One major factor contributing to the failure of Fallschimjäger operations was that only about one in ten men dropped armed; for the rest, they had to find separately-dropped weapon canisters, open them, and break out the weapons contained therein before they were capable of more than minimal action. This resulted in unacceptable casualties in Crete as British troops slaughtered the Fallschimjäger as they tried to arm themselves.
...good Lord, man. There's incompetence, and then there's _this_ tomfoolery. I guess all those stories about recreational drug use among the Nazi military elite were true after all. =/
That’s totally incredible when we know how organized are the Germans. To drop unarmed soldiers on the battlefield & force them to retrieve their separately dropped weapons, that’s the height of folly. Not the only insanity in the Crete operation : the mountain troops & infantry were transported by wooden boats hardly bigger than fishing boats, that were pitilessly sunk by the Royal Navy. The Admiral-Cunningham-clobbered Mussolinian fleet at Matapan was understandably wanting in its escort duties.
IIRC, equally as bad was the Fallschimjäger parachutes attached to a single point in the back of the soldier; meaning they had zero control over their direction or rate of descent. They were just passive dummies during the drop.
One reason the german airframe designs were so much advanced is the discovery of Adolf Busemann, who found out that swept wings provide much more stability when speeds surpass or approach Mach levels, and who subsequently did extensive windchannel experiments. All german aircraft developers had his papers during the war. The original discovery was already published in 1935 at a congress in Rome, but the rest of the world did not take notice. Some scientists deemed this information irrelevant, since those speeds were considered unachievable anyway. Only in 1944, 10 years after the the germans, an american scientist made the same discovery.
Another advantage of the swept wing, they discovered, is that the aircraft had far less tendency to have control lock when speeds approached the speed of sound. This was because on the swept wing, the airflow is changed so as to not lock up the control surfaces - the airflow isn't as blocked as with the straight wing aircraft.
The lack of availability of strategic metals did more to delay the deployment of the German jets, and made them vulnerable to failure over short flight times, combining with sabotage by the slave labor used to build airframes to make most of the late-war designs rare and ineffective.
The lack of strategic metals was an excuse for a fundamentally flawed design. The early models of the Ju004 had a fundamental resonance problem caused by having an even number of blades in each stage. Identification of this design fault in late 1943 forces the scrapping of the five thousand engines built to that time and remanufacturing of new engines with a prime number of blades in each stage. That delayed the operational deployment of the Me262 until mid 1944.
They had all the strategic metals but they were used for other weapons. They developed over a hundred new alloys and plastics which the americans stole after the war plus they gave us titanium for aircraft and weapons in 1955.
"the slave labor used to build airframes" Yes, expecting starving slaves working in horrific conditions to build high precision machines was never going to work.
Please remember, that Hugo Junkers was a pacifist and is company was requested when the Nazis came to power in 1933. He only built civilian airplanes. Even in WW I he was forced to cooperate with Fokker, because he didn't built military airplanes at that time too. The Nazis only continued to use his name, because he was too famous. Hugo Junkers - one of the greatest aviation pioneers. 1859-1935.
@@CAROLDDISCOVER-2025 The Nazis came to power in January 1933. Hugo Junkers was expropriated in the autumn of 1933 and he had to leave his town Dessau. In 1934 he was imprisoned in his new house. In 1935 he died at his 76th birthday. No, he is not responsible in any kind for what happened after that. There were a lot of other aviation pioneers, you could point at. Messerschmitt, Heinkel, Focke, Wulf and Dornier if you want to name some. Even if Dornier wasn't very purposeful. And you can call out more: Porsche, BMW, Mercedes, ... And you even can call out foreign companies. For instance Ford and IBM/Hollerith/DEHOMAG . But Hugo Junkers did everything he could to prevent what happened after 1933.
@@Pfefferhaubitze I do not give any credit to Nazis other than being very creative monsters. But I do know of different Nazis who fought the system from within. They were Nazis they had to join the party. They were officers. I don't know them personally I just read the stories. So if what you say is true and I believe you have researched it thoroughly and I thank you for the information. I'll research it for myself. Just to see if I can find out more. Einstein is a comparable story. Thank you very much for presenting this information. Yes his plans and designs were used but like I said he was dead. And his life at least at the end was anti-nazi. If what you say is true and I believe you. But I believe in that old saying trust and verify. I would rather have him than Henry Ford on our side
The story goes that the Swedish engineers, who were almost invariably educated at German universities, managed to come across German documents that the Allies had not managed to translate, and that they managed to recruit German engineers who had fled to Switzerland and Sweden before the end of the war. Their input became a crash course in the development of jet planes, which quickly led to the J29 Tunnan, A32 Lancen and J35 Draken at the same rate as the Allies, which meant that little Sweden had the 4th largest air force during the 50s and early 60s
The Messerschmidt 321 Gigant glider was the competitor to the Junkers 322. The Me 321 evolved into the Me 323 with the addition of 6 engines. Germany actually used both the 321 & 323 trying to resupply the Panzerarmee Afrika under Rommel.
umm, hello... Me-323... wood, fabric and pipe. As an aircraft it did work and could carry a tank but was seriously underpowered and under-armed. Had they used more powerful engines and added more firepower it may have been a complete success but the airframe did work. also, He-162 was a jet aircraft, made from wood. The problem with it was not the wood but rather the glue and the use of slave labor to build them, which wasted no opportunity to sabotage them. Even Eric Brown had high praise for this wooden aircraft.
The Me P.1101 is clearly the design basis of the subsequent SAAB Tunnen, flying before 1950. Apparently the Americans gave the Swedes a peak at captured German aircraft designs somewhere in Switzerland. You can also see the design heritage of the MiG15 and North American Sabre, both of which became operational just after the Tunnan. The British didn't catch up until 1954 with the Hawker Hunter and the French even later in 50s along with Argentina and the Puma.
The FA225 design isn't entirely ridiculous. It's basically an autogyro, which had tremendous success until airplanes got faster, making the autogyro obsolete. Arguably, the most successful was the Pitcairn Autogyro Co. used extensively in mail delivery. There's even a picture of one landed on the White House lawn.
The British Fairey Rotodyne was the best known attempt to use an autogyro/gyroplane for commercial flight. The prototypes worked and were more efficient and faster than a helicopter, but it was beset with noise problems (the rotor blades were powered by gas jets during take off) and eventually the project fizzled out for lack of support.
Pitcairn basically made autogyros out of whatever airframe he found. I remember hearing them around home in Philly and Langhorne Pa. I think my father knew him.
The Swedish success 'Tunnan' ("The Barrel", Saab J29) was a result of German drawings Saab got their hands on in Switzerland just after the end of WW2. Looking very much like the drawing showed here of Messerschmitt P.1101, but (looking with the eyes of an amateur!) in profile a more rounded belly and a shorter tail rodder. 'Tunnan' was the first European built arrow winged plane, and reached a little more than 1000 km/h, for a while the fastest in the world (at least officially, the USA was in the heals..😅). It primiered in September 1, 1948, the British test pilot Robert 'Rob' More later said "It was love at first sight". I saw one of the still flying Tunnan on an airshow just the other day. It looks like a bumblebee, flies like a swift. It's a huge shame that not more of the over 660 built Tunnan hasn't been taking care of, it is worthy to remain flying. It certainly show you, it's not in the looks, it's in ability.
interesting :-) in 1971 was glider training at RAF South Cerney , England . Once famous for a Vulcan that landed in an emergency , could not take off . In another hanger was a German plane , forget how it got there . Was not huge , slightly oversized Cessna :-) Cool thing was how it was started ? Ground crew would lean into the air intake , and find a pull handle , ala , motor mower , which then used to start the jet :-) 54 years ago now , cannot recall if there was a ladder to get up . Looked in and saw the whole deal :-) Quite ironic that the RAF Buccaneers on duty in ' West Germany ' back then , had huge generators alongside to get them started :-)
Simon... On a jet engine (technically, a turbine engine) the blades at the front are called compressor blades and see cold fresh air only. These were what failed on the Jumo 004. The turbine blades were at the rear and had hot gasses from the combustion chamber blowing on them, basically a blow torch. These recovered force which caused the turbine to spin, and via a shaft up the middle, they also turned the compressor blades at the front. Turbine blades HAVE to be made of very special material, but the Germans thought that regular steel would suffice for the [cold] compressor blades at the front that packed air into the combustion chambers; Boy where they wrong! They had the design, but they simply did not have the metallurgy necessary. The Jumo 004 had a time before overhaul of 8 hours. Compare that to modern turbofan engines that typically run to 15,000 hours before they have to be pulled off the wing and taken apart....
They had the metallurgy, but not the metals themselves, necessitating the use of steel. Eventually, blade design changes addressed some of the reliability issues, but too late to be put into mass production.
@@seanmalloy7249 Perfect! Completely right, that's what I meant to say, they didn't have the metals but they did have the science. They could build turbine blades, but not compressor blades? That smacks of arrogance.
@@Flies2FLL From the Zoukei-Mura Ho229 model I have, there are nine compressor rotors and ten stator disks, but only one turbine rotor; the compressor stage would be using considerably more of the strategic metals than the turbine. Only the areas that were determined to be critical used the scarce strategic metals, and the designers were unable to fully compensate for that limitation.
Simon calls the Jumo 004 little more then scrap metals. Meanwhile in England the Whittle W.1 had a claimed paternal of 3,000 HP, but never achieved it due to an inferierior design. GE engineers pointed out after the war the Whittle W.1 had to run with everything at maximum, so once you up and flying there's no where for the engine to go. It's maxed out. Where the Germans, when they wanted more power, added more turbine plates. The end product went from 800 hp to 6,000 depending on the engine. And as a friend of mine who worked at GE said, "It was the end of the war. Imagine if Mercedes were building them today, now picture them building them in 1968 Vietnam. See the difference?" What an eye opener!
I’m also concerned as to your claim that once you were up and flying the Germans could just as more turbine plates. This would be quite hard at 10,000ft and 500mph😂 Also you would want more compressor stages as well.
😂!! A lot of 'futuristic' stuff has existed at the same time as it was presented in fiction. Did you know that the first catapult chair (not to confuse a 'rocket chair'!) was made by Swedish Saab? It was first used in the Saab 21A, where the motor and propeller was literally in the middle of the plane, behind the pilot, in a frame of two bars and the tail. The catapult chair was the solution to how the pilot could avoid the propeller if he had to parachute himself out. A large gunpowder explosion beneath the chair was the answer. He was popped out of the plane, in difference to an ejection chair where you are shot out and a rocket motor takes you further away before the parachute opens. In the latter much more energy is used, and absorbed by the body which may easily cause injuries on the spine and neck. It was also the first (maybe only??🤔) propeller plane to have its motor exchanged to a jet engine, changed the model name to 21R. (FUN FACTS! Volvo made the first user-friendly seatbelt, however one of the engineers working on that had earlier worked on Saab's airplane division, developing ejection chairs!)
Idea for a video is the FMA IAe 33 Pulqui II, an Argentine home-grown Jet Fighter development of Kurt Tank of FW-190 fame in the 1950s and 60s. Was eventually scrapped in favor of internationally licensed variants of the F-86 Sabre, but it’s a fascinating story.
@@leneanderthalien Not entirely. Argentina’s economic situation and lack of industrial-grade tooling were well on their way to killing the project before the eventual decision to move on in favor of the F-86.
An interesting bit of trivia is that when the Soviets tested the DFS-346, they launched it from one of B29s they had interned during the war. No, not one of the TU-4 which they created by reverse-engineering the B-29, but one of the actual B-29s. The test pilots for these flights was German, he was Wolfgang Ziese and had been Siebel's chief test pilot.
Please do something about the extreme spread in volume levels. The loud portions are almost painful and then when you speak quietly I can’t hear what you say at all. A compressor would fix that nicely! Other than that, GREAT VIDEO as always!!
In 1944-45, the aim of the design offices was to come up with projects that they knew were unfeasible only so as not to end up as soldiers on the Eastern Front.
in the same week, when Frank Whittle sit down with Rolls-Royce engineers on that famous lunch to discuss which compressor to build for his jet engine, the first production batch of the Me-262 rolls out of the factory. IN THE SAME WEEK!!
It's almost like the UK, having survived 'the Blitz' didn't feel the need to rush into, largely untested, aircraft technology to defend them from massive raids by enemy bombers.
@@markhall2960 Only there was no "massive raids by enemy bombers". The Luftwaffe was like a sparrow next to a pterodactyl compared to the RAF. The difference was so big. After all, during the escape from Dunkirk, the RAF drove the Luftwaffe out of the sky, keeping the Germans in combat at their own airfields while the British Expeditionary Force was evacuated.
@triibustevonkass9100 Too much too quickly. A product of desperation rather than technical superiority. The Rolls Royce Welland would be the foundation of British turbine engine design in the immediate postwar (the Rolls Royce Derwent and Nene, the turboprop Dart.. as well as the similar DeHavilland Goblin and Ghost). Meanwhile the Jumo 004 had an advanced design but was not easily scalable due to the complexities of compressor surge with axial compressors and had an average life span of 25 hours before overhaul was needed due to the lack of superalloys in Germany. The early adoption of axial compressors would also curse the Americans who went straight into them for indigenous designs as a result of early 1940s NACA research on a six stage axial compressor and the selection of Westinghouse to make its own design where its experience with steam turbines influenced it. The axial compressor was great in the small J30 and J34 engines.. but when it tried to make the J40 in the late 40s to power a new generation of supersonic jets, it failed. The French took until 1948 to develop the comparable BMW 003 into a workable axial flow turbojet as the SNEMCA Atar. The British wouldn’t make a large axial flow engine until the Avon in 1950 and the Americans not until 1950 as well with the two spool J57.
It scares me sometimes when I hear about our military's high technology programs. WWII Germany wasted a lot of money, time and effort on useless projects that siphoned off much needed resources. Sometimes it looks as though we are making the same mistake.
Yep. Why does the USA need the F-22 when the aircraft it replaced was 108:0 in combat? But yet can’t protect against high jacked airliners or win against a bunch of camel jockeys with Kalashnikovs.
@@calvinnickel9995 Because the F-15 won't be top dog forever. You don't want to be behind other nations in military tech if you can prevent it. Highjacked airliners and sand people aren't where you use an F-22 nor an F-15.
@@dallesamllhals9161 Nuts like, like huge 4-6 engined Jet Bombers that would've been the WW2 n∆zi equivalent to the B-52, and then there's things like a giant Rocket-powered Stratospheric Bomber plane that's design to attack from the edge of space, then you also have things such as the concept of converting an ME-109 to be powered by Jet-Engines like an ME-262, and MANY MANY more. Those aircraft designers were absolutely nuts
Operational time for the Junkers Jumo has been regularly calculated as 25 Operational hours, about the same life expectancy of an RAF Fighter Pilot in the Battle of Britain. The distance covered in 25 minutes for a 262 was 13,500 miles!
Germany should never have went to war prior to developing some strategic long range bombers. They made many blunders which were vital for their defeat which the world can be happy for.
You seem to forget that the Nazi economics model was just a large Ponzi scheme. They would have bankrupted Germany by 1940 if it wasn't for starting to invade neighbouring nations.
How about a detailed video on the Argentinian I.Ae. 27 Pulqui which was basically the German fighter that would have been developed if the war hadn't ended. It definitely isn't talked about very often.
2:05 Holy smokes, the Mig-15 suddenly doesn't look so innovative after all after seeing the P.1101... but rather... inspired by stolen carried back home German engineering prototypes, plans, and drawings after the war. 4:56 Nor does the Bell Bell X-5
P1101 was a step up with the engine, too. Instead of having them hanging off the wings as in the Me262, having it in the fuselage reduced drag quite a bit.
Just one thing.99.9 of all germans were not nazis. Most of the aircraft designers and all the workers were not members of the party. They were german. The russians flew the dfs346 in 1947 many times and say they broke the speed of sound several months before yaeger.. They might well have.the plane was capable of nearly 1000 mph. Anyway the Bellx1 had a lot of german engineers working on it as well.
That percentage is inaccurate. Anyone who was in Nazi service both military and contractors were required to join the party. Police and firefighters as well. Anyone associated with the government, too. That is not to say that they agreed with the party and its goals, but they were members. I'm not sure what the percentage was, but I do know that it was greater than 1%. My dad helped at Trials at Nuremberg as a US Army MP. He was guarding some high-ranking German officers. He told me once that several bragged that membership in the Nazi party was over 80%, and that farmers and small shop owners were exempt. That source was questionable, to say the least, but if you consider the size of the German military, the number of civil servants administering the government, and the number of contractor companies putting out military equipment, I would guess about 55-60% were members.
Quite a few resources say the membership of the Nazi Party was around 7-10%, but it's very true that many job/professions would require you to be a member. From what I can see, in elections, the party achieved about 37% of the vote. In respect of these airplanes, they were all commissioned in the service of the Nazi war machine, so it's fair to say they deserve an association, even if the designers were "just doing their job".
A BIG issue for the Germans was the fact their aerospace engineers didn't fully understand creep properties (a material's tendency to deform over time while under load) of nickel alloys. If they'd had that knowledge, they could have made their jet planes more reliable.
Not true, they were very advanced in material technologies, but they couldn’t source the necessary alloys because of allied blockade. Instead they developed a hollow turbine blade aircooled with fresh air drawn off from the intake. A technology still in use today.
You seem to mock many of the innovations that these vehicles had... yet most of them ended up being used by the USA and Great Britain during their own development phase, particularly the Me-1101. Also, the Me 323 was successful as a vehicle but was seriously under armed and easy prey for a single fighter... it too was made of wood and canvas with a pipe frame. The EF-61 was not developed as a bomber. It was a test aircraft to develop high altitude technologies intended for the Ju-317.
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable man persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
"... after all of that, when in the air, the [airplane] proved about as stable as a newborn deer that's just downed 15 pints of lager!" - Simon Whistler, 2024
I get the feeling hat the devs of homeworld deserts of kharak very big transport plane was made from the ju 322 mamut but without the tail and the loading ramp on the back with a bit of the very big horten bomber.
Simon, would you please SLOW DOWN! Your commentary is so fast that there is no time for me to look at the photos, and grasp their relationship to what you're saying, before they disappear.
@@spaceageGecko Yes the Luftwaffe found out the Go-229 can cheat radar, had the Second Battle of Britain kicked off, it would easily sneak through our radar defences, so minimal was the Go-229,s radar cross section.
It would have made no difference. Just like the "wunderwaffe" that did actually enter service, they would have been available in such limited numbers/serviceability/reliability that the swarms of Mustangs, Thunderbolts, Spitfires, Typhoons, Lavochkins and Yakovlevs would have swept them from the skies or destroyed them on the ground.
So, I have video topic suggestion. What if Adolf Hitler were never born or never existed? How would that have impacted the history of the 20th century? One would initially consider all the lives that might have been saved had WWII not occurred (at least in Europe). Also, would the Holocaust have still occurred? And, given that the primary push to develop the Atomic Bomb was a fear that Nazi Germany was developing them as well, would nuclear weapons have ever been developed? There is also the geo-political ramifications of WWII in Europe and how much that has shaped the modern world we live in today. Anyway, at the very least I think it would be an interesting thought discussion from an alternative history standpoint.
There was more than one Fascist group in Germany after WWI. All had war veterans in them. Someone was going to rise to power in the interwar years. Might not have been a second world war, we'll never know.
Thats not correct. Min. 12:00 ; The Pz 38(t) was 1940/41 the lightest medium tank with ca. 10 tons . On this time it was one of the boneback of the armoured divisions. So the Ju 322 Mammut could possibly carry 2 of them, if the Mammut project with the 20 tons could realized...,instead the Me 321 was produced.
The F 86 and MiG 15 obviously borrowed heavily from the P 1101
Noup, they are more close to the Ta-183 Huckebein (the closest is appearance is the Mig 15 in that regard)
F 86 yes, MiG 15 nope.
The MiG was closest to the Gloster Whittle jet prototype.
Take a look at the Saab Tunnan and it's history.
U murucans got more German
One major factor contributing to the failure of Fallschimjäger operations was that only about one in ten men dropped armed; for the rest, they had to find separately-dropped weapon canisters, open them, and break out the weapons contained therein before they were capable of more than minimal action. This resulted in unacceptable casualties in Crete as British troops slaughtered the Fallschimjäger as they tried to arm themselves.
...good Lord, man. There's incompetence, and then there's _this_ tomfoolery. I guess all those stories about recreational drug use among the Nazi military elite were true after all. =/
That’s totally incredible when we know how organized are the Germans.
To drop unarmed soldiers on the battlefield & force them to retrieve their separately dropped weapons, that’s the height of folly.
Not the only insanity in the Crete operation :
the mountain troops & infantry were transported by wooden boats hardly bigger than fishing
boats, that were pitilessly sunk by the Royal Navy.
The Admiral-Cunningham-clobbered Mussolinian fleet
at Matapan was understandably
wanting in its escort duties.
If only they had thought of paras riding the weapons canisters.
@PaxAlotin-j6r
Really have to wonder why the prop blast issue wasn't anticipated, surely it would have regularly presented in routine tests/training?
IIRC, equally as bad was the Fallschimjäger parachutes attached to a single point in the back of the soldier; meaning they had zero control over their direction or rate of descent. They were just passive dummies during the drop.
One reason the german airframe designs were so much advanced is the discovery of Adolf Busemann, who found out that swept wings provide much more stability when speeds surpass or approach Mach levels, and who subsequently did extensive windchannel experiments. All german aircraft developers had his papers during the war. The original discovery was already published in 1935 at a congress in Rome, but the rest of the world did not take notice. Some scientists deemed this information irrelevant, since those speeds were considered unachievable anyway. Only in 1944, 10 years after the the germans, an american scientist made the same discovery.
10 years after the US discovered..10 years..lucky Germany didn't win
Another advantage of the swept wing, they discovered, is that the aircraft had far less tendency to have control lock when speeds approached the speed of sound. This was because on the swept wing, the airflow is changed so as to not lock up the control surfaces - the airflow isn't as blocked as with the straight wing aircraft.
The lack of availability of strategic metals did more to delay the deployment of the German jets, and made them vulnerable to failure over short flight times, combining with sabotage by the slave labor used to build airframes to make most of the late-war designs rare and ineffective.
The lack of strategic metals was an excuse for a fundamentally flawed design. The early models of the Ju004 had a fundamental resonance problem caused by having an even number of blades in each stage. Identification of this design fault in late 1943 forces the scrapping of the five thousand engines built to that time and remanufacturing of new engines with a prime number of blades in each stage.
That delayed the operational deployment of the Me262 until mid 1944.
They had all the strategic metals but they were used for other weapons. They developed over a hundred new alloys and plastics which the americans stole after the war plus they gave us titanium for aircraft and weapons in 1955.
"the slave labor used to build airframes"
Yes, expecting starving slaves working in horrific conditions to build high precision machines was never going to work.
Of course, having the whole thing run by corrupt, incompetent, racist, egotistical clowns didn't help either...
@@robertpullen3726 The Americans got their titanium from Russia in the 1950’s and 60’s.
Please remember, that Hugo Junkers was a pacifist and is company was requested when the Nazis came to power in 1933. He only built civilian airplanes. Even in WW I he was forced to cooperate with Fokker, because he didn't built military airplanes at that time too. The Nazis only continued to use his name, because he was too famous.
Hugo Junkers - one of the greatest aviation pioneers. 1859-1935.
Remember his claims were used for military service as well transport troops and supplies
@@CAROLDDISCOVER-2025 The Nazis came to power in January 1933. Hugo Junkers was expropriated in the autumn of 1933 and he had to leave his town Dessau. In 1934 he was imprisoned in his new house. In 1935 he died at his 76th birthday.
No, he is not responsible in any kind for what happened after that. There were a lot of other aviation pioneers, you could point at. Messerschmitt, Heinkel, Focke, Wulf and Dornier if you want to name some. Even if Dornier wasn't very purposeful. And you can call out more: Porsche, BMW, Mercedes, ...
And you even can call out foreign companies. For instance Ford and IBM/Hollerith/DEHOMAG .
But Hugo Junkers did everything he could to prevent what happened after 1933.
@@Pfefferhaubitze I do not give any credit to Nazis other than being very creative monsters. But I do know of different Nazis who fought the system from within. They were Nazis they had to join the party. They were officers. I don't know them personally I just read the stories. So if what you say is true and I believe you have researched it thoroughly and I thank you for the information. I'll research it for myself. Just to see if I can find out more. Einstein is a comparable story. Thank you very much for presenting this information. Yes his plans and designs were used but like I said he was dead. And his life at least at the end was anti-nazi. If what you say is true and I believe you. But I believe in that old saying trust and verify. I would rather have him than Henry Ford on our side
Beyond the Bell X-5 the Me P.1101 also is the predecessor to the very successful Swedish Saab J 29 Tunnan
The story goes that the Swedish engineers, who were almost invariably educated at German universities, managed to come across German documents that the Allies had not managed to translate, and that they managed to recruit German engineers who had fled to Switzerland and Sweden before the end of the war. Their input became a crash course in the development of jet planes, which quickly led to the J29 Tunnan, A32 Lancen and J35 Draken at the same rate as the Allies, which meant that little Sweden had the 4th largest air force during the 50s and early 60s
0:50 - Chapter 1 - Messerschmitt P1101
5:05 - Chapter 2 - DFS 346
8:55 - Chapter 3 - Junkers JU 322 Mammut
13:10 - Chapter 4 - Junkers EF 61
15:30 - Chapter 5 - Focke achgelis FA 225
The Messerschmidt 321 Gigant glider was the competitor to the Junkers 322. The Me 321 evolved into the Me 323 with the addition of 6 engines. Germany actually used both the 321 & 323 trying to resupply the Panzerarmee Afrika under Rommel.
The best YT channel presenter there is. Simon could read an old telephone book and make it sound interesting.
I couldn't agree more!!😂🎉
I would say Mark Felton is.
"Wood had stumped them"
...well played
oh good someone else notice that too
umm, hello... Me-323... wood, fabric and pipe. As an aircraft it did work and could carry a tank but was seriously underpowered and under-armed. Had they used more powerful engines and added more firepower it may have been a complete success but the airframe did work. also, He-162 was a jet aircraft, made from wood. The problem with it was not the wood but rather the glue and the use of slave labor to build them, which wasted no opportunity to sabotage them. Even Eric Brown had high praise for this wooden aircraft.
Didn't the Soviet Union use the term "unintentional sabotage" for people that couldn't deliver what they were ordered to produce
Nah, for the Soviets it was always intentional with corresponding GULAG sentences.
The Me P.1101 is clearly the design basis of the subsequent SAAB Tunnen, flying before 1950. Apparently the Americans gave the Swedes a peak at captured German aircraft designs somewhere in Switzerland. You can also see the design heritage of the MiG15 and North American Sabre, both of which became operational just after the Tunnan. The British didn't catch up until 1954 with the Hawker Hunter and the French even later in 50s along with Argentina and the Puma.
The Flying Barrel was an exceptional fighter.
The FA225 design isn't entirely ridiculous. It's basically an autogyro, which had tremendous success until airplanes got faster, making the autogyro obsolete. Arguably, the most successful was the Pitcairn Autogyro Co. used extensively in mail delivery. There's even a picture of one landed on the White House lawn.
The British Fairey Rotodyne was the best known attempt to use an autogyro/gyroplane for commercial flight. The prototypes worked and were more efficient and faster than a helicopter, but it was beset with noise problems (the rotor blades were powered by gas jets during take off) and eventually the project fizzled out for lack of support.
Pitcairn basically made autogyros out of whatever airframe he found.
I remember hearing them around home in Philly and Langhorne Pa.
I think my father knew him.
The Swedish success 'Tunnan' ("The Barrel", Saab J29) was a result of German drawings Saab got their hands on in Switzerland just after the end of WW2. Looking very much like the drawing showed here of Messerschmitt P.1101, but (looking with the eyes of an amateur!) in profile a more rounded belly and a shorter tail rodder.
'Tunnan' was the first European built arrow winged plane, and reached a little more than 1000 km/h, for a while the fastest in the world (at least officially, the USA was in the heals..😅).
It primiered in September 1, 1948, the British test pilot Robert 'Rob' More later said "It was love at first sight".
I saw one of the still flying Tunnan on an airshow just the other day. It looks like a bumblebee, flies like a swift.
It's a huge shame that not more of the over 660 built Tunnan hasn't been taking care of, it is worthy to remain flying. It certainly show you, it's not in the looks, it's in ability.
interesting :-)
in 1971 was glider training at RAF South Cerney , England .
Once famous for a Vulcan that landed in an emergency , could not take off .
In another hanger was a German plane , forget how it got there .
Was not huge , slightly oversized Cessna :-)
Cool thing was how it was started ?
Ground crew would lean into the air intake , and find a pull handle , ala , motor mower , which then used to start the jet :-)
54 years ago now , cannot recall if there was a ladder to get up . Looked in and saw the whole deal :-)
Quite ironic that the RAF Buccaneers on duty in ' West Germany ' back then , had huge generators alongside to get them started :-)
little air-cooled boxer twin cylinder (think small BMW R100 motorcycle engine) , cleverly faired into the center jet intake. ;)
@ApeStimplair-et9yk Thanks :-)
I always thought DFS is the discount that goes on forever with never-ending final clearance.
I hear they’ve got a sale on at the moment!
Simon...
On a jet engine (technically, a turbine engine) the blades at the front are called compressor blades and see cold fresh air only. These were what failed on the Jumo 004. The turbine blades were at the rear and had hot gasses from the combustion chamber blowing on them, basically a blow torch. These recovered force which caused the turbine to spin, and via a shaft up the middle, they also turned the compressor blades at the front. Turbine blades HAVE to be made of very special material, but the Germans thought that regular steel would suffice for the [cold] compressor blades at the front that packed air into the combustion chambers; Boy where they wrong! They had the design, but they simply did not have the metallurgy necessary.
The Jumo 004 had a time before overhaul of 8 hours. Compare that to modern turbofan engines that typically run to 15,000 hours before they have to be pulled off the wing and taken apart....
They had the metallurgy, but not the metals themselves, necessitating the use of steel. Eventually, blade design changes addressed some of the reliability issues, but too late to be put into mass production.
@@seanmalloy7249 Perfect! Completely right, that's what I meant to say, they didn't have the metals but they did have the science.
They could build turbine blades, but not compressor blades? That smacks of arrogance.
@@Flies2FLL From the Zoukei-Mura Ho229 model I have, there are nine compressor rotors and ten stator disks, but only one turbine rotor; the compressor stage would be using considerably more of the strategic metals than the turbine. Only the areas that were determined to be critical used the scarce strategic metals, and the designers were unable to fully compensate for that limitation.
@@seanmalloy7249 +1
This is the reason we didn't have a jet engine in WW1....the design existed. A ground model was built.
Simon calls the Jumo 004 little more then scrap metals.
Meanwhile in England the Whittle W.1 had a claimed paternal of 3,000 HP,
but never achieved it due to an inferierior design.
GE engineers pointed out after the war the Whittle W.1 had to run with everything at maximum,
so once you up and flying there's no where for the engine to go. It's maxed out.
Where the Germans, when they wanted more power, added more turbine plates.
The end product went from 800 hp to 6,000 depending on the engine.
And as a friend of mine who worked at GE said, "It was the end of the war.
Imagine if Mercedes were building them today, now picture them building them in 1968 Vietnam.
See the difference?"
What an eye opener!
England was also developing axial flow engine.
Centrifugal had its advantages in war time development. He was not stupid.
I’m also concerned as to your claim that once you were up and flying the Germans could just as more turbine plates. This would be quite hard at 10,000ft and 500mph😂
Also you would want more compressor stages as well.
“Constant bombing” seemed to be a slight irritation developing new planes
"Escape capsule? Yer joking." - 007
😂!! A lot of 'futuristic' stuff has existed at the same time as it was presented in fiction.
Did you know that the first catapult chair (not to confuse a 'rocket chair'!) was made by Swedish Saab? It was first used in the Saab 21A, where the motor and propeller was literally in the middle of the plane, behind the pilot, in a frame of two bars and the tail.
The catapult chair was the solution to how the pilot could avoid the propeller if he had to parachute himself out. A large gunpowder explosion beneath the chair was the answer. He was popped out of the plane, in difference to an ejection chair where you are shot out and a rocket motor takes you further away before the parachute opens. In the latter much more energy is used, and absorbed by the body which may easily cause injuries on the spine and neck.
It was also the first (maybe only??🤔) propeller plane to have its motor exchanged to a jet engine, changed the model name to 21R.
(FUN FACTS! Volvo made the first user-friendly seatbelt, however one of the engineers working on that had earlier worked on Saab's airplane division, developing ejection chairs!)
I enjoy videos that discuss experimental vehicles that just didnt make it. You can learn a great deal from a failure.
Keep up the good work!
Idea for a video is the FMA IAe 33 Pulqui II, an Argentine home-grown Jet Fighter development of Kurt Tank of FW-190 fame in the 1950s and 60s. Was eventually scrapped in favor of internationally licensed variants of the F-86 Sabre, but it’s a fascinating story.
Mark Felton has done a video on that very aircraft!
@@AtheistOrphan Mark Felton mentioned!! He's my favourite wartime history channel
@@georgehh2574 - Same here!👍
The pulqui II was abandoned because had insufficient performance in comparison with th F86
@@leneanderthalien Not entirely. Argentina’s economic situation and lack of industrial-grade tooling were well on their way to killing the project before the eventual decision to move on in favor of the F-86.
The guy in the cast at 4:22 is Wernher Von Braun of V2 fame. He wasn't with any jet projects was he? Certainly not at Peenemunde.
An interesting bit of trivia is that when the Soviets tested the DFS-346, they launched it from one of B29s they had interned during the war. No, not one of the TU-4 which they created by reverse-engineering the B-29, but one of the actual B-29s. The test pilots for these flights was German, he was Wolfgang Ziese and had been Siebel's chief test pilot.
Please do something about the extreme spread in volume levels. The loud portions are almost painful and then when you speak quietly I can’t hear what you say at all. A compressor would fix that nicely! Other than that, GREAT VIDEO as always!!
You should apply for the job.
Saab J29 is a "when a Swedish gave the P-1011 some meatball"
What was the beat behind the first half of the p1101?
In 1944-45, the aim of the design offices was to come up with projects that they knew were unfeasible only so as not to end up as soldiers on the Eastern Front.
Germany was ahead of aeronautical game with several prototypes during the war.
And yet fact is the nazis were thankfully killed, obliterated. To this day little germany maintains United States bases. Occupied.
in the same week, when Frank Whittle sit down with Rolls-Royce engineers on that famous lunch to discuss which compressor to build for his jet engine, the first production batch of the Me-262 rolls out of the factory. IN THE SAME WEEK!!
It's almost like the UK, having survived 'the Blitz' didn't feel the need to rush into, largely untested, aircraft technology to defend them from massive raids by enemy bombers.
@@markhall2960 Only there was no "massive raids by enemy bombers". The Luftwaffe was like a sparrow next to a pterodactyl compared to the RAF. The difference was so big. After all, during the escape from Dunkirk, the RAF drove the Luftwaffe out of the sky, keeping the Germans in combat at their own airfields while the British Expeditionary Force was evacuated.
@triibustevonkass9100
Too much too quickly. A product of desperation rather than technical superiority.
The Rolls Royce Welland would be the foundation of British turbine engine design in the immediate postwar (the Rolls Royce Derwent and Nene, the turboprop Dart.. as well as the similar DeHavilland Goblin and Ghost).
Meanwhile the Jumo 004 had an advanced design but was not easily scalable due to the complexities of compressor surge with axial compressors and had an average life span of 25 hours before overhaul was needed due to the lack of superalloys in Germany.
The early adoption of axial compressors would also curse the Americans who went straight into them for indigenous designs as a result of early 1940s NACA research on a six stage axial compressor and the selection of Westinghouse to make its own design where its experience with steam turbines influenced it. The axial compressor was great in the small J30 and J34 engines.. but when it tried to make the J40 in the late 40s to power a new generation of supersonic jets, it failed.
The French took until 1948 to develop the comparable BMW 003 into a workable axial flow turbojet as the SNEMCA Atar. The British wouldn’t make a large axial flow engine until the Avon in 1950 and the Americans not until 1950 as well with the two spool J57.
Tom Bower's book, "Paperclip Conspiracy", examined selection of those guilty of war crimes but not prosecuted, being deemed useful to the USA.
They were saved by the Cold War.
A very good video, I have heard of some of those, so a good use of probably in the title, very good narration.
The "Panzer 3" at 11:30 is actually a Mark IV with the short barrel main gun.
It scares me sometimes when I hear about our military's high technology programs. WWII Germany wasted a lot of money, time and effort on useless projects that siphoned off much needed resources. Sometimes it looks as though we are making the same mistake.
Yep.
Why does the USA need the F-22 when the aircraft it replaced was 108:0 in combat? But yet can’t protect against high jacked airliners or win against a bunch of camel jockeys with Kalashnikovs.
@@calvinnickel9995 Because the F-15 won't be top dog forever. You don't want to be behind other nations in military tech if you can prevent it.
Highjacked airliners and sand people aren't where you use an F-22 nor an F-15.
I remember spending hours browsing Luft46. A lot of those designs were nuts.
Define NUTS?
@@dallesamllhals9161 ranging from highly creative and possible to highly creative and impractical.
@@dallesamllhals9161 Nuts like, like huge 4-6 engined Jet Bombers that would've been the WW2 n∆zi equivalent to the B-52, and then there's things like a giant Rocket-powered Stratospheric Bomber plane that's design to attack from the edge of space, then you also have things such as the concept of converting an ME-109 to be powered by Jet-Engines like an ME-262, and MANY MANY more. Those aircraft designers were absolutely nuts
@@clawyraptor9029 Oh! So not like in surrender? 😛
So basically again Germany thought it up, and the others copied their homework.
3:40 "A little but posh scrap". This fits for a lot of things but surely not for a Jumo 004. I mean did you really say that?
great presentation, but please get rid of the phony sound effects between scenes, they are very distracting
Love your work brother thankyou
Operational time for the Junkers Jumo has been regularly calculated as 25 Operational hours, about the same life expectancy of an RAF Fighter Pilot in the Battle of Britain. The distance covered in 25 minutes for a 262 was 13,500 miles!
I have never imagined a new born deer downing 15 pints of lager... but now that's all I can think of.
gave up on this video when You tube threw SEVEN minutes of ads before i could watch it
The P.1101 is a research plane with manually adjustable wing sweep. The fighter was the P.1110.
That was a huge concept which led the way into the future
The Arado was essentially a reconnaissance aircraft adapted for bombing.
Germany should never have went to war prior to developing some strategic long range bombers. They made many blunders which were vital for their defeat which the world can be happy for.
It was a deliberate strategic choice of the Nazis to not build large bombers. There were ideas but command didn't want them.
You seem to forget that the Nazi economics model was just a large Ponzi scheme. They would have bankrupted Germany by 1940 if it wasn't for starting to invade neighbouring nations.
Judge nothing, you will be happy. Forgive everything, you will be happier. Love everything, you will be happiest.
How about a detailed video on the Argentinian I.Ae. 27 Pulqui which was basically the German fighter that would have been developed if the war hadn't ended. It definitely isn't talked about very often.
2:05 Holy smokes, the Mig-15 suddenly doesn't look so innovative after all after seeing the P.1101... but rather...
inspired by stolen carried back home German engineering prototypes, plans, and drawings after the war.
4:56 Nor does the Bell Bell X-5
P1101 was a step up with the engine, too. Instead of having them hanging off the wings as in the Me262, having it in the fuselage reduced drag quite a bit.
If Simon carries on at such a frantic pace he'll be at the Mad Jack Torrance stage.😂
Just one thing.99.9 of all germans were not nazis. Most of the aircraft designers and all the workers were not members of the party. They were german. The russians flew the dfs346 in 1947 many times and say they broke the speed of sound several months before yaeger.. They might well have.the plane was capable of nearly 1000 mph. Anyway the Bellx1 had a lot of german engineers working on it as well.
That percentage is inaccurate. Anyone who was in Nazi service both military and contractors were required to join the party. Police and firefighters as well. Anyone associated with the government, too. That is not to say that they agreed with the party and its goals, but they were members. I'm not sure what the percentage was, but I do know that it was greater than 1%. My dad helped at Trials at Nuremberg as a US Army MP. He was guarding some high-ranking German officers. He told me once that several bragged that membership in the Nazi party was over 80%, and that farmers and small shop owners were exempt. That source was questionable, to say the least, but if you consider the size of the German military, the number of civil servants administering the government, and the number of contractor companies putting out military equipment, I would guess about 55-60% were members.
Quite a few resources say the membership of the Nazi Party was around 7-10%, but it's very true that many job/professions would require you to be a member.
From what I can see, in elections, the party achieved about 37% of the vote.
In respect of these airplanes, they were all commissioned in the service of the Nazi war machine, so it's fair to say they deserve an association, even if the designers were "just doing their job".
complete rubbish.
The superior man is modest in his speech, but exceeds in his actions.
Thank God you didn't mention the Horton Brothers. I would have had to take off my belt.
Sorry 😊 Horton Brothers???
@@Gonefishing6572 You know.. The BS Brothers.
@@Gonefishing6572 they made the world's first prototype stealth bomber
@@worldwanderer91 No, they didn't.
When we seek to discover the best in others, we somehow bring out the best in ourselves.
You cover a range of interesting topics. Pity being glib always seems to be your MO.
I would like to be the first person to identify a new way to date Simon’s videos; Coo di Grahh, and Coo di Graysss. ❤
He’s using a lot more American pronunciations.
It is better to have enough ideas for some of them to be wrong, than to be always right by having no ideas at all.
Belief consists in accepting the affirmations of the soul; Unbelief, in denying them.
p1101 became the sabre, j29, mig-15 and a direct copy the Bell X-5.
A BIG issue for the Germans was the fact their aerospace engineers didn't fully understand creep properties (a material's tendency to deform over time while under load) of nickel alloys. If they'd had that knowledge, they could have made their jet planes more reliable.
Not true, they were very advanced in material technologies, but they couldn’t source the necessary alloys because of allied blockade. Instead they developed a hollow turbine blade aircooled with fresh air drawn off from the intake. A technology still in use today.
"But hey, a crap engine is better than no engine!"
^More or less why we never got the F-14B Super Tomcat in the 70s.
the operation of the German gliders in WW2 is perhaps an interesting subject for future video
Solid!
Top KEK!
Peace be with you.
Ref. the DFS 346, the soviets actually used captured German aircrew for their test flights!
12:24 The empennage reminds me of the Mooney M-20 with its swept-forward tail. Don't see that a whole lot.
Great reevaluation of my favorite subject. Luftwaffe 1946.
That looks like Kurt Tanks Argentinian jet.
Yes, the Me evolved into that. Mark Felton has done a video all about it that’s worth a look.
Great job. The amount of research required for each of your projects results in great projects. WW2;history is a passion for me.
Simon; video on repeat from a different channel?
Actually, the Gloster Meteor beat the 262 into service by a couple of days.
The Mig 15 was basically a German design. The Soviets didn't have the designs for the jet engine, but then got them from the British.
If you really wanna revive that myth, I'd like too and say that Sabre and J29 were just copies of German design
That’s a lie and you know it
As stable as a newborn deer who just downed 15 pints of lager. Love it. Classic Simon.
You seem to mock many of the innovations that these vehicles had... yet most of them ended up being used by the USA and Great Britain during their own development phase, particularly the Me-1101. Also, the Me 323 was successful as a vehicle but was seriously under armed and easy prey for a single fighter... it too was made of wood and canvas with a pipe frame. The EF-61 was not developed as a bomber. It was a test aircraft to develop high altitude technologies intended for the Ju-317.
Those engines were works of art.
Messerschmitt P1101 looks just like the aircrafts that the US and USSR made in the cold war
It certainly influenced them, that’s for sure.
Everyone says they love nature until they realize how dangerous she can be.
And yet post-war Allied jet fighters did not incorporate the swept wing until the advent of the Mig15
Very much of a “our German scientist are better than their German scientists”
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable man persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
It is only with the heart that one can see rightly, what is essential is invisible to the eye.
4:22 That's von Braun, nothing to do with Messerschmidt.
So did the Vulcan but she got through US radar during an exercise in Nevada during the early 1970,s .
"... after all of that, when in the air, the [airplane] proved about as stable as a newborn deer that's just downed 15 pints of lager!" - Simon Whistler, 2024
I get the feeling hat the devs of homeworld deserts of kharak very big transport plane was made from the ju 322 mamut but without the tail and the loading ramp on the back with a bit of the very big horten bomber.
Simon, would you please SLOW DOWN! Your commentary is so fast that there is no time for me to look at the photos, and grasp their relationship to what you're saying, before they disappear.
Mammut, just like the Spruce Goose, good on paper.
Forgot about the Messerschmitt Me 264 Amerika Bomber, Gotha Go-229 Stealth Fighter, and Heinkel He 119 Recce with twin-pac Daimler Benz 606.
The HO-229 was in no way a stealth fighter.
@@spaceageGecko Yes the Luftwaffe found out the Go-229 can cheat radar, had the Second Battle of Britain kicked off, it would easily sneak through our radar defences, so minimal was the Go-229,s radar cross section.
@@basiltaylor8910 No the HO-229 was absolutely not a stealth aircraft, it had a massive RCS
Jumping jellyfish, I was here in the first 2 minutes.
It would have made no difference. Just like the "wunderwaffe" that did actually enter service, they would have been available in such limited numbers/serviceability/reliability that the swarms of Mustangs, Thunderbolts, Spitfires, Typhoons, Lavochkins and Yakovlevs would have swept them from the skies or destroyed them on the ground.
How many UA-cam channels do you have?
I doubt it but challenge accepted. Do you have the triflugel, just to name one? We shall see.
So, I have video topic suggestion. What if Adolf Hitler were never born or never existed? How would that have impacted the history of the 20th century? One would initially consider all the lives that might have been saved had WWII not occurred (at least in Europe). Also, would the Holocaust have still occurred? And, given that the primary push to develop the Atomic Bomb was a fear that Nazi Germany was developing them as well, would nuclear weapons have ever been developed? There is also the geo-political ramifications of WWII in Europe and how much that has shaped the modern world we live in today. Anyway, at the very least I think it would be an interesting thought discussion from an alternative history standpoint.
There was more than one Fascist group in Germany after WWI. All had war veterans in them. Someone was going to rise to power in the interwar years. Might not have been a second world war, we'll never know.
The J29 Tunnan is based of the Messerschmitt P.1101. So if you want to see a real one look at them
Thats not correct. Min. 12:00 ; The Pz 38(t) was 1940/41 the lightest medium tank with ca. 10 tons . On this time it was one of the boneback of the armoured divisions. So the Ju 322 Mammut could possibly carry 2 of them, if the Mammut project with the 20 tons could realized...,instead the Me 321 was produced.
Clever all the puns e.g. "stumped" the engineers of the wood aircraft
I had the luck to speak to a german test pilot.
It was quiet interesting listen to him.
P-1101!!!!! The F-86 Saber was designed based on it. Clearly evident from the above view.
Germany 🇩🇪 Engineers who built advanced design aircrafts that were cost effective designs that were copied by other Air forces today
So the glider and the helicopter fokkered...
I've heard of them all, Simon.
The DFS 346 looks a little bit like the snark missile.