With all things equal how much does bore size affect the string ? For example do I get better/worse results out of my 10g 3.5" over my 12g 3.5" or a 12g 2 3/4" vs a 20g 2 3/4" of the same/similar load.
Less of a question and more of an assertion but my guess is that shot string doesn't matter that much due to the overwhelming speed of the shot. Cannot wait to see your data on it!
@@danieldempsey4149 the long standing recognized theory says that the shot string of a 2 3/4 12ga is shorter than 3 inch and 3 1/2 in 12ga is the longest of the three. In theory your 10ga should've a shorter shot string than the 12ga 3 1/2... We will be looking at some of this to prove or disprove the theory. Thanks!
You could already calculate this with your data, but I would be interested to hear how much of that shot string would pass/hit a duck flying by. Similar to your ballistic gel test but with the new data. “If a duck is flying 40mph and the first pellet hits the tip of his beak, how many feet of the shot string will impact before the tip of his tail passes?
Cameron asks the question as it relates to this video that I asked you last year about leading. A good formula with calculated FPS you should be able to answer. Joel you are the man, this is awesome.
Just some quick calculations. A 6’ shotstring at 600fps requires 0.01 sec to pass the plane of your target (600fps is a typical velocity at 40yds for birdshot). A bird flying at 35mph will travel 6 inches in the time it takes for the shotstring to pass. The same bird will travel about 12 inches in the time it takes a 12 foot shotstring to pass. The longer string MIGHT give you a bit of additional margin for error, but it’s going to be slight and it also will be hitting with the less dense pattern at the trailing end of the string. All things being equal, a shorter string will likely result in fewer cripples.
Is the 600fps the speed at which the pellets are traveling at 40 yards? Just wondering. I wouldnt have thought the speed declines that fast. Interesting! Edit: i realize you did say that in your comment! Thanks for that info! Shorter shot string is def the way to go it seems!
thats what my math came out to as a well. ironically for every foot of string on the video would relatively be an inch of bird travel at 40yrds. it seems anything quail or smaller would get a very very small 5-6 inch luck window if you perfectly led the shot far enough. for every shot to fly around the bird. at the tail end of the 12 ft string. at 40 yards.
Dude you’re awesome. Like I mean that, I really appreciate the work AND money you put into this content. You have my “boy admiring a man doing his dream job” type of respect.
John Olin and other ballisticians of the past would be in awe of this video. I've always understood the following things in relation to shot string.....1st, the tighter the choke, the longer the shot string. 2nd: The harder the shot, the shorter the shot string because softer pellets will deform and thus will fly slower due to increased air resistance, thus, increasing shot string length. 3rd: Given weight of shot charge, the smaller the gauge, the longer the shot string. A 20 gauge 3" shell for instance is starting with a much longer shot string (1 1/4 oz. of lead shot) than a 12 gauge "high-brass" shell also starting with the same shot charge but in an initially shorter height "pile" of shot. My Dad used to use a 3" loaded 20 (back in the good old days of lead) for ducks and he always maintained he'd hit more ducks at the same distance (40 yards) with the 20 than with the 12 (Using the same weight shot charge), BUT....they also tended to not be "hit as well" with the 20 because of it's longer shot string. Thanks again for such a wonderful and overdue video.
I have been shooting guns for about 60 years now and got my first shotgun about 54 years ago. Yes it beat me up, and yes I loved it. Ever since then I have wanted to see what you showed me right here. Thank you so very much for the effort and time it took to make a great video and put to rest the nagging cloud of questions that I only had "a priori" answers to until this morning. So, now what am I supposed to think about . . . . Thanks again!
Talk about taking your content to a new level - this is amazing! Your hard work did not go unnoticed and I speak for many waterfowlers when I say we don’t take it for granted. Incredible stuff Joel!
I am dying to see a pattern master code black duck stack up against other full chokes to see how much shorter (if it is) the shot string is. Keep up the awesome footage and information. This is stuff so many of us have wondered about but never have been able to test
28 gauge.... They have always been known to hit harder than their gauge says... The mystery has always been in the shot string to a lot of people,, I would love to see that.... Great job!
Joel, this brilliant, groundbreaking stuff! You did not disappoint! Can't wait for the next one! I just finished editing a video on the art of shotgunning whose sole conclusion and purpose is to point people to this series. Scheduled to post in 2 weeks! Great job!
@Surviving Duck Season, Joel this is getting so intense. And seeing fiocci with such a short shot string. And thinking about it a short shot string means more hitting power on a moving target. I will not miss another video. I am glad to see this historic footage you two are making.
Thanks Rick! More hitting power with a short shot string is certainly one theory... we will know very soon which one is a FACT and which "theories" can be called a myth!
Thank you for your many hours and $ put into this research. My experience has been that deep, thoughtful research usually exposes more questions than it answers initially. Years ago I participated in 2 duck seasons of steel shot vs lead shot study, where the hunter didn't know which he was shooting. A Federal game biologist/technician monitored approximate distances, clear misses, clean kills, and cripples, along with wind and weather. Steel sheels were crude, using shell componets (wad cups) made for lead. Choke tubes were still in the future. Most smooth bores were Modified or Full choke. It became obvious that steel produced more cripples, (and the need for a dog) but it was here to stay. Over the years the ammo makers improved steel shells. For a multitude of reasons, ammo (at least where I am) has been in short supply the last 2-3 years. so I shoot whatever I can find. A box of 3inch, 1-1/4 ounce can be $17 or $35. My own research has convinced me that practice and gun discipline improves my success rate. When the pattern and the duck collides, my limits improve. Your research will surely help choke and ammo manufacturers improve their products and their bottom lines, but I can bet you that their marketing campaigns are already in overdrive. Great video!
I stumbled across this video and all I can say is Wow! I really wish some one would do this with different chokes and trap/skeet loads. Thank you for taking the time to make this.
Great information thanks for the video. Never knew that shot strings were that long/short, amazing... Great Info... Would love to see the length of shot strings with target loads for like trap loads. I shoot a lot of trap it would be so helpful to know the shot string on them loads and different chokes...
This is a wonderful film clip. Love to see what a 12 gauge trap load does in 7 1/2's and 8's. I like a long shot string on high birds because if you are a tad too far in front of them the back end of the shot string still gets them. That is when you can actually see a time lag between the report of the shotgun going off and the bird actually getting the impact of the shot string. In the video bob aronsohn shoots his 100,000th crow filmed in 2001 you can see live birds getting shot at all different ranges. The last hunt where I shot my 100,000th crow in 28 seasons you can see a 551 bird shoot on crows. If you would like to view this film clip it's on you tube under bob aronsohn shoots his 100,000th crow. The work you have done with this $ 300,000 camera is a real eye opener. Much better than seeing it on a patterning board. It is deceiving looking at pellet holes on paper because not all the shot gets there at once. Your film clip really shows this, a huge bravo to you and your partner doing the filming.
Outstanding video. It would be awesome to get different extended choke tubes and ammo from all sizes for waterfowl and see what they do in flight. This would definitely tell if your choke tubes are actually doing what they are supposed to be doing for distance and shot pattern.
This is awesome. I shoot a lot of sporting clays and I"m always trying to figure out the variation between 9s and 7.5s and skeet choke vs. IC vs mod. I would love a video on that.
Great video. I'm always calculating my leads and patterns with different loads and shot drag and now you throw in shot string. It can be complicated but fun to think about.
I don’t see how it can, from the few clips we saw the ones where the wad kept the shot contained longer seemed to have a shorter shot string. I think we’re about to find out that after market choke tubes companies are really good at marketing.
@@justincastor937 i agree, striping the wad seems like the last thing you want to do. I'm starting to think the best choke compresses the wad the tightest for the longest. I'm also curious to see if porting matters, does it create more turbulent air and jostle pellets around or does it vent air out of the way and help the wad stay compressed.
I really hope he tests the patternmaster! I’ve been bragging about it having a shorter shot string for as long as I’ve been shooting it. Sure hope I’m not a liar! Although I do see better knock down performance with the patternmaster
Without a doubt the best information I have seen or heard since Bob Brister's book. All the rest do not address the shot string which is too inportent to ignore. Thanks for sharing your information and hard work. Old Louisiana duck hunter and dreamer.
Fascinating. I am relating it to the clay target sports. Explains a few things related to that. Gives me a headache thinking about all the scenarios. Like Jim Scoutten use to say, "shoot more, shoot more often". That will improve those misses. Thank you for the video. Awesome.
Velocity, constriction, wad design, crimp style, hill design n thickness, burn rate of powder. I believe every one will effect the shot string. Very interesting stuff
Best shot shell video EVER !! So so interesting .. i have always thought it was wad and powder combination that made the load ? But now I wonder please tell ..
This is great. I would love to see brand comparisons of 3.5" BB, then with different chokes. There's so many videos you could make on this topic to suit all types of shotgun hunting. Thanks for the work you're doing!
Great stuff! Loved how the Boss Bismuth appeared to fragment when shot through the turkey choke - many of the trailing pellets were twinkling like stardust, indicating irregular surfaces from the broken pellets. It was also very interesting seeing how the duplex loads separated in flight. Keep it coming!
Bro you are legend this series and target life are the best stuff on shotgun life !!! GOD BLESS YOU SND THE WORK YOU DO!!! Thanks so much and PEACE BE WITH YOU ALWAYS
This is awesome to see. Seeing this is slow motion makes me think that a longer shot string would definitely give you a better chance at hitting the bird, but in reality everything is happening so fast that maybe it wouldn’t matter at all. Plus, the longer shot string would make it so less bb’s are hitting the bird at the same time. Super cool to see and think about
Amazing, Awesome footage and super informative. Thanks for putting this together. Read Bret Huntsman Information would like to see the gel block dropped through the frame and shot.
This is great! 19:39 so the shot string seems wider when it ends, and it's the opposite when the wad comes out - does it mean that pellets in the shot string start to reverse their order before slowing down to subsonic? 24:25 seems like it starts reversing at 24 feet and is fully reversed at 20 yards, so it shows supersonic air drag is significant
I’m always told I over analyze shot loads, velocities. Ok now I’m not alone. Very well done. The technology of today is appreciated. I once set up a spinning disc of paper and measured the string. That is way back in my memory but I think our results were similar. Nice work.
This is an awesome series that hopefully will be used for years to come to educate all types of shotgunners. Can't wait to see all the rest of the videos you have in store for us!!!
I want to come sit with my feet up on the desk and watch all the raw footage....WOW!!! The muzzle shots are just plain awesome!!!! Interesting so far for sure! Can't wait for the next one.
The Teaser you showed me this Summer doesn't compare to how cool it looks with all the types and distances! Wow. Thank you for you work and dedication!!
This series was one of the best I’ve ever watched. Thanks for taking the time to do the research and break everything down. I’m excited to go on my first ever guided hunt next Saturday.
Hey Joe I’m a trap shooter, and like you have read all of the theories about the shot string . I’m really glad that you took on this challenge…from my prospective I would ask if the cheap shells have a different shot string than the premium shells, for instance Remington gun clubs versus Remington STS. Also could you do more with lead shot such as hard lead with 6% antimony versus soft lead quenched low antimony. Ok one last item. does wad design make a difference? Windjammer versus rem figure 8. 4 petal type.. thanks and keep up the great work!
As a shooter who uses both 12 and 20 gauge, the only difference between them is the length of the shot string. Aside from super heavy magnum duck loads, which are not used in a 20, if you take two normal load size shells from the same manufacturer, i.e 1 oz, 1 1/4 oz etc, same pellet size, same muzzle velocity, the only difference is the length of the shot string, nothing else. Because the 20 is a smaller tube and has a slimmer cartridge, the shot string created is longer than the 12. Most people find the 12 easier to kill with due to the shorter shot string. However, some experts use the longer shot string of the 20 bore to their advantage. It is a matter of personal choice. 10 years of pattern testing has clearly proved to me that at extreme range, 60 yards plus, the 20 delivers a more dense pattern and retains more percentage of the original load, choke for choke over the 12 but that is a different matter. It amuses me how otherwise intelligent people have an almost superstitious belief that the same load in a 12 is somehow magically more powerful than the exact same load/muzzle velocity in a 20. Read the cartridge box dummy.
Extremely informative! As someone who has been wingshooting for 40 years, I have always wondered about shot string and never new any real facts about it, only guesses. Thanks for putting so much time and technology into this subject!
awesome video. The question on my mind is, how does cold weather affect the shot string. here in NE Ontario I've hunted in freezing temps. wonder if you put a few shells in the freezer for a bit, would the shot string look any different 🤔
According to my oldest's 6th grade science experiment, colder temps(denser air) does effect shotgun pellets. He used 7.5 lead and 20 F temp diff, low 60's and low 40's. Colder was a slightly more open pattern. Sample was 3 shots each session.
SDS, thank you for some really great videos. Because of your videos, I DID GO OUT AND PATTERN MY BENELI NOVA. Tried six different loads at 40 yards, shooting large cardboard squares. So now I know, and I'm happy with the results. Also, every time I would pull off the feathers of a duck I shot in preparation for skinning and de-breasting, I would wonder why they only seemed to have a few shot in them. And now I know. As soon as they are hit, by the first shot in the string, they fall. And all the rest of the shot continues on past the spot they were at. 2021 was my first duck season. I'm late to the game I know. Your videos have really helped me understand some things. Great serious your posting now. Thank you. In the future, I would like to see your take on duck vision and the best ways for concealment in the marsh and overhead cover. I would also like to see your take on the best and worst waterfowl gear, be it calls, decoys, motion devices... etc. One Shot... One Kill!
Just an awesome video! I watched it 3 times! Fascinating stuff, so much data, so many more questions! You should send this to the ammo companies, maybe they will hire you for R&D so they can improve their products! Cant wait to watch the rest of this series!
Holy smokes that was cool!!! I agree, I could watch that all day! The smoke and fire coming out of the barrel and differences in pellet strings was fascinating! Truly groundbreaking stuff! Way to go Joel!
Wow. That was a lot of money and effort spent. Most of us find a gun that we like, and then try a bunch of shotshells to see which one patterns best at whatever distance we think we're going to shoot at. Usually costs under two grand. But, I guess we all have our Pursuits.
Great stuff!!! It must have been a blast collecting all the data. So many variables, so many questions to be answered! Choke size, payload, hull length, velocity....
Very surprising. I would think propelling equal size/weight projectiles, they would all fly at the same speed and be affected equally by drag. So what is causing some pellets to slow down faster than others to create the string? Minute variations in size and weight?
Likely many things... imperfections on each individual pellet is a big reason. Even though pellets are round, they are not all perfect. The harder pellets (TSS and Steel) have shorter stringing likely because they are smoother and more round. Softer pellets like lead and bismuth are likely affected by the explosive charge in the gun damaging, flattening or changing some of the pellets at the bottom of the cartridge... which is why they tend to have longer strings. It also appears some pellets are drafted by others, as well as some might be affected by wind sheer from pellets that are ahead in line. All very interesting.
@@SurvivingDuckSeason It really is surprising because I thought "shot string" was not a "stringy" as people thought. It really is. Then you have to factor in the shockwaves from each pellet affecting other shot nearby when it's all going supersonic.
Many people claim that the outer and front pellets get hit by more air resistance, while pellets in the center are "drafting" in the vacuum space created by the front pellets, if this is true we should see the front and outer edge pellets "falling behind" and the middle rear pellets moving forward.. I think I see this in some of the videos.
@@ejchem101 I think it would be interesting (albeit tedious) to take a shell that has a long string and a shell with a short string and weigh out a number of the shot to see it there are variations in weight.
This is some ABSOLUTELY FANTASTIC information that I’ve never seen anywhere else! “Mind blown 🤯” great video of amazing content and a TON of information for new thought patterns…🤔 - I’m sending links to everyone I know that shotguns! - mad respect! Thank you for this information!!!
Well done that man!! However, I would love to see some fibre wad shots. I am in the UK and many grounds here allow only fibre wads and I have heard that they throw a better pattern. Someone else made a remark about 28 bore and that would be very interesting as would a 410 shot. You have a job for life here Joel. Best regards from the UK
What are YOUR QUESTIONS about the shot string? Thanks for watching!
With all things equal how much does bore size affect the string ? For example do I get better/worse results out of my 10g 3.5" over my 12g 3.5" or a 12g 2 3/4" vs a 20g 2 3/4" of the same/similar load.
Less of a question and more of an assertion but my guess is that shot string doesn't matter that much due to the overwhelming speed of the shot. Cannot wait to see your data on it!
@@danieldempsey4149 the long standing recognized theory says that the shot string of a 2 3/4 12ga is shorter than 3 inch and 3 1/2 in 12ga is the longest of the three. In theory your 10ga should've a shorter shot string than the 12ga 3 1/2... We will be looking at some of this to prove or disprove the theory. Thanks!
You could already calculate this with your data, but I would be interested to hear how much of that shot string would pass/hit a duck flying by. Similar to your ballistic gel test but with the new data. “If a duck is flying 40mph and the first pellet hits the tip of his beak, how many feet of the shot string will impact before the tip of his tail passes?
Cameron asks the question as it relates to this video that I asked you last year about leading. A good formula with calculated FPS you should be able to answer. Joel you are the man, this is awesome.
Just some quick calculations. A 6’ shotstring at 600fps requires 0.01 sec to pass the plane of your target (600fps is a typical velocity at 40yds for birdshot). A bird flying at 35mph will travel 6 inches in the time it takes for the shotstring to pass. The same bird will travel about 12 inches in the time it takes a 12 foot shotstring to pass. The longer string MIGHT give you a bit of additional margin for error, but it’s going to be slight and it also will be hitting with the less dense pattern at the trailing end of the string. All things being equal, a shorter string will likely result in fewer cripples.
This is the comment I was looking for
That’s the real question/answer we needed.
Is the 600fps the speed at which the pellets are traveling at 40 yards? Just wondering. I wouldnt have thought the speed declines that fast. Interesting!
Edit: i realize you did say that in your comment! Thanks for that info! Shorter shot string is def the way to go it seems!
thats what my math came out to as a well. ironically for every foot of string on the video would relatively be an inch of bird travel at 40yrds. it seems anything quail or smaller would get a very very small 5-6 inch luck window if you perfectly led the shot far enough. for every shot to fly around the bird. at the tail end of the 12 ft string. at 40 yards.
A nasty bit of product placement thar boy !
Dude you’re awesome. Like I mean that, I really appreciate the work AND money you put into this content. You have my “boy admiring a man doing his dream job” type of respect.
I appreciate that! It's been a ton of work, but it's been a ball!
This guy is the most likeable, friendly duck hunter on the planet :) Intelligent, analytical and articulate too. Good on you, brother!
John Olin and other ballisticians of the past would be in awe of this video. I've always understood the following things in relation to shot string.....1st, the tighter the choke, the longer the shot string. 2nd: The harder the shot, the shorter the shot string because softer pellets will deform and thus will fly slower due to increased air resistance, thus, increasing shot string length. 3rd: Given weight of shot charge, the smaller the gauge, the longer the shot string. A 20 gauge 3" shell for instance is starting with a much longer shot string (1 1/4 oz. of lead shot) than a 12 gauge "high-brass" shell also starting with the same shot charge but in an initially shorter height "pile" of shot. My Dad used to use a 3" loaded 20 (back in the good old days of lead) for ducks and he always maintained he'd hit more ducks at the same distance (40 yards) with the 20 than with the 12 (Using the same weight shot charge), BUT....they also tended to not be "hit as well" with the 20 because of it's longer shot string. Thanks again for such a wonderful and overdue video.
I have been shooting guns for about 60 years now and got my first shotgun about 54 years ago. Yes it beat me up, and yes I loved it. Ever since then I have wanted to see what you showed me right here. Thank you so very much for the effort and time it took to make a great video and put to rest the nagging cloud of questions that I only had "a priori" answers to until this morning. So, now what am I supposed to think about . . . . Thanks again!
50 years of hunting and shooting… this has answered so many questions I’ve had and been asked over the years… what a fantastic video!
Talk about taking your content to a new level - this is amazing! Your hard work did not go unnoticed and I speak for many waterfowlers when I say we don’t take it for granted. Incredible stuff Joel!
I am dying to see a pattern master code black duck stack up against other full chokes to see how much shorter (if it is) the shot string is. Keep up the awesome footage and information. This is stuff so many of us have wondered about but never have been able to test
I have the same questions but with smoke kiks vs factorys choke
This!!!!
28 gauge.... They have always been known to hit harder than their gauge says... The mystery has always been in the shot string to a lot of people,, I would love to see that.... Great job!
Joel, this brilliant, groundbreaking stuff! You did not disappoint! Can't wait for the next one! I just finished editing a video on the art of shotgunning whose sole conclusion and purpose is to point people to this series. Scheduled to post in 2 weeks! Great job!
That's great George, thank you!
Shooters ability has more impact than anything else.
@Surviving Duck Season, Joel this is getting so intense. And seeing fiocci with such a short shot string. And thinking about it a short shot string means more hitting power on a moving target. I will not miss another video. I am glad to see this historic footage you two are making.
Thanks Rick! More hitting power with a short shot string is certainly one theory... we will know very soon which one is a FACT and which "theories" can be called a myth!
Joel you are a duck hunting hero for this video! Thank you, Thank you, Thank you!
💪🏻🦸🏼♂️👊🏻 lol you’re welcome!!
Boss totally used this video to engineer the new buffered ammo warchief. Excellent video my friend
Remember you hinting about this in a past video. Been excited to see it!
Right on!
Try Hornady 3" BB , copper plated lead coyote load. Also some 00 buck.
100% the best UA-cam Channel! Thanks Joel for going above and beyond for Waterfowlers!
Thank you for your many hours and $ put into this research. My experience has been that deep, thoughtful research usually exposes more questions than it answers initially. Years ago I participated in 2 duck seasons of steel shot vs lead shot study, where the hunter didn't know which he was shooting. A Federal game biologist/technician monitored approximate distances, clear misses, clean kills, and cripples, along with wind and weather. Steel sheels were crude, using shell componets (wad cups) made for lead. Choke tubes were still in the future. Most smooth bores were Modified or Full choke.
It became obvious that steel produced more cripples, (and the need for a dog) but it was here to stay. Over the years the ammo makers improved steel shells. For a multitude of reasons, ammo (at least where I am) has been in short supply the last 2-3 years. so I shoot whatever I can find. A box of 3inch, 1-1/4 ounce can be $17 or $35. My own research has convinced me that practice and gun discipline improves my success rate. When the pattern and the duck collides, my limits improve. Your research will surely help choke and ammo manufacturers improve their products and their bottom lines, but I can bet you that their marketing campaigns are already in overdrive.
Great video!
The video I’ve been waiting for the most in this series
Right on!
I stumbled across this video and all I can say is Wow! I really wish some one would do this with different chokes and trap/skeet loads. Thank you for taking the time to make this.
Glad you enjoyed it!
You are freaking awesome to put this together. More please more. The steel was crazy tight more on lead is needed for us upland hunters.
Great information thanks for the video. Never knew that shot strings were that long/short, amazing... Great Info... Would love to see the length of shot strings with target loads for like trap loads. I shoot a lot of trap it would be so helpful to know the shot string on them loads and different chokes...
This is a wonderful film clip. Love to see what a 12 gauge trap load does in 7 1/2's and 8's. I like a long shot string on high birds because if you are a tad too far in front of them the back end of the shot string still gets them. That is when you can actually see a time lag between the report of the shotgun going off and the bird actually getting the impact of the shot string. In the video bob aronsohn shoots his 100,000th crow filmed in 2001 you can see live birds getting shot at all different ranges. The last hunt where I shot my 100,000th crow in 28 seasons you can see a 551 bird shoot on crows. If you would like to view this film clip it's on you tube under bob aronsohn shoots his 100,000th crow. The work you have done with this $ 300,000 camera is a real eye opener. Much better than seeing it on a patterning board. It is deceiving looking at pellet holes on paper because not all the shot gets there at once. Your film clip really shows this, a huge bravo to you and your partner doing the filming.
Outstanding video. It would be awesome to get different extended choke tubes and ammo from all sizes for waterfowl and see what they do in flight. This would definitely tell if your choke tubes are actually doing what they are supposed to be doing for distance and shot pattern.
Thanks... good suggestion! Be watching!
I’m really interested in seeing a blind side load seeing if the hex shot makes a difference
Incredible video. Keep making them. I watched it a couple of times and noticed the pellets dropping 40 yards over the 7-foot span.
This is awesome. I shoot a lot of sporting clays and I"m always trying to figure out the variation between 9s and 7.5s and skeet choke vs. IC vs mod. I would love a video on that.
How about cylinder bore 18.5" self-defense loads?
Excellent Excellent work. I had no idea the shot stream was that long. TY
Great video. I'm always calculating my leads and patterns with different loads and shot drag and now you throw in shot string. It can be complicated but fun to think about.
So happy to have crossed your channel…oh yeah
Curious to see if pattern masters claims have been true all these years
Especially curious to see if it shortens the long shot string of that boss bismuth
I don’t see how it can, from the few clips we saw the ones where the wad kept the shot contained longer seemed to have a shorter shot string. I think we’re about to find out that after market choke tubes companies are really good at marketing.
@@justincastor937 i agree, striping the wad seems like the last thing you want to do. I'm starting to think the best choke compresses the wad the tightest for the longest.
I'm also curious to see if porting matters, does it create more turbulent air and jostle pellets around or does it vent air out of the way and help the wad stay compressed.
I really hope he tests the patternmaster! I’ve been bragging about it having a shorter shot string for as long as I’ve been shooting it. Sure hope I’m not a liar! Although I do see better knock down performance with the patternmaster
@@justincastor937 Good observation. I hadn’t noticed that. I’m definitely curious to see how it does
Without a doubt the best information I have seen or heard since Bob Brister's book. All the rest do not address the shot string which is too inportent to ignore. Thanks for sharing your information and hard work. Old Louisiana duck hunter and dreamer.
Thank you!
I definitely want to see the shotstring of non constriction choke tubes like Patternmaster.
This is the very best analysis I have ever seen
Fascinating. I am relating it to the clay target sports. Explains a few things related to that. Gives me a headache thinking about all the scenarios. Like Jim Scoutten use to say, "shoot more, shoot more often". That will improve those misses. Thank you for the video. Awesome.
Dude, your show's writing is amazing.
The episode we have all been waiting for! Moohahaha!!
Indeed!!
Been waiting on this one!!
Enjoy!
Velocity, constriction, wad design, crimp style, hill design n thickness, burn rate of powder. I believe every one will effect the shot string. Very interesting stuff
bloody incredible video mate... legendary stuff your doing here!!! greetings from the UK
@text-9455 Good lord! i did write i was from the UK
Joel, spot on work! Had to watch it twice to let it all soak in! I know you’re tossing and turning at night thinking through it all.
Best shot shell video EVER !!
So so interesting .. i have always thought it was wad and powder combination that made the load ? But now I wonder please tell ..
This video gives me strong Mythbusters vibes and I’m all about it! Super informative, can’t wait to see the next part
Awesome! Thank you!
This video will take your channel to the next level.
Thanks 👊🏻👍🏻👊🏻
I can hardly wait for the next one , so glad you’re taking the time to research this for all the shotgunners that watch you,THANKS !
Glad you enjoyed it! You're welcome.
I had a different perception about shots before seeing this video. Amazing content.
I'm in awe
Thank you for all the work you put into this series. As a new duck hunter, it has been extremely helpful.
Love this video. This is a dream come true.
This is great. I would love to see brand comparisons of 3.5" BB, then with different chokes. There's so many videos you could make on this topic to suit all types of shotgun hunting. Thanks for the work you're doing!
Thanks for putting your time and money into this. Dropping a lot of knowledge bombs in this one!!
Great stuff! Loved how the Boss Bismuth appeared to fragment when shot through the turkey choke - many of the trailing pellets were twinkling like stardust, indicating irregular surfaces from the broken pellets. It was also very interesting seeing how the duplex loads separated in flight. Keep it coming!
Bro you are legend this series and target life are the best stuff on shotgun life !!! GOD BLESS YOU SND THE WORK YOU DO!!! Thanks so much and PEACE BE WITH YOU ALWAYS
Thank you!
This is awesome to see. Seeing this is slow motion makes me think that a longer shot string would definitely give you a better chance at hitting the bird, but in reality everything is happening so fast that maybe it wouldn’t matter at all. Plus, the longer shot string would make it so less bb’s are hitting the bird at the same time. Super cool to see and think about
Great video. I have always wondered about shot string after shooting birds and clays for 45 years.
Much respect for going through all of this just to help us fellow hunters out mr Strickland!
Really great work. I'd be interested in seeing the effect of a wad grabber type choke such as a Patternmaster Code Black Duck on shot string.
Thank you! Good question!
Hilarious opening segment, but , true , two thumbs up , thanks for the info
Amazing, Awesome footage and super informative. Thanks for putting this together. Read Bret Huntsman Information would like to see the gel block dropped through the frame and shot.
Best shotsell video EVER! Hands Down!!! Great Job JOEL!!!!
Haha! 🙌🏻 Thanks Tim! I appreciate you.
What a great video, no questions just in awe taking it all in. Can’t wait for the next video!
This is great! 19:39 so the shot string seems wider when it ends, and it's the opposite when the wad comes out -
does it mean that pellets in the shot string start to reverse their order before slowing down to subsonic?
24:25 seems like it starts reversing at 24 feet and is fully reversed at 20 yards, so it shows supersonic air drag is significant
Old school Cutts compensator used to be thought to shorten shot string. Based on watching a few hundred thousand skeet targets I would agree. Tests?
I’m always told I over analyze shot loads, velocities. Ok now I’m not alone. Very well done. The technology of today is appreciated. I once set up a spinning disc of paper and measured the string. That is way back in my memory but I think our results were similar. Nice work.
This is an awesome series that hopefully will be used for years to come to educate all types of shotgunners. Can't wait to see all the rest of the videos you have in store for us!!!
More cool and interesting stuff, I guarantee!
Does an extended forcing cone shorten the shot string?
Excellent Question!
Curious on that myself
I want to come sit with my feet up on the desk and watch all the raw footage....WOW!!! The muzzle shots are just plain awesome!!!! Interesting so far for sure! Can't wait for the next one.
Thanks for sharing all of this, very interesting stuff. Really appreciate !!!
Excellent work, the Best I have ever seen.
For a cross moving Target the shot string creates a oval shaped pattern.
Great work on the shot string. Great information, very useful .
Simply awesome footage! I’ve seen drawings of guessdamations of the ‘shotstring’ but really seeing the real thing is just as good as it gets!
I know… cool stuff huh!?!
The Teaser you showed me this Summer doesn't compare to how cool it looks with all the types and distances! Wow. Thank you for you work and dedication!!
Thanks Josh, yeah pretty incredible to see it!
This series was one of the best I’ve ever watched. Thanks for taking the time to do the research and break everything down. I’m excited to go on my first ever guided hunt next Saturday.
Hey Joe I’m a trap shooter, and like you have read all of the theories about the shot string . I’m really glad that you took on this challenge…from my prospective I would ask if the cheap shells have a different shot string than the premium shells, for instance Remington gun clubs versus Remington STS. Also could you do more with lead shot such as hard lead with 6% antimony versus soft lead quenched low antimony. Ok one last item. does wad design make a difference? Windjammer versus rem figure 8. 4 petal type.. thanks and keep up the great work!
This is by far the best demonstration, I have ever seen. Great 👍👌👍
Thank you very much!
As a shooter who uses both 12 and 20 gauge, the only difference between them is the length of the shot string. Aside from super heavy magnum duck loads, which are not used in a 20, if you take two normal load size shells from the same manufacturer, i.e 1 oz, 1 1/4 oz etc, same pellet size, same muzzle velocity, the only difference is the length of the shot string, nothing else. Because the 20 is a smaller tube and has a slimmer cartridge, the shot string created is longer than the 12. Most people find the 12 easier to kill with due to the shorter shot string. However, some experts use the longer shot string of the 20 bore to their advantage. It is a matter of personal choice. 10 years of pattern testing has clearly proved to me that at extreme range, 60 yards plus, the 20 delivers a more dense pattern and retains more percentage of the original load, choke for choke over the 12 but that is a different matter. It amuses me how otherwise intelligent people have an almost superstitious belief that the same load in a 12 is somehow magically more powerful than the exact same load/muzzle velocity in a 20. Read the cartridge box dummy.
Extremely informative! As someone who has been wingshooting for 40 years, I have always wondered about shot string and never new any real facts about it, only guesses. Thanks for putting so much time and technology into this subject!
I have been absolutely fascinated with this whole series. Thank you for the great film work and factual information!!
Hi 👋 ! I absolutely want to know if the patternmaster chokes really reduces the length of the shotstring??? 🤔
Fascinating stuff!
awesome video.
The question on my mind is, how does cold weather affect the shot string.
here in NE Ontario I've hunted in freezing temps.
wonder if you put a few shells in the freezer for a bit, would the shot string look any different 🤔
According to my oldest's 6th grade science experiment, colder temps(denser air) does effect shotgun pellets. He used 7.5 lead and 20 F temp diff, low 60's and low 40's. Colder was a slightly more open pattern. Sample was 3 shots each session.
One of the coolest videos I've seen , something for everyone, you got , it all. Great photogaphs
SDS, thank you for some really great videos. Because of your videos, I DID GO OUT AND PATTERN MY BENELI NOVA. Tried six different loads at 40 yards, shooting large cardboard squares. So now I know, and I'm happy with the results. Also, every time I would pull off the feathers of a duck I shot in preparation for skinning and de-breasting, I would wonder why they only seemed to have a few shot in them. And now I know. As soon as they are hit, by the first shot in the string, they fall. And all the rest of the shot continues on past the spot they were at.
2021 was my first duck season. I'm late to the game I know. Your videos have really helped me understand some things. Great serious your posting now. Thank you.
In the future, I would like to see your take on duck vision and the best ways for concealment in the marsh and overhead cover. I would also like to see your take on the best and worst waterfowl gear, be it calls, decoys, motion devices... etc.
One Shot... One Kill!
Just an awesome video! I watched it 3 times! Fascinating stuff, so much data, so many more questions! You should send this to the ammo companies, maybe they will hire you for R&D so they can improve their products! Cant wait to watch the rest of this series!
UA-cam is so cool for content like this. Well, really UA-cam creators are so cool for brining rich content like this we would never see on cable.
Love to see different clay target loads demonstrated like this.
Holy smokes that was cool!!! I agree, I could watch that all day! The smoke and fire coming out of the barrel and differences in pellet strings was fascinating! Truly groundbreaking stuff! Way to go Joel!
Appreciate all your time you're putting into this it's very interesting
Thanks! Glad you enjoyed!
This was absolutely the coolest video I have ever watched!
Absolutely fascinating. Can't wait to watch the rest.
Wow. That was a lot of money and effort spent.
Most of us find a gun that we like, and then try a bunch of shotshells to see which one patterns best at whatever distance we think we're going to shoot at. Usually costs under two grand. But, I guess we all have our Pursuits.
😀😀😀👍👍👍❤ Joel this info on shot string length needs to be in all shot shell reloading manuals. NOW!!!!
Great stuff!!! It must have been a blast collecting all the data. So many variables, so many questions to be answered! Choke size, payload, hull length, velocity....
Very surprising. I would think propelling equal size/weight projectiles, they would all fly at the same speed and be affected equally by drag. So what is causing some pellets to slow down faster than others to create the string? Minute variations in size and weight?
Likely many things... imperfections on each individual pellet is a big reason. Even though pellets are round, they are not all perfect. The harder pellets (TSS and Steel) have shorter stringing likely because they are smoother and more round. Softer pellets like lead and bismuth are likely affected by the explosive charge in the gun damaging, flattening or changing some of the pellets at the bottom of the cartridge... which is why they tend to have longer strings. It also appears some pellets are drafted by others, as well as some might be affected by wind sheer from pellets that are ahead in line. All very interesting.
@@SurvivingDuckSeason It really is surprising because I thought "shot string" was not a "stringy" as people thought. It really is. Then you have to factor in the shockwaves from each pellet affecting other shot nearby when it's all going supersonic.
Yep, and you can also see shock waves from the muzzle moving across on the shots with the white background.
Many people claim that the outer and front pellets get hit by more air resistance, while pellets in the center are "drafting" in the vacuum space created by the front pellets, if this is true we should see the front and outer edge pellets "falling behind" and the middle rear pellets moving forward.. I think I see this in some of the videos.
@@ejchem101 I think it would be interesting (albeit tedious) to take a shell that has a long string and a shell with a short string and weigh out a number of the shot to see it there are variations in weight.
Outstanding
Great video. I’m interested in the lot to lot variability of the shot string.
This is some ABSOLUTELY FANTASTIC information that I’ve never seen anywhere else! “Mind blown 🤯” great video of amazing content and a TON of information for new thought patterns…🤔 - I’m sending links to everyone I know that shotguns! - mad respect! Thank you for this information!!!
Well done that man!! However, I would love to see some fibre wad shots. I am in the UK and many grounds here allow only fibre wads and I have heard that they throw a better pattern. Someone else made a remark about 28 bore and that would be very interesting as would a 410 shot. You have a job for life here Joel. Best regards from the UK
Well done guys