Working on Williams System 11 PINBOT Pinball PCB's MPU Testing With a Multimeter
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- Опубліковано 21 вер 2021
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Our store is located at 139 Caldwell St., Rock Hill, SC 29730. - Ігри
I still like seeing these videos. You get it done and thats an admirable trait these days.
Thanks viscountalpha, we keep making them because we know nice people like you enjoy them. See you on the next one!
I have no clue about electronics but just love how you logically track down the faults and enjoy playing at the end. Great content keep going. 👍
Thanks Matthew, that's the vibe we're trying to project I hope it comes across a little bit. We appreciate you watching man, see you on the next video!!!
me neither..cannot get the grips of it no matter what, just goes in one ear and out the other, but to make up for being dumb i try to be funny
And too be honest.
I rather learn from apprenticeship in hands on approach then learning from a book and getting a degree.
Just because I've had bad case of short attention span.
And get bored easily.
But with hands on approach with added trial and error. I find it more entertaining and I can learn a lot from it.
that's how I figured out how to repair cassette tapes back in the day.
in learning recorded mixtapes with no gaps between songs. And learned how to play a tape cassette backwards.
Just by learning from experience.
So still doing awesome job there Ron.
Thanks man we appreciate you hanging out with us!
I usually have a beer (or two) with the videos, but I had to bust out some bourbon for this one! :) Great work!
Heck yeah man glad to hear you enjoyed it :) Thanks for watching Gregory, have a drink on me :)
Thank Joe ! I watched it twice,and now Im starting to at least recognize what some of that stuff in the backbox is !
Good stuff,and I'm gonna watch everything I can on System 11 games .
Very cool Ralph, once you mess with them a little bit they start making sense :)
Basic troubleshooting skills can get you through just about any problem. You do a great job explaining it!
Thank you Zac, I appreciate you watching buddy!
Great video, Ronnie. Thanks!
Love your expalnations, ive learnt alot.
Good long video with great information. Thanks for going through the process.
Thanks Pez glad you enjoyed it!!!
Oh yes! I just love the main theme music from this game. Before I'd open the arcade or after I'd close it, I'd put it in test mode and crank up that song. And the fact that the backbox has a tweeter and midrange in it and there's a big ol' subwoofer in the bottom makes it sound REALLY good!
Yup that thing really did have great music! Thanks for watching Tim, we appreciate it man!
Great another good video to see. Thanks Ron.
Thank you MrVectrex, I hope you enjoy it! We appreciate you hanging out with us.
Ronnie for the win! You make common sense look so easy. Better yet, you can tell you are self taught.
Thank you Eric that's very nice of you to say. We appreciate you watching!
All videos need to have you saying "Microfarad" burning the Know-It-Alls. Cracks me up!
Thank you Pabsy, we appreciate you watching :) We'll see you on the next one :)
Thank you for all your thoughts about checking and being able to repair.
Very good walk through mate :)
Thank you glad you enjoyed it!!!
You on a next level of repairing in this video.
We try! Thanks for watching Brant!!!
Love your A-B testing. solves a lot of problems
Thank you Adam we appreciate it man, see you on the next video!!!!
Nice one. Thumbs up as always. Pin*Bot was one of pinballs, to which I spent few coins at my teenager time.
It's a very cool game!
Had to work on a board for the first time recently and used exactly the approach I’d seen you do so many times before. You made it simple and it works. Ended up figuring everything was good with the exception of a chip that drove the GI relay. Replaced the chip and boom, problem solved! I would not have even considered doing some of the stuff I do now if I hadn’t been watching your videos for the last few years. So thanks for continuing to do them.
Hey Dave, how you getting on up there in level 3?
@@naytch2003 - bunch of fluffies, much easier being in our own place this time and with a project pin to work on didn’t feel the need to leave the house anyway! 🤣
@@davidg-m1768 I'm surprised Cindy didn't extend level 4, wouldn't put it past her
Most techs wouldn't accept a job without the whole machine to eliminate the source of the short or back fed voltage. Ron, just sick Donny on the haters and trolls we saw what he can do to a wall with a crowbar LoL!
keep up the informative vids!
Thanks macdaddyns, we appreciate it man! We save Donnie for the real bad ones, lol
Joe, great video you really keep it simple. I collect EM’s but would like to own a few solid state machines but lacked the confidence to make repairs. After viewing your videos and your way of troubleshooting I will start looking for a SS machine to tinker with, thanks.
Regards Skeeter.
Skeeter you can fix it, just take your time, the good news about Pinball Machines is that there's only a few types of boards for them, Gottlieb had 3 boardsets, Bally had 4 (I think), Williams had basically 3 or 4. Even if you can't repair it all of those boardsets are reproduced (I believe) so with that knowledge, you can safely kind of work through them.... thanks for watching man!
Ron, great vid as always!
A comment from one on the design side. I learned your diode mode transistor check technique ~25yrs ago from a tech and have used it ever since. In fact, you can figure out the B, C & E terminals from the relative values. It's unfortunate that others dismiss it and don't see the value in it.
The reason it helps me is because I don't have to memorize the different values, I have a bad memory (at least when it comes to anything important :) ) so this really helps me to be able to troubleshoot. I can understand why people who are designing boards need to of course know values and how things work and what the pinout is, etc. of course that's very important, but when you're working on something already designed (and proven, in this case) you kind of just need a way to quickly check and focus on trouble spots... THEN you can look it up if you need to since you've eliminated 95% of the board.
Thank you for watching svgalib, we appreciate it!!!
Wow how time flies.
It was 2? 3? Years ago when you did the last pinbot.
Kinda lost track.
Yeah it's been awhile! I was listening to Elvis earlier singing "Funny how time slips away" have you ever heard that one? Written by Willie Nelson I think - ua-cam.com/video/_ZcnT5gqRXk/v-deo.html
Sorry never been a fan of Elvis. Just a matter of opinion. Hound dog jailhouse Rock and Don't be cruel are classic.
More of a Beatles fan. Just saying.
And Chuck Berry and Little Richard really deserve the crown of king of rock and roll..
But that's just a opinion..
Good stuff here. You are 100% correct that there are those that will scream "Look up the specs", "you need to pull out the scope for that". No, unless you're dealing with some high end gear, or that's your jam, you learn how to do this quickly and efficiently. You do just that. I'm sure Dave Jones over at eeVBlog would have kittens watching your repair videos. Dave's a mega nerd and he's great at what he does. He's forgotten more than I ever knew, even when I was an engineer so many years ago. I forgot about 90% of what I learned after leaving the field.
That's my problem, I forget things... so it does me no good to look up the specs on everything because I'll never remember it... I do look up the specs of course when I need to, but I'm trying to show that you don't always need to, if you have 16 of something doing the exact same thing, you really don't even need to know what it does, lol Just see if any of them aren't :) Thank you for watching WreckDiver99!
@@LyonsArcade Ron, you're doing it right. I knew game techs back nearly 40 years ago that had ZERO "electronic engineering" background, but knew enough to be able to troubleshoot all of this stuff, and they did it exactly as you are doing it.
I laugh at Dave Jones over at eeVBlog because the guy has more test gear in his "lab" than my engineering school had in ALL their labs. I mean this guy must have 500 pieces of test equipment in his lab...we had like 5 scopes, 10 multimeters, a few frequency counters...and all dated back to when the school was called MCMT (Michigan College of Mining Technologies)...it's now known as Michigan Technological University...yea, our equipment was ANCHIENT...LOL
You can test pretty much anything on a system 11 CPU with a simple bench supply, on +5 and +12.
You can hook the +12 to the coil and lamp supply rails to get a good idea on base functionality.
Dude I have a degree in electronics and yet I learn a hell of a lot from your videos about this particular subject which you are very knowledgeable in. But before i did University i did what we call in the UK City and Guilds which brought me to where you are at self taught (also impressive) which is what you would call "Technician level" and indeed you are correct at Technician/repair level, you do not necessarily need to know how something works or how it was designed to fix it, as you so amply demonstrate in your fix videos. So your honesty and lack of ego about your abilities is refreshing.
Also all these types getting annoyed are usually armchair wizards that have never made, soddered (see what I did there) or fixed anything in their lives for a paycheck.
They seem to invariably show up on every UA-cam video be it, car repair or this or anything else.
Basically I think its a general personality type (or even flaw), the know it all, but does little of practical value themselves types or people that have to constantly prove themselves cleverer than others.
Usually they are doubters, naysayers, nit pickers and blah blah merchants all...
What these types really need to learn is that you are choosing to share your troubleshooting skills with them and it is not their place to criticise you, but just to be thankful someone is taking the time to teach someone else this stuff and are freely giving out the benefit of their experience that normally they would have to either pay to study or to sit many hours in a classroom for and be told to shut up with their know all ways when they piped up with a real teacher, not that you aren't a real teacher.
So like I said i've learned alot from your videos about electromechanics repair (which is what your videos are actually about) and if I ever wanted to fix a pinball machine (which looks like a lot of fun) I would know pretty much how to go about it from watching your excellent and humourous videos...
So Well done for that, and ignore these arrogant imbeciles and keep on keeping on with what you do...
But I'm sure that you will, as its what you do for a job
and some internet idiot isn;t going to slow your roll there...
I think we both had the same thoughts when you looked at the bridge rectifier.
Your description is pretty close. A transistor just measures like two diodes back to back. Technically the juice flows from black to red, electrons flow from negative to positive, but it doesn't really matter as "conventional" flow is positive to negative. It starts getting confusing lol.
Leg is the technical term by the way. Components have legs :).
Thanks for a great video.
Thank you Brendan, next time I'm going to call you and wake you up :) I know enough to be dangerous :) We'll see you on the next video, thank you for hanging out with us!
Ron back in the ol days there was a Test Rig for Bally and a separate one for Williams . You are doing good without . I used to work for Coin Machine Dist. Back in the late 70s to 1982
Very cool, I've seen some of the test rigs from time to time but never really messed with them, I just saw pictures and a few set up at Brady Distributing back in the day... thanks for watching Patrick, hope you enjoyed the video!
Not a bad price from Yorktown for recap kit at all! I need to recap my old Taxi power supply and track down where it is shorting out at. Keeps blowing a fuse. Thanks for the info!
They are good folks! Thanks for watching Trent!!!
Haters going to hate. Love your videos, great for picking tips and trick. Love the arcade stuff but checkout the pinball and other repairs. Always learn something. Don't let them get you down. I get silly comments on my small hobby channel and I just ignore them.
Thanks Dermot I appreciate it, I just subscribed to you so I can check out some of your stuff, I appreciate you hanging out with us!
Id like to find a junk board so I can practice soldering on. Plus I can't wait to try the Solder sucker Joe recommended.😁
Thanks!
Thank you Keith, that's very nice of you! I see you have a Pinbot, hopefully this video helped you out!
@@LyonsArcade it did indeed! I was heading down a rabbit hole and your video grabbed me by the scruff of my neck and set me up for success.
We had customers like that, its called repeat business ... I always found if the magic smoke was released, that there are more issues in the closet .. Fun as always !!
Hey Ron, I think that Power Supply cap is soldered in backwards! Be careful ;)
I did the same thing with my bally 35 boards while learning about the electronics. What interesting is on board a few values were way off on resistors, but checking underneath they were ran in series (or parallel). And one of my bridge rectifiers posted a .960 value, yet all test point voltage came out all good.
I also used an old computer psu to use as a bench tester to apply voltage on the mpu and it at least provided I have a good board with proper led flashes.
I'm guessing those don't have the led? Anyways with that damage they needed to provide the machine but understandable they being out of state
These actually do have LED's but I don't think they work as well as the classic Bally boot up test, I DO hook those up to power like you did because that boot led is so usefull. I believe theres a test rom you can burn for these System 11's though to make the led help you repair it. Thanks for watching RoadSurfer2k11!!!!!!
@@LyonsArcade sounds good. Great vid as always
Hey Ron, do you repair bingo machines? Pins 19 and 1 are enable pins on the IC it seems, according to the datasheet... 10/10 for this vid...
Dero I've got a few of them but I never have time to work on them, they're soooo complex, it's like 3 pinball machines in 1.... I looked up that datasheet just to make sure it was a buffer, lol and saw the enable pins on there, thanks for watching!!!!
Video seems a little blurry with ghosting happening. Thought it may have been my monitor so I used another one but still had the issues. Didn't stop from learning from the video though. :D
Man the auto focus on my camera is giving me fits, it's a struggle! Thank you for watching Practice dummy!
@@LyonsArcade We are at the age where we are the slaves and technology is the master lol.
JOES CLASSIC, Maybe you can show on the schematic in the next video about when a switch on playfield triggers the "special solenoid" transistor so it doesn't have to report to the CPU. When looking at the schematic I'm not sure which transistors are considered the Special Solenoid and how they work in the operations of series of events. You mention that if a switch on the playfield is turned on that the special solenoid will turn on. If you can explain it better using the schematic it might help understand it better even tho you're just guessing also its ok so I get a better idea of what you're trying to say is fine with me.
We went over it with schematics in this video on an F-14 (which uses the same pcb as the pinbot).... thank you for watching Wayne!!!! - ua-cam.com/video/ufo8lTy_uo0/v-deo.html
@@LyonsArcade ok thanks
I see that atomic purple Gameboy Color, nice!!!!!! What games are ya playing?
We're repairing that one, I usually test it with Tetris, i'm a Vanilla type of game player , lol Thanks for watching Ronald!!!
@@LyonsArcade always man. Thank you for the content you put out. I am a slot technician at a casino and your videos have helped me learn over time how to figure out how to fix our machines or at least what caused them to fail
I’d be more worried about what might be wrong with the rest of the machine. A problem might not show until it’s plugged into something. But yeah this is a way to find more definitive failures.
Besides visuals, you can smell damaged components and feel the for excessive heat.
I agree with you 100%, I don't like working on them without the entire machine because even if you get the board working all the way, if something caused the damage as soon as you plug it back in it burns up the board again. Thanks for watching GreenAppelPie!
6:00. My biggest concern is you fix it, he plugs it in and it fries things again. Need to know what caused the short first!
Ain't that the truth! I think we may be seeing that Pinbot here in the shop sooner or later, i'll keep you posted :)
I have a question. Should I reflow pins on the board or should i examine very carefully. And if ok skip this step
You can definitely skip it if it looks o.k., usually if there's a problem you will up close (really, really close) see a little ring or the beginning of one at the base of the pin where it's breaking away from the board. Usually it's the pins on either end, they get more stress when the plug is removed. It's possible for them to not be connecting 'electrically' even if they look good but it's usually physically actually broken loose. Thanks for watching Pyro Todd Fireworks!
The biggest issue with testing System 11 boards on the bench is that the displays changed a few times. Nobody has made a universal bench display like is available for the the 3 - 7 boards.
Thank you Jeff, I don't do too much bench stuff I usually have the whole machine and use it as a test bench, I usually fire it up in there and find out what's not working, then focus on that on the bench and put it back in. Thank you for watching!
@@LyonsArcade Siegecraft makes some good and not too expensive diagnostic tools that when combined with a switching power supply let you fire up the board fully on the bench. All of the System 11 boards use the same connectors for the displays but the decoding changed with each display rev. If you plug in a display that does not match it will light up but you just get garbage.
I would say you fix the machines and the customers are happy.
What's the problem?
With the way you do things compared to someone else who's got a degree in engineering.
That's a good point buddy
Shame you cannot replace the NPN transistors with transistors with lower on resistances i.e something like the VN66AF or smaller.
That might work, do they have similar specs?
@@LyonsArcade It appears to be source(-),gate,drain(+) so should work and it is a TO92 style package, if they are not on for very long then no heatsink is required but maybe a small clip on heatsink should keep them cool.
Yodel ay hee hoo
Yodelay Hee Hoo!!!!
Is there anybody alive out there?!!!!😁
@@naytch2003 What?
@@lileveretteyoakumiii haha you've never heard of the boss Bruce Springsteen?..that's what he says at his concerts..c'mon Everette c'mon man 😆it's also from his song Radio Nowhere
@@naytch2003 ok
hm at 30:52 C52 looks realy burned to isnt it ?
it looks that way but I think it was just smoke 'dirt', the one to the right of it looks like that too.
@@LyonsArcade yea, just better cleaaan it off, had one time a short cause the black dirt on a resistor had so much carbon in it that it changed the value to pretty much zero 😵
Being a qualified graduate with 40 years experience designing computer systems. If I was paying someone else to fix a pinball board. I would hope for experience over theory. Theory will help with the head scratching times... But I to would look for cooked bits first.
There is a chap ( north ridge fix. UA-cam channel) who repairs I-phones xboxs and similar......much testing done with diode test at least at first....so yeah diode test for the win
Thank you Jason that's very nice of you to say. See you on the next video!
Must be a major pain in the
When everyone is trying to tell you how to do it the way they think it should be done.
When you just figured out a way to go around it and go common Sense approach.
They're a bit jealous I think.
That might be it :)
Hey bud. I have a question. Do you know anything about pop machines?
I have an old Dixie narco soda machine and it can't dispense cans or accept coins. It powers on and lights up but doesn't vend. Do you know what could be going on with it if you might know how to I mean?
I don't know anything about them unfortunately, does the compressor still keep it cold? The powering on is the easy part, if you run AC through something it'll power on but I'm not sure what the electronics look like in these. One of these days i'll get one and mess around with it, i'll bet there are folks on youtube though that know all about them, I just don't know of any particular channels, sorry. Thank you for watching Foxy!
@@LyonsArcade that's good k man. You make great videos man. I started watching since off-road challenge arcade cabinet.
But I'll look around on your suggestion
I'm not Ron and I haven't ever worked on a pop machine, but I would suggest approaching it like Ron does video games or juke boxes. Start at where the power comes in and work your way forward (e.g. is the power supply supplying the correct voltages?) When you get to a circuit board examine it for obvious flaws (e.g. blown up chips, sweaty or bulging capacitors, etc. Check the components (that you can) with a multi-meter. When you get to the can-dispenser mechanism, make sure it works smoothly, your problem could be as simple as a gummed up moving component.
Note: Be very careful around the refrigeration system, the coolant they use can be toxic (so you don't want to let it out) and damaging to the environment (particularly with older systems).
what model. the older ones just had simple enough electronics to count the coins and then fire a coil. depending on the machine every slot was unlocked at the same time but instantly re-locked as you were pulling your choice out so only one came out. only time I had a problem was when it toasted a fusible trace but everything concerning lights and cooling worked
I mean how else can you explain why master class videos and tutorial videos are so popular.
Because of your learning from someone else's experience from Hands-On approach.
Just saying.
Thank you Me my opinion Sche you're one of my best viewers you know that right?
YOU BONEHEAD!!!! You put the capacitor in backwards on the Power Supply. I bet that dude is gonna put it in, it won't work and he'll have to drive it all the way from several states away just so you can see it and put the capacitor in right!!!!
BTW, I can also tell looking at the burns on the board that the guy has a wire connected to a cylinoid instead of the tilt switch. You should put a note in the package that you send back.
;)
hahaha... if you ever read the Sherlock Holmes books, he said you could look at one piece of evidence and figure out everything that must have happened before. So If I was good enough, I would have been able to tell that the only wire that could have possibly been connected to a solenoid, on that switch line, was the tilt switch :)