Thaon di Revel class (Pattugliatore Polivalente d'Altura - PPA) | Is it an offshore patrol vessel?
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- Опубліковано 5 лип 2024
- We are investigating the Thaon di Revel-class multipurpose offshore patrol vessel of the Italian Navy. #OPV #italiannnavy #warship
Why did Italy develop a multipurpose offshore patrol vessel like the Thaon di Revel class?
Has the PPA met the initial criteria of the Italian Navy?
Why did Italy reduce the number of vessels that would be built?
Is the Thaon di Revel class an offshore patrol vessel or a frigate?
00:00 Introduction
01:00 Programme history
02:35 Design
06:12 General characteristics
07:29 Armament (127mm LW127 gun / 76mm Strales gun / 25mm KBA 25/80 gun / Teseo Mk2/E anti-ship missile / Aster 15 and Aster 30 air defence missiles / 324mm Black Arrow lightweight torpedo)
10:06 Analysis
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Italians were always very innovative shipbuilders, while also managing to make their ships look impressive and beautiful at the same time.
idk but PPA looks downright ugly with its big a** mast but its fairly powerful of a ship though.
I had the opportunity to see the Francesco Morosini (P431), second ship of the class, up close in Ho Chi Minh City, Viet Nam a few months back. Quite an impressive vessel.
agree, not at al a failure!! very modern and heavy armed
Probably one of the best if not the best of it's class, italy as always making both beautiful and extremely effective ships.
Indonesians future war ship!!
an OPV that can rival with many front line frigates of other navies. 👍
Italy offers cutting-edge PPA Paolo Thaon class to Indonesia .
its more like a fully armed frigate as a high sea patrol vessel!
Italy's golden opportunity to be friendly with Indonesia. Those who need a large number of warships in the TNI shopping list will buy 4 destroyers🤭
The Thaon Di Revel class is not exactly intended as a "cheap, less capable" frigate then the Bergamini Class. It is substantially different in use. The Bergamini is a fleet defence ship, fully integrated in the air defence dome.
The Thaon Di Revel Is a "a lone wolf", able to defend itself and other civilian ships, which has, as main design asset, it's speed and flexibility. It is in fact noticeably faster then the Bergamini Class and can easily be configured for support missions, where the Bergamini is rather more limited. It's Ability to carry modular large containers without impeding the hangar was its main design focus. It also can be operated with a lower number of men, especially in the bridge area, which massively reduce operational costs.
The Ship which is a PPA (Multirole Patrol Ship) and not a Frigate, is aimed at surveillance and protection of shipping lanes, where Bergamini capabilities would be overkill. The PPA is also quite flexible, when it comes to disaster relief operations, despite not being a dedicated ship, with the option to be fully equipped for the task. Yet, unlike a Corvette or a LCS, it can hold its own in a deep water fleet, possibly slaved to a Bergamini or a Doria class, as it carries the same SA missile and a compatible 3D radar systems.
This is possibly the reason behind the decision by the Italian navy to upgrade the Light PPA to full or light plus, or possibly an hybrid version, as it makes no sense to take off the existing C Band radar module instead of just adding the X band antennas to have a complete radar suit.
I'm not sure about the full ASW suit, but the high costs and low number of Bergamini class ASW in service would make it a good choice, with Syria acting as a Russian hub for submarines in the Mediterranean.
The war environment is always evolving, so I'd not be surprised to hear of more changes to the PPA program.
The new asset of a common European blue water defence, (E-NACSOS/PESCO) forsees a full range of patrol ships that can be commonly operated by all the members, so the existing Light PPA (design before the agreement) can be equipped for more complex duties. The European Patrol Corvette has emerged in 2021, so it could take over the duties of the PPA Light, as the EU program will allow for a large fleet which will not be sustainable for a single Navy.
Still, the PPA is very capable for a fleet with limited resources and could be an interesting export variant for many navies which do not need, or cannot afford, a FREMM, due to its flexibility and ease of configuration swapping for any required roles.
[Edit] There is currently interest from Indonesia for supply of 2 Thaon the Revel ships (2023)
There is also an evolution in the design of 2 upcoming FREMM EVO, which will inherit the main deck of the Thaon di Revel, with it's cockpit and the AESA twin band radar in place of the rotating superstructure currently mounted.
Non fa una piega.
Allow me to make a clarification in your correct speech, the European corvettes are 3200/600 tons while the PPAs are double, so the EPCs I believe are more for border or Mediterranean use
@@met71metaldetector55 You are right, but the geopolitical situation is ever changing.
The EPC will be deployed in the Exclusive Economic area of Italy, providing rescue for Migrants and fishing routes, low tech Pirates and smugglers control; this will also save a lot of operational costs and wearing for the PPA fleet.
The problems with the original PPA idea came with the war in Ukraine and Palestine and what followed. What used to be Pirate control missions in the Red sea turned out into a much more lethal environment, with the Houti shooting cruise, ballistic missiles and drones. A light configuration won't cut there any more.
In the meantime, Anti Submarine Warfare suddenly became a priority after the sabotage of the North Stream Pipelines, demonstrating how vulnerable Strategic energy infrastructure can be at sea. Most of the Italian FREMM were designed in multi purpose configuration, but now rumors are that all the 4 upcoming frigates, the two replacements for the Schergat and Bianchi, sold to Egypt, and the upcoming 2 EVO, will be in ASW configuration plus a 127mm main gun.
Now that Indonesia has purchased the two PPA in fitting stage, Lauria and Millelire (both Light+), I expect the Thaon di Revell and the Morosini to be refitted to FULL configuration, with the two replacement been financed in 2024, also in Full configuration. The main difference, aside a slightly less capable radar surveillance suite, for the Light +, is in ASW capability, and this way only the Montecuccoli, among the PPA, will remain in Light+ configuration (but easily upgradable), which is not a big deal. All the PPA will maintain their Rescue and support capability when needed.
This will bring the MMI to a total of 8 ASW FREMM ad 6 ASW capable PPA, for a total of 2 Duilio, 12 FREMM and 7 PPA with advanced AA capabilities.
This way all the PPA will become fully fledged frigates, barely inferior to the FREMM ASW variant due to lack of a bow sonar, but with the same sonar trailing system.
Apparently the Aster 15 missile will also be replaced by multiple CAMM-ER launchers, (possibly 3 per Sliver tube), keeping the Aster 30 Block 1NT for ballistic missile interception, substantially increasing the endurance of the Italian fleet to saturation AS attacks.
横須賀に来た時にくまの型と並んで係留されてる映像があるけど、日本とイタリアの船に対する考えが比較ができて面白いな
fino agli anni 70 il giappone ha copiato tutte le classi di navi da quelle italiane, poi è cambiato tutto perchè l' italia non è circondata dalla nord korea, russia e cina, oltre a paesi poco amici a causa dei massacri fatti dall esercito giapponese contro i civili della sud korea, filippine e birmania, quindi se la vostra marina ha navi con sistema aegis e missili SM2/3 è per necessita', per altri tipi di navi la situazione si capovolge, perche' non potete competere con il gigante Fincantieri.
Great video of a beautiful ship. Love your videoes.
Beautiful?? You blind?
@@jonathanlegg4308 it's indeed a beautiful ship. Go check the comments of every video about this ships and you can only find people praising the aesthethic of this wonderful vessel.
It was a wonderful video about PPA patrol marine vassals for the Italian naval fleet...video clearly explained all characteristics of that remarkable Italian vassal thank you, 🙏 respectful ( weapon detective) channel..for sharing this video
Considerably better than the RN River-class offshore patrol vessels. Yet both likely given the very same duties to perform.
Yes while both are classed as Patrol Vessels the PPA is a Frigate in all but name - a better comparison would be with the Type 31.
Initially they had to make 3 versions, the n2 light, n3 light +, n2 full, the full ones are fully armed frigates, today the light versions They will be configured as full and the 3 light + will be more anti-aircraft and anti-missile frigates, Italy can count on 17 frigates
Fincantieri top!
Nice piece
Good video. The story of the evolution of the destroyer reminded me of the movie Pentagon Wars.
It indeed reminds 😊
"What if we could make them submerge?
And they should have a loading ramp, so that they could land troops directly onto the beach."
@@FallenPhoenix86 🤣🤣
This is so far just the best video i have found on youtube showing the ship in detail. Describing things clearly.
Btw, the ship is equiped with only 16 VLS, i wonder whether the vls number can be added more?
And why this ship is not equiped with hull mounted sonar? Thanks
Fantastic
This is the best destroyer concept I have seen. Intentional weak stats to conceal her 6000 tons capabilities with light and light+ options. Other than low ready to fire missile capacity, there is no downgrade. And this aspect might not even be considered as a downgrade, if we think about importance of EW will be in the future.
The two cannons are the real dangerous weapon. The volcano munitions for the OTO Melara 127/64 and the Davide/Strales system for the 76/62 are game changers. A few days ago a Davide/strales system shot down an Houthi drone at a distance of 7 Km using two shots (of three projectiles each)
Make a video on the Italian aircraft carrier Cavour
Indonesia already buy 2 PPA with full spect 1,18 billion Euro
Can you feature the Fridjtof Nansen and Daegu Class Frigates?
Can we get a video about the german U212 class (plus export variants, future CD upgrade) next?
We will built with the Italian shipyard three U212 subs. For our own navy we will built only two🙄
can u make video about georgian lazika ifv?
The full versions are nice like frigates but looking very top-heavy. That bridge and radar system would fit much better on a 7,000 ton of ship
The full version that the light will become full are 6400 tons
one has to ask what is a light plus version and what is the point if you already have light ans full versions.
The less armed light vehicles with patrol role will be transformed into full ones, the light + ones will have the anti-aircraft missile defense system, the full ones will be with various types of armament How they quiver
Which is more advaced technologi ppa or freem
CIC on the bridge. Interesting.
Quite a vulnerable position, that was surprising.
🤺👀😉
I also think it is risky for first-line combat duties
CIC on the bridge because it's not meant for first line combat...
Ahh yes takling about modulerait, it would be nice to se a video about the stand flex system then, but a good informative video
She look like she can turn herself into a giant mecha robot...😅
Great ship. But it is a frigate armed as an OPV
She has looks that only a mother can love
I dunno, it’s not that ugly
Indonesian new PPA
Indonesian akusisi ship navy
It's not a patrol vessel nor a real fregate. Too big and costly for the first purpose to little armed for the second. One solution could to arm all units to full standard and something more in terms of VLS (at mid ship) with an add on module and a couple more of effective CIWS like 35 mm Oerlikon Millenium and another 76 mm. Than it could be used as an alternative fregate to the FREMM. For patrolling should be used a smaller vessel like the European Patrol Corvette at about 3000 tons. This one looks to be more indicate to be fitted in patrol version and first line version with different engines, armament and number of VLS.
So you'll repeat the mistake made with the LCS. To build a class of "military" ships that can't be used in battle for lack of equipment, and are not that good in humanitarian missions for lack of space.
It doesn't cost that much more to build a 4500 tons ship instead of a 3000 tons one (that's why even the Legend class cutters of the Coast Guard are 4500 tons). What costs is the equipment installed, and the maintenance it requires. It's more economical to build a single class of modular ships than two classes.
Guided shell armament and reusable torpedoes feels ahead of the curve to me. But the Light variant does seem too vulnerable without SAMs.
But the light version have the SAMs too
The Light Variant is not intended for operation in areas where missile defence is required: imagine an international mission to patrol the Gulf of Aden, or the Indonesian sea, where pirates roam the area armed with a heavy machine gun or, may be, unguided man held rockets. Unless you are facing hostiles armed with several anti ship weapons, the 127mm is plenty enough to scare them of.
Another mission where the Light is ideal is in disaster relief operation, where the empty areas of the ship, like the VML slot, can be used to accomodate more crew.
If the area is not safe enough for patrol there are other, more sophisticated PPA that could take the job, possibly accompanied by a small fleet.
This being said, the change in EU costal defence, has made the Light Variant redundant, as more, less capable ships are now required all across the EU costal waters.
The danger posed by cheap drones has also to be considered, something that came to attention only after the last conflict between Armenia and Azerbaijan. A cheap drone can deal massive damage to a billion € worth ship, which makes better AA worth the expense, even if both the 127mm and 76mm on board are very good at dealing with this kind of menaces.
All the Light PPA will be converted either to Full or a Full/Light+ hybrid as the AESA 3D Dual Band Radar, just need the X-band antennas and the VML system can be added to the area now used for crew accommodation. I don't know if the whole anti sub suite will be added or not, but ti can be added at any time if needed, as the modular design allows for a simple slot in instead of requiring extensive and destructive retrofitting of the ship.
The light ships have the sole role of patrol vessels, while the light+ can be used as patrol boats and escort ships, while the full ships are frigates of the line.The light and + in the event of conflict are designed to become full, so they will not be vulnerable in these war contexts, let's say that in peacetime it is useless to make them all Frigates
Consider However, as an anti-aircraft and short-range missile defense, the 76 strales stern gun which with dart ammunition has excellent effectiveness at
The light is the patrol version but will be transformed into full, these ships can be modified by adding armament packages.
Next content kirov battle cruiser analysis
There is only one reason and one reason alone why todays 10000t frigates are still called frigates ! And thats cause its sound cheaper/smaller to taxpayer who has is in most chase little to no clue !
Ticonderogas got called cruisers for the reason they were too expensive for destroyers.
German frigates weren't called destroyers, as destroyers sounded too aggressive.
In fact, you can call your rubber dingy a battleship if you want, as there are no hard rules anyway. Even the Washington treaty ship classifications were just an agreement, but no rule.
🤺🤷😉
Nope, but it does give me dyslexia!
that is a weird looking ship looks like somebody couldn't decide what they want it too be used for so made it capable of doing a bit of everything. it seems to big for patrol boat but too small for a frigate.
This ship was thinked exactely knowing what they want it to be. It's a multipurpose Offshore patrol ship, it's exactely made to fulfill multiple roles.
Regarding your confusion on light, light+, full variants:
1. Light: Offshore Patrol duty set up.
2. Light+: Frigate weapons and systems set up.
3: Full: Heavy Frigate/Destroyer weapons and systems set up.
@@solinvictus1234 iam sure that is the case but it just looks like somebody designed it and half way through thought lets add this and that capability on.
@@poil8351the main use for the ship, as it was designed in 2015 (before the Ukraine shitshow) was to be easily set up for the task without the need for invasive and expensive refit in dockyard. The weird shape in the middle is designed for container storing, wile keeping the helicopter operation functional. One of the main missions for the ship is disaster relief operation, where you need to carry heavy water distillers and medical supplies on place. The radar is 100% modular, so you can just slot in the antennae and the modules for X-Band side by side to the C-Band (or vice versa) and have a very capable heavy AA frigate in the Light+ or Full configuration.
The light PPA can slot a VML module straight in and become fully operational as a fleet vessel, sharing resources with the more capable FREMM and Horizon.
Not being fully committed is a deliberate choice, not an afterthought.
BTW, with how the world has evolved in the last 5 years, after the first PPA laid down, I expect a lot of changes: the EU is fully committed to create an interservice heavy corvette system for sea patrol which could take over the PPA offshore duties, while the need for Capable Blue Water ships has increased tenfold, with ASW becoming a priority again in the Mediterranean after the end if the Cold War. Syria is now acting as a main hub for Russian submarines outside of the black sea, and, as the ASW FREMM are few and very expensive, I'd not be surprised to see the PPA upgraded and enhanced for the role.
Being modular and flexible, in hindsight, is a blessing, given this ships are already built and can easily be adapted to counter new menaces.
I agree that a ship built on purpose is easier to build and certainly less expensive then a ship that can be modularly adapted if needed, but it fixes you in the choices you made a decade before the ship becomes fully operational. The choice to replace the Light PPAs with other ships and the flexibility to bring them to the standards needed for a possible new cold war has massive value.
140m is as big as frigate
Impressive looking but definitely not beautiful. She reminds me of that Tom Clancy line, (iirc) 'any beauty that she had was completely incidental'.
Pure ugly.
Certainly, none of the renown italian designers took part on this abomination...
What an expensive 'OPV' hahahahahaha. Europeans going crazier and crazier with costs....
It's the opposite, but you should understand something to know that.
It is not an "OPV" and it's certainly less expensive then a FREMM, which it will supplement, sharing the same weapon systems.
On the flip side, it's a much faster ship, to get where needed and has greater flexibility when it comes to disaster relief missions, something that is often an afterthought in many military designs. Expensive? After a fashion, but if you can afford it, the modular design gives you extreme flexibility to adapt to operational scenarios that can changes on a whim, much faster then any design takes from being just an idea to launch.
it's exactly the opposite! you should not only watch but also listen!
Instead it costs less not only to build them but above all for the maintenance of these ships they are halved, already half the staff is needed to operate them
This is modular flexibility multipurpose vessel , it can be supply logistic vessel , hospital humanitarian relief support vessel, opv patrol, corvette and fregat depends on the mission. Very good idea Don Italiano
Ugh, it’s hideous
Not good design.😕
What an ugly ship...give me a Type 42 any day.
Great, so you can be sunked better, but inside a gorgerous ship.
There are a few on the ocean floor around Argentina
@ronmaximilian6953 Your point is?
@@solinvictus1234Can't really compare ships made 40 years apart.
@@admiralmallard7500 You mean Type 42? It's right.