@@babyanie4673 True. It's wrong either way. The point I'm trying to make is that kids should not go through what adult are having a hard time going through.
@@alanaatkinson551exactly bro, K-pop Stans are a huge factor in why kids should not debut. Like they hate for no reason! Literally! Hypocritical Mfs should be the new definition of A netizen.
OMG thank you for this. I'm stanning both IVE and Le Seraffim. I legit don't understand the rivalry and hate from the fans of these groups. The IVE hate is stupid af.
Tbh that rivalry has sort of been brewing since Produce 48 days because of the Wonyoung VS Sakura solo stan feud, so it would make sense that it would evolve to IVE VS Le Seraphim
Kpop stans are so hypocritical. They will praise their idol for saying something along the lines of "bullying is wrong, idols are people too," but then turn around and do the exact thing their fave told them not to do. It's ridiculous. Not to mention kpop stans LOVE negging idols. When an idol is an underdog, they will praise and love them, but once that idol breaks through, suddenly everyone is telling them they're not good enough for whatever achievement they reach.
What I saw until I got used to it . when blackpink is successful BTS fans will say YG pays for success😂😂😂😂From what I saw, YG should own this world because they pay a lot. 🤣🤣
Facs.. 🙂:) I stan multi fandoms not only kpop and whenever I come back to kpop after watching some other entertainment industry I feel like I've been Toxicated🤕 the environment turns so painful from the other fandom to the kpop fandom 😬
I don’t think people talk enough about how starship, their own company whose suppose to protect them, has set those girls up multiple times and added fuel to the fire
Thank you! Everyone seems to brush over the fact that Starship is fanning the flames. Look at the incident of them attending an award show and Wonyoung’s outfit being made to stand out. You can’t tell me the decision wasn’t intentional because they wanted media buzz Starship doesn’t care about the group because to them bad press is still press, even if it’s at the expense of such young talent.
Being a WIZ*ONE, it's sad seeing some IVE and LE SERRAFIM fans go at each other. Like brothers and sisters, like can we just get along, some of their group members get along with each other, why can't we.
All those teen Kpop fans that are mad at a 15 year old being babied, are the same ones babying grown men and women NONSTOP. Seriously why is that so common and normalised?
It's scary to think about what will happen to future K-pop stans. They said every time *it was a joke,* but they didn't realize they were normalizing it, maybe not for them personally but we don't know for others.
Wonyoung is primarily getting hate because other 4th gen girl group stans (plus some Blinks and Onces) are threatened by IVE. Look at how IVE got a bit of a break when Le Sserafim and NewJeans had their respective scandals. But once IVE won Rookie of the year, they became the easy targets again. And they’re the competition again. Once Baby Monster debuts, they’re going to have massive debut sales/streams/viewing numbers and become the next target. IVE took over the hatred that was targeted at Aespa. Look at how people would take any opportunity to bash on Giselle and Winter. And that was taking on the hate that was originally targeted at Lia and Yuna of Itzy. It felt like Blackpink was getting a break between Itzy’s debut and the Born Pink album release (because again, they put themselves at the top of the food chain despite questionable effort going into the album release and following tour). IVE will eventually be overshadowed by another group in the near future and all of the hate will be direct towards that one until IVE’s popularity increases again. I wish that none of these idols had to endure that.
Also does anybody remember when Red Velvet debuted and they got a ton of hate for their debut song, and then yeri debuted and she got a ton of hate that was then overshadowed by Twice debuting and getting a bunch of hate for “copying girls generation” and nayeon being labeled as an idol with a bad attitude for not smiling all the time? Like everybody just jumps on the hate train no matter who it is
@@Callista2270 Exactly. It’s literally just always bash on the biggest girl group. And don’t get me wrong, boy groups get plenty of hate themselves. But this level of nitpicking and condemning everything (even breathing) is very centralized around girl groups.
It is funny how different your experience with fandoms can be depending what platform you use. Twitter is a toxic hellscape. Reddit is pretty chill. I was on the Blackpink subreddit and a Dive post a question asking how to deal with all the hate. Everyone was really respectful and nice.
@@Callista2270 I feel like it’s always girl groups too, correct me if I’m wrong because I’m not into guys groups like that but I neverrrrr see hate trains of guy group members and I think it’s because for the most part the popularity gap isn’t as vast for guy groups but idk
Bro I could do a whole ass report on the issues with Ive’s fandom and haters. I can start with how Wonyoung was practically forced to act face bc when she was her genuine self, she was mercilessly shit on by adults twice her senior which made her more cold and feel less sincere. Not to mention the many comments about her body and how people make fun of her potential ED she possibly suffers from PD48 Yujin is incredibly aware abt what the public says abt them. “Ive doesn’t have respect” then the next time I’ve makes an appearance, Yujin is practically snapping her back to do 90 degree bows. “Ive is disrespectful!” When Yujin accidentally interrupted Wonyoung, she apologized and looked possibly scared staring out at the fans. Leeseo… I just feel bad for the kid. She’s been practicing since she was 12 to be an idol only for adults to mercilessly shit on her dream and send her death threats. She’s getting the Iz*one Wonyoung treatment from netizens and it’s so upsetting to see history repeat itself. When it comes to Liz and Rei, it’s ALL about their weight. Constantly body shamed… When it comes to personality, they’re loved but are also absolutely dragged through the mud when it comes to their healthy weight looking like ‘fat’. Also, many antis use Rei and Liz to hate on Wonyoung and Leeseo (even though Rei and Liz literally adore them) Gaeul really just needs good stans and is also the most overlooked member. A good portion of her stans have the same issue when it comes to a good portion of Liz and Rei stans. They don’t recognize her talent or even her ability to dance and hyper focus on the ‘airport incident’ that K-pop news dramatized to death.
I totally agree lesserafim our my ults and some fearnots are ridiculous on tiktok, its crazy to see how many people switched up, just last year yall was saying how “ IVE was the best rookie girl group “ “ they deserve everything they received ” all “ they have is good songs “ 9 months ago yall was saying how LOVE DIVE was song of the year, how it was so good but when it actually won song of the year, the same people who was saying how good it was, was saying how they didnt deserve it and another group was robbed
People say that the hate from Wonyoung comes from favoritism but these same people don't give a rat's ass about the other member's promotions. Yujin has 13+ endorsements including big brands like Tiffany. Rei is the first 4th gen idol to be on the cover of Vogue Japan, plus her multiple variety appearances and her peach tree brand deals, 1K literally gave Gaeul her own variety show, she has several maize spreads and recently been promoted much more as a dancer. Liz also has multiple variety appearances that all reach over 1mil views. Leeseo is the member with the least promotion but still has multiple magazine spreads under her belt. It's not like these solo activities aren't promoted, if they weren't millions of views wouldn't be there. It's extremely frustrating to dives that international kpop stans often ignore the other members for something minuscule Wonyoung does. For instance, Gaeul, Yujin and Leeseos solo for KBS Gayo was completely overshadowed by nondives complaining about what Wonyoung was wearing. Mind you the girl was hosting the entire show, no matter how much Dives scream about respecting and paying attention to the other members it doesn't matter. Believe it or not a lot of us don't care that Wonyoung is the most popular because she's way more popular than most 4th gen idols.
yep people don't realise that the non-iz ive members are doing REALLY well for rookie idols, but they choose to conveniently ignore this for the sake of making them look like victims.
I disagree with the other members being untouchable when it comes on to hate. Liz and Rei got tons of hate because of their weight. Leeseo gets tons of hate because she acts cute (and most idols who are older than her over do it but gets praise). The difference is Wonyoung is an easy target and anything she does gets hate.
I agree, I don’t think any idols are untouchable to hate. But I’ve only ever seen Liz’s weight brought up like maybe twice in the last couple of months. Not saying it doesn’t happen just saying it happens much much less.
if you want to criticize kakao and starship for ruining an innocent girl's life to further their own interests, that's fine. the ive hate train goes beyond legitimate criticisms of shady business practices they had nothing to do with - like, tell me why we care about how wonyoung eats a strawberry? or why we're throwing so much vitriol at leeseo who is barely sixteen? i get the feeling lsf stans in particular are upset about garam but they should absolutely not be directing that energy at the ive girls
When people sees a handsome, confident and charismatic male idol they're gonna support him. But if it was a Beautiful, confident and attractive female idol they're gonna either support her ir hate on her just like wonyoung and Jennie
A significant factor that makes even ive fans themselves dislike wonyoung is how they feel their solopicks get mistreated cause wonyoung gets all the promotions, and the strawberry moon incident is yet another nail in the coffin i must say.
I think the company does play a significant factor in the amount of hate she recieves. They give her the most promotional opportunities and at times it overshadows the rest of the members. She can't really help this either which makes it even worse.
I can understand frustration seeing her seemingly "overshadow" other members or getting more brand deals. That doesn't mean that the other members get "mistreated" though. We don't know why things are the way they are. Maybe there are very valid reasons and maybe the other members are totally fine with Wonyoung and her role in the group. We should never forget, that we're not in the room when those decisions are made and that we only have assumptions and our own personal biases. So we should be careful with allegations like mistreatment, especially as long as the "mistreated" members never expressed any dissatisfaction themselves.
This kind of thing has always existed in kpop. The featured member brings a lot of attention to the group and helps them survive longer. It’s kind of a double edged sword, but ultimately good for the group
@@Taejiu I think one of the reasons the IVE hate stands out so much is because DIVE is starting to have a lot of the same issues BLINKS have, and I think that’s pretty significantly a managing/company’s issue, like it was for BLINKS
With all due respect that is not true at all, Wonyoung is not the only member promoted, that is something haters push, not actual IVE stans. Rei recently got a SOLO cover for Vogue Japan which is literally INSANE, Gaeul had a cover recently too and became a fashion brand ambassador, Yujin became the face of Clio makeup which is one of the biggest makeup brands in korea, all this only at the end of December. And that’s to name a few of the things the girls did all year. All members get brand deals and publication deals, us dives know that because we keep up with their accomplisments. Don’t get swayed away by the hate train and fact check. Also, this is a business, if Wonyoung gets more deals is because she is the most popular member, something the PUBLIC made her. Starship is an agency, they make the connection between artists and the publications/brands that CHOOSE THEMSELVES to work with the girls. The girls are offered these opportunities, most of the time it is not Starship going around doing phone calls. This is how business works, they want Wonyoung more because she has a bigger reach. It’s not that Starship does not want to promote the girls ( which already are VERY well promoted ), it’s that they are giving them the offers that come about. If anybody wants Liz or Gaeul to be more popular than make her more popular, the public has the power. People can’t be upset at Wonyoung for essentially working and taking the opportunities that are given to her or blame Starship for allowing her when they are the ones that brought her to that level. It’s ridiculous. Sorry for the long comment but I just wanted to say that the ‘wonyoung is more promoted’ thing is untrue.
I feel so bad for Wonyoung and Leeseo. They’re kids, and the real world is scary. They’re not enjoying their teenage years because they sacrificed themselves to idol life. Imagine the pressure, the criticism, the misogyny. It’s really brutal, especially for their mental health. Off topic, but this reminds me of Garam (from Lesserafim) and her scandal. Kpop fans KNOW that she’s a child and that fiasco took a toll on her mental health. I’m so worried about these kids.
I saw a lot of those videos about the strawberry moon performance and the comments really made me worried. The hate got a lot worse because the antis found a weak point to attack. I hope this ends soon cause the same people attacking Ive for lipsyncing are the same people who will excuse their faves for lipsyncing.
Stanning groups like blackpink, aespa, IVE etc. can be so exhausting because of immature and vicious haters. Btw, I'm sorry you had to go through bullying as well, you're really brave to share your experience with the audience. I was bullied when I was 5-12 and I can confirm that this shit has a huge effect on your self-esteem and it's extremely hard to gain back your confidence and ability to trust people (been working on that for the last few years). Anyways ,thank you for the video, it was great!
They are similar, just waiting for the IVE international promotion/popularity increase and they are basically BlackPink of 4th gen, not even joking. Also, both groups can sing live while being stable
In Korea, most of the K-pop fandom is the female fandom. Male fans don't really like boy groups. They listen to pop music, girl groups, Korean indie music, or hip-hop. Currently, in Korea, only about 1 or 2 aces of boy groups survive in each agency. And these boy groups are organized by the desires of female core fans. . Girl groups, on the other hand, are attracting attention from everybody. Therefore, it receives a lot of competition and attention. The characteristic of Korea's female fandom is that they project their identity to their favorite groups. They want the girl group to realize their ideals. For example, extreme feminism is in vogue in Korea in the 2010s. Most girl groups have become girl crush concepts. The lyrics, sound, and dance style all contain strong female ideals. If they don't like it at all, they will be hated. And they do everything they can to make their group stronger than others. This is what has been happening in Korea for years now. be hated for minor mistakes, suspicions, and incidents Perhaps few people are aware of this situation. Because this is an area that cannot be touched by Korean K-pop fandom. What's interesting is that the metaphor for the malicious commenter at the end of the omg music video of Newjeans made a big controversy. That's how powerful the 'That' community is in Korea. so I was surprised by Hyve's courage.
True. Korean Twitter, some community... There are certainly a lot of problems with The reason why hybe is great is that they are not conscious of Korean fandom at all now.
NJ songs are good, but many people already know that NJ's success is largely due to BTS fans, many of whom are stan hybe . Views of YT are less because of fans. Most of BTS is on Spotify. And they're doing the same old habits when NJ succeeds. They started pushing other groups and raising it to 1gen4.
Yep. Honestly, men's reactions are good, bad, or pretty, or nah... That's it. There's actually another place where rumors are consumed persistently. This is a fact that only people who really know the situation in Korea know. Korea's cultural industry is mostly tailored to women's tastes, except for artistic areas such as movies and indie culture. The reason why NJ is a sensation in Korea is that the music and concept are great, but it is something that everyone can enjoy and wanted.
It’s terrible what wonyoung needs to go through. As a dive who keeps up with their messages and other content. Wonyoung has sent messages how she hopes for a good day and how she won’t pay attention to the hate because she has her fans. It really shows how much wonyoung cares about her fans and tries to maintain a strong mindset, but the hate still has an affect on her. I feel that if people actually tried watching ives content and some of wonyoung’s vlogs. They can see a new side to her;-;
The rivalry of Le Sserafim and IVE was manifesting over the start of this year, I want them to push each other more to reach the top cause I love to see Iz*one's girls winning but certainly dread that anyday someone will start a fanwar,I think both the fandoms are quite good now as I think all focus is on New Jeans,I hope dives and fearnots don't go toxic on each other cause no wiz*one will bear seeing these girls not looking into each other in eyes in award shows or music shows interactions.
Imagine cancelling Idol's whole careers for bullying that may or may not have happened years ago, and somehow being ok with bullying Idols and harassing them, and sometimes even threatening them online. The double standard...
It’s really sad how much of the video had to be about wonyoung getting hate for literally breathing, and leeseo for acting her age and doing what her position requires, like ya’ll really need to leave them alone! 😢 Gaeul stans remind me of Bahiyyih stans, please focus on supporting your fav idols instead hurting others! Like how do you think Gaeul would react to you bullying one of her best friends?? I hope all of ive can still flourish in this rough industry. We’ll continue to support the girls against toxic keyboard warriors and hopefully the members will be able to keep their mental and physical health in tact throughout the course of their careers. (New sub btw❤)
jealousy can be pretty ugly, they think IVE is not as talented as there faves, and that’s why they get mad when IVE is more successful, criticism is good to a certain extend, but people need to remind them self that this are children.
I've (lol) been predicting this shit happening for a while now. And people thought I was being dramatic. I wrote this in an Aespa content video: " I am not saying in this comment section. I probably shouldn't have brought this up. I am not even an IVE stan. This should have been a happy moment. I just realised a shift in the K-pop scene yet again. Kpop fans tend to love having their villains or groups that they hate the most. In 2018, it was Blackpink and Jennie. In 2019, it was Momoland and Nancy/Jooe. In 2020, it was AOA Jimin. In 2021, it was Aespa. And in 2022 it was Nmixx, but now it is starting to be IVE. They are probably going to have a horrible year in 2023 in terms of hate. And each time this situation happen, the last group/villain stopped getting an insane amount of hate and even gain support from the people who used to shit on them. It a very fuck up situation and I guess I wanted to talk about it (?)." I wrote that comment about 3 weeks ago and have been feeling this way since the Wonyoung vs Gaeul drama happened. Since I am not a Dive, I have never really paid attention to IVE stans. So it was the first time I realized how broken their fandom is. For an outsider perspective, it seems like most Dive are Ot5 and dislike Wonyoung. Which makes Wonyoung fans very pissed and become solo stan. And then Gaeul fans are highkey becoming like Jisoo solo stan (if you know, you know). And Liz fans are becoming resentful against Starship and Wonyoung. Anyways, it's a big mess, and this is cultivating the perfect climat for anti to attack the group. The same shit happened with Blackpink and Jennie. With Momoland and Nancy/Jooe. With AOA and Jimin. Aespa with Winter/Giselle. And now with IVE and Wonyoung. The only thing I didn't see coming was Leeseo also being hated. But, to be fair, this isn't also surprising. She seems to have the least solo stans. She is an easy target for the people to hate. And since she and Wonyoung have the same performance style, it was only a matter of time. This villain thing is a sad reality about K-pop that has been happening even before 2018. I can think of many groups that went through this, like Twice, T-ara, SNSD and Sulli etc. But I am glad people are finally picking up the patterns and are talking about it. I just hope that this will happen less and less. But I don't think it will. Anytime soon, at least.
It is soooo sad especially for OT6 dives like me. To see what this young fandom has become is really disappointing. But honestly I think (or at least hope) that as soon as the hate goes down a bit real dives will grow together more. If you are on the right side of the fandom it is an amazing place and I would love more people to experience that. Another thing that makes me really sad is the rivaly between fearnots and dives which is really sad since we could and should support eachother
First time i hear ot5 stans, wonyoung actially gets hate bcoz of the favoritism from starship like giving her better clothes like jennie and also she half ass some performance coz she dont want her hair to get ruined coz she is the mc, but im sure the hate will be gone later since wonyoung is not a instagram thot like jennie tbh, dont even compare them, wy is just doing her job so sometimes she act too much but she only does that on stage, offstage if u can see her behind the stage she is rly wholesome and thats what haters dont see bcoz they didnt watch ive/izone vlogs, wonyoung is rly sweet so there is a duality on her, she is fierce on stage thats why haters are mad coz she is the most popular idol right now, most haters come from other group fans too so annoying they are not from dive fandom. Gaeul stans are rly loud in youtube too which is more annoying than anything wonyoung did, wonyoung girlie is just soo popular everyone is shaking by her just breathing
Idk in your fyp, but in one vid, I once saw a comment that this user is waiting for Wonyoung to get end up like Go Hara and Sulli. I was just so shock seeing that comment
I think we need to start a conversation on who “deserves success” cause I see a lot of people using their “lack of talent” to say they don’t deserve fame as if every group at the top can only be perfect all rounders when that is rare in itself. There’s always gonna be someone better so I feel that’s invalid hell look at the top 3rd gen groups (bts & blackpink) they both lack in areas I’m not gonna say cause you know and they still sit at the top. It’s not about most talented it’s a game of luck and sometimes hard work/strategy, just cause your top picks didn’t end up on the right end of that rainbow doesn’t mean u tear others down. It is what it is just live with it, just let these people make that money cause we all know we wish we could.
Man, i am such a lazy person that when i hate someone i won't bother to do anything about them. Why waste my time to even cyber bullying someone that i hate??? But those haters, their hates just out of this world, illogical... I am speechless on how far they goes with their hate.... They become a Big Bully. But more that anything i hope IVE keep moving on and be better... Specially Wony and Hyunseo.
I don't understand how people can be so damn hateful like ofc I also have opinions but it's not like I'll write hate or target someone. You can write nice criticism. Ive had been such a target and I don't understand why. Yeah there are some things I don't like as well like I think it's a bit sad to see someone lipsync while sitting down but *many* idols and groups have done that so why are people only mentioning Ive? One thing I really appreciate with Ive is that they sing live very often and sound stable and probably also thanks to their choreo but I was bullied too and I don't understand how people can act like this and honestly look at the Garam case too... Without even knowing if it was true people sent extreme hate to a CHILD and then now they're being all soft and want her back like they weren't the one who sent hate to her which could have made her mental health really bad. Even if someone does something wrong, don't send extreme hate. Periodt.
Ppl act as if lsf is leagues above ive talent wise but they are exactly the same. While opera and ballet are great talents, they don't automatically make the person the best in their field. As we saw, kazuha struggled in dances outside of her specialty.
Lol saying that ls is at the same level of skills as IVE is like dua Lipa is at the same level of singing as Mariah Carey, please be fk serious. To say something like that you truly know nothing about singing, dancing or art performing. Put some respect on these craft.
And I’m flabbergasted at the people who are hyping Yunjin being an “opera singer” when she’s nothing of the sort and this is coming from someone who’s actually studied the field
i always imagine wonyoung and leeseo getting told by the company and the people training them to act cute (especially leeseo since shes the maknae and ppl expect maknaes to act cutely) so they probably feel a lot of pressure to always be pretty and cute, so they do their best and try their hardest, do to their job…. and then they get hated for exactly that. I imagine that must be very frustrating for them.
Liz gets b*llied too for her weight but I agree with you, thank you for your video and I am so so sorry you had to experience this when you were a teenager
we may not be seeing the hate on liz cuz we're international stans, but I've seen knetz bullying her for her weight gain. it's honestly so upsetting to see her confidence diminishing because of the hate for something she can't control over. she's so young, her body is still growing of course she's gonna gain weight and that's a normal human thing that doesn't deserve to be made fun of
One of my favorite stages this year was the "Shinee-Love like Oxygen" cover by eunchae and leeseo among others I generally love collabs like that because they show that the idols themselves can work with each other, so why can't we as fans work with each other...
Personally I believe this is actually Media Play even hate brings them a lot of attention and brings more people bringing sympathy to them, which can also bring more fan's, I find it sad especially that Dives drag other groups involved like Lesserafim, in the performance when sitting down Lesserafim fancams prove u can hear their actual voices along side the backtrack
I honestly feel bad for IVE but again this happened with Jennie as u said but Jennie brought bad press which led to Media Play by YGE which makes Blinks increase
Even tho the bad press was media play to begin with, same thing with V from BTS, HYBE didn't hesitate to denied the rumor which brings BlackPink instant attraction bcos of how Famous V is.
No disrespect to any of Jennie or Wonyoung but Kakao and Starship is no diff with YGE and BlackPink, Media Play to bring attention to the group whether it is bad press or good
I mean IVE is the 4th Gen BlackPink, they may have a few good songs that sound similar in future but they may end up Overhyped like BlackPink is now Again no disrespect to them
It’s disappointing to see Le Sserafim fans act like this but then I remember that these are the same people that bullied a 16 year old out of the group based on overly exaggerated allegations. Embarssing. As someone who enjoys HYBE artists there is a pattern of toxicity some of the fandoms in that company display. Which is not surprising considering the fandoms mesh into each other.
@@mylovechoerry2233 Did I say they were the only ones? I just said that they bullied her. Which they absolutely did, and probably the most because they were unreasonably upset with her and accused her or ruining things for the other girls. Not to mention the in person silence from the crowd she would experience during her short period of promotions. The fandom did her dirty the most, so don’t even try and avoid blame.
ngl it's disappointing to know that fearnots bully leesseo for acting like her age.... how can you act like that when you stan a group that has yunjin and sakura in it. two mental health advocates. furthermore, she's the same age as eunchae. what a shame.
It seems ridiculous! First it was kids bullying other kids then it was adults bullying other adults but now have full grown people become such __ that they are bullying kids?! For basically nothing
tbh dives arent complaining all the time abt the line distribution, center time, brand deals, solo promos, etc because we KNOW and ACCEPT that wonyoung and yujin have been an idol for four years and the rest are just rookies. it's always the casual listeners speaking over us as if they know everything the members do. they constantly complain abt liz and gaeul being hidden when both just have plenty of solo promos that they don't even bother checking. no sane gaeul stan complained abt the wonyoung and gaeul airport drama. genuine liz stans arent cursing wonyoung for getting three repetitive choruses in after like and one verse.
I think the reason why just wony and leesso gets hate is cuz they are not best at something for eg Liz being best in vocal, rei being best in rap geyul being best in dance yujin is an ace!(in this group) So hater sees this as an opportunity. They tend to ignore the fact they fits the concept the best " pretty popular popstar kind of vibe" they have best sp in the group (according to the concept) but you know for them it's not talent it's just being pretty 🤦♀️ (This comment is not related to lip sync controversy so don't bring it here as a shield to justify all the hate you give them)
I thought it was crazy how wonyoung was being bullied for being what people would call a "ideal kpop idol". She gets hated on because of her weight or her personality or even just the way she acts around anybody the list goes on. This really shows that avoiding hate in the kpop industry is impossible and even an ideal idol wouldn't never be considered "good enough".
For me, most of my criticisms are for Starship. They’ve proven time and time again to be very vain and even fraudulent for the sake of success. However, I’m not going to pin the corruption of a multi-million dollar entertainment company on a group of teenage girls…I feel like the misdirect of hate is one of the main reasons why IVE catches the heat most of the time. It’s an unfortunate situation 🤷🏾♀️
i think the only criticism of ive that is valid is the lip synching one, but even then not to the extent it got blown up to. yeah, a daesang winning group and rookies of the year should be able to deliver more. groups who don't hold those accolades deliver more consistently. i also think wonyoungs situation is only 75% similar to jennie's case especially in regards to the "laziness". of course a lot of things overlap but with jennie i feel like it was fueled by everyone seeing what her peak condition was and to have it deteriorate so suddenly with zero explanation from her or the company (health related issues). at the end of the day idols should be able to give good performances, whether thats amazing vocals or synchronized dances or killer stage presence and jennie was not following that part of her job description for (at the time) seemingly no reason. wonyoungs hate is much more deeply rooted in misogyny and insecurity. she is literally the pinnacle of korean beauty and she gets called a "pick me" simply for the fact that a lot of men (and probably these fangirls' faves) find her very attractive and would love to have the honor of being with her. she's seen as an attention hog for simply existing because everyone is watching her every move. she's younger than most fangirls, way prettier, richer, and living a better life and she hasn't really had an excess of struggles that make her an underdog people can root for (twice's jihyo and jeongyeon, rv's joy and wendy, itzy's chaeryeong) she started at the top and only goes higher and i think people can't stand that so they feel like they have to knock her down and make her "earn" her happy ending
Good video! Thank you! For me people that hate on idols are not "fans" or "stans" they're just toxic idiots that use K-Pop as an excuse to provoke and bully others. Every fandom has those and popularity (of a group or idol) attracts them because of the bigger attention they can get for their behavior. But we really should stop accepting them as "fans" (or part of a fandom) and call them what they really are "bullies". I hope (but somehow doubt) that labels take good care of their idols and their mental and physical wellbeing, especially if they're still children, which nowadays seems to be even more normalized than in the past. Of course nobody is immune to criticism and opinions differ but is has to stay constructive and not get personal. If we criticize a company or an idol we should always remind ourselves, that Idols are just humans and that we don't know s**t. Nobody of us is in their place and nobody is in the room when all those decisions are made. We just have are our personal biases, assumptions and external observations to go off. Getting offended or "protecting" somebody else from "mistreatment" that never expressed any criticism themselves is a special kind of st***d. For example: Wonyoung getting criticized because of allegations of favoritism or because of her lip-syncing of Strawberry Moon. Sure, we can express our disappointment that it was not live. But we should not forget that there might be very valid reasons that we're not aware of why she had to lip-sync . And for here role in the group: Maybe the other members are completely fine with that role for Wonyoung in the group or even prefer it that way. We just don't know. So please, let's also stop whining about "mistreatment" or getting offended for somebody else based on our vague assumptions and personal biases. That's part of the problem.
K-pop can be exhausting, especially mentally because of never-ending wars. The reflection of what is happening is just getting worse through the years. More noise=more profit to the company and the country overall. To be honest, this won't stop, but the thing we can change is only ourselves. How we see K-pop will either help or worsen our lives. It's a Yin and Yang. But we’ll not stop voicing what to change because we never knew, someday we can.
Also regarding the lip-sync situation, it is okay to be against it, but please don’t send hate to the girls because rest assure they were most likely NOT the ones in charge of the decision to not sing live. Those decisions are made by the company or broadcasting station. Also, please take in account other factors too, the girls prerecorded all their performances for that night right after the AAAs because on the day of the show they had to fly to Japan to perform there too. Who knows how much time they had to prepare considering the rush. Some of us dives are understanding of the situation and choose to not care too much because we know the girls can sing decently, they’ve shown it before. Also I wonder why so many people care so much if they don’t even stan them, it’s weird to go around and criticize groups you don’t know. I for one don’t do that. Leave it to dives to see if they care or not and go support your group. People act like it’s the end of the world.
I love Ive and my biais is Wonyoung! Wonyoung retired from a MC role on music show i think because of all the haters who bullied since last year for doing nothing wrong, for eating just a strawberry with 2 hands! Wonyoung is the most popular 4th gen visual It girl who were hated for nothong wrong like Jennie of Blackpink
Honestly I think Ive doesnt lack in talents, the dancing and stage presence always fits their concept. Liz is an amazing vocalist, Rei has amazing rap skills, Gaeul is a fantastic dancer, Yujin is the perfect leader if you look up their training and Wonyoung has great stage prensence and full control of her face expressions. As an Ive stan... it hurts my heart so much that the girls get so much hate for literally nothing :( Wonyoung prooved already that she can sing and dance, we have seen her on produce48 (please look up how hard those shows are! and how mentally draining) ._. we have heard her encore stages... and still she gets bullied for "lip sync"
The reason I think they are easy to hate coz in defense they don't have that much skill under there belt compared to other 4th gen, yujin and liz has exceptional vocal talent other than them skill wize not much can be said. Ive shot to stardom was very quick which starship hasn't seen in the long time so it might be new for them to handle such a young group at the peak of the popularity, if they would have taken a bit of time then the company could also have a proper blueprint to promote each member. I always think did they become too big too soon..? The bigger you get the more eyeballs you catch as well as more mouth, so at this moment they have to be ready, that company can counter these things.
Hate is not rational. It is emotional. And haters aim at the easy target (not the right one if such thing exists). As you said, it comes mostly from insecurities directed against a competing group. When you have no major insecurities, you just don't care. Hate is bad for health. So going from hating competitors to supporting the loved band would be the best rewarding move.
Female kpop stans created a stupid reason just to hate on gorgeous beautiful popular female members like Jennie in 2022 (created a rumor on her about dating a BTS member, created a stupid reason to get her bashed, criticized, bullied her for nothing wrong), same with Wonyoung (dig her nationality etc bc just jealousy of Wonyoung being too perfect gorgeous and popular so they tried to dig to find something to bullied her)
For Wonyoung, the hypocrisy of kpop stans who love her aegyo when she was the maknae in Izone but now she grew up in Ive and became such a popular member who fits korean beauty standards, she's gorgeous and popular now, has a lot of brands deals and when Wonyoung eats in a cute way, she get bashed now
I hate watching people be so mean for no reason I was also bullied so at times it can be triggering I know it’s not realistic but I wish people could be kinder to each other.
Starship is also a easy target because Starship isn't a big 4 company and immature kpop fans who follow and stans only groups from big 4 company and thought the kpop groups from others medium and small company didn't deserve their sucess LOL the hypocrisy! Baby Monster from YG didn't debuted but has a lot of followers bc of big company privilege
Great message but you shouldn't have mentioned names of the other rookies IVE is being compared to, especially lesserafim. That rivalry was pointless and you mentioning them was just not called for. You're not calling out the rivalry but adding fuel to the fire I wish you'd make a video on why these two groups shouldn't be arguing anymore since you decided to point it out. Also, if you're talking about people who were comparing Eunchae to Leeseo, it wasn't just fearnots because not every fan of Eunchae is a fearnot. Some just think she's cute although the hate on Leeseo was pretty dumb and yes some fearnots were included but I'm sick and tired of IVE haters hiding behind fearnots because to be honest, many fearnots are wizones! Other rookie and non rookie fandoms hate on IVE too and you're only calling fearnots out cause obviously, you're also comparing lesserafim to IVE naturally Eunchae and Leeseo are both my biases and I just wished people stopped comparing them and their groups
You HAVE to bring up people comparing others because that's the root of the issue. If you don't bring up why people hate certain idols, than what's the point of discussing the subject. There is no hiding anything here. I also never said it was just Eunchae stans that attack Leeseo, I just called them out specifically. Respectfully, I don't think I'm adding any fuel to the fire by bringing up Le Sserafim.
Ur right, some people hating IVE pretending they are fearnots or by bringing up lesserafim n comparing even if they don't stan them just to stir up fanwars it's really annoying!!
@@Taejiu You seem to have no idea how protective Dives can be. Bfr, although they do have reason, they are a bit extremely overprotective. I don't have a problem with your video. I'm just stating a fact
@@green360z Every fandom is toxic, Dives were, and still will be toxic after watching this video. It's just how fandoms work, I only report what's happening.
@@Taejiu mentioning lessarafim was so UNCALLED for. i have never seen fearnots on lsfm videos bringing up ives maknae. it was mostly kpop stans who uses lsf as token gg.
Humans reflect on and off of others. It can be both positive reflection and negative reflection. The positive reflection is what parents do to their kids, especially if the child is very pretty, smart, etc. (e.g. "She's as pretty as her mom", "He's hardworking like his dad", "My son/daughter is just like me, I was a great student too", etc.) Negative reflection is when we see people who have the same negative traits like us. We see someone who's lazy/rude/has bad taste/etc., we comment on it trying to separate ourselves from it ("Hey look at that guy wearing a Hitler T-shirt, I could never" meanwhile, you wore Stallin's tee as a 11yo coz you didn't know or didn't care, shit example I know). Lastly, we have "comfort" hate, which is what most haters and bullies do, they comfort themselves by hating on others. Whenever people see someone having or embodying something they themselves don't it makes them angry, jealous, resentful,... That's when hate strikes so that the person feels comfortable about themselves again. What's truly sad is how people choose to hurt others so that they could feel better, when there are so many other ways to gain self-esteem and self-love. 🤦♀️
Exactly! this is what I've been thinking all this time!! And tbh international fans act all open minded, mature and nice but they are the main bullies bullying ive😮 I haven't touched kpop in a long time when I suddenly came back here all i saw was hate shorts on this new group 😐
There's also the conspiracy theory that Wonyoung is ethnically Chinese but concealing it due to racist discrimination. It's actually a conspiracy that makes a lot of sense. They used a Chinese name for Wonyoung without any explanation in the beginning and Wonyoung even looks more Chinese than Korean with those longer legs, taller height, thinner body, and certain facial features.
It always baffles me how whenever someone uploads a video about the IVE/wonyoung hate you always get a few comments going "but actually...". There's no way you can justify the kind of hate they get. It's even gone beyond the point of so-called constructive criticism.
Ngl from a non kpop fans perspective , they will think ive members did some illegal /racist/ sexist stuff but if they knew the reason for hate, they will laugh on our face.
Ive’s lipsyncing and Jennie’s dancing are for sure valid issues, but it’s so so wrong to respond to that with straight up hate. Criticism is totally fair but to push negativity along with that, and in most cases to just hate and not fairly criticize, is yeah. Wrong
I will said a lot of hate to 4th gen girl groups is because they are starting to replace 3rd gen groups. In the case of girls it is more bloody because we know it is not about music but because the fans are changing idols because of their age. They go for the new young girl on the scene. In men is because military but most of them will still have a couple of years if they want but girls as soon as they reach 30 are called old for be an idol. Women are always hold over higher standards than men. But women when debut is becoming more and more clear that they are not being choosen by their talent but because how they look and that push a lot of red buttons. Yes, they managed to reach the final selection so they are talented but we know a lot of hate that BP received come from the fact that they were used to replace a perfectly successful group 2NE1 for a more pretty version. Even we know it was the same with the new group of SoMu, they needed a more cool and younger and more appeling group that Hybe could market as the new BP (by the own CEO of Hybe words) so the old group could go werever they want. IVE is not replacing anyone inside their own agency but they did it with Twice that last year have seen a lot of less recognition because all this new groups. Another fact I think it comes with new groups are being viral too fast without really first proof themselves. IVE was the biggest winner and the one to proclame that the 4th generation is here and it is ready to rule over K-Pop in the last awards ceremonies and their stage was as boring as they could make it. They did not seemed to sing live and they are singers, they are performers and I still feel sleep during their performance. That is the standard it seems to be for 4th gen girls groups, the only stage I found interesting was Itzy and J-Hope (but he is 3rd gen) and I do not remember a single one beside Stray Kids and I am almost sure I am rembering the one of 2021. I think that is part of the reason of the hate a lot of girls groups are acting more like influencers than really musical performers and I blame BP for bring that to K-Pop. Twice went trought the same but Nayeon and Jihyo managed to show they could sing and Momo showed she could dance and Twice prooved themselves after some time. NMIXX already did it, Aespa did it, Itzy did it. IVE still need to proove themselves in the music sphere. Last, I think it is the fact that maybe IVE's agency used Woonyoung image to much in order to promote the group making to be seen as if she was holding some kind of privilege in the group and people dislike that. No one likes the feel to know you are giving pretty privilege to someone only because her pretty face and you are leaving the rest of hard working members besides because they are not as "pretty" or famous. I think Woonyoung did her best to promote IVE and her fans must be proud of her an IVE's fans must be thankful to her for that. All that work put on question another "it girl": Jenni and Blink maybe over reacted. I hope they manage to proof themselves with their album and can leave this stage of hate behind them.
There is a lot of sexism, misogyny, and pick mes (I don’t know the proper word for it) in K-pop community. Which is why it’s mainly girl groups getting targeted.
The next girl group that’s going to be the next victim is Baby Monster Because think about it most likely Blinks are going to support them once they debut. & there going to break so many records & be internationally famous like how BLACKPINK was & Baby Monster will steal the title for Monster Rookies & take over 4th generation of K*POP
have you heard of aespa aepsa is the punching pag aswell as IVE. Giselle got tons of hate for bad dancing & all of aespa gets hate for 0 reasons and i can name so many lies and rumors that have been msde up about aespa to destroy them. snd then on top of that the kpop fandoms either hate aespa or completely act like they dont exist
As I neverland I saw parts of the hate coming from toxic newjeans, le sserafim and gidle fans being frustrated of Ive winning most big awards for rookie groups and gg. I get being frustrated when your favourite group is often nominated, then constantly losing to a specific other group and on top of all that getting tons of pity awards instead - which is what happened to gidle - but that´s no reason throwing hate on said group. The blame should be taken to the companies for making an overcompetitive system. They promote kpop as such while also making people get attached to certain idols/groups. This is a huge factor in creating frustrations that lead into fan wars, hate and cyber bullying. And guess what? Cyber bullying is mentally hurting idols and in worst case we get another Sulli situation sometime in the future. The way award shows are held feed into that: They give group nominations way before announcing the winners where the winning groups are propably already clear to the judges (based on the data and their votes) *while* not givng a second or third place. This gives fans a false hope which naturally leads into frustration if another group is constantly taking the cake. Pity awards are the extra slap in the face of the fans and the groups and shouldn´t be given. And then we get the cycle that leasds to cyber bullying certain groups. Side note: Fan votes shouldn´t be made for an award show since the nominated songs already have proven to gain gp popularity (except the true fan favourite awards).
I think this video dismisses a lot of things that did happen eg jennie being "lazy" on just one dance practice (it was a whole compilation so people saw the issue) and starship essentially putting a target on wony and leeseo's back with the blatant favoritism on wony (which I do hate cause that's actually out of her control why should she receive hate for it) and starship uploading that one video of leeseo not helping staff and playing it off as a joke (I've seen a couple of people say they dont like leeseo because of this, and I have to admit I also did judge her character silently for ONE thing she did but thats on me, and I'll be trying to not do that anymore) But I do agree that there's really no point in hating on these girls who have a LOT of room for growth. Pointing out this kind of stuff is also really hard cause people will jump them for the smallest things and blow things out of proportion for their own entertainment. I may have my reservations about them but I still think they do deseve better than this.
i stan le sserafim and not ive i find it ridiculous seeing other fearnots going UwU over eunchae and then hate on leeseo for doing the same thing eunchae did they're only 9 months apart in terms of age it's pretty stupid how one of them can act her age but the other is "too immature" when she acts her age i'm not saying eunchae being able to act her age without getting hate is bad bc it's actually a really good thing i'm saying y'all are hypocrites for not letting leeseo do the same thing the poor girl is only 15 ofc she's going to act immature and do cutesy maknae things
starship knows what works for ive and that’s why even though the girls may not be the best rappers or singers in the 4th gen people don’t like how ive is more famous than their faves because in their eyes the most talented should be the most successful
These people specially female kpop stans (the majority of kpop stans in South Korea are young women, they are normal, wants to be popular and beautiful) that's why being a female kpop idols specially a gorgeous beautiful popular member in a kpop girlsband. Insecure female kpop stans created rumors about Jennie & Wonyoung bc of Jealousy and their insecurity!
Imagine having time to ‘hate’ on a group of kids trying to pursue their dreams
exactly!! and if you don’t like them keep it to yourself, don’t waste your time with writing comments or by making thousands of shorts...
That's why kids should stay out of the industry.
@@alanaatkinson551 Even if they were adults it's not right.
@@babyanie4673 True. It's wrong either way. The point I'm trying to make is that kids should not go through what adult are having a hard time going through.
@@alanaatkinson551exactly bro, K-pop Stans are a huge factor in why kids should not debut. Like they hate for no reason! Literally! Hypocritical Mfs should be the new definition of A netizen.
OMG thank you for this. I'm stanning both IVE and Le Seraffim. I legit don't understand the rivalry and hate from the fans of these groups. The IVE hate is stupid af.
Same
Tbh that rivalry has sort of been brewing since Produce 48 days because of the Wonyoung VS Sakura solo stan feud, so it would make sense that it would evolve to IVE VS Le Seraphim
Ditto
@@k_n_c_y despite Kkura and Wonyoung being good friends? Wonyoung literally looked up to Sakura like a Maknae does
@@あきら-v7h 😭 Don’t ask me, ask the solo stans who are fighting to this day!
Kpop stans are so hypocritical. They will praise their idol for saying something along the lines of "bullying is wrong, idols are people too," but then turn around and do the exact thing their fave told them not to do. It's ridiculous. Not to mention kpop stans LOVE negging idols. When an idol is an underdog, they will praise and love them, but once that idol breaks through, suddenly everyone is telling them they're not good enough for whatever achievement they reach.
What I saw until I got used to it . when blackpink is successful BTS fans will say YG pays for success😂😂😂😂From what I saw, YG should own this world because they pay a lot.
🤣🤣
Smh
Facs.. 🙂:) I stan multi fandoms not only kpop and whenever I come back to kpop after watching some other entertainment industry I feel like I've been Toxicated🤕 the environment turns so painful from the other fandom to the kpop fandom 😬
ofc their hypocrites
I don’t think people talk enough about how starship, their own company whose suppose to protect them, has set those girls up multiple times and added fuel to the fire
Exactly my point
Thank you! Everyone seems to brush over the fact that Starship is fanning the flames.
Look at the incident of them attending an award show and Wonyoung’s outfit being made to stand out. You can’t tell me the decision wasn’t intentional because they wanted media buzz
Starship doesn’t care about the group because to them bad press is still press, even if it’s at the expense of such young talent.
Hoping they'll get through all of these challenges.
Being a WIZ*ONE, it's sad seeing some IVE and LE SERRAFIM fans go at each other. Like brothers and sisters, like can we just get along, some of their group members get along with each other, why can't we.
All those teen Kpop fans that are mad at a 15 year old being babied, are the same ones babying grown men and women NONSTOP. Seriously why is that so common and normalised?
It's scary to think about what will happen to future K-pop stans.
They said every time *it was a joke,* but they didn't realize they were normalizing it, maybe not for them personally but we don't know for others.
The only thing I hate about IVE is how Starship handles them
Capitalism at its cost.
Wonyoung is primarily getting hate because other 4th gen girl group stans (plus some Blinks and Onces) are threatened by IVE. Look at how IVE got a bit of a break when Le Sserafim and NewJeans had their respective scandals. But once IVE won Rookie of the year, they became the easy targets again. And they’re the competition again. Once Baby Monster debuts, they’re going to have massive debut sales/streams/viewing numbers and become the next target.
IVE took over the hatred that was targeted at Aespa. Look at how people would take any opportunity to bash on Giselle and Winter. And that was taking on the hate that was originally targeted at Lia and Yuna of Itzy.
It felt like Blackpink was getting a break between Itzy’s debut and the Born Pink album release (because again, they put themselves at the top of the food chain despite questionable effort going into the album release and following tour).
IVE will eventually be overshadowed by another group in the near future and all of the hate will be direct towards that one until IVE’s popularity increases again.
I wish that none of these idols had to endure that.
Also does anybody remember when Red Velvet debuted and they got a ton of hate for their debut song, and then yeri debuted and she got a ton of hate that was then overshadowed by Twice debuting and getting a bunch of hate for “copying girls generation” and nayeon being labeled as an idol with a bad attitude for not smiling all the time? Like everybody just jumps on the hate train no matter who it is
@@Callista2270 Exactly. It’s literally just always bash on the biggest girl group.
And don’t get me wrong, boy groups get plenty of hate themselves. But this level of nitpicking and condemning everything (even breathing) is very centralized around girl groups.
About baby monster, I am hella worried for the 13 year old debuting in there. Anybody boycotting babymonster?
It is funny how different your experience with fandoms can be depending what platform you use. Twitter is a toxic hellscape. Reddit is pretty chill. I was on the Blackpink subreddit and a Dive post a question asking how to deal with all the hate. Everyone was really respectful and nice.
@@Callista2270 I feel like it’s always girl groups too, correct me if I’m wrong because I’m not into guys groups like that but I neverrrrr see hate trains of guy group members and I think it’s because for the most part the popularity gap isn’t as vast for guy groups but idk
Bro I could do a whole ass report on the issues with Ive’s fandom and haters.
I can start with how Wonyoung was practically forced to act face bc when she was her genuine self, she was mercilessly shit on by adults twice her senior which made her more cold and feel less sincere. Not to mention the many comments about her body and how people make fun of her potential ED she possibly suffers from PD48
Yujin is incredibly aware abt what the public says abt them. “Ive doesn’t have respect” then the next time I’ve makes an appearance, Yujin is practically snapping her back to do 90 degree bows. “Ive is disrespectful!” When Yujin accidentally interrupted Wonyoung, she apologized and looked possibly scared staring out at the fans.
Leeseo… I just feel bad for the kid. She’s been practicing since she was 12 to be an idol only for adults to mercilessly shit on her dream and send her death threats. She’s getting the Iz*one Wonyoung treatment from netizens and it’s so upsetting to see history repeat itself.
When it comes to Liz and Rei, it’s ALL about their weight. Constantly body shamed… When it comes to personality, they’re loved but are also absolutely dragged through the mud when it comes to their healthy weight looking like ‘fat’. Also, many antis use Rei and Liz to hate on Wonyoung and Leeseo (even though Rei and Liz literally adore them)
Gaeul really just needs good stans and is also the most overlooked member. A good portion of her stans have the same issue when it comes to a good portion of Liz and Rei stans. They don’t recognize her talent or even her ability to dance and hyper focus on the ‘airport incident’ that K-pop news dramatized to death.
I feel sad for them going through a lot of this. I don't(but I'm hoping)know if the company will take action against this chaos
fr
And here we are. One year later. The same pattern with lesserafim...
Being a fearnot biasing eunchae, AND a dive biasing leeseo, AND a WIZ*ONE biasing wonyoung……………….
it’s VERY hard these days…
I feel you so hard..
More success= More hate...
That's a fact...
fr
I totally agree lesserafim our my ults and some fearnots are ridiculous on tiktok, its crazy to see how many people switched up, just last year yall was saying how “ IVE was the best rookie girl group “ “ they deserve everything they received ” all “ they have is good songs “ 9 months ago yall was saying how LOVE DIVE was song of the year, how it was so good but when it actually won song of the year, the same people who was saying how good it was, was saying how they didnt deserve it and another group was robbed
they're calling it rigged just because the award didn't go to their favs 😭 loser behavior
People say that the hate from Wonyoung comes from favoritism but these same people don't give a rat's ass about the other member's promotions. Yujin has 13+ endorsements including big brands like Tiffany. Rei is the first 4th gen idol to be on the cover of Vogue Japan, plus her multiple variety appearances and her peach tree brand deals, 1K literally gave Gaeul her own variety show, she has several maize spreads and recently been promoted much more as a dancer. Liz also has multiple variety appearances that all reach over 1mil views. Leeseo is the member with the least promotion but still has multiple magazine spreads under her belt. It's not like these solo activities aren't promoted, if they weren't millions of views wouldn't be there.
It's extremely frustrating to dives that international kpop stans often ignore the other members for something minuscule Wonyoung does. For instance, Gaeul, Yujin and Leeseos solo for KBS Gayo was completely overshadowed by nondives complaining about what Wonyoung was wearing. Mind you the girl was hosting the entire show, no matter how much Dives scream about respecting and paying attention to the other members it doesn't matter. Believe it or not a lot of us don't care that Wonyoung is the most popular because she's way more popular than most 4th gen idols.
yep people don't realise that the non-iz ive members are doing REALLY well for rookie idols, but they choose to conveniently ignore this for the sake of making them look like victims.
I disagree with the other members being untouchable when it comes on to hate. Liz and Rei got tons of hate because of their weight. Leeseo gets tons of hate because she acts cute (and most idols who are older than her over do it but gets praise). The difference is Wonyoung is an easy target and anything she does gets hate.
I agree, I don’t think any idols are untouchable to hate. But I’ve only ever seen Liz’s weight brought up like maybe twice in the last couple of months. Not saying it doesn’t happen just saying it happens much much less.
I remember Aespa had a lot of hate even before their debut 😢 anyway this hate train to anybody needs to stop !
if you want to criticize kakao and starship for ruining an innocent girl's life to further their own interests, that's fine. the ive hate train goes beyond legitimate criticisms of shady business practices they had nothing to do with - like, tell me why we care about how wonyoung eats a strawberry? or why we're throwing so much vitriol at leeseo who is barely sixteen? i get the feeling lsf stans in particular are upset about garam but they should absolutely not be directing that energy at the ive girls
When people sees a handsome, confident and charismatic male idol they're gonna support him. But if it was a Beautiful, confident and attractive female idol they're gonna either support her ir hate on her just like wonyoung and Jennie
A significant factor that makes even ive fans themselves dislike wonyoung is how they feel their solopicks get mistreated cause wonyoung gets all the promotions, and the strawberry moon incident is yet another nail in the coffin i must say.
I think the company does play a significant factor in the amount of hate she recieves. They give her the most promotional opportunities and at times it overshadows the rest of the members. She can't really help this either which makes it even worse.
I can understand frustration seeing her seemingly "overshadow" other members or getting more brand deals. That doesn't mean that the other members get "mistreated" though. We don't know why things are the way they are. Maybe there are very valid reasons and maybe the other members are totally fine with Wonyoung and her role in the group. We should never forget, that we're not in the room when those decisions are made and that we only have assumptions and our own personal biases. So we should be careful with allegations like mistreatment, especially as long as the "mistreated" members never expressed any dissatisfaction themselves.
This kind of thing has always existed in kpop. The featured member brings a lot of attention to the group and helps them survive longer. It’s kind of a double edged sword, but ultimately good for the group
@@Taejiu I think one of the reasons the IVE hate stands out so much is because DIVE is starting to have a lot of the same issues BLINKS have, and I think that’s pretty significantly a managing/company’s issue, like it was for BLINKS
With all due respect that is not true at all, Wonyoung is not the only member promoted, that is something haters push, not actual IVE stans. Rei recently got a SOLO cover for Vogue Japan which is literally INSANE, Gaeul had a cover recently too and became a fashion brand ambassador, Yujin became the face of Clio makeup which is one of the biggest makeup brands in korea, all this only at the end of December. And that’s to name a few of the things the girls did all year. All members get brand deals and publication deals, us dives know that because we keep up with their accomplisments. Don’t get swayed away by the hate train and fact check. Also, this is a business, if Wonyoung gets more deals is because she is the most popular member, something the PUBLIC made her. Starship is an agency, they make the connection between artists and the publications/brands that CHOOSE THEMSELVES to work with the girls. The girls are offered these opportunities, most of the time it is not Starship going around doing phone calls. This is how business works, they want Wonyoung more because she has a bigger reach. It’s not that Starship does not want to promote the girls ( which already are VERY well promoted ), it’s that they are giving them the offers that come about. If anybody wants Liz or Gaeul to be more popular than make her more popular, the public has the power. People can’t be upset at Wonyoung for essentially working and taking the opportunities that are given to her or blame Starship for allowing her when they are the ones that brought her to that level. It’s ridiculous. Sorry for the long comment but I just wanted to say that the ‘wonyoung is more promoted’ thing is untrue.
I feel so bad for Wonyoung and Leeseo. They’re kids, and the real world is scary. They’re not enjoying their teenage years because they sacrificed themselves to idol life. Imagine the pressure, the criticism, the misogyny. It’s really brutal, especially for their mental health. Off topic, but this reminds me of Garam (from Lesserafim) and her scandal. Kpop fans KNOW that she’s a child and that fiasco took a toll on her mental health. I’m so worried about these kids.
I saw a lot of those videos about the strawberry moon performance and the comments really made me worried. The hate got a lot worse because the antis found a weak point to attack. I hope this ends soon cause the same people attacking Ive for lipsyncing are the same people who will excuse their faves for lipsyncing.
Stanning groups like blackpink, aespa, IVE etc. can be so exhausting because of immature and vicious haters. Btw, I'm sorry you had to go through bullying as well, you're really brave to share your experience with the audience. I was bullied when I was 5-12 and I can confirm that this shit has a huge effect on your self-esteem and it's extremely hard to gain back your confidence and ability to trust people (been working on that for the last few years). Anyways ,thank you for the video, it was great!
They are similar, just waiting for the IVE international promotion/popularity increase and they are basically BlackPink of 4th gen, not even joking.
Also, both groups can sing live while being stable
At this time no one is waiting for Baby monster to debut more than Ive/starship
It's so weird to think that I'm in this timeline witnessing this obnoxious ive hate.
what's even more worse is that im witnessing this for the second time, bc this is the same EXACT thing blackpink went through in 2018-19 💀
In Korea, most of the K-pop fandom is the female fandom. Male fans don't really like boy groups. They listen to pop music, girl groups, Korean indie music, or hip-hop. Currently, in Korea, only about 1 or 2 aces of boy groups survive in each agency. And these boy groups are organized by the desires of female core fans. .
Girl groups, on the other hand, are attracting attention from everybody. Therefore, it receives a lot of competition and attention. The characteristic of Korea's female fandom is that they project their identity to their favorite groups. They want the girl group to realize their ideals. For example, extreme feminism is in vogue in Korea in the 2010s. Most girl groups have become girl crush concepts. The lyrics, sound, and dance style all contain strong female ideals. If they don't like it at all, they will be hated. And they do everything they can to make their group stronger than others. This is what has been happening in Korea for years now. be hated for minor mistakes, suspicions, and incidents Perhaps few people are aware of this situation. Because this is an area that cannot be touched by Korean K-pop fandom. What's interesting is that the metaphor for the malicious commenter at the end of the omg music video of Newjeans made a big controversy. That's how powerful the 'That' community is in Korea. so I was surprised by Hyve's courage.
True. Korean Twitter, some community... There are certainly a lot of problems with The reason why hybe is great is that they are not conscious of Korean fandom at all now.
NJ songs are good, but many people already know that NJ's success is largely due to BTS fans, many of whom are stan hybe . Views of YT are less because of fans. Most of BTS is on Spotify. And they're doing the same old habits when NJ succeeds. They started pushing other groups and raising it to 1gen4.
Yep. Honestly, men's reactions are good, bad, or pretty, or nah... That's it. There's actually another place where rumors are consumed persistently. This is a fact that only people who really know the situation in Korea know. Korea's cultural industry is mostly tailored to women's tastes, except for artistic areas such as movies and indie culture. The reason why NJ is a sensation in Korea is that the music and concept are great, but it is something that everyone can enjoy and wanted.
It’s terrible what wonyoung needs to go through. As a dive who keeps up with their messages and other content. Wonyoung has sent messages how she hopes for a good day and how she won’t pay attention to the hate because she has her fans.
It really shows how much wonyoung cares about her fans and tries to maintain a strong mindset, but the hate still has an affect on her. I feel that if people actually tried watching ives content and some of wonyoung’s vlogs. They can see a new side to her;-;
The rivalry of Le Sserafim and IVE was manifesting over the start of this year, I want them to push each other more to reach the top cause I love to see Iz*one's girls winning but certainly dread that anyday someone will start a fanwar,I think both the fandoms are quite good now as I think all focus is on New Jeans,I hope dives and fearnots don't go toxic on each other cause no wiz*one will bear seeing these girls not looking into each other in eyes in award shows or music shows interactions.
Imagine cancelling Idol's whole careers for bullying that may or may not have happened years ago, and somehow being ok with bullying Idols and harassing them, and sometimes even threatening them online. The double standard...
🤦🏻♀️
It’s really sad how much of the video had to be about wonyoung getting hate for literally breathing, and leeseo for acting her age and doing what her position requires, like ya’ll really need to leave them alone! 😢 Gaeul stans remind me of Bahiyyih stans, please focus on supporting your fav idols instead hurting others! Like how do you think Gaeul would react to you bullying one of her best friends??
I hope all of ive can still flourish in this rough industry. We’ll continue to support the girls against toxic keyboard warriors and hopefully the members will be able to keep their mental and physical health in tact throughout the course of their careers. (New sub btw❤)
jealousy can be pretty ugly, they think IVE is not as talented as there faves, and that’s why they get mad when IVE is more successful, criticism is good to a certain extend, but people need to remind them self that this are children.
I've (lol) been predicting this shit happening for a while now. And people thought I was being dramatic. I wrote this in an Aespa content video: " I am not saying in this comment section. I probably shouldn't have brought this up. I am not even an IVE stan. This should have been a happy moment. I just realised a shift in the K-pop scene yet again. Kpop fans tend to love having their villains or groups that they hate the most. In 2018, it was Blackpink and Jennie. In 2019, it was Momoland and Nancy/Jooe. In 2020, it was AOA Jimin. In 2021, it was Aespa. And in 2022 it was Nmixx, but now it is starting to be IVE. They are probably going to have a horrible year in 2023 in terms of hate. And each time this situation happen, the last group/villain stopped getting an insane amount of hate and even gain support from the people who used to shit on them. It a very fuck up situation and I guess I wanted to talk about it (?)."
I wrote that comment about 3 weeks ago and have been feeling this way since the Wonyoung vs Gaeul drama happened. Since I am not a Dive, I have never really paid attention to IVE stans. So it was the first time I realized how broken their fandom is. For an outsider perspective, it seems like most Dive are Ot5 and dislike Wonyoung. Which makes Wonyoung fans very pissed and become solo stan. And then Gaeul fans are highkey becoming like Jisoo solo stan (if you know, you know). And Liz fans are becoming resentful against Starship and Wonyoung. Anyways, it's a big mess, and this is cultivating the perfect climat for anti to attack the group. The same shit happened with Blackpink and Jennie. With Momoland and Nancy/Jooe. With AOA and Jimin. Aespa with Winter/Giselle. And now with IVE and Wonyoung. The only thing I didn't see coming was Leeseo also being hated. But, to be fair, this isn't also surprising. She seems to have the least solo stans. She is an easy target for the people to hate. And since she and Wonyoung have the same performance style, it was only a matter of time.
This villain thing is a sad reality about K-pop that has been happening even before 2018. I can think of many groups that went through this, like Twice, T-ara, SNSD and Sulli etc. But I am glad people are finally picking up the patterns and are talking about it. I just hope that this will happen less and less. But I don't think it will. Anytime soon, at least.
Most of the hatred is directed against girl groups because more than 80% of the kpop fan base is female. Well-known female traits
It is soooo sad especially for OT6 dives like me. To see what this young fandom has become is really disappointing. But honestly I think (or at least hope) that as soon as the hate goes down a bit real dives will grow together more. If you are on the right side of the fandom it is an amazing place and I would love more people to experience that. Another thing that makes me really sad is the rivaly between fearnots and dives which is really sad since we could and should support eachother
First time i hear ot5 stans, wonyoung actially gets hate bcoz of the favoritism from starship like giving her better clothes like jennie and also she half ass some performance coz she dont want her hair to get ruined coz she is the mc, but im sure the hate will be gone later since wonyoung is not a instagram thot like jennie tbh, dont even compare them, wy is just doing her job so sometimes she act too much but she only does that on stage, offstage if u can see her behind the stage she is rly wholesome and thats what haters dont see bcoz they didnt watch ive/izone vlogs, wonyoung is rly sweet so there is a duality on her, she is fierce on stage thats why haters are mad coz she is the most popular idol right now, most haters come from other group fans too so annoying they are not from dive fandom. Gaeul stans are rly loud in youtube too which is more annoying than anything wonyoung did, wonyoung girlie is just soo popular everyone is shaking by her just breathing
Idk in your fyp, but in one vid, I once saw a comment that this user is waiting for Wonyoung to get end up like Go Hara and Sulli. I was just so shock seeing that comment
That so awful and messed up 😭
Oh my god, that is absolutely vile.
I think we need to start a conversation on who “deserves success” cause I see a lot of people using their “lack of talent” to say they don’t deserve fame as if every group at the top can only be perfect all rounders when that is rare in itself. There’s always gonna be someone better so I feel that’s invalid hell look at the top 3rd gen groups (bts & blackpink) they both lack in areas I’m not gonna say cause you know and they still sit at the top. It’s not about most talented it’s a game of luck and sometimes hard work/strategy, just cause your top picks didn’t end up on the right end of that rainbow doesn’t mean u tear others down. It is what it is just live with it, just let these people make that money cause we all know we wish we could.
Yeah even though IVE may not be as talented as per say a Le Sserafim or an NMIXX they still deserve the success that they achieved.
Man, i am such a lazy person that when i hate someone i won't bother to do anything about them. Why waste my time to even cyber bullying someone that i hate???
But those haters, their hates just out of this world, illogical... I am speechless on how far they goes with their hate.... They become a Big Bully.
But more that anything i hope IVE keep moving on and be better... Specially Wony and Hyunseo.
I don't understand how people can be so damn hateful like ofc I also have opinions but it's not like I'll write hate or target someone. You can write nice criticism. Ive had been such a target and I don't understand why. Yeah there are some things I don't like as well like I think it's a bit sad to see someone lipsync while sitting down but *many* idols and groups have done that so why are people only mentioning Ive? One thing I really appreciate with Ive is that they sing live very often and sound stable and probably also thanks to their choreo but I was bullied too and I don't understand how people can act like this and honestly look at the Garam case too... Without even knowing if it was true people sent extreme hate to a CHILD and then now they're being all soft and want her back like they weren't the one who sent hate to her which could have made her mental health really bad. Even if someone does something wrong, don't send extreme hate. Periodt.
ur commentary is literally the best. notifs on!!!
But IVE literallt have an amazing rapline..💀
See, this is one of the MANY reasons why children under 18, should not debut.
Ppl act as if lsf is leagues above ive talent wise but they are exactly the same. While opera and ballet are great talents, they don't automatically make the person the best in their field. As we saw, kazuha struggled in dances outside of her specialty.
Lol saying that ls is at the same level of skills as IVE is like dua Lipa is at the same level of singing as Mariah Carey, please be fk serious. To say something like that you truly know nothing about singing, dancing or art performing. Put some respect on these craft.
And I’m flabbergasted at the people who are hyping Yunjin being an “opera singer” when she’s nothing of the sort and this is coming from someone who’s actually studied the field
i always imagine wonyoung and leeseo getting told by the company and the people training them to act cute (especially leeseo since shes the maknae and ppl expect maknaes to act cutely) so they probably feel a lot of pressure to always be pretty and cute, so they do their best and try their hardest, do to their job…. and then they get hated for exactly that. I imagine that must be very frustrating for them.
Liz gets b*llied too for her weight but I agree with you, thank you for your video and I am so so sorry you had to experience this when you were a teenager
we may not be seeing the hate on liz cuz we're international stans, but I've seen knetz bullying her for her weight gain. it's honestly so upsetting to see her confidence diminishing because of the hate for something she can't control over. she's so young, her body is still growing of course she's gonna gain weight and that's a normal human thing that doesn't deserve to be made fun of
I've seen some of Jiwoo from NMIXX
They'll compliment them but criticize what they don't like.
One of my favorite stages this year was the "Shinee-Love like Oxygen" cover by eunchae and leeseo among others
I generally love collabs like that because they show that the idols themselves can work with each other, so why can't we as fans work with each other...
People are gonna be looking dumb if one of the members leave because of all the hate, they’re just kids.
Personally I believe this is actually Media Play even hate brings them a lot of attention and brings more people bringing sympathy to them, which can also bring more fan's, I find it sad especially that Dives drag other groups involved like Lesserafim, in the performance when sitting down Lesserafim fancams prove u can hear their actual voices along side the backtrack
I honestly feel bad for IVE but again this happened with Jennie as u said but Jennie brought bad press which led to Media Play by YGE which makes Blinks increase
Even tho the bad press was media play to begin with, same thing with V from BTS, HYBE didn't hesitate to denied the rumor which brings BlackPink instant attraction bcos of how Famous V is.
No disrespect to any of Jennie or Wonyoung but Kakao and Starship is no diff with YGE and BlackPink, Media Play to bring attention to the group whether it is bad press or good
I mean IVE is the 4th Gen BlackPink, they may have a few good songs that sound similar in future but they may end up Overhyped like BlackPink is now
Again no disrespect to them
Hey, I wouldn't be surprised. These companies will do anything to just keep making money, even at the expense of their employees.
She is the same age as my sister I can’t imagine I hope she doesn’t see the comments
It’s disappointing to see Le Sserafim fans act like this but then I remember that these are the same people that bullied a 16 year old out of the group based on overly exaggerated allegations. Embarssing. As someone who enjoys HYBE artists there is a pattern of toxicity some of the fandoms in that company display. Which is not surprising considering the fandoms mesh into each other.
Everyone and their mother were bullying garam don't try to rewrite history and put the blame on fearnot lol.
@@mylovechoerry2233 Did I say they were the only ones? I just said that they bullied her. Which they absolutely did, and probably the most because they were unreasonably upset with her and accused her or ruining things for the other girls. Not to mention the in person silence from the crowd she would experience during her short period of promotions. The fandom did her dirty the most, so don’t even try and avoid blame.
Hybe groups got the worst fandoms they give me narcissistic vibes sometimes lmao
@@bellsgotitnowft girl I think u haven’t meet yg stans
ngl it's disappointing to know that fearnots bully leesseo for acting like her age.... how can you act like that when you stan a group that has yunjin and sakura in it. two mental health advocates. furthermore, she's the same age as eunchae. what a shame.
It seems ridiculous! First it was kids bullying other kids then it was adults bullying other adults but now have full grown people become such __ that they are bullying kids?! For basically nothing
You forgot the bullying of Momoland.
Always so happy to see a new upload from you ❤️
tbh dives arent complaining all the time abt the line distribution, center time, brand deals, solo promos, etc because we KNOW and ACCEPT that wonyoung and yujin have been an idol for four years and the rest are just rookies. it's always the casual listeners speaking over us as if they know everything the members do. they constantly complain abt liz and gaeul being hidden when both just have plenty of solo promos that they don't even bother checking. no sane gaeul stan complained abt the wonyoung and gaeul airport drama. genuine liz stans arent cursing wonyoung for getting three repetitive choruses in after like and one verse.
I think the reason why just wony and leesso gets hate is cuz they are not best at something for eg Liz being best in vocal, rei being best in rap geyul being best in dance yujin is an ace!(in this group) So hater sees this as an opportunity.
They tend to ignore the fact they fits the concept the best " pretty popular popstar kind of vibe" they have best sp in the group (according to the concept) but you know for them it's not talent it's just being pretty 🤦♀️
(This comment is not related to lip sync controversy so don't bring it here as a shield to justify all the hate you give them)
I thought it was crazy how wonyoung was being bullied for being what people would call a "ideal kpop idol". She gets hated on because of her weight or her personality or even just the way she acts around anybody the list goes on. This really shows that avoiding hate in the kpop industry is impossible and even an ideal idol wouldn't never be considered "good enough".
For me, most of my criticisms are for Starship. They’ve proven time and time again to be very vain and even fraudulent for the sake of success. However, I’m not going to pin the corruption of a multi-million dollar entertainment company on a group of teenage girls…I feel like the misdirect of hate is one of the main reasons why IVE catches the heat most of the time. It’s an unfortunate situation 🤷🏾♀️
It's always the company
I wish more people thought like this.
I have very least interest in kpop due to several reasons mostly personal, but your content is really amazing.
Appreciate you
i think the only criticism of ive that is valid is the lip synching one, but even then not to the extent it got blown up to. yeah, a daesang winning group and rookies of the year should be able to deliver more. groups who don't hold those accolades deliver more consistently. i also think wonyoungs situation is only 75% similar to jennie's case especially in regards to the "laziness". of course a lot of things overlap but with jennie i feel like it was fueled by everyone seeing what her peak condition was and to have it deteriorate so suddenly with zero explanation from her or the company (health related issues). at the end of the day idols should be able to give good performances, whether thats amazing vocals or synchronized dances or killer stage presence and jennie was not following that part of her job description for (at the time) seemingly no reason. wonyoungs hate is much more deeply rooted in misogyny and insecurity. she is literally the pinnacle of korean beauty and she gets called a "pick me" simply for the fact that a lot of men (and probably these fangirls' faves) find her very attractive and would love to have the honor of being with her. she's seen as an attention hog for simply existing because everyone is watching her every move. she's younger than most fangirls, way prettier, richer, and living a better life and she hasn't really had an excess of struggles that make her an underdog people can root for (twice's jihyo and jeongyeon, rv's joy and wendy, itzy's chaeryeong) she started at the top and only goes higher and i think people can't stand that so they feel like they have to knock her down and make her "earn" her happy ending
Good video! Thank you! For me people that hate on idols are not "fans" or "stans" they're just toxic idiots that use K-Pop as an excuse to provoke and bully others. Every fandom has those and popularity (of a group or idol) attracts them because of the bigger attention they can get for their behavior. But we really should stop accepting them as "fans" (or part of a fandom) and call them what they really are "bullies". I hope (but somehow doubt) that labels take good care of their idols and their mental and physical wellbeing, especially if they're still children, which nowadays seems to be even more normalized than in the past.
Of course nobody is immune to criticism and opinions differ but is has to stay constructive and not get personal. If we criticize a company or an idol we should always remind ourselves, that Idols are just humans and that we don't know s**t. Nobody of us is in their place and nobody is in the room when all those decisions are made. We just have are our personal biases, assumptions and external observations to go off. Getting offended or "protecting" somebody else from "mistreatment" that never expressed any criticism themselves is a special kind of st***d. For example: Wonyoung getting criticized because of allegations of favoritism or because of her lip-syncing of Strawberry Moon. Sure, we can express our disappointment that it was not live. But we should not forget that there might be very valid reasons that we're not aware of why she had to lip-sync . And for here role in the group: Maybe the other members are completely fine with that role for Wonyoung in the group or even prefer it that way. We just don't know. So please, let's also stop whining about "mistreatment" or getting offended for somebody else based on our vague assumptions and personal biases. That's part of the problem.
Wait till you realize super senior is the real punching bag😂
thats for good reason tho lmaoo
K-pop can be exhausting, especially mentally because of never-ending wars. The reflection of what is happening is just getting worse through the years. More noise=more profit to the company and the country overall. To be honest, this won't stop, but the thing we can change is only ourselves. How we see K-pop will either help or worsen our lives. It's a Yin and Yang.
But we’ll not stop voicing what to change because we never knew, someday we can.
this perfectly encompasses my thoughts ab ive for the last month or so THANK YOU
Also regarding the lip-sync situation, it is okay to be against it, but please don’t send hate to the girls because rest assure they were most likely NOT the ones in charge of the decision to not sing live. Those decisions are made by the company or broadcasting station. Also, please take in account other factors too, the girls prerecorded all their performances for that night right after the AAAs because on the day of the show they had to fly to Japan to perform there too. Who knows how much time they had to prepare considering the rush. Some of us dives are understanding of the situation and choose to not care too much because we know the girls can sing decently, they’ve shown it before. Also I wonder why so many people care so much if they don’t even stan them, it’s weird to go around and criticize groups you don’t know. I for one don’t do that. Leave it to dives to see if they care or not and go support your group. People act like it’s the end of the world.
I love Ive and my biais is Wonyoung! Wonyoung retired from a MC role on music show i think because of all the haters who bullied since last year for doing nothing wrong, for eating just a strawberry with 2 hands! Wonyoung is the most popular 4th gen visual It girl who were hated for nothong wrong like Jennie of Blackpink
For some reason, for the time I've been a kpop fan, I couldn't imagine Leeseo getting hate. She's so bright and positive.
Honestly I think Ive doesnt lack in talents, the dancing and stage presence always fits their concept. Liz is an amazing vocalist, Rei has amazing rap skills, Gaeul is a fantastic dancer, Yujin is the perfect leader if you look up their training and Wonyoung has great stage prensence and full control of her face expressions. As an Ive stan... it hurts my heart so much that the girls get so much hate for literally nothing :( Wonyoung prooved already that she can sing and dance, we have seen her on produce48 (please look up how hard those shows are! and how mentally draining) ._. we have heard her encore stages... and still she gets bullied for "lip sync"
The reason I think they are easy to hate coz in defense they don't have that much skill under there belt compared to other 4th gen, yujin and liz has exceptional vocal talent other than them skill wize not much can be said. Ive shot to stardom was very quick which starship hasn't seen in the long time so it might be new for them to handle such a young group at the peak of the popularity, if they would have taken a bit of time then the company could also have a proper blueprint to promote each member.
I always think did they become too big too soon..?
The bigger you get the more eyeballs you catch as well as more mouth, so at this moment they have to be ready, that company can counter these things.
Hate is not rational. It is emotional. And haters aim at the easy target (not the right one if such thing exists). As you said, it comes mostly from insecurities directed against a competing group. When you have no major insecurities, you just don't care. Hate is bad for health. So going from hating competitors to supporting the loved band would be the best rewarding move.
1:50 and then fearnots have the audacity to ask dives to show mercy when they were getting slammed for coachella
Female kpop stans created a stupid reason just to hate on gorgeous beautiful popular female members like Jennie in 2022 (created a rumor on her about dating a BTS member, created a stupid reason to get her bashed, criticized, bullied her for nothing wrong), same with Wonyoung (dig her nationality etc bc just jealousy of Wonyoung being too perfect gorgeous and popular so they tried to dig to find something to bullied her)
For Wonyoung, the hypocrisy of kpop stans who love her aegyo when she was the maknae in Izone but now she grew up in Ive and became such a popular member who fits korean beauty standards, she's gorgeous and popular now, has a lot of brands deals and when Wonyoung eats in a cute way, she get bashed now
It's not hypocrisy when she looked like a 14 years old it looked cute, now that she looks 25 it look cringy.
@@mylovechoerry2233 she does not look 25, wonyoung just turned 18 and her eating a strawberry in a cringy way is not a good excuse to send hate to her
I hate watching people be so mean for no reason I was also bullied so at times it can be triggering I know it’s not realistic but I wish people could be kinder to each other.
Starship is also a easy target because Starship isn't a big 4 company and immature kpop fans who follow and stans only groups from big 4 company and thought the kpop groups from others medium and small company didn't deserve their sucess LOL the hypocrisy! Baby Monster from YG didn't debuted but has a lot of followers bc of big company privilege
9:06 people say nwjns shouldnt debut so young bc its for their own good then the same people go on to hate on kids the same age as nwjns. wtf??
Great message but you shouldn't have mentioned names of the other rookies IVE is being compared to, especially lesserafim. That rivalry was pointless and you mentioning them was just not called for. You're not calling out the rivalry but adding fuel to the fire
I wish you'd make a video on why these two groups shouldn't be arguing anymore since you decided to point it out.
Also, if you're talking about people who were comparing Eunchae to Leeseo, it wasn't just fearnots because not every fan of Eunchae is a fearnot. Some just think she's cute although the hate on Leeseo was pretty dumb and yes some fearnots were included but I'm sick and tired of IVE haters hiding behind fearnots because to be honest, many fearnots are wizones! Other rookie and non rookie fandoms hate on IVE too and you're only calling fearnots out cause obviously, you're also comparing lesserafim to IVE naturally
Eunchae and Leeseo are both my biases and I just wished people stopped comparing them and their groups
You HAVE to bring up people comparing others because that's the root of the issue. If you don't bring up why people hate certain idols, than what's the point of discussing the subject. There is no hiding anything here. I also never said it was just Eunchae stans that attack Leeseo, I just called them out specifically. Respectfully, I don't think I'm adding any fuel to the fire by bringing up Le Sserafim.
Ur right, some people hating IVE pretending they are fearnots or by bringing up lesserafim n comparing even if they don't stan them just to stir up fanwars it's really annoying!!
@@Taejiu You seem to have no idea how protective Dives can be. Bfr, although they do have reason, they are a bit extremely overprotective. I don't have a problem with your video. I'm just stating a fact
@@green360z Every fandom is toxic, Dives were, and still will be toxic after watching this video. It's just how fandoms work, I only report what's happening.
@@Taejiu mentioning lessarafim was so UNCALLED for. i have never seen fearnots on lsfm videos bringing up ives maknae. it was mostly kpop stans who uses lsf as token gg.
Humans reflect on and off of others.
It can be both positive reflection and negative reflection.
The positive reflection is what parents do to their kids, especially if the child is very pretty, smart, etc. (e.g. "She's as pretty as her mom", "He's hardworking like his dad", "My son/daughter is just like me, I was a great student too", etc.)
Negative reflection is when we see people who have the same negative traits like us. We see someone who's lazy/rude/has bad taste/etc., we comment on it trying to separate ourselves from it ("Hey look at that guy wearing a Hitler T-shirt, I could never" meanwhile, you wore Stallin's tee as a 11yo coz you didn't know or didn't care, shit example I know).
Lastly, we have "comfort" hate, which is what most haters and bullies do, they comfort themselves by hating on others. Whenever people see someone having or embodying something they themselves don't it makes them angry, jealous, resentful,... That's when hate strikes so that the person feels comfortable about themselves again.
What's truly sad is how people choose to hurt others so that they could feel better, when there are so many other ways to gain self-esteem and self-love. 🤦♀️
I hope the girls are ok
There's still a lot of misogyny in Kpop which basically means there's a lot of misogyny in South Korea
Exactly! this is what I've been thinking all this time!! And tbh international fans act all open minded, mature and nice but they are the main bullies bullying ive😮 I haven't touched kpop in a long time when I suddenly came back here all i saw was hate shorts on this new group 😐
There's also the conspiracy theory that Wonyoung is ethnically Chinese but concealing it due to racist discrimination. It's actually a conspiracy that makes a lot of sense. They used a Chinese name for Wonyoung without any explanation in the beginning and Wonyoung even looks more Chinese than Korean with those longer legs, taller height, thinner body, and certain facial features.
It always baffles me how whenever someone uploads a video about the IVE/wonyoung hate you always get a few comments going "but actually...". There's no way you can justify the kind of hate they get. It's even gone beyond the point of so-called constructive criticism.
Le Sserafim and Nmixx fans are so toxic.
Ngl from a non kpop fans perspective , they will think ive members did some illegal /racist/ sexist stuff but if they knew the reason for hate, they will laugh on our face.
Ive’s lipsyncing and Jennie’s dancing are for sure valid issues, but it’s so so wrong to respond to that with straight up hate. Criticism is totally fair but to push negativity along with that, and in most cases to just hate and not fairly criticize, is yeah. Wrong
IVE FOREVER !!! 🔥🔥
I will said a lot of hate to 4th gen girl groups is because they are starting to replace 3rd gen groups.
In the case of girls it is more bloody because we know it is not about music but because the fans are changing idols because of their age. They go for the new young girl on the scene. In men is because military but most of them will still have a couple of years if they want but girls as soon as they reach 30 are called old for be an idol.
Women are always hold over higher standards than men. But women when debut is becoming more and more clear that they are not being choosen by their talent but because how they look and that push a lot of red buttons. Yes, they managed to reach the final selection so they are talented but we know a lot of hate that BP received come from the fact that they were used to replace a perfectly successful group 2NE1 for a more pretty version. Even we know it was the same with the new group of SoMu, they needed a more cool and younger and more appeling group that Hybe could market as the new BP (by the own CEO of Hybe words) so the old group could go werever they want. IVE is not replacing anyone inside their own agency but they did it with Twice that last year have seen a lot of less recognition because all this new groups.
Another fact I think it comes with new groups are being viral too fast without really first proof themselves. IVE was the biggest winner and the one to proclame that the 4th generation is here and it is ready to rule over K-Pop in the last awards ceremonies and their stage was as boring as they could make it. They did not seemed to sing live and they are singers, they are performers and I still feel sleep during their performance. That is the standard it seems to be for 4th gen girls groups, the only stage I found interesting was Itzy and J-Hope (but he is 3rd gen) and I do not remember a single one beside Stray Kids and I am almost sure I am rembering the one of 2021. I think that is part of the reason of the hate a lot of girls groups are acting more like influencers than really musical performers and I blame BP for bring that to K-Pop. Twice went trought the same but Nayeon and Jihyo managed to show they could sing and Momo showed she could dance and Twice prooved themselves after some time. NMIXX already did it, Aespa did it, Itzy did it. IVE still need to proove themselves in the music sphere.
Last, I think it is the fact that maybe IVE's agency used Woonyoung image to much in order to promote the group making to be seen as if she was holding some kind of privilege in the group and people dislike that. No one likes the feel to know you are giving pretty privilege to someone only because her pretty face and you are leaving the rest of hard working members besides because they are not as "pretty" or famous. I think Woonyoung did her best to promote IVE and her fans must be proud of her an IVE's fans must be thankful to her for that. All that work put on question another "it girl": Jenni and Blink maybe over reacted.
I hope they manage to proof themselves with their album and can leave this stage of hate behind them.
IVE !! IVE !! IVE !! 🔥🔥🔥🔥
There is a lot of sexism, misogyny, and pick mes (I don’t know the proper word for it) in K-pop community. Which is why it’s mainly girl groups getting targeted.
1:48 i was not aware of this... what the hell? which sickos would hate on a kid for trying to be cute. Stupid
IVE still number 1 for me
The next girl group that’s going to be the next victim is Baby Monster
Because think about it most likely Blinks are going to support them once they debut. & there going to break so many records & be internationally famous like how BLACKPINK was & Baby Monster will steal the title for Monster Rookies & take over 4th generation of K*POP
Something that also can happen is Kpop stans dropping absolutely every GG and using Baby Monster as their new token gg to hate on the rest
In my country rn boy group stan started to throw hate on Wonyoung after the AAA. Istg like some boy group stans are wild and rude lol.
have you heard of aespa aepsa is the punching pag aswell as IVE. Giselle got tons of hate for bad dancing & all of aespa gets hate for 0 reasons and i can name so many lies and rumors that have been msde up about aespa to destroy them. snd then on top of that the kpop fandoms either hate aespa or completely act like they dont exist
As I neverland I saw parts of the hate coming from toxic newjeans, le sserafim and gidle fans being frustrated of Ive winning most big awards for rookie groups and gg. I get being frustrated when your favourite group is often nominated, then constantly losing to a specific other group and on top of all that getting tons of pity awards instead - which is what happened to gidle - but that´s no reason throwing hate on said group.
The blame should be taken to the companies for making an overcompetitive system.
They promote kpop as such while also making people get attached to certain idols/groups. This is a huge factor in creating frustrations that lead into fan wars, hate and cyber bullying. And guess what? Cyber bullying is mentally hurting idols and in worst case we get another Sulli situation sometime in the future.
The way award shows are held feed into that:
They give group nominations way before announcing the winners where the winning groups are propably already clear to the judges (based on the data and their votes) *while* not givng a second or third place. This gives fans a false hope which naturally leads into frustration if another group is constantly taking the cake. Pity awards are the extra slap in the face of the fans and the groups and shouldn´t be given. And then we get the cycle that leasds to cyber bullying certain groups.
Side note: Fan votes shouldn´t be made for an award show since the nominated songs already have proven to gain gp popularity (except the true fan favourite awards).
I think this video dismisses a lot of things that did happen eg jennie being "lazy" on just one dance practice (it was a whole compilation so people saw the issue) and starship essentially putting a target on wony and leeseo's back with the blatant favoritism on wony (which I do hate cause that's actually out of her control why should she receive hate for it) and starship uploading that one video of leeseo not helping staff and playing it off as a joke (I've seen a couple of people say they dont like leeseo because of this, and I have to admit I also did judge her character silently for ONE thing she did but thats on me, and I'll be trying to not do that anymore)
But I do agree that there's really no point in hating on these girls who have a LOT of room for growth. Pointing out this kind of stuff is also really hard cause people will jump them for the smallest things and blow things out of proportion for their own entertainment. I may have my reservations about them but I still think they do deseve better than this.
i stan le sserafim and not ive i find it ridiculous seeing other fearnots going UwU over eunchae and then hate on leeseo for doing the same thing eunchae did they're only 9 months apart in terms of age it's pretty stupid how one of them can act her age but the other is "too immature" when she acts her age i'm not saying eunchae being able to act her age without getting hate is bad bc it's actually a really good thing i'm saying y'all are hypocrites for not letting leeseo do the same thing the poor girl is only 15 ofc she's going to act immature and do cutesy maknae things
starship knows what works for ive and that’s why even though the girls may not be the best rappers or singers in the 4th gen people don’t like how ive is more famous than their faves because in their eyes the most talented should be the most successful
I agree about leeseo & Wonny getting the most hate BUT liz also got cyberbullied about her weight which is absolutely mind-boggling to me
why cant we 4th gen fans just enjoy the 4th gen groups? open your mind, you will be happier.
These people specially female kpop stans (the majority of kpop stans in South Korea are young women, they are normal, wants to be popular and beautiful) that's why being a female kpop idols specially a gorgeous beautiful popular member in a kpop girlsband. Insecure female kpop stans created rumors about Jennie & Wonyoung bc of Jealousy and their insecurity!