I wish he had gone into more detail on the falling out between Russia and Armenia as a result of this conflict. That consequence deserves to be talked about.
Simon, follower for about a year now across your channels and platforms. This channel is almost to 1M subscribers… well deserved, congratulations and thank you.
For some of the people making ignorant assumptions in the comments. The Armenians of Artsakh (as it was known since ancient times) or Mountainous/Nagorno Karabakh have a history of self-rule going back 1000 years. The Principality of Khachen (821-1000), Kingdom of Artsakh (1000-1261), the Principality of Khachen (1261-1601), the Principalities/Melikdoms of "Khamsa" (1601-1822), Russian empire abolished local titles in 1822-1918, the Armenian National Council of Karabakh (1918-1920), the Nagorno Karabakh Autonomous Oblast/Region from 1921-1991, and the Republic of Artsakh (1991-2023). This area had been self-ruled by local Armenians for nearly 1200 years.
What is it with the Balkans & this blood feud bullshit? You realize, “my ancestors lived in this area for over 9000 years,” is a nonsense basis for a territorial claim, right? You know the other guy is just gonna counter with, “well, mine have been here for nine-thousand & one! Plus, it would’ve been 10,000, had your ancestors not told the viceroy my ancestor was a witch! This forced my ancestors to flee so your ancestors could steal their home!” At which point you retort with, “Oh, are we just going to completely ignore the fact that not four score and 7 summers later, your ancestors convinced everyone that my Great-Great-Great-Great-Great-Great-Great-Great-Great-Great-Great-Great-Great-Great-Great-Great-Grandmother’s Massive-Mommy-Milkers were to blame for the drought, forcing MY ancestors to flee, just so YOUR ancestors could then claim my ancestors’ land, their homes, & everything else they had to leave behind?…And we only called her Witch on account because she were a Witch!!” To this they’ll say something like, “Yea? YEA!?? If that’s how it went down, how do you explain how my ancestral name was recorded as the one liable for tribute less than 4 barley moons later, when the land; its inhabitants were compelled ,under hoof of The Golden Horde, to swear fealty to the Great Kahn of Kahns?” To which you’d shoot back, “Sure, only if you’re willing to ignore your ancestors front running mine. So, they could tell The Horde my ancestors said, ‘Kahn? Kahn? Tell Mr. Kahn of Kahns, he Kahn keep the dingles when he eats them from my unwashed medieval ass! How’s that for tribute?’” And on and on and on. In this case, I actually believe the Armenians to be the ones with the strongest claim to the territory (Artsakh). It’s pretty clear that the Azerbaijanis are in the wrong, & the region belongs to the ppl who had lived there until they were violently forced out. But you know what I hear when someone like you starts citing shit that happened nearly a thousand years ago? Some bullshit. Nobody, outside the region anyway, could give 2 shits about such bygone bullshit. It’s not relevant. With any history from that far back, we’re lucky if we can verify whatever is claimed happened happened at all. If we’re able to meet that bar, it’s still assumed that the description of the event will be at best incomplete and at worst full of fabrications. It’s just too error prone and too likely to contradict primary sources from the same era, covering the same events even.
@@WgCdrLuddite They left Karabakh themselves,nobody compelled them. Even Azerbaijani president mentioned several times that if armenian residents want to live in Karabakh then they need to apply for Azerbaijani citizenship.some of them applied and still live in Khankendi peacefully.But most of armenians has left because they know what they have done in 1992-94 to azerbaijani people. Armenians left Karabakh so easily and comfortably. However in 1992 azeri people from Khojaly were struggling to flee under daily shelling of bombs and offensive attacks of armenian forces.(google it: Khojaly massacre) .Btw not all of armenians were ancient inhabitants.remarkable amount of armenians has been moved to populate karabakh by armenian government during 30 years
@@WgCdrLudditearmenians left karabakh themselves,nobody compelled them. Even Azerbaijani president mentioned several times that if armenian citizens want to live in Karabakh then they need to apply for Azerbaijani citizenship.some of them applied and still live in Khankendi peacefully.But most of armenians has left because they know what they have done in 1992 -94 to azerbaijani people. They left Karabakh so easily and comfortably. However in 1992 azeri people from Khojaly were struggling to flee under daily shelling of bombs and offensive attacks of armenian forces.(google it: Khojaly massacre) btw not all armenians were ancient inhabitants of karabakh. Remarkable amount of them was moved to there by armenian government to populate during 30 years
As a Belgo- Armenian I applaud the effort in creating this video to educate, but can’t shake the feeling that some major details have been glossed over. Like how this whole region has been an Armenian one since several millennia, and the Azeri claim is only due to Lenin & Stalin’s errors… Or the fact that the first NK war started when the Azeris started the first pogrom in Sumgait (1988) followed by another one in Baku in 1990. Killing and getting rid of all Armenians from soviet AZ. Or how Armenophobia runs deep in Azeri culture… These are facts that shed major light on why this all happened, and how a corrupt country can rely on its oil and equally corrupt allies to take away land that had never been theirs.
For the record - Alievs are in power only because armenians started the war in 80-90s and occupied Azerbaijani lands. Aliev was not welcomed in Azerbaijan political life until 1993. The occupation made people ask Aliyev to come back to power in hope that he will help with the war and occupation. But the main point is - Armenians created the situation when Aliyev came to power.
the reason this was ignored was because the azeris were providing europe with oil/natural gas to fill the void that russia left in that market. no one would be willing to bite the hand that....keeps them warm. and aliyev, knowing that fact, along with the fact that russia would be busy with ukraine, absoluteky took advantage. it has nothing to do with politics.
Can definitely feel Simon’s increasing sadness and exasperation at the world’s totally ignorance of the less popular headlines. Thanks for covering - without you I’d also still be totally ignorant of this, and the situations in Myanmar and Sudan
@@tanjiro2507 Exactly the truth is people only care about war and Ethnic cleansing when the fight is attached to their political, social and or ethnic identity.
Armenia was illegal occupying internationally recognized Azeri territory, just as Russia is illegally occupying internationally recognized Ukrainians Crimea.
@@JB-xi2yv Maui fires? That was extremely well covered in the US. And there’s nothing wrong with that - just good to get the other stuff too. Like Maui was tragic. But a much smaller scale vs. something like Sudan civil war. But the latter has nothing to do with US politics or global warming or things that make the press get excited.
''We have forgotten how we lost the First Republic of Armenia. There was the Turkish-Russian cooperation. There also was the pursuit of the Treaty of Sevres. Then, as now, we became obsessed with our dreams instead of focusing on the possible, and we lost part of what was possible. More, we lost our independence. In other words, all of this was predictable and predicted.'' - Gerard Libaridian (US-Armenian historian and diplomat, advisor to the first president of Armenia between 1991-1997, deputy foreign minister, one of the main negotiators with Turkey and Azerbaijan over the NK issue)
Dear Simon and team, thank you so much for bringing up an issue which has been silenced by everyone, including the colaborationist government of Armenia. Your concern is greatly appreciated....
As I recall, Nagorno-Karabakh was made an autonomous oblast of the Azerbaijani SSR by Stalin (despite being mostly inhabited ethnic Armenians) as part of a “divide and rule” strategy that would keep the other Soviet Republics from resisting Moscow’s rule. It’s also the reason for the three-way border dispute between Uzbekistan, Kyrgyzstan, and Tajikistan.
Yes. Stalin did the classic imperial move to create a conflict waiting to happen between vassals to increase their dependency on the empire with his arrangement in both those areas.
Stalin is very much overlooked as the most influential figure of the 20th century. The ripples in the pond from his decisions made 70 odd years ago are still strong and spreading.
Stalin gave armenians living in azerbaijan autonomy while soviets expelled muslims living in armenia. Yet armenians are the ones complaining. Stating one sides argument is bias
@Samirustem Before you go around accusing people of being biased, maybe you should consider the possibility that I’ve never heard of the particular fact you’re talking about? And how is what I said “biased?”
Thank you for shedding some light to one of the worst forced exile in the modern history. It’s important to recognize and reflect on these significant events in history, even the painful ones, to ensure that the stories and experiences of those affected are acknowledged and remembered.
George W Bush held what was supposed to be a week-long conference in 2001 in hopes of resolving the dispute. It ended after a few hours, and on his way out he said to Colin Powell, “I don’t ever want to hear about this again!”
while after a 5 min search i didn't find that quote i did find that a meeting did happen in April 2001 confirmed by many sources and that the Bush administration walked away from a military parity agreement in 2004.
@@EAWanderer They self-identified as "Armenian" and addressed "Simon". That's a response customised with data not directly present in this video's displayed meta data, and while hypothetically derivable, you're not going to see that in a youtube bot going for likes. So quite unlikely to be a bot. Furthermore your capitalisation of "OR BS", the smirk emoji at the end, and how this was all levelled at a person self-identified as one of the people negatively impacted by the events in this video; well it all makes you come across as an unlikeable jerk. You need to work on pruning out this behaviour or it'll become habitual, then unconsciously done. You'll find yourself doing it when you really didn't want or mean to, and slowly drive people away. That road sucks, please don't take steps down it.
@remethtiamat7950 Bla bla bla I still didn't get a response from the original source and I have no interest in reading your anecdote Plus liking your own comment won't fool any1
@@EAWanderer Oh, you're displaying Troll behaviour. Always disappointing to see someone who isn't interested in discussing, just in putting down others to try and make themselves feel better. Very well, this'll be my last response to you. I do hope you manage to overcome whatever it is driving you to treat others like this. Goodbye.
Thank you as always for discussing topics that aren't discussed often enough, Simon and team. You do a fantastic job on reporting things like this. I do wish you had made more mention of the horrific war crimes of the Azeri government and cast a bigger spotlight on the despot that is Aliyev, as you have done with so many other horrific dictators around the world on this channel, but at least this helps shed some light on what has happened.
@@andzejsulzicki9401 It is Armenia who still harbours the Russian army base in Armenia Russian protect your borders So ruzzians are in armenia not in Azerbaijan
I think Simon deserves praise for beginning this retrospective by reminding us that Armenia and Azerbaijan alike did truly horrible things to one another, where as many others who discuss this conflict either gloss over Armenia's more sinister actions or outright ignore them to paint Azerbaijan far less favorably. It's important to recognize that sometimes, there's no real good guy in these situations.
There might be no good guy but there surely is a right guy, which in the case of this conflict is Azerbaijan since the territory is internationally recognized as hers, borders are defined by international law and any medieval minded country that goes against it is by definition THE AGRESSOR
Because that's what you think when you listen it at face value. The first war was started by Azerbaijan and Azerbaijan alone, people were blockaded to starve in the late 80s and military was used against them, when you face such a thing, you either pick up arms or you die, so that's what they did. That's like Russia crying over of its lands being occupied by Ukraine after it started the war. Remember, the azerbaijani president openly admitted he was offered the 7 regions back in return for a peace deal but he refused them, he wanted to solve it by war and that's what he did. I wish I can share links here, but don't push bothsidism just on the surface without going into the details on each step on how things got there.
@@ca7971 in my experience, Simon isn't obviously right or left wing, but if you forced me to choose one, I'd say he leans a bit to the left. Overall though, I'd describe Simon as a pragmatist more than anything. He doesn't think of political parties like sports teams and advocates for policies on a case by case basis. In short, he's one of the good ones.
@@lehmejoun oh I'm not saying Azerbaijan is the good either to clarify. However I do feel that people who sincerely believe Azerbaijan plans to annex Armenia are more than bit misguided. I personally consider it far more likely for Azerbaijan to attack Iran to conqueror the majority Azeri regions of Northern Iran, possibly with the assistance of Iraqi Kurdistan and the Balochistan rebels from Pakistan as they are similarly ethnically divided and Azerbaijan and Iraqi Kurdistan actually have pretty good relations with one another.
This conflict proly did not get attention because of its naturally confusing baseline. A psudeo-state that is not recognized attacked by the state that should technically own it (by international borders at least). With both main parties being small local nations that seldom get headlines anyway. With both parties not appearing as easy good guys, its just not a particularly sexy story. I think if Baku pulled the trigger on a full war thou, media attention might finally have swung. In any case, this is just a unfortunate situation all around and i doubt even with a peace treaty that this is the last round to this mess.
The conflict didn't get attention because Azerbaijan was simply restoring it's territorial integrity you know the way Ukraine's currently doing with Russia being the Armenian correspondant
@@0816M3RC😂😂😂 Armenians in southern Georgia have lived there for centuries I guess Georgia should be scared because irredentism is a religion in Armenia.
"The Formation of the Armenian Diaspora in the Caucasus" by Ronald Grigor Suny (Oxford University Press) focuses on the historical Armenian communities that settled in the Caucasus as part of a broader diaspora movement. The study also addresses the role of imperial powers in facilitating these migrations and the sociopolitical implications for local populations.
Great job, covering this topic! I would obstain from quoting someone like Tom De Waal though, he is far from being "neutral" and certainly not an expert in anything, but gaslighting and subtle forms of genocide denial... The fact that this grifter managed to establish himslef as some sort of authority in the matter despite each and every single prediction of his turning out to be 100% wrong is just one of many reasons he should never have been taken seriousely!
I deeply appreciate you posting this and continuing to tell this story which is deeply personal to me. Cultural Erasure is horrifying, and I'm not proud of some of the things that Armenia has done in the past. Azeris and Armenians we're both guilty of needless and spiteful action in the history of this conflict. But now that it is over there is absolutely nothing that justifies cultural Erasure, especially without any real direction or cohesion to the construction in the area. It's the kind of kick in the teeth that perpetuates the deeply seated anger that sparked the is conflicts to begin with.
I did a full semester of Caucasus Studies at uni, and I must say Simon. I don't know how you manage to do it, but you are extremely good at your research. Nearly all my uni work contained disclaimers at how a lot of the narratives here are biased. Yet you manage to explain both sides and perspectives well. I must applaud you for your great work.
16:14 second comment because I have to dispute this point. There were protests and flags flown, hell I even managed to get a small local donation together and sent, sure it was only like 1500$ usd total.. but we still did something. The sacking of Nagorno-Karabakh was a preventable tragedy, one which the wider world ignored but for those of us who’ve had Armenian or Azerbaijani room mates, we were well aware of it. I only hope that the future brings peace and that the damage isn’t so far beyond the pale that it instigates new conflict.
Not really. While there are some inaccuracies - you can clearly see that he is trying to be fair and even mentioning propaganda points from Azeri side, while clarifying those with reports from international organizations. As an Armenian I am happy that my favorite creator is a man of honor, trying his best to be unbiased and still reminding the world about great injustice that happened.
Hey Simon, is your footage open source? Or are you subscribed to a news wire? The production values are phenomenal, even when the content like this is emotionally devastating.
I think Armenia is right to crack down on the attempts to form a Nagorno government in exile. If allowed to fester it could eventually form into a Hezbollah like organization that could cause a great deal of border tension with Azerbaijan. Just like what we are seeing in Israel and Lebanon currently.
@@kristaporkhach I am not saying it isn't but there are quite a few similarities. Armenia is a country that no longer wants to engage in aggression with their neighbor since the balance of power has shifted in Azerbaijan's favor. While being forced to play host to the vast majority of the dislocated refugees that now see their homeland as occupied by their regional enemies who have largely settled on their border with Azerbaijan. It is not hard to see how with this situation can snowball into militias and radicalized groups that seek to reclaim what they have lost. The seeds for a Hezbollah organization forming are there if allowed to take root.
@@tylerpetersen6226 I still don’t see the similarities, Hezbollah is a political group, not a people, and it was not ousted from its homeland. Armenia did not engage in aggression, the Armenians of NK, voted for independence and were met with violence that then became a full fledged war. Armenians in general would like to see NK back under Armenian control, but aren’t willing to initiate a war they know they cannot win at this moment in time.
@kristaporkhach No Hezbollah is a military organization that eventually formed an ideology of the destruction of Israel. If you go to the very early start of Hezbollah was largely formed in Jordan before they caused a whole bunch of problems for the Jordanian government that resulted in a crackdown forcing Hezbollah out of Jordan and refocus their efforts in Lebanon. Nasrallah was key in establishing legitimacy for the Hezbollah organization by focusing on fostering political aspirations and public goodwill in Lebanon in an infiltration tactic to stop a repeat of what happened in Jordan. Its gotten to the point where no leader of Lebanon can do what Jordan did to Hezbollah without serious resistance and the potential of starting a civil war. Now imagine if a government in exile was able to form with the ideology of take back NK which according to some estimates 90% of its population flee to Armenia last year and a vast majority have settle close to the border. And it becomes the goal of this exiled government to gather assets to take back NK by any means for the next 20-40 years, meanwhile the Armenian government wants peace but a portion of the population has sympathy for the refugees. You could see this exiled government become another nonstate military organization causing border friction with Azerbaijan prompting another war with a much more powerful nation. Just like what we are seeing now in Israel/Lebanon. This is why I think it is wise for the Armenian government to crackdown now and focus on assimilating the refugees and not let these aspirations form because this is a potential outcome if left unaddressed.
Can you show your sources on 600K Azeris displaced from the first Karabakh war? Because according to the last Soviet census, to there were between 350-400k Azeris in and the surrounding regions of NKAO and not 600k. With the Azeris from Armenia itself, the total number is 450-500k Azeris displaced.
The channel @Rare Earth did a fantastic video about the plight of this region about 6 years ago. I only wish I got to visit before it was shelled and overtaken..
Thank you so much for the follow up! That conflict is more complex than it seems and to describe it thoroughly would take hours. I just want to note that this dispute was existential for Armenians (the result speaks for itself) and territorial for the other side.
It is strange. In recent history, Armenia fell under the Russian geopolitical sphere of influence. The west, leaving this situation to Russia to police and deal with as it saw fit, demonstrated no interest whatsoever in involving itself during the pandemic. Russia, the only group that might’ve cared to intervene in this conflict (being a member of the same regional security group of nations as Armenia which is similar in scope to NATO) was thoroughly occupied with their own military operations in Ukraine at the time, and provided little support, amongst a backdrop of already recent weak Russian-Armenian relations. The East only cared about this region and it’s issues because it benefited them (China’s Belt and Road initiative could now expand in another direction, so they preferred an Azeri victory). These reasons are why the world turned a blind eye and demonstrated little to no care towards this conflict 😅
Thank you Simon. As an Armenian, this hits hard. The terrible war crimes, the hypocrisy of great powers, the memories of ancestral homes being torn down... we have to rebuild under this burden and we need to remember, so the history does not repeat itself.
The Armenians of Nagorno-Karabakh have been forced to abandon their ancestral homes for fear of ethnic cleansing, while Azerbaijan has inherited land that’s been all but completely abandoned that doesn’t have much in overall value. Seems like nobody really won in the end. And please keep in mind that I’m trying to remain as neutral as possible here. This is just my personal opinion, and forgive me if I’m ultimately incorrect.
@@bluraggon6674do you mean desolate as in Sahara dessert desolate or desolate as in America being desolate of native Americans and European settlers taking over their Land. pls elaborate.
The Turks never stopped being genocidal to the Armenians. After the Armenian Genocide the Turkish governments, both Azeri and Anatolian, never stopped trying to antagonize and force Armenia to "know it's place" as effectively a kind of vassal state that has to bend to whatever demands the Turks imposed at best or "western Azeris" as Ilham Aliyev wanted them to be. Nagorno-Karabakh is just another example of this. The Azeris claimed that they would allow the Armenians there to stay and they wouldn't tear down or suppress their culture, yet they then conducted consistent attacks on the Armenians there until they left and are tearing down their monuments. At this point, without foreign intervention Armenians seem to have two options, give in and maybe survive, or fight. I'm not Armenian so it isn't my place to decide for them. I just wish the rest of the world would take an interest here and stop it. It seems the only way these Turkish nations will stop is if they face force strong enough to stop them. That force could be sanctions, peacekeeping forces, or if necessary military intervention. Still, the Turks have to be stopped otherwise we might see another Armenian Genocide.
It is truly incredible the atrocities the West but especially the US as the dominant global military power has been complicit in or turned a blind eye to. We saw it with Cyprus. We saw it in the brutal dictators propped up by the US as long as they were anti-communist and then anti-Russian. And now we see it with Armenia and Artsakh. The prevailing notion seems to be that any means are justified in the end, a decision that has spilled much blood. If you start with a noble goal but use ignoble means to get there, is the end still a noble one?
Well, Königsberg existed too, its whole German population expelled after so many centuries of being there. History is full of sad tales where people is caught on geopolitical ethnic claims.
"The South Caucasus in the Context of Armenian Migration" (University of Southern California Institute of Armenian Studies) explores the migration patterns of Armenians within the Caucasus, highlighting the continuous movement of Armenians into the region from various surrounding territories, particularly in times of conflict and under Soviet influence.
The third volume of the Armenian Soviet Encyclopedia (p. 571) contains a list of those who ruled Irevan from the end of the 14th century to 1828. Is there at least one Armenian among them? 1. Emir Saad (end of the XIV century - 1410); 2. Pir Huseyn (son of Emir Saad), Pir Gaib (son of Pir Hussein) - (1410-1420); 3. Abdul (son of Pir Hussein) (1430); 4. Yagub bey (1440); 5. Hasan Ali Qaragoyunlu (1460); 6. Div Sultan Rumlu (1515); 7. Huseynjansultan Rumlu (1550); 8. Shahgulusultan Rumlu (1550-1575); 9. Muhammad khan Tohmah Ustajli (1576-1583) 10. Hydyr Pasha (1583); 11. Muhammad Sharif Pasha (1604); 12. Amir-Guna khan Qajar (1605-1625); 13. Tohmaz Gulu khan Qajar (1625-1635); 14. Kelbeli Khan (1636-1639); 15. Jaghatay Kyotuk Muhammad Khan (1639-1648); 16. Keyhosrov khan (1648-1652); 17. Muhammad Khan (1652-1656); 18. Najafgulu Khan (1656-1663); 19. Abbasgulu khan Gajar 1663-1666); 20. Sefigulu khan (1666-1674); 21.Sarkhan bey (1674-1675); 22.Sefigulu khan (1675-1679); 23. Hall of the khan (1679-1688); 24. Murtuzagulu khan (1688-1691); 25. Muhammadgulu khan (1691-1694); 26. Farzali khan Qajar (1694-1700); 27. Zohrab khan (1700-1705); 28. Abdul Muhammad Khan (1705-1709); 29. Mehrali Khan (1709-1719); 30. Allahgulu Khan (1719-1725); 31. Rajab Pasha (1725-1728); 32. Ibrahim Pasha and Mustafa Pasha (1728-1734); 33. Ali Pasha Defterdar (1734); 34. Muhammadgulu khan (1735-1736); 35. Haji Huseyn Pasha (1735) 36. Pirmehmet Khan (1736); 37. Khalil Khan Uzbek (1752-1755); 38. Hasanali khan Qajar (1755-1762); 39. Huseynali khan Qajar (1762-1783); 40. Gulamali khan Qajar (1783-1784); 41. Muhammad khan Qajar (1784-1805); 42. Mehtigulu khan Qajar (1805-1806); 43. Ahmed khan Maragaly (1806-1807); 44. Huseyn khan Qajar (1807-1827).
A thought I've been having is what if, after many years of a stable peace with Azerbaijan out of necessity, does Armenia quietly expand and modernize its military for an eventual revenge campaign. That is essentially what happened with Azerbaijan once they could capitalize on their oil wealth and we are starting to see France make inroads to Armenia by providing political and military support. Does this signal something bigger in the future?
Did you even pay attention to the video? Armenia wants peace with it's neighbors, not more war. Azerbaijan and Turkey have a defense pact. Invading Azerbaijani territory will result in a dual invasion from both sides. An Armenia stupid enough to do this is better off not being independent at all.
Armenians settled in parts of the South Caucasus, particularly in what is now modern-day Armenia, after migrations and conquests that occurred over centuries. The Armenian population expanded into regions like Nagorno-Karabakh and Javakheti, especially during the era of the Russian Empire's expansion into the Caucasus in the 19th century, as Armenians were seen as a Christian ally within the region. The Russian Empire's policies encouraged Armenian settlement in territories that were historically contested between Qajars, Ottomans, and local Caucasian groups. Some notable academic sources discussing this include The Armenian People by Richard G. Hovannisian, which delves into the history of Armenians, including their interactions and settlement in the Caucasus. Another source: Russia's Entangled Embrace: The Tsarist Empire and the Armenians, by Stephen B. Riegg provides insight into how Russian policies played a role in Armenian settlement in the region.
From a letter sent to the tsar by Alexander Griboyedov, a well-known Russian diplomat and writer: “Your Majesty, do not allow the resettlement of Armenians in central Russian lands. They are such a tribe that after a few decades they will make a noise to the world that ''this is the land of our ancestors."
I tried searching on UA-cam if you’ve made a video on the thaad air defense system. If there is one someone plz let me know if there isn’t that would be cool to watch.
"Armenian Migration and Settlement in the South Caucasus" (published by Cambridge University Press) provides a detailed account of how Armenians were relocated into the Caucasus during the 19th century, particularly after the Treaty of Turkmenchay in 1828. Russian Empire policies favored the resettlement of Armenians into areas like Nagorno-Karabakh and Javakheti to strengthen Christian populations in the region.
Georgian writer, poet, thinker and public figure Ilia Chavchavadze: ''Armenians erase and destroy traces of Georgians in churches and monasteries belonging to Georgians, scrape off or erase Georgian inscriptions on the stone, remove the stones themselves from the building and replace the inscriptions on them with Armenian ones''.
Man i hope no other country is currently attempting to destroy the culture of a group that they are also forcing out of their own land, because youd think they would know better.
Armenia's leadership looks like incompetent disappointing leadership, just like our leadership in Tigray. They bring nothing but shame to such great people. Politicians are the worest species in existence.
i think this war also damaged Russia's reputation, they were supposed to defend Armenia and instead left them to fight alone. This does a ton of damage to Russia's defense alliance.
If the Azeri try to take that Corridor on the Iranian border it could open the floodgates of War once again because many Armenians and Azeri treated the hostilities in this last round as the completion of azerbaijan's response overall to Armenia not relinquishing the corridor in the first place. The Armenians have more than squared up for the azerbaijani corridor by relinquishing Artsakh. After everything that has happened, taking the corridor on top of all of that would be 1,000 steps too far for the Azeris, and would drum up enough Anger from the Armenians to fight by whatever means necessary, tooth and nail, to the very ends of the Earth, because that kind of a signal threatens every Foundation the peacekeeping is based on today. At least from my perspective. If a boxer is knocked unconscious in a fight, that does not Grant the winner license to sneak a lit firecracker up the nostril of their sleeping opponent afterward.
Blaming Slatin for for it kind of weak. You can’t have ethnically pure borders for every country. But the issue is that NKAO had secession rights within USSR and they were ignored. So the issue was that Karabakh’s constitutional rights were ignored as a Soviet entity to appease Azerbaijan. Once the independence of Azerbaijan happened, it kind of sealed the deal for Armenians. As great powers agreed that borders of ex soviet states stay as is
In 1978, the Armenians of Karabakh celebrated the 150th anniversary of their resettlement, and in honor of this a monument was erected in the village of Maragashen-Leninavan, Mardakert-Aghdara region. The village is named after its first homeland - the Armenian village of Maragha in Iran. Article XV of the Turkmenchay Treaty signed on February 10, 1828 between the Russian Empire and Qajar Empire provided for the resettlement of Armenians. To organize the resettlement of Armenians in Nakhchivan and Erivan, a resettlement committee was established in 1829. The settlers were given great benefits: they were exempt from taxes and military service for 6 years, they were paid benefits at the expense of contributions received from Iran. The monument in honor of the resettlement of the first Armenian families to Karabakh was destroyed by the Armenians in 1988 in the initial period of the Karabakh war, and then modified beyond recognition.
I remember the first time I learned about the karback, from rare earth nearly 7 years ago.... I can't believe they finally lost there fight for freedom......
Pre 2020 the world thought armenians were lying when they said armenians could live in peace with their azeri overlords. The world didnt believe us when we said the azeris hate armenians and would never let us live in our land. Now you have western nations coming out and finally agreeing with armenias position. To little to late
"After leaving their mark on the region for centuries" - no, rather, "after leaving their mark on the region for millennia" (this is not an insignificant nuance for historical credibility)
People piping off about who’s right: Its pretty clear there isn’t a “good” side as far as governments are concerned. Just many civilian victims trying to live their lives while more powerful people draw lines on maps.
TBF as harsh as this may sound but this is probably one of the best solutions this conflict could have realistically come to. A quick fight with minimal casualties, a clear victor creating new facts on the ground and a defeated nation that accepts the loss and seeks to move on. People died yes. Many many more got displaced, also yes. But what would have been the alternative? Ever lasting conflict with half assed compromises in between phases of more or less open fighting? A full scale war between the two nations where both the death toll and the number of refugees would be exponentially larger? If someone can give me a realistic scenario with less human suffering and a good shot at long term peace, I'm happy to change my mind. But the way I see it it was a tragedy but still the best case scenario
There was the ideal scenario sabotaged by Aliyev every time when the agreement seemed to be imminent. Armenians were negotiating to surrender 5 or 7 regions in exchange for a recognition and status of Artsakh which would lead a long lasting peace and remove any reason to be hostile to each other. You need to understand that the decision to go to war has not been made overnight, Aliyev was preparing for it for 10+ years. And he is a dictator who inherited the "throne" from his father - there is really no opposition or a sane voice in Azerbaijan - they kill or imprison everyone who dares to speak against him. He was "negotiating" with Armenians while knowing perfectly that he is not interested to make any peace - he was arming itself, corrupting EU officials and paying a lot in exchange for their silence/inaction and waiting for a perfect timing. Then Covid and Ukraine war happened. The same is going on right now again - he is "negotiating" while arming itself even more and preparing for an invasion of Armenia proper when the circumstances are right (world war, big reigonal war, basically - chaos in the world/region/Russia, etc). Unfortunately this has very little coverage in western media - and the lack of understanding regional issues leads a lot of people just try to be fair and neutral saying things like "both sides are bad", "give it up to avoid a war", etc. I get it, the life is not fair, but at least you need to acknowledge and recognize unfairness, injustice and evil - and sometimes you have to draw a line and protect it with the cost of your life. Otherwise crazy dictators will take over the world.
There was an ideal scenario sabotaged by Aliyev every time when the agreement seemed to be imminent. Armenians were negotiating to surrender 5 or 7 regions in exchange for a recognition and status of Artsakh which would lead to a long lasting peace and remove any reason to be hostile to each other. We need to understand that the decision to go to war has not been made overnight, Aliyev was preparing for it for 10+ years. And he is a dictator who inherited the "throne" from his father - there is really no opposition or a sane voice in Azerbaijan - they kill or imprison everyone who dares to speak against him. He was "negotiating" with Armenians while knowing perfectly that he is not interested to make any peace - he was arming itself, corrupting officials and paying a lot in exchange for their silence/inaction and waiting for a perfect timing. Then Covid and Ukraine happened. The same is going on right now again - apparently he is "negotiating" while arming itself even more and preparing for an invasion of Armenia proper when the circumstances are right (next big international chaos). Unfortunately this has very little coverage in western media - and the lack of understanding regional issues leads a lot of people just try to be fair and neutral saying things like "both sides are bad", "give it up to avoid a greater loss", etc. I get it, the life is not fair, but at least you need to acknowledge and recognize unfairness, injustice and evil - and sometimes you have to draw a line and protect it. Otherwise crazy dictators will take over the world.
There was an ideal scenario sabotaged by Aliyev every time when the agreement seemed to be imminent. Armenians were negotiating to surrender 5 or 7 regions in exchange for a recognition and status of Artsakh which would lead to a long lasting peace and remove any reason to be hostile to each other. We need to understand that the decision to go to war has not been made overnight, Aliyev was preparing for it for 10+ years. And he is a dictator who inherited the "throne" from his father - there is really no opposition or a sane voice in Azerbaijan - they kill or imprison everyone who dares to speak against him. He was "negotiating" with Armenians while knowing perfectly that he is not interested to make any peace - he was arming itself, corrupting officials and paying a lot in exchange for their silence/inaction and waiting for a perfect timing. Then Covid and Ukraine happened. The same is going on right now again - apparently he is "negotiating" while arming itself even more and preparing for an invasion of Armenia proper when the circumstances are right (next big international chaos). Unfortunately this has very little coverage in western media - and the lack of understanding of regional issues leads a lot of people just try to be fair and neutral saying things like "both sides are bad", "give it up to avoid a greater loss", etc.
There was an ideal scenario. Armenians were negotiating to surrender 5 or 7 regions in exchange for a recognition and status of Artsakh which would lead to a long lasting peace and remove any reason to be hostile to each other. We need to understand that the decision to go to war has not been made overnight, Aliyev was preparing for it for 10+ years. And he is a dictator who inherited the "throne" from his father - there is really no opposition or a sane voice in Azerbaijan - they kill or imprison everyone who dares to speak against him. He was "negotiating" with Armenians while knowing perfectly that he is not interested to make any peace - he was arming itself, corrupting officials and paying a lot in exchange for their silence/inaction and waiting for a perfect timing. Then Covid and Ukraine happened. The same is going on right now again - apparently he is "negotiating" while arming itself again even more and preparing for an invasion of Armenia proper when the circumstances are right (next big international chaos). Unfortunately this has very little coverage in western media - and the lack of understanding regional issues leads a lot of people just try to be fair and neutral saying things like "both sides are bad", "give it up to avoid a greater loss", etc. I get it, the life is not fair, but at least you need to acknowledge and recognize unfairness, injustice and evil - and sometimes you have to draw a line and protect it. Otherwise crazy dictators will take over the world.
@@erokul Well I absolutely agree with par of what you have said, while disagreeing with others. So the scenario where Artsakh is recognized in exchange for the return of the surrounding areas is one that we could definetly consider ideal but should also be aware of it being unrealistic (even at the time). It doesnt take much more than a look at a map to see that it wouldnt have been sustainable long term, especially given the recent history around it and Armenian Azerbajani relations. Landlocked enclaves with very close ties to another country like this can only ever exist if both countries are good friends and even then its an inheritly unstable situation and they are likely to be swallowed up by one or the other long term. And well given how Armenia acted when they had the upper hand its no wonder that there was a considerable lust for vengance in Azerbajan (acknowleding the reasoning behind Azerbajans action doesnt mean I agree with them btw), so tension were high and the kind of friendly relations needed to keep a border situation as complicated as this peaceful simply not in sight. The current border combined with the fact that the Armenian population within the region has been forcibly removed has increased those tensions by a lot but also gotten rid of the inherit instability of the enclave situation. Now the only reason for Armenia to open up hostilities again would be (an also understandable) desire for vengance but not geography. And hurt feelings can be put aside and be forgotten over time but geography doesnt. The second half of your reply does however have my full support! I will openly admitt that due to the underreporting you yourself have mentioned I am not particulary knowledgable about the finer details of the situation and Azerbajani politics. So I will take your word for it. And yes stopping any leaders (whether dictators or others) that seek the violent expansion of their countries at the cost of others for little reason as their own (often personal) power, prestige and wealth should be kept in check. Whether he is just playing for time again idk. But what i do know that the situation as it is now at least from a purely geographic and geopolitical angle is now far more stable than it was a few years ago and that at least in theory there now is a real chance to normalise the Armenian Azerbajani relations. Whether Aliyev actually wants to do so we will have to see.
Seeing this makes us feel the Balkans is a paradise compared to the Caucasus. The Caucasus is truly Europe's powder keg. The dirtiest European conflicts occurred not in the Balkans but the Caucasus.
The troubles in the Caucasus have been intentionally engineered by the Russians to create a buffer made of small countries too occupied by bickering with each other to become a real issue for Russia.
For much of Artsakh it is too late. But tiktok didn’t tell people to care in 2020 when this was happening because it wasn’t expedient for the CCP so nobody cared.
The Zangezur region (modern-day Syunik in southern Armenia) was given to Armenia in the 1920s by the Bolsheviks. In July 1921, the Bolshevik government formally transferred Zangezur to the republic of Armenia, officially ending the territorial dispute between Azerbaijani and Armenian republics. Garegin Nzhdeh, who had continued resistance even after the Sovietization of Armenia, eventually retreated to Qajar dynasty, marking the end of military conflict in the region.
The most attention the ethnic cleansing of Artsakh got in the West was from System of A Down. They released a single with two new songs. They are all of Armenian descent and are part of the diaspora of Armenians that came about after the Armenian Genocide.
Love this channel - not because of the horrors it covers; but because of the horrors it covers. I would never have known this great injustice happened to those poor people. And now I know. I’m sorry to anyone affected by this conflict. Nobody deserves to have their home destroyed. Armenian, or Azerbaijani. Cut us open and we have the same insides. When your body is found in centuries by archaeologists; they won’t know - they’ll only be able to assume where you came from. The bottom line is that you were human, regardless of the name that belonged to the outline on a map which you were born in. War seems inevitable with how humanity works; but I wish we lived in an ideal world where it wasn’t an option.
![Lp. Сердце Вселенной #60 РОЖДЕНИЕ ЛОЛОЛОШКИ [Финал] • Майнкрафт](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/YoR0pAV9FVQ/mqdefault.jpg)
I wish he had gone into more detail on the falling out between Russia and Armenia as a result of this conflict. That consequence deserves to be talked about.
There are plenty of videos describing this on this channel.
yeah the warographics review videos of recent events covered it pretty much as it happened/still happening
Thanks!
Simon, follower for about a year now across your channels and platforms.
This channel is almost to 1M subscribers… well deserved, congratulations and thank you.
For some of the people making ignorant assumptions in the comments. The Armenians of Artsakh (as it was known since ancient times) or Mountainous/Nagorno Karabakh have a history of self-rule going back 1000 years. The Principality of Khachen (821-1000), Kingdom of Artsakh (1000-1261), the Principality of Khachen (1261-1601), the Principalities/Melikdoms of "Khamsa" (1601-1822), Russian empire abolished local titles in 1822-1918, the Armenian National Council of Karabakh (1918-1920), the Nagorno Karabakh Autonomous Oblast/Region from 1921-1991, and the Republic of Artsakh (1991-2023).
This area had been self-ruled by local Armenians for nearly 1200 years.
What is it with the Balkans & this blood feud bullshit? You realize, “my ancestors lived in this area for over 9000 years,” is a nonsense basis for a territorial claim, right? You know the other guy is just gonna counter with, “well, mine have been here for nine-thousand & one! Plus, it would’ve been 10,000, had your ancestors not told the viceroy my ancestor was a witch! This forced my ancestors to flee so your ancestors could steal their home!” At which point you retort with, “Oh, are we just going to completely ignore the fact that not four score and 7 summers later, your ancestors convinced everyone that my Great-Great-Great-Great-Great-Great-Great-Great-Great-Great-Great-Great-Great-Great-Great-Great-Grandmother’s Massive-Mommy-Milkers were to blame for the drought, forcing MY ancestors to flee, just so YOUR ancestors could then claim my ancestors’ land, their homes, & everything else they had to leave behind?…And we only called her Witch on account because she were a Witch!!” To this they’ll say something like, “Yea? YEA!?? If that’s how it went down, how do you explain how my ancestral name was recorded as the one liable for tribute less than 4 barley moons later, when the land; its inhabitants were compelled ,under hoof of The Golden Horde, to swear fealty to the Great Kahn of Kahns?” To which you’d shoot back, “Sure, only if you’re willing to ignore your ancestors front running mine. So, they could tell The Horde my ancestors said, ‘Kahn? Kahn? Tell Mr. Kahn of Kahns, he Kahn keep the dingles when he eats them from my unwashed medieval ass! How’s that for tribute?’” And on and on and on.
In this case, I actually believe the Armenians to be the ones with the strongest claim to the territory (Artsakh). It’s pretty clear that the Azerbaijanis are in the wrong, & the region belongs to the ppl who had lived there until they were violently forced out. But you know what I hear when someone like you starts citing shit that happened nearly a thousand years ago? Some bullshit. Nobody, outside the region anyway, could give 2 shits about such bygone bullshit. It’s not relevant. With any history from that far back, we’re lucky if we can verify whatever is claimed happened happened at all. If we’re able to meet that bar, it’s still assumed that the description of the event will be at best incomplete and at worst full of fabrications. It’s just too error prone and too likely to contradict primary sources from the same era, covering the same events even.
@@oymakmedya I'm pretty sure the UN didn't agree to the ethnic cleansing.
@@WgCdrLuddite
They left Karabakh themselves,nobody compelled them. Even Azerbaijani president mentioned several times that if armenian residents want to live in Karabakh then they need to apply for Azerbaijani citizenship.some of them applied and still live in Khankendi peacefully.But most of armenians has left because they know what they have done in 1992-94 to azerbaijani people. Armenians left Karabakh so easily and comfortably. However in 1992 azeri people from Khojaly were struggling to flee under daily shelling of bombs and offensive attacks of armenian forces.(google it: Khojaly massacre) .Btw not all of armenians were ancient inhabitants.remarkable amount of armenians has been moved to populate karabakh by armenian government during 30 years
@@WgCdrLudditearmenians left karabakh themselves,nobody compelled them. Even Azerbaijani president mentioned several times that if armenian citizens want to live in Karabakh then they need to apply for Azerbaijani citizenship.some of them applied and still live in Khankendi peacefully.But most of armenians has left because they know what they have done in 1992 -94 to azerbaijani people. They left Karabakh so easily and comfortably. However in 1992 azeri people from Khojaly were struggling to flee under daily shelling of bombs and offensive attacks of armenian forces.(google it: Khojaly massacre) btw not all armenians were ancient inhabitants of karabakh. Remarkable amount of them was moved to there by armenian government to populate during 30 years
@@oymakmedya lmao delusional azerhayvani
As a Belgo- Armenian I applaud the effort in creating this video to educate, but can’t shake the feeling that some major details have been glossed over. Like how this whole region has been an Armenian one since several millennia, and the Azeri claim is only due to Lenin & Stalin’s errors… Or the fact that the first NK war started when the Azeris started the first pogrom in Sumgait (1988) followed by another one in Baku in 1990. Killing and getting rid of all Armenians from soviet AZ. Or how Armenophobia runs deep in Azeri culture… These are facts that shed major light on why this all happened, and how a corrupt country can rely on its oil and equally corrupt allies to take away land that had never been theirs.
For the record - Alievs are in power only because armenians started the war in 80-90s and occupied Azerbaijani lands. Aliev was not welcomed in Azerbaijan political life until 1993. The occupation made people ask Aliyev to come back to power in hope that he will help with the war and occupation. But the main point is - Armenians created the situation when Aliyev came to power.
the reason this was ignored was because the azeris were providing europe with oil/natural gas to fill the void that russia left in that market. no one would be willing to bite the hand that....keeps them warm. and aliyev, knowing that fact, along with the fact that russia would be busy with ukraine, absoluteky took advantage. it has nothing to do with politics.
Can definitely feel Simon’s increasing sadness and exasperation at the world’s totally ignorance of the less popular headlines. Thanks for covering - without you I’d also still be totally ignorant of this, and the situations in Myanmar and Sudan
"Ignorance" and hypocrisy, people want really what it want see
@@tanjiro2507 Exactly the truth is people only care about war and Ethnic cleansing when the fight is attached to their political, social and or ethnic identity.
Oh, I thought you were talking about Maui or North Coralina, or Ohio. However, you are not wrong. Those happened beforehand.
Armenia was illegal occupying internationally recognized Azeri territory, just as Russia is illegally occupying internationally recognized Ukrainians Crimea.
@@JB-xi2yv Maui fires? That was extremely well covered in the US. And there’s nothing wrong with that - just good to get the other stuff too.
Like Maui was tragic. But a much smaller scale vs. something like Sudan civil war. But the latter has nothing to do with US politics or global warming or things that make the press get excited.
Thanks for bringing attention to this overlooked issue
''We have forgotten how we lost the First Republic of Armenia. There was the Turkish-Russian cooperation. There also was the pursuit of the Treaty of Sevres. Then, as now, we became obsessed with our dreams instead of focusing on the possible, and we lost part of what was possible. More, we lost our independence. In other words, all of this was predictable and predicted.''
- Gerard Libaridian (US-Armenian historian and diplomat, advisor to the first president of Armenia between 1991-1997, deputy foreign minister, one of the main negotiators with Turkey and Azerbaijan over the NK issue)
Random UA-cam comment, Better at citing sources than each of Simon’s dozen writers (they’re usually right I just want a source list)
Dear Simon and team, thank you so much for bringing up an issue which has been silenced by everyone, including the colaborationist government of Armenia. Your concern is greatly appreciated....
As I recall, Nagorno-Karabakh was made an autonomous oblast of the Azerbaijani SSR by Stalin (despite being mostly inhabited ethnic Armenians) as part of a “divide and rule” strategy that would keep the other Soviet Republics from resisting Moscow’s rule.
It’s also the reason for the three-way border dispute between Uzbekistan, Kyrgyzstan, and Tajikistan.
Yes. Stalin did the classic imperial move to create a conflict waiting to happen between vassals to increase their dependency on the empire with his arrangement in both those areas.
@@IfyoucanreadthisgooglebrokeSame with Donbas and Crimea. Just an excuse for the Russians to come back for more.
Stalin is very much overlooked as the most influential figure of the 20th century. The ripples in the pond from his decisions made 70 odd years ago are still strong and spreading.
Stalin gave armenians living in azerbaijan autonomy while soviets expelled muslims living in armenia. Yet armenians are the ones complaining. Stating one sides argument is bias
@Samirustem
Before you go around accusing people of being biased, maybe you should consider the possibility that I’ve never heard of the particular fact you’re talking about?
And how is what I said “biased?”
Thank you for sharing our grief with the world!
Thank you for shedding some light to one of the worst forced exile in the modern history. It’s important to recognize and reflect on these significant events in history, even the painful ones, to ensure that the stories and experiences of those affected are acknowledged and remembered.
George W Bush held what was supposed to be a week-long conference in 2001 in hopes of resolving the dispute. It ended after a few hours, and on his way out he said to Colin Powell, “I don’t ever want to hear about this again!”
Would love to see a source on that
@@aram9167if only you had a magic box that answers all your questions...
Armenia and Azerbaijan: Key
West Peace Talks
@@aram9167Same!
@@aram9167 Love that this is the first reply to a comment like this. UA-cam would be much better off if this was the norm
while after a 5 min search i didn't find that quote i did find that a meeting did happen in April 2001 confirmed by many sources and that the Bush administration walked away from a military parity agreement in 2004.
As an Armenian, thank you for reporting on this Simon.
A genuine Armenian, OR BS?
A bot/fake account seeking likes in the comments section? 😏
@wassupyeah28
I don't
That was a genuine question this bot hasn't responded to yet and likely never will 😄
@@EAWanderer They self-identified as "Armenian" and addressed "Simon". That's a response customised with data not directly present in this video's displayed meta data, and while hypothetically derivable, you're not going to see that in a youtube bot going for likes. So quite unlikely to be a bot. Furthermore your capitalisation of "OR BS", the smirk emoji at the end, and how this was all levelled at a person self-identified as one of the people negatively impacted by the events in this video; well it all makes you come across as an unlikeable jerk. You need to work on pruning out this behaviour or it'll become habitual, then unconsciously done. You'll find yourself doing it when you really didn't want or mean to, and slowly drive people away. That road sucks, please don't take steps down it.
@remethtiamat7950
Bla bla bla
I still didn't get a response from the original source and I have no interest in reading your anecdote
Plus liking your own comment won't fool any1
@@EAWanderer Oh, you're displaying Troll behaviour. Always disappointing to see someone who isn't interested in discussing, just in putting down others to try and make themselves feel better. Very well, this'll be my last response to you. I do hope you manage to overcome whatever it is driving you to treat others like this. Goodbye.
Thanks for being virtually the only major history & geopolitics channel to follow up on the plight of Artsakh 💪🏻🇦🇲
You mean KARABAH 💪🏻🇦🇿👈🏻
@@islammehmeov2334u turks live in delusion
Artsakh is no longer it is Karabah
Thanks for this, Simon. It is important to remember this, so thank you for doing your part.
Thank you as always for discussing topics that aren't discussed often enough, Simon and team. You do a fantastic job on reporting things like this. I do wish you had made more mention of the horrific war crimes of the Azeri government and cast a bigger spotlight on the despot that is Aliyev, as you have done with so many other horrific dictators around the world on this channel, but at least this helps shed some light on what has happened.
Reading about what the Azeri government did to Nakhchivan I’m horrified by what’s gonna happen to Artsakh.
@@eddiemcboss7080 Nothing can be as worse as what Armenians had done to Aghdam so 0 sympathy
@@nenenindonuSeeing your other comment no wonder you have no symphaties. You have no morallity, just like nazis in WW2 or ruzzians in Ukraine.
@@nenenindonuAnother Azeri without any moral or honour.
@@nenenindonu
Typical Azeri denial of war crimes that don't fit the narrative that Azerbaijan pushes.
@@andzejsulzicki9401 It is Armenia who still harbours the Russian army base in Armenia
Russian protect your borders
So ruzzians are in armenia not in Azerbaijan
Yo thanks! Was wondering about Nagorno the other day but didn't get time to check, life is soooooo busy eh!
With these vids Simon does more for our country than our politicians
I think Simon deserves praise for beginning this retrospective by reminding us that Armenia and Azerbaijan alike did truly horrible things to one another, where as many others who discuss this conflict either gloss over Armenia's more sinister actions or outright ignore them to paint Azerbaijan far less favorably. It's important to recognize that sometimes, there's no real good guy in these situations.
There might be no good guy but there surely is a right guy, which in the case of this conflict is Azerbaijan since the territory is internationally recognized as hers, borders are defined by international law and any medieval minded country that goes against it is by definition THE AGRESSOR
Im new to this guy and channel. Does he/this channel claim objectivity or admit to lean one way? If so what ways do they lean?
Because that's what you think when you listen it at face value. The first war was started by Azerbaijan and Azerbaijan alone, people were blockaded to starve in the late 80s and military was used against them, when you face such a thing, you either pick up arms or you die, so that's what they did. That's like Russia crying over of its lands being occupied by Ukraine after it started the war. Remember, the azerbaijani president openly admitted he was offered the 7 regions back in return for a peace deal but he refused them, he wanted to solve it by war and that's what he did. I wish I can share links here, but don't push bothsidism just on the surface without going into the details on each step on how things got there.
@@ca7971 in my experience, Simon isn't obviously right or left wing, but if you forced me to choose one, I'd say he leans a bit to the left. Overall though, I'd describe Simon as a pragmatist more than anything. He doesn't think of political parties like sports teams and advocates for policies on a case by case basis. In short, he's one of the good ones.
@@lehmejoun oh I'm not saying Azerbaijan is the good either to clarify. However I do feel that people who sincerely believe Azerbaijan plans to annex Armenia are more than bit misguided. I personally consider it far more likely for Azerbaijan to attack Iran to conqueror the majority Azeri regions of Northern Iran, possibly with the assistance of Iraqi Kurdistan and the Balochistan rebels from Pakistan as they are similarly ethnically divided and Azerbaijan and Iraqi Kurdistan actually have pretty good relations with one another.
Thank you for covering our corner of the world.
Great video Simon!
Thank you for this
This conflict proly did not get attention because of its naturally confusing baseline. A psudeo-state that is not recognized attacked by the state that should technically own it (by international borders at least). With both main parties being small local nations that seldom get headlines anyway. With both parties not appearing as easy good guys, its just not a particularly sexy story. I think if Baku pulled the trigger on a full war thou, media attention might finally have swung. In any case, this is just a unfortunate situation all around and i doubt even with a peace treaty that this is the last round to this mess.
The conflict didn't get attention because Azerbaijan was simply restoring it's territorial integrity you know the way Ukraine's currently doing with Russia being the Armenian correspondant
@@nenenindonu Wrong. Armenians have lived on that land for centuries.. long before Turkey created the Turkish colony known as Azerbaijan.
@@0816M3RC😂😂😂 Armenians in southern Georgia have lived there for centuries I guess Georgia should be scared because irredentism is a religion in Armenia.
@@0816M3RC Azerbaijanis also lived there for centuries, borders are defined by international law which makes Armenia the Aggressor here
@@Austine1452 Shouldn't you be proud of your origins and use your real Azeri name? lol
Why is Simon the only person talking about events like this and no "mainstream" outlets?
No one talked about this because it's not politicized
"The Formation of the Armenian Diaspora in the Caucasus" by Ronald Grigor Suny (Oxford University Press) focuses on the historical Armenian communities that settled in the Caucasus as part of a broader diaspora movement. The study also addresses the role of imperial powers in facilitating these migrations and the sociopolitical implications for local populations.
Great job, covering this topic! I would obstain from quoting someone like Tom De Waal though, he is far from being "neutral" and certainly not an expert in anything, but gaslighting and subtle forms of genocide denial... The fact that this grifter managed to establish himslef as some sort of authority in the matter despite each and every single prediction of his turning out to be 100% wrong is just one of many reasons he should never have been taken seriousely!
I deeply appreciate you posting this and continuing to tell this story which is deeply personal to me. Cultural Erasure is horrifying, and I'm not proud of some of the things that Armenia has done in the past. Azeris and Armenians we're both guilty of needless and spiteful action in the history of this conflict. But now that it is over there is absolutely nothing that justifies cultural Erasure, especially without any real direction or cohesion to the construction in the area. It's the kind of kick in the teeth that perpetuates the deeply seated anger that sparked the is conflicts to begin with.
Great reporting Simon.
Thank you!
"Unless I can make money off this "thing" you're talking about, then I don't care" - most people
Thank you formaking this video
It is important to remember all of the lives that are wasted because we still can't get along with each other.
it's a tale as old as time
It's kinda depressing that even today the idea behind most conflicts can be reduced to "must... destroy... different... people..."
I did a full semester of Caucasus Studies at uni, and I must say Simon. I don't know how you manage to do it, but you are extremely good at your research. Nearly all my uni work contained disclaimers at how a lot of the narratives here are biased. Yet you manage to explain both sides and perspectives well. I must applaud you for your great work.
16:14 second comment because I have to dispute this point. There were protests and flags flown, hell I even managed to get a small local donation together and sent, sure it was only like 1500$ usd total.. but we still did something. The sacking of Nagorno-Karabakh was a preventable tragedy, one which the wider world ignored but for those of us who’ve had Armenian or Azerbaijani room mates, we were well aware of it. I only hope that the future brings peace and that the damage isn’t so far beyond the pale that it instigates new conflict.
Slava Armenia,God will not forget your deeds.In my heart from now on I will always remember Armenia and its people.❤
This was so well done and so well balanced that you will probably be savaged by both sides in the comments.
Not really. While there are some inaccuracies - you can clearly see that he is trying to be fair and even mentioning propaganda points from Azeri side, while clarifying those with reports from international organizations. As an Armenian I am happy that my favorite creator is a man of honor, trying his best to be unbiased and still reminding the world about great injustice that happened.
Hey Simon, is your footage open source? Or are you subscribed to a news wire? The production values are phenomenal, even when the content like this is emotionally devastating.
I think Armenia is right to crack down on the attempts to form a Nagorno government in exile. If allowed to fester it could eventually form into a Hezbollah like organization that could cause a great deal of border tension with Azerbaijan. Just like what we are seeing in Israel and Lebanon currently.
The destruction of Nagorno Karabakh is very different than Israel/Lebanon...
they tried and are still trying. research more dear mr. brainwashed
@@kristaporkhach I am not saying it isn't but there are quite a few similarities. Armenia is a country that no longer wants to engage in aggression with their neighbor since the balance of power has shifted in Azerbaijan's favor. While being forced to play host to the vast majority of the dislocated refugees that now see their homeland as occupied by their regional enemies who have largely settled on their border with Azerbaijan. It is not hard to see how with this situation can snowball into militias and radicalized groups that seek to reclaim what they have lost. The seeds for a Hezbollah organization forming are there if allowed to take root.
@@tylerpetersen6226 I still don’t see the similarities, Hezbollah is a political group, not a people, and it was not ousted from its homeland. Armenia did not engage in aggression, the Armenians of NK, voted for independence and were met with violence that then became a full fledged war. Armenians in general would like to see NK back under Armenian control, but aren’t willing to initiate a war they know they cannot win at this moment in time.
@kristaporkhach No Hezbollah is a military organization that eventually formed an ideology of the destruction of Israel. If you go to the very early start of Hezbollah was largely formed in Jordan before they caused a whole bunch of problems for the Jordanian government that resulted in a crackdown forcing Hezbollah out of Jordan and refocus their efforts in Lebanon. Nasrallah was key in establishing legitimacy for the Hezbollah organization by focusing on fostering political aspirations and public goodwill in Lebanon in an infiltration tactic to stop a repeat of what happened in Jordan. Its gotten to the point where no leader of Lebanon can do what Jordan did to Hezbollah without serious resistance and the potential of starting a civil war. Now imagine if a government in exile was able to form with the ideology of take back NK which according to some estimates 90% of its population flee to Armenia last year and a vast majority have settle close to the border. And it becomes the goal of this exiled government to gather assets to take back NK by any means for the next 20-40 years, meanwhile the Armenian government wants peace but a portion of the population has sympathy for the refugees. You could see this exiled government become another nonstate military organization causing border friction with Azerbaijan prompting another war with a much more powerful nation. Just like what we are seeing now in Israel/Lebanon. This is why I think it is wise for the Armenian government to crackdown now and focus on assimilating the refugees and not let these aspirations form because this is a potential outcome if left unaddressed.
THANKS
Can you show your sources on 600K Azeris displaced from the first Karabakh war? Because according to the last Soviet census, to there were between 350-400k Azeris in and the surrounding regions of NKAO and not 600k. With the Azeris from Armenia itself, the total number is 450-500k Azeris displaced.
The channel @Rare Earth did a fantastic video about the plight of this region about 6 years ago. I only wish I got to visit before it was shelled and overtaken..
Retaken*
That ending was deep. Nobody in the streets for these people
Thank you so much for the follow up! That conflict is more complex than it seems and to describe it thoroughly would take hours. I just want to note that this dispute was existential for Armenians (the result speaks for itself) and territorial for the other side.
Exactly! Its home for one, and land for the other.
It is strange. In recent history, Armenia fell under the Russian geopolitical sphere of influence. The west, leaving this situation to Russia to police and deal with as it saw fit, demonstrated no interest whatsoever in involving itself during the pandemic. Russia, the only group that might’ve cared to intervene in this conflict (being a member of the same regional security group of nations as Armenia which is similar in scope to NATO) was thoroughly occupied with their own military operations in Ukraine at the time, and provided little support, amongst a backdrop of already recent weak Russian-Armenian relations. The East only cared about this region and it’s issues because it benefited them (China’s Belt and Road initiative could now expand in another direction, so they preferred an Azeri victory). These reasons are why the world turned a blind eye and demonstrated little to no care towards this conflict 😅
Thank you Simon. As an Armenian, this hits hard. The terrible war crimes, the hypocrisy of great powers, the memories of ancestral homes being torn down... we have to rebuild under this burden and we need to remember, so the history does not repeat itself.
The Armenians of Nagorno-Karabakh have been forced to abandon their ancestral homes for fear of ethnic cleansing, while Azerbaijan has inherited land that’s been all but completely abandoned that doesn’t have much in overall value.
Seems like nobody really won in the end.
And please keep in mind that I’m trying to remain as neutral as possible here. This is just my personal opinion, and forgive me if I’m ultimately incorrect.
Azerbaijan won
@@nenenindonu yeah, though its gonna take a lot effort on their part to make any use of the now desolate lands
@@bluraggon6674land without armenians is more valuable than land with armenians
@@bluraggon6674do you mean desolate as in Sahara dessert desolate or desolate as in America being desolate of native Americans and European settlers taking over their Land. pls elaborate.
This war was lowkey the beginning to the small drone era or warfare
The Turks never stopped being genocidal to the Armenians. After the Armenian Genocide the Turkish governments, both Azeri and Anatolian, never stopped trying to antagonize and force Armenia to "know it's place" as effectively a kind of vassal state that has to bend to whatever demands the Turks imposed at best or "western Azeris" as Ilham Aliyev wanted them to be. Nagorno-Karabakh is just another example of this. The Azeris claimed that they would allow the Armenians there to stay and they wouldn't tear down or suppress their culture, yet they then conducted consistent attacks on the Armenians there until they left and are tearing down their monuments. At this point, without foreign intervention Armenians seem to have two options, give in and maybe survive, or fight. I'm not Armenian so it isn't my place to decide for them. I just wish the rest of the world would take an interest here and stop it. It seems the only way these Turkish nations will stop is if they face force strong enough to stop them. That force could be sanctions, peacekeeping forces, or if necessary military intervention. Still, the Turks have to be stopped otherwise we might see another Armenian Genocide.
It is truly incredible the atrocities the West but especially the US as the dominant global military power has been complicit in or turned a blind eye to. We saw it with Cyprus. We saw it in the brutal dictators propped up by the US as long as they were anti-communist and then anti-Russian. And now we see it with Armenia and Artsakh. The prevailing notion seems to be that any means are justified in the end, a decision that has spilled much blood. If you start with a noble goal but use ignoble means to get there, is the end still a noble one?
Lol what a sook you are. Instead of being a keyboard warrior come and take it back lol
Well, Königsberg existed too, its whole German population expelled after so many centuries of being there. History is full of sad tales where people is caught on geopolitical ethnic claims.
"The South Caucasus in the Context of Armenian Migration" (University of Southern California Institute of Armenian Studies) explores the migration patterns of Armenians within the Caucasus, highlighting the continuous movement of Armenians into the region from various surrounding territories, particularly in times of conflict and under Soviet influence.
The third volume of the Armenian Soviet Encyclopedia (p. 571) contains a list of those who ruled Irevan from the end of the 14th century to 1828. Is there at least one Armenian among them?
1. Emir Saad (end of the XIV century - 1410);
2. Pir Huseyn (son of Emir Saad), Pir Gaib (son of Pir Hussein) - (1410-1420);
3. Abdul (son of Pir Hussein) (1430);
4. Yagub bey (1440);
5. Hasan Ali Qaragoyunlu (1460);
6. Div Sultan Rumlu (1515);
7. Huseynjansultan Rumlu (1550);
8. Shahgulusultan Rumlu (1550-1575);
9. Muhammad khan Tohmah Ustajli (1576-1583)
10. Hydyr Pasha (1583);
11. Muhammad Sharif Pasha (1604);
12. Amir-Guna khan Qajar (1605-1625);
13. Tohmaz Gulu khan Qajar (1625-1635);
14. Kelbeli Khan (1636-1639);
15. Jaghatay Kyotuk Muhammad Khan (1639-1648);
16. Keyhosrov khan (1648-1652);
17. Muhammad Khan (1652-1656);
18. Najafgulu Khan (1656-1663);
19. Abbasgulu khan Gajar 1663-1666);
20. Sefigulu khan (1666-1674);
21.Sarkhan bey (1674-1675);
22.Sefigulu khan (1675-1679);
23. Hall of the khan (1679-1688);
24. Murtuzagulu khan (1688-1691);
25. Muhammadgulu khan (1691-1694);
26. Farzali khan Qajar (1694-1700);
27. Zohrab khan (1700-1705);
28. Abdul Muhammad Khan (1705-1709);
29. Mehrali Khan (1709-1719);
30. Allahgulu Khan (1719-1725);
31. Rajab Pasha (1725-1728);
32. Ibrahim Pasha and Mustafa Pasha (1728-1734);
33. Ali Pasha Defterdar (1734);
34. Muhammadgulu khan (1735-1736);
35. Haji Huseyn Pasha (1735)
36. Pirmehmet Khan (1736);
37. Khalil Khan Uzbek (1752-1755);
38. Hasanali khan Qajar (1755-1762);
39. Huseynali khan Qajar (1762-1783);
40. Gulamali khan Qajar (1783-1784);
41. Muhammad khan Qajar (1784-1805);
42. Mehtigulu khan Qajar (1805-1806);
43. Ahmed khan Maragaly (1806-1807);
44. Huseyn khan Qajar (1807-1827).
Two wrongs don’t make a right.
0:48
First lie : no one was forced to leave, they voluntarily left.
considering that Azerbaijan has a history of brutally killing POW's and innocent civilians I don't think they had much of a choice
@
Did they massacre loot and rape hundreds of thousands of Muslims in 1994?
Exactly.
🤫
As long as they keep the LNG flowing to the west and Armenia stayes aligned with Russia, Azerbaijan can do whatever atrocities they want
A thought I've been having is what if, after many years of a stable peace with Azerbaijan out of necessity, does Armenia quietly expand and modernize its military for an eventual revenge campaign. That is essentially what happened with Azerbaijan once they could capitalize on their oil wealth and we are starting to see France make inroads to Armenia by providing political and military support. Does this signal something bigger in the future?
Population of Armenia 2.7 m
Population of Azerbaijan 10.7 m
This should answer your question
Did you even pay attention to the video? Armenia wants peace with it's neighbors, not more war.
Azerbaijan and Turkey have a defense pact. Invading Azerbaijani territory will result in a dual invasion from both sides. An Armenia stupid enough to do this is better off not being independent at all.
Thought this was a Sinwar video being posted immediately. Love the channel, Simon and co. Thanks for all you do.
Armenians settled in parts of the South Caucasus, particularly in what is now modern-day Armenia, after migrations and conquests that occurred over centuries. The Armenian population expanded into regions like Nagorno-Karabakh and Javakheti, especially during the era of the Russian Empire's expansion into the Caucasus in the 19th century, as Armenians were seen as a Christian ally within the region. The Russian Empire's policies encouraged Armenian settlement in territories that were historically contested between Qajars, Ottomans, and local Caucasian groups.
Some notable academic sources discussing this include The Armenian People by Richard G. Hovannisian, which delves into the history of Armenians, including their interactions and settlement in the Caucasus.
Another source: Russia's Entangled Embrace: The Tsarist Empire and the Armenians, by Stephen B. Riegg provides insight into how Russian policies played a role in Armenian settlement in the region.
From a letter sent to the tsar by Alexander Griboyedov, a well-known Russian diplomat and writer:
“Your Majesty, do not allow the resettlement of Armenians in central Russian lands. They are such a tribe that after a few decades they will make a noise to the world that ''this is the land of our ancestors."
What happened Pashinyan ? You were paving road to Jabrayil… You were dancing… What happened to status que?
I tried searching on UA-cam if you’ve made a video on the thaad air defense system. If there is one someone plz let me know if there isn’t that would be cool to watch.
"Armenian Migration and Settlement in the South Caucasus" (published by Cambridge University Press) provides a detailed account of how Armenians were relocated into the Caucasus during the 19th century, particularly after the Treaty of Turkmenchay in 1828. Russian Empire policies favored the resettlement of Armenians into areas like Nagorno-Karabakh and Javakheti to strengthen Christian populations in the region.
7:22 the video starts
Starting to think Simon only owns 1 shirt.
Georgian writer, poet, thinker and public figure Ilia Chavchavadze:
''Armenians erase and destroy traces of Georgians in churches and monasteries belonging to Georgians, scrape off or erase Georgian inscriptions on the stone, remove the stones themselves from the building and replace the inscriptions on them with Armenian ones''.
Man i hope no other country is currently attempting to destroy the culture of a group that they are also forcing out of their own land, because youd think they would know better.
Armenia's leadership looks like incompetent disappointing leadership, just like our leadership in Tigray. They bring nothing but shame to such great people. Politicians are the worest species in existence.
Always I want to be with you,
And make believe with you,
And live in harmony, harmony oh love!
I'm glad that Simon got out of VisualPolitikEn before they starting shilling for AI.
i think this war also damaged Russia's reputation, they were supposed to defend Armenia and instead left them to fight alone. This does a ton of damage to Russia's defense alliance.
If the Azeri try to take that Corridor on the Iranian border it could open the floodgates of War once again because many Armenians and Azeri treated the hostilities in this last round as the completion of azerbaijan's response overall to Armenia not relinquishing the corridor in the first place. The Armenians have more than squared up for the azerbaijani corridor by relinquishing Artsakh. After everything that has happened, taking the corridor on top of all of that would be 1,000 steps too far for the Azeris, and would drum up enough Anger from the Armenians to fight by whatever means necessary, tooth and nail, to the very ends of the Earth, because that kind of a signal threatens every Foundation the peacekeeping is based on today. At least from my perspective. If a boxer is knocked unconscious in a fight, that does not Grant the winner license to sneak a lit firecracker up the nostril of their sleeping opponent afterward.
Blaming Slatin for for it kind of weak. You can’t have ethnically pure borders for every country. But the issue is that NKAO had secession rights within USSR and they were ignored. So the issue was that Karabakh’s constitutional rights were ignored as a Soviet entity to appease Azerbaijan. Once the independence of Azerbaijan happened, it kind of sealed the deal for Armenians. As great powers agreed that borders of ex soviet states stay as is
I feel this triggered everything in the Middle East these days
Armenia have right to defend itself.
In 1978, the Armenians of Karabakh celebrated the 150th anniversary of their resettlement, and in honor of this a monument was erected in the village of Maragashen-Leninavan, Mardakert-Aghdara region.
The village is named after its first homeland - the Armenian village of Maragha in Iran.
Article XV of the Turkmenchay Treaty signed on February 10, 1828 between the Russian Empire and Qajar Empire provided for the resettlement of Armenians.
To organize the resettlement of Armenians in Nakhchivan and Erivan, a resettlement committee was established in 1829. The settlers were given great benefits: they were exempt from taxes and military service for 6 years, they were paid benefits at the expense of contributions received from Iran.
The monument in honor of the resettlement of the first Armenian families to Karabakh was destroyed by the Armenians in 1988 in the initial period of the Karabakh war, and then modified beyond recognition.
So, the bottom line is Armenia forced Azeris from Azerbaijan after the collapse of SSR and in 2021 Azerbaijan gained its territory back?
I remember the first time I learned about the karback, from rare earth nearly 7 years ago.... I can't believe they finally lost there fight for freedom......
Pre 2020 the world thought armenians were lying when they said armenians could live in peace with their azeri overlords. The world didnt believe us when we said the azeris hate armenians and would never let us live in our land. Now you have western nations coming out and finally agreeing with armenias position. To little to late
That smoldering mess look like the infield of the Indy 500 after a race!
"After leaving their mark on the region for centuries" - no, rather, "after leaving their mark on the region for millennia" (this is not an insignificant nuance for historical credibility)
what a shame..
Starfishes are glad you guys cover the smaller, but still important things
People piping off about who’s right: Its pretty clear there isn’t a “good” side as far as governments are concerned. Just many civilian victims trying to live their lives while more powerful people draw lines on maps.
TBF as harsh as this may sound but this is probably one of the best solutions this conflict could have realistically come to.
A quick fight with minimal casualties, a clear victor creating new facts on the ground and a defeated nation that accepts the loss and seeks to move on.
People died yes. Many many more got displaced, also yes. But what would have been the alternative? Ever lasting conflict with half assed compromises in between phases of more or less open fighting?
A full scale war between the two nations where both the death toll and the number of refugees would be exponentially larger?
If someone can give me a realistic scenario with less human suffering and a good shot at long term peace, I'm happy to change my mind. But the way I see it it was a tragedy but still the best case scenario
There was the ideal scenario sabotaged by Aliyev every time when the agreement seemed to be imminent. Armenians were negotiating to surrender 5 or 7 regions in exchange for a recognition and status of Artsakh which would lead a long lasting peace and remove any reason to be hostile to each other.
You need to understand that the decision to go to war has not been made overnight, Aliyev was preparing for it for 10+ years. And he is a dictator who inherited the "throne" from his father - there is really no opposition or a sane voice in Azerbaijan - they kill or imprison everyone who dares to speak against him. He was "negotiating" with Armenians while knowing perfectly that he is not interested to make any peace - he was arming itself, corrupting EU officials and paying a lot in exchange for their silence/inaction and waiting for a perfect timing. Then Covid and Ukraine war happened.
The same is going on right now again - he is "negotiating" while arming itself even more and preparing for an invasion of Armenia proper when the circumstances are right (world war, big reigonal war, basically - chaos in the world/region/Russia, etc).
Unfortunately this has very little coverage in western media - and the lack of understanding regional issues leads a lot of people just try to be fair and neutral saying things like "both sides are bad", "give it up to avoid a war", etc. I get it, the life is not fair, but at least you need to acknowledge and recognize unfairness, injustice and evil - and sometimes you have to draw a line and protect it with the cost of your life. Otherwise crazy dictators will take over the world.
There was an ideal scenario sabotaged by Aliyev every time when the agreement seemed to be imminent. Armenians were negotiating to surrender 5 or 7 regions in exchange for a recognition and status of Artsakh which would lead to a long lasting peace and remove any reason to be hostile to each other.
We need to understand that the decision to go to war has not been made overnight, Aliyev was preparing for it for 10+ years. And he is a dictator who inherited the "throne" from his father - there is really no opposition or a sane voice in Azerbaijan - they kill or imprison everyone who dares to speak against him. He was "negotiating" with Armenians while knowing perfectly that he is not interested to make any peace - he was arming itself, corrupting officials and paying a lot in exchange for their silence/inaction and waiting for a perfect timing. Then Covid and Ukraine happened.
The same is going on right now again - apparently he is "negotiating" while arming itself even more and preparing for an invasion of Armenia proper when the circumstances are right (next big international chaos).
Unfortunately this has very little coverage in western media - and the lack of understanding regional issues leads a lot of people just try to be fair and neutral saying things like "both sides are bad", "give it up to avoid a greater loss", etc. I get it, the life is not fair, but at least you need to acknowledge and recognize unfairness, injustice and evil - and sometimes you have to draw a line and protect it. Otherwise crazy dictators will take over the world.
There was an ideal scenario sabotaged by Aliyev every time when the agreement seemed to be imminent. Armenians were negotiating to surrender 5 or 7 regions in exchange for a recognition and status of Artsakh which would lead to a long lasting peace and remove any reason to be hostile to each other.
We need to understand that the decision to go to war has not been made overnight, Aliyev was preparing for it for 10+ years. And he is a dictator who inherited the "throne" from his father - there is really no opposition or a sane voice in Azerbaijan - they kill or imprison everyone who dares to speak against him. He was "negotiating" with Armenians while knowing perfectly that he is not interested to make any peace - he was arming itself, corrupting officials and paying a lot in exchange for their silence/inaction and waiting for a perfect timing. Then Covid and Ukraine happened.
The same is going on right now again - apparently he is "negotiating" while arming itself even more and preparing for an invasion of Armenia proper when the circumstances are right (next big international chaos).
Unfortunately this has very little coverage in western media - and the lack of understanding of regional issues leads a lot of people just try to be fair and neutral saying things like "both sides are bad", "give it up to avoid a greater loss", etc.
There was an ideal scenario. Armenians were negotiating to surrender 5 or 7 regions in exchange for a recognition and status of Artsakh which would lead to a long lasting peace and remove any reason to be hostile to each other.
We need to understand that the decision to go to war has not been made overnight, Aliyev was preparing for it for 10+ years. And he is a dictator who inherited the "throne" from his father - there is really no opposition or a sane voice in Azerbaijan - they kill or imprison everyone who dares to speak against him. He was "negotiating" with Armenians while knowing perfectly that he is not interested to make any peace - he was arming itself, corrupting officials and paying a lot in exchange for their silence/inaction and waiting for a perfect timing. Then Covid and Ukraine happened.
The same is going on right now again - apparently he is "negotiating" while arming itself again even more and preparing for an invasion of Armenia proper when the circumstances are right (next big international chaos).
Unfortunately this has very little coverage in western media - and the lack of understanding regional issues leads a lot of people just try to be fair and neutral saying things like "both sides are bad", "give it up to avoid a greater loss", etc. I get it, the life is not fair, but at least you need to acknowledge and recognize unfairness, injustice and evil - and sometimes you have to draw a line and protect it. Otherwise crazy dictators will take over the world.
@@erokul
Well I absolutely agree with par of what you have said, while disagreeing with others.
So the scenario where Artsakh is recognized in exchange for the return of the surrounding areas is one that we could definetly consider ideal but should also be aware of it being unrealistic (even at the time). It doesnt take much more than a look at a map to see that it wouldnt have been sustainable long term, especially given the recent history around it and Armenian Azerbajani relations. Landlocked enclaves with very close ties to another country like this can only ever exist if both countries are good friends and even then its an inheritly unstable situation and they are likely to be swallowed up by one or the other long term. And well given how Armenia acted when they had the upper hand its no wonder that there was a considerable lust for vengance in Azerbajan (acknowleding the reasoning behind Azerbajans action doesnt mean I agree with them btw), so tension were high and the kind of friendly relations needed to keep a border situation as complicated as this peaceful simply not in sight.
The current border combined with the fact that the Armenian population within the region has been forcibly removed has increased those tensions by a lot but also gotten rid of the inherit instability of the enclave situation. Now the only reason for Armenia to open up hostilities again would be (an also understandable) desire for vengance but not geography. And hurt feelings can be put aside and be forgotten over time but geography doesnt.
The second half of your reply does however have my full support! I will openly admitt that due to the underreporting you yourself have mentioned I am not particulary knowledgable about the finer details of the situation and Azerbajani politics. So I will take your word for it. And yes stopping any leaders (whether dictators or others) that seek the violent expansion of their countries at the cost of others for little reason as their own (often personal) power, prestige and wealth should be kept in check. Whether he is just playing for time again idk. But what i do know that the situation as it is now at least from a purely geographic and geopolitical angle is now far more stable than it was a few years ago and that at least in theory there now is a real chance to normalise the Armenian Azerbajani relations. Whether Aliyev actually wants to do so we will have to see.
System of a down noticed
Seeing this makes us feel the Balkans is a paradise compared to the Caucasus.
The Caucasus is truly Europe's powder keg. The dirtiest European conflicts occurred not in the Balkans but the Caucasus.
The troubles in the Caucasus have been intentionally engineered by the Russians to create a buffer made of small countries too occupied by bickering with each other to become a real issue for Russia.
Not interested in warfronts, war.
We need to make sure the culture isn’t destroyed.
For much of Artsakh it is too late. But tiktok didn’t tell people to care in 2020 when this was happening because it wasn’t expedient for the CCP so nobody cared.
Informative video about Armenian 🇦🇲 Azerbaijan 🇦🇿 challenges. How do turkey 🇹🇷 and Israelian weaponry help Azerbaijan against Armenia 🇦🇲
You guys must be so tired posting a wonderful video, only to hear breaking news of your next video
The Zangezur region (modern-day Syunik in southern Armenia) was given to Armenia in the 1920s by the Bolsheviks.
In July 1921, the Bolshevik government formally transferred Zangezur to the republic of Armenia, officially ending the territorial dispute between Azerbaijani and Armenian republics. Garegin Nzhdeh, who had continued resistance even after the Sovietization of Armenia, eventually retreated to Qajar dynasty, marking the end of military conflict in the region.
They fixed the s problem
AND WHY DID THE MSM IGNORE THIS??? (That was a rhetorical question; I know why: it's only profitable if you can BLAME ISRAEL for it)
Not sure how that’s the motive…. If you can literally blame Israel for this…… because their Azerbaijan’s closest backer and ally🤣
The most attention the ethnic cleansing of Artsakh got in the West was from System of A Down. They released a single with two new songs. They are all of Armenian descent and are part of the diaspora of Armenians that came about after the Armenian Genocide.
What's left to focus on...genocidal war crimes?
That's pretty cool. Very metal.
Love this channel - not because of the horrors it covers; but because of the horrors it covers.
I would never have known this great injustice happened to those poor people.
And now I know.
I’m sorry to anyone affected by this conflict. Nobody deserves to have their home destroyed.
Armenian, or Azerbaijani.
Cut us open and we have the same insides.
When your body is found in centuries by archaeologists;
they won’t know - they’ll only be able to assume where you came from. The bottom line is that you were human, regardless of the name that belonged to the outline on a map which you were born in.
War seems inevitable with how humanity works; but I wish we lived in an ideal world where it wasn’t an option.