Imagine selling bikes at 1k over MSRP vs. 15k. That would help. I'll tell you the story next time we talk about the local owner of a HD dealer and myself chatting about that. Criminal upcharging. Bad for business, and 100% of the reason I'm Indian Mikey and not Harley Mikey. Not putting LEDs in new bikes in 2023 is also criminal. Totally agree with you.
I agree, harley starts their negotiating about $10k to $12k over msrp, I bought a few harleys, it's always been a painful time wasting experience to get what I would hardly call a fair deal, buying a motorcycle is fun, buying a harley is a whole different experience
@@brucesmith7858 The Motor Company is trying to make the bikes cheaper so they can try to appeal to a younger audience and there is talk of putting a 117ci in the street bob and then making the 117ci in the Lowrider S and ST models have increased power and ride modes just putting the information I have out for all Harley lovers to see
I think HD has been using thier huge parts aftermarket as an excuse for not upgrading their bikes for too long. Maybe I wouldn't have to swap out so many parts if the stock version wasnt junk i.e. suspension.
💯 This is what has been slowly driving me out of the brand for years. You can't call yourself a premium motorcycle company and not build your bike with premium parts.
Personally I don't panic when something gets placed on the bike for 1-2 years. I'm all for development and trial and error is how new items get tried out. The weak gets dropped and the good stuff becomes mainstream. It's when something crappy gets changed for 5+ years that I start to worry that it is the new norm.
Not that I would upgrade right away but I hoping the Road King Standard comes back with some of the newer technology you just talk about. But my 103 is fine and I enjoy it just the way it is.
Except for the Pan America, the HD ride modes are a joke. In BMW, Triumph, Ducati, Indian Challenger, for example, when you change ride mode say from Road to Sport, there is a compensating change to suspension settings (automatically) to complement the ride mode and of course, the rider can adjust the suspension settings further using controls on the handlebars. With HD, you still have to get off the bike and adjust suspension (rear preload only just the same) settings manually - including on the new expensive SG and RG CVOs. I'd like to see a bagger with removable saddlebags but so the bike doesn't look like garbage when the bags are removed.
I do not want any of the RDRS. I know how to ride my motorcycle. I do not like ride modes. I want to control the bike not have a computer control it. I like normal gauges not digital. I am tired of hearing about what europe requires. Harley needs to remember that their biggest market is the united states not europe. They can add all the required stuff to the eurpean models.
@derfskittlers6125 Keep safety optional. Maybe I want to pay for safety, maybe I want to be responsible for my own safety? Don’t require my money for something I don’t want. That’s my ask.
I now we talk bikes! Don’t think you can buy a car in the US of A without abs! So i think its development ! As led. But not for extra 💰 But if you are like me 35 year of riding! Its ok without😂🇸🇪
Yep agreed, if it has it ok. I have it on 1/2 of my bikes but it's no deal breaker. Been on hogs that many years too, put better led lights on and I'd be happy. Don't care about ride modes either.
I can't believe the revolution max is a Harley Davidson engine! Don't seem like Harley Davidson to me. More like a Honda with Harley Davidson's name on it.
Unfortunately the MoCo has to comply to regulations outside of their control. Can you imagine the money they would make if they could re-release the Pan Head as an Icon model?
@JaySorsby1 the EPA needs to pound sand and fuck off why does the EPA get to tell companies what they can and can't build. ???? If Harley Davidson started bringing back all the old bikes their sales would go through the roof.
Imagine selling bikes at 1k over MSRP vs. 15k. That would help. I'll tell you the story next time we talk about the local owner of a HD dealer and myself chatting about that. Criminal upcharging. Bad for business, and 100% of the reason I'm Indian Mikey and not Harley Mikey.
Not putting LEDs in new bikes in 2023 is also criminal. Totally agree with you.
Luckily my local dealer is MSRP. Unfortunately my dealer is MSRP.
@@JaySorsby1 😆 🤣 😂
I agree, harley starts their negotiating about $10k to $12k over msrp, I bought a few harleys, it's always been a painful time wasting experience to get what I would hardly call a fair deal, buying a motorcycle is fun, buying a harley is a whole different experience
How a out 5k under MSRP, dealership cost, and the only profit comes with completing the bike, and keep the T-Shirt
Great overview and thoughts, appreciate the time you put into this.
I think that they’ll go with VVT in the 117’s.
Thank you for noticing the work.
I work at a Dealership and I can guarantee you guys that the 2024 models will have a major price reduction so keep an eye out for that
I can’t see that happening.
@@brucesmith7858 The Motor Company is trying to make the bikes cheaper so they can try to appeal to a younger audience and there is talk of putting a 117ci in the street bob and then making the 117ci in the Lowrider S and ST models have increased power and ride modes just putting the information I have out for all Harley lovers to see
hahahahahaha!!!!! HD equals High Dollar
@@francis105G of course it does. You’re a little late to the party with that expression.
I'd like to see that but I I would not bet on it
I love the bike but I'd like to see a 5 gallon tank because the 3 gallon is keeping me from buying it
After 120 miles on that bike I’d be ready for a gas stop anyway. 😆
@@JaySorsby1 that's a fair point lol
Making ABS standard is not a "feature" should have been standard years ago, same with LEDs
I still would prefer it to be optional.
Out of interest, here in Canada ABS is required on bikes sold here so it comes as standard equipment on all Harley models.
@jimtownsend6139 Dang. That sucks. Do they require helmets as well?
I want to be able to opt out of ABS.
Let only those who want it buy it.
I think HD has been using thier huge parts aftermarket as an excuse for not upgrading their bikes for too long. Maybe I wouldn't have to swap out so many parts if the stock version wasnt junk i.e. suspension.
That’s the best and the worst part. Swapping parts is fun, but expensive on top of a premium cost to entry.
💯
This is what has been slowly driving me out of the brand for years. You can't call yourself a premium motorcycle company and not build your bike with premium parts.
Personally I don't panic when something gets placed on the bike for 1-2 years. I'm all for development and trial and error is how new items get tried out. The weak gets dropped and the good stuff becomes mainstream. It's when something crappy gets changed for 5+ years that I start to worry that it is the new norm.
Good points Jay... You have been around Mike (Riding in the Ozarks) too much, you are starting to sound like him. LOL
It’s harder than it looks.
Not that I would upgrade right away but I hoping the Road King Standard comes back with some of the newer technology you just talk about. But my 103 is fine and I enjoy it just the way it is.
I'm happy with mine, but I'm starting to get that itchy new bike feeling.
What about the 110" CVO? Missed that in your line-up. Good info and content.
Frick yeah😡 I noticed after it published.
Thanks for the kind words.
What I don't see is me affording one.
I only buy used, but that’s just me.
Yep. Saved about 6k on a softail std 2020 with 100 miles on it. He admitted it was a mid life crisis mistake.
@@kenster007 my guy! 👊😎
@@JaySorsby1 plus I live in Denver, dealer markup for a new one was high teens out the door. Low 20s for the street bob.
@@kenster007 ouch! That’s nuts that dealers are still marking them up like that.
Except for the Pan America, the HD ride modes are a joke. In BMW, Triumph, Ducati, Indian Challenger, for example, when you change ride mode say from Road to Sport, there is a compensating change to suspension settings (automatically) to complement the ride mode and of course, the rider can adjust the suspension settings further using controls on the handlebars. With HD, you still have to get off the bike and adjust suspension (rear preload only just the same) settings manually - including on the new expensive SG and RG CVOs. I'd like to see a bagger with removable saddlebags but so the bike doesn't look like garbage when the bags are removed.
I do not want any of the RDRS. I know how to ride my motorcycle. I do not like ride modes. I want to control the bike not have a computer control it. I like normal gauges not digital.
I am tired of hearing about what europe requires. Harley needs to remember that their biggest market is the united states not europe. They can add all the required stuff to the eurpean models.
I hope we maintain options as well. My Road King has ABS and I’d be ok if it did not.
Options are fine. Then the people that want it can have it.
ABS and RDRS are fantastic options even if you think you are a pro rider. Don't knock it until you've tried it.
@derfskittlers6125 Keep safety optional. Maybe I want to pay for safety, maybe I want to be responsible for my own safety? Don’t require my money for something I don’t want. That’s my ask.
Well said
I think the big question is will the 121VVT make it into other bikes. I would like to see the 121VVT come to the Street Bob and the Road Glide ST.
I think we will see the VVT in 117 or possibly 114 well before we see the 121 in anything other than the CVO. Similar to the TC110 and M8 117.
I dont think HD will make a VVT117.
I hope new EPA restrictions will force the 121 into more bikes sooner than later.@@JaySorsby1
@@richpuller1348 the EPA has done quite enough to motorcycles.
If they do VVT on the 117 then the 114 will get it too.
Agreed.
It’s all bottom end stuff. I don’t see why the displacement would really be a factor.
Road King Standard with 114 engine?
Would be dope!
I took that survey and I didn't read into it like you did I think they just want to know what we want I doubt we're going to get it
Changes are coming. We made not like them, but they’re acoming.
Get me that CVO look for the basic models, drop the price a little and Im in for a road glide in 2024 ;)
For real. I’m ready for the new bodywork.
I think all stay the same except colors. Hopefully the Road King base comes back. Then in 2025 you see the up grades.
That is most likely. Probably the base RoadKing comes back and the Highway King goes away.
New vibrant PAINT!!!!
I now we talk bikes!
Don’t think you can buy a car in the US of A without abs!
So i think its development ! As led.
But not for extra 💰
But if you are like me 35 year of riding!
Its ok without😂🇸🇪
Yep agreed, if it has it ok. I have it on 1/2 of my bikes but it's no deal breaker. Been on hogs that many years too, put better led lights on and I'd be happy. Don't care about ride modes either.
I can't believe the revolution max is a Harley Davidson engine! Don't seem like Harley Davidson to me. More like a Honda with Harley Davidson's name on it.
Unfortunately the MoCo has to comply to regulations outside of their control. Can you imagine the money they would make if they could re-release the Pan Head as an Icon model?
@JaySorsby1 the EPA needs to pound sand and fuck off why does the EPA get to tell companies what they can and can't build. ???? If Harley Davidson started bringing back all the old bikes their sales would go through the roof.
@@Johnclark300 yeah they would!
Harley IS an American compay. They want an instant return for nothing new.
That’s human nature
When are we going to see the new Street Fighter
If we don’t see it in 2025 I doubt we ever will.
@@JaySorsby1 I was going to buy that and then I decided to buy the brand new 2023 mt10sp
Those MT series bikes are wicked.
@@JaySorsby1 only got 600 Mi on it... I need to ride more but I own my own company and I'm busy.... Master Plumber
@@STATION26ADDISON keep fighting the good fight. The ride will be there when you’re ready.
I think we'll see SSDD lol.
SSDD is the most likely.
U should just buy a road glide 😂
FXRP fairing looks better.
New collection for hipsters...
😆😆