything you do...PERIOD! 💙🎸🩵
I don't think this is just "responding to trolls", I think this is educational, and I am here for it! Excellent points. Good science should always be repeatable. When you are conducting an experiment, you have to eliminate or figure out how to control for other variables or you cannot make ANY conclusions from your data. Science 101. Well done!
But this sounds like an anonymous sockpuppet and troll trying to make Fil respond to more of these.
@@papalaz4444244 The other dude is not important here, IMO, this is a “teachable moment,” and Fil is a great teacher. Yes, we know we can rely on what he tells us, but why? Because he uses good scientific methods for his analyses. He uses tools that are reliable and repeatable. He doesn’t introduce other variables that would confound the results. That’s the point here, to me.
To me the other dude isn't really important, this is a "teachable moment" and Fil is a great teacher. We know we can trust what he tells us, but why? Because he uses good scientific methods in his analyses, and he explains what some of those are - using tools that are reliable and repeatable, not introducing confounding variables, etc. It's defining very specifically what sets him apart.
@@cindi1313 I agree with both of you! Fil is using every teaching opportunity he can to clarify things in an ever confusing techno world BUT I don't want to see him caught in a defense loop.
@@ginnyvogel7754 I see your point, and I'm glad that Fil didn't identify the guy to give him any more "credibility".
I have seen that UA-camr before. Didn't take but about a minute of listening to him to figure out he didn't know what he was doing. Thank you for the elegant response. (You DO know what you are doing).
I'm just hearing him now on this and I know he doesn't know what he's talking about. He said err a lot 😂 he's just looking at the screen and guessing. With Fil you know exactly that he knows what he's talking about.
You have a logical, technical mind. It all makes perfect sense the way you explain things
You're a class act, Fil.
Fil, it’s so professional of you to explain this further. I very much appreciate the time, patience, and effort you put into your channel.
We know you're one of the good guys, Fil. You don't have to explain yourself. Thanks for the videos.
Remember that every time someone mentions you on their blog or UA-cam channel it will just bring more eyes and ears to your channel. A win!! And it does not matter whether their comments are plus or minus!!
Some youtubers are just garnering clicks. Controversy sells in this world, and people want to be right all the time. Hope you don't spend too much time Fil concerned with negative nellies. 😊
Agreed. Great way to phrase it.
I proved in my latest video that the factors of phone recording plus crowd and reverb did not change the pitch so I don't know what you talking about being negative.
Thank you for your expertise and grace
Fil, my husband and I enjoy your videos immensely! We have learned so much from you. Not only are you very knowledgeable, but you have a great personality to go along with it. I also appreciate that you include us older folks (68 and 66) when you analyze great musicians from our era. It makes me happy the way you smile at the things you are listening to, as if you are enjoying the joy they have while performing. You are a great guy. Keep up the great work!
You mention the passing police car. I believe that is known as the Doppler effect! You're spot-on on this one, Fil!
I am old. I remember the times you bought a record in a shop, put it on a turntable and listened to it and sounded great. Oh the good old days. Now you have to discuss machines, software and never even listen to music. And even if you happen to find a shop with records somewhere people trying to sell them are so woefully ignorant it's embarrassing. Ohthe good old days. I feel sorry for you youngsters 😅
They can just listen to good old music. And by old I mean pre-2000/auto-tune. They need to buy CDs to avoid MP3 overcompression.
Fortunately I already have 700 CDs I bought between 1993 and 2004... and a few from 2006 to 2013 (RedHotChiliPeppers: Stadium Arcadium, Jason Mraz x4 and Sara Bareilles "Blessed Unrest").
I hear you 😢
I remember those days, too. But nobody's forcing you to discuss software instead of listening to music. If you bothered to take a look, ignoring the obvious charts trash, you'd discover there's actually more good music out there than ever before. It might not be on mainstream fm radio or, indeed, on vinyl in your record store, but there's a wealth of younger artist making fantastic and original stuff across many genres, including genres you've never heard of. Being grumpy isn't a virtue, go with the times, friend :)
@@zendakk I agree there is a lot of great music there. I am not grumpy at all. And with UA-cam it's all easily accessible. However, there was a certain magic to buying a vinyl record, putting it on and listening to it on decent system. System which hardly anybody has. I can't be bothered even to sell my own cds, as I noticed most people do not even have a cd player now😉. Plus I made enough money from them anyway. And yes, I used all sort of software to make them too. However, there is no comparison between live acoustic music and a record, especially modern one. One reason IMHO is simply acoustics , the other that outside classical and some folk genres people simply cannot play, especially in a ansambles. And "going with the times" is not always a virtue. I prefer to to make my own way to following the herd just be ouse it "goes with the times" and this channel, that used find and analyse some great music seems to discuss some stupid software lately on and on. We could go on arguing it all started with pythagoras and his turning music into mathematics, or equal temperament, but I'd rather listen to music
@@zendakk With the endless supply of things on the internet, can you recommend to him where he should start searching to discover this gold?
The best thing about your work is your total and complete honesty and fairness.
Keep up your important effort.
Fil please ignore the trolls... they don't really care about this. You're working so hard for nothing if he was really interested he would reach out.
Oh but I have. I made a response to this video where I recreated a phone recording with crowd and reverb and the pitch remained the same
Fil, you're 100 % correct. However, we all know about trolls. We also know it's not worth your time. IMO, I think it's smart to choose your battles wisely. You know exactly who you are, and so do we ,and that my friend is all that matters at the end of the day. Don't waste another precious moment on anyone trying to disrespect you or anyone else, for that matter. 😊
People need to remember that sound travels fairly slowly at (1,235 km/h; 767 mph at sea level and stand and temperature and pressure). This relative slowness impacts the way sound is heard as the origin of a sound is propagated (either stationary or moving), and where the/a sound is manipulated when it is propagated.
I know it’s nothing to do with recorded music but your analysis about spaces and acoustics reminds me of when I was in an amateur drama group. Our home stage had a “dead” space about a third back and a third from stage left. We all knew about it and tried to move out of that space when trying to project. I really appreciate your analysis videos, they are fair and informative.
A perfect example of why it's so very important to explore (dare I say "research") any UA-cam channel to ensure you're getting accurate information.
You possess a certain sensitivity towards select commentators that is remarkably civil. This radiates through my screen all the way over here in Florida USA. You have taught me so much about subjects I have never thought about before. This is sometimes referred to as lifelong learning. I thank you.
Just a great comment
Thank you for explaining this in simple terms that, hopefully, anyone can understand.
I see what you mean. I saw the great Jim Reeves back in 1964 in a large sportshall with questionable accoustic quality.
In spite of this he sounded great because of the quality of his voice and the sound engineers. No effects and monkey business, just sheer quality and talent.
Good one, Fil. I hadn't thought about all the variables involved in voice sampling. It was worth the effort. Thanks!
So ... after watching this (Fil's) video, what I would like to see is someone write a song, or perhaps start a band, called "Pitch Correcting Police Cars." :)
Good one!
For those of us who are willing to listen and learn, this was an excellent video. Very educational, and your arguments are backed up by your experience in analysing vocals, and knowing how to use your pitch monitoring software.
Unfortunately, there will always be those unwilling to listen with an open mind...the ones that are always convinced that they are right despite evidence to the contrary...and you will just never get through to people like that.
You mentioned a determining factor beyond his location confusion and his inability to repeat the results. Your use of zoom-in feature of P M software in your original analysis, provided the proof one can't dispute.
Overall instructive video.
I expect all sirens to be pitch corrected from this point forward!😂😂😂
So much appreciate your level of music knowledge and ability to explain. Thanks Fil.
People who do not know how to apply the Scientific Method to their research are doomed to fail. The difference between the inside and outside recording(sound) is impossible to miss to my ears. Unfortunately almost anyone can post to UA-cam and the background of anyone making scientific claims should be established. Thanks for the details keep up the great work!
Excellent clarification. Teaching moment in music analysis 🎶
Hi Fil! You have always been objective on all analysis videos you have done. You've shown us time and time again on the pitch monitor software that what you see and hear is true, and we have seen and heard them ourselves! Just ignore the negative feedback, most of us know that you're right. I mean, 353k plus subscribers can't be wrong! Thank you for this incredible analysis, and keep up the good work! Rock!
No need to explain yourself, I trust in your expertise. God bless ❤
I have learned so much about music, sound, and voice from you, Fil, and truly appreciate everything you do. I especially appreciate the way in which you address detractors and trolls. You are patient, kind, and knowledgeable. Don’t change a thing that you do. You’re amazing and over 300,000 of us know it (and I’m sure many more to follow).
You have so much more patience that i do. As soon as i heard the quality of his sample for comparison, i laughed and though, are you serious!?
He should go to more studios and listen to singers cutting tracks. Its just a matter of lack of experience.
Flying a plane in a simulator makes you think you know how to fly a plane. Being in a studio and hearing a pro singer really is eye opening. They actually sing well, and you know why people pay them money for singing.
It's hard to be logical and reasonable in an illogical, unreasonable world.
But you know how to ignore what distracts from your goals, Fil. After all, you wrote a FANTASTIC album called "Persistence" ❤
Thanks!
Thank you for this comparitive analysis. You explain the differences in straight forward language so I can readily understand. This was done in your usual non-judgmental way. Thank you again.
Kudos Fil, I’ve followed your channel - you have credibility.
Fil,
He doesn’t understand pitch correction or sound.
I stumbled upon his channel while looking for “British guitarist Angelina Jordan,” because I thought you had done a video of her years ago.
He isn’t a musician. He has no background in music.
I watched him analyze a few videos, and he doesn’t understand the software he’s using.
He doesn’t deserve your time.
(Remember, it’s useless to debate anything with a Flearther. They don’t understand science.)
Are you sure about a British guitarist named Angelina Jordan? Just wondering.
Fil has not done a video analysis of Angelina Jordan. I have asked him to do so. But at first he said bc of disclaimer of using her material (she had a disclaimer at first) he could not react to her. Since the disclaimer was gone, I asked him again, but he has not. I am still waiting 🙏
Thank you, Fil, for going to so much trouble to explain. We follow and support you for this very reason.
The fact that you have so many of us watching supports your effort. 😊
Love the comment "people aren't going around pitch correcting police cars"!!!
Thank you, Fil!
I really like that Fil doesn't at any time say what he (and we) think about this know-nothing numpty -- that he's a know-nothing numpty. A very polite reaction, and nicely informative.
5:50 ... Doppler Effect 🧐 🚓
Yep, the effect changes with the different speeds of the passing vehicle.
Fil, you’re so gracious. I appreciate that about you. ;)
You are fantastic (full stop). And some people are assholes. Thank you for being awesome.
Informative and educational! Excellent job Fil, it's not feeding trolls, you're helping people to understand how sound can be affected by so many different things. Thank you!
Reminds me of seeing Zeppelin in Madison Square Garden many years ago. It must have been a nightmare for the sound engineer. The Garden was not built as a musical venue. Depending on where you were sitting it sounded great or not so great. The amps were turned up to 10 and you heard mostly what was coming out of the amp you were closest to. The thrill was seeing this great band playing live.
I appreciate your depth of understanding in regards to how sound works. Always enjoy the meticulous nature of your explanations. Thank you.
Great carful explanation Fil. You are showing your audience how to be scientific when analyzing music.
I absolutely enjoy Fils channel. And im an old lady but my kids growing up were in music and still are. Piano, drums, singing even sang in Rome at the Vatican. Youngest daughter very good but sometimes its who you know. After Idol auditions she stopped. Too bad, but like you she has a sensitive heart. Just enjoy listening to knowledgeable person. Truth.
.
Fil, you are ridiculously patient and polite. Ignore that guy---it sounds like he is not a musician and not the expert on this topic that you are.
Being an ex-programmer I'm a little concerned his software interpreted the same input in different ways; that really should not happen without some form of 'external' influence, such as a setting within the software being changed, or the input arriving in a different way: not sure if the software/hardware takes audio (actual sound) or the signal, via cables.
The most polite "jog on" I've ever heard.
Fil, again your beautiful analytical mind has explained everything in this video! Love the police car example. I found this to be very educational . You are a great teacher , musician and so much more.💜
So professional.
What always shines through is your authenticity, astuteness, integrity and caring!
Seen this guy before not for me if i need to be educated then it's over to your reactions doing a great job 👍
Thanks!
Anyone waging a campaign against pitch correction gets my vote everyday.
Thanks for this. You're an excellent instructor.
FIL THANK YOU FOR YOUR EXPERTISE AND YEARS OF MUSIC EXPERIENCE IT'S ALWAYS A PLEASURE TO WATCH YOUR VIDEOS 🥰🥰🥰
When Fil analyzes music, music says I'm not worthy.
What a terrific compliment!
Discussion is important to learning. You are continuing an ongoing discussion without accusation or rudeness. Kudos to you; and to the other UA-camr, if they did the same. We need this sort of discorse to further our understanding, so keep at it!
From an old retired professional to an active professional: I love your explanations and have never had to feel like your facts were wrong. A simpler way of saying your point (and I know this from working at frequency level back when we couldn't use a computer for pitch correction) is the following:
If you have one performance with two recorded sources and one of those sources is dirty (crowd noise, distortion, tape speed Etc) (damned I'm old) the dirty source cannot be used well in any comparitive manner. This means that the human ear can detect that the two performances are the same- but a computer will have a hard time doing it.
Audio analysis tools we have today do not hear like humans. So the quality standard for the audio data we feed to these algorithms matters greatly.
In the IT/Programming world I often refer to it as "Garbage in = Garbage out". One good recording and one dirty recording will equal crappy analysis with current technology.
This kind of analysis relies on the same know how us old guys had. And the rules have not changed because physics is the same. We just did it on oscilloscopes.
Be well Fil.
Hi Fil,
There is no way this guy couldn’t tell the difference between the inside and outside vocals. And he ran the same vocals twice! He was a little confused! Glad you were able to clear things up for the poor fella! The are always so many variables when singing outdoors and anything can happen! Great teaching moment for all to enjoy! Well done. Thanks again for explaining things so clearly… You Are The Best! Debbie☮️
Keep it up and keep focused on what you are gifted at❤
I did, some time ago, stumble on the channel of the gentleman in question and it was obvious to me that he had limited knowledge of what he was doing. So this doesn't surprise me.
Fil, remember that "Latin" motto, "Don't let the bastards get you down!"
Non ifantilus carborundum. Don't let the little bastards wear you down is the correct quote and translation from the Latin.
@@lindapendleton9176 Why thank you! But didn't it originate in modern-day English (my guess is WW2), move to Latin, then back to English?
1. the phrase was usually _"Illegitimi non carborundum"_ and is usually translated as "Don't let the bastards grind you down".
2. It is not real Latin. It is 'dog-Latin' or 'mock-Latin', English with Latin-style endings, usually for a humorous purpose.
3. 'carborundum' is an English word, it is a mass produced synthetic abrasive, hence 'grind you down'
4. AFAIK, It was invented during WW2
5. AFAIK, the phrase "get you down" became popular well after WW2, ie the 1960s.
So rubynibs, what motto are you thinking of?
@@gbulmer Thank you! That was what I'd been told many years ago - apart from the time period it was invented, which I'd guessed.
I'm glad you did post this explanation. That analogy about the police car was brilliant! I actually understood everything you said. Yay, me! 😂
Fil, u do an awesome job. You don't have to explain yourself. You are extremely knowledgeable. I have learned so much from u. Keep up the great work, u are a pleasure to listen to. 🎼🎶🎤
I think this person is trying to ride in your wake. Wipeout!🏄🤑
Don't worry about it. You can't explain everything to everyone. Acoustics, electronics, and software algorithms are a very large field of understanding. I've spent years dabbling in them and I'm just starting to understand what the Hell is going on.
You are THE authority on these matters. Period. Thanks for the clarification, Fil, even though it was not required.
Great analysis and info as usual. Thank you.
Fil you are so kind. Thanks for your knowledge. ❤
14:12 Take no notice, Fil!!❤
You are spot on!!!
“Resonant frequencies”…..that’s a new term for me. This all leads me to believe that sound engineers must be extremely valuable to singers.
@123Rockchild This is an interesting viewpoint.
The postion of trust we (engineers) are in is immesurable. The band trust us to make sure they sound their best and the audience want to hear the band at their best so the pressure comes from both ends. This goes for live or studio.
It's also the reason that recording studios -- the environment in which the music is played -- have to be very well designed, and why different studios produce subtly different sounds.
Sound engineers are invaluable to the entire group. Bad sound engineering can make an awesome-sounding band sound like crap. I've heard it. And a good sound engineer can make a good-sounding band sound even better, or at the least their very best.
A _good_ sound engineer is a pearl beyond price.
@@soundguyHielmi So you're kind of like spit-roasted...
Always educational, here.
Fil, your explanations are incredibly accurate and your knowledge of how the difference between pristine sounds and pitch adjusted should be the the baseline for any use of the software to determine accuracy.
Well done, Fil. I can't honestly say I followed it all (it's such a maze) But I really appreciate your knowledge and your passion. And I especially appreciate how you consciously attempted to quiet down any animosity before it rose between your fans and that other guy who made the video. That showed wisdom and patience. You're a true gentleman, Fil. A rarity. Stay with it man. Cyrano 66
We need more videos from you that are examples not using pitch correction software so we can have a better understanding of what normal, baseline, quality singing looks like on the spectrometer. Give us some studio recordings of Freddie Mercury, some Ann Wilson, some Elton John, some Bruce Dickinson, some people we all know have really great pitch but yet don't use pitch correction software. Thanks.
Fil, you are always on target with your analysis of any singer and your integrity is without question is rock solid!
You're a professional Fil , your word is law , if you say pitch correction or auto tune is at play , then it is 👍 this is a great channel , there is always someone being a low level nuisance !!
Glad you did this video. I've seen some of that site's claims that just don't make sense - based on what I've seen again and again on your channel. I'd rather be guided by professionals than no-professionals (and to give him his fair due he does say he's not a professional).
The 'police car' example you cited is an example of doppler shift. A well understood phenomenon since the mid 1800s! ;)
I was already familiar with the UA-camr you’re responding to because of his reputation for being sensationalist and clickbaity. Nevertheless, I appreciate that he inspired another informative video from you.