Thank you Jeff. I'm on your mailing list. As always you show the easiest most straight forward way to do things. This is a nice gesture to helping us DIY guys.
excellent jeff!!i did this on my 19 ktm 500exc as well as the enduro engineering low soft seat and you are right it was a game changer!so much more confidence and control! thank you!
Well said at the end and i endorse it 100%... I am 5.6 and struggled to gain confidence on trails but once the were lowered man it made so much difference... What you gain by lowering is far more good than what you lose... Very well explained video mate thanks
Man you are awesome! Thank you so much for sharing this info. I was ready to ship out my suspension even though I k ew I could do it if I just had a quick run through. Thanks so much for providing that!
Thanks for your insights Sir! I want to lower my tall bike and have just become aware of the “low shock build” concept you describe herein. But I am also aware of the idea of just using lowering links for the same purpose. My concern in that I read one negative comment re the latter proposition that suggested lowering links were a bandaid solution at best. I don’t understand the difference between the two concepts and would be grateful for your comments. Thank you.
Just seeing this video a year and a half later. I am very impressed with how simple it was to do, so thanks for the easy to follow video. Can you supply these lowering kits or do we need to get from a dealer? I am in Africa - many thanks
All of our videos have links below the video in the description section. Or you can us this link >>> slavensracing.com/shop/rear-suspension-lowering-kit-for-kyb-wp-showa-by-zeta/
Hi, I have a Honda CB300R and I'm thinking of lowering it but don't have the knowledge. Does changing the spring retainer to lower the height the same as this or would changing the stock spring retainer different from this and would it have any disadvantages?
Thanks for another excellent video! Can you comment on what you do for a spring once this kit is installed? Do you install a lower spring rate? If not, have you found you can accommodate the lowering kit by adjusting rebound and compression settings?
The spring rate stays the same assuming you have the correct rate installed. The sag should be reduced a little. Sag should always be set at 1/3 of the overall travel.
Thanks for the video Jeff. How do you go about figuring what your new rider sag measurement should be? Say, if you had it set at 110mm before, how do you figure what to set it to after? Is it just as simple as subtracting the thickness of the Zeta pieces or something else?
@@slaverace1 ok but the 2022 ktm as 310 mm of travel and you put in 10 mm piece in PDS, that means you should ajust the SAG acording to 300 mm or 280 mm because the all bike is lowered 30 mm?
Thanks Jeff, Two questions. 1) Noticed the shock shaft went down when you pushed the seal down. After getting the spacer and circlip in, should you then pull the shaft back up to max height with the spacer up to the circlip? This will create the max volume for oil. Then push the piston to the original position? If not, won't more oil come out when you push the piston back to original position without pulling the shock shaft up? 2) I installed a bladder in place of the piston. What if anything different is needed if I put the spacer in the shock? Do I then need to play with the pressure or reduce the amount of oil? Then how do I determine to change the amount of oil or pressure? Thank you, Scott
The location of the shaft is irrelevant because the fluid flows through the shaft bleed regardless of its location. The seal head gets pushed back into position when I push in on the reservoir piston. The best thing you can do is remove the bladder and re-install the piston. Bladders downgrade performance because the nitrogen penetrates the rubber and ends up in the oil making it similar to beer foam. They also change the oil to nitrogen ratio (not good) and usually have poor quality Schrader valves that leak. They are nothing more than a marketing scam.
@Love Sports YES, You are correct. As the shaft goes into the body it Does displace more oil into the piston accumulator. The seal head Did Not get moved back into position because he already removed the filler/bleed screw. Perhaps he forgot this time as he was distracted by videoing...
If a specific bike, in this case a '20 KTM350XC, has an application kit for the shock but not for its forks, I don't imagine it's recommended to just raise the tubes in the triple clamp by an inch or so to match the rear/balance the bike back out. Thoughts for that scenario?
If the tubes are raised an inch, the tire will hit the fender and stop the wheel rotation when you bottom the suspension. There is no cheap solution on XC models with AER forks. The spindle must be shortened and re-threaded by a machinist. We offer the machining service.
Hi ...shouldn't you also pull shock shaft up after installing the spacer and clip to seat in same position as where you measured depth of piston? Otherwise you will be draining off too much oil...Joe
Hi Jeff. I want to do this on an old Honda XR250. I think it’s the original shock , i.d. of the shock is 45mm. But there is no drain bolt for the oil. Can I still use the zeta lowering piece? Thanks
The forks need shortened the same amount as the shock to keep the bike in balance. That requires an internal mod. That video will be posted soon. Stay tuned.
@@specializedbighitfsr This video just shows how to install the Zeta Low Down kit which lowers the back of the bike 30mm. This kit is NOT for balancing the stinkbug stance on 2017-19 models. We have a Stink Bug killer for that. slavensracing.com/shop/stink-bug-killer-slavens-racing/
Thank you Jeff, I am also curious, can 2 of these be installed in one shock? Lowering bike around the 60mm mark? I want to fit a wp rear shock to beta xtrainer but would need two lowering rings stacked, is that possible ?
Jeff, one thing I think you missed. After the spacer is in place, you need to put some air pressure on the reservoir to seat the seal head. If you don't, the reservoir gap will probably be way off. I'm doubtful that you really had 25mm+ of piston displacement from installing the spacer.
The video editor must have trimmed 2 seconds too much because the sealhead was reset when I pushed on the reservoir piston with the special tool. There is no need to pressurize it and the piston was displaced by the thickness of the spacer which is NOT 25mm.
Looks like that letting the nitrogen out is necessary for lowering, but what if I'm going back to normal and removing that spacer out? Do I still need to let the nitrogen out?
Thanks Jeff, When setting the piston height, does shaft position matter? I'm guessing fluid volume is constant, and the Ni reservoir cushions big hits until fluid volume equalizes? I got in over my head, lol that piston wouldn't move and then it did, you would of had a good laugh. I'm bleeding without a highend system by watching other youtubers(sometimes not the best, lol). When moving the shaft up and down, shaft in pushes fluid out(path of easiest resistance) so I'm sure getting air out below the piston is hard. I need to some how move piston down, thinking of pushing the top of it down, how fragile is the piston? Thanks for the video!!
Easier install since the part is a 2 piece design, no need to completely disassemble shock internals like with the stinkbug killer (1 piece design) no re-bleeding of the rear shock needed (unless you accidentally sucked in air or pushed out too much oil when resetting the IFP/oil level) Also, Zeta kit lowers seat height by 30mm where as the stinkbug killer lowers seat height by 19mm.
I don't mention the brand because it is irrelevant. The video is about installing the Zeta lowering kit which is available for many brands of shocks. A link to the product and fitment information is in the video description.
Thanks Jeff - we appreciate your hard work on the videos !
Thank you Jeff. I'm on your mailing list. As always you show the easiest most straight forward way to do things. This is a nice gesture to helping us DIY guys.
You're welcome. How about throwing us a bone?
excellent jeff!!i did this on my 19 ktm 500exc as well as the enduro engineering low soft seat and you are right it was a game changer!so much more confidence and control! thank you!
Hopefully you lowered the front for correct balance or you now have a dirt chopper.
Well said at the end and i endorse it 100%... I am 5.6 and struggled to gain confidence on trails but once the were lowered man it made so much difference... What you gain by lowering is far more good than what you lose... Very well explained video mate thanks
Good explanation for how this part is installed properly.
Thank you.
Man you are awesome! Thank you so much for sharing this info. I was ready to ship out my suspension even though I k ew I could do it if I just had a quick run through. Thanks so much for providing that!
Glad I could help!
Thank you!! I really appreciate your videos. So helpful!!
Glad you like them!
Thanks for this!
thank you jeff!!! very helpful
Very welcome!
Thanks for your insights Sir!
I want to lower my tall bike and have just become aware of the “low shock build” concept you describe herein. But I am also aware of the idea of just using lowering links for the same purpose.
My concern in that I read one negative comment re the latter proposition that suggested lowering links were a bandaid solution at best.
I don’t understand the difference between the two concepts and would be grateful for your comments.
Thank you.
Lowering links change the leverage ratio and are basically changing the factory geometry. Not a fan.
So u return the piston to its original position and just remove the extra oil to do it.. Did I understand it right?
Just seeing this video a year and a half later. I am very impressed with how simple it was to do, so thanks for the easy to follow video. Can you supply these lowering kits or do we need to get from a dealer? I am in Africa - many thanks
All of our videos have links below the video in the description section. Or you can us this link >>> slavensracing.com/shop/rear-suspension-lowering-kit-for-kyb-wp-showa-by-zeta/
Hi, I have a Honda CB300R and I'm thinking of lowering it but don't have the knowledge. Does changing the spring retainer to lower the height the same as this or would changing the stock spring retainer different from this and would it have any disadvantages?
Thanks for another excellent video! Can you comment on what you do for a spring once this kit is installed? Do you install a lower spring rate? If not, have you found you can accommodate the lowering kit by adjusting rebound and compression settings?
The spring rate stays the same assuming you have the correct rate installed. The sag should be reduced a little. Sag should always be set at 1/3 of the overall travel.
I had a 48 spring for my ktm and put in 45 or 46 mm should I go back to the original
Im 5.3" height from india using ktm duke 125cc..is it possible to lower ???
do u have this procedure for KYB shock?
Great video. I already hava a lowered shock, and i will take it back to normal. How can i november the piston the other way?
Sorry, I don't understand your question.
Thanks for the video Jeff. How do you go about figuring what your new rider sag measurement should be? Say, if you had it set at 110mm before, how do you figure what to set it to after? Is it just as simple as subtracting the thickness of the Zeta pieces or something else?
Hello
Rider sag on all bikes should be 1/3 of the travel.
@@slaverace1 ok but the 2022 ktm as 310 mm of travel and you put in 10 mm piece in PDS, that means you should ajust the SAG acording to 300 mm or 280 mm because the all bike is lowered 30 mm?
Do one for the forks jeff im a short rider. If you recommend lowering it
Stay tuned.
Thanks Jeff, Two questions.
1) Noticed the shock shaft went down when you pushed the seal down. After getting the spacer and circlip in, should you then pull the shaft back up to max height with the spacer up to the circlip? This will create the max volume for oil. Then push the piston to the original position? If not, won't more oil come out when you push the piston back to original position without pulling the shock shaft up?
2) I installed a bladder in place of the piston. What if anything different is needed if I put the spacer in the shock? Do I then need to play with the pressure or reduce the amount of oil? Then how do I determine to change the amount of oil or pressure?
Thank you,
Scott
The location of the shaft is irrelevant because the fluid flows through the shaft bleed regardless of its location. The seal head gets pushed back into position when I push in on the reservoir piston.
The best thing you can do is remove the bladder and re-install the piston. Bladders downgrade performance because the nitrogen penetrates the rubber and ends up in the oil making it similar to beer foam. They also change the oil to nitrogen ratio (not good) and usually have poor quality Schrader valves that leak. They are nothing more than a marketing scam.
@Love Sports YES, You are correct. As the shaft goes into the body it Does displace more oil into the piston accumulator. The seal head Did Not get moved back into position because he already removed the filler/bleed screw. Perhaps he forgot this time as he was distracted by videoing...
If a specific bike, in this case a '20 KTM350XC, has an application kit for the shock but not for its forks, I don't imagine it's recommended to just raise the tubes in the triple clamp by an inch or so to match the rear/balance the bike back out. Thoughts for that scenario?
If the tubes are raised an inch, the tire will hit the fender and stop the wheel rotation when you bottom the suspension. There is no cheap solution on XC models with AER forks. The spindle must be shortened and re-threaded by a machinist. We offer the machining service.
Thanks Jeff , i have a question? After you put in Zeta product, do you put the retaining clip back on or did i miss that?
He put it back in. Makes a comment to check if it’s seated by testing to see if it will come up.
Can I put two aluminium rings in there? 1 can lower 30mm so 2 of them can lower 60mm? Right? Great video!! Thank you!!
Sorry, that won't work.
Hi ...shouldn't you also pull shock shaft up after installing the spacer and clip to seat in same position as where you measured depth of piston? Otherwise you will be draining off too much oil...Joe
Only the sealhead needs to be topped out.
Hi Jeff. I want to do this on an old Honda XR250. I think it’s the original shock , i.d. of the shock is 45mm. But there is no drain bolt for the oil. Can I still use the zeta lowering piece? Thanks
No, sorry
Would you just recommend lowering the fork tubes 5mm in the trees, or actually lower the fork travel to balance the bike?
The forks need shortened the same amount as the shock to keep the bike in balance. That requires an internal mod. That video will be posted soon. Stay tuned.
@@slaverace1 unless it is on a bike such as a 2017-19 KTM 150/250/300 XCW which had the excessively high rear end correct? Thanks Jeff.
@@specializedbighitfsr
This video just shows how to install the Zeta Low Down kit which lowers the back of the bike 30mm. This kit is NOT for balancing the stinkbug stance on 2017-19 models. We have a Stink Bug killer for that. slavensracing.com/shop/stink-bug-killer-slavens-racing/
Go to dealer lol, mine would be like 300 miles from
here. Is there somewhere else I could get the 150
psi of nitrogen? Great video and info!
You can send us your shock for a nitrogen charge.
This work for the WP shock on the big twins? Specifically the 1290 SAR?
Yes
Just to clarify Jeff , Did you say the groove has a sharp and round edge, Not the snap ring?
Correct
So, no new shortened shock spring? Enough threads on the shock body to adjust the length?
Plenty of threads to adjust the length.
Hi Jeff is there a lowering spacer available for Ktm 530 exc-r ? Which one should I get ?
Yes, the 50mm fits. slavensracing.com/shop/rear-suspension-lowering-kit-for-kyb-wp-showa-by-zeta/
Thank you Jeff, I am also curious, can 2 of these be installed in one shock? Lowering bike around the 60mm mark? I want to fit a wp rear shock to beta xtrainer but would need two lowering rings stacked, is that possible ?
Yes, but lowering it that much will throw the bike WAY out of balance and might require a shorter spring.
And about the SAG tunning when the bike is lowered 30 mm ?
Sag should always be 1/3 of the overall travel.
would you recommend altering the spring seat the same amount as the space?
The spring seat has threads and can be easily adjusted.
How would I remove the spacer if I needed to raise the suspension back up?
Just release the nitrogen and remove the spacer.
What's the process and bill of materials for raising husqvarna suspension to ktm spec? 2022 TC 250.
Sorry, I would have to do a lot of research to answer that question, but I'm sure it will be expensive.
Jeff, one thing I think you missed. After the spacer is in place, you need to put some air pressure on the reservoir to seat the seal head. If you don't, the reservoir gap will probably be way off. I'm doubtful that you really had 25mm+ of piston displacement from installing the spacer.
The video editor must have trimmed 2 seconds too much because the sealhead was reset when I pushed on the reservoir piston with the special tool. There is no need to pressurize it and the piston was displaced by the thickness of the spacer which is NOT 25mm.
Looks like that letting the nitrogen out is necessary for lowering, but what if I'm going back to normal and removing that spacer out? Do I still need to let the nitrogen out?
Yes, remove the nitrogen.
what is the nitrogen piston's correct location?
10-12mm from the top.
The jaws on your Vice, are they made of aluminium?
Yes slavensracing.com/shop/soft-aluminum-magnetic-vise-jaws/
So how much would something like this run.
slavensracing.com/shop/rear-suspension-lowering-kit-for-kyb-wp-showa-by-zeta/
Hi,is the same procedure on husqvarna 2017?
Yes. slavensracing.com/shop/rear-suspension-lowering-kit-for-kyb-wp-showa-by-zeta/
Do you have one for a 2021 beta 300 rr race edition? Thanks
Hello Dave:
Sorry, we do not.
How do you lower the front?
slavensracing.com/shop/front-fork-lowering-inner-kit-for-wp-xplor-by-zeta/
Can I use 2 spacers to lower it 60mm?
If you need it that much lower, you purchased the wrong bike.
do you think you should lower front and rear, or can you just do the rear?
You should do both front and rear to keep the bike balanced.
@@slaverace1 i have a 2011 ktm 150. i didnt see anything on your site for the front.
Do you have to measure the travel afterwards to set the sag or is there a calculation?
Sag is 1/3 of the overall travel.
@@slaverace1 I get that. Is overall travel smaller because it's lowered now?
@@brianbrannon
Yes. The only way to lower a bike is to reduce the travel.
@@slaverace1 is there a way to tell how much travel is reduced?
we don´t have that information :(
Thanks Jeff,
When setting the piston height, does shaft position matter?
I'm guessing fluid volume is constant, and the Ni reservoir cushions big hits until fluid volume equalizes?
I got in over my head, lol that piston wouldn't move and then it did, you would of had a good laugh.
I'm bleeding without a highend system by watching other youtubers(sometimes not the best, lol).
When moving the shaft up and down, shaft in pushes fluid out(path of easiest resistance) so I'm sure getting air out below the piston is hard.
I need to some how move piston down, thinking of pushing the top of it down, how fragile is the piston?
Thanks for the video!!
How does this differ to the stink bug killer. Thx.
Easier install since the part is a 2 piece design, no need to completely disassemble shock internals like with the stinkbug killer (1 piece design) no re-bleeding of the rear shock needed (unless you accidentally sucked in air or pushed out too much oil when resetting the IFP/oil level) Also, Zeta kit lowers seat height by 30mm where as the stinkbug killer lowers seat height by 19mm.
250 PSI of nitrogen??? But in the book of the bike (ktm 300 2020) it says 10 bar (150 PSI) ???
I said 150psi in the video, not 250.
He doesn't mention model or year or type. I assume it is also KTM.
I don't mention the brand because it is irrelevant. The video is about installing the Zeta lowering kit which is available for many brands of shocks. A link to the product and fitment information is in the video description.