Hello, I hope you enjoy this video BUT!!! -> What am I actually asking you in this Video?? a) I doubt anyone really does need to update their card (Before their CPU) b) MSFS24 `SHOULD` have noticeably better performance. c) Are DLSS3 AI Generated frames, really frames? (Do they react to your input?) d) IF the answer to the above is no, then the RTX 3080 out performed the RTX 4070ti (with DLSS3 turned off) In essence I am asking people to query the Cost/Benefit of upgrading their cards...So, do you really need to upgrade your GPU?
Refreshing to see a GPU comparison that isn't just endless, mind-numbing, irrelevant stats! Thanks for taking the time (and presumably, cost) of showing a real world comparison in FS. Subbed.
I have both cards mentioned in this video. The RTX 3080 and RTX 4070ti. A major issue with the 3080 is the amount of power draw. It can sometimes be double that of the 4070ti. Something for people to think about when purchasing these cards new or even second hand.
I think its an interesting comparison for MSFS 2020, the challenge as I see it is we simply don’t know what performance benefits MSFS 2024 will bring in practice add to that a new generation of GPUs coming around or close to the same release date and that’s before you have even factored in VR (which doesn’t atm get the DLSS 3 frame gen benefits). I’m looking forward to FS 2024 but it’s still a bit of a mystery to me if I’m honest… lots of unanswered questions.
Really good to see this. I'm running my old RTX3090 Founder's, along with Ryzen 7 5800X3D, and 32Gb ddr4 3600 RAM. I fly in VR on my Quest 2. I don't know the FPS I get (set to auto), but it's not at all bad. I'm looking forward to MSFS 2024 to come out, especially if the FPS go up a little.
I think the 4070 Ti needs a correction. You say 4070 Ti, but at the top it says you used a 4070 Ti Super. These are two different cards with different performance and difference VRAM capabilities (12G vs 16G). Which is used? The Ti or Ti Super?
Good video very impressed. I have 3080 form just after covid I had paid for it before and then it all went wrong prices went though the roof. I could wait to have it at the price I paid or it cancel my ordered and buy a different card. I choose to wait. then NVIDIA in there wisdom released the 40 series shortly after I received my card, I was not happy but you have shown me that my card in standard setup can run MSFS very well against these other cards So I wont be wasting my money on a 40 series, as the card I have has very little run time and it wouldn't make a huge difference if I changed it.. So thanks for showing me this very great-full
Hey no probs. I was surprised the RTX 3080 would out perform the RTX 4070ti, but when you turn on DLSS3 (AI generated frames - are they real FPS or not?) but yet then it swings back the other way. But for MSFS at least the CPU seems to be more important (that might change for MSFS 24?).. So all 3 of these cards seemed to work really well in my tests and I like them all; sometime marketing makes you think you need something when you really don't lol :-)
@@SimUKReviews Don't forget DLSS does not work in VR. So basically for us VR users, a card that I paid 800€ in 2020 outperforms a card that cost 800€ today. Thank you NVidia!
@@Bigbaz-bj8io I was being sarcastic in case you missed it. It's not a miracle it's a pure shame NVidia rip everyone off for several years. If you create new models but prices go up as fast as performances, in the technology field, I call that a rip off.
Just switched recently from a 3080 to a 4080 and there was definitely a performance improvement. What a lot of people are not talking about and not properly considering though are other aspects of their system other than GPU. Motherboard and Ram can also play a huge roll in FPS, some of the best results came from upgrading my RAM and Motherboard. Ram speed for me can be as much as a 20-25 FPS depending on the Ram speed 4800 or 6000. I use 4K and I also record in 4K and 50 FPS is my sweet spot. With frame gen turned on I'm getting roughly 100 FPS in 4K and a lot of that boost came from Motherboard and Ram upgrade. For a CPU I am running a 7900X 3D. Moral of the story is, the quality of your motherboard and Ram will dictate how well your CPU and GPU are going to work and play together. If your not going to put the effort into your motherboard and Ram then don't waste your money on a 40 series card, that would be my advice. It's not just about the GPU. When I upgraded to a 40 series card I also made the decision to upgrade everything else behind it so I could get the best out of the 4080. Just upgrading my GPU would of been senseless and a waste of money. I told my son that I just wanted to upgrade my GPU and he told me that would be stupid and still wouldn't solve my issues with flightsim. He suggested we do a complete upgrade but before that we would run my system with just replacing the GPU and then The difference with next gen motherboard and RAM. The difference was staggering, he was right. I have Been a simmer for decades and this is by far the best sim and best performing sim I've had to date. I can't wait for 2024. Recording in 4K costs me around 10 FPS leaving my frame gen frame rates in the high 80 and 90's which is just fine for flying in Microsoft Flight Simulator. 40 FPS is my target framerate leaving me from 30 to 40 as a buffer, 35 FPS is my FPS danger zone anything below that is not good for me. A good graphics card helps but must consider the rest also when deciding.
Great post, thanks. Yes, precisely my point. MSFS 2020 benefits more from a CPU upgrade than a GPU upgrade. Furthermore, I'm still not fully convinced AI generated frames are real (do they react to your inputs?) & as shown a 3080 without DLSS outperforms an RTX 4070ti (Also without DLSS). With the rumoured DLSS like future potentially allowing ALL non 40's cards to benefit & MSFS24 promoting numerous improvements......Do any of us really need anew GPU at all? 4K gaming is a little different than 2K UW....But if DLSS3 frames are NOT interactive time, then what is the point of them at all?
@@SimUKReviews Exactly, that's why I don't bother with that lossless scaling with 4x FPS. I just don't see the point of it. There is no use having a 4" pipe if your pump only pumps 2 gallons an hour, your just not going to move more water because you have a bigger pipe. if you upgrade the pipe then you will need to upgrade the pumps also. If going high end with one part then you will need to go high end on all the parts or your just wasting money. It's about balance. Great video by the way, that was an honest insight. Cheers!
Well, I am sure I saw something about a DLSS release coming soon that will boost ALL Existing Nvidia Cards....Not sure how true that is, but an exciting prospect none the less?
For me, 50-60 FPS is acceptable. But I'm more interested in frametimes (latency) and making sure my Main Thread and GPU are balanced. I just updated from an AM4 to AM5 system, and right now running 4K with mostly Ultra settings I'm being limited more by my 3090 Ti. I plan to wait until I've had the chance to run FS2024 before upgrading that GPU (probably to a 4080.)
How sure are you that your GPU is limiting you? In MSFS the CPU seems to be the real bottleneck? Open developer tools and turn on FPS, it will show you real-time your bottleneck.
Thanks for the quick and clean review. Looking for a replacement of my 5yr old rtx2070 which nowadays deliver me 20-25 fps. The thing with the high end card rtx4090, it also need an upgrade of the powersupply and cpu… So in short answer to your question, yes i will need a gpu upgrade.
Ahhhhh yes, but will you actually? I don't know your specs...But If you Upgrade your CPU and RAM (and PSU if necessary) I suspect your 2070 will deliver much better performance and with MSFS24 adding improvements and the potential DLSS global update release....I think you might not be so keen to plash out on a new Expensive GPU?? But as I said I don't know your specs....?
I appreciate your effort to help but FPS is not my only concern, stutters are more of a deal breaker (though rare). You can't just put a 40 series card on to a motherboard with DDR4. You basically have to build a new PC (ddr5 ram, 40 series card, new proccessor, new ram). My RTX3070 is still a solid card & even more so with Lossless Scaling, FPS are good. I get 32-60 fps depending. Specs/ Intel 10600K with all core enhancement locked at 4.8 ghz, 32 gbs 3200 factory overclocked 3200 mhz ram with a 4K monitor, (my specs are only for context in this video). Everyone hopes that MSFS 2024 lives up to claims, I'm optimistic, Asobo's track record is quite impressive. Knowledge takes a back seat to cost for many. Only critisism, your video is flying over water & clouds. Try it at NYC !
Thank you. You may have missed my point here though? a) I doubt anyone really does need to update their card (Before their CPU) b) MSFS24 `SHOULD` have noticeably better performance. c) Are DLSS3 AI Generated frames, really frames? (Do they react to your input?) d) IF the answer to the above is no, then the RTX 3080 out performed the RTX 4070ti (with DLSS3 turned off) In essence I am asking people to query the Cost/Benefit of upgrading their cards :-) & I will do some more tests in time.
nice comparison. I'm thinking of switching from Xbox to PC. Would you buy a RTX 4060ti 16gb or a RTX 4070 12gb? The 4070 is about 100€ more expensive. Are the 12gb enough, should I save the 100€ difference for future upgrades? Thanks in advance. I would prefer to play in 1080p-1440p with Ultra settings and some addons like PMDG 777, FSLTL
Unfortunately, I don't get sent every card to test, but it is fair to say the 4070 IS the faster GPU. That being said: the 4060ti (should) be able to cope with 1440p on MSFS running ultra in (most) situations keeping easily above 30fps and often over 60fps. PMDG 777 is one of the heavier aircraft; in terms of FPS dips, so prob best to say solid 30fps? ....but ONLY if your CPU, Motherboard, RAM & HDD is fast enough; this is so important for MSFS 2020. So this is specific to MSFS 2020. Other games have other requirements. Some good websites to help you make a decision include: Userbenchmark.com & Systemrequirementslab.com (can you run it) MSFS recommended specs are thus: Microsoft Flight Simulator 2020 Recommended Requirements CPU: Intel Core i5-8400 or AMD Ryzen 5 1500X or better RAM: 16 GB VIDEO CARD: Radeon RX 590 or GeForce GTX 970 DEDICATED VIDEO RAM: 4096 MB PIXEL SHADER: 5.1 VERTEX SHADER: 5.1 OS: Windows 10 64-bit FREE DISK SPACE: 150 GB
unfortunately i only use VR and nope there is NO card out there that can handle MSFS2020 in ultra in VR so waiting on MSFS2024 and the RTX 5090 hopefully 2024 will use multithread cross fingers.
They all look good, but it's difficult to tell the quality from a UA-cam video, but I do notice that none of your testing is using a 100% render scale to match your display. You're using 960p not 1440p render, so probably using DLSS High (or maybe Quality) in all tests? Try 100% render at TAA Full Ultra settings and the resulting FPS will be much lower, though quality much better. Frame Generation really does double the frame rate and works well from my experience running a 4k 120hz LG OLED which does 120Hz VRR HDR . That's why I went for a 4090 upgrade from my 3090, and also upgraded from a 13900K to a 14900KS which should be amazing for FS2024. For the Varjo Aero VR you need all the grunt you can get.
No I am using 100% render scale and the resolution specified in the video: 5120 x 1440p (the reason it drops lower is because the Developer bar forces it to a window with a bit missing off the top, but this is the only way I could show the REAL FPS values). DLSS set to Quality. FPS is constant and as the last video shows DLSS3 boosts almost double the frames (but I still question if they are real frames....?) Performance actually goes up when developer tools are turned off & obviously not recording gives me another boost. The point I was trying to make BTW is if you are happy with 30FPS all 3 of these deliver that in abundance with 5120 x 1440p BUT if you want 60FPS the RTX 3080 is a lot cheaper and delivers that without DLSS where as the more expensive RTX4070ti cannot. Hope that makes sense?
@@SimUKReviews I do understand the point you were making, and I completely agree. However, if you check your horizontal render resolution it is 0.666 x 5120. I believe that is using DLSS Quality to upscale by 'one step'? My 4090 at 4K TAA shows render resolution of 3840x2160 as expected for full render.
Again, no. If you set your system to full render as per usual then turn on developer tools and use the fps counter, you will see it forces the adjustment. I wish it didn't, but it does.
@@SimUKReviews Not sure why it does that on your system. I always have developer tools turned on to view native FPS via Debug as you do. At 4K TAA all 3 values always show 3840x2160. Maybe the widescreen?
I'm a little out on DLSS3 ATM. Can't decide if fake frames are really frames 🤔 But I do think DLSS3 is the thing to have, until the 5 series releases at least.
My understanding is something like this: DLSS: For every 3 frames 1 is AI generated as a filler, and inbetween frame based on the two frames either side; but is not able to be interacted with. So for example: gameplay at 60fps will feel like 30fps because every other frame is AI generated (not real). Frame Generation on the otherhand IS an actual tangible frame (again generated by AI) but is intractable (you can click a button and it will be interpreted)....not sure if that also requires a 3rd involvement like a responsive booster or something. But the fact remains, DLSS frames are not real & unless DLSS3 allows Frane generation to drive it instead (which it might) then it isn't really running at 60fps, but 30. I understand DLSS 3.5 is due to release soon, or may have already landed....and I don't.know what that changes?
Thank you, what games do you tend to play? With DLSS3.5+ the frames are defo higher, & maybe smoother too as you mentioned (depending on game) but what I was trying to show with this video was; a) Game Looks great on all 3 b) Game was super stable on all 3 Because the core FPS rates are higher on the RTX3080 than the RTX 4070ti (without DLSS) it might not be the best option overall? I am still undecided if AI generated frames are really frames at all? If your inputs do not make any difference to an AI generated frame, then are they just pointless? I am still researching this TBH because I think DLSS3.5 might have resolved this...But it is difficult to peel back all the promotional advertising speak to see the truth sometimes.
@@SimUKReviews I mainly play MSFS and hunting simulations. I am not using DLSS, since I am using AutoFPS when playing MSFS, I am not sure if it will create a conflict. Overall I felt that 4070ti super gave me an advantage for its 16GB compared to the 10GB vram of the 3080.
Ryzen 7 7700 liquid cooled, DDr5, 16 gb ram, 1tb hd. Its a beast. Has way better refresh rate. Ray tracing is better than 4090 an 3080 by far. Plus its cheaper than the most but better than the less. Settle for the middle. I did an Its Banging bruh. I get 120fps on FS. 300+ fps on racing games and shooter games. Everything is real AF an only a few games are made for a 4090. So unless you want to wait settle for what i told you. By then itll be something new. Also play with your graphic setting an see what minor tweaks do to enhance your playing
I've never really been into AMD. My First few cards were AMD, but they were plagued with issues in the early days, so I switched and never looked back.
The 7900XT or 7900XTX the 7900XT beats a 3090 in Raster, not in RT though. More power efficient than a 3090, but decidedly more power draw than a 4070 Ti Super or 4080. Edited here as I forgot to add power draw as in "...more power draw than a 4070Ti Super...." In general the 7900XT is 10-15% better in raster than a 4070Ti Super. And in some highly cpu limited fames like MSFS2020 it can trade blows with a 4080, but not always. DCS in 3440x1440 the 7900XT is a beast, together with my 5800X3D I'm constantly bouncing off the engines internal 180 fps limiter everywhere except the Marianas. Only had one driver tha caused major issues, 23.12.1. Owned it since early January 2023. Edit: I would recommend though that you turn on the low poeer mode in the MSFS2020 menues, as the standard settings causes it to run at full chat. In fact I'd recommend that for all GPUs.
11:09 EST Hello, my name is John. I just bought a new pc to build and after watching your excellent video for MSFS2024 my question is: Will my new system give me the happiness that I’m hoping? Specs: AMD 7 7800XT3D Air cooled ASUS B650-E RTX GEFORCE 4070 Super 12gb 2x16 DDR5 6000 MSI MAG 850 Power Supply Samsung Odyssey G5 180hz monitor plan on using Display Port cable. Any advice will be greatly appreciated. Thank You
Hi John, I have limited AMD knowledge tbh, but the spec of the rest of your machine I suspect will serve you well. If gaming in 2K, I think you can max everything out, and if on 4K, then maybe just dial down a few things.
So here is my Mid- tower specs: Z590 Gaming force 2tb Pioneer SSD 2x Samsung 2tb QVO Deepcool AK400 - fan cooler 4x 16gb Vengeance Corsair RAM CPU Intel 10900k GPU RTX 4090fe Corsair Premium 600 PCie 5.0 cable PSU 1000x Corsair Win 11 pro I upgraded from Z490 to Z590, PSU from 850x to 1000x, GPU from RTX3090 Asus to RTX 4090fe and cooler from Noctua NH-D15 to Deepcool AK400. I don't recommend RTX30's for MSFS it lags from experience, minimum fps for MSFS is 30 fps otherwise forget it, be sure to have fast internet fibre or 5g. My 10900k CPU is running brilliant no issue's with performance. The only issue I experience is with the Thrustmaster Boeing Yoke otherwise in a highly detailed densed city I get a minimum of 50 fps on high settings.
@abk8152 I just bought the 4070 super pairing it with i7 10k and I'm not having any problems, I thought I had to upgrade the CPU to be able to run the 16x4 pcle but it's not necessary although I get a constant 60fps I'm running the card on the 16x3 line . Imagine running full GPU specs. Would I get better performance or wouldn't I need to upgrade the CPU? You has a 10th gen i9 and I think your SIM card looks great. , good?
According to review that I have read, PCIE3 vs 4 vs 5 make very little difference overall. Personally I wouldn't worry about it too much as no game has really tried to exploit the benefits.
@@SimUKReviews I mean I do get around 50-100 fps however, as soon as I start moving around cockpit i get stutters. Im on broadband 50mb download and 20 upload
Hello, I hope you enjoy this video BUT!!! -> What am I actually asking you in this Video??
a) I doubt anyone really does need to update their card (Before their CPU)
b) MSFS24 `SHOULD` have noticeably better performance.
c) Are DLSS3 AI Generated frames, really frames? (Do they react to your input?)
d) IF the answer to the above is no, then the RTX 3080 out performed the RTX 4070ti (with DLSS3 turned off)
In essence I am asking people to query the Cost/Benefit of upgrading their cards...So, do you really need to upgrade your GPU?
What about VR :) 2k/4k 2d displays are nothing on these cards. VR is another story..
Yeah, a few people have asked that. I will have to arrange some more tests.
Refreshing to see a GPU comparison that isn't just endless, mind-numbing, irrelevant stats! Thanks for taking the time (and presumably, cost) of showing a real world comparison in FS. Subbed.
Thank you. Welcome & I hope it was good enough to maybe be useful?
I have both cards mentioned in this video. The RTX 3080 and RTX 4070ti. A major issue with the 3080 is the amount of power draw. It can sometimes be double that of the 4070ti. Something for people to think about when purchasing these cards new or even second hand.
That is an excellent point, thank you.
I think its an interesting comparison for MSFS 2020, the challenge as I see it is we simply don’t know what performance benefits MSFS 2024 will bring in practice add to that a new generation of GPUs coming around or close to the same release date and that’s before you have even factored in VR (which doesn’t atm get the DLSS 3 frame gen benefits). I’m looking forward to FS 2024 but it’s still a bit of a mystery to me if I’m honest… lots of unanswered questions.
Good point about VR, thank you.
Really good to see this. I'm running my old RTX3090 Founder's, along with Ryzen 7 5800X3D, and 32Gb ddr4 3600 RAM. I fly in VR on my Quest 2. I don't know the FPS I get (set to auto), but it's not at all bad. I'm looking forward to MSFS 2024 to come out, especially if the FPS go up a little.
Yes I very much hope to see a noticeable improvement; based on their promotional material :-)
I should really test this in VR too
@@SimUKReviews I'm looking forward to the video. It hopefully won't be too long before release.
I think the 4070 Ti needs a correction. You say 4070 Ti, but at the top it says you used a 4070 Ti Super. These are two different cards with different performance and difference VRAM capabilities (12G vs 16G). Which is used? The Ti or Ti Super?
Thanks for spotting that, I will double check....
@@SimUKReviews Thanks for checking...any updates?
@@chuckmiggs6703 no doesn’t look like he can be bothered to answer you
@@SimUKReviews So?
Good video very impressed. I have 3080 form just after covid I had paid for it before and then it all went wrong prices went though the roof.
I could wait to have it at the price I paid or it cancel my ordered and buy a different card. I choose to wait. then NVIDIA in there wisdom released the 40 series shortly after I received my card, I was not happy but you have shown me that my card in standard setup can run MSFS very well against these other cards So I wont be wasting my money on a 40 series, as the card I have has very little run time and it wouldn't make a huge difference if I changed it.. So thanks for showing me this very great-full
Hey no probs. I was surprised the RTX 3080 would out perform the RTX 4070ti, but when you turn on DLSS3 (AI generated frames - are they real FPS or not?) but yet then it swings back the other way.
But for MSFS at least the CPU seems to be more important (that might change for MSFS 24?)..
So all 3 of these cards seemed to work really well in my tests and I like them all; sometime marketing makes you think you need something when you really don't lol :-)
@@SimUKReviews Don't forget DLSS does not work in VR. So basically for us VR users, a card that I paid 800€ in 2020 outperforms a card that cost 800€ today. Thank you NVidia!
@@haltuxwow it’s a miracle you have the best card in the world
@@Bigbaz-bj8io I was being sarcastic in case you missed it. It's not a miracle it's a pure shame NVidia rip everyone off for several years. If you create new models but prices go up as fast as performances, in the technology field, I call that a rip off.
@@haltux what is DLSS that other plane sim
Just switched recently from a 3080 to a 4080 and there was definitely a performance improvement. What a lot of people are not talking about and not properly considering though are other aspects of their system other than GPU. Motherboard and Ram can also play a huge roll in FPS, some of the best results came from upgrading my RAM and Motherboard. Ram speed for me can be as much as a 20-25 FPS depending on the Ram speed 4800 or 6000. I use 4K and I also record in 4K and 50 FPS is my sweet spot. With frame gen turned on I'm getting roughly 100 FPS in 4K and a lot of that boost came from Motherboard and Ram upgrade. For a CPU I am running a 7900X 3D.
Moral of the story is, the quality of your motherboard and Ram will dictate how well your CPU and GPU are going to work and play together. If your not going to put the effort into your motherboard and Ram then don't waste your money on a 40 series card, that would be my advice. It's not just about the GPU. When I upgraded to a 40 series card I also made the decision to upgrade everything else behind it so I could get the best out of the 4080. Just upgrading my GPU would of been senseless and a waste of money.
I told my son that I just wanted to upgrade my GPU and he told me that would be stupid and still wouldn't solve my issues with flightsim. He suggested we do a complete upgrade but before that we would run my system with just replacing the GPU and then The difference with next gen motherboard and RAM. The difference was staggering, he was right. I have Been a simmer for decades and this is by far the best sim and best performing sim I've had to date. I can't wait for 2024.
Recording in 4K costs me around 10 FPS leaving my frame gen frame rates in the high 80 and 90's which is just fine for flying in Microsoft Flight Simulator. 40 FPS is my target framerate leaving me from 30 to 40 as a buffer, 35 FPS is my FPS danger zone anything below that is not good for me. A good graphics card helps but must consider the rest also when deciding.
Great post, thanks.
Yes, precisely my point.
MSFS 2020 benefits more from a CPU upgrade than a GPU upgrade.
Furthermore, I'm still not fully convinced AI generated frames are real (do they react to your inputs?) & as shown a 3080 without DLSS outperforms an RTX 4070ti (Also without DLSS).
With the rumoured DLSS like future potentially allowing ALL non 40's cards to benefit & MSFS24 promoting numerous improvements......Do any of us really need anew GPU at all?
4K gaming is a little different than 2K UW....But if DLSS3 frames are NOT interactive time, then what is the point of them at all?
@@SimUKReviews
Exactly, that's why I don't bother with that lossless scaling with 4x FPS. I just don't see the point of it. There is no use having a 4" pipe if your pump only pumps 2 gallons an hour, your just not going to move more water because you have a bigger pipe. if you upgrade the pipe then you will need to upgrade the pumps also. If going high end with one part then you will need to go high end on all the parts or your just wasting money. It's about balance. Great video by the way, that was an honest insight. Cheers!
Thank you
Still on my rusty but trusty 2080, everything good at QHD. I'm waiting for the new generation of GFX cards and CPUs next year.
Well, I am sure I saw something about a DLSS release coming soon that will boost ALL Existing Nvidia Cards....Not sure how true that is, but an exciting prospect none the less?
There has to be some bottlenecking going on with the 4070ti. No way a 3080 should be faster at native 5120x1440!
That has to be a 4070.
According to my 4070ti with DLSS turned off is slower...who would have thought.
So is it crap
What about VR? I use the Vajo Aero and it sucks performance. Running on an RTX 3090 but holding out for the RTX 5090 later this year, hopefully.
Yeah good question, I haven't even tried MSFS in VR properly yet...So will try and do some testing soon.
For me, 50-60 FPS is acceptable. But I'm more interested in frametimes (latency) and making sure my Main Thread and GPU are balanced.
I just updated from an AM4 to AM5 system, and right now running 4K with mostly Ultra settings I'm being limited more by my 3090 Ti.
I plan to wait until I've had the chance to run FS2024 before upgrading that GPU (probably to a 4080.)
How sure are you that your GPU is limiting you?
In MSFS the CPU seems to be the real bottleneck?
Open developer tools and turn on FPS, it will show you real-time your bottleneck.
Thanks for the quick and clean review. Looking for a replacement of my 5yr old rtx2070 which nowadays deliver me 20-25 fps. The thing with the high end card rtx4090, it also need an upgrade of the powersupply and cpu… So in short answer to your question, yes i will need a gpu upgrade.
Ahhhhh yes, but will you actually? I don't know your specs...But If you Upgrade your CPU and RAM (and PSU if necessary) I suspect your 2070 will deliver much better performance and with MSFS24 adding improvements and the potential DLSS global update release....I think you might not be so keen to plash out on a new Expensive GPU??
But as I said I don't know your specs....?
I'm mainly flying on Xbox, while using a laptop with integrated graphics for travel... Anything will be an improvement for me 😅
Nice. Fair play.
I appreciate your effort to help but FPS is not my only concern, stutters are more of a deal breaker (though rare). You can't just put a 40 series card on to a motherboard with DDR4. You basically have to build a new PC (ddr5 ram, 40 series card, new proccessor, new ram). My RTX3070 is still a solid card & even more so with Lossless Scaling, FPS are good. I get 32-60 fps depending. Specs/ Intel 10600K with all core enhancement locked at 4.8 ghz, 32 gbs 3200 factory overclocked 3200 mhz ram with a 4K monitor, (my specs are only for context in this video). Everyone hopes that MSFS 2024 lives up to claims, I'm optimistic, Asobo's track record is quite impressive. Knowledge takes a back seat to cost for many. Only critisism, your video is flying over water & clouds. Try it at NYC !
Thank you.
You may have missed my point here though?
a) I doubt anyone really does need to update their card (Before their CPU)
b) MSFS24 `SHOULD` have noticeably better performance.
c) Are DLSS3 AI Generated frames, really frames? (Do they react to your input?)
d) IF the answer to the above is no, then the RTX 3080 out performed the RTX 4070ti (with DLSS3 turned off)
In essence I am asking people to query the Cost/Benefit of upgrading their cards :-)
& I will do some more tests in time.
@@SimUKReviews OK, my bad, We agree !😀
lol
nice comparison. I'm thinking of switching from Xbox to PC. Would you buy a RTX 4060ti 16gb or a RTX 4070 12gb? The 4070 is about 100€ more expensive. Are the 12gb enough, should I save the 100€ difference for future upgrades? Thanks in advance. I would prefer to play in 1080p-1440p with Ultra settings and some addons like PMDG 777, FSLTL
Unfortunately, I don't get sent every card to test, but it is fair to say the 4070 IS the faster GPU.
That being said: the 4060ti (should) be able to cope with 1440p on MSFS running ultra in (most) situations keeping easily above 30fps and often over 60fps.
PMDG 777 is one of the heavier aircraft; in terms of FPS dips, so prob best to say solid 30fps?
....but ONLY if your CPU, Motherboard, RAM & HDD is fast enough; this is so important for MSFS 2020.
So this is specific to MSFS 2020. Other games have other requirements.
Some good websites to help you make a decision include:
Userbenchmark.com
&
Systemrequirementslab.com (can you run it)
MSFS recommended specs are thus:
Microsoft Flight Simulator 2020 Recommended Requirements
CPU: Intel Core i5-8400 or AMD Ryzen 5 1500X or better
RAM: 16 GB
VIDEO CARD: Radeon RX 590 or GeForce GTX 970
DEDICATED VIDEO RAM: 4096 MB
PIXEL SHADER: 5.1
VERTEX SHADER: 5.1
OS: Windows 10 64-bit
FREE DISK SPACE: 150 GB
unfortunately i only use VR and nope there is NO card out there that can handle MSFS2020 in ultra in VR so waiting on MSFS2024 and the RTX 5090 hopefully 2024 will use multithread cross fingers.
DLSS for VR would be a very useful tool....It is likely to arrive sooner or later.
They all look good, but it's difficult to tell the quality from a UA-cam video, but I do notice that none of your testing is using a 100% render scale to match your display. You're using 960p not 1440p render, so probably using DLSS High (or maybe Quality) in all tests? Try 100% render at TAA Full Ultra settings and the resulting FPS will be much lower, though quality much better. Frame Generation really does double the frame rate and works well from my experience running a 4k 120hz LG OLED which does 120Hz VRR HDR . That's why I went for a 4090 upgrade from my 3090, and also upgraded from a 13900K to a 14900KS which should be amazing for FS2024. For the Varjo Aero VR you need all the grunt you can get.
No I am using 100% render scale and the resolution specified in the video: 5120 x 1440p
(the reason it drops lower is because the Developer bar forces it to a window with a bit missing off the top, but this is the only way I could show the REAL FPS values).
DLSS set to Quality.
FPS is constant and as the last video shows DLSS3 boosts almost double the frames (but I still question if they are real frames....?)
Performance actually goes up when developer tools are turned off & obviously not recording gives me another boost.
The point I was trying to make BTW is if you are happy with 30FPS all 3 of these deliver that in abundance with 5120 x 1440p
BUT if you want 60FPS the RTX 3080 is a lot cheaper and delivers that without DLSS where as the more expensive RTX4070ti cannot.
Hope that makes sense?
@@SimUKReviews I do understand the point you were making, and I completely agree. However, if you check your horizontal render resolution it is 0.666 x 5120. I believe that is using DLSS Quality to upscale by 'one step'? My 4090 at 4K TAA shows render resolution of 3840x2160 as expected for full render.
Again, no. If you set your system to full render as per usual then turn on developer tools and use the fps counter, you will see it forces the adjustment.
I wish it didn't, but it does.
@@SimUKReviews Not sure why it does that on your system. I always have developer tools turned on to view native FPS via Debug as you do. At 4K TAA all 3 values always show 3840x2160. Maybe the widescreen?
Interesting. I'll play about with it some more. Appreciate the insight; many thanks.
Was looking at getting the 4070ti super. I think dlss3 is worth having 🙂
I'm a little out on DLSS3 ATM. Can't decide if fake frames are really frames 🤔 But I do think DLSS3 is the thing to have, until the 5 series releases at least.
@@SimUKReviews DLSS frames are real its just AI upscaling, you're thinking of frame gen maybe
My understanding is something like this:
DLSS: For every 3 frames 1 is AI generated as a filler, and inbetween frame based on the two frames either side; but is not able to be interacted with.
So for example: gameplay at 60fps will feel like 30fps because every other frame is AI generated (not real).
Frame Generation on the otherhand IS an actual tangible frame (again generated by AI) but is intractable (you can click a button and it will be interpreted)....not sure if that also requires a 3rd involvement like a responsive booster or something.
But the fact remains, DLSS frames are not real & unless DLSS3 allows Frane generation to drive it instead (which it might) then it isn't really running at 60fps, but 30.
I understand DLSS 3.5 is due to release soon, or may have already landed....and I don't.know what that changes?
My AMD GP performs extremely well and at a better price point too.
AMD are impressing me a lot in the last few years
I have a 7900 XT much cheaper and can run like a RTX4090
I had sold my RTX3080 10GB version for RTX4070ti SUPER 16GB and felt that it was way smoother than the 3080. playing with 1440p only
Thank you, what games do you tend to play?
With DLSS3.5+ the frames are defo higher, & maybe smoother too as you mentioned (depending on game) but what I was trying to show with this video was;
a) Game Looks great on all 3
b) Game was super stable on all 3
Because the core FPS rates are higher on the RTX3080 than the RTX 4070ti (without DLSS) it might not be the best option overall?
I am still undecided if AI generated frames are really frames at all? If your inputs do not make any difference to an AI generated frame, then are they just pointless?
I am still researching this TBH because I think DLSS3.5 might have resolved this...But it is difficult to peel back all the promotional advertising speak to see the truth sometimes.
@@SimUKReviews I mainly play MSFS and hunting simulations. I am not using DLSS, since I am using AutoFPS when playing MSFS, I am not sure if it will create a conflict. Overall I felt that 4070ti super gave me an advantage for its 16GB compared to the 10GB vram of the 3080.
That is a very fair point, VRAM limitations are not something that can be overturned.
AutoFPS though....Not heard of that?
Well since I have a 4k monitor at 60 fps per second, I'll say that 60 fps is my goal.
Goal, yes.
Are you happier with Solid 30fps without stutters or 60fps with ocasional drops?
Do you notice the difference I guess is the key question.
@@SimUKReviews Well I have discoverd that at 30 fps or 60 it stutters either way. It always has dealing with airports.
We almost got the same PC parts?!??
You must have good taste :-)
Ryzen 7 7700 liquid cooled, DDr5, 16 gb ram, 1tb hd. Its a beast. Has way better refresh rate. Ray tracing is better than 4090 an 3080 by far. Plus its cheaper than the most but better than the less. Settle for the middle. I did an Its Banging bruh. I get 120fps on FS. 300+ fps on racing games and shooter games. Everything is real AF an only a few games are made for a 4090. So unless you want to wait settle for what i told you. By then itll be something new. Also play with your graphic setting an see what minor tweaks do to enhance your playing
Yeah, I like what AMD have been releasing these past few years....haven't had a chance to test them out, though.
Appreciate the input 👍
there is no gpu with better ray tracing than a 4090 for the time being my friend
Until DLSS3.5 releases
Looks amazing but I'll need a new PC before I get this. I'll have to make do with mfs X until then. 😂
What is your current rig?
@SimUKReviews I don't even know mate, but I don't have an SSD.
SSD will make startup and loading times faster, but not really impact too much on game performance.
HI thanks for the video. How do you lock in the 120Hz Monitor Refresh rate?
Either set v sync set to monitor max rr.
Or physically limit it via fps slider to 120.
What is the max FPS our eyesight can discern? Laurie. NZ. 😊
I do believe it is 60....?
I am very interested how you get 5120x1440 in MSFS?
49" Ultrawidescreen monitor. AOC AGON Gaming AG493UCX - 49 inch 2K Curved Monitor, 1ms GTG, VA HDR400, FreeSync Premium, Speakers, KVM (5120x1440 @ 120Hz, 550 cd/m², HDMI/DP/USB 3.0/USB-C) amzn.eu/d/57upd99
Do you think 4070ti super would run 4k in msfs2024
Yes, depending on your FPS target you might need to run in high rather than Ultra...But I had it running well on a 4070ti for quite some time.
Don't use DLSS, so I'd go with a '3080... Oh, I'm using one now.
Wondeful
What is DLSS
@@Bigbaz-bj8io Graphics jiggery-pokery courtesy of Nvidia.
@@johnelliott7850 that’s not what I asked
Basically better image quality for the same PC resources.
What about a AMD equivalent If there is one Sim
I've never really been into AMD. My First few cards were AMD, but they were plagued with issues in the early days, so I switched and never looked back.
The 7900XT or 7900XTX the 7900XT beats a 3090 in Raster, not in RT though.
More power efficient than a 3090, but decidedly more power draw than a 4070 Ti Super or 4080.
Edited here as I forgot to add power draw as in "...more power draw than a 4070Ti Super...."
In general the 7900XT is 10-15% better in raster than a 4070Ti Super. And in some highly cpu limited fames like MSFS2020 it can trade blows with a 4080, but not always.
DCS in 3440x1440 the 7900XT is a beast, together with my 5800X3D I'm constantly bouncing off the engines internal 180 fps limiter everywhere except the Marianas.
Only had one driver tha caused major issues, 23.12.1.
Owned it since early January 2023.
Edit: I would recommend though that you turn on the low poeer mode in the MSFS2020 menues, as the standard settings causes it to run at full chat.
In fact I'd recommend that for all GPUs.
Wow I'm looking to go over to AMD 16g card
11:09 EST
Hello, my name is John.
I just bought a new pc to build and after watching your excellent video for MSFS2024 my question is:
Will my new system give me the happiness that I’m hoping?
Specs:
AMD 7 7800XT3D Air cooled
ASUS B650-E
RTX GEFORCE 4070 Super 12gb
2x16 DDR5 6000
MSI MAG 850 Power Supply
Samsung Odyssey G5 180hz monitor plan on using Display Port cable.
Any advice will be greatly appreciated.
Thank You
Hi John,
I have limited AMD knowledge tbh, but the spec of the rest of your machine I suspect will serve you well.
If gaming in 2K, I think you can max everything out, and if on 4K, then maybe just dial down a few things.
@@SimUKReviews Thank You It will be 2k I guess that means 2560x1440 correct?
Correct. So yeah, I think you will be just fine.
Is a xx60 series even viable here?
As in 3060?
2060 3060 4060. Personally I have a 4060
@@SimUKReviews it runs dcs at 60 on high just fine. The fans dont even come on
I think your 4060 will be just fine 🙂
Will 3060 work or am i cooked?
I have a 3070ti I could test on?
What resolution and fps are you hoping for?
@@SimUKReviews well i was hoping for full HD 60 fps, not sure if that might happen tho
@@LuffyStrawHatyou won’t achieve that with a 3060
1080p 60fps I think you might manage it....I have a laptop with a 3060 I will test and get back to you.
@@SimUKReviews ty
My 14900k and 4090 will not hold me back
No, I suspect it won't lol
So here is my Mid- tower specs:
Z590 Gaming force
2tb Pioneer SSD
2x Samsung 2tb QVO
Deepcool AK400 - fan cooler
4x 16gb Vengeance Corsair RAM
CPU Intel 10900k
GPU RTX 4090fe
Corsair Premium 600 PCie 5.0 cable
PSU 1000x Corsair
Win 11 pro
I upgraded from Z490 to Z590, PSU from 850x to 1000x, GPU from RTX3090 Asus to RTX 4090fe and cooler from Noctua NH-D15 to Deepcool AK400. I don't recommend RTX30's for MSFS it lags from experience, minimum fps for MSFS is 30 fps otherwise forget it, be sure to have fast internet fibre or 5g. My 10900k CPU is running brilliant no issue's with performance.
The only issue I experience is with the Thrustmaster Boeing Yoke otherwise in a highly detailed densed city I get a minimum of 50 fps on high settings.
Nice rig. What are you recording your FPS with?
@abk8152 I just bought the 4070 super pairing it with i7 10k and I'm not having any problems, I thought I had to upgrade the CPU to be able to run the 16x4 pcle but it's not necessary although I get a constant 60fps I'm running the card on the 16x3 line . Imagine running full GPU specs. Would I get better performance or wouldn't I need to upgrade the CPU? You has a 10th gen i9 and I think your SIM card looks great. , good?
According to review that I have read, PCIE3 vs 4 vs 5 make very little difference overall. Personally I wouldn't worry about it too much as no game has really tried to exploit the benefits.
4080 Super here and still getting shitty performance
What settings are you using?
What hardware is in your PC?
@@SimUKReviews SSD, GigabyteB550 Aorus, AMD 5600x, 16Gb ram ( 3600mhz ) 4080 Super, PSU 850 W, WIn11. everything set to high end, clouds to ultra, LOD100, beta12
I'm not overly familiar with AMD based cpus; but I would say you should have solid and stable gameplay with that rig.
Are you 4k?
@@SimUKReviews 2560/1440
@@SimUKReviews I mean I do get around 50-100 fps however, as soon as I start moving around cockpit i get stutters. Im on broadband 50mb download and 20 upload