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This is also something I've noticed, having lived in the US and Germany for many years. Even though the kWh price in Germany is twice as high (now three times as high) as in the US, the overall energy bill in the US was a lot higher. In Germany you use 8 maybe 10 kWh/day, in the US you are way beyond 30 kWh/day. And a huge factor in that was the 24/7 running AC unit or the multiple fridges holding enough food to sustain you for many years. Germany is so much more energy efficient, be it electricity, heating (housing insulation), gasoline. Mainly because energy cost in Germany are so much higher, Germans don't waste.
Multiple refrigerators holding years of food. I must be doing something wrong. :D But ya, I remember TX and having to run the A/C in months we should have been running the heat.
I(Austria) have a house and 2 fridges and 2,5 freezers and need about 9kWh/day with about 4-5kWh/day just for the fridges/freezers. I have an AC which runs about 15h/year(!). But heating is not included and comes to 20kWh/day if calculated for a whole year (and a house which has not the best of insulation).
@@toomflussiggrillanzunderfu8828 It was built in when I bought the house. I'm in the south of Austria so we get some hot nights. Mostly natural cooling will be enough but on 5 nights I let it run to cool the bedroom to 23°C which needed about 3h. The exact numbers might vary a bit.
It sounds like a lot of people are wasting energy. I live in a two bedroom condominium just outside of Orlando, Florida. My energy bill is around $65 per month. In the Summer, when I'm running the A/C much of the time, that number goes up to $110 per month. If this place were better insulated, like the homes up North, I expect these monthly bills would drop significantly.
Compared to my stay in the US and my current life in Germany: yes, I had more money in the US, which was nice for many visits to the different national parks, but the medical costs in the US sometimes would replace certain trips with their high bills (even though I had a health insurance). While I have generally less disposable income in Germany, I don't need to worry about surprise medical bills that often, which is nice for my general state of mind.
Just got hit for a very small amount but it was for Lab work and really, $2.76 should have been written off. It cost them more to process the invoice and now my payment. It was a surprise for us as we thought all labs were covered by our medical plan. Go figure.
@@julutschka1591 the economy of the USA is built on people spending more than they make. Very sad truth from my own observations. Luckily my wife and I don't do that but we know people who do. They are one emergency or missed paycheck for a disaster. :(
@@tonykyle2655 Yeah. You guys are too reckless there and then complain about inequality. Life quality in the USA is vastly superior for people who use credit responsibly
****CORRECTION TO VIDEO It seems that despite double checking my calculations and having the video proofed by a third party.... the housing costs for single Steve were added into the first section BUT not added in the subsequent calculations. Steve's final total should have amounted to 2,097.14 - which is still more than Max but a significant error and I will be spending the rest of the afternoon kicking myself for it. For your reference here is how Steve's finances should have ended: Starting net pay: 4,883.25 - Housing: - $1,411 - Utilities: - $286.93 - Transportation: - $822.25 - Food: - $265.93 TOTAL: $2,097.14
Ok, that 500 € are well spent for living in germany with nearly no gun abuse, near to nil religious goofing of the people around me and the better work-life-balance. Thanks for big review on that topic.
Look forward to part 3 where you compare what they can get with their money after everything else. What will a night out in Denver cost vs Berlin. How much would it cost to go skiing on the Czech border vs those hills to the west of Denver. Major items for home. Day out with the children. etc.
Your last comment on time off from work kind of struck me. As far as I remember, the federal law requires a 20 day time of vacation per year. Most unions in Germany have worked out a 28-30 day regulation. Besides that, we have a saying in Germany: "Do you live to work, or do you work to live?" Have a great day Black Forest Family!
Nice comparison, but unfortunately you made one big mistake in your calculation. At 8:08 you substract rent related costs of 1411$ from Steves income bringing his 4883.25$ correctly down to 3472.25$. You do similar calculations for all the others, but if you have a look at 23:37 Steve´s money is back to his total income of 4883.25$ whereas all the others are correctly reduced by the rent. This goes through all other calculations which makes the end result you calculated for Steve much higher than it really would be taking his rent cost into consideration. In the final comparison Steve would not be at 3508.14$/3306.32€ but at 2097.14$/1976.49€ which is much closer to the 1620.22$/1527.62€ Max has as a final disposable income. One other thing: not sure if a BahnCard100 is such a common thing that you can substrct those costs from the family income. A quick google search tells me that only 36,000 people purchased a BahnCard100 in 2021. Of course you have to substract other fees of public trasportation instead, but they would be much cheaper than the BahnCard100.
I agree that only very few people have the Bahncard 100. More have a Bahncard 25, which is ~90€/year. Also, there is a new nationwide ticket for 49€/month for public transport, which would be more likely to be owned by most people.
Another factor that goes into effect in 2023 is the capped train ticket at € 49,00. Having 2 kids needing it for their education (University & "FOS"), it will lower our transportation costs by min. € 150,00 ... 🤷♀️
Many people get "job ticket" from their employer and pay basically nothing for public transportation within the city. However, also many families have two cars. The truth is somewhere in the mix.
@@toomflussiggrillanzunderfu8828 that's the point. As soon as you move out of the city, many families do. But within a city, even one car might be more of a liability.
What a great job (again and again), Ashton!👏 Peace of mind is hard to quantify, especially for families I think! If one of the persons becomes seriously or chronically ill (children often get sick again and again) the level hits hard! Thanks a lot! PS: German Version of Breaking Bad: Mr White you have cancer. Your treatment starts tomorrow and it will be covered by you're health insurance. The End
Breaking Bad is SUCH a good analogy for the American healthcare system... although let's hope that not everyone resorts to being a power-hungry drug lord 😉😂😳
Yeah, that's what I tend to say. You are healthy in america: No problems. You get chronically sick in america? Game over. It all breaks down. You can lose your job tomorrow, lose money to pay the rent, get kicked out the appartement and thats it. Its probably hard to impossible for many to recover. Your fate is sealed. Thats how I see it. And its unworthy of a modern society.
That the different between private Insurance and public Insurance. And my American Friends that is Not socialistvh that is based on public solidarity. Germany and EU are captitalistc countrys too. But Working Class figthing for this more than 170 Years...
@@mllecamill3 The only salvation in the above scenario is if a spouse has a good job and put the "ill" person on their plan. But your observation is spot on. In the USA, if one gets seriously ill then we have to resort to GoFundMe type campaigns. Know a person right now trying to fund their chemotherapy using a GoFundMe site. :(
Hallo Arno, I remember a day, I must have been about fifty-something years old at that time, when I passed my old Alma Mater and suddenly it struck me, that I had a family and was not free any more on what I could do (because of my responsibilities). Unfortunately that is the age where the probability for becoming seriously ill gets higher and higher again. And at that time most life forming decisions have been made and one has little influence left on what is to come. Looking back now, another decade later, I am rather happy that the government 'forced' me into things like the 'Krankenversicherung' or 'Rentenversicherung' before I understood why it is a good choice. Had to use it later, too. I also remember being advised by older colleagues to start early with those 'Versicherungen' and I certainly am happy now for doing as they said. In hindsight I see why they recommended that. And I made sure, my kids did understand that as soon as they started earning money as well.
This is an excellent analysis. My German husband lived in the US for eleven years before moving back to Germany to accept his dream job offer. I am American. I enjoy the quality of life here more. My husband would say that both countries have their good points and their bad points. It is really a matter of what makes one happy.
@schattensand , if you are responding to me, your assumption is mistaken. I worked full-time in the US, and I work here in Germany. I have Hashimoto's disease (an auto-immune thyroid disorder), which is defined as a chronic disease. To assume our move was based on my need for healthcare is grossly mistaken.
@@schattensand chronically ill.. I have the same baaaaad disease. You can do anything with it once you are "eingestellt" with medication. So I don't know what point you are trying to make here 🤣🤣
Great job. It is difficult to compare apples to oranges, and you did a thorough job trying. I think one important factor you mentioned very briefly is expectations. In Germany, most young people do not expect to live alone. They have roommates. I rent an apartment with my son in Hamburg, there are 8 large apartments in my Altbau (1905) and all are Wohngemeinschaften (WGs) with 2 or more roommates. I don‘t know anyone who loves alone. Living alone is an option, but it would require either moving to the suburbs or spending more on housing and less on entertainment and vacation, which are sacred here.
I always hated flat sharing (unless it's with a partner and/or kids) and it is by far not as common or cheap as you say. A decent sized room in a shared flat is often not much cheaper than a studio or a 1 bedroom flat. Actually, the flat sharing frenzy in cities makes it very hard for families (and single parents) to find flats, because it's almost impossible to compete against 3-4 adults who are all willing to pay 80% of the rent for a small individual flat, but for a room.
Thanks for this series. I don't know whether one can or should take into account the factor for illness or an accident. Not a "disaster" but something that can be described as serious but not life changing. For example an accident with a broken arm, or appendicitis. The difference between Germany and the USA should be big here. One thing that is also underestimated is the payment into the pension fund, which pays off in old age.
Yes, the cost of even a minor accident can have major consequences for someone living in the USA. Many private insurance plans have a 100 dollar co-pay for emergency room visits - and that's the price BEFORE any tests, procedures, or care is given.
@@TypeAshton Yes, even the "best" HMO tends to arbitrarily refuse to cover for some lab tests, and we have no recourse. I see it frequently in the many bills for my wife, who is of declining health. This and the 'copays' really eat up a chunk of the annual income. Some copays for medication are also excessive. For example my wife's blood thinner Elliquis eats up $100 for every refill. A list of such cases could go on endlessly...
@@TypeAshton 100%? A few year's ago I became heat-stroke and needed an afternoon stay in the hospital for approximately 2-3 hours. I have a very good job and insurance. My share was over $6,000.
Forget accidents, how about common stuff? i.e getting reimbursed for reading glasses or sunglasses, free or discounted prescriptions, zero or little copay on common dental procedures, etc. By the way, shouldn't Steve's family start have several thousand dollars subtracted just to give birth to kids?
Thanks, Ashton, for all the effort you (&your husband) put into these videos. Upon explaining the situation for the US family, you make a passing mention that they want to buy a house in a 'good school district'. I remember that - being German - it took me quite a while to figure out that the same physical house across the street might be waaay more expensive (or cheaper), simply because there is a school district boundary between them. For the benefit of your non-US-audience, it might be worthwhile to explain (sometime), why the differences between school district are there in the first place, and why they matter so much.
Confused? You won't be after this episode of... This in-depth comparison dive (to the extent possible) you take us on is extremely informative, even if only to show how complicated this can be. As a citizen of one of the Nordic countries (crappy climate but high security) it is a no-brainer to me: Working to live a secure and comfortable life, very similar to most of my fellow citizens, is more important to me than the apparent rat-race of life in 'Murica. Of course I am biased, but who isn't?
Despite the mistakes that you pointed out yourself--again it was a great analysis. What a huge amount of research and work you must have put into it! In my comment on the first video I pointed out the better infrastructure (the upside of higher taxes) in Germany, especially public transport (or transportation as you Americans say), and the way, cities in Germany--and generally in Europe--are built. In this video, certainly planned long ago, you considered exactly these factors. I was really shocked that in the example of the US couple, the nearest grocery store was 14 km away, while--at least in the cities in Germany--you have almost always supermarkets within walking distance which maybe are not as large as the grocery stores in the US, but usually still cover your needs for your weekly household shopping tour i.e. food, drink, and other non-food household articles). In the countryside this is often more difficult, and usually you need a car there too, to get about and to decent shops, but still, 14 km to the next grocery store seems to me a huge distance, even in the German countryside.
Yes - I'd say the distance to shop in cities averages maybe under 1km (10min walk). And in rural areas in the south it can be up to 3 to 5km - which is still easily doable with a bike 🚲 Everything is much denser and walkable here - if you're lucky you even a 🚉🛤️ or 🚌 connecting small cities and bigger villages. So the need for a car is not completely necessary - except if you're living in remote/less populated areas like - mountains, agriculture land or forests (mainly East Germany and "Sauerland", on the northern coast or on the borders of Germany - public transport infrastructure mainly sucks there.
Hey guys, couple of things I'd like to add: Nebenkosten usually include trash in about 98% of the cases. Differentiating Nebenkosten and heating costs is also misleading as they're commonly one thing (though the sums seem realistic in your example). Lastly, no German I know calculates the rent he can afford by the cold price. It doesn't really make any sense, to be honest. If you have a budget of 1.5k per month for rent, you need to look for an appartment that comes out at about 1.5k *including* heating, water, etc -- i.e. anything included in your monthly payments to your landlord. Also, I want to add that comparing the second most expensive city in Germany when it comes to rent with ... Denver doesn't really make sense. Bahn 100 also doesn't make a lot of sense. It's an option you pick if you need long-distance travel, since it includes ICE. Otherwise, why not stick with the new 49€ ticket, which will still allow him to use local trains, busses, the subway ... and only costs like 1/8 of the Bahncard. I don't have as much of a problem with the car you picked as with the rather arbitrary 20k km. If you're in the vicinity of Berlin, I just don't see why you'd drive over 50km *per day*, including weekends. If anything, you'd try to avoid driving into Berlin with a car as much as possible -- especially a nice car. Trust me. It's a good attempt but it's really difficult to make a valid comparison in these videos. P.S.: 900 KWH per MONTH for a single person?? Jesus!
@RagingGoblin "Differentiating Nebenkosten and heating costs is also misleading as they're commonly one thing (though the sums seem realistic in your example). " No, not necessarily. When I was living in Hannover, all my appartemens save one had "Gasetagenheizung" - which was a small gas heating providing heating and warm water, which was either located in the kitchen or in the bathroom. Each appartement had their own, and hence, there were "Nebenkosten" (which included common costs for the house), which we paid alongside the rent, but we also had a contract with our local provider for gas, which went extra. In Hannover, this was very common especially for older houses from pre war or from the 1950ies and 1960ies, but I don't know how often this is seen elsewhere.
Berlin has the 2nd most expensive rent? Denver is very expensive (Colorado is #5 most expensive state to live in) so it might not be too far off. Alot of her information is averages, not the cheapest a family can do, so 20,000km for a whole German family in suburbs is pretty typical.
As many have already pointed out, it would be interesting to see the differences at the lower end of the salary spectrum. Max, the single German worker is actually earning quite a lot. Many white collar workers with masters degrees earn about 2000-3000 Euros per month. On the otherhand in the US even waiters seem to earn about 35000 USD, while at the same time one can often read about people having to live out of their cars or with other serious restrictions in their lives, like not being able to consistently pay for the schooling of their children. So at that salary level things seems to be quite different!
Yes, I was shocked as well! I'm 40 years old and barely earn more than the 23 year old Max from the example 😂 I would say the average salary at 23 is around 2000 netto - as long as you're not studying anymore 😉 With some years of experience it might be around 3000-3500 netto. But that's already the top 20% of all employees. With a netto salary of 3500 you are already considered "rich" in Germany.
@@Dunklerturm1990 McD is always a good indicator, not just the salaries, but also the pricing of the products. Especially crazy if you compare Germany to Switzerland 😅
@@simply-the-max You are totally right. I am starting to dislike this channel that only points out how fabulous life is in Germany when it is not. Yes, healthcare and university bla bla bla but she doesn't point out how easy is to get stuck in a salary in Germany. How difficult is it to afford a house (not an apartment) in Germany, and how good do you need to be to outstand the average. OFC USA has its drawbacks that we all know, but tbh life in Germany is not as pleasant as she points out. Life is hard everywhere and the more money you have, the easier it is
Great video/information. My husband and I are weighing the options to move to Germany. We are retired and I have family there. Inflation, although increased worldwide, seems to be even higher here in Canada where its becoming increasingly difficult to live, let alone live with some quality. Throw in the healthcare problems and yeah...were looking elsewhere.
I'm happy for this follow-up video cuz you've been very thorough! I'm also happy it confirms what I already had a feeling for. Specially the last part with the vacation days, work hours and worker's right in general, I can only expect the disposable income per actually worked hours is gonna heavily tilt towards DE, both for the family as for the single people. Some other random thoughts: - Idk if the salaries you considered are nationwide or localized to the actual cities you considered in the end. I imagine both countries will see differences in salary depending on location. - As you laid out very well in the first video, in Germany you pay a lot of things preemptively, with the appropriate name "insurance", while a lot of this is up to the individual and in worst case left to be a thought only after the fact. So in Germany you're "forced" by the Government to have a plan in case you get unemployed, while in the US it is more of a gamble that you hope you won't get unemployed and hence not need unemployment money. - Speaking of unemployment, yes, labor laws in DE are so strong you will have less terminations. So that "forced" unemployment insurance can be cheaper per worker since the chance that any give worker will be unemployed unexpectedly. The prevalence of at will work contracts would increase this chance and the amount set aside would have to increase accordingly. - Final thought on unemployment money, since the vast majority of the expenditure of an american worker is related to consumption and not taxes, this also means you need more money set aside to hold the same standard of living as before. In DE wouldn't pay taxes anymore so your remaining income stretches further. - The comparison was done with relative well paying jobs, which honestly also makes sense since immigrating as a lower income worker is much harder, and your audience is likely people considering immigration. That said, I can only wonder what the comparison would look like for, say, Stephanie and Mila when they were young and single, assuming their salaries would be smaller than young Steve and Max and the comparison would look even worst
I really like the addition this video makes to the previous one. I particularly like the fact how you solved the housing issue by simply going for a percentage of income. It is an incredibly elegant solution, which approximates the reality of people spending what they can afford, whether that's on housing, food, hobbies, etc. I think there are 2 major takeaways from these 2 videos: 1) If you're young and healthy, the USA is absolutely amazing. That is, if you / your parents can actually afford to give you a quality education, but I think that might even be a different topic; wealth gap and economic opportunity gaps between the US and Germany. But, I digress. What I meant to say was that it really struck me how the difference in actual spending power decreases in the USA at the same rate it increases in Germany as age and social circumstances change. When you put that into perspective of actual spending power per person, both will decrease. Germany from (and I will round to an easy number for simplicty's sake) €1.600 to €3.200/4=€800 meaning a 50% reduction. The USA by comparison will be €3.200 to €1.600/4=€400 meaning a whopping 87,5% reduction. 2) As mentioned by several others already, peace of mind is priceless. I'm living in the Netherlands, which is quite similar to Germany in many ways. If I had lived in the USA, I would have been so completely screwed, I think there would be a significant chance I would have committed suicide. For context, I am now 41 years old, have Asperger's (on the Autism Spectrum) and I'm transgender. I have battled with depression and various other mental issues for the majority of my life. Here in the Netherlands I've been able to live off disability welfare and most of my medical costs are covered by my insurance (which I pay a whopping 18,7% of my net income for. Ew.). It has allowed me the time and financial opportunity to seek an education at age 39. I have recently found a job at which I can both earn a decent living as well as continue and finish my studies. Thank God for socialism. EDIT: Due to the correction posted a short while ago, my first major takeaway point now contains an error. Unfortunately, I am lazy and can't be bothered to correct it fully. While it significantly reduces the loss of spending power per person in the USA, it's still much larger than in Germany since the total spending power is still reduced in the USA vs increased in Germany, so my point still stands.
@@mina_en_suiza That's okay! It's sometimes hard to sift through all the comments to find if someone else has written something similar. Besides, it's not a bad thing really.😊
Hallo. Ich denke, ihr habt einen kleinen Fehler bei den Miet-Kosten für Max in Berlin gemacht: Die Müllkosten (Trash) sind bei Mietwohnungen in den Nebenkosten enthalten. Das macht auch deshalb Sinn, weil die BSR, also der Müllentsorger, nicht für jeden Mieter eine eigene Mülltonne bereitstellt, sondern nur eine Behältergröße per Haus und die Rechnung auch nur an einen Empfänger schickt.
Ich habe eine eigene Restmülltonne, die ja kostenpflichtig ist, in meiner Mietwohnung und teile mit 6 Parteien eine Biotonne und auch meine Gebühren für die einzelne Tonne sind in den Nebenkosten enthalten.
@@Kloetenhenne Dann bist du / sind Sie die große Ausnahme. In aller Regel sind Müllkosten in den Nebenkosten enthalten. Genauso wie - bis Mitte dieses Jahres - Kabelgebühren enthalten sein können (das ist weniger üblich). Ich wohne in einer Altbauwohnung in Hannover und wir haben zwei Restmülltonnen vor dem Haus stehen, eine Bio-Tonne, zwei Gelbe Tonnen und eine Papiertonne. Restmüll und Bio-Tonne sind gebührenpflichtig, die anderen Tonnen gebührenfrei.
@@Kloetenhenne 'Warum so aggressiv - ich hab nur noch mal herausgehoben, dass es in Deutschland die große Ausnahme ist. Das hattest du so nicht geschrieben.
Thank you again for your efforts! As most workers in both countries earn less than engineering wages, I would imagine the disparity between those earning closer to the average (or below) is greater - favoring Germany, especially with the better Sozialhilfe in Germany. The vacation days, labor rules are so difficult to quantify or express, but living them sure is a life-changer!
"Who has more money at the end of the day" is such an American way of approaching life. I have to quote Mr. Micawber from Dicken's "David Copperfield". “Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen and six, result happiness. Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pounds ought and six, result misery.” It's about the lifestyle that money buys you. I am far poorer financially here in Germany than I was in the UK but I am far happier.
I really like your deep dive, it is very interesting to me! My partner and I had some thoughts about moving to the US for a while, since salaries are sometimes dramatically higher (we are both software developers) but then again working culture is not really a match for us (we have some experience since we worked in international companies). I wonder how remote work will shift salaries around in our sector where big companies hire now everywhere and sometimes with much higher salary ranges than in Germany. One thing I would also take into account is the cost of sick leave and paid vacation in Germany (I think that was already mentioned before). What also contributes much to quality of living is security (murder/crime rate) as well as poverty in general.
Hello Ashton, hello Jonathan, happy Sunday. As you said corretly in the last Part of todays Video, there are some factors in live where you can not put a pricetag on, like Variation days social securtiy and so on. So living in the US would be no option for me. Just thinking of the 30 Vacation days and starting in April one Day off every three werks when getting 57 years old and enjoying "Altersteilzeit". Best regards Ralf
Thanks for the thoughtful analysis -- really interesting. I lived in Germany for a few years in the early 70's. Living now in the U.S. for decades, I believe things for the average person have accelerated downhill here, and are reflected in our low comparative life expectancy.
Excellent. Like the last video, I'd still love to see a Monte Carlo analysis that ranges over all these variables rather than picking a couple representative "average" answers...
Adding to the work life balance topic: When I worked short-term in the US, a lot of colleagues told me that they would take a fixed amount of paid sick leave days per year as "extra vacation days" if they don't get sick (Minnesota). While a short research showed me that there are actually some states where you get paid even in case of short-term sicknesses, if you have a bad immune system, you would also have additional reduction of money per hour in most states. In Germany as soon as a doctor confirms that you are short-term sick enough (paid for by default insurance), you don't need to work but still get paid (but of course social factors if you do that very often are also not to neglect)
My problem with these videos is that you put the US in Denver - which is an average city, but not one that people are super clamoring to live in - and Berlin, which is a city everyone is clamoring to live in, has a housing crisis that is ... really bad. Not munich bad, but really bad. It's like comparing apples to... not oranges, but certainly pears. The pair seems off, and I think doesn't really show an accurate representation. Somewhere mid-sized, like Leipzig, Dresden, or even Bielefeld might have been a better comparison. In Leipzig, for the kind of money that Max had in his budget he could have gotten an apartment that was just as nice - or nicer - than Steve's. ALSO: No family with a car also gets a Bahncard 100. They get whatever the regional ticket they need to get them where they need to go to work, or they have two cars. That's just insanity.
Thank you for part 2 of this very exhaustive and comprehensive comparison. Over the years I have done quite a number of similar comparisons, though on a much more casual and subjective level, between Paraguay and Germany. And as you stated in your final thoughts, at the end of the day, the deciding factor often is not the cold, hard numbers, but such emotional factors as work-life balance and the living environment (like multi-use zoning and housing). And frankly even the objective numbers are not so different if you strive to include all factors to achieve a true apples-to-apples comparison.
Like I commented to the previous video, once American kids are out of the childcare, the American family is approximately $30000 per year ahead. That changes the result completely: Both American single workers and American families are financially ahead of their German counterparts.
Very comprehensive, almost overwhelming. Thank you. The cost of living and salaries are only one aspect of choosing a place to live. It seems a cultural peculiarity of Americans to give a lot of weight to money. It is always amazing how Americans seem to remember the prices of any small thing, like a coffee, costs anywhere. Not criticising just noticing. The Americans possibly overestimate money, French food and wine, Germans probably rules, security and orderliness. The USA were very cheap in the mid-90s when I stayed there was very cheap, in particular food. Now it is extremely expensive: hotels, restaurants, drink, sightseeing tickets, cinema, This is an aspect I notice, but I would still go there even for living there if I had to. Ultimately what makes me happy not having chosen to live there is personal safety, social security, accessibility of education for my kids, and weather in most of the USA. It is very extreme in most places. Very hot humid summers and arctic winters. Even in cities which are quite South, compared to European cities, such as NY, the winters are like Russia and the summers are like Hong Kong. The mountains simply run the wrong way. Only a short Indian summer in October which is actually pleasant. I admire the settlers who settled the midwest without AC. What I like about the US outside big cities is that everything is big: cars, beds, fridges, parking lots and the lack or non-enforcement of regulations. I could rent a speed boat on Lake Powell without showing any license. Wouldn't get anything but a rowing boat in Germany. What is good about having grown up in Europe is, that it is quite easy to move to the US, which is not the case vice versa. The easy language is one reason, the fact that we know what it will be like there culturally before we go there from movies and TV shows.
Thank you for the incredible effort you put into these videos. From my point of view, there are different approaches to financial independence in the US and Germany. In the US, it is often said that everyone is the architect of his own fortune, meaning that everyone can shape his own fate through hard work and good decision-making. In Germany, however, there is a greater focus on the strong helping the weak. This means that a US citizen with a good education and no problems that prevent him from earning money (such as family problems, illness, genetic factors, accidents, misjudgements, or layoffs) will have more money available comparatively faster and can achieve financial independence more easily. He will live in a country with neglected infrastructure, but he can largely escape the problem with his money. If the plan does not go smoothly, he can fall deep. On the other hand, a German citizen will find it much more difficult to earn money quickly because he have to contribute a part for infrastructure and the weak. For example, 50% of the price of gasoline is taxes. But if he have problems, he can rely on the solidarity of the system. Even if he caused the problems himself, the state would still pay him an apartment and a basic income that is enough to live on. This is certainly an incredible thought for a US citizen: Even a murderer is treated like this after his release. As a comparison: Germany, with 83 million inhabitants, has 37,400 homeless people, which is 0.045% (as of 09/22). Source: Spiegel. The US, with 331.4 million inhabitants, has 580,000 homeless people, which is 1.75%.
Thanks for the video. I am living in Germany for 6 months, and it was really required to see such kind of comparison video. From my point of view, there is also a disproportion between professions. For IT guys salary in the US is x2 of germans. PS. Thanks to taxpayers of Germany and the US for support of Ukrainians.
Super video as always. One can not imagine, how much work you must have put into that. Just allow me some comments: Trash will always be included in the Nebenkosten when you rent. I have never heard or seen anything else. The consideration of just one car for a Beelitz family makes sense. However the BC100 doesn't...if one of them works in/around Berlin. It is quite generously assumed. Maybe it's the case with some "Freiburg family" ;-) - as Freiburg is a bit more remote than Berlin/Beelitz...but I am assuming here. Yes, thank you for the final point on the personal experiences, the life what happens to people. If you happen to get very sick, your life in the US might become unbearable. If you happen to have a great business idea, you might get filthy rich in the US and chase your American dream...but many chase it forever and all they end up with is credi card debts. Whereas your German dream might be on a much smaller scale. Not getting filthy rich, even with the brightes of ideas, but also not get filthy poor if you are dealt very bad cards.
In some german cities the trash bill has to be paid direct to the city administration - also for rented flats. So it is not possible to charge this with the Nebenkosten
Good morning 🌄 Respect and admiration for all the work you always do there, all the filming, designing, the search for facts and so much more that comes together until the video can be uploaded and presented. Almost an hour and a half just the last two videos, that's really great and of course there are a few mistakes every now and then, but that's how everyone is after all and makes you human and likeable. I really enjoy your videos with all the information and look forward to a new one every week. We still hear the error about the solidarity surcharge almost every day from West Germany, I can reset the clock, so all is well. Over the years I've found for myself that less is more, I don't actually need so many things. It is very important for me that I can get from one place to another without a car, so there are also Germans who don't have anything for cars and are in favor of a further good expansion of public transport, instead of subordinating everything to the car. Have a nice week
Someone that lived in Colorado and bought a home and now lives in Germany. One thing you forgot! Colorado checks taxes every two year for home and land. Ie one time home goes up and then your land goes up. This is added to your monthly bill. I was paying $400 month and after 5 years was paying $700 more. Also 30 year loan in Germany? Cover the way Banks calculator an home loan in US to Germany and you will be surprised.
There are all sorts of closing costs in the USA. Typically there is a 6% broker fee. Who pays it is negotiated but typically the seller pays this fee. There are title fees and other things but not sure it would approach 25%. :) Oklahoma, when we left in 1998, still had a personal property tax derived based on the property tax. It was eventually repealed. My wife and I would LOVE communities like those found in Germany or other European countries. The closest we got was Portland, OR when we lived in an apartment in downtown Portland. She could walk nearly everywhere and at the time (1999) she could catch a bus 17 miles south to Wilsonville to meet me after work. You said you did real estate data research when you were in the USA. Funnily enough my job is related to real estate. I appreciate all the research you have done and how you show your sources. It gives you huge credibility when discussing the differences between 2 countries. Thank you for the wonderful series/channel.
Good Jon on the analysis. One thing I bring up is utilities can be cheaper or more expensive in each state. I grew up in Florida, and when my mom and I moved to Tennessee our electricity bill in Florida was cheaper than Tennessee, but our water bill in Tennessee was cheaper than our water bill in Florida. I had friends that visited us from Florida. When they saw our water bill price they came up with the theory we didn't shower 🤣🤣. Florida has been going for the renewable energy (mostly solar) like crazy. You see in Parks sculptures that have solar panels on top of the sculptures. You don't see that in Tennessee.
Great video. But for the transportation segment I think the cost of maintaining and repairing the cars are missing. It should be a significant factor for single Steve with the used car and help level the playing field. I think the cost of maintaining the car: regular check ups, filter changes, liquid fill ups, winter-summer changes are a factor. And for the used car the repair cost should be noticable. For the families with new cars it shoudn't be a big factor.
I looked into this when I looked at staying in Germany or moving back to the USA. If I moved back to the USA I would need to live in the Boston area since that is where the office is. Even with a cost of living adjustment I would lose out BADLY on that move. The cost of living adjustment would not come even close to covering the rental difference. An 80 m^2 apartment in koln will run about 1400 but in Boston it would run about 3x that. I would also lose easy access of walking to grocery stores and other stores which would also increase the costs I would have to pay.
@@nicholashartmann4525 You can go ahead and check out apartment prices yourself in Cambridge and Boston. It is insane. Also the cost of food there is also much higher than anything I have seen in Germany.
I think there was a video from Sarah Dietschi about the costs of her New York apartment. Really crazy over there! In our countryside in Germany, you can get small apartments for 400-500 Euro already.
It’s sad that your channel doesn’t have more views. You put so much work and research into it, while others just do „reaction videos“ with no preparation and have a million subscribers
Unless Married Max or Mila have to travel a lot for work, they will probably not get a BahnCard 100, but a VBB Umweltticket. Which would cost them 142,20 Euro per person (Berlin ABC plus one district, since they live just outside of zone C) if they pay monthly. If they pay yearly, the price goes down to 114, 95 Euro per person/month. There is a good chance at least one of them works for a company that offers a Firmenticket, which would decrease the price further (depending on the kind of deal the company has made, by quite a lot, they might end up paying less than a hundred per person/month).
Excellent points. There are quite a bit of options when it comes to public transit that can really make it an attractive option from a price perspective. I know many employers here in Freiburg also offer "commuter bonuses" for employees that take public transit or bike to work instead of driving.
Eine Freundin von mir bekommt monatlich einen Tankgutschein über 60€, da sie etwas außerhalb wohnt! A friend of mine gets a monthly gas voucher for 60€, because she lives a bit outside!
Thanks I had the same thought since most German metro subscriptions are quite extensive and relatively low cost. Imagine what it will be like if they get the $49 country-wide ticket going!
Very detailed analysis. For my life, almost everything is advantageous here in Nevada. Higher income, lower taxes by far, far lower costs for driving the car I want, insurance much cheaper than in Colorado in your example, much cheaper electricity costs, heating costs, and on and on. Very good. People have to decide how they want to live.
Hallo Ash, die beiden Videos waren sehr interessant und gut recherchiert, allerdings ist mir bei deinem Max ein Fehler in den Nebenkosten/Müll kosten aufgefallen:) Und zwar ist es so, dass in den meisten fällen die Müllkosten in den Nebenkosten enthalten sind, da es Gemeinschaftstonnen pro Haus, oder gar mehrere Häuser gemeinsam, gibt. Ich persönlich Miete seit über 10 Jahren mit diversen Vermietern von Privat bis Vonovia oder auch kleinere Hausverwaltungen und auch in diversen Bundesländern. Aber ich musste noch nie extra eine Mülltonne bestellt. Meine Mutter hingegen, die in einem Eigenheim wohnt, die bestellt ihre eigenen Tonnen (die sie wiederum mit ihren Untermietern teilt).
Having 5 weeks of paid vacation vs none ist quite simple to factor in - contrary to what was stated in the end. After all you work 11 month, but get 12 months salary. Another example would be Austria, where there are mandatory 14 months of salary per year. In both cases you would simply even out the differences over 12 months.
Great video. One thing: The cost of day care in the US is insane, not sure if this should be factored in for families. Also in Germany, you don't need to have a college savings plan, so I think that this puts costs for a family even more in favor for the German family.
All great points. These factors were included in the cost analysis in part one of this series (last week's video)... so for this video, those costs have already been taken into account.
UK citizen here - Interesting to note the differences in housing and related transportation and food links between US and Germany. In US, your nearest grocery store (in this example) is 14.5km DRIVE from the home, whilst in Germany, you'll rarely, if ever be further than 3-5 mins WALK from most, if not all amenities. I learned this from another video, produced by someone else, but this is largely down to Zonal regulations when it comes to town planning. In US, residential zones are strictly residential only, with shopping in a separate zone elsewhere and commercial elsewhere again. This leads to Americans going for bulk buying of foods with a long shelf life on an irregular basis. In Germany, residential zones must allow for a certain amount of shops nearby whereby residents can access fresh products on a regular or daily basis, from very close to your home. Hopefully, someone else with experiences of both countries will be able to give a more accurate confirmation, but that is what I am lead to believe.
Comparing a house to an apartement doesn‘t make sense. It is the dream of most germans to own their own house one day, but we just can‘t afford the mortgage, so we have to live in apartements. And only because you don‘t need a car most germans just like to have a car. You compared two different lifestyles. The american one with a nice house and cars and the german one with a appartment and reliance on public transportation. Most Germans would love to life the Us lifestyle with all that luxury commodities.
Great analysis with a lot of detail, as always. 👍 I really enjoyed it. There is one factor however that I missed. Maybe you said it and I just didn’t notice it, but for home owners you also have to include that they need to build some sort of reserve fund in case that there is a bigger spending necessary like a new roof, new heating, water pipes, etc. Insurance doesn’t cover that. If you don’t want your property to depreciate in value over time, regular investments are a must. In fact if you buy a flat like your German family does, this is mandatory in Germany (called Hausgeld). Keep up the great work! 💪
I have seen videos where they compared north American zoning laws and the way cities and towns are set up in Germany. Stateside they had housing and commercial/schools/industry all clearly separated, with large satellite housing estates offside and mostly not allowing shops to be built within, which makes things a bit impractical. In Europe there are mixed areas where there was housing and shops mixed, thus making places more accessible without the need for a car for every thing
Actually these slightly mixed areas are the norm, while strict residential areas are rarely larger than a soccer stadium with maybe 20 houses - and even those may allow for things as a bakery if none is nearby.
Ok, so single Steve could buy 262 beers at a price of $8 (adjusted after video was corrected in pinned comment) Single Max would end up with 428 beers at €3,50 -Not- -much- -of- Now that's a difference! -too-
Hmm I have never heard of people comparing it with beer. My famous goto is the BMI (Big Mac Index). Which would be 328 Big Macs for Max (at €4,65), and 681 Big Macs for Steve (at $5.15) Are beer prices that much higher in the US?
Loved Part 2! Thank you for the hard work and research in getting all this information and data together. To continue the series can we do further analysis as our family ages, ala retirement? paying for kids college, the impact of those early pension and retirement contributions etc I feel like a lot of the social contributions would wind up being better for Germany as you get older. Expecting at least one major surgery like a hip replacement, or even diabetes or cancer which is more prevalent than ever before.
Based on the last video I think the major player in all of this is still child care. If one of the parents in the US can work remotely (even just a couple days a week), the savings on that alone start to balance the scale. At a macro level it's interesting to see how German tax and social policy basically encourages having kids haha. I don't expect that it's coincidence, given the need to rebuild after the war. Thanks for this awesome two-part analysis!
It’s unrealistic to think that remote working equates with child care. Impossible to get any work done or have video calls when young children are constantly demanding attention.
Childcare costs are definitely the problem, but working from home is not the solution! That said, those costs will drop enormously once all the kids are in school. Picking a point in time during the ~3-6 years when those parents are paying nursery fees does skew things quite a bit.
@@phueal Unfortunately covid blew those assumptions sky high. A parent is vulnerable to daycare failure until the child can do remote school unsupervised . If the school closes for epidemic or weather reasons we have one pay check taking a nick.
Well, am I happy to have found your video!… My son in law has just moved to Germany, actually kind of close to you (Metzingen), and my daugther will join him later on when the kids finish school. It’s going to be an experience for the kids as well as for the parents!!!
One major issue that Germany and most developed countries have is demographic implosion. Large welfare states require young people to pay into the system. Germany is aging quickly and producing very few children while having low immigration rates. An attempt to increase Germany’s immigration to a level like the US would likely cause political instability. US birth rates are super low as well but immigration will keep the US in better shape over the next few decades. That’s assuming immigration rates stays the same. Without immigrants, US will implode too.
that explains why this creator made this video. she's probably being paid by the german government to paint america in a bad light so people can move over to germany.
such a long video, again. this must have taken quite a while to research, record and edit. Very interesting to watch, thank you. Hope you and your famly are doing well.
Yeah I don't think 40 minute videos are sustainable for us to put out each week, but the topic of this video needed a more comprehensive analysis/outline. Glad you enjoyed the video!!
Hi Black Forest Family, Ashton a few thoughts about single Max, as my personal experience single flat or as you called one bedroom Apartments are really hard to get in German Cities... espacilly Berlin, Hamburg, München. So i think Max is smart, he will either look for a larger Flat and to Start a Wohngemeinschaft (shortened WG) at the Start of his University Time, or move to a existing one, where i has his own room and share Bathroom, Kitchen and Living Room with others... Maybe Students or People with a far away home just for Workingstay... he will save a lot of costs... Don't know if a WG is also Known in the US? Also as last week, i was happy with starting with less money in the begin, it's much easier to get later a feeling about money when you have to calculate from early on...also more Work life Balance and Workers right, but hey each one as he likes... Stay safe and Healthy Black Forest Family!
Great points! The housing shortage is also pretty strong in the Freiburg area as well. I would love to make a video in the future taking a look at all of the various co-opts and housing types in Germany. Housing was the subject of my studies, so I love to nerd out on those factors.
@@peter_meyer as far as i can see, the neighbourhood in the US is even more important than in germany, as there is real Marzahn as exemple cause there are in the different Quarters also different places more expensive to rent then others and the "stigma" to live somewhere is felt a bit less than i can hear from US
Love the last 2 videos with the comparison of salarys and costs. I am a german that moved to Alabama recently. Would love a video about the different school systems in Germany to the US. I think it is weird that all people go to the same middle ore highschool. Imagine you put the Hauptschüler together with the Gymnasiasten.
I think that would be a really interesting idea for a video. I grew up in a very rural area (my dad is a farmer, and quite literally the town where my school is/was is so tiny it doesn't even have a stoplight). I went to the same school system with the same kids from Kindergarten all the way through high school.
It would be interesting - but also a long series of videos. Unfortunately there isn't a German school system anymore, there are sixteen. In Hesse for example there are schools where all kids attend classes together, the so called IGS or integrierte Gesamtschule. They are separated in 9th grade, when some of them get their Hauptschulabschluss, but if marks are good enough they can go on for Mittlere Reife after 10th grade and even Abitur after that. And the other Bundesländer have other concepts. Don't move if you have kids in school!
Great video! Again it shows the effort an diligence you put in your videos. Sure a lot of estimates but how else to approach that. So everybody watching can see for themselves in which area they go for more expensive options or save money. One additional factor going into decisions and quality of life are the cultural options. How does rural Colorado and Berlin (of all German cities 😉) compare in this area? Just a thought...
Great job! You really made yourself the effort to find "all" (I guess one could go into this even deeper, but then no one really can follow what's being said in the beginning and end. What's important too ) the informations needed to compare both systems! One gets you're already a good teacher. 😃
Yall got one of the best in-depth analyses out there on this subject, good job guys. Its nice to have lot of comments on here to point out errors and the other side of the arguments too. USA vs Germany ,no wrong or right, which one is better ? Just depends on where you are in your life stage, both of these countries might benefit you. For us (family of 4), we found a way to hack this. We were supposed to move to Germany but we ended up on the Czech Republic of side of German/Czech border. We are still very accessible to German infrastructure, culture, tourism.We have the same benefits with education and healthcare, but pay none of the high taxes and expenses that comes with it. We are in our mid 50's , have 2 kids , its the perfect setup with central Europe if you need that extra safety net with health care and education heading in your retirement. Knowing full well ahead, we were never dependent on getting a job or running a successful business when deciding moving to the EU , we did had a good career and slowly transitioned to operating remotely before coming here. Id like to add something you pointed out , in the transportation part. It is the perfect travelling hub of Europe, all the best services with buses ,trains ,planes transit thru there. The competitions between these companies are so intense , I've gotten so many good deals traveling from Germany to other EU destinations for 100 E ,roundtrip to almost anywhere. Compared to Canada ,where Im from, could be anywhere from 400-600 each way before taxes.So for everyone out there that's thinking about retiring and travelling a lot around the EU, living anywhere near Germany is a perfect spot for traveling base.
I grew up in Germany and planned to migrate to the US. However, things in the US went downhill. As did things in Germany. Smaller countries make better deals nowadays. I ended up in Switzerland. Luxembourg is also very attractive in Europe.
@@svr5423 Very smart of you! Ppl automatically assume you're a leech if you want to move to a better cost of living country to lower your taxes and expenses. What they dont know is , lot of folks out there (myself included) in North America are so fed up being so much taxes (40 years in my case), but getting less and less for it lately.They decided to look elsewhere for better deals. This is totally legal, thats why digital nomads/capitalist exist. Why should we alwasy pay half of our money for something we dont really need? I thought about Luxemberg too, but Im considering either Lichenstein or Andorra for the tax heavens. They're both right beside the major hubs of big infrastructures countries like France , Spain and Germany. Good choices you made with Switzerland tho, good luck.
@@Cz-De-Lifestyle Thanks. I believe it often boils down to psychological reasons. Germans are collectivist by culture. They do what the others do. If someone is different, it may be perceived as a threat, especially if he is successful. Therefore they become hostile in order to "shame" someone into compliance. "Das macht man nicht" ("that's something we don't do") is a very powerful German saying and way of criticising someone. Australia, New Zealand and Singapore might also be interesting for you. I know a few people who migrated there.
1. Get a master degree in computer science in Germany. It's almost free. 2. Get a private medical insurance (Anwartschaftsversicherung) as early as possible (it's cheap), get a public medical insurance for students at the same time. 3. Work part time as a software developer while you're working on #1 and save as much money as possible for #4. 4. Move to the USA and get a PhD degree in a high reputation school like Stanford or MIT. If you're not good enough to be accepted to such schools, you can skip this step (alternative: make a bachelor degree in Germany and a master degree in the USA). During your studies find a part time job as a software developer. 5. After graduating find a full time job in the Silicon Valley that will pay you about $300-500K p.a. (of course, nobody will pay you that much right after finishing the university, but it is a realistic range once you get experience. This range is impossible to reach in Germany as an engineer, no matter how hard you try. 6. Live frugally and save money. You will have to pay 5K per month for a tiny apartment, but who cares if you make 300-500K per year? For the remaining money buy stocks. The first years will be the hardest. 7. After 10-15 years retire and move to Germany. Ideally, you should be in your early 40s by now. 8. Convert your Anwartschaftsversichering into full private medical insurance (if you have completed step #2). 9. Get a job in Germany and work for "peanuts". But you need this step for at least 6 months for #10. Also, you will need this step, if you haven't completed step #2. 10. Get a mortgage and buy a house. 11. Quit the job. Enjoy the life, the low 25% fixed income rate and the social benefits. You can still continue working as a software developer in Germany for "peanuts" (maybe part time?) if life is too boring for you. Alternative: become a self employed IT engineer and earn about 90-100 EUR per hour (of course, no fixed 25% income tax in this case). 12. Now you can afford to have a family. This may sound harsh, but honestly, most Germans will not have a family until this age anyway. Most people will not follow this "easy" plan, because they will have no discipline while they are young. USA = good for people who make a lot of money. Germany = good for people who have a lot of money.
Sounds like a good plan to me! :) And I agree with your conclusion. Germany is unattractive for people who (want to) work, but very attractive if you already have assets that you can live off.
On a global scale, both countries are very wealthy ones with a high standard of living. Still, if you are a "high potential" young individual (healthy, belonging to right ethnic group, from a family with the means and social background to give you a quality education), you're probably going to make considerably more money in the US (especially, if you're a DINK couple with similar characteristics). Whilst these characteristics apply to most of the people I know (besides the age - most of us are already in the 2nd half of life), it's by no means the majority of the population in either country. Most of those other people have probably better chances of making a decent living in Germany. If you want both, high income and European style social benefits, than you would probably have to move to Luxemburg or Switzerland (or perhaps Canada?).
It can be. But at our last apartment in Freiburg, we had to pay for it outside of Nebenkosten. Unfortunately these listings didn't specify whether it was included or not, so I added it on just to be safe.
A more realistic comparison to a flat/house in the Berlin would be something in the Boston area, for example. And that a quite different numbers, and I am not even starting with New York … The VBB-Umweltkarte ABC+One County costs 124,43 €, and the complete ticket for Berlin-Brandung costs 186,90 €. And there is a good chance, that the employer will take some of the costs over. When it comes to food costs, there it will be a bigger different spread, when consumer want to buy organic food, pastries from a bakery etc.
Great points - for this video it was just easier for me to keep them in the same locations as part 1, since state taxes would have changed the American calculation. But I would agree that they aren't a complete apples to apples comparison.
One of the perceived benefits of US style capitalism is the perception that anyone can put forth some effort and "live the dream". Income mobility, from lower to middle to upper, is a strong indicator of how realistic that opportunity is. A comparison between the US and Germany on that income mobility would be very interesting. Comparing the progression opportunities for a native, an immigrant, and an expat would be very interesting.
Seems about similar if you have the capabilities of getting the degrees. The US has the added drawback of you getting riddled with debt while you are still poor and thus getting prevented from dedicating your time or resources to climbing upwards.
What you forgot about buying an Eigentumswohnung in Germany is the dreaded Eigentümerversammlung. I once planned to buy one, but after I had been to such an assembly, I decided to not want to live close to those Eigentümer with their Eigentümlichkeiten. (Sorry, that joke only works in German.) Gladly, I inherited a small house in the country, and that's where I live now.
I guess that is a HOA in the US. I am actually looking to purchase a home in the US here in the next two years, but I will never purchase one that has a HOA.
Compare that to the HOA and it's 'congregation' of dedicated home owners deciding on which types of plants you are allowed to plant in your own garden, just so you won't inconvenience somebody with having to look at individualistic expressions, I can't even guess which of them is worse.
@@RustyDust101 Neither could I. I would have had to take a loan to afford that home, but after I was at that assembly, I decided to rather not to. Yes, the types of flowers you plant on your balcony also was an issue, discussed in full length, and I was just craving for a cigarette and thinking, "please, Scotty, beam me out of here".
As always, Dr. Ashton presents a complex subject in enough detail to get context but not overwhelm. Unfortunately, you undertook an impossible task as the regional variations potentially render the comparisons less useful. I don’t know the magnitude of the regional variations in Germany but in the US they are huge. I suspect the wage differential within the US reflects this. Living in a state that is at the end of the national supply chain distribution system has significant impact on the numbers. I’d love to be paying the costs you quoted for Denver but the average single family detached house costs double your examples in the metropolitan area where I live (the northernmost major one on the East Coast.) Granted, energy prices are now really distorted, but electric costs per KWH in my state are currently over three times higher than the Denver example. This is making my EV a lot less of a bargain. My city’s water and sewer rates are double those of Aurora, too, and are slated for a 25% increase phased in over the next 18 months. One last thing, I’d love to see neighborhoods in the US that were walkable clustered around small village like downtowns with key services (bank, post office, pharmacy, grocery store, train station, etc.) but still had detached homes with small yards as I don’t want to be hearing my neighbors’ activities. The older towns in the area have those but most new construction even in those towns is far away and has large lot size requirements as all in closer locations with their much smaller lots are already developed.
Interestingly, you don’t hear you neighbors nearby as much as you would in a typical US apartment building due to concrete floors and cinder block type wall construction in Germany. Likewise, double or triple glazed windows and excellent insulation reduce sound transfer. I’ve experienced this in my German vacation apartment building which has 30 units. Or maybe Germans are just less loud.
Another fascinating video. Thanks for making these and keep it up! Such a great point how everything looks exactly the same in U.S. suburbs; it feels like wandering through some dystopian simulation from Black Mirror. I just wasn't sure what the basis was for the remark that the U.S. properties are nicer. I'm not an engineer but the buildings in DE seem to be of a much higher quality in general, both structurally and aesthetically.
European quality of life for me wins every time. There is more to life than work. Internet costs in the US are very expensive. $130 = £107 per month. Internet prices in the UK are around £30/$35 per month
@@jjsmallpiece9234 it is shitty. I lived there for more than a quarter of a century. I know how it is and can compare to other developed countries I visited around the world. You should acquire some experience before saying ridiculous things.
@@jjsmallpiece9234 I'm not insulting anyone. I'm just stating things as they are. It's not my problem if that hurts your feelings. Maybe you should consult a therapist.
Always love your videos. I live in Romania. Have you been out of Germany and been to Eastern Europe? The Black Sea? Beautiful. Mountains as in Switzerland, or even more beautiful. Have been to more German family reunions? Would love some life updates, updates on pregnancy, more of Jack - how he's developing, etc.
We'll be sprinkling in some more personal videos here soon... I think later this month we are going to put out an update video on how the Kita transition has been since moving (in short, we've been in a 3 month Eingewohnung that has been PAINFUL to say the least). But YES, we have been traveled throughout Europe and included some destinations in Eastern Europe (but by no means have we been everywhere). It's always a toss up whether or not we film those trips, sometimes we do but sometimes we just want to enjoy the holiday and not have to worry about storylines or filming. The Black Sea and some travels to Turkey are high up on our list of places to visit in the coming years. 2023 will be a bit shorter on the travel excursions so we can save up vacation days for when the baby is born. Probably more weekend trips were we can arrive at the destination within a short 3-4 hour drive and take advantage of long weekends.
Comparing houses in Europe with USA ones in pure architectural view, energy efficiency and structural integrity is like comparing Mercedes with GM. So even if building a house in EU is more expensive, at least it will not be blown of with some wind or toppled with a small earthquake. In EU you build houses with stone and steel, in USA you build it with wood and thin sheets of plyboard... Just for comparison - try hitting a wall with a fist in an EU made house and USA made house :D
In earthquake country our building codes require the use of flexible materials like wood so they don’t “topple in a small earthquake.” Stone and brick crack and break, and thus are dangerous to those living below. In CA we’ve had to spend a lot of money retrofitting older buildings built when knowledge of how earthquakes work was not as great. Tall commercial buildings are now built with flexible joints and some on pads that allow the building to sway rather than shake and crumble.
@@annamc3947 Yep, seen some impressive videos about it. Interesting tech. As we don't have serious earthquakes in middle and northern europe (yet), we concentrate in insulation. You don't get far with plywood there. But i've seen some interesting videos on that, too.
The US is the most natural disaster prone country in the world. Masonry construction is dangerous in the face of tornadoes, hurricanes, and earthquakes. Building with wood is kinder for the environment and we have plenty of it.
I was shocked when I saw the US prices in restaurants and how everybody was okay with them. On average, eating at a restaurant was twice as expensive than what I had expected in Germany and then they expect you to pay up to 20% tip on top of those prices as apparently not even with that price they can afford to pay waiters a fair salary. And still many Americans prefer to eat at a retaurant before using their own kitchen, at least middle class and up.
No offense Black Forest Family living here in Europe is so much better than living in the Divided States of America. I feel sorry for all the European people now living in the Divided States of America they have been sold a lie America is not the greatest country in the world and it's definitely not the land of the free far from it. America treats it's own people like slaves i see no benefit in living in America the so called land of the free once again it's not no offense. Other than that a great video keep up the great work👍 And greetings from the Netherlands🇳🇱
No offence taken. I can understand why some choose to live in the States, but we truly live more comfortably in Germany. I have had significant health issues in the past, and not having to worry about the costs is truly freeing.
@@TypeAshton Exactly that's why living here in Europe is so much better than living in the Divided States of America. Healthcare here is so much better especially if you are a parent my god giving birth in the Divided States of America way to expensive. Europe is so much better period.
@@DidierWierdsma6335 weirdest comment ever I must say 😅 let people live wherever they want. If you can't afford to live in the D(?)SA, then don't. I doubt anyone was forced to move there, right?
@@maddinek Do you wish to be a DEBT SLAVE Martin? Many Americans and Europeans now living there are DEBT SLAVES. Europe is so much better than the Divided States of America period.
@@maddinek huh?? What is so weird about that statement, Europe is much better to live in, healthcare, holidays, and yes we are much more free than in the US, most of tge US are in jail, did you not know that? Oops..😂🤣😂🤣
Thank you for this series. They say "comparison is the thief of joy", and never has this been proven more true. After two 40 minute (!) videos of endless sizing and comparing (most of which I only breezed through), I don't know what to think, other than...I yearn for respite. May god have mercy on all our souls. 🙏
I found this series quite informative with facts and reasonable assumptions. Complex yes, but I think we can learn things about relative US v. German costs for transportation and food, things we might not think too much about in our own budgets. We can now ask ‘what if I didn’t have to own two cars?’ In the U.S.
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I think, for a young family with school going kids, another important factor is how much vacation time they get compared to their parents. Living in the Netherlands, my kid gets double the amount of time off (spring break, may break, summer break, fall break, xmas/new year break) than I get in days off from my full time job. So it becomes an annoying trade off between child care - or grand parents baby sitting - vs having time off with both or one parent. Kids dont even know how good they have it...
Estimate of anything under 300 a month for food for a single person is wild. One trip for a couple weeks worth of food and maybe a couple toiletries is well over 200 every couple weeks
Thank you so much for such an informative video! All the videos on your channel are very helpful for people considering moving to Germany and working there.
You tackled a tough comparison but I think you got as close as you could get. But there are still BIG differences between areas. The US is too big to make a generalized statement. I'm in Chicagoland and use 25kWh/day currently. But the house is 3,000 sqft (270 m2 + 90m2 basement). My house is $410k now but twice as big as the one in Colorado in your example. My US house in Berlin's suburbs would cost most likely around 3,500EUR/m2 = 945.000 EUR. Good luck saving up the additional 500k. Housing is difficult to compare due to the huge differences. In general, I would say home ownership is cheaper in the US. Rent is cheaper in Germany. Working for someone (W2-job) is better in Germany. Having a business is better in the US. In Germany, the government takes care of you and regulates more. In the US you are more responsible for yourself but less regulated (I think that is THE biggest difference between the countries). The lifestyle is vastly different and depends on what you like. I live for 14 years in the US and would have never thought that the differences are so big. It doesn't look like that on TV.
Yes! I have owned a business in the USA and Germany and its crazy when you run a business in Germany you have to worry more about having issues with regulations than running the business.
Wow. As always, a well researched topic and a very well made video. But I think there are a few points that aren't realistic and typical from a German point of view. On the one hand, Max is supposed to pay 250 Euros for heating, which I find completely unrealistic. Realistically, you can estimate maybe 80-120 euros per month for heating and hot water for a normally insulated apartment. Of course, if we assume that it heats normally. That the trash is already included in the monthly utiilities has already been mentioned in the comments. I would like to say with the family that a Bahncard 100 is not really common for local transportation service. I don't know anyone who has or had a Bahncard 100. It's more for someone who travels all over Germany several times a week. For local transport, you should then book a monthly ticket for the local transport association, which will probably cost around 100 euros a month. What I still missed are costs for Mobile phone and the cost of eating out sometimes. But based on average values, I think most of the numbers in the video are pretty accurate. Thank you for this video!!
I spend about €180/month for heating a house at the moment (Fernwärme, older house). In my old appartement it was less than that for a year (very good insulation !).
Mila, 36, Lehrerin in Deutschland mit 15(!) Jahren Berufserfahrung. Regelstudienzeit in Deutschland für das Lehramt: üblicherweise 10 Semester (=5 Jahre). Abitur hat Mila also ca. mit 31-15 = 16 Jahren gemacht (damals noch G9). Chapeau, Mila, so rechnet man sich Deutschland schön. :)
Great work. Comprehensive, transparent, and so well presented. And it finally gives some substance to that fuzzy notion of "way of life", and how profoundly it shapes your biography as well as your environment.
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This is also something I've noticed, having lived in the US and Germany for many years. Even though the kWh price in Germany is twice as high (now three times as high) as in the US, the overall energy bill in the US was a lot higher. In Germany you use 8 maybe 10 kWh/day, in the US you are way beyond 30 kWh/day. And a huge factor in that was the 24/7 running AC unit or the multiple fridges holding enough food to sustain you for many years. Germany is so much more energy efficient, be it electricity, heating (housing insulation), gasoline. Mainly because energy cost in Germany are so much higher, Germans don't waste.
Multiple refrigerators holding years of food. I must be doing something wrong. :D But ya, I remember TX and having to run the A/C in months we should have been running the heat.
I(Austria) have a house and 2 fridges and 2,5 freezers and need about 9kWh/day with about 4-5kWh/day just for the fridges/freezers. I have an AC which runs about 15h/year(!). But heating is not included and comes to 20kWh/day if calculated for a whole year (and a house which has not the best of insulation).
@@reinhard8053Why do you have an AC if it only runs 15h per year? Also somehow a oddly specific number.
@@toomflussiggrillanzunderfu8828 It was built in when I bought the house. I'm in the south of Austria so we get some hot nights. Mostly natural cooling will be enough but on 5 nights I let it run to cool the bedroom to 23°C which needed about 3h. The exact numbers might vary a bit.
It sounds like a lot of people are wasting energy. I live in a two bedroom condominium just outside of Orlando, Florida. My energy bill is around $65 per month. In the Summer, when I'm running the A/C much of the time, that number goes up to $110 per month. If this place were better insulated, like the homes up North, I expect these monthly bills would drop significantly.
Compared to my stay in the US and my current life in Germany: yes, I had more money in the US, which was nice for many visits to the different national parks, but the medical costs in the US sometimes would replace certain trips with their high bills (even though I had a health insurance). While I have generally less disposable income in Germany, I don't need to worry about surprise medical bills that often, which is nice for my general state of mind.
Just got hit for a very small amount but it was for Lab work and really, $2.76 should have been written off. It cost them more to process the invoice and now my payment. It was a surprise for us as we thought all labs were covered by our medical plan. Go figure.
My experience is that although Americans have more disposable income they tend to spend it much more freely than Germans.
@@julutschka1591 the economy of the USA is built on people spending more than they make. Very sad truth from my own observations. Luckily my wife and I don't do that but we know people who do. They are one emergency or missed paycheck for a disaster. :(
@@julutschka1591 americans used to have five credit cards .... I never had or needed one in germany.
@@tonykyle2655 Yeah. You guys are too reckless there and then complain about inequality. Life quality in the USA is vastly superior for people who use credit responsibly
****CORRECTION TO VIDEO
It seems that despite double checking my calculations and having the video proofed by a third party.... the housing costs for single Steve were added into the first section BUT not added in the subsequent calculations. Steve's final total should have amounted to 2,097.14 - which is still more than Max but a significant error and I will be spending the rest of the afternoon kicking myself for it.
For your reference here is how Steve's finances should have ended:
Starting net pay: 4,883.25
- Housing: - $1,411
- Utilities: - $286.93
- Transportation: - $822.25
- Food: - $265.93
TOTAL: $2,097.14
Ok, that 500 € are well spent for living in germany with nearly no gun abuse, near to nil religious goofing of the people around me and the better work-life-balance. Thanks for big review on that topic.
@@m.r.3912but it will be mutch more interesting if a no academic Worker. Most of them are well edicataed in the German speaking Part of europe...
Thank you for correcting the mistake that fast and don´t worry too much about it.
@@gwenselahvonmorthond5576 with so mutch numbers. There must be mistakes Inside. But without mistakes we do Not learn..
Look forward to part 3 where you compare what they can get with their money after everything else. What will a night out in Denver cost vs Berlin. How much would it cost to go skiing on the Czech border vs those hills to the west of Denver. Major items for home. Day out with the children. etc.
Your last comment on time off from work kind of struck me. As far as I remember, the federal law requires a 20 day time of vacation per year. Most unions in Germany have worked out a 28-30 day regulation. Besides that, we have a saying in Germany: "Do you live to work, or do you work to live?" Have a great day Black Forest Family!
And if you get too ill to work you are discarded.@@user-de9uc3py4d
Nice comparison, but unfortunately you made one big mistake in your calculation. At 8:08 you substract rent related costs of 1411$ from Steves income bringing his 4883.25$ correctly down to 3472.25$. You do similar calculations for all the others, but if you have a look at 23:37 Steve´s money is back to his total income of 4883.25$ whereas all the others are correctly reduced by the rent. This goes through all other calculations which makes the end result you calculated for Steve much higher than it really would be taking his rent cost into consideration.
In the final comparison Steve would not be at 3508.14$/3306.32€ but at 2097.14$/1976.49€ which is much closer to the 1620.22$/1527.62€ Max has as a final disposable income.
One other thing: not sure if a BahnCard100 is such a common thing that you can substrct those costs from the family income. A quick google search tells me that only 36,000 people purchased a BahnCard100 in 2021. Of course you have to substract other fees of public trasportation instead, but they would be much cheaper than the BahnCard100.
I agree that only very few people have the Bahncard 100. More have a Bahncard 25, which is ~90€/year. Also, there is a new nationwide ticket for 49€/month for public transport, which would be more likely to be owned by most people.
Another factor that goes into effect in 2023 is the capped train ticket at € 49,00. Having 2 kids needing it for their education (University & "FOS"), it will lower our transportation costs by min. € 150,00 ... 🤷♀️
Many people get "job ticket" from their employer and pay basically nothing for public transportation within the city. However, also many families have two cars. The truth is somewhere in the mix.
@@hw2508I actually don’t know any family living in a city that owns 2 cars
@@toomflussiggrillanzunderfu8828 that's the point. As soon as you move out of the city, many families do. But within a city, even one car might be more of a liability.
What a great job (again and again), Ashton!👏 Peace of mind is hard to quantify, especially for families I think! If one of the persons becomes seriously or chronically ill (children often get sick again and again) the level hits hard!
Thanks a lot!
PS: German Version of Breaking Bad:
Mr White you have cancer. Your treatment starts tomorrow and it will be covered by you're health insurance.
The End
Breaking Bad is SUCH a good analogy for the American healthcare system... although let's hope that not everyone resorts to being a power-hungry drug lord 😉😂😳
Yeah, that's what I tend to say. You are healthy in america: No problems. You get chronically sick in america? Game over. It all breaks down. You can lose your job tomorrow, lose money to pay the rent, get kicked out the appartement and thats it. Its probably hard to impossible for many to recover. Your fate is sealed. Thats how I see it. And its unworthy of a modern society.
That the different between private Insurance and public Insurance. And my American Friends that is Not socialistvh that is based on public solidarity. Germany and EU are captitalistc countrys too. But Working Class figthing for this more than 170 Years...
@@mllecamill3 The only salvation in the above scenario is if a spouse has a good job and put the "ill" person on their plan.
But your observation is spot on. In the USA, if one gets seriously ill then we have to resort to GoFundMe type campaigns. Know a person right now trying to fund their chemotherapy using a GoFundMe site. :(
Hallo Arno, I remember a day, I must have been about fifty-something years old at that time, when I passed my old Alma Mater and suddenly it struck me, that I had a family and was not free any more on what I could do (because of my responsibilities). Unfortunately that is the age where the probability for becoming seriously ill gets higher and higher again. And at that time most life forming decisions have been made and one has little influence left on what is to come. Looking back now, another decade later, I am rather happy that the government 'forced' me into things like the 'Krankenversicherung' or 'Rentenversicherung' before I understood why it is a good choice. Had to use it later, too.
I also remember being advised by older colleagues to start early with those 'Versicherungen' and I certainly am happy now for doing as they said. In hindsight I see why they recommended that. And I made sure, my kids did understand that as soon as they started earning money as well.
This is an excellent analysis. My German husband lived in the US for eleven years before moving back to Germany to accept his dream job offer. I am American. I enjoy the quality of life here more. My husband would say that both countries have their good points and their bad points. It is really a matter of what makes one happy.
What a nice family. Chronically ill American wife lives in Germany, while German husband was making the money in US. That is what the world needs.
@schattensand , if you are responding to me, your assumption is mistaken. I worked full-time in the US, and I work here in Germany. I have Hashimoto's disease (an auto-immune thyroid disorder), which is defined as a chronic disease. To assume our move was based on my need for healthcare is grossly mistaken.
@@schattensand chronically ill.. I have the same baaaaad disease. You can do anything with it once you are "eingestellt" with medication. So I don't know what point you are trying to make here 🤣🤣
This is what I try and tell people in the US and outside thr US. Most don't understand. Each thinks their country is the best for living.
@@jessicaely2521No, i believe Switzerland is the best country for living and i am German.
American living in Italy here. I think I've found my new favorite youtube family. What a great job you do in your videos! Keep them coming.
Great job. It is difficult to compare apples to oranges, and you did a thorough job trying. I think one important factor you mentioned very briefly is expectations. In Germany, most young people do not expect to live alone. They have roommates. I rent an apartment with my son in Hamburg, there are 8 large apartments in my Altbau (1905) and all are Wohngemeinschaften (WGs) with 2 or more roommates. I don‘t know anyone who loves alone. Living alone is an option, but it would require either moving to the suburbs or spending more on housing and less on entertainment and vacation, which are sacred here.
I always hated flat sharing (unless it's with a partner and/or kids) and it is by far not as common or cheap as you say. A decent sized room in a shared flat is often not much cheaper than a studio or a 1 bedroom flat. Actually, the flat sharing frenzy in cities makes it very hard for families (and single parents) to find flats, because it's almost impossible to compete against 3-4 adults who are all willing to pay 80% of the rent for a small individual flat, but for a room.
Thanks for this series. I don't know whether one can or should take into account the factor for illness or an accident. Not a "disaster" but something that can be described as serious but not life changing. For example an accident with a broken arm, or appendicitis. The difference between Germany and the USA should be big here.
One thing that is also underestimated is the payment into the pension fund, which pays off in old age.
Yes, the cost of even a minor accident can have major consequences for someone living in the USA. Many private insurance plans have a 100 dollar co-pay for emergency room visits - and that's the price BEFORE any tests, procedures, or care is given.
Love the show but respectfully suggest that Ashton work on her public speaking by eliminating filler words such as honestly, frankly, literally; etc.
@@TypeAshton Yes, even the "best" HMO tends to arbitrarily refuse to cover for some lab tests, and we have no recourse. I see it frequently in the many bills for my wife, who is of declining health. This and the 'copays' really eat up a chunk of the annual income. Some copays for medication are also excessive. For example my wife's blood thinner Elliquis eats up $100 for every refill. A list of such cases could go on endlessly...
@@TypeAshton 100%? A few year's ago I became heat-stroke and needed an afternoon stay in the hospital for approximately 2-3 hours. I have a very good job and insurance. My share was over $6,000.
Forget accidents, how about common stuff? i.e getting reimbursed for reading glasses or sunglasses, free or discounted prescriptions, zero or little copay on common dental procedures, etc. By the way, shouldn't Steve's family start have several thousand dollars subtracted just to give birth to kids?
Thanks, Ashton, for all the effort you (&your husband) put into these videos. Upon explaining the situation for the US family, you make a passing mention that they want to buy a house in a 'good school district'. I remember that - being German - it took me quite a while to figure out that the same physical house across the street might be waaay more expensive (or cheaper), simply because there is a school district boundary between them. For the benefit of your non-US-audience, it might be worthwhile to explain (sometime), why the differences between school district are there in the first place, and why they matter so much.
Confused? You won't be after this episode of...
This in-depth comparison dive (to the extent possible) you take us on is extremely informative, even if only to show how complicated this can be. As a citizen of one of the Nordic countries (crappy climate but high security) it is a no-brainer to me: Working to live a secure and comfortable life, very similar to most of my fellow citizens, is more important to me than the apparent rat-race of life in 'Murica. Of course I am biased, but who isn't?
Despite the mistakes that you pointed out yourself--again it was a great analysis. What a huge amount of research and work you must have put into it! In my comment on the first video I pointed out the better infrastructure (the upside of higher taxes) in Germany, especially public transport (or transportation as you Americans say), and the way, cities in Germany--and generally in Europe--are built. In this video, certainly planned long ago, you considered exactly these factors. I was really shocked that in the example of the US couple, the nearest grocery store was 14 km away, while--at least in the cities in Germany--you have almost always supermarkets within walking distance which maybe are not as large as the grocery stores in the US, but usually still cover your needs for your weekly household shopping tour i.e. food, drink, and other non-food household articles). In the countryside this is often more difficult, and usually you need a car there too, to get about and to decent shops, but still, 14 km to the next grocery store seems to me a huge distance, even in the German countryside.
Yes - I'd say the distance to shop in cities averages maybe under 1km (10min walk).
And in rural areas in the south it can be up to 3 to 5km - which is still easily doable with a bike 🚲
Everything is much denser and walkable here - if you're lucky you even a 🚉🛤️ or 🚌 connecting small cities and bigger villages.
So the need for a car is not completely necessary - except if you're living in remote/less populated areas like - mountains, agriculture land or forests (mainly East Germany and "Sauerland", on the northern coast or on the borders of Germany - public transport infrastructure mainly sucks there.
Just one thing I wanna say - thanks and very, very good job. Your production value has gone truely through the roof ...
Hey guys, couple of things I'd like to add:
Nebenkosten usually include trash in about 98% of the cases.
Differentiating Nebenkosten and heating costs is also misleading as they're commonly one thing (though the sums seem realistic in your example).
Lastly, no German I know calculates the rent he can afford by the cold price. It doesn't really make any sense, to be honest. If you have a budget of 1.5k per month for rent, you need to look for an appartment that comes out at about 1.5k *including* heating, water, etc -- i.e. anything included in your monthly payments to your landlord.
Also, I want to add that comparing the second most expensive city in Germany when it comes to rent with ... Denver doesn't really make sense.
Bahn 100 also doesn't make a lot of sense. It's an option you pick if you need long-distance travel, since it includes ICE. Otherwise, why not stick with the new 49€ ticket, which will still allow him to use local trains, busses, the subway ... and only costs like 1/8 of the Bahncard.
I don't have as much of a problem with the car you picked as with the rather arbitrary 20k km. If you're in the vicinity of Berlin, I just don't see why you'd drive over 50km *per day*, including weekends. If anything, you'd try to avoid driving into Berlin with a car as much as possible -- especially a nice car. Trust me.
It's a good attempt but it's really difficult to make a valid comparison in these videos.
P.S.:
900 KWH per MONTH for a single person??
Jesus!
Mit 900kWh komme ich ca 9 Monate aus. Das ist echt absurd viel für einen Monat.
900 Kilowattstunden? Da ist aber die Hanfplantage mit drinnen oder? :DD
@RagingGoblin "Differentiating Nebenkosten and heating costs is also misleading as they're commonly one thing (though the sums seem realistic in your example). "
No, not necessarily. When I was living in Hannover, all my appartemens save one had "Gasetagenheizung" - which was a small gas heating providing heating and warm water, which was either located in the kitchen or in the bathroom. Each appartement had their own, and hence, there were "Nebenkosten" (which included common costs for the house), which we paid alongside the rent, but we also had a contract with our local provider for gas, which went extra. In Hannover, this was very common especially for older houses from pre war or from the 1950ies and 1960ies, but I don't know how often this is seen elsewhere.
900 kWh will be to run their AC / electric heating system 24/7, as many Americans would.
Berlin has the 2nd most expensive rent? Denver is very expensive (Colorado is #5 most expensive state to live in) so it might not be too far off. Alot of her information is averages, not the cheapest a family can do, so 20,000km for a whole German family in suburbs is pretty typical.
As many have already pointed out, it would be interesting to see the differences at the lower end of the salary spectrum. Max, the single German worker is actually earning quite a lot. Many white collar workers with masters degrees earn about 2000-3000 Euros per month. On the otherhand in the US even waiters seem to earn about 35000 USD, while at the same time one can often read about people having to live out of their cars or with other serious restrictions in their lives, like not being able to consistently pay for the schooling of their children. So at that salary level things seems to be quite different!
Yes. I was surprised by her saying their salaries were so similar
Just compare 2 full time Mc Donalds worker in the US and Germany and you will see the real difference.
Yes, I was shocked as well! I'm 40 years old and barely earn more than the 23 year old Max from the example 😂 I would say the average salary at 23 is around 2000 netto - as long as you're not studying anymore 😉 With some years of experience it might be around 3000-3500 netto. But that's already the top 20% of all employees. With a netto salary of 3500 you are already considered "rich" in Germany.
@@Dunklerturm1990 McD is always a good indicator, not just the salaries, but also the pricing of the products. Especially crazy if you compare Germany to Switzerland 😅
@@simply-the-max You are totally right. I am starting to dislike this channel that only points out how fabulous life is in Germany when it is not. Yes, healthcare and university bla bla bla but she doesn't point out how easy is to get stuck in a salary in Germany. How difficult is it to afford a house (not an apartment) in Germany, and how good do you need to be to outstand the average. OFC USA has its drawbacks that we all know, but tbh life in Germany is not as pleasant as she points out. Life is hard everywhere and the more money you have, the easier it is
Great video/information.
My husband and I are weighing the options to move to Germany. We are retired and I have family there. Inflation, although increased worldwide, seems to be even higher here in Canada where its becoming increasingly difficult to live, let alone live with some quality. Throw in the healthcare problems and yeah...were looking elsewhere.
I'm happy for this follow-up video cuz you've been very thorough! I'm also happy it confirms what I already had a feeling for. Specially the last part with the vacation days, work hours and worker's right in general, I can only expect the disposable income per actually worked hours is gonna heavily tilt towards DE, both for the family as for the single people. Some other random thoughts:
- Idk if the salaries you considered are nationwide or localized to the actual cities you considered in the end. I imagine both countries will see differences in salary depending on location.
- As you laid out very well in the first video, in Germany you pay a lot of things preemptively, with the appropriate name "insurance", while a lot of this is up to the individual and in worst case left to be a thought only after the fact. So in Germany you're "forced" by the Government to have a plan in case you get unemployed, while in the US it is more of a gamble that you hope you won't get unemployed and hence not need unemployment money.
- Speaking of unemployment, yes, labor laws in DE are so strong you will have less terminations. So that "forced" unemployment insurance can be cheaper per worker since the chance that any give worker will be unemployed unexpectedly. The prevalence of at will work contracts would increase this chance and the amount set aside would have to increase accordingly.
- Final thought on unemployment money, since the vast majority of the expenditure of an american worker is related to consumption and not taxes, this also means you need more money set aside to hold the same standard of living as before. In DE wouldn't pay taxes anymore so your remaining income stretches further.
- The comparison was done with relative well paying jobs, which honestly also makes sense since immigrating as a lower income worker is much harder, and your audience is likely people considering immigration. That said, I can only wonder what the comparison would look like for, say, Stephanie and Mila when they were young and single, assuming their salaries would be smaller than young Steve and Max and the comparison would look even worst
I really like the addition this video makes to the previous one. I particularly like the fact how you solved the housing issue by simply going for a percentage of income. It is an incredibly elegant solution, which approximates the reality of people spending what they can afford, whether that's on housing, food, hobbies, etc.
I think there are 2 major takeaways from these 2 videos:
1) If you're young and healthy, the USA is absolutely amazing. That is, if you / your parents can actually afford to give you a quality education, but I think that might even be a different topic; wealth gap and economic opportunity gaps between the US and Germany.
But, I digress. What I meant to say was that it really struck me how the difference in actual spending power decreases in the USA at the same rate it increases in Germany as age and social circumstances change.
When you put that into perspective of actual spending power per person, both will decrease. Germany from (and I will round to an easy number for simplicty's sake) €1.600 to €3.200/4=€800 meaning a 50% reduction. The USA by comparison will be €3.200 to €1.600/4=€400 meaning a whopping 87,5% reduction.
2) As mentioned by several others already, peace of mind is priceless. I'm living in the Netherlands, which is quite similar to Germany in many ways. If I had lived in the USA, I would have been so completely screwed, I think there would be a significant chance I would have committed suicide. For context, I am now 41 years old, have Asperger's (on the Autism Spectrum) and I'm transgender. I have battled with depression and various other mental issues for the majority of my life. Here in the Netherlands I've been able to live off disability welfare and most of my medical costs are covered by my insurance (which I pay a whopping 18,7% of my net income for. Ew.). It has allowed me the time and financial opportunity to seek an education at age 39. I have recently found a job at which I can both earn a decent living as well as continue and finish my studies.
Thank God for socialism.
EDIT: Due to the correction posted a short while ago, my first major takeaway point now contains an error. Unfortunately, I am lazy and can't be bothered to correct it fully. While it significantly reduces the loss of spending power per person in the USA, it's still much larger than in Germany since the total spending power is still reduced in the USA vs increased in Germany, so my point still stands.
I wrote a comment with very similar conclusions, but now I realise, you wrote this, including more details.
Well, so be it.
@@mina_en_suiza That's okay! It's sometimes hard to sift through all the comments to find if someone else has written something similar.
Besides, it's not a bad thing really.😊
Hallo. Ich denke, ihr habt einen kleinen Fehler bei den Miet-Kosten für Max in Berlin gemacht:
Die Müllkosten (Trash) sind bei Mietwohnungen in den Nebenkosten enthalten.
Das macht auch deshalb Sinn, weil die BSR, also der Müllentsorger, nicht für jeden Mieter eine eigene Mülltonne bereitstellt, sondern nur eine Behältergröße per Haus und die Rechnung auch nur an einen Empfänger schickt.
I can confirm, this is not only the case in Berlin but more or less everywhere where you have shared trash.
Ich habe eine eigene Restmülltonne, die ja kostenpflichtig ist, in meiner Mietwohnung und teile mit 6 Parteien eine Biotonne und auch meine Gebühren für die einzelne Tonne sind in den Nebenkosten enthalten.
@@Kloetenhenne Dann bist du / sind Sie die große Ausnahme. In aller Regel sind Müllkosten in den Nebenkosten enthalten. Genauso wie - bis Mitte dieses Jahres - Kabelgebühren enthalten sein können (das ist weniger üblich).
Ich wohne in einer Altbauwohnung in Hannover und wir haben zwei Restmülltonnen vor dem Haus stehen, eine Bio-Tonne, zwei Gelbe Tonnen und eine Papiertonne. Restmüll und Bio-Tonne sind gebührenpflichtig, die anderen Tonnen gebührenfrei.
@@franhunne8929 hä, hab ich was anderes behauptet? Lesen will gelernt sein.
@@Kloetenhenne 'Warum so aggressiv - ich hab nur noch mal herausgehoben, dass es in Deutschland die große Ausnahme ist. Das hattest du so nicht geschrieben.
Thank you again for your efforts!
As most workers in both countries earn less than engineering wages, I would imagine the disparity between those earning closer to the average (or below) is greater - favoring Germany, especially with the better Sozialhilfe in Germany.
The vacation days, labor rules are so difficult to quantify or express, but living them sure is a life-changer!
"Who has more money at the end of the day" is such an American way of approaching life. I have to quote Mr. Micawber from Dicken's "David Copperfield".
“Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen and six, result happiness. Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pounds ought and six, result misery.”
It's about the lifestyle that money buys you. I am far poorer financially here in Germany than I was in the UK but I am far happier.
I really like your deep dive, it is very interesting to me! My partner and I had some thoughts about moving to the US for a while, since salaries are sometimes dramatically higher (we are both software developers) but then again working culture is not really a match for us (we have some experience since we worked in international companies). I wonder how remote work will shift salaries around in our sector where big companies hire now everywhere and sometimes with much higher salary ranges than in Germany.
One thing I would also take into account is the cost of sick leave and paid vacation in Germany (I think that was already mentioned before).
What also contributes much to quality of living is security (murder/crime rate) as well as poverty in general.
Hello Ashton, hello Jonathan,
happy Sunday. As you said corretly in the last Part of todays Video, there are some factors in live where you can not put a pricetag on, like Variation days social securtiy and so on.
So living in the US would be no option for me. Just thinking of the 30 Vacation days and starting in April one Day off every three werks when getting 57 years old and enjoying "Altersteilzeit". Best regards Ralf
Hi Ralf! Happy Sunday to you too. We 100% agree - peace of mind is so important. ❤️
You actually have proven what we all knew for a long time. Thank you very much for your elaboration on the matter.
That’s my overall conclusion also confirming what I get living in the US and Germany.
Thanks for the thoughtful analysis -- really interesting. I lived in Germany for a few years in the early 70's. Living now in the U.S. for decades, I believe things for the average person have accelerated downhill here, and are reflected in our low comparative life expectancy.
I am in my 30s and live in the US. The 2008 crash decimated my generation, but the quality of life was decaying since the 90s.
I can only repeat my suggestion from last week: How would those numbers compare if you look at the lower end of the income spectrum?
true
I always thought that if ur rich the US is awesome but if ur poor its a nightmare
I agree, those videos seem to be based on the top 10 percent of incomes - at least in Germany.
Excellent. Like the last video, I'd still love to see a Monte Carlo analysis that ranges over all these variables rather than picking a couple representative "average" answers...
Loving this series - very analytic, fact-driven and all the assumptions clearly stated. Cannot wait for the next Sunday.
Really glad you are enjoying the video series! Thanks for watching.
Adding to the work life balance topic: When I worked short-term in the US, a lot of colleagues told me that they would take a fixed amount of paid sick leave days per year as "extra vacation days" if they don't get sick (Minnesota). While a short research showed me that there are actually some states where you get paid even in case of short-term sicknesses, if you have a bad immune system, you would also have additional reduction of money per hour in most states. In Germany as soon as a doctor confirms that you are short-term sick enough (paid for by default insurance), you don't need to work but still get paid (but of course social factors if you do that very often are also not to neglect)
My problem with these videos is that you put the US in Denver - which is an average city, but not one that people are super clamoring to live in - and Berlin, which is a city everyone is clamoring to live in, has a housing crisis that is ... really bad. Not munich bad, but really bad. It's like comparing apples to... not oranges, but certainly pears. The pair seems off, and I think doesn't really show an accurate representation.
Somewhere mid-sized, like Leipzig, Dresden, or even Bielefeld might have been a better comparison. In Leipzig, for the kind of money that Max had in his budget he could have gotten an apartment that was just as nice - or nicer - than Steve's.
ALSO: No family with a car also gets a Bahncard 100. They get whatever the regional ticket they need to get them where they need to go to work, or they have two cars. That's just insanity.
Thank you for part 2 of this very exhaustive and comprehensive comparison.
Over the years I have done quite a number of similar comparisons, though on a much more casual and subjective level, between Paraguay and Germany. And as you stated in your final thoughts, at the end of the day, the deciding factor often is not the cold, hard numbers, but such emotional factors as work-life balance and the living environment (like multi-use zoning and housing).
And frankly even the objective numbers are not so different if you strive to include all factors to achieve a true apples-to-apples comparison.
Like I commented to the previous video, once American kids are out of the childcare, the American family is approximately $30000 per year ahead. That changes the result completely: Both American single workers and American families are financially ahead of their German counterparts.
Very comprehensive, almost overwhelming. Thank you. The cost of living and salaries are only one aspect of choosing a place to live. It seems a cultural peculiarity of Americans to give a lot of weight to money. It is always amazing how Americans seem to remember the prices of any small thing, like a coffee, costs anywhere. Not criticising just noticing. The Americans possibly overestimate money, French food and wine, Germans probably rules, security and orderliness. The USA were very cheap in the mid-90s when I stayed there was very cheap, in particular food. Now it is extremely expensive: hotels, restaurants, drink, sightseeing tickets, cinema, This is an aspect I notice, but I would still go there even for living there if I had to. Ultimately what makes me happy not having chosen to live there is personal safety, social security, accessibility of education for my kids, and weather in most of the USA. It is very extreme in most places. Very hot humid summers and arctic winters. Even in cities which are quite South, compared to European cities, such as NY, the winters are like Russia and the summers are like Hong Kong. The mountains simply run the wrong way. Only a short Indian summer in October which is actually pleasant. I admire the settlers who settled the midwest without AC. What I like about the US outside big cities is that everything is big: cars, beds, fridges, parking lots and the lack or non-enforcement of regulations. I could rent a speed boat on Lake Powell without showing any license. Wouldn't get anything but a rowing boat in Germany. What is good about having grown up in Europe is, that it is quite easy to move to the US, which is not the case vice versa. The easy language is one reason, the fact that we know what it will be like there culturally before we go there from movies and TV shows.
Thank you for the incredible effort you put into these videos. From my point of view, there are different approaches to financial independence in the US and Germany. In the US, it is often said that everyone is the architect of his own fortune, meaning that everyone can shape his own fate through hard work and good decision-making. In Germany, however, there is a greater focus on the strong helping the weak. This means that a US citizen with a good education and no problems that prevent him from earning money (such as family problems, illness, genetic factors, accidents, misjudgements, or layoffs) will have more money available comparatively faster and can achieve financial independence more easily. He will live in a country with neglected infrastructure, but he can largely escape the problem with his money. If the plan does not go smoothly, he can fall deep. On the other hand, a German citizen will find it much more difficult to earn money quickly because he have to contribute a part for infrastructure and the weak. For example, 50% of the price of gasoline is taxes. But if he have problems, he can rely on the solidarity of the system. Even if he caused the problems himself, the state would still pay him an apartment and a basic income that is enough to live on. This is certainly an incredible thought for a US citizen: Even a murderer is treated like this after his release. As a comparison: Germany, with 83 million inhabitants, has 37,400 homeless people, which is 0.045% (as of 09/22). Source: Spiegel. The US, with 331.4 million inhabitants, has 580,000 homeless people, which is 1.75%.
Thanks for the video. I am living in Germany for 6 months, and it was really required to see such kind of comparison video. From my point of view, there is also a disproportion between professions. For IT guys salary in the US is x2 of germans. PS. Thanks to taxpayers of Germany and the US for support of Ukrainians.
Super video as always. One can not imagine, how much work you must have put into that. Just allow me some comments: Trash will always be included in the Nebenkosten when you rent. I have never heard or seen anything else. The consideration of just one car for a Beelitz family makes sense. However the BC100 doesn't...if one of them works in/around Berlin. It is quite generously assumed. Maybe it's the case with some "Freiburg family" ;-) - as Freiburg is a bit more remote than Berlin/Beelitz...but I am assuming here. Yes, thank you for the final point on the personal experiences, the life what happens to people. If you happen to get very sick, your life in the US might become unbearable. If you happen to have a great business idea, you might get filthy rich in the US and chase your American dream...but many chase it forever and all they end up with is credi card debts. Whereas your German dream might be on a much smaller scale. Not getting filthy rich, even with the brightes of ideas, but also not get filthy poor if you are dealt very bad cards.
In some german cities the trash bill has to be paid direct to the city administration - also for rented flats. So it is not possible to charge this with the Nebenkosten
I worked in the USA in my 30 right after my PhD…. And left back to Germany after a decade… and never regretted both decisions.
Yes, US for money and PhD education ONLY.
Good morning 🌄
Respect and admiration for all the work you always do there, all the filming, designing, the search for facts and so much more that comes together until the video can be uploaded and presented. Almost an hour and a half just the last two videos, that's really great and of course there are a few mistakes every now and then, but that's how everyone is after all and makes you human and likeable. I really enjoy your videos with all the information and look forward to a new one every week. We still hear the error about the solidarity surcharge almost every day from West Germany, I can reset the clock, so all is well. Over the years I've found for myself that less is more, I don't actually need so many things. It is very important for me that I can get from one place to another without a car, so there are also Germans who don't have anything for cars and are in favor of a further good expansion of public transport, instead of subordinating everything to the car.
Have a nice week
Someone that lived in Colorado and bought a home and now lives in Germany. One thing you forgot! Colorado checks taxes every two year for home and land. Ie one time home goes up and then your land goes up. This is added to your monthly bill. I was paying $400 month and after 5 years was paying $700 more. Also 30 year loan in Germany? Cover the way Banks calculator an home loan in US to Germany and you will be surprised.
There are all sorts of closing costs in the USA. Typically there is a 6% broker fee. Who pays it is negotiated but typically the seller pays this fee. There are title fees and other things but not sure it would approach 25%. :)
Oklahoma, when we left in 1998, still had a personal property tax derived based on the property tax. It was eventually repealed.
My wife and I would LOVE communities like those found in Germany or other European countries. The closest we got was Portland, OR when we lived in an apartment in downtown Portland. She could walk nearly everywhere and at the time (1999) she could catch a bus 17 miles south to Wilsonville to meet me after work.
You said you did real estate data research when you were in the USA. Funnily enough my job is related to real estate. I appreciate all the research you have done and how you show your sources. It gives you huge credibility when discussing the differences between 2 countries.
Thank you for the wonderful series/channel.
Really glad you enjoyed the video. Thank you so much for watching!
You can bring down the broker fee if you have a good realtor. My mom sold her house in Florida and she got the broker fee down to 2%
Good Jon on the analysis. One thing I bring up is utilities can be cheaper or more expensive in each state. I grew up in Florida, and when my mom and I moved to Tennessee our electricity bill in Florida was cheaper than Tennessee, but our water bill in Tennessee was cheaper than our water bill in Florida. I had friends that visited us from Florida. When they saw our water bill price they came up with the theory we didn't shower 🤣🤣. Florida has been going for the renewable energy (mostly solar) like crazy. You see in Parks sculptures that have solar panels on top of the sculptures. You don't see that in Tennessee.
Great video.
But for the transportation segment I think the cost of maintaining and repairing the cars are missing. It should be a significant factor for single Steve with the used car and help level the playing field.
I think the cost of maintaining the car: regular check ups, filter changes, liquid fill ups, winter-summer changes are a factor. And for the used car the repair cost should be noticable. For the families with new cars it shoudn't be a big factor.
ah that is a fair point! That would be a great addition to this video.
A new car has a great loss in value. If you consider it the repair costs shouldn't matter to much.
What a well researched, thorough video! Thank you so much for taking the time to put out videos like this!
Glad you enjoyed the video! Thanks for watching.
I looked into this when I looked at staying in Germany or moving back to the USA. If I moved back to the USA I would need to live in the Boston area since that is where the office is. Even with a cost of living adjustment I would lose out BADLY on that move. The cost of living adjustment would not come even close to covering the rental difference.
An 80 m^2 apartment in koln will run about 1400 but in Boston it would run about 3x that. I would also lose easy access of walking to grocery stores and other stores which would also increase the costs I would have to pay.
4200 Euro? What the heck!
@@nicholashartmann4525 You can go ahead and check out apartment prices yourself in Cambridge and Boston. It is insane. Also the cost of food there is also much higher than anything I have seen in Germany.
@@Immudzen daaamn
I think there was a video from Sarah Dietschi about the costs of her New York apartment. Really crazy over there!
In our countryside in Germany, you can get small apartments for 400-500 Euro already.
@@simply-the-max Hahaha try 1K in Munich 🤣. But still cheap compared to four damn thousand
It’s sad that your channel doesn’t have more views. You put so much work and research into it, while others just do „reaction videos“ with no preparation and have a million subscribers
Yes... and unfortunately, many of those reaction channels don't ask for our permission first before using our content online.
Unless Married Max or Mila have to travel a lot for work, they will probably not get a BahnCard 100, but a VBB Umweltticket. Which would cost them 142,20 Euro per person (Berlin ABC plus one district, since they live just outside of zone C) if they pay monthly. If they pay yearly, the price goes down to 114, 95 Euro per person/month. There is a good chance at least one of them works for a company that offers a Firmenticket, which would decrease the price further (depending on the kind of deal the company has made, by quite a lot, they might end up paying less than a hundred per person/month).
Excellent points. There are quite a bit of options when it comes to public transit that can really make it an attractive option from a price perspective. I know many employers here in Freiburg also offer "commuter bonuses" for employees that take public transit or bike to work instead of driving.
Eine Freundin von mir bekommt monatlich einen Tankgutschein über 60€, da sie etwas außerhalb wohnt!
A friend of mine gets a monthly gas voucher for 60€, because she lives a bit outside!
Thanks I had the same thought since most German metro subscriptions are quite extensive and relatively low cost. Imagine what it will be like if they get the $49 country-wide ticket going!
Very detailed analysis. For my life, almost everything is advantageous here in Nevada. Higher income, lower taxes by far, far lower costs for driving the car I want, insurance much cheaper than in Colorado in your example, much cheaper electricity costs, heating costs, and on and on. Very good. People have to decide how they want to live.
yeah and Brandenburg is cheaper then Berlin or Baden-Württemberg
Hallo Ash, die beiden Videos waren sehr interessant und gut recherchiert, allerdings ist mir bei deinem Max ein Fehler in den Nebenkosten/Müll kosten aufgefallen:) Und zwar ist es so, dass in den meisten fällen die Müllkosten in den Nebenkosten enthalten sind, da es Gemeinschaftstonnen pro Haus, oder gar mehrere Häuser gemeinsam, gibt. Ich persönlich Miete seit über 10 Jahren mit diversen Vermietern von Privat bis Vonovia oder auch kleinere Hausverwaltungen und auch in diversen Bundesländern. Aber ich musste noch nie extra eine Mülltonne bestellt. Meine Mutter hingegen, die in einem Eigenheim wohnt, die bestellt ihre eigenen Tonnen (die sie wiederum mit ihren Untermietern teilt).
Having 5 weeks of paid vacation vs none ist quite simple to factor in - contrary to what was stated in the end. After all you work 11 month, but get 12 months salary. Another example would be Austria, where there are mandatory 14 months of salary per year. In both cases you would simply even out the differences over 12 months.
Great video. One thing: The cost of day care in the US is insane, not sure if this should be factored in for families. Also in Germany, you don't need to have a college savings plan, so I think that this puts costs for a family even more in favor for the German family.
All great points. These factors were included in the cost analysis in part one of this series (last week's video)... so for this video, those costs have already been taken into account.
UK citizen here - Interesting to note the differences in housing and related transportation and food links between US and Germany. In US, your nearest grocery store (in this example) is 14.5km DRIVE from the home, whilst in Germany, you'll rarely, if ever be further than 3-5 mins WALK from most, if not all amenities.
I learned this from another video, produced by someone else, but this is largely down to Zonal regulations when it comes to town planning. In US, residential zones are strictly residential only, with shopping in a separate zone elsewhere and commercial elsewhere again. This leads to Americans going for bulk buying of foods with a long shelf life on an irregular basis. In Germany, residential zones must allow for a certain amount of shops nearby whereby residents can access fresh products on a regular or daily basis, from very close to your home.
Hopefully, someone else with experiences of both countries will be able to give a more accurate confirmation, but that is what I am lead to believe.
Comparing a house to an apartement doesn‘t make sense. It is the dream of most germans to own their own house one day, but we just can‘t afford the mortgage, so we have to live in apartements. And only because you don‘t need a car most germans just like to have a car. You compared two different lifestyles. The american one with a nice house and cars and the german one with a appartment and reliance on public transportation. Most Germans would love to life the Us lifestyle with all that luxury commodities.
High taxes is the reason german don't live that lifestyle , socalism policy screw middle class
Same with cars a camaro Llt in Germany 55000 euros
Your country heading to communism where the state own all property in Germany only 15% people own homes
@@coopsnz1
Great analysis with a lot of detail, as always. 👍 I really enjoyed it.
There is one factor however that I missed. Maybe you said it and I just didn’t notice it, but for home owners you also have to include that they need to build some sort of reserve fund in case that there is a bigger spending necessary like a new roof, new heating, water pipes, etc. Insurance doesn’t cover that. If you don’t want your property to depreciate in value over time, regular investments are a must. In fact if you buy a flat like your German family does, this is mandatory in Germany (called Hausgeld).
Keep up the great work! 💪
Ah yes, this would be true for both the US and German buyers. Ideally I should calculate in homeowners insurance (and discuss deductibles) as well.
I have seen videos where they compared north American zoning laws and the way cities and towns are set up in Germany. Stateside they had housing and commercial/schools/industry all clearly separated, with large satellite housing estates offside and mostly not allowing shops to be built within, which makes things a bit impractical. In Europe there are mixed areas where there was housing and shops mixed, thus making places more accessible without the need for a car for every thing
Actually these slightly mixed areas are the norm, while strict residential areas are rarely larger than a soccer stadium with maybe 20 houses - and even those may allow for things as a bakery if none is nearby.
A little correction: Trash is part of the Nebenkosten
Ok, so single Steve could buy 262 beers at a price of $8 (adjusted after video was corrected in pinned comment)
Single Max would end up with 428 beers at €3,50
-Not- -much- -of- Now that's a difference! -too-
Hmm I have never heard of people comparing it with beer. My famous goto is the BMI (Big Mac Index).
Which would be 328 Big Macs for Max (at €4,65), and 681 Big Macs for Steve (at $5.15)
Are beer prices that much higher in the US?
@@codex4048 AFAIK $6-7 per beer plus the usual tip. As you tip for every single drink in the US, i added it to the price.
Single max will never see 3.5k netto at 23 😂
@@saribelouni902 as a Single Max I have to disagree with you. I got it at 24, but 23 should be quite doable.
The beer would also be better in most places for Max also. There are some good local US beers but.
Loved Part 2! Thank you for the hard work and research in getting all this information and data together. To continue the series can we do further analysis as our family ages, ala retirement? paying for kids college, the impact of those early pension and retirement contributions etc I feel like a lot of the social contributions would wind up being better for Germany as you get older. Expecting at least one major surgery like a hip replacement, or even diabetes or cancer which is more prevalent than ever before.
Based on the last video I think the major player in all of this is still child care. If one of the parents in the US can work remotely (even just a couple days a week), the savings on that alone start to balance the scale. At a macro level it's interesting to see how German tax and social policy basically encourages having kids haha. I don't expect that it's coincidence, given the need to rebuild after the war. Thanks for this awesome two-part analysis!
It is always interesting that as soon as someone with children works remotely, this person basically has two jobs at the same time.
It’s unrealistic to think that remote working equates with child care. Impossible to get any work done or have video calls when young children are constantly demanding attention.
@@SuperPuddingcat exactly
Childcare costs are definitely the problem, but working from home is not the solution!
That said, those costs will drop enormously once all the kids are in school. Picking a point in time during the ~3-6 years when those parents are paying nursery fees does skew things quite a bit.
@@phueal Unfortunately covid blew those assumptions sky high. A parent is vulnerable to daycare failure until the child can do remote school unsupervised . If the school closes for epidemic or weather reasons we have one pay check taking a nick.
Well, am I happy to have found your video!… My son in law has just moved to Germany, actually kind of close to you (Metzingen), and my daugther will join him later on when the kids finish school. It’s going to be an experience for the kids as well as for the parents!!!
One major issue that Germany and most developed countries have is demographic implosion. Large welfare states require young people to pay into the system. Germany is aging quickly and producing very few children while having low immigration rates. An attempt to increase Germany’s immigration to a level like the US would likely cause political instability. US birth rates are super low as well but immigration will keep the US in better shape over the next few decades. That’s assuming immigration rates stays the same. Without immigrants, US will implode too.
that explains why this creator made this video. she's probably being paid by the german government to paint america in a bad light so people can move over to germany.
such a long video, again. this must have taken quite a while to research, record and edit. Very interesting to watch, thank you. Hope you and your famly are doing well.
Yeah I don't think 40 minute videos are sustainable for us to put out each week, but the topic of this video needed a more comprehensive analysis/outline. Glad you enjoyed the video!!
Hi Black Forest Family, Ashton a few thoughts about single Max, as my personal experience single flat or as you called one bedroom Apartments are really hard to get in German Cities... espacilly Berlin, Hamburg, München. So i think Max is smart, he will either look for a larger Flat and to Start a Wohngemeinschaft (shortened WG) at the Start of his University Time, or move to a existing one, where i has his own room and share Bathroom, Kitchen and Living Room with others... Maybe Students or People with a far away home just for Workingstay... he will save a lot of costs... Don't know if a WG is also Known in the US? Also as last week, i was happy with starting with less money in the begin, it's much easier to get later a feeling about money when you have to calculate from early on...also more Work life Balance and Workers right, but hey each one as he likes...
Stay safe and Healthy Black Forest Family!
Great points! The housing shortage is also pretty strong in the Freiburg area as well. I would love to make a video in the future taking a look at all of the various co-opts and housing types in Germany. Housing was the subject of my studies, so I love to nerd out on those factors.
And would he move to Marzahn? I doubt it.
@@marie9814 Well, would Steve want to live in that neighbourhood she chose? We don't know.
@@peter_meyer as far as i can see, the neighbourhood in the US is even more important than in germany, as there is real Marzahn as exemple cause there are in the different Quarters also different places more expensive to rent then others and the "stigma" to live somewhere is felt a bit less than i can hear from US
@@peter_meyer My reaction as well - Marzahn? Highly problematic area of Berlin.
Love the last 2 videos with the comparison of salarys and costs. I am a german that moved to Alabama recently. Would love a video about the different school systems in Germany to the US. I think it is weird that all people go to the same middle ore highschool. Imagine you put the Hauptschüler together with the Gymnasiasten.
I think that would be a really interesting idea for a video. I grew up in a very rural area (my dad is a farmer, and quite literally the town where my school is/was is so tiny it doesn't even have a stoplight). I went to the same school system with the same kids from Kindergarten all the way through high school.
it's called "Gesamtschule" in Germany.
It would be interesting - but also a long series of videos. Unfortunately there isn't a German school system anymore, there are sixteen. In Hesse for example there are schools where all kids attend classes together, the so called IGS or integrierte Gesamtschule. They are separated in 9th grade, when some of them get their Hauptschulabschluss, but if marks are good enough they can go on for Mittlere Reife after 10th grade and even Abitur after that.
And the other Bundesländer have other concepts. Don't move if you have kids in school!
@@marie9814 In Gesamtschule every child learns as much as the slowest pupil. Very good! Equal rights and opportunities for everyone! YaY!
@@wolfgangpreier9160 Das ist Quatsch. Es gibt selbstverständlich differenzierten Unterricht.
this would be something super interesting seeing what this looks like for minimum wage workers. really enjoyed this video :)
Great video! Again it shows the effort an diligence you put in your videos.
Sure a lot of estimates but how else to approach that. So everybody watching can see for themselves in which area they go for more expensive options or save money.
One additional factor going into decisions and quality of life are the cultural options. How does rural Colorado and Berlin (of all German cities 😉) compare in this area? Just a thought...
Great job! You really made yourself the effort to find "all" (I guess one could go into this even deeper, but then no one really can follow what's being said in the beginning and end. What's important too ) the informations needed to compare both systems! One gets you're already a good teacher. 😃
Yall got one of the best in-depth analyses out there on this subject, good job guys. Its nice to have lot of comments on here to point out errors and the other side of the arguments too.
USA vs Germany ,no wrong or right, which one is better ? Just depends on where you are in your life stage, both of these countries might benefit you. For us (family of 4), we found a way to hack this. We were supposed to move to Germany but we ended up on the Czech Republic of side of German/Czech border. We are still very accessible to German infrastructure, culture, tourism.We have the same benefits with education and healthcare, but pay none of the high taxes and expenses that comes with it. We are in our mid 50's , have 2 kids , its the perfect setup with central Europe if you need that extra safety net with health care and education heading in your retirement. Knowing full well ahead, we were never dependent on getting a job or running a successful business when deciding moving to the EU , we did had a good career and slowly transitioned to operating remotely before coming here.
Id like to add something you pointed out , in the transportation part. It is the perfect travelling hub of Europe, all the best services with buses ,trains ,planes transit thru there. The competitions between these companies are so intense , I've gotten so many good deals traveling from Germany to other EU destinations for 100 E ,roundtrip to almost anywhere. Compared to Canada ,where Im from, could be anywhere from 400-600 each way before taxes.So for everyone out there that's thinking about retiring and travelling a lot around the EU, living anywhere near Germany is a perfect spot for traveling base.
So you are proud of being a parasite?
@@TheBrazilRules nah Im smart. Are you proud of being troll ...morality police? Nobody ask you about ur opinions so scoot
I grew up in Germany and planned to migrate to the US. However, things in the US went downhill. As did things in Germany.
Smaller countries make better deals nowadays. I ended up in Switzerland. Luxembourg is also very attractive in Europe.
@@svr5423 Very smart of you! Ppl automatically assume you're a leech if you want to move to a better cost of living country to lower your taxes and expenses. What they dont know is , lot of folks out there (myself included) in North America are so fed up being so much taxes (40 years in my case), but getting less and less for it lately.They decided to look elsewhere for better deals. This is totally legal, thats why digital nomads/capitalist exist. Why should we alwasy pay half of our money for something we dont really need?
I thought about Luxemberg too, but Im considering either Lichenstein or Andorra for the tax heavens. They're both right beside the major hubs of big infrastructures countries like France , Spain and Germany. Good choices you made with Switzerland tho, good luck.
@@Cz-De-Lifestyle Thanks.
I believe it often boils down to psychological reasons. Germans are collectivist by culture. They do what the others do. If someone is different, it may be perceived as a threat, especially if he is successful. Therefore they become hostile in order to "shame" someone into compliance.
"Das macht man nicht" ("that's something we don't do") is a very powerful German saying and way of criticising someone.
Australia, New Zealand and Singapore might also be interesting for you. I know a few people who migrated there.
1. Get a master degree in computer science in Germany. It's almost free.
2. Get a private medical insurance (Anwartschaftsversicherung) as early as possible (it's cheap), get a public medical insurance for students at the same time.
3. Work part time as a software developer while you're working on #1 and save as much money as possible for #4.
4. Move to the USA and get a PhD degree in a high reputation school like Stanford or MIT. If you're not good enough to be accepted to such schools, you can skip this step (alternative: make a bachelor degree in Germany and a master degree in the USA). During your studies find a part time job as a software developer.
5. After graduating find a full time job in the Silicon Valley that will pay you about $300-500K p.a. (of course, nobody will pay you that much right after finishing the university, but it is a realistic range once you get experience. This range is impossible to reach in Germany as an engineer, no matter how hard you try.
6. Live frugally and save money. You will have to pay 5K per month for a tiny apartment, but who cares if you make 300-500K per year? For the remaining money buy stocks. The first years will be the hardest.
7. After 10-15 years retire and move to Germany. Ideally, you should be in your early 40s by now.
8. Convert your Anwartschaftsversichering into full private medical insurance (if you have completed step #2).
9. Get a job in Germany and work for "peanuts". But you need this step for at least 6 months for #10. Also, you will need this step, if you haven't completed step #2.
10. Get a mortgage and buy a house.
11. Quit the job. Enjoy the life, the low 25% fixed income rate and the social benefits. You can still continue working as a software developer in Germany for "peanuts" (maybe part time?) if life is too boring for you. Alternative: become a self employed IT engineer and earn about 90-100 EUR per hour (of course, no fixed 25% income tax in this case).
12. Now you can afford to have a family. This may sound harsh, but honestly, most Germans will not have a family until this age anyway.
Most people will not follow this "easy" plan, because they will have no discipline while they are young.
USA = good for people who make a lot of money. Germany = good for people who have a lot of money.
Sounds like a good plan to me! :)
And I agree with your conclusion. Germany is unattractive for people who (want to) work, but very attractive if you already have assets that you can live off.
On a global scale, both countries are very wealthy ones with a high standard of living. Still, if you are a "high potential" young individual (healthy, belonging to right ethnic group, from a family with the means and social background to give you a quality education), you're probably going to make considerably more money in the US (especially, if you're a DINK couple with similar characteristics). Whilst these characteristics apply to most of the people I know (besides the age - most of us are already in the 2nd half of life), it's by no means the majority of the population in either country. Most of those other people have probably better chances of making a decent living in Germany.
If you want both, high income and European style social benefits, than you would probably have to move to Luxemburg or Switzerland (or perhaps Canada?).
Switzerland and Luxembourg are very nice countries in Europe to work and settle down.
Very good video. Sehr gut ausgearbeiteter, präziser und nachvollziehbarer Vergleich. Thank you very much! Vielen Dank!
Great video as always.
Just a small remark, but as far as I know trash cost is always included in the Nebenkosten.
It can be. But at our last apartment in Freiburg, we had to pay for it outside of Nebenkosten. Unfortunately these listings didn't specify whether it was included or not, so I added it on just to be safe.
A more realistic comparison to a flat/house in the Berlin would be something in the Boston area, for example. And that a quite different numbers, and I am not even starting with New York …
The VBB-Umweltkarte ABC+One County costs 124,43 €, and the complete ticket for Berlin-Brandung costs 186,90 €. And there is a good chance, that the employer will take some of the costs over.
When it comes to food costs, there it will be a bigger different spread, when consumer want to buy organic food, pastries from a bakery etc.
Great points - for this video it was just easier for me to keep them in the same locations as part 1, since state taxes would have changed the American calculation. But I would agree that they aren't a complete apples to apples comparison.
One of the perceived benefits of US style capitalism is the perception that anyone can put forth some effort and "live the dream". Income mobility, from lower to middle to upper, is a strong indicator of how realistic that opportunity is. A comparison between the US and Germany on that income mobility would be very interesting. Comparing the progression opportunities for a native, an immigrant, and an expat would be very interesting.
We would LOVE to make a video on this exact topic. Its on our list for future content.
@@TypeAshton Please do it
Seems about similar if you have the capabilities of getting the degrees. The US has the added drawback of you getting riddled with debt while you are still poor and thus getting prevented from dedicating your time or resources to climbing upwards.
Classic good BFF Video again. But now we want a full german Video Duett Jonathan 's Intermission 😁
What you forgot about buying an Eigentumswohnung in Germany is the dreaded Eigentümerversammlung. I once planned to buy one, but after I had been to such an assembly, I decided to not want to live close to those Eigentümer with their Eigentümlichkeiten. (Sorry, that joke only works in German.) Gladly, I inherited a small house in the country, and that's where I live now.
I guess that is a HOA in the US. I am actually looking to purchase a home in the US here in the next two years, but I will never purchase one that has a HOA.
Compare that to the HOA and it's 'congregation' of dedicated home owners deciding on which types of plants you are allowed to plant in your own garden, just so you won't inconvenience somebody with having to look at individualistic expressions, I can't even guess which of them is worse.
@@RustyDust101 Neither could I. I would have had to take a loan to afford that home, but after I was at that assembly, I decided to rather not to. Yes, the types of flowers you plant on your balcony also was an issue, discussed in full length, and I was just craving for a cigarette and thinking, "please, Scotty, beam me out of here".
True that! Though US HOAs are a mess too.
As always, Dr. Ashton presents a complex subject in enough detail to get context but not overwhelm.
Unfortunately, you undertook an impossible task as the regional variations potentially render the comparisons less useful. I don’t know the magnitude of the regional variations in Germany but in the US they are huge. I suspect the wage differential within the US reflects this. Living in a state that is at the end of the national supply chain distribution system has significant impact on the numbers. I’d love to be paying the costs you quoted for Denver but the average single family detached house costs double your examples in the metropolitan area where I live (the northernmost major one on the East Coast.) Granted, energy prices are now really distorted, but electric costs per KWH in my state are currently over three times higher than the Denver example. This is making my EV a lot less of a bargain. My city’s water and sewer rates are double those of Aurora, too, and are slated for a 25% increase phased in over the next 18 months.
One last thing, I’d love to see neighborhoods in the US that were walkable clustered around small village like downtowns with key services (bank, post office, pharmacy, grocery store, train station, etc.) but still had detached homes with small yards as I don’t want to be hearing my neighbors’ activities. The older towns in the area have those but most new construction even in those towns is far away and has large lot size requirements as all in closer locations with their much smaller lots are already developed.
Interestingly, you don’t hear you neighbors nearby as much as you would in a typical US apartment building due to concrete floors and cinder block type wall construction in Germany. Likewise, double or triple glazed windows and excellent insulation reduce sound transfer. I’ve experienced this in my German vacation apartment building which has 30 units. Or maybe Germans are just less loud.
Another fascinating video. Thanks for making these and keep it up! Such a great point how everything looks exactly the same in U.S. suburbs; it feels like wandering through some dystopian simulation from Black Mirror. I just wasn't sure what the basis was for the remark that the U.S. properties are nicer. I'm not an engineer but the buildings in DE seem to be of a much higher quality in general, both structurally and aesthetically.
Grundsteuer currently changes in Germany. We expect to pay way more in the future.
European quality of life for me wins every time. There is more to life than work.
Internet costs in the US are very expensive. $130 = £107 per month. Internet prices in the UK are around £30/$35 per month
That's a lot.
I pay roughly 50 USD / month for gigabit (both ways) via FTTH.
Germany is way cheaper but they got a shitty infrastructure.
@@svr5423 German infrastructure is not shitty. You need to get out more
@@jjsmallpiece9234 it is shitty. I lived there for more than a quarter of a century. I know how it is and can compare to other developed countries I visited around the world.
You should acquire some experience before saying ridiculous things.
@@svr5423 Not at all I know Germany well. You are insulting to your old location.
@@jjsmallpiece9234 I'm not insulting anyone. I'm just stating things as they are. It's not my problem if that hurts your feelings. Maybe you should consult a therapist.
Who wants to live in Denver when you can live in Berlin for about the same costs
Always love your videos. I live in Romania. Have you been out of Germany and been to Eastern Europe? The Black Sea? Beautiful. Mountains as in Switzerland, or even more beautiful. Have been to more German family reunions? Would love some life updates, updates on pregnancy, more of Jack - how he's developing, etc.
We'll be sprinkling in some more personal videos here soon... I think later this month we are going to put out an update video on how the Kita transition has been since moving (in short, we've been in a 3 month Eingewohnung that has been PAINFUL to say the least).
But YES, we have been traveled throughout Europe and included some destinations in Eastern Europe (but by no means have we been everywhere). It's always a toss up whether or not we film those trips, sometimes we do but sometimes we just want to enjoy the holiday and not have to worry about storylines or filming. The Black Sea and some travels to Turkey are high up on our list of places to visit in the coming years.
2023 will be a bit shorter on the travel excursions so we can save up vacation days for when the baby is born. Probably more weekend trips were we can arrive at the destination within a short 3-4 hour drive and take advantage of long weekends.
Again, very well done. Thank you.
A lot of "food for thought" left, but that's a personal decission, everyone has to make on it's own.
Thanks again Peter for following along on this series and for providing such helpful comments/feedback along the way. ❤️
@@TypeAshton My pleasure.
@@TypeAshton Peter ist fleißig und kennt sich aus!😉
@@arnodobler1096 Naja, eher: ich hatte Zeit und habe meine Quellen.
Du bist ja auch recht umtriebig gewesen.
Comparing houses in Europe with USA ones in pure architectural view, energy efficiency and structural integrity is like comparing Mercedes with GM. So even if building a house in EU is more expensive, at least it will not be blown of with some wind or toppled with a small earthquake. In EU you build houses with stone and steel, in USA you build it with wood and thin sheets of plyboard... Just for comparison - try hitting a wall with a fist in an EU made house and USA made house :D
Well, she owned a house in the US and they recently moved into their new house in Germany.
She knows.
In earthquake country our building codes require the use of flexible materials like wood so they don’t “topple in a small earthquake.” Stone and brick crack and break, and thus are dangerous to those living below. In CA we’ve had to spend a lot of money retrofitting older buildings built when knowledge of how earthquakes work was not as great. Tall commercial buildings are now built with flexible joints and some on pads that allow the building to sway rather than shake and crumble.
@@annamc3947 Yep, seen some impressive videos about it. Interesting tech.
As we don't have serious earthquakes in middle and northern europe (yet), we concentrate in insulation. You don't get far with plywood there. But i've seen some interesting videos on that, too.
The US is the most natural disaster prone country in the world. Masonry construction is dangerous in the face of tornadoes, hurricanes, and earthquakes. Building with wood is kinder for the environment and we have plenty of it.
I was shocked when I saw the US prices in restaurants and how everybody was okay with them. On average, eating at a restaurant was twice as expensive than what I had expected in Germany and then they expect you to pay up to 20% tip on top of those prices as apparently not even with that price they can afford to pay waiters a fair salary. And still many Americans prefer to eat at a retaurant before using their own kitchen, at least middle class and up.
No offense Black Forest Family living here in Europe is so much better than living in the Divided States of America.
I feel sorry for all the European people now living in the Divided States of America they have been sold a lie America is not the greatest country in the world and it's definitely not the land of the free far from it.
America treats it's own people like slaves i see no benefit in living in America the so called land of the free once again it's not no offense.
Other than that a great video keep up the great work👍
And greetings from the Netherlands🇳🇱
No offence taken. I can understand why some choose to live in the States, but we truly live more comfortably in Germany. I have had significant health issues in the past, and not having to worry about the costs is truly freeing.
@@TypeAshton Exactly that's why living here in Europe is so much better than living in the Divided States of America.
Healthcare here is so much better especially if you are a parent my god giving birth in the Divided States of America way to expensive.
Europe is so much better period.
@@DidierWierdsma6335 weirdest comment ever I must say 😅 let people live wherever they want. If you can't afford to live in the D(?)SA, then don't. I doubt anyone was forced to move there, right?
@@maddinek Do you wish to be a DEBT SLAVE Martin?
Many Americans and Europeans now living there are DEBT SLAVES.
Europe is so much better than the Divided States of America period.
@@maddinek huh?? What is so weird about that statement, Europe is much better to live in, healthcare, holidays, and yes we are much more free than in the US, most of tge US are in jail, did you not know that? Oops..😂🤣😂🤣
Thank you for this series. They say "comparison is the thief of joy", and never has this been proven more true. After two 40 minute (!) videos of endless sizing and comparing (most of which I only breezed through), I don't know what to think, other than...I yearn for respite. May god have mercy on all our souls. 🙏
I found this series quite informative with facts and reasonable assumptions. Complex yes, but I think we can learn things about relative US v. German costs for transportation and food, things we might not think too much about in our own budgets. We can now ask ‘what if I didn’t have to own two cars?’ In the U.S.
Productivity is never accidental; it is always the result of careful planning, dedication, and consistency. I am grateful to God for my advisor, Yuval Eric Brokman; with his help, I am now financially secure, earning between $10,000 and $25,000 per week.
Buying a stock is easy, but buying the right stock without a time-tested strategy is incredibly hard. hence I will suggest you get yourself a financial-Advisor that can provide you with entry and exit points on best stocks to buy now or put on a watchlist.
As Yuval Eric Brokman is a highly sought-after counsel, he is actually the one who directs me. Nonetheless, you can try your luck. Just leaving his phone number would not be appropriate. he may be lying about, but if you Google his name, you can view his website.
google his name.
Yuval Eric Brokman.
search his full name.
I think, for a young family with school going kids, another important factor is how much vacation time they get compared to their parents.
Living in the Netherlands, my kid gets double the amount of time off (spring break, may break, summer break, fall break, xmas/new year break) than I get in days off from my full time job.
So it becomes an annoying trade off between child care - or grand parents baby sitting - vs having time off with both or one parent.
Kids dont even know how good they have it...
Summer break in Texas is 12 weeks
Thank you so much for the second part! This is a really great idea! 🙂
Glad you enjoyed the video! Thanks for watching!
Estimate of anything under 300 a month for food for a single person is wild. One trip for a couple weeks worth of food and maybe a couple toiletries is well over 200 every couple weeks
Thank you so much for such an informative video! All the videos on your channel are very helpful for people considering moving to Germany and working there.
I really enjoy these new high quality analytical videos and would love to see more of them.
You tackled a tough comparison but I think you got as close as you could get. But there are still BIG differences between areas. The US is too big to make a generalized statement. I'm in Chicagoland and use 25kWh/day currently. But the house is 3,000 sqft (270 m2 + 90m2 basement). My house is $410k now but twice as big as the one in Colorado in your example. My US house in Berlin's suburbs would cost most likely around 3,500EUR/m2 = 945.000 EUR. Good luck saving up the additional 500k. Housing is difficult to compare due to the huge differences. In general, I would say home ownership is cheaper in the US. Rent is cheaper in Germany. Working for someone (W2-job) is better in Germany. Having a business is better in the US. In Germany, the government takes care of you and regulates more. In the US you are more responsible for yourself but less regulated (I think that is THE biggest difference between the countries). The lifestyle is vastly different and depends on what you like. I live for 14 years in the US and would have never thought that the differences are so big. It doesn't look like that on TV.
Yes! I have owned a business in the USA and Germany and its crazy when you run a business in Germany you have to worry more about having issues with regulations than running the business.
Wow. As always, a well researched topic and a very well made video.
But I think there are a few points that aren't realistic and typical from a German point of view. On the one hand, Max is supposed to pay 250 Euros for heating, which I find completely unrealistic. Realistically, you can estimate maybe 80-120 euros per month for heating and hot water for a normally insulated apartment. Of course, if we assume that it heats normally. That the trash is already included in the monthly utiilities has already been mentioned in the comments.
I would like to say with the family that a Bahncard 100 is not really common for local transportation service. I don't know anyone who has or had a Bahncard 100. It's more for someone who travels all over Germany several times a week. For local transport, you should then book a monthly ticket for the local transport association, which will probably cost around 100 euros a month.
What I still missed are costs for Mobile phone and the cost of eating out sometimes. But based on average values, I think most of the numbers in the video are pretty accurate.
Thank you for this video!!
Hallo Andreas 🙋♂
I spend about €180/month for heating a house at the moment (Fernwärme, older house). In my old appartement it was less than that for a year (very good insulation !).
@@arnodobler1096 Hallo auch.... 😉
The transportation cost just got a lot cheaper thanks to the 49 € Ticket.
Thank you very much, I learned a lot about my own country! Nice to hear that you feel at home here, greetings from Brandenburg
Mila, 36, Lehrerin in Deutschland mit 15(!) Jahren Berufserfahrung. Regelstudienzeit in Deutschland für das Lehramt: üblicherweise 10 Semester (=5 Jahre). Abitur hat Mila also ca. mit 31-15 = 16 Jahren gemacht (damals noch G9). Chapeau, Mila, so rechnet man sich Deutschland schön. :)
Great work. Comprehensive, transparent, and so well presented. And it finally gives some substance to that fuzzy notion of "way of life", and how profoundly it shapes your biography as well as your environment.
Yes, US for money and PhD education ONLY.