I QUIT my academic job. Here are three signs you should too.

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  • Опубліковано 2 січ 2025

КОМЕНТАРІ • 240

  • @gazoontight
    @gazoontight Рік тому +93

    I stayed a postdoctoral associate and adjunct instructor until my late thirties. Leaving academia was hard but once I did it my real life started. Best thing that I did.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому +1

      I’m so happy it worked out for you! Good for you

  • @Erintii
    @Erintii Рік тому +110

    I left Academia lest year and are now in the industry. I have lived in burnout, feeling of meaninglessness for years but feeling there is nothing awaits for me outside Academia. I was told my contract would not be prolonged week after I came back from my Mother's funeral. Started applying outside Academia but it was hard as my CV wasn't right, but got help and find a job. Taking entry level in late 30s is hard but better than meaningless, post-doc like jobs in Academia. I got federal fellowship, I was involved in federal grants, got 38 papers in PubMed but felt like loser. Still feel all after my PhD is a waste of time and need to live with feeling I blunder away 9 years of my life. I have no one to socialize but I have stable job and with experience can get better job in better location and not blasted countryside I hate.
    I was applying for jobs in major cities but so many years of Academia did not help. Now I started new chapter in my life and at least I am no longer wasting my life. To all reading this comment: leave Academia ASAP. No matter how hard you work, most of you will never get tenure-tract position. No one cares what you know but who do you know. Academia job market is extremely completive and 10% of PhD graduates has chance to stay. Don't make mine or other people's mistake. Leave Academia, think how your skills will be transferable, what you can add. Academia is toxic environment of lowly paid, unstable, fixed-term contracts. It is fine for those in 20s but this is all. Academia freedom and flexibility is not worth your mental health. I waited too long. Don't repeat my mistakes.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому +11

      I’m sorry your experience was so awful. It can truly feel like you’re entirely alone when you don’t know where you’re going next. It sounds like you’re starting to get things back on track though. Don’t worry about starting entry level at 30. I did - and now I’m progressing quickly. It does get better!

    • @Erintii
      @Erintii Рік тому +2

      @@cherylhurst Thank you for kind words. I am starting a new, more stable chapter in my life. You are right it's never too late to make a change. I am open to wait awaits me in my current job, let's see what will happen in 5 years.
      Best of luck.

    • @pauljones5066
      @pauljones5066 Рік тому +1

      good luck!

    • @Erintii
      @Erintii Рік тому +1

      @@pauljones5066 thank you

    • @fajardofje
      @fajardofje Рік тому +2

      Can you tell a little bit more about how your transition ended up and details of your new job. I'm considering transitioning

  • @pauljones5066
    @pauljones5066 Рік тому +85

    90% of people in academia will relate to this

    • @davidbrick6325
      @davidbrick6325 Рік тому +3

      90%? Surely not 90% of tenure track faculty. I teach 7 hours per week for 30 weeks each year. And I mostly teach courses that I've taught many times before and always on a subject that I love. That's pretty standard for the humanities at an R1 university. Why would I give that up?

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому

      That’s so great that you enjoy it!! I understand the 90% sentiment though, when you dislike your job it can make you feel like everyone does. I’m sure it was just a flippant number but if you enjoy your work definitely hold onto it!

    • @davidbrick6325
      @davidbrick6325 Рік тому

      @@cherylhurst : Thanks for your comment. I don't wish to pry into your personal life, but I'm curious to know if you're still happy that you left your lectureship eleven months later. Don't you miss having close to four months off over the summer?
      Of course, as I'm sure you know, you're supposed to spend your summers engaged in research. So if you're not excited about research, I can see why summers wouldn't exactly seem like "close to four months off."

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому +9

      @@davidbrick6325 I’m not sure where you work or what academics you speak to but there’s no “summers off”.. during the summer is when you do research and grants, and often still dissertation work. The only difference is that students aren’t there for July and august, and even then, they are if you do masters or phD supervision. But I’m definitely still very happy and will do a “one year later” video!

    • @davidbrick6325
      @davidbrick6325 Рік тому +2

      @@cherylhurst : I'm glad to hear that you're still happy. That's the important thing.
      I was speaking of higher education in the US. I submit final grades no later than mid-May and begin teaching again at the start of September. In the intervening time, I almost never write grant proposals, because they're no fun and not essential in the humanities, where research doesn't require much money. I do spend a big portion of my summers researching and writing on topics that interest me, but that's what I'd do if I were rich and didn't have to work. Plus I can take a break whenever I want. So it feels like four months off.

  • @viktorsaurus
    @viktorsaurus 2 роки тому +13

    Oh boy... I relate too much with everything you brought up :/
    Edit: thanks for sharing your experience, I cannot tell you how grateful I am to hear someone else feel this way

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  2 роки тому +1

      Sorry you feel this way but I hope it works out for you! I can honestly say I’m the happiest I’ve ever been now, I can’t believe I ever thought academia was for me 😅 I’m basically in a 9-5 (but more flexible) and the structure is exactly what I need right now

  • @ericv7720
    @ericv7720 11 місяців тому +6

    Before starting college, I spent 6 years in the US Marines (most of that time infantry). I was young; I thought I could do anything! It didn't hold a candle to grad school, though. The competitiveness, the brownnosing, the backstabbing, every waking hour taken up by research. I discovered that I hated teaching, though, so I dropped out and went on to do other things. I still have friends who went on to finish their Ph.D, and then teaching, and talking to them is like talking to a strict religious practitioner - academia is all they know, their only point of reference. All I can think is, "How did I get so lucky?"

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  11 місяців тому +2

      Yea I’ve experienced that a bit too! And people thinking I sold out because I got tired of it. Hopefully it worked out for you!

  • @Clint945
    @Clint945 Рік тому +31

    Still fighting for a permanent position.
    Earned over a million in grants over 4 years since my PhD. Published plenty. Created new collaborations with 3 different universities (and an internal one). Created and taught a new course.
    Turned down for positions given to people 6 years my junior straight out of their PhD. No papers. No grants. Correct ethnicity and/or gender.
    Kinda done with it if im honest. Kinda really fucking done with it.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому

      That sounds absolutely awful. I’m so sorry you’ve had to go through that. Do you have a mentor or someone you trust that you can have a really honest conversation with? I have two friends who experienced this - one stuck it out and now has a great job in academia, one left and now has a great job at a tech company. I hope it works out for you❤️

    • @Clint945
      @Clint945 Рік тому +7

      @@cherylhurst
      With regards to a mentor, not really. My boss is at the end of his career, an *extremely* talented man, but I don't think he understands the modern social academic setting very well.
      With regards to jobs, it's all rolling dice, quite literally. Was chatting to the vice-rector of a European institute recently about this topic and he admitted that they hired a full professor through a dice roll. They couldn't decide between three candidates so they numbered them and rolled dice. No joke.
      It's just hard to jive relentless excessively hard work (and the fun mental maladies that come with it) up against the reality that academia is utterly arbitrary. It kills a lot of great researchers.

  • @Ken-er9cq
    @Ken-er9cq 9 місяців тому +8

    The pointlessness is really horrible. It is a really bad sign when you realise that the paper that you are writing is for only one reason, and that is to add to your c.v. The research isn't interesting, it doesn't solve a real problem, it just is there because you have to have an output. Then it gets rejected, and you have to make major changes to this paper that you didn't want to write in the first place. Several people I know left to go to industry, and they now work on things that have a purpose. I retired.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  9 місяців тому

      Ah ya I totally see that perspective and felt that way. Some people don’t and they thrive in academia but definitely not me (or us it seems!)

  • @nickreid5297
    @nickreid5297 Рік тому +9

    I left a tenured lectureship in English twenty years ago, for similar reasons. Fortunately, I had also majored in Economics in my first degree, and that got me a job in the Australian Treasury. It took me a couple of years to find an area I liked working in, and I didn't climb the greasy pole--but I was earning more than I had as a senior lecturer in NZ, and as a junior employee I could go home at 5pm.
    I bought myself a hammer and saw and built a house, and I spent my evenings reading what I wanted to, rather than marking endless student essays. I've gone on publishing, but only when I had something to say. There were small humiliations, like having your prose edited by illiterates, but I've certainly been much happier having stepped off the pointless hamster wheel.
    Academia was still a happy place when I was a student in the 70s and 80s, but once we let the dementors (I mean the managerialists) in, they sucked the life out of it.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому +1

      Wow sounds like you’re definitely living the good life now, though! Good for you. I hope the other people who have commented on this get to experience some of the good parts of working life like you have. Hope it keeps getting better for you 😊

    • @nickreid5297
      @nickreid5297 Рік тому

      It worked out well. Once I'd paid off my house, I took a very badly paid adjunct position at the Australian National University, teaching first year English and Philosophy to students doing a foundation year. I loved the teaching and nobody hassled me about research. Covid put a stop to that, and now I'm happily retired--and about to produce a major index to one of Coleridge's longer works!

  • @ms.saiyan
    @ms.saiyan 8 місяців тому +3

    I absolutely relate to the apathy part. This video showed up for me just as I'm about to take the plunge of quitting my academia job, especially since I've been recently denied promotion after years of working as an adjunct instructor. Thank you for your honesty and insight!

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  8 місяців тому +1

      Good luck!! You’ve got exciting things ahead

    • @curiouspenguin6887
      @curiouspenguin6887 6 місяців тому +2

      They never promote adjuncts. As in business, once you prove you're willing to stick around in a dead-end job for crap wages, they will never respect you. Run from such positions!

  • @sahilgupta221
    @sahilgupta221 Рік тому +13

    I can relate to it.
    I left the industry in 2014 and started pursuing a master's in India and Phd degree in the US.
    Looking at my advisor's condition.
    I decided to shift to Industry again with better perks and pay packages this time.

  • @Aokaimusic
    @Aokaimusic 9 місяців тому +1

    I wasnt an academic but was a corporate lawyer for many years. I'm now chasing a career as an electronic nusic producer, so a lot of the reasons you gave for leaving i strongly resonate with. Thanks for the video!

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  9 місяців тому +2

      Wow how exciting!! I’m doing something similar alongside my corporate role (something more aligned to the arts/creativity) and it’s so much more fulfilling. Good luck with it all!

  • @saphone9758
    @saphone9758 2 роки тому +11

    Got it. I'm there now. Sort of quiet quitting.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому +2

      Sorry it’s been so long for me to respond, UA-cam took a back seat to my new job! I hope you find something you enjoy, inside or outside academia. It really does get better once you find something that feels valuable

  • @os2171
    @os2171 2 роки тому +16

    Imagine your journey, except having terrible, bad psycho anti mentors... this has been the journey for me... I think I have been surviving just to prove them wrong... which is wrong... I love science but I don't respect the way the system works... and specially the injustice and the rampant lack of shame that many of they actors present every day when they are micromanaging, harassing (work and sexually -yess), passive aggressiveness and open aggression... anyways im still here... Thanks for sharing. you are very brave.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому +2

      I know this feeling.. the system is broken and makes it difficult to respect it.

    • @os2171
      @os2171 Рік тому +2

      @@cherylhurst I Finally finished my PhD and although officially now I’m unemployed, last week I decided not to pursue a postdoc, but instead, to quit academia… and I’m feeling good!

  • @2Mishule2
    @2Mishule2 7 місяців тому +1

    Oh, you exactly described how I feel about my employment in academia. I had all the feelings but couldn't find the right words, but you captured my feelings exactly. Thank you for this video.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  7 місяців тому +1

      I’m happy it resonated but wish you had a better experience! Good luck with everything

  • @ariannaaddis4989
    @ariannaaddis4989 10 місяців тому

    Thank you SO much for this video. As an organizational psychology graduate student contemplating leaving academia, this video was immensely helpful and resonated so much.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  10 місяців тому +1

      Oh I’m happy to hear that!! Good luck with your decisions

  • @loodwich
    @loodwich Рік тому +3

    How does UA-cam know that I am struggling with this?
    I hate my actual position (Associate professor), I'm not too fond of the papers and the little help the university gives to my research.
    But I love my students, and the projects I develop with them.
    At this moment, I don't feel burnout, and I still like my job... It is an important job that influences a lot of people.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому

      That’s a rough position to be in. I hope you’ve got some mentors or other close confidants you can talk to about it - see if they have similar sentiments. Worth spending time thinking about what you want. I hope it works out for you!

  • @wrbl
    @wrbl Рік тому +8

    Omg totally relate. I am now on 4th year of phd and the only thing left to do is to write my thesis. I think about dropping out everyday, however first I decided to go on a therapy and then decide. Guys Keep fingers crossed for me!!

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому

      Ah sorry you’re feeling that way! I really enjoyed my phd and writing my thesis. Sometimes I miss the days of just focusing on one thing - I hope you start to enjoy it more or that it goes quickly for you!!

  • @I.am.here.only.
    @I.am.here.only. 9 місяців тому +1

    It's been more than three years since I quit my permanent teaching position and moved to another city for settling down. It felt really good initially to quit and I looked forward to a new set of opportunities. But, in the competitive market, I haven't found another position. I remain jobless, very distracted and anxious, unable to progress and produce good academic articles. With a PhD in Humanities, I don't think if there is anything interesting in the industry for me. Hopefully I'll get new perspectives on my current situation soon. Some of the comments here are, and your video of course, is comforting and making me less guilty for resigning.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  9 місяців тому

      I really hope it works out for you - it can be a scary time. The market is very competitive and you might not find something you love right away but can learn a lot by trying new things!

    • @I.am.here.only.
      @I.am.here.only. 9 місяців тому

      Your words mean a lot, thanks!@@cherylhurst

  • @Nickname006
    @Nickname006 25 днів тому

    You describe exactly what I have felt for at least 3 years. Started my first postdoc recently, which I think is a mistake. I have to continue in the role for at least a year, but should start making plans for the life after.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  23 дні тому

      Definitely start thinking about the good and the bad, and develop a plan either way. I know lots of happy people who stayed so it’s just about finding what works for you

    • @Nickname006
      @Nickname006 23 дні тому

      @cherylhurst I'm not proud to hide behind a diagnosis, but as someone with ADHD, listing good and bad and any long-term planning has always been very difficult to me. It all comes down to intuition for me. I have very much mixed feelings (mostly complaining all the time though). I'm now trying to take it all less seriously, disregard the pressures of academia and stop complaining and see where it takes me.

  • @Akerfeldtfan
    @Akerfeldtfan Рік тому +6

    Feeling this right now, everything you're saying is stuff I've hit on. However, I'm deeper in than you were- I got tenure just now and can tell you it's MUCH worse the longer you stick around. Salary compression in the academy is brutal and you will actually end up getting paid less as a person with tenure than a brand new hire. And in my university the hierarchies across fields (STEM vs not) mean my department was always getting shit on. Academia operates by entrapping and exploiting- We aren't taught how to prepare our CVs or resumes for non academic jobs and the longer we are there the more the sunk cost becomes. But at the same time, the scale your institution's leverage against increases. By year 10, you've bought a house, would be passed over as overqualified for many transitional positions, and are trying to start a family. All this makes it harder and harder to bail out. And don't get me started on the cult-y vibe around the "life of the mind." I love the flexibility academia has afforded my life, but it's a very, very sick institutional setting for a lot of people.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому +1

      I’m so sorry to read this.. I completely agree with what you’ve said. I hope you manage to find something that works for you, or at least find a way to really really take advantage of the flexibility (the one thing I miss!)

    • @Akerfeldtfan
      @Akerfeldtfan Рік тому

      @@cherylhurst I appreciate it! Your model resume was very helpful, and it's good to hear other ex-academics share their stories because you can't talk to other colleagues since they'll start divesting from you.

  • @monochromios
    @monochromios 8 місяців тому +5

    I have been an MD for 20 years. After the pandemic, my job became unbearable. My life was heavily affected by the new conditions in which it was supposed that a doctor and medical researcher had to work: no rights, continued psychological abuses, no respect. I started a psychological consult, and it helped me to regain myself. I am a human, have my rights, and deserve respect: if, after 20 years, this is not clear, it is time to leave. I have saved during my career, so money was not an issue. I resigned on July 1st, the best day in my life. I will remember forever my responsible screaming at me: "You cannot do this! (plus various insults)" and me smiling and telling her: "I already did; have good times." I graduated in philosophy in less than a year. Now, I am a writer for an excellent philosophical magazine. I am also a consultant for an ADV company, where my skills are appreciated. I do not work more than I can: I am trying to work the less I can. It is not easy to quit, but if you reach the "enough is enough" point, it is the best decision you can make. We are not a job; we are human beings.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  8 місяців тому

      Wow I’m so happy this worked out for you!! It’s not worth living an unhappy life. Congratulations 😊

  • @lilandertaler9702
    @lilandertaler9702 Рік тому +1

    Very good video! I can really relate to the points even though my situation is quite different. Just speaks for the quality and thought behind all of it 👍

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому

      Thanks very much for saying that 😊

  • @cocs88715
    @cocs88715 Рік тому +3

    Yep, totally. I didn’t give a s*#t about what I did or published while I was a postdoc. So glad that I left academia. The time to make a choice is always now, not later.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому

      Totally agree! Happy you found something that works for you

  • @thelastofgus
    @thelastofgus Рік тому +1

    This video and others have helped me a lot; great stuff and I look forward to more of your videos!

  • @nazlalagoz8616
    @nazlalagoz8616 2 роки тому +6

    Great video!!! Could you make a video on how you transitioned from academia to industry? How long did it take you to find a job you want, and how did you go about applying, networking, etc.?

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  2 роки тому +6

      Definitely will! Been so busy I’ve not made any videos lately 😅 I applied to about 10 different jobs honestly, but only took about 3 weeks to get it. I didn’t network just worked really hard on all applications to make them individual to the company

  • @katielebedeva6009
    @katielebedeva6009 Рік тому +5

    Wow this is so relatable. Have been feeling the exact same way recently in academia. Thank you for sharing!

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому

      Oh sorry you’re feeling the same but I hope it works out for you 😊

  • @martinparidon9056
    @martinparidon9056 5 місяців тому

    There's a lot of good advice in your video.
    I experienced the same thing as you. I was burned out and desperate but I knew I couldn't just quit. So I forced myself to stay until I'd find another job.
    It took me 1.5 years to find a new job. It was a terrible, terrible time for me. At the same time I had 2 friends who experienced something similar, but unlike me, they just quit without having looked for a job beforehand. Now, both have a new job.
    So, in my opinion, there is no clear path that you need to take. Maybe I could have saved myself from 1.5 years of horror or maybe it was the right decision. I'd say it depends on the particular situation.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  5 місяців тому

      I agree completely. There’s no clear path, and it’s not usually a direct line to “happiness” either. Hopefully you’ve found the right thing now!

  • @ivanescalante832
    @ivanescalante832 Рік тому

    Excellent! Hope the change do you good.

  • @OntologyofValue
    @OntologyofValue Рік тому +1

    Sounds like you have an intuitive mind and ways of making decisions and it works for you. So well done! I am curious what happened to your career next!

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому

      Thank you!! I’m setting up my next video now and will connect on LinkedIn too 😊

  • @liveandlife4347
    @liveandlife4347 4 місяці тому

    I am exactly like what you have told. Now I am doing postdocter and I am doing well. But I can't feel passion at all, and I am struggling to quit and find a new job for more than one year. But I realize more and more that it is time to change.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  4 місяці тому

      Sorry to hear you’re having a hard time. It can take a while to find a new role and a new job, so hang in there! I hope it works out for you.

  • @janedoe41276
    @janedoe41276 25 днів тому

    I got into my academic career as an adjunct, and stayed in that career-purgatory for 15 years. This is my last semester (2 weeks left!!), and then I'm switching careers. I am so DONE.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  23 дні тому

      Ah congratulations!! I really hope you enjoy whatever’s next ☺️

  • @TheMuffinBagare
    @TheMuffinBagare Рік тому +2

    So what did you do instead? What sort of job did you go to after?
    I'm not in academia per se, but I studied for 5 years to be a teacher (high school), and I'm 2,5 years into the profession at the moment. Feelin' a bit disenchanted, lacking motivation etc. I feel like I wouldn't want to stay here for the rest of my life. And I don't want to become one of those unmotivated teachers that make school seem pointless for the students...
    However, I don't know that I have a back-up plan. I don't really know what I would do with my time if I quit. I wouldn't have direction.
    So I'm curious. When you quit your job, did you have a plan whatsoever?

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому

      I ended up going into a change management/HR type role. It suits my speciality but obviously different for everyone.
      I did have a backup plan - I’d spent a lot of time googling things like “jobs for someone with [insert skill]” and essentially talked to lots of people, looked up career trajectories on LinkedIn - that kinda thing. It requires self awareness to know your skills and then find jobs that align with those. Good luck. I hope it works out for you 😊

  • @somo_nb
    @somo_nb 2 роки тому +3

    Love this video! And wow the thing that your friend said was exactly the same sentence my brother told me when I finished PhD. Talking to someone we trust is very important indeed.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  2 роки тому +1

      Thanks Som! It’s true that our friends sometimes see things we don’t. Happy you’re figuring it out now rather than later 😊

  • @AmateurPeanutButter
    @AmateurPeanutButter Рік тому

    Hi Cheryl thank you so much for sharing this. It is clear, articulate and relatable. I also watched your other video and you keep saying that we should leave for right reason, not only running away from something, which is very true. However, I also have difficulties in articulating what my aim and I want, all I know is just I don't want to be in academia anymore, and that thought started 1.5 year into my PhD (3 years ago) and now I am doing postdoc. In your next video can you talk about it more. How you navigate yourself toward what you want if you are kind clueless about it? Should we check our core value? Should we see the sector in industry? etc. Thank you so much.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому

      Yes I can definitely try to do this! Will motivate me to post another video. Thanks for watching and good luck!

  • @paulbloemen7256
    @paulbloemen7256 4 місяці тому

    I can relate to what you are telling: I already had those feelings while being a student, I couldn’t see myself doing all that difficult stuff that seemed totally irrelevant to me for years and years. I ended up taking a job in IT, I was lucky I guess, but is was my best decision ever together with marrying my wife. Good objectives, good results, mine and of the teams I worked with, I went working every day as a very happy person.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  4 місяці тому

      That’s amazing! So happy it worked out for you. Hopefully others commenting here can experience that too

  •  Рік тому +2

    Crazy times when we have to like ouur jobs and fell great about them... a job is a mean, not a destiny. However, good for you if your live is better now.

  • @kungfumartialarts
    @kungfumartialarts Рік тому +20

    I came to academia later in life after having experienced many other jobs. .There is so much to keep you interested in teaching subjects you love. Sometimes we need experiences to appreciate what we have. There are certainly negative points to academia, but, comparatively speaking, an academic position is better than much that is out there,. Keep in mind that people think jobs will fulfill them in some way. This is not the case for any job. Life-satisfaction involves a list of items, most probably.. There are people who go through a PhD and are done with writing papers or research . To that, I would say go into something else. If you like research, academia is a good option. So, I would defend academia to a point, and that is based on the amount of jobs that are far more boring and useless. When you talk about the best part of your day was going to the gym, keep in mind that you had the time to do that. Many do not. Nevertheless, I thank you for the signs that are outlined; they are helpful.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому +4

      I completely agree! I think academia has some great points and it really works for some people. I also think if I’d had a different job and then come into academia later it would have worked better for me. I definitely agree that work isn’t the only thing that gives fulfilment, but it should make you miserable either! Really pleased you enjoy academia 😊😊

    • @kungfumartialarts
      @kungfumartialarts Рік тому +1

      @effy I'm not sure I understand the reply. In academia usually after 10 years in most states, you are vested in the pension system. So, that's a positive I would highlight. Money in the bank. There's a comment below stating that it is really difficult to get a tenure track position. This is absolutely the case., and certainly a negative point. But, if you can figure out how to get ten years of pension credit, even if it accrues on a part-time basis, it is great cash. To your point that it is obvious that career is not everything. People spend time and enormous amounts of cash on becoming "something". , lawyer, doctor, nurse. Academic jobs is the topic of the video; that is what is being discussed.

  • @fajardofje
    @fajardofje Рік тому

    I totally relate, looking forward to see more of your story

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому +1

      It’s too bad you relate but I hope it works out for you too 😊 I’ll be posting an update video soon after 1 year in industry!

  • @SidikaTuncCandogan
    @SidikaTuncCandogan 2 роки тому +6

    omg, I can't relate more.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  2 роки тому +1

      Hope it works out for you! It certainly worked out for me and I’m much happier 😊

  • @janelast5177
    @janelast5177 Рік тому +3

    Am quitting soon too This really resonates with him The system is corrupted especially in publishing

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому

      I’m sorry if you’ve been having a rough time. It was the best decision for me to leave, and I’m so much happier for it. I hope you find the same 😊

  • @Physics_Dude
    @Physics_Dude Рік тому

    You remind me of Brit Marling (essay content and vocal inflections). She "quit" the corporate Wall Street scam and moved to LA to make movies. We all need to take chances. Thanks for sharing your path.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому

      That is my absolute dream! The summer before I quit I was in some made for TV movies and I’m still auditioning for small things here and there, trying out some stand up.. good on her. Thanks!

    • @Physics_Dude
      @Physics_Dude Рік тому

      @@cherylhurst - Have you watched Brit Marling's Brit Marling Georgetown Convocation Speech? It's on UA-cam. I highly recommend it. Also, I quit my teaching job in 2015 and spent 3 years making films and working on other projects in San Diego. I had to return to "the grind" but I'm ready to lift off again!

    • @cigdemylmaz1532
      @cigdemylmaz1532 Рік тому

      I am planning to leave the academia scam and move into the Wall Street scam. At least I will earn a living where I can comfortably pay for a studio apartment in nyc

  • @tindrums
    @tindrums Рік тому +2

    I work in an university as faculty. I care a shit about what others say or do. I do things my way my time. I dont work on holidays. Thats the only way u can retain sanity in academia.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому +1

      That seems to be one way to succeed! Really happy you can maintain your sanity that way.

  • @chungang7037
    @chungang7037 Рік тому +3

    I guess for me it was the opposite. I remember finishing my masters and turning onto the freeway to drive home and thought "Finally, I'm free, fuck that place I'm going somewhere else for a PhD and..." suddenly I had to pull over, had a panic attack....The panic attacks would appear every time I thought of going back for a PhD afterwards, even another school, as I knew my supervisor would try to sabotage my efforts [as he had promised he would]. I decided not to go back. It is strange, I can handle meeting horrific people and work conditions outside of academia, but I don't hold others to the same standard. Academia for me is arguably worse because if anything I find most of the people involved the most brutally selfish, self-promoting, and unapologetically arrogant pricks I have ever had to deal with. The few I met that were good people didn't matter, they rarely have any power, as the system is sick AF.

    • @notquiteordinary
      @notquiteordinary Рік тому +1

      Yep they're the worst ppl on the planet. They view themselves as Gods

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому +2

      Ugh that sounds awful. I had my first panic attack during my phd. I’m happy you made the right choice for you!

    • @chungang7037
      @chungang7037 Рік тому

      @@cherylhurst Thanks! and thanks for sharing, it helps many of us more than you can know.

  • @cyang4432
    @cyang4432 Рік тому +3

    As a last-year phd student, I can relate so much to your video. I've been thinking about getting a postdoc job lately, but the idea only makes me even more anxious, and I feel exactly like I am stepping into someone else's race, since I was only starting to consider a postdoc job when my peer students were competing to get one. I constantly feel burnt out, even after a day off or a 12-hour sleep. I had nightmares about mixing my supervisor and a mobster I saw on TV.......I spent more time fixing my mental state than working on my thesis. Now, I decide to find an administrative job instead of an academic job, and I can feel the pressure leaving my body....

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому

      Oh I’m so happy to hear that! I hope you have a strong network around you to support you. It can be tough as a transition but your mental health is too important to not work on it 😊

  • @kalidwapur
    @kalidwapur Рік тому

    I can relate but I still love my research for now. I have almost never however seen a post doc with a year of salary saved. It possible to leave without that, scary but possible.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому +1

      It’s great you love your research! Definitely scary, and for me it was a few years ago and in a cheap city. Not sure I could do it now / in an expensive area

    • @kalidwapur
      @kalidwapur Рік тому

      @@cherylhurst also I live in Europe we have an unfortunately deteriorating but very useful, social safety net that can help with the transition.

  • @yanj111
    @yanj111 Рік тому +3

    one gets paid so much less in academia and has to work way harder, this is a place needs a lot of passion for the job itself and one can afford the low return. it is not for everyone.
    I worked in academia for 20 years, and left it 4 years ago. I would say academic career takes certain type of person, who is good at applying funding and networking, which I am none of both.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому +2

      Very true! hope you prefer your job now!

    • @cigdemylmaz1532
      @cigdemylmaz1532 Рік тому +3

      Academia no longer rewards deep thinkers, it is mostly networkers who get rewarded.

  • @scottbrandon6244
    @scottbrandon6244 Рік тому +2

    I imagine a person with a PhD in organizational psychology has the luxury of quitting a tenure track job. There are a number of jobs that could be done in the business world or consulting. Many disciplines don't afford that luxury. Getting a tenure track job is like winning a job lottery. There are very few university teaching jobs compared to the number of PhDs on the job market. Think of many PhD in the humanities and some social sciences. There are not that many options in the real world. Think of a PhD in Classics or Comparative Literature.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому +3

      I agree completely - academia as a career is no longer fit for purpose and there are too many phds for the number of jobs available. I don’t think we need more phds.
      You’re also right that i was very lucky to choose something with obvious transferable skills. I’m very aware of how difficult the job market is. That doesn’t mean people shouldn’t try to find new roles with transferable skills if they’re unhappy.

  • @CapitanNaufrago
    @CapitanNaufrago Рік тому

    Just do it! There's light at the end of the tunnel. There's so much world out there to explore.

  • @Str8UpFax
    @Str8UpFax Рік тому

    What are you doing now instead? I'm working on my PhD in biochem and I'm already feeling like this.. I think I want to go into industry leading a team and working with machines

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому +1

      I work in People now, essentially HR- so very different to before. I have lots of friends who went into STEM roles, computer science, UX, and data science though. Hopefully you can find resources to help you find the right role 😊

  • @DannyBoy443
    @DannyBoy443 Рік тому

    The apartment is a huge plus, good find. I'll agree w/ most of what she's saying as long as you actually do deep work and go external first. Then go internal. The temper and flare ups are a good unhealthy sign that you need to leave yes. I'm a little resentful of her for being able to talk to her parents about this lol. I can't. Does anyone else have "simple" parents and feel that way? I'm changing careers to tech and because there are already a few tech people in my fam, they're not really "impressed" because I wasn't one of the first to get into it. I hate it lol

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому

      Hey! I get your point about my parents, I’m really really lucky in that sense. I hope you can find other people to speak to and maybe even get some replies here of people who are in the same position? Reddit is a great place for specific leaving academia advice (there’s lots of nasty people there you need to ignore) but I did read Reddit a lot to see how other people handled it.
      Also there’s a few academics in my family (not my parents) so when I got my phd it wasn’t that big a deal. I wouldn’t worry about being the first into tech or not, just do what’s right for you!

  • @courtnayzeitler8564
    @courtnayzeitler8564 Рік тому +2

    Quit my shitty academic job as well. Thanks to Jordan Peterson, whose wise words gave me the courage to do so.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому +1

      Glad to hear you’re better off for it!

  • @BParis-kj5qo
    @BParis-kj5qo Рік тому

    I have a question. What you said resonates with me. However, your retirement pland could be possible thanks to your academic job in the first hand? salary, other non financial benefit, social capital etc. Can u elaborate on that?

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому

      Good questions - I can make a video to elaborate. There’s three things I considered, 1. I didn’t think being miserable for 50 years was worth a retirement plan one day,
      2. My new job does have good benefits (I’m in the U.K. and work at a bank, so the benefits aren’t bad),
      3. My potential future earnings are higher now than they were in academia and im a good saver. I feel confident that I can continue to earn more now and invest for retirement, whereas the cap in academia is lower… hope that helps!

  • @Biology_lady
    @Biology_lady Рік тому

    I lived inside the academia vicious cycle for too long, so I can relate to this

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому +1

      Sorry to hear that.. I hope it worked out for you in the end 😊

  • @MarkSeifter-n8o
    @MarkSeifter-n8o 6 місяців тому +1

    Pointlessness??!! Of course. THAT is the essence of academia. Burnout and quitting consumes perhaps the majority of people employed in academia-especially at the graduate level. Don't expect creativity or self-respect to be welling up constantly from your work in academia, or your presence there as a PhD student, engaged in studying for that endless thesis.

  • @saphone9758
    @saphone9758 2 роки тому +2

    Permanent lectureship?

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  2 роки тому +2

      Yes.. as opposed to a fixed term contract. It’s similar in rank to assistant professor in the USA./Canada. But U.K. doesn’t have the same tenure process.

  • @billking8843
    @billking8843 Рік тому

    I am in a casual academic research job ATM. I got it after 10 months of being unemployed. It is important research on Covid and satisfying intellectually. I would swap for a more secure job but nobody will let me move out of the university sector.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому

      That is tough- secure jobs are hard to come by. I hope it works out for you!

  • @Tony-pk6ql
    @Tony-pk6ql Рік тому

    Wow, great video.

  • @Brockdorf
    @Brockdorf Рік тому +1

    UGH, you can make the same amount of money as a high school teacher in the US.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому +2

      When I think of how I acted in high school… you couldn’t pay me enough! 😅

  •  Рік тому +1

    It seems that Academia suffered a strong process of precarization... may be better to do something about it. Unions in other countries also work this sector.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому +1

      There’s incredibly strong unions at unis in the U.K., they’ve been on strike for this reason on and off for quite some time. I don’t think it’s crazy to want to enjoy your job and to make a decision to get out of a bad one.

    •  Рік тому

      @@cherylhurst you mean that there is not possible solution? That's sound sad... I hope Mexico preserve the good conditions that we have in the academy.

  • @Howtogetfluent
    @Howtogetfluent Рік тому +1

    Great video, Cheryl. I left academia (history) 20 yrs ago now. I enjoyed my role much more than (from the sound of it) you do, really appreciated many aspects, but I really didn't feel it was the "right" fit at that stage and I was looking ahead thinking, what would I be like in five, ten...yrs if I stay put. I think the demands of the sector have only got worse since then. As regards telling other people: I wouldn't tell any colleauges until you've told your boss. These things have a way of getting around it's known that you're leaving, your position has changed overnight to "departure lounge". Geeky YT q: how do you do the blue "slide in from the left" background with text? I've been trying to find something like this (for Final Cut Pro) for ages, with no success. Is it a plug-in?

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому

      Oh yes really good point! I didn’t tell any of my colleagues except those at other institutions who were having similar thoughts. RE the UA-cam question.. I actually think this is a plug-in that came with my final cut? If not it’s a free one I downloaded. I’ll have a look at let you know!

    • @Howtogetfluent
      @Howtogetfluent Рік тому

      @@cherylhurst thanks, would be great if you could :)

  • @88tongued
    @88tongued 7 місяців тому

    That's so funny. I'm having a reverse situation where there's something inside me nagging "I should be doing academic research!"

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  7 місяців тому

      Doing Research is great, I miss it sometimes - but doing it professionally isn’t always what it seems

  • @emmanuelameyaw9735
    @emmanuelameyaw9735 5 місяців тому

    Just 8 years of university?

  • @PZJBimha
    @PZJBimha Рік тому

    Insightful

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому

      Have you had a similar experience at all?

    • @PZJBimha
      @PZJBimha Рік тому

      Nope. I am still trying to get into a full-tenure track position.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому +1

      That’s great!! Good luck 😊

  • @khl170
    @khl170 Рік тому +1

    Why no one talks good stuff about PhD? Everyone just say this is BA's thing to do. Is there anyone that satisfy?

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому +1

      Definitely! They just aren’t usually on UA-cam 😊 also I enjoyed my PhD, just not academia afterward

    • @khl170
      @khl170 Рік тому +1

      @@cherylhurst I want to study my PhD in Europe but I am not sure about it cuz many on UA-cam are dissatisfy with it. I don't know if I can handle it by myself or not. I was so happy that I am gonna take my PhD in Europe but after such videos I lost my enthusiasm. And I don't know full funding will help me to cover my accommodation and monthly food needs.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому +2

      @@khl170I enjoyed my PhD a lot - it was hard but I met great friends and learned a lot. If you’re excited you should go for it! Make the right choice for you depending on your career goals 😊

  • @hommerd
    @hommerd Рік тому

    You are smart and brave.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому

      That’s very kind, I’m sure you are too

  • @enavigatorE
    @enavigatorE 8 місяців тому +3

    Academia doesn’t value my technical skill set other than teaching ability. Thinking about starting my own company.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  8 місяців тому +1

      Good luck! There’s lots of options outside of academia

  • @sahilgupta221
    @sahilgupta221 Рік тому

    We follow you on some social media platforms?

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому

      I only have UA-cam and Twitter 😊 cherylmhurst

  • @literology1329
    @literology1329 6 місяців тому

    Girl they are begging for professors in Florida and georgia.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  6 місяців тому

      Are they!? Not American 😭

  • @lloovvaallee
    @lloovvaallee Рік тому +1

    A lot of kvetching here from somebody who appears to occupy a luxury apartment.

  • @MrProy33
    @MrProy33 Рік тому

    People who feel the way you describe are not the ones at the top, not the ones doing invigorating ressearch that pushes their discipline forward. You instinctively recognized that you are mediocre as an academic. Your speech here sounds nothing like the words of visionsries, the movers and shakers, in each discipline.
    It's good that you left, because you were likely doing more harm than intended in the classroom. It would be better if you recognized that you weren't cut out to be a professor. There is no shame in admitting you chose the wrong career.
    More academics need to be reflexive, and analyze their life goals before committing to a career in the scademy. If you have the teaching mindset, and it's truly your passion, you won't wash out--you'll thrive.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому

      Okay!

    • @TheBoldPhD
      @TheBoldPhD Рік тому +1

      So you are going around leaving comments on other people's videos too. Hahaha. Oh Mr. Proy33. 😆

    • @ciobalina7445
      @ciobalina7445 Рік тому +4

      It's clear you don't work in academia. Being a university professor is about publishing not about teaching. You get tenure based on points from articles and books and not on points about how good you are as a teacher. If you like teaching more, it's better to choose a highschool or middle school.

  • @dperricone81
    @dperricone81 9 місяців тому

    The research part is pointless. No one who makes decisions will ever read it. The teaching part, though…

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  9 місяців тому

      The research part is the most important in terms of progression, but teaching in terms of impact (in my view!)

  • @a.a.7416
    @a.a.7416 3 місяці тому

    I have worked at universities in 6 different countries. I am earning as much, probably more than I would in real-world industries. I love conducting field research, learning about business people, their journeys, their words of wisdom... most of all, I love publishing my work based on my own merits, not by being friends of journal editors. I made the right decision to move to academia, with all the cheating, nepotism, hypocrisy and wokeism. However, I know it will be much harder to work here in 10-15 years and I do not think I would be able to cope with the increasing wokeism.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  3 місяці тому

      What is wokeism in this context?

    • @a.a.7416
      @a.a.7416 3 місяці тому

      @@cherylhurst Mmmm, really? Do I need to explain it to someone living in Canada? It will be risky because WOKE UA-cam is watching. How about?: People following the woke narrative that predominates on many campuses, such as taking certain political/moral and other stances just because they are the flavour of the day or because people want to feel virtue signalling and morally 'superior' by taking the side of the alleged underprivileged groups while despising other groups implicitly/explicitly or directly/indirectly.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  3 місяці тому

      Ah. One of those. Have a nice life ✌🏻

    • @a.a.7416
      @a.a.7416 3 місяці тому

      @@cherylhurst One of those... it sounds very tolerant and open-minded. I wish you many UA-cam subscribers.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  3 місяці тому

      That’s so kind, thanks so much!!!

  • @drbonesshow1
    @drbonesshow1 Рік тому

    Some people are quitters. I prefer to get fired. Then I get fired up!

  • @MarkSeifter-n8o
    @MarkSeifter-n8o 6 місяців тому +1

    The point is: there are TOO MANY PEOPLE engaged in graduate study in the USA and Great Britain. There are too many paid slaves-oops, I meant teaching and research assistants and adjunct instructors-busily engaged in that path to nowhere: NO PROMOTION to something better paying and more meaningful. Graduate school was not designed to absorb, productively and with good reimbusement, the number of people it is now taking in each year. And DON'T EVEN THINK of there being jobs outside of the coil of academia that have some minimal relation to all the years you sat through, and all the work you did in Cinema Studies, Ethno-Queer (that word still is offensive to me; it is GAY) Studies, Art History, History in general, Political Science, Philosophy, Religion, ad nauseum. And do you think that your university is going to move you into some corner office with an Assistant Prof. title plate nailed on its door, a decent salary, a workable teaching schedule, once you finish up your endless PhD? Better bet: buy a lottery ticket and follow the televised winnings.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  6 місяців тому +1

      You seem really passionate about this! Hope your choices work out for you

    • @MarkSeifter-n8o
      @MarkSeifter-n8o 5 місяців тому

      @@cherylhurst Yes I am passionate about this. I hope you are not being condescending here.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  5 місяців тому +1

      @@MarkSeifter-n8oabsolutely not! I think we need more people passionate to make a change ☺️

  • @stoneageprogrammer432
    @stoneageprogrammer432 Рік тому +1

    Great. So glad to see that rich, beautiful, young people in a high-paying, ivory tower job can just pop right into ANOTHER high-paying job without too much trouble. Meanwhile, at 51, I'm stuck with a car that doesn't run, forced to stay home and NOT work while my rich young millennial spoiled brat narcissist roommate leaves me to feed his dog while he bangs his gf in another state.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Рік тому

      I really hope things turn around for you.

    • @stoneageprogrammer432
      @stoneageprogrammer432 Рік тому

      @@cherylhurst well, I also just tested positive on a colorectal cancer test a month ago, so I'm doubtful, but I've become vegetarian and I walk 2 hours a day now, so we'll see. Right now, I just hope I have enough for food for this month. $107 left in the bank, so we'll see...

  • @andyprompt
    @andyprompt Рік тому

    Nice apartment

  • @ROForeverMan
    @ROForeverMan Рік тому +1

    Academia is a religion, the religion of materialism. It has nothing to do with what it is supposed to do: finding Truth.

  • @suchismitakar2154
    @suchismitakar2154 9 місяців тому

    1:13 😅 sameee

  • @harrychu650
    @harrychu650 Місяць тому +1

    No man or women will ever find fulfillment in "work." Build a family.

  • @mickeykozzi
    @mickeykozzi 10 місяців тому

    Pity she doesnt have a real phd

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  10 місяців тому

      Yes such a pity 😭😭😭😭😭😭😭

  • @English_Learning_Source
    @English_Learning_Source Рік тому

    Sorry, losing focus as u are so beautiful, captivating, and may u get a decent job.

  • @encefalord
    @encefalord Рік тому

    Cientific research is 100% artificial intelligence

  • @yxx_chris_xxy
    @yxx_chris_xxy 9 місяців тому

    2:00 "there are more important things I could contribute to the world" ... by becoming a youtube influencer?

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  9 місяців тому +2

      Omg yes!!!!!! With my limited videos and random uploads, this is my life now!!!!!!

  • @HUEHUEUHEPony
    @HUEHUEUHEPony 6 місяців тому

    Not all "academies" are equal, if you study engineering, this video is pointless/useless

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  6 місяців тому +1

      Great insight thanks so much for your considered and helpful response!!!!!!!!!!!

  • @andrewnguyen3312
    @andrewnguyen3312 8 місяців тому +1

    Academia sucks , def should leave

  • @mariachiingles2348
    @mariachiingles2348 Місяць тому

    You can't save 6-12 months salary if you're an academic in the UK. Either you risk it or you line up a job.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  Місяць тому

      It’s definitely getting less and less possible unfortunately.

  •  7 місяців тому +1

    You don't need to talk to much, everyone understands how toxic the academia is.

    • @cherylhurst
      @cherylhurst  7 місяців тому

      Cool thanks for watching 👍🏻