It seems as though it depends on the context. The most loving thing I can do for my family when their lives are threatened, is protect them from an aggressor. However, if the government comes for me because I am a Christian, the most loving thing I can do for God is to give myself up as he did when the authorities came for him.
That being said; as a fellow believer, I love you John Piper, and even though I disagree, I still believe you are a good and Godly man. Keep spreading the Gospel of Jesus Christ and witnessing to others. You are doing great work! 😎🙏
And He said to them, "But now, whoever has a money belt is to take it along, likewise also a bag, and whoever has no sword is to sell his coat and buy one. Luke 22:36
I like John Piper's approach to any subject because he approaches it biblically, and he doesn't just shoot from the top of his head without thinking it through biblically...he thinks like a GOD fearing man who loves his LORD and SAVIOUR JESUS CHRIST and not just like a Republican or an American for that matter...I dont always see eye to eye with John Piper, but I have great respect for my brother and I always like to hear what he has to say...
I work hard to not over generalize groups of people. Please keep in mind that some Americans and Republicans may be Christian as with other political parties and other Christian denominations. There were 7 churches in Asia Minor and (I think) only 2 of them ministered the truth correctly. God knows our intentions and our love for him he will judge us individually and not by our denominations or by our pastor's beliefs. May God be with you and your family. I am and advocate for personal self defense and the defense of the innocent as long as I feel it is right. But I'm new at this.
I respect you, John Piper, and have little variation in opinion with you on any topic I’ve heard you cover, apart from the subject of self defense and defending ones family (or any victim) from bodily harm and death. If God has established government for the defense and justice of its populace, has He not imbued the same right- and more with the head of the family? As husbands, fathers and able bodied men, do we not only carry the right but also the responsibility of protecting our children, wives and innocents from evil to the extent of using lethal force? If government is the head of the people and man the head of the family, how can you reason that it is improper for a man to defend his wife and children from rape, death or forced internment by the state? If a murderer or rapist breaks into your home, armed, and begins to murder or harm your children and wife, what is your recourse? Why would it be permissible to call another man (police) to come and rescue your family (using lethal force) whilst you helplessly watch the perpetrator harm them until the police arrive? Is it not only your right but your RESPONSIBILITY to defend your own family rather than outsource the dirty work to another man. I don’t follow the logic. If man is the head of family and government the head of man, it is only logical that man has authority (to be exercised in a godly manner) over his family and is charged to protect them. While I believe that each man must answer to the call of his own conscience and conviction from the Lord, I don’t believe your stance on this aligns with the over arching message, story and spirit of the Word of God. There are example after example of God not only urging his people to fight, but even strengthening and helping them do so. Even in Nehemiah the people (citizens, not soldiers) and told to guard the city with sword and spear and Nehemiah urges them all to fight to the death for their wives, children and brethren. As Gods word is unchanging (although under a new covenant) I don’t believe that stance has changed. That being said, I do believe there is a time and place for sacrifice unto death, but when that time comes, I believe His Spirit will impress it upon our soul; but I do not believe it to be the default position, in the same way I don’t believe you should default to helping those in need at the expense of placing your family in unnecessary risk of harm. Would it be Christlike to house a pedophile in need when you have children or would it be exposing your children to unnecessary evil due to faulty understanding of the Word? I appreciate you prefacing your argument by stating it as your opinion and not the unwavering truth. Thank you for all that you and your team do!
The Bible says there is a time to fight, hate, kill, a time for war. We have a moral responsibility to defend others and self, to preserve peace and liberty.
But this is not the time to KILL as Christ as commanded his faithful followers to "LOVE your enemies". It's impossible to kill them and then say......."I really loved them Lord".
@@earnestlycontendingforthef5332 I don't believe you could say "I loved my neighbor" either if you refused to use necessary force to prevent a violent rapist from assaulting a woman.
If we love our enemies then we should try to avoid them murdering us... Because murder is a sin... And we should try our best to make sin harder to do. But if put in an ultimatum between denouncing Jesus or die then... Yes death is the right answer.
I’m in between with this as well. I cannot imagine sitting there while my family gets tortured or abused. I completely have faith that God protects those who serve him but the scripture says the Days are Evil. I believe a father’s responsibility is to love, provide, raise, and also to protect. I believe God will be the judge in these situations. Now, this doesn’t mean your going to be Superman and go look for trouble. I’m only saying if someone breaks into your home. Whose to say that person won’t go on and do that to someone else? It’s a tough situation.
Book of Timothy Chapter 5:8 "But anyone who does not provide for their relatives, especially the members of their household, has denied the faith and is worse than the heathen." I think it's pretty self explanatory. One of the things one is to provide for their family is protection. And at all costs if you ask me.
@@born2win262 it's not THEIR fault tho. It's the govt in which we are NOT to obey. Book of Acts (I forget which chapter) "Sometimes it's better to obey God than men." So this often usurped translation of Romans chapter 13 saying we MUST obey the govt no matter what, is just simply not true at all. St. Paul makes a clear distinction between justice and tyranny in Romans 13.
It was said in Exodus 22:2 2 “If a thief is caught breaking in at night and is struck a fatal blow, the defender is not guilty of bloodshed; 3 but if it happens after sunrise, the defender is guilty of bloodshed" now there is also if sunrise is upon him, he shall be guilty. So when its made by accident (so in darkness/night) the man is not guilty of murder, but if it was intentional...now its bad. Also it was institue later in the bible, places that thoses who killed by accidents, to flee/hide. Dont know much about that last part tho.
In other words if someone breaks into my house intent on killing or raping my family and the police kill them it’s ok. But if I protect my family and kill the intruder it’s not ok. I will not stand by and allow this to happen and I do not believe for one second it will be held against me.
Exodus 22:2- "If the thief is [c]caught while [d]breaking in and is struck so that he dies, there will be no guilt for bloodshed on his account. 3 If the sun has risen on him, there will be guilt for bloodshed on his account-A thief shall certainly make restitution; if he owns nothing, then he shall be sold for his theft." Looks like you aren't held liable if you kill a thief after dark. It also looks like we are to use our best discretion and try less lethal means on a thief during the day. If you know that they're intent on harming you or your family, I feel like its biblically justified to retaliate with necessary force. Notice how the bible mentions a thief and not a murderer or a rapist. The most loving thing you can do in that scenario is to protect your family.
Our Government and Law institutes “the right of the people “ to bear arms. I ponder our police and military’s duty to protect citizens. I ponder a father’s duty to protect his family in the same way. Is it right to let a man intrude into our home and physically harm our family? I ask this as a real question, because this really does happen. Is it a sin to not physically protect your family? Perhaps as long as revenge is not in our hearts, but rather the motive is protection of our loved ones?
This is just my opinion and it is not my intention offend anyone. I agree with what was said, however I believe any Christian who defends themselves or their families, friends and the innocent is guided by the Lord as long as they do not take an offensive position. Loving and God fearing Christians never start trouble, they live peacefully and don't try to overthrow any government or harm anyone but they don't have to be murdered. The Holy Spirit will guide you if He is with you. I didn't quote scripture because even though I am 60 I have just recently come to Christ and I dont want to misinterpret or mislead anyone. May the Lord be merciful to me for my ignorance.
Besides a thousand other issues, like "If a thief be found breaking up, and be smitten that he die, there shall no blood be shed for him" (ex 22) what else is lost in this is that a gun isn't only useful for killing violent perpetrators but disabling them. ie a bullet to a would-be rapist & murderers kneecap could help hinder them from from committing the sin of murder and protect a loved one. A win win. I wrote something along these lines to Piper ten years ago in response to some blog post of his similar to the above video. No, he didn't ever write back. _ Better is a poor and a wise child than an old and foolish king, who will no more be admonished. - Solomon
Every righteous action will fall under these two commandments Matthew 22:37-40 "Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. 38 This is the first and great commandment. 39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets." If someone is trying to attack your family or other innocent people, the most loving thing you could do is to stop them from being attacked.
the centurion that Jesus said had more faith than anyone he’d encountered , they were not rent a cop then battle tested individuals . Idk I can read into it and say how I feel but here’s a difference in martyredom and self protection in the circumstances, being attacked or already in there possession idk
I personally don't believe in predestination like a calvinist does, but if you do believe in that kind of predestination, wouldn't you believe that God would have been able to save and stop a person from theoretically breaking into someones house or attacking a family that could lead to his own death? It seems that only someone who doesn't believe in predestination would say "don't kill them so that they have more time to maybe get saved"??? Just a passing thought.
The truly Elected "Sons of God" must obey Christ's commands on this subject. "27 But I say unto you that hear, Love your enemies, do good to them that hate you, 28 bless them that curse you, pray for them that despitefully use you. 29 To him that smiteth thee on the one cheek offer also the other; and from him that taketh away thy cloak withhold not thy coat also". Luke 6:27-29 (ASV) One cannot be loving their enemies by harming and killing them. It's just impossible! Even self defense and retaliation Christ has ruled out. For as Scripture states: "36 Even as it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; We were accounted as sheep for the slaughter." Romans 8:35-36 (ASV) "False brethren" may well disobey and harm and kill and retaliate, but the true and conscientious faithful brother of the Lord, knows it is better to die then disobey Christ's command not to "Kill" or "Murder" or hate an enemy. After all has not Christ promised: " 25 For whosoever would save his life shall lose it: and whosoever shall lose his life for my sake shall find it." Matthew 16:24-26 (ASV)
@@ScotchIrishHoundsman But not to use against humans. "One of those who were with Jesus reached out his hand and drew his sword and, striking the body servant of the high priest, cut off his ear. 52 Then Jesus said to him, Put your sword back into its place, for all who draw the sword will die by the sword" Matt 26:51-52 (AMP. BIBLE) Note: Any idea of how many millions of 'Christians' suffered his penalty in the last two World Wars by disobeying their Lord and Master?
Earnestly contending for the faith Jesus said to sell your garment and buy a sword. You don’t hunt with a sword so your statement “not against humans” makes no sense. A sword is specifically made to use against other humans. They key word in that last verse is “for my sake”. If we are being persecuted by the authorities, I say that would be my ideal death, to be murdered for Christ. But if there are others involved, children, etc. I will do all in my power to protect them. God did not create us to be cowards. Yes, vengeance is his, you shouldn’t act with vengeance on a personal level. But according to Jesus, having a sword was more important than being clothed, hence “sell your garment and buy one”.
@@ScotchIrishHoundsman Well, the word sword is actually a 'Small knife' or a 'dirk'. used for killing animals to eat, or skinning them, filleting or dealing with fish, etc. Certainly not for killing other people, as Christ forbade such killing, even of enemies. "52 Then Jesus said to him, Put your sword back into its place, for all who draw the sword will die by the sword" Matt 26:51-52 (AMP. BIBLE) Note: Any idea of how many millions of 'Christians' suffered his penalty in the last two World Wars by disobeying their Lord and Master? So, how many, Dave? We are told to love them, not hate or kill them. "43 Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbor, and hate thine enemy. 44 But I say unto you, **Love your enemies**: bless them that curse you: do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which hurt you, and persecute you, 45 That ye may be the children of your father that is in heaven" Matt 5:43-45 (Geneva Bible) Only children of the Devil will do the very opposite which you recommend doing.
@@earnestlycontendingforthef5332 so, can i ask you seriously then, how would you explain all the righteous killings that went on in war? david himself slew goliath, and cut off his head, goliath was his enemy undoubtedly, and yet david was a man after gods own heart.....
I love much of Piper's preaching on Christ and His glory, but anyone that really knows Piper knows in his fervor to glorified God he occasionally steps into extrabiblical (or outside of scripture) theology or teachings. Just like what he does with divorce. It's an injustice to have people believe that only the police or military can do violence (not evil) to stop violence. Every person has the right to defend themselves, their family or any innocent life by countering violence with violence (or force), and that isn't evil! You would let someone take your life as a Christian? What about your responsibility to your wife and children? This is silly. I can see an exception to where you might be responding to a direct leading from God for a specific purpose He might have, but that would be an exception. Absolutely not the norm of how we should respond or act.
So, murder someone I can understand, that's a crime, that's premeditated, but self-defense? Nope. If my family is in imminent danger of bodily harm I will not sit and wait for them to be raped or killed in the name of "He has not met Jesus". He showed not care about Jesus the morning he decided to do the crime. If I permit that, what does that say about me as a protector?
Mr Leg in case the man hasn’t come to the truth yet. His time would be cut short because of me. Idk what I’d end up doing, by instincts, if the situation actually happened. But if I’m killed, im going to a better place afterwards. So unless I’m protecting others, might as well give the person the chance to come to the truth. This is just my take
Mr Leg really? Where is that in the Bible? And if that’s true, isn’t he just saying it’s important to have one? Not telling us the exact manner in which we need to use it?
Mr Leg I had no idea Jesus said that and I’ve read through the gospels about 3 times so far. I could’ve missed it. But I’m not against guns, I just think we have to be thoughtful of the scenarios in which we use them
"Turn the other cheek" (Matt 5:39) is a teaching about how we are to respond in grace beyond human capabilities because we're being led by the Spirit of God to do so. This is actually a way of being perfect. (Matt 5:48) But let me ask you this.. how good is the Samaritan that allows OTHER PEOPLE to be abused, tortured, enslaved, murdered and does nothing to stop it? That's not about YOURSELF. "Thou shalt not kill" (Exodus 20:13) is just a misleading 400-year-old translation of the word that actually means MURDER. This is a commandment not to unjustly or immorally take the life of an innocent person.
@@MPoweredChristianMinistries Is there a verse in the Bible that says what to do when other people are being attacked besides the one in which Jesus tells Peter not to defend him?
I thought turn the other cheek was meant if someone insults you you don’t insult back. Jesus said if you don’t have a sword sell your cloak and buy one? And yes Jesus told Paul if you live by the sword you will die by the sword. But that was because Jesus was fulfilling scripture. And it’s thou shalt not murder. We have the biblical right self defense and defend others.
IF I was going to ask someone that question...I WOULDNT BE ASKING A MAN for his OPINION ....I'd be asking God!! The Bible says no longer will you teach your neighbor to know me,they will all know me from the least to the greatest!! God is your teacher,the bible says so even if man doesnt want to acknowledge that truth!! Preachers havent been needed for a long long time....but the arrogant wont admit it!!
That might be the most arrogant thing I've heard yet. Maybe you haven't read: Ephesians 4:10-13 [10]He who descended is Himself also He who ascended far above all the heavens, so that He might fill all things.) [11]And He gave some as apostles, and some as prophets, and some as evangelists, and some as pastors and teachers, [12]for the equipping of the saints for the work of service, to the building up of the body of Christ; [13]until we all attain to the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to a mature man, to the measure of the stature which belongs to the fullness of Christ.
Even the devil can quote scriptures!! A man calling himself a preacher means nothing to me!! I know God personally! and there sure are alot of pharisee's and fakes calling themselves preachers!!
Hearing Christians tell each other to stockpile guns is the most shameful, disgusting, fearful and unGodly things I've ever heard. I thought the belief was in going to Heaven? I thought the day of your death would be better than the day of your birth?
The fakes,taught by man, wont tell you all the verses in the Bible about hating evil.....but God sure will!! He's my teacher.I would never put any man above God!! Even if they choose to call themselves a preacher! Search for those verses yourself! Even if a man,who doesnt know the bible, wont mention them.....theyre in the Bible!!
I feel like "love your enemies" would be to try your hardest ti prevent them from killing you, without killing them. But if you REALLY have to kill them, it's not murder. But for them,who would killed you, it'd be murder. Am i right? Am I?
It seems as though it depends on the context. The most loving thing I can do for my family when their lives are threatened, is protect them from an aggressor. However, if the government comes for me because I am a Christian, the most loving thing I can do for God is to give myself up as he did when the authorities came for him.
That being said; as a fellow believer, I love you John Piper, and even though I disagree, I still believe you are a good and Godly man. Keep spreading the Gospel of Jesus Christ and witnessing to others. You are doing great work! 😎🙏
And He said to them, "But now, whoever has a money belt is to take it along, likewise also a bag, and whoever has no sword is to sell his coat and buy one. Luke 22:36
I like John Piper's approach to any subject because he approaches it biblically, and he doesn't just shoot from the top of his head without thinking it through biblically...he thinks like a GOD fearing man who loves his LORD and SAVIOUR JESUS CHRIST and not just like a Republican or an American for that matter...I dont always see eye to eye with John Piper, but I have great respect for my brother and I always like to hear what he has to say...
I work hard to not over generalize groups of people. Please keep in mind that some Americans and Republicans may be Christian as with other political parties and other Christian denominations. There were 7 churches in Asia Minor and (I think) only 2 of them ministered the truth correctly. God knows our intentions and our love for him he will judge us individually and not by our denominations or by our pastor's beliefs. May God be with you and your family. I am and advocate for personal self defense and the defense of the innocent as long as I feel it is right. But I'm new at this.
I respect you, John Piper, and have little variation in opinion with you on any topic I’ve heard you cover, apart from the subject of self defense and defending ones family (or any victim) from bodily harm and death. If God has established government for the defense and justice of its populace, has He not imbued the same right- and more with the head of the family? As husbands, fathers and able bodied men, do we not only carry the right but also the responsibility of protecting our children, wives and innocents from evil to the extent of using lethal force? If government is the head of the people and man the head of the family, how can you reason that it is improper for a man to defend his wife and children from rape, death or forced internment by the state?
If a murderer or rapist breaks into your home, armed, and begins to murder or harm your children and wife, what is your recourse? Why would it be permissible to call another man (police) to come and rescue your family (using lethal force) whilst you helplessly watch the perpetrator harm them until the police arrive? Is it not only your right but your RESPONSIBILITY to defend your own family rather than outsource the dirty work to another man. I don’t follow the logic. If man is the head of family and government the head of man, it is only logical that man has authority (to be exercised in a godly manner) over his family and is charged to protect them. While I believe that each man must answer to the call of his own conscience and conviction from the Lord, I don’t believe your stance on this aligns with the over arching message, story and spirit of the Word of God. There are example after example of God not only urging his people to fight, but even strengthening and helping them do so. Even in Nehemiah the people (citizens, not soldiers) and told to guard the city with sword and spear and Nehemiah urges them all to fight to the death for their wives, children and brethren. As Gods word is unchanging (although under a new covenant) I don’t believe that stance has changed.
That being said, I do believe there is a time and place for sacrifice unto death, but when that time comes, I believe His Spirit will impress it upon our soul; but I do not believe it to be the default position, in the same way I don’t believe you should default to helping those in need at the expense of placing your family in unnecessary risk of harm. Would it be Christlike to house a pedophile in need when you have children or would it be exposing your children to unnecessary evil due to faulty understanding of the Word?
I appreciate you prefacing your argument by stating it as your opinion and not the unwavering truth. Thank you for all that you and your team do!
I for one will protect myself and family.
The Bible says there is a time to fight, hate, kill, a time for war. We have a moral responsibility to defend others and self, to preserve peace and liberty.
But this is not the time to KILL as Christ as commanded his faithful followers to "LOVE your enemies".
It's impossible to kill them and then say......."I really loved them Lord".
@@earnestlycontendingforthef5332 I don't believe you could say "I loved my neighbor" either if you refused to use necessary force to prevent a violent rapist from assaulting a woman.
If we love our enemies then we should try to avoid them murdering us... Because murder is a sin... And we should try our best to make sin harder to do.
But if put in an ultimatum between denouncing Jesus or die then... Yes death is the right answer.
pro trick: you can watch series on flixzone. I've been using them for watching all kinds of movies these days.
@Aiden Kylo Definitely, been using flixzone} for years myself =)
@Aiden Kylo Yup, have been watching on flixzone} for months myself =)
You make me laugh and understand and agree with you at the same time ,thank you dear brother in Christ love you 🫡🌹🌹🥰
I’m in between with this as well. I cannot imagine sitting there while my family gets tortured or abused. I completely have faith that God protects those who serve him but the scripture says the Days are Evil. I believe a father’s responsibility is to love, provide, raise, and also to protect. I believe God will be the judge in these situations. Now, this doesn’t mean your going to be Superman and go look for trouble. I’m only saying if someone breaks into your home. Whose to say that person won’t go on and do that to someone else? It’s a tough situation.
Book of Timothy Chapter 5:8 "But anyone who does not provide for their relatives, especially the members of their household, has denied the faith and is worse than the heathen." I think it's pretty self explanatory. One of the things one is to provide for their family is protection. And at all costs if you ask me.
@@arc77fordo29 I agree with you my brother! If you seen the crime taking place now a days it’s absolutely insane. Police are so understaffed.
@@born2win262 it's not THEIR fault tho. It's the govt in which we are NOT to obey. Book of Acts (I forget which chapter) "Sometimes it's better to obey God than men." So this often usurped translation of Romans chapter 13 saying we MUST obey the govt no matter what, is just simply not true at all. St. Paul makes a clear distinction between justice and tyranny in Romans 13.
It was said in Exodus 22:2
2 “If a thief is caught breaking in at night and is struck a fatal blow, the defender is not guilty of bloodshed; 3 but if it happens after sunrise, the defender is guilty of bloodshed" now there is also if sunrise is upon him, he shall be guilty. So when its made by accident (so in darkness/night) the man is not guilty of murder, but if it was intentional...now its bad. Also it was institue later in the bible, places that thoses who killed by accidents, to flee/hide. Dont know much about that last part tho.
Yeah,me too. I've struggled to understand this and to accept it if it's true we can't defend ourselves or family or innocent people no matter what
In other words if someone breaks into my house intent on killing or raping my family and the police kill them it’s ok. But if I protect my family and kill the intruder it’s not ok. I will not stand by and allow this to happen and I do not believe for one second it will be held against me.
Exodus 22:2- "If the thief is [c]caught while [d]breaking in and is struck so that he dies, there will be no guilt for bloodshed on his account. 3 If the sun has risen on him, there will be guilt for bloodshed on his account-A thief shall certainly make restitution; if he owns nothing, then he shall be sold for his theft." Looks like you aren't held liable if you kill a thief after dark. It also looks like we are to use our best discretion and try less lethal means on a thief during the day. If you know that they're intent on harming you or your family, I feel like its biblically justified to retaliate with necessary force. Notice how the bible mentions a thief and not a murderer or a rapist. The most loving thing you can do in that scenario is to protect your family.
Our Government and Law institutes
“the right of the people “ to bear arms.
I ponder our police and military’s duty to protect citizens. I ponder a father’s duty to protect his family in the same way. Is it right to let a man intrude into our home and physically harm our family? I ask this as a real question, because this really does happen. Is it a sin to not physically protect your family? Perhaps as long as revenge is not in our hearts, but rather the motive is protection of our loved ones?
I ponder this as well.
thank you Lord for your wisdom being shared here
This is just my opinion and it is not my intention offend anyone. I agree with what was said, however I believe any Christian who defends themselves or their families, friends and the innocent is guided by the Lord as long as they do not take an offensive position. Loving and God fearing Christians never start trouble, they live peacefully and don't try to overthrow any government or harm anyone but they don't have to be murdered. The Holy Spirit will guide you if He is with you. I didn't quote scripture because even though I am 60 I have just recently come to Christ and I dont want to misinterpret or mislead anyone. May the Lord be merciful to me for my ignorance.
Plot twist… how about killing someone who is going to kill millions of other people who are going to go to hell?
“We show the value of God himself as our reward” when someone murders me I’m sure that’s the last thing they’ll be thinking about.
Besides a thousand other issues, like "If a thief be found breaking up, and be smitten that he die, there shall no blood be shed for him" (ex 22) what else is lost in this is that a gun isn't only useful for killing violent perpetrators but disabling them.
ie a bullet to a would-be rapist & murderers kneecap could help hinder them from from committing the sin of murder and protect a loved one. A win win.
I wrote something along these lines to Piper ten years ago in response to some blog post of his similar to the above video.
No, he didn't ever write back.
_
Better is a poor and a wise child than an old and foolish king, who will no more be admonished. - Solomon
Every righteous action will fall under these two commandments Matthew 22:37-40 "Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38 This is the first and great commandment.
39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets."
If someone is trying to attack your family or other innocent people, the most loving thing you could do is to stop them from being attacked.
what? Anyone more confused than they were before?
the centurion that Jesus said had more faith than anyone he’d encountered , they were not rent a cop then battle tested individuals . Idk I can read into it and say how I feel but here’s a difference in martyredom and self protection in the circumstances, being attacked or already in there possession idk
What about self-defence of a private citizen?
I personally don't believe in predestination like a calvinist does, but if you do believe in that kind of predestination, wouldn't you believe that God would have been able to save and stop a person from theoretically breaking into someones house or attacking a family that could lead to his own death? It seems that only someone who doesn't believe in predestination would say "don't kill them so that they have more time to maybe get saved"??? Just a passing thought.
What about ccw holders that are just normal citizens?
The truly Elected "Sons of God" must obey Christ's commands on this subject.
"27 But I say unto you that hear, Love your enemies, do good to them that hate you, 28 bless them that curse you, pray for them that despitefully use you. 29 To him that smiteth thee on the one cheek offer also the other; and from him that taketh away thy cloak withhold not thy coat also".
Luke 6:27-29 (ASV)
One cannot be loving their enemies by harming and killing them.
It's just impossible!
Even self defense and retaliation Christ has ruled out.
For as Scripture states:
"36 Even as it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; We were accounted as sheep for the slaughter."
Romans 8:35-36 (ASV)
"False brethren" may well disobey and harm and kill and retaliate, but the true and conscientious faithful brother of the Lord, knows it is better to die then disobey Christ's command not to "Kill" or "Murder" or hate an enemy.
After all has not Christ promised:
" 25 For whosoever would save his life shall lose it: and whosoever shall lose his life for my sake shall find it."
Matthew 16:24-26 (ASV)
Did Christ also not say to “sell your cloak and buy {a sword}”?
@@ScotchIrishHoundsman
But not to use against humans.
"One of those who were with Jesus reached out his hand and drew his sword and, striking the body servant of the high priest, cut off his ear.
52 Then Jesus said to him, Put your sword back into its place, for all who draw the sword will die by the sword"
Matt 26:51-52 (AMP. BIBLE)
Note: Any idea of how many millions of 'Christians' suffered his penalty in the last two World Wars by disobeying their Lord and Master?
Earnestly contending for the faith
Jesus said to sell your garment and buy a sword. You don’t hunt with a sword so your statement “not against humans” makes no sense. A sword is specifically made to use against other humans. They key word in that last verse is “for my sake”. If we are being persecuted by the authorities, I say that would be my ideal death, to be murdered for Christ. But if there are others involved, children, etc. I will do all in my power to protect them. God did not create us to be cowards. Yes, vengeance is his, you shouldn’t act with vengeance on a personal level. But according to Jesus, having a sword was more important than being clothed, hence “sell your garment and buy one”.
@@ScotchIrishHoundsman
Well, the word sword is actually a 'Small knife' or a 'dirk'. used for killing animals to eat, or skinning them, filleting or dealing with fish, etc. Certainly not for killing other people, as Christ forbade such killing, even of enemies.
"52 Then Jesus said to him, Put your sword back into its place, for all who draw the sword will die by the sword"
Matt 26:51-52 (AMP. BIBLE)
Note: Any idea of how many millions of 'Christians' suffered his penalty in the last two World Wars by disobeying their Lord and Master?
So, how many, Dave?
We are told to love them, not hate or kill them.
"43 Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbor, and hate thine enemy. 44 But I say unto you, **Love your enemies**: bless them that curse you: do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which hurt you, and persecute you, 45 That ye may be the children of your father that is in heaven"
Matt 5:43-45 (Geneva Bible)
Only children of the Devil will do the very opposite which you recommend doing.
@@earnestlycontendingforthef5332 so, can i ask you seriously then, how would you explain all the righteous killings that went on in war? david himself slew goliath, and cut off his head, goliath was his enemy undoubtedly, and yet david was a man after gods own heart.....
I love much of Piper's preaching on Christ and His glory, but anyone that really knows Piper knows in his fervor to glorified God he occasionally steps into extrabiblical (or outside of scripture) theology or teachings. Just like what he does with divorce. It's an injustice to have people believe that only the police or military can do violence (not evil) to stop violence. Every person has the right to defend themselves, their family or any innocent life by countering violence with violence (or force), and that isn't evil! You would let someone take your life as a Christian? What about your responsibility to your wife and children? This is silly. I can see an exception to where you might be responding to a direct leading from God for a specific purpose He might have, but that would be an exception. Absolutely not the norm of how we should respond or act.
So, murder someone I can understand, that's a crime, that's premeditated, but self-defense? Nope. If my family is in imminent danger of bodily harm I will not sit and wait for them to be raped or killed in the name of "He has not met Jesus". He showed not care about Jesus the morning he decided to do the crime. If I permit that, what does that say about me as a protector?
As a man, your duty is to your family. A true Shepherd is supposed to defend the flock
Well if it’s to protect others, it’s okay. But if it’s just yourself, no taking care of family, I believe that’s a different case.
Mr Leg in case the man hasn’t come to the truth yet. His time would be cut short because of me. Idk what I’d end up doing, by instincts, if the situation actually happened. But if I’m killed, im going to a better place afterwards. So unless I’m protecting others, might as well give the person the chance to come to the truth. This is just my take
Mr Leg really? Where is that in the Bible? And if that’s true, isn’t he just saying it’s important to have one? Not telling us the exact manner in which we need to use it?
Mr Leg I had no idea Jesus said that and I’ve read through the gospels about 3 times so far. I could’ve missed it. But I’m not against guns, I just think we have to be thoughtful of the scenarios in which we use them
All those verses and neither of them mentioned "turn the other cheek" or "thou shalt not kill."
"Turn the other cheek" (Matt 5:39) is a teaching about how we are to respond in grace beyond human capabilities because we're being led by the Spirit of God to do so. This is actually a way of being perfect. (Matt 5:48)
But let me ask you this.. how good is the Samaritan that allows OTHER PEOPLE to be abused, tortured, enslaved, murdered and does nothing to stop it? That's not about YOURSELF.
"Thou shalt not kill" (Exodus 20:13) is just a misleading 400-year-old translation of the word that actually means MURDER. This is a commandment not to unjustly or immorally take the life of an innocent person.
@@MPoweredChristianMinistries Is there a verse in the Bible that says what to do when other people are being attacked besides the one in which Jesus tells Peter not to defend him?
Romans 13:4 only justifies government force.
If "turn the other cheek " isn't enough, "he who takes up the sword shall perish by the sword" is more applicable than Romans 13:4.
I thought turn the other cheek was meant if someone insults you you don’t insult back. Jesus said if you don’t have a sword sell your cloak and buy one? And yes Jesus told Paul if you live by the sword you will die by the sword. But that was because Jesus was fulfilling scripture. And it’s thou shalt not murder. We have the biblical right self defense and defend others.
IF I was going to ask someone that question...I WOULDNT BE ASKING A MAN for his OPINION ....I'd be asking God!! The Bible says no longer will you teach your neighbor to know me,they will all know me from the least to the greatest!! God is your teacher,the bible says so even if man doesnt want to acknowledge that truth!! Preachers havent been needed for a long long time....but the arrogant wont admit it!!
That might be the most arrogant thing I've heard yet. Maybe you haven't read:
Ephesians 4:10-13
[10]He who descended is Himself also He who ascended far above all the heavens, so that He might fill all things.)
[11]And He gave some as apostles, and some as prophets, and some as evangelists, and some as pastors and teachers,
[12]for the equipping of the saints for the work of service, to the building up of the body of Christ;
[13]until we all attain to the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to a mature man, to the measure of the stature which belongs to the fullness of Christ.
Even the devil can quote scriptures!! A man calling himself a preacher means nothing to me!! I know God personally! and there sure are alot of pharisee's and fakes calling themselves preachers!!
Hearing Christians tell each other to stockpile guns is the most shameful, disgusting, fearful and unGodly things I've ever heard. I thought the belief was in going to Heaven? I thought the day of your death would be better than the day of your birth?
The fakes,taught by man, wont tell you all the verses in the Bible about hating evil.....but God sure will!! He's my teacher.I would never put any man above God!! Even if they choose to call themselves a preacher! Search for those verses yourself! Even if a man,who doesnt know the bible, wont mention them.....theyre in the Bible!!
I thought Hilary Clinton was the most out of touch. I was wrong.
Good grief! “Love your enemies” doesn’t mean let them kill you 🤦♂️
Talk about twisting scripture to your own destruction!
Please explain Stephen’s account in Acts 6 and 7.
@@juliocarrion1438 Please explain a time to hate, fight, kill, for war.
I feel like "love your enemies" would be to try your hardest ti prevent them from killing you, without killing them. But if you REALLY have to kill them, it's not murder. But for them,who would killed you, it'd be murder. Am i right? Am I?
@@waterheaterservices .....The time now is to "LOVE YOUR ENEMIES, do GOOD to those who HATE YOU and would despitfully use YOU"....
No faithful Christian "Worth his SALT did fight against Hitler...."