Designing is like evolution: You build on top of the existing thing in the search for perfection. Remove all not needed, unessential elements. Keep the base idea! A head, torso, four legs. Now you shape it and adjust it based on your specific needs. Take a horse and a cat. Head, torso, four legs... But they are totally separate beasts.
In our design study course we use the idiom “we’re standing on the shoulders of giants” when talking about most research. Whether that’s a book from the library or user’s comments on other designs.
The problem with Amazon Basics knockoffs isn't the stolen design, but rather their abuse of their platform to outcompete other sellers based solely on their intricate (and others's lack of) knowledge of their own platform's product ranking system. In the Peak bag case where price segments differ it matter less, as Peak can sell on their quality (as they have done so), but for many cheaper products Amazon can effectively delete their competition.
@@kylejohnston4788 much more nuanced, sure sell your competitive product and if all things equal the better one wins But all things are not equal Between Amazon controlling the data and with the size to make production cheap, and not to mention abuses of the review and catagories/what gets shown, it's like a monopoly So yes, but you seem very disingenuous with your question
@@toneeviera8336 we all hear the classic phrase "I can get the same thing cheaper on Amazon" so then they buy from them. If a company can provide the world with a same or better product they need or want at a cheaper price, sooner and more efficiently, that benefits everyone. God forbid they reap rewards. Amazon will phase out eventually like how Blockbuster got taken by Netflix and Sears / JcPenney / Kmart got taken by Lowes / TJ Maxx / Target. Circuit City by Best Buy. Big companies aren't forever.
@@kylejohnston4788 it's perfectly fine for them to sell their own stuff on their own platform. Costco and Trader Joe's do just that. The problem is with the way they do it, and inherent to online where there's product ratings and search rankings. C and TJ don't hide competing products behind their own on the shelves, they're side by side; consumers can also physically touch them and better compare; and they both cost around the same price. What Amazon is doing is artificially putting their products first, piggybacking on others' brand recognition, and in the case of many products, putting up cheaper but much lower quality products. Competition is good, dishonest competition isn't.
Absolutely brilliant. Attributed to Picasso "A good artist copies, a great artist steals". Brahm's 1st symphony is sometimes jokingly called "Beethoven's 10th symphony" (Beethoven wrote 9 symphonies, for those who are not classical music nerds like me)... You get the drift. But the way you put it in the video is brilliant.
Huge fan! I try to teach young designers that our craft is one of iteration. A lot of designers feel like they want to re-invent the wheel for projects, and don't seem to understand that design is an evolutionary procress.
Excellent video John - Always great to see/hear your perspective. One thing about copying is that historically it has become more of an issue due to the monetization associated with our basic needs. Copying builds cultures as more people do those same things. That's how we got farming done as communities, community dances, united singing etc. Watching how others did it, nature first, then groups of people. When volume production for the benefit of profit came into style, IP protection and patents were formed to stop people from doing this in larger, unlicensed ways. ID and IP have changed a lot over the past 25 years. Watch for even more of it to change with more and more product value being driven by experience and content contexts over the actual product itself. Most people cannot tell the difference between an Acura and BMW with all the emblems off the car. This has been true for many years with clothing, food, and even specialized sound equipment. Our sense of preference is diminishing as more time is spent with blended product offerings and more choices in the marketplace.
Another thing that's happening is absolutely unfettered access to EVERYTHING. You can travel anywhere with minimal effort when compared to 150 years ago. You have all of the knowledge of the world in your pocket. This makes the creative evolutionary process happen faster and faster. One thing that is hindering this evolutionary development is antiquated IP law. IP was initially put in place to benefit the customer, but it has slowly transformed to benefit companies with big legal teams. Basically, IP protects those with resources, rather than those who have legitimate cases.
@@Design.Theory and IP is often not protecting equally important things like spoken language, indigenous music, dance and cultural traditions that get lost in the demands of majority owned companies (or worse stolen by) with profit agendas above social/cultural preservation.
I can't believe I had been missing out on such great content! Just discovered your channel last week and the content is just quality! I love the Design Analysis of some of the most iconic brands and products!
Awesome work! This is the best video I've seen on this topic, you covered all the important points but kept it accessible and succinct. This is gonna be my go-to video to send to people from now on when they preach some unattainable ideal of "pure originiality" or complain about "copying".
As someone who sews, I love remixing things! I often trace existing mass produced garments, reference old patterns, and put different patterns together to make something new (like taking sleeves from a different pattern than the rest of the shirt). Usually I try to make my garments without directly using bought patterns, but rather taking the basic principals and seam placements, to make something that's a lot more me. I'm working on designing something to wear for my wedding right now, and I'm taking bits and pieces from designers (Riki Dalal being a big inspiration) while taking different fabrics, and design elements that haven't been put together before. Different lace, neckline, sleeves, textures, etc. My idea is that you can't call me outdated when what I wear has never been in style, or rather is a combination of mostly 1930s, 1970s and 2010s style.
In the topic of Fender copies I'd like to add the fact that many musicians look for those copies because their image of an electric guitar/bass is directly linked to the old Fender designs (Telecaster, Stratocaster, Precision and Jazz basses), just like modern violins look like Stradivarius' designs and classical guitars look almost the same as the original Antonio de Torres design. It's fascinating to see how many high-end luthiers make Fender copies because that's what the market wants
hey man super great video! You still owe me that video on talking to engineers, survive and make your design prevail (also with clients). As designer I always feel so stretch out by these two forces! Anyway thanks for the great vid!
I once read that there is no such thing as inventions (only innovations of previous ideas). This is sort of the concept when mixing blue and yellow - it makes green (invention), but it was still only an iteration/combination of 2 previous colors.
yes, I do think that too, especially nowadays company designer just copy, transform, and design from their competitor or bringing back some old design to nowadays standard. Also, people don't realize we copy each other everyday, even copy from the nature it self. as designer, we really threading on a very fine line of copy or innovating, but without it there is no development of the previous thing. it's really dual sided blade at the end, but one key difference is: the shameless act to not told people who/what our inspiration when creating something. if we not told people who inspired us or based on what, then we can say it is a really shameless act at the end, and wee already see it in some of cases.
Thank you for another wonderful essay! I would love to see more diversity in the examples of product design you talk about. This channel is like an inspirational library for me, however it can get a little bit dull, seing the same speaker or bass guitar over and over, although they do make a point. I am sure, you yourself come across a plentitude of designs while researching for your craft!
Architecture is a little different. Even tribute buildings are generally looked down on. I would argue that the equivalent of a Penny loafer in architecture could be a typology.
Holy fkin shit! What a video, i think every industrial designer student or professional should watch this video. It’s very revelational and understands exacly the current issues about industrial design. I totally agree with you and i love the examples and the way it develops the arguments. I would like to add the importance and respnsability of industrial design in our human and non human realities. We have to be very carefull with the functions that we want create or the ones that we have to ask if we really need. For me designers, objects and products must always have a social, natural, emocional and beauty coeherence and perspective. We are designing the material world! Which belongs to the same reality so, do it with a loving and critic soul. Never forget that design is from humans to humans. Thanks a lot for your videos
In the last decade I have been explaining the concept remix from Kirby to other industrial designers peers and entrepreneur colleagues, it is so hard for many to understand and assimilate. when at the same time, we are being push constantly by this often vague urge concept of innovation, the idealism of the one genius, designer or inventor that changed the world; that often just creates frustration in students and our career in the long run, when you actually look to the roots many of them you find how much copy has been done with little tweaks to achieve their innovation, is more of an adaptation process rather than creation.. It was difficult to fully embrace this concept of remix with 5 years of designing and living for a Chinese company in China, I felt the creative spark was fading but this basic creative elements helped a lot to keep moving, even if it was small changes to differentiate from competitors. Finally with my own startup I manage to push the remix to the maximum extend in the right way and I am happy to see is being push forward by ID influencers like you too, in a great concise way.
I find that combining disparate ideas/disciplines/categories to be one of the best ways to remix in an innovative way. Thank you for your thoughtful comment!
Good points !!!! To me looks like many creative people don't study enough, they just follow the new Trends. I studied industrial Design time ago, without computers. Very few people are familiar with innovators like "the
I agree with everything except for your last statement. We’re are not all the same links, some links have more knowledge and experience than others which they can convey in their artwork and make more substantial art.. Hence a 5 yr old compared to a 30 yr old .. but great vid thank you
Love the video very interesting prospective, but amazon have been sue for copying other company’s design for years now I think there are still an fine line on the Intellectual property rights and patent,
Yeah I'm not saying that Amazon is perfect when it comes to copying in an unethical way. I'm actually not sure I've heard of any Amazon patent lawsuits. But just because a company is sued doesn't necessarily mean they are wrong.
i'm gonna think of it like a scientist, cite the works that inspired you and the works that you build upon to, and clearly offer your own contribution to the field
I think with Braun's designs that heavily inspired Apple's designs it wouldnt be so much of an issue if they acknowledged the design inspiration, but I doubt Apple would ever admit their design is not 100% unique and original. On the other hand, If someone creates a new product that is "inspired" by an Apple product and is a transformation as you say, I predict that they would be pursued legally and have to answer all sorts of IP issues, since Apple have way more power and are well known for being particularly strict on that sort of thing.
I think Jony Ive actually admitted that he copied Braun's products, but I could be wrong. There are definite issues with IP law around design patents. In my opinion they're mostly pointless unless you have a massive legal team.
I really like it when cars look different. Should I ever get a license (not a priority, I walk everywhere atm) I want a renault twizy or a similarly small car. Easy parking space ^^
Thanks, this is very inspiring! Good how you show the evolution of design, but also reaction from one school of design to meke someting completely "new" as a reaction, like the Arts&Crafts. Iike to see the proces in a design, like the tree painting by Mondriaan and how he transposed it to the abstract art he is famous for. I don't like the end result as paintings (or better, I don't understsnd it...) But I do enjoy to look at these in between fases of the painting. Again thanks for a great story/documentary.
Sidenote: Acura & Honda are the same company, bruh. It doesn’t count when they copy each other. A better example might be Hyundai’s 2006-2010 Sonata vs. Honda’s 2008-2014 Accord. At first it looked like Hyundai was trying to create an updated version of the early 2000s Honda Accord; but then Honda turned around and copied Hyundai’s updated design, yielding a copy of a copy! But really, it’s hard. All automakers are trying to tailor both to customer demand and the regulations placed upon them. Add to that the desire to play it safe, and we get lots of cars that look alike. David F&P America Tier 1 Honda (& Acura) Supplier
These views are mine, and mine only. I don't personally benefit from supporting Amazon, especially since the team I worked with is completely separate from the team that made this bag. Amazon doesn't need my dinky UA-cam channel to defend their business practices.
As someone who is looking to get into industrial design this video really struck a chord with me. I think a lot of the self-doubt I experience relates to this topic! Do you think it is a good strategy to learn the skills needed for ID by trying to recreate product sketches, CAD models, Renders, etc. of other designers and then actually physically make them?
Yes, absolutely 100%. That is by far the best technique. Obviously there's a line. Don't pass off the work as your own. It also helps to get inspiration from disparate sources in order to avoid making derivative design work. But if you're trying to learn technical skills or the basics, there is no better way to learn than to copy the masters. I wouldn't necessarily put this stuff in my folio, but it's a great skill builder.
@@Design.Theory Thanks for the advice! I'm definitely in the skill building stage of my journey and would never want to take credit for anyone's work. As I mentioned, for someone who is out of college trying to make a career shift, these videos are huge help!
Great video. You should do a follow up video around design patents. I believe you've stated previously that you think they're not practical. I think going more in depth and explain when they are appropriate would be awesome.
Great suggestion! I think they're practical only as long as you're able to enforce them. Most independent creators are not able to...only large corporations with big legal teams
I had that song on repeat as a teen. Thanks for watching, I appreciate the kind words. These videos are essentially a way for me to structure and organize my thoughts around nuanced concepts.
The problem with Amazon is not their copy/inspiration of some design, rather that they do this with every product category that sells on their platform. The strategy is to identify top-sellers, copy them, undercut them in price, and outsell the original on the very same platform. The scale and money amazon has allows them to hurt smaller, niche brands. The ethical discussion here is about platforms and their role rather than copying design per se. If a random other company had copied the Peak Performance design it wouldn't have nearly the same amount of visibility and traction that Amazon does, that inherently is the problem. Amazon has a disproportionate relationship with the smaller retailers that are dependant on them. They are abusing the power their position gents them. Not to mention the power amazon has in pushing their own products on their platform. The money they have to take losses and undercut competitors just to monopolise a market. And ultimately the data they harvest from their customers which leads into whole other debate about privacy and data security. This is not even mentioning the labour practices involved to produce these knockoffs at a low price. You can't just look at onc instance and brush it off as part of design legacy.
Here is a fundamental truth - everything has been done already. Hardly is there a truly new innovation. Even Yeezys organic shoe is inspired something.
I have a feeling that Amazon only "borrow" designs from smaller, unknown companies, not Apple, Bang & Olufsen, or IKEA. Good video though and there's certainly a lot of grey area here.
I discovered you today from the interview you did with Derek Elliot in his latest tutorial (Gunglasses tutorial). Your knowledge in this field of art is amazing and your content is super helpful to a 3D artist like me. May I ask which software you're using to sketch the guitar at timestamp 10:33?
Thanks a lot for the quick response. I should try out Procreate. I look forward to watching all the videos on your channel to gain more insight from you. Keep up the great work!
@@Design.Theory this proves there is no need to try not to copy, just be honest about it and find a way to adjust enough so it's not a 100% copy and possibly make it better :)
That shape, of the BeO and that vase.. have a look at the Vodafone Wi-Fi 6 Station.. very similar, but you know.. inspiration? :) I am an industrial designer myself and this is something that is always in the design process. The challenge is to have your own style, anyway. Getting details is ok, not putting anything personal in the things you do is not design. This video is so great, anyway, keep up the good work, Cheers form Italy! :)
Interesting! Another important thing to remember is that minimal shapes such as the mist vase, beosound emerge, and vodafone wifi station are bound to look similar
This takes a lot of pressure off my shoulders... looking at inspiration images and trying to transform them into different products, I feel like I'm stealing someone else's creativity. Seems like it's the norm!
As Mark Twain rightly said, "There is no such thing as a new idea. It is impossible. We simply take a lot of old ideas and put them into a sort of mental kaleidoscope."
I gave up on my motorcycle parts business, because of far east copies, they even blatantly order your stuff to their door, then using selling regulations then ask for a return when finished I just go for making bespoke now
Man, your videos are great but you really need to be carefull with your audio mix : the music at 0:33 is way too loud (same for the ending). As a designer who works with his hands, you may understand that some people work with their ears ;)
Design education has also been transformational. You left out that Braun design was impacted by HfG/Ulm, like the design schools of Yale, GA Tech and NC State, a transformation of the Bauhaus, as Auburn was a transformation of HfG/Ulm by structuring design as the integration of the arts, humanities and science, defining function as more than the pragmatic physiological aspect of the form of the design. The transformation of design philosophy was a significant aspect of design management in complex systems such as computers, evident in the design of products at IBM and Apple. Such ideology was frowned on by design managers from styling schools in the 70s, but became the norm as design management required more involvement in corporate strategy as the design of product systems became global. However, most design UA-cam videos focus on style, sketching and rendering skills VS the logic of design to transform into interdisciplinary professions. Bauhaus was not a style, it was a philosophy of what design should become.
I mention a little bit about the transformation from styling schools to involvement in corporate strategy in one of my other vids about the 1980s. I think it's titled "How Design Changed in the 1980s & Why It's Relevant Today" or something like that
Copying the design wasn't necessarily unethical. The thing that was unethical is when you type "everyday sling" into Amazon, you get Amazon's product. Peak's product is way down the list. Imagine a parent or a friend purchasing a gift for a photographer they know. This is a thing that Amazon does all the time. They will take a popular product, make something that is incredibly similar in appearance, name it the same thing, and then shove the original deep into the algorithm
Another great video John!!! I have a question out personal curiosity, for a Video like this where you take inspiration from similar content to yours, did you ask the different creators if they were okay with with your video before releasing it, or do you trust yourself to remix the content without the fear of coming off as a blatant copycat?
No, I did not. So at least from a legal perspective, any sort of footage used as a commentary falls under what is called "Fair Use", because you are sufficiently transforming the footage into something new. So it's perfectly legal. But just because something is legal doesn't mean that it's necessarily ethical. I think in instances where it's a well-known company, I don't feel a need to credit them. But if it's a smaller independent creator (like Stewart Hicks or Kirby Ferguson), I think it makes sense to.
I think you miss the mark with the amazon copying the peak bag! They have access to vast amounts of data as to what is popular which the peak bag company, and many others companies, don't. Amazon are not transforming or remixing or taking inspiration they are deliberately capitalizing on the success of other brands. On top of that they have the ability which they most definitely use to increase the visibility on their product while simultaneously reducing the visibility of the original product. This is vastly different from the bass guitar case that you use where the more expensive 'copy' is a much smaller manufacturer with no ability to influence Fenders marketing. Even in the case that it was Fender copying the smaller manufacturers design it would not be 1/10th as bad as what amazon does.
Such a great video John, really appreciate the nuanced contrarian view on the Peak design bag controversy.
Designing is like evolution: You build on top of the existing thing in the search for perfection. Remove all not needed, unessential elements. Keep the base idea! A head, torso, four legs. Now you shape it and adjust it based on your specific needs. Take a horse and a cat. Head, torso, four legs... But they are totally separate beasts.
Well said! Great analogy.
In our design study course we use the idiom “we’re standing on the shoulders of giants” when talking about most research. Whether that’s a book from the library or user’s comments on other designs.
The problem with Amazon Basics knockoffs isn't the stolen design, but rather their abuse of their platform to outcompete other sellers based solely on their intricate (and others's lack of) knowledge of their own platform's product ranking system. In the Peak bag case where price segments differ it matter less, as Peak can sell on their quality (as they have done so), but for many cheaper products Amazon can effectively delete their competition.
Exactly
Are you complaining about someone using their own platform to sell more of their own products?
@@kylejohnston4788 much more nuanced, sure sell your competitive product and if all things equal the better one wins
But all things are not equal
Between Amazon controlling the data and with the size to make production cheap, and not to mention abuses of the review and catagories/what gets shown, it's like a monopoly
So yes, but you seem very disingenuous with your question
@@toneeviera8336 we all hear the classic phrase "I can get the same thing cheaper on Amazon" so then they buy from them. If a company can provide the world with a same or better product they need or want at a cheaper price, sooner and more efficiently, that benefits everyone. God forbid they reap rewards. Amazon will phase out eventually like how Blockbuster got taken by Netflix and Sears / JcPenney / Kmart got taken by Lowes / TJ Maxx / Target. Circuit City by Best Buy. Big companies aren't forever.
@@kylejohnston4788 it's perfectly fine for them to sell their own stuff on their own platform. Costco and Trader Joe's do just that. The problem is with the way they do it, and inherent to online where there's product ratings and search rankings. C and TJ don't hide competing products behind their own on the shelves, they're side by side; consumers can also physically touch them and better compare; and they both cost around the same price. What Amazon is doing is artificially putting their products first, piggybacking on others' brand recognition, and in the case of many products, putting up cheaper but much lower quality products. Competition is good, dishonest competition isn't.
The fine line between innovation, inspiration, & copying designs
Indeed! Thank you for watching :)
More like a blur.
Absolutely brilliant. Attributed to Picasso "A good artist copies, a great artist steals". Brahm's 1st symphony is sometimes jokingly called "Beethoven's 10th symphony" (Beethoven wrote 9 symphonies, for those who are not classical music nerds like me)... You get the drift. But the way you put it in the video is brilliant.
Thank you!!!
Great take on a hot topic!
Thanks Derek! I love your content :O
Huge fan! I try to teach young designers that our craft is one of iteration. A lot of designers feel like they want to re-invent the wheel for projects, and don't seem to understand that design is an evolutionary procress.
Excellent video John - Always great to see/hear your perspective. One thing about copying is that historically it has become more of an issue due to the monetization associated with our basic needs. Copying builds cultures as more people do those same things. That's how we got farming done as communities, community dances, united singing etc. Watching how others did it, nature first, then groups of people. When volume production for the benefit of profit came into style, IP protection and patents were formed to stop people from doing this in larger, unlicensed ways.
ID and IP have changed a lot over the past 25 years. Watch for even more of it to change with more and more product value being driven by experience and content contexts over the actual product itself. Most people cannot tell the difference between an Acura and BMW with all the emblems off the car. This has been true for many years with clothing, food, and even specialized sound equipment. Our sense of preference is diminishing as more time is spent with blended product offerings and more choices in the marketplace.
Another thing that's happening is absolutely unfettered access to EVERYTHING. You can travel anywhere with minimal effort when compared to 150 years ago. You have all of the knowledge of the world in your pocket. This makes the creative evolutionary process happen faster and faster. One thing that is hindering this evolutionary development is antiquated IP law. IP was initially put in place to benefit the customer, but it has slowly transformed to benefit companies with big legal teams. Basically, IP protects those with resources, rather than those who have legitimate cases.
@@Design.Theory and IP is often not protecting equally important things like spoken language, indigenous music, dance and cultural traditions that get lost in the demands of majority owned companies (or worse stolen by) with profit agendas above social/cultural preservation.
I can't believe I had been missing out on such great content! Just discovered your channel last week and the content is just quality! I love the Design Analysis of some of the most iconic brands and products!
Awesome work! This is the best video I've seen on this topic, you covered all the important points but kept it accessible and succinct. This is gonna be my go-to video to send to people from now on when they preach some unattainable ideal of "pure originiality" or complain about "copying".
As someone who sews, I love remixing things! I often trace existing mass produced garments, reference old patterns, and put different patterns together to make something new (like taking sleeves from a different pattern than the rest of the shirt). Usually I try to make my garments without directly using bought patterns, but rather taking the basic principals and seam placements, to make something that's a lot more me.
I'm working on designing something to wear for my wedding right now, and I'm taking bits and pieces from designers (Riki Dalal being a big inspiration) while taking different fabrics, and design elements that haven't been put together before. Different lace, neckline, sleeves, textures, etc. My idea is that you can't call me outdated when what I wear has never been in style, or rather is a combination of mostly 1930s, 1970s and 2010s style.
Powerful video with a powerful message, nothing is new under the sun
Thanks so much for watching! I think this is an important topic that simply is not discussed enough in creative circles.
Amazing video, John - great comparisons and conclusions. Also I love the honesty and charme of it.
Thanks Dominik! I really appreciate that. I think this is one of my favorite videos to date.
"What has been will be again, what has been done will be done again; there is nothing new under the sun."
- Ecclesiastes 1:9
The bible copied my video.
In the topic of Fender copies I'd like to add the fact that many musicians look for those copies because their image of an electric guitar/bass is directly linked to the old Fender designs (Telecaster, Stratocaster, Precision and Jazz basses), just like modern violins look like Stradivarius' designs and classical guitars look almost the same as the original Antonio de Torres design.
It's fascinating to see how many high-end luthiers make Fender copies because that's what the market wants
I’m not a product engineer or marketing consultant or anything, but I’m subbing anyway. This video is full of good info.
Your thumbnail really grabbed me. I’ve always been interested in how some seemingly completely unrelated products look alike
hey man super great video! You still owe me that video on talking to engineers, survive and make your design prevail (also with clients). As designer I always feel so stretch out by these two forces!
Anyway thanks for the great vid!
Working on it!
I once read that there is no such thing as inventions (only innovations of previous ideas). This is sort of the concept when mixing blue and yellow - it makes green (invention), but it was still only an iteration/combination of 2 previous colors.
yes, I do think that too, especially nowadays company designer just copy, transform, and design from their competitor or bringing back some old design to nowadays standard. Also, people don't realize we copy each other everyday, even copy from the nature it self. as designer, we really threading on a very fine line of copy or innovating, but without it there is no development of the previous thing.
it's really dual sided blade at the end, but one key difference is: the shameless act to not told people who/what our inspiration when creating something. if we not told people who inspired us or based on what, then we can say it is a really shameless act at the end, and wee already see it in some of cases.
John, this was so good! :)
Thanks so much! I learned a lot while making it.
this video has really humbled my view on the process of creativity. Thank You
As a designer, I absolutely loved this. Nice work. It's hard to find good, design-related content.
Thanks for watching, Scott!
@@Design.Theory I'm also a guitar player so your bass is really intriguing. Best of luck with it. It's a beautiful design.
Satisfying video, full of sincerity that is why it's very original from the side of his creator. 👏👏👏
Thank you for another wonderful essay! I would love to see more diversity in the examples of product design you talk about. This channel is like an inspirational library for me, however it can get a little bit dull, seing the same speaker or bass guitar over and over, although they do make a point. I am sure, you yourself come across a plentitude of designs while researching for your craft!
Great suggestion! More varied examples are definitely on my to do list
Architecture is a little different. Even tribute buildings are generally looked down on. I would argue that the equivalent of a Penny loafer in architecture could be a typology.
Holy fkin shit! What a video, i think every industrial designer student or professional should watch this video. It’s very revelational and understands exacly the current issues about industrial design. I totally agree with you and i love the examples and the way it develops the arguments. I would like to add the importance and respnsability of industrial design in our human and non human realities. We have to be very carefull with the functions that we want create or the ones that we have to ask if we really need. For me designers, objects and products must always have a social, natural, emocional and beauty coeherence and perspective. We are designing the material world! Which belongs to the same reality so, do it with a loving and critic soul. Never forget that design is from humans to humans.
Thanks a lot for your videos
Incredible video, thank you for your content! Cheers from Argentina!
Glad you enjoyed it!
In the last decade I have been explaining the concept remix from Kirby to other industrial designers peers and entrepreneur colleagues, it is so hard for many to understand and assimilate. when at the same time, we are being push constantly by this often vague urge concept of innovation, the idealism of the one genius, designer or inventor that changed the world; that often just creates frustration in students and our career in the long run, when you actually look to the roots many of them you find how much copy has been done with little tweaks to achieve their innovation, is more of an adaptation process rather than creation..
It was difficult to fully embrace this concept of remix with 5 years of designing and living for a Chinese company in China, I felt the creative spark was fading but this basic creative elements helped a lot to keep moving, even if it was small changes to differentiate from competitors.
Finally with my own startup I manage to push the remix to the maximum extend in the right way and I am happy to see is being push forward by ID influencers like you too, in a great concise way.
I find that combining disparate ideas/disciplines/categories to be one of the best ways to remix in an innovative way. Thank you for your thoughtful comment!
You know you're good when they start copying you.
Spot on! Well said and well executed. Thanks for sharing your thoughts.
Glad you enjoyed it!
Just found your channel and loving it
Good points !!!! To me looks like many creative people don't study enough, they just follow the new Trends. I studied industrial Design time ago, without computers.
Very few people are familiar with innovators like "the
"the
just incredible. everything is just spot on. wow!
Great video, I love how constructivism reminds me so much of the first era of Franz Ferdinand (band). This vide was so fun.
Wow! your videos are so well put together.
Thanks Shehzada :) I spent a lot of time on this one!
Great video. I think the addition of your personal insight into the factual story telling is really entertaining and useful. -Ken
Thanks Ken! I really appreciate that.
Nah. That Amazon Basics camera bag is a DIRECT KNOCKOFF of PD's design
I really like you how you covered some design history in this video.
Glad you liked it! That will become a bigger part of this channel, I hope
Very interesting content Jonh! Keep it up!
Thanks! More coming soon :)
this channel is really great!
I appreciate that!
I agree with everything except for your last statement. We’re are not all the same links, some links have more knowledge and experience than others which they can convey in their artwork and make more substantial art.. Hence a 5 yr old compared to a 30 yr old .. but great vid thank you
Thank u soooo much for such an instructive video.
Sheers ✌️
My pleasure 😊 Glad it was helpful!
Love the video very interesting prospective, but amazon have been sue for copying other company’s design for years now I think there are still an fine line on the Intellectual property rights and patent,
Yeah I'm not saying that Amazon is perfect when it comes to copying in an unethical way. I'm actually not sure I've heard of any Amazon patent lawsuits. But just because a company is sued doesn't necessarily mean they are wrong.
Another great one, thanks John 🙌
Glad you enjoyed it! Thank you for listening
Great video! And the ending, hahahaha, smash it!
Thank you for this great video!!! Lots of good information!
i'm gonna think of it like a scientist, cite the works that inspired you and the works that you build upon to, and clearly offer your own contribution to the field
I think with Braun's designs that heavily inspired Apple's designs it wouldnt be so much of an issue if they acknowledged the design inspiration, but I doubt Apple would ever admit their design is not 100% unique and original. On the other hand, If someone creates a new product that is "inspired" by an Apple product and is a transformation as you say, I predict that they would be pursued legally and have to answer all sorts of IP issues, since Apple have way more power and are well known for being particularly strict on that sort of thing.
I think Jony Ive actually admitted that he copied Braun's products, but I could be wrong. There are definite issues with IP law around design patents. In my opinion they're mostly pointless unless you have a massive legal team.
Yeah, no. If you’d googled even for 2 seconds you’d find Jony Ive talking about Braun’s design inspiration. Nice try.
I really like it when cars look different. Should I ever get a license (not a priority, I walk everywhere atm) I want a renault twizy or a similarly small car. Easy parking space ^^
Thanks, man! Always interesting and useful
My pleasure! This was one of my favorite videos to make so far!!
Amazing content! Thanks
very useful video, thank you!
Glad it was helpful! Thanks for watching :)
Thanks, this is very inspiring! Good how you show the evolution of design, but also reaction from one school of design to meke someting completely "new" as a reaction, like the Arts&Crafts.
Iike to see the proces in a design, like the tree painting by Mondriaan and how he transposed it to the abstract art he is famous for. I don't like the end result as paintings (or better, I don't understsnd it...) But I do enjoy to look at these in between fases of the painting. Again thanks for a great story/documentary.
This video made me realise we pronounce Braun differently in the UK.
I pronounce it roughly the way Germans pronounce it. Most Americans pronounce it "brawn"
Sidenote: Acura & Honda are the same company, bruh. It doesn’t count when they copy each other.
A better example might be Hyundai’s 2006-2010 Sonata vs. Honda’s 2008-2014 Accord. At first it looked like Hyundai was trying to create an updated version of the early 2000s Honda Accord; but then Honda turned around and copied Hyundai’s updated design, yielding a copy of a copy!
But really, it’s hard. All automakers are trying to tailor both to customer demand and the regulations placed upon them. Add to that the desire to play it safe, and we get lots of cars that look alike.
David
F&P America
Tier 1 Honda (& Acura) Supplier
cars in particular are tricky....because you have soooo many constraints. It's hard to make something fresh.
how should we read your take defending big corp when you cite Amazon as one of your clients on your portfolio?
These views are mine, and mine only. I don't personally benefit from supporting Amazon, especially since the team I worked with is completely separate from the team that made this bag. Amazon doesn't need my dinky UA-cam channel to defend their business practices.
As someone who is looking to get into industrial design this video really struck a chord with me. I think a lot of the self-doubt I experience relates to this topic!
Do you think it is a good strategy to learn the skills needed for ID by trying to recreate product sketches, CAD models, Renders, etc. of other designers and then actually physically make them?
Yes, absolutely 100%. That is by far the best technique. Obviously there's a line. Don't pass off the work as your own. It also helps to get inspiration from disparate sources in order to avoid making derivative design work. But if you're trying to learn technical skills or the basics, there is no better way to learn than to copy the masters. I wouldn't necessarily put this stuff in my folio, but it's a great skill builder.
@@Design.Theory Thanks for the advice! I'm definitely in the skill building stage of my journey and would never want to take credit for anyone's work. As I mentioned, for someone who is out of college trying to make a career shift, these videos are huge help!
Great video. You should do a follow up video around design patents. I believe you've stated previously that you think they're not practical. I think going more in depth and explain when they are appropriate would be awesome.
Great suggestion! I think they're practical only as long as you're able to enforce them. Most independent creators are not able to...only large corporations with big legal teams
Awesome as usual 😁.
Thank you, Sshlok! Great to hear from you :)
Great video 🔥
It’s not the best guitar in the world, it’s just a tribute.
But jokes aside, great video. I have nothing to do with design professionally, yet I find your videos incredibly captivating and interesting. Kudos.
I had that song on repeat as a teen. Thanks for watching, I appreciate the kind words. These videos are essentially a way for me to structure and organize my thoughts around nuanced concepts.
The problem with Amazon is not their copy/inspiration of some design, rather that they do this with every product category that sells on their platform. The strategy is to identify top-sellers, copy them, undercut them in price, and outsell the original on the very same platform. The scale and money amazon has allows them to hurt smaller, niche brands. The ethical discussion here is about platforms and their role rather than copying design per se. If a random other company had copied the Peak Performance design it wouldn't have nearly the same amount of visibility and traction that Amazon does, that inherently is the problem. Amazon has a disproportionate relationship with the smaller retailers that are dependant on them. They are abusing the power their position gents them. Not to mention the power amazon has in pushing their own products on their platform. The money they have to take losses and undercut competitors just to monopolise a market. And ultimately the data they harvest from their customers which leads into whole other debate about privacy and data security. This is not even mentioning the labour practices involved to produce these knockoffs at a low price. You can't just look at onc instance and brush it off as part of design legacy.
Great video, your take on pressing like button made me chuckle and like button has been pressed. Have a good day!
Here is a fundamental truth - everything has been done already. Hardly is there a truly new innovation. Even Yeezys organic shoe is inspired something.
Very well said!
I have a feeling that Amazon only "borrow" designs from smaller, unknown companies, not Apple, Bang & Olufsen, or IKEA.
Good video though and there's certainly a lot of grey area here.
I discovered you today from the interview you did with Derek Elliot in his latest tutorial (Gunglasses tutorial). Your knowledge in this field of art is amazing and your content is super helpful to a 3D artist like me. May I ask which software you're using to sketch the guitar at timestamp 10:33?
Hey Ken, thank you for the kind words. I sketched the guitars in Procreate. I hope you learn as much my channel as you learn from Derek's!
Thanks a lot for the quick response. I should try out Procreate. I look forward to watching all the videos on your channel to gain more insight from you. Keep up the great work!
What's the microphone shown at 3:50?
sometimes you can even design something from scratch and later you find something that is very similar that was done before :)
That's true! Happens to me all the time
@@Design.Theory this proves there is no need to try not to copy, just be honest about it and find a way to adjust enough so it's not a 100% copy and possibly make it better :)
Great video! reminds me a lot of the book steal like an artist by austin kleon
Oh, I have heard of that one! I'll have to check it out
@@Design.Theory 100% would recommend
Try building off of blueprints today. I think they teach architects how to copy/paste and give them diplomas.
That shape, of the BeO and that vase.. have a look at the Vodafone Wi-Fi 6 Station.. very similar, but you know.. inspiration? :) I am an industrial designer myself and this is something that is always in the design process. The challenge is to have your own style, anyway. Getting details is ok, not putting anything personal in the things you do is not design. This video is so great, anyway, keep up the good work, Cheers form Italy! :)
Interesting! Another important thing to remember is that minimal shapes such as the mist vase, beosound emerge, and vodafone wifi station are bound to look similar
This takes a lot of pressure off my shoulders... looking at inspiration images and trying to transform them into different products, I feel like I'm stealing someone else's creativity. Seems like it's the norm!
The best thing you can do for your work is to take inspiration for disparate sources.
Honestly this is a banger
Thank you! I had a lot of fun making this video. It's a very big, very important topic.
8:36 Acura is literally Honda, so the two vehicles would have been planned and designed as a set.
Great video!!
Glad you enjoyed it
As Mark Twain rightly said, "There is no such thing as a new idea. It is impossible. We simply take a lot of old ideas and put them into a sort of mental kaleidoscope."
I gave up on my motorcycle parts business, because of far east copies, they even blatantly order your stuff to their door, then using selling regulations then ask for a return when finished
I just go for making bespoke now
Isn't it true that clothing design is generally not protected by copyright law because fashion design considered as utilitarian and is not protected?
Man, your videos are great but you really need to be carefull with your audio mix : the music at 0:33 is way too loud (same for the ending). As a designer who works with his hands, you may understand that some people work with their ears ;)
ok, thank you very much for your feedback
"Original is overrated, we are all copies with extra steps."
Design education has also been transformational. You left out that Braun design was impacted by HfG/Ulm, like the design schools of Yale, GA Tech and NC State, a transformation of the Bauhaus, as Auburn was a transformation of HfG/Ulm by structuring design as the integration of the arts, humanities and science, defining function as more than the pragmatic physiological aspect of the form of the design. The transformation of design philosophy was a significant aspect of design management in complex systems such as computers, evident in the design of products at IBM and Apple. Such ideology was frowned on by design managers from styling schools in the 70s, but became the norm as design management required more involvement in corporate strategy as the design of product systems became global. However, most design UA-cam videos focus on style, sketching and rendering skills VS the logic of design to transform into interdisciplinary professions. Bauhaus was not a style, it was a philosophy of what design should become.
I mention a little bit about the transformation from styling schools to involvement in corporate strategy in one of my other vids about the 1980s. I think it's titled "How Design Changed in the 1980s & Why It's Relevant Today" or something like that
Copying the design wasn't necessarily unethical. The thing that was unethical is when you type "everyday sling" into Amazon, you get Amazon's product. Peak's product is way down the list. Imagine a parent or a friend purchasing a gift for a photographer they know.
This is a thing that Amazon does all the time. They will take a popular product, make something that is incredibly similar in appearance, name it the same thing, and then shove the original deep into the algorithm
Fantastic!
Thanks for watching :)
We're constantly copying, transforming and combining.
That's exactly right!
Great video
what is an overhang in car design?
The front and rear part of the car that hangs out past the edges of the wheels when looked at in side view. Google it
Dieter Rams ❤️
Another great video John!!!
I have a question out personal curiosity, for a Video like this where you take inspiration from similar content to yours, did you ask the different creators if they were okay with with your video before releasing it, or do you trust yourself to remix the content without the fear of coming off as a blatant copycat?
No, I did not. So at least from a legal perspective, any sort of footage used as a commentary falls under what is called "Fair Use", because you are sufficiently transforming the footage into something new. So it's perfectly legal. But just because something is legal doesn't mean that it's necessarily ethical. I think in instances where it's a well-known company, I don't feel a need to credit them. But if it's a smaller independent creator (like Stewart Hicks or Kirby Ferguson), I think it makes sense to.
@@Design.Theory Thanks for the thorough explanation. The transparency and the good faith are a big part of the reason why I like your content.
Ayyyy hello from discord
8:34 Both those cars are made by the same company though.
We do stand on the shoulders of giants!
That Accord and Acura meme shouldn't be called copying. They're from the same company.
If you're improving the original design, is it still copying?
Hahaha the meme with the accura and Honda is funny cuz this is the same company just with different names
I'ma print this video
No ThAtS CoPyInG
I think you miss the mark with the amazon copying the peak bag! They have access to vast amounts of data as to what is popular which the peak bag company, and many others companies, don't. Amazon are not transforming or remixing or taking inspiration they are deliberately capitalizing on the success of other brands. On top of that they have the ability which they most definitely use to increase the visibility on their product while simultaneously reducing the visibility of the original product.
This is vastly different from the bass guitar case that you use where the more expensive 'copy' is a much smaller manufacturer with no ability to influence Fenders marketing. Even in the case that it was Fender copying the smaller manufacturers design it would not be 1/10th as bad as what amazon does.
That’s my mom you’re talking about! 😂
Your mom is a very lovely person I'm sure
Great video! :D
Glad you liked it!
amazon didnt add anything it's a cheap knockoff
abidas, niko, poma >>>>
agreed.