Hi Kevin, thanks very much! Yes, you can: the unit doesn't have to be running and is unaffected if it's not: it's made from the same grade steel as the flue, but has thicker walls. You can also run the pump off a car battery if you have a power cut or are off-grid: the stated draw is 37w, but actually our engineering consultants have been testing it and found it draws just 17w when operating on the system.
Keep up the great work you guys. Ques: Have you ever thought about a three way directional outlet to help direct the output heat around a larger living space?
Hi Gary, thanks very much! A directional outlet isn't actually necessary because the outlet air is pressurised. That means the heat distribution is quite unlike that from a fan: the pressurised, turbulent jet draws the radiant heat from the stove into it, mixing it into the flow. Because it's pressurised, this warm air has to equalise with the colder air in the room, so it is spread by that equalisation process. The heat obviously dissipates over time and distance, but the big difference is that we're not powering that equalisation process, and it's going to act first on the coldest, lowest pressure areas. It's literally the same difference as the energy required to pump water across a room, or pouring water onto an uneven floor and letting it settle. That's why we see a spread that is so much further than we put the electrical or mechanical energy in to power: our energy goes into pressuring the air, in conjunction with the heat energy, and this combination then disperses the heat for free through the equalisation. So directing it doesn't make much difference - an effect our customers first reported to us is that the units heat the floor, as well as into other rooms and upstairs, and it was this phenomena that actually got us working out how that could be so.
Should probably say that people certainly do aim the outlet nozzles in a specific direction - you might have seen one chap has his backwards to heat the open-plan room behind the stove, and quite a few aim it to the corridor or into their conservatory. In this respect though, splitting the nozzle would split the jet, which is crucial in drawing the radiant heat of the stove into that air flow and dispersing it. In terms of the total heat dispersal, it is is this heat from the stove, rather than the heat from the flue, that is by far the greater proportion of the useful heat distributed.
Oh, and just to add again, have you seen Philip's stove with three Recoheat units in series above each other! ua-cam.com/video/SwUB78xd_hk/v-deo.html You'll see he has put them at different angles to spread the heat around his large workshop. He reports little difference in the output temperature of the higher nozzles, but he'll be shifting less total heat from them because they're further from the top of the stove. It's a 13kw stove though, that puts 10 of them into the back boiler, so he's massively increasing the heat he's pulling into the room.
Hi Gary, do you mean the flue is coming off the stove at the rear, horizontally? We're aiming for the end of September, and in two configurations: one in a T section with the outlet from the vertical, and one with an extension pipe off the horizontal. If you email through a picture of your install, we'll be able to advise. Thanks very much indeed for your support!
A fan just pushes the radiant heat from the surface of the stove, and requires space above the stove just to sit on. Our units can fit into a 3" gap above the stove, and are powered by pumped air, so don't rely on the radiant heat for power generation. That means they keep pumping heat for a long time after the surface of the stove is cool, when there is still plenty of heat inside the combustion chamber, which passes up the flue. Whilst the stove is hot, the effect is still very different and much more effective because of the additional heat from the flue, but more because a lot of the heat displacement derives from the pressure equalisation between the expanded, turbulent air flow from the unit which creates an envelope of warm air that pushes out from the stove and warms a long way. So it warms a much wider area, for much longer, than a conventional set-up, with or without a fan. An eco fan doesn't use electrical power, but our units use a 37w pump, so that's also a difference.
Sorry for the slow reply. Yes, you can: put a T with a soot hatch on, and fit the Recoheat on the top of that so you can sweep through it. The Recoheat has to be vertical and you need to make sure that the flue is running hot enough - at about 250C.
I have a couple of questions could I set this up with some gate valves and direct heat all around the building or alternate areas also would it be suitable to operate with thermostatic switch to have it operate until the ambient temperature reached a desired level.
Thanks for the interest: www.recoheat.co.uk/shop lists the different sizes. We'll have different flue configurations and some other related gear shortly.
It really is a piece of string because it depends on the position and layout of the flue. As an additional cost to whatever remedial work the stove and flue might need, it's usually similar to the cost of a sweep.
Just letting you know that, contrary to our previous information, you don’t need a Hetas installer to fit your Recoheat: it’s classed as remedial work, doesn’t come under building regs and can be done by a sweep as maintenance and updating work.
The industry has recently undergone a review of processes and published their standards as part of their training and assessment requirements, where the issue is clarified and codified: details are here: www.ukstandards.org.uk/NOS-Finder#k=chimney%20occupations
That makes a massive difference to us, and I hope does to you. If you need a Recoheat installing, you can ask your sweep!
Interesting. Your 60 l/m air pump = a handy 1 l/s which is about 1.2g/s. The Cp (specific heat capacity of air at constant pressure) is about 1 j/g. So a 400C temperature increase is 1.2 (g) x 400 (C) x 1 (J/s) = 480 Watts of heat. I would be interested to know if you could measure the speed of the flow and temperature out of the top of the flue to see how much potential for heat recovery there is.
Is there an option to run this on 12v? The pump looks quite large, for our off grid cabin running that from an inverter is not really an option i think.
I think you would need an inverter. The pump isn't that big, Will put a video up showing that it only draws 17watts too. In saying that you might be able to find a 12v pump that would have some effect maybe.
Sorry for the very slow response - missed your comment. It does actually only run at 17w, so will be drawing just over 1amp on your 12v. We run ours from a motorbike battery for outside operation. There are a few people running them from batteries, including the chap in the yurt in Ontario!
Thank you for info , I note you mention that if you have a back boiler there is little point in installing the blower . Being ignorant of their construction is the back boiler type already designed to recover heat from the flue ? IE it is not literally a ‘back’ boiler.
@@pmbpmb5416 It depends very much on the stove, but as a general rule, a back burner will take too much heat out, so that adding an additional heat recovery system will be too much. Some do work fine, so you can test it by checking the temperature of the flue above the collar. We need an operating temperature of at least 250C so that the coil is kept clean.
We do have some on our website, but not many at the moment. The best thing is to use the Hetas installer search widget: you put your postcode in and get the list of your local guys. Give them a shout and check availability and see if they'll do it. They're very busy. If you contact us at sales@recoheat.co.uk, we can send of the CE marking info with the installation manual and safety certificate from BSRIA, and we're very happy to talk to them, give references from existing installers etc. The Hetas page is www.hetas.co.uk/consumer/services/installers/ Many thanks for your interest.
Just letting you know that, contrary to our previous information, you don’t need a Hetas installer to fit your Recoheat: it’s classed as remedial work, doesn’t come under building regs and can be done by a sweep as maintenance and updating work.
The industry has recently undergone a review of processes and published their standards as part of their training and assessment requirements, where the issue is clarified and codified: details are here: www.ukstandards.org.uk/NOS-Finder#k=chimney%20occupations
That makes a massive difference to us, and I hope does to you. If you need a Recoheat installing, you can ask your sweep!
No, it can't. The stove is designed not to put too much heat up the flue, so it shouldn't be maintaining much heat at the next floor level, for example. In that case there's not enough heat to keep the unit clean. It would also be difficult to put the chimney sweep's brush through. Thanks for your interest!
Great piece of innovation but that white noise would drive me crackers ..... as I think it would all tinnitus sufferers...... If you can solve that issue you'd be on a real winner.
Thanks Robert. Tinnitus is quite a burden. The sound actually doesn't affect the only person I know with bad tinnitus: it's not as loud as the microphone shows because the turbulent flow messes with audio pickup.
Yes, no problem. It works on anything with an open flue - so even on gas and oil stoves as long as they don't use a balanced flue, which falls under different regulations.
Just letting you know that, contrary to our previous information, you don’t need a Hetas installer to fit your Recoheat: it’s classed as remedial work, doesn’t come under building regs and can be done by a sweep as maintenance and updating work.
The industry has recently undergone a review of processes and published their standards as part of their training and assessment requirements, where the issue is clarified and codified: details are here: www.ukstandards.org.uk/NOS-Finder#k=chimney%20occupations
That makes a massive difference to us, and I hope does to you. If you need a Recoheat installing, you can ask your sweep!
I'm thinking of a stove to go in our fireplace that currently has a Baxi Burnall grate, which has a large ashpan set into the hearth under the grate, as well as an air inlet down there that draws air from under the floorboards. It looks like that pump may fit down in the ashpan hole and it could draw air through the vent, effectively from outside via the airbricks. Do you know of anyone who has done that? One worry might be still hearing the pump, even if it is down below the hearth, also to access the pump would mean removing the stove.
The biggest issue there would be having power under the stove. That Burnall looks a very clever system, but I still wouldn't be running power into it. It would seem a better idea to put the air line through the vent, so put the pump outside. Thanks very much for the interest.
@@Recoheat That's got me thinking - I could run the power from a switched plug socket under the floorboards and in through the same air vent in the bottom of the ashbox hole. The heat resistant air pipe would come up behind the stove, pretty well out of sight.
It's not, because it's the turbulence in the air flow, which is what causes the rapid heat gain in the unit, and the transfer into the room. There is no hiss when the air is cool - it is caused by the acceleration and turbulence resulting from the heating action.
The units do have a silencer on them to take the mechanical noise of the pump out of the airflow. The hiss that is left is actually caused by the turbulence in the air, rather than the velocity. You can't take that out with baffles - in fact the only way is to combine 3 turbulent airflows. We're working on trying to achieve a silencing nozzle but it's pretty complex. @@ricardopelc-wesoly3483
Thanks for the engagement. It's a valid concern. In fact it doesn't do so in a properly functioning stove and flue because the coil is in the hottest part of the flue and the heat recovered is a much smaller percentage than that lost through the flue wall. The vortex produced by the foiling action of the coil also agitates the particles to prevent them adhering to the metal. The coil demonstrably remains cleaner than the flue sides.
Hi great video. Can you still have the fire going if there is a power cut
Hi Kevin, thanks very much! Yes, you can: the unit doesn't have to be running and is unaffected if it's not: it's made from the same grade steel as the flue, but has thicker walls. You can also run the pump off a car battery if you have a power cut or are off-grid: the stated draw is 37w, but actually our engineering consultants have been testing it and found it draws just 17w when operating on the system.
Keep up the great work you guys. Ques: Have you ever thought about a three way directional outlet to help direct the output heat around a larger living space?
Hi Gary, thanks very much! A directional outlet isn't actually necessary because the outlet air is pressurised. That means the heat distribution is quite unlike that from a fan: the pressurised, turbulent jet draws the radiant heat from the stove into it, mixing it into the flow. Because it's pressurised, this warm air has to equalise with the colder air in the room, so it is spread by that equalisation process. The heat obviously dissipates over time and distance, but the big difference is that we're not powering that equalisation process, and it's going to act first on the coldest, lowest pressure areas. It's literally the same difference as the energy required to pump water across a room, or pouring water onto an uneven floor and letting it settle. That's why we see a spread that is so much further than we put the electrical or mechanical energy in to power: our energy goes into pressuring the air, in conjunction with the heat energy, and this combination then disperses the heat for free through the equalisation. So directing it doesn't make much difference - an effect our customers first reported to us is that the units heat the floor, as well as into other rooms and upstairs, and it was this phenomena that actually got us working out how that could be so.
Should probably say that people certainly do aim the outlet nozzles in a specific direction - you might have seen one chap has his backwards to heat the open-plan room behind the stove, and quite a few aim it to the corridor or into their conservatory. In this respect though, splitting the nozzle would split the jet, which is crucial in drawing the radiant heat of the stove into that air flow and dispersing it. In terms of the total heat dispersal, it is is this heat from the stove, rather than the heat from the flue, that is by far the greater proportion of the useful heat distributed.
Oh, and just to add again, have you seen Philip's stove with three Recoheat units in series above each other! ua-cam.com/video/SwUB78xd_hk/v-deo.html You'll see he has put them at different angles to spread the heat around his large workshop. He reports little difference in the output temperature of the higher nozzles, but he'll be shifting less total heat from them because they're further from the top of the stove. It's a 13kw stove though, that puts 10 of them into the back boiler, so he's massively increasing the heat he's pulling into the room.
When will you have the rear exhaust systems ready. I am only able to use the rear exhaust on my stove and if available would order today. Thanks
Hi Gary, do you mean the flue is coming off the stove at the rear, horizontally? We're aiming for the end of September, and in two configurations: one in a T section with the outlet from the vertical, and one with an extension pipe off the horizontal. If you email through a picture of your install, we'll be able to advise. Thanks very much indeed for your support!
What’s the comparison like against a large eco fan ?
A fan just pushes the radiant heat from the surface of the stove, and requires space above the stove just to sit on. Our units can fit into a 3" gap above the stove, and are powered by pumped air, so don't rely on the radiant heat for power generation. That means they keep pumping heat for a long time after the surface of the stove is cool, when there is still plenty of heat inside the combustion chamber, which passes up the flue. Whilst the stove is hot, the effect is still very different and much more effective because of the additional heat from the flue, but more because a lot of the heat displacement derives from the pressure equalisation between the expanded, turbulent air flow from the unit which creates an envelope of warm air that pushes out from the stove and warms a long way. So it warms a much wider area, for much longer, than a conventional set-up, with or without a fan. An eco fan doesn't use electrical power, but our units use a 37w pump, so that's also a difference.
Can you fit it to a stove with the flu out the back,of the stove not the top?
Yes, but regs state the horizontal section of flue pipe should be no more than 150mm.
Sorry for the slow reply. Yes, you can: put a T with a soot hatch on, and fit the Recoheat on the top of that so you can sweep through it. The Recoheat has to be vertical and you need to make sure that the flue is running hot enough - at about 250C.
I have a couple of questions could I set this up with some gate valves and direct heat all around the building or alternate areas also would it be suitable to operate with thermostatic switch to have it operate until the ambient temperature reached a desired level.
Hi John. Essentially, no, but have a look at this video for a detailed explanation: ua-cam.com/video/Wt08Fo1gCRw/v-deo.html
Loving the videos guys !
Thanks Theo!
What is the cost including VAT of the Recoheat unit ?
Thanks for the interest: www.recoheat.co.uk/shop lists the different sizes. We'll have different flue configurations and some other related gear shortly.
I want one for my camper conversion. But now the question is, what stove works good with this?
We've got one on a Hygge stove, with a 4" to 5" adapter. It works really well.
Can use insulated ducting/piping to send the hot air i to thr next room
Hi I am looking to buy one of these can you tell me is it available in black as your site just shows silver many thanks
Wonderful! It certainly is - you just specify black or silver on the purchase page. Many thanks!
Any idea on the average installation costs guys?
It really is a piece of string because it depends on the position and layout of the flue. As an additional cost to whatever remedial work the stove and flue might need, it's usually similar to the cost of a sweep.
Just letting you know that, contrary to our previous information, you don’t need a Hetas installer to fit your Recoheat: it’s classed as remedial work, doesn’t come under building regs and can be done by a sweep as maintenance and updating work.
The industry has recently undergone a review of processes and published their standards as part of their training and assessment requirements, where the issue is clarified and codified: details are here: www.ukstandards.org.uk/NOS-Finder#k=chimney%20occupations
That makes a massive difference to us, and I hope does to you. If you need a Recoheat installing, you can ask your sweep!
Interesting. Your 60 l/m air pump = a handy 1 l/s which is about 1.2g/s. The Cp (specific heat capacity of air at constant pressure) is about 1 j/g. So a 400C temperature increase is 1.2 (g) x 400 (C) x 1 (J/s) = 480 Watts of heat. I would be interested to know if you could measure the speed of the flow and temperature out of the top of the flue to see how much potential for heat recovery there is.
Well, the diameter is 125mm as opposed to 8mm, so it's got to be proportional to that.
Is there an option to run this on 12v? The pump looks quite large, for our off grid cabin running that from an inverter is not really an option i think.
I think you would need an inverter. The pump isn't that big, Will put a video up showing that it only draws 17watts too. In saying that you might be able to find a 12v pump that would have some effect maybe.
Sorry for the very slow response - missed your comment. It does actually only run at 17w, so will be drawing just over 1amp on your 12v. We run ours from a motorbike battery for outside operation. There are a few people running them from batteries, including the chap in the yurt in Ontario!
Is it possible to plumb the outlet to another part of the house ?
You can’t because the turbulent air just heats the cold metal really quickly, so comes out cold after a short distance.
As a matter of interest can u advise make and model number of that burner , thanks.
It's an Ecosys Ottawa, 7kw
Thank you for info , I note you mention that if you have a back boiler there is little point in installing the blower . Being ignorant of their construction is the back boiler type already designed to recover heat from the flue ? IE it is not literally a ‘back’ boiler.
@@pmbpmb5416 It depends very much on the stove, but as a general rule, a back burner will take too much heat out, so that adding an additional heat recovery system will be too much. Some do work fine, so you can test it by checking the temperature of the flue above the collar. We need an operating temperature of at least 250C so that the coil is kept clean.
Thanks , knowing that I can see if we can purchase a stove accordingly .
Thanks , knowing that I can see if we can purchase a stove accordingly .
Do you have any recomended installers?
We do have some on our website, but not many at the moment. The best thing is to use the Hetas installer search widget: you put your postcode in and get the list of your local guys. Give them a shout and check availability and see if they'll do it. They're very busy. If you contact us at sales@recoheat.co.uk, we can send of the CE marking info with the installation manual and safety certificate from BSRIA, and we're very happy to talk to them, give references from existing installers etc. The Hetas page is www.hetas.co.uk/consumer/services/installers/ Many thanks for your interest.
Just letting you know that, contrary to our previous information, you don’t need a Hetas installer to fit your Recoheat: it’s classed as remedial work, doesn’t come under building regs and can be done by a sweep as maintenance and updating work.
The industry has recently undergone a review of processes and published their standards as part of their training and assessment requirements, where the issue is clarified and codified: details are here: www.ukstandards.org.uk/NOS-Finder#k=chimney%20occupations
That makes a massive difference to us, and I hope does to you. If you need a Recoheat installing, you can ask your sweep!
Is this approved in Canada?
No - we've only submitted for approval in the UK and EU.
Is it true its made in Burnley?
Invented by Kevin who lives in Padiham, outside Burnley. We make them in Suffolk now, with flue sections from Oldham.
Can this be placed higher up the pipe ??
No, it can't. The stove is designed not to put too much heat up the flue, so it shouldn't be maintaining much heat at the next floor level, for example. In that case there's not enough heat to keep the unit clean. It would also be difficult to put the chimney sweep's brush through. Thanks for your interest!
I have an inset style wood burner i guess there i no way i use the Recoheat?
There isn't, unfortunately. Thanks for the interest - and very sorry for the very slow reply!
Great piece of innovation but that white noise would drive me crackers ..... as I think it would all tinnitus sufferers...... If you can solve that issue you'd be on a real winner.
Thanks Robert. Tinnitus is quite a burden. The sound actually doesn't affect the only person I know with bad tinnitus: it's not as loud as the microphone shows because the turbulent flow messes with audio pickup.
Can this bu used if burnings coal ?
Yes, no problem. It works on anything with an open flue - so even on gas and oil stoves as long as they don't use a balanced flue, which falls under different regulations.
I am trying to get a good installer unable to find one can some one help me i am in the Buckingham area (Milton Keynes)
Have you tried your local ones from the Hetas widget? I know everyone is very busy at the moment.
Just letting you know that, contrary to our previous information, you don’t need a Hetas installer to fit your Recoheat: it’s classed as remedial work, doesn’t come under building regs and can be done by a sweep as maintenance and updating work.
The industry has recently undergone a review of processes and published their standards as part of their training and assessment requirements, where the issue is clarified and codified: details are here: www.ukstandards.org.uk/NOS-Finder#k=chimney%20occupations
That makes a massive difference to us, and I hope does to you. If you need a Recoheat installing, you can ask your sweep!
I'm thinking of a stove to go in our fireplace that currently has a Baxi Burnall grate, which has a large ashpan set into the hearth under the grate, as well as an air inlet down there that draws air from under the floorboards. It looks like that pump may fit down in the ashpan hole and it could draw air through the vent, effectively from outside via the airbricks.
Do you know of anyone who has done that? One worry might be still hearing the pump, even if it is down below the hearth, also to access the pump would mean removing the stove.
The biggest issue there would be having power under the stove. That Burnall looks a very clever system, but I still wouldn't be running power into it. It would seem a better idea to put the air line through the vent, so put the pump outside. Thanks very much for the interest.
@@Recoheat That's got me thinking - I could run the power from a switched plug socket under the floorboards and in through the same air vent in the bottom of the ashbox hole. The heat resistant air pipe would come up behind the stove, pretty well out of sight.
@@stevechelt1 Yes, that sounds the way to do it. 👍
It's a heat exchanger for the waste heat that goes up the flue. Clever idea.
@@bennewinn1101 Yes, that's right. Thanks for stopping by!
Not a legal requirement in Scotland as is HETAS
That's interesting. We have plenty of customers in Scotland, as you'd expect!
Is it possible not to have that hissing sound?
It's not, because it's the turbulence in the air flow, which is what causes the rapid heat gain in the unit, and the transfer into the room. There is no hiss when the air is cool - it is caused by the acceleration and turbulence resulting from the heating action.
Just wondering if some sort of muffler could help reduce the hiss noise similar to a car exhaust without compromising the air flow.@@Recoheat
The units do have a silencer on them to take the mechanical noise of the pump out of the airflow. The hiss that is left is actually caused by the turbulence in the air, rather than the velocity. You can't take that out with baffles - in fact the only way is to combine 3 turbulent airflows. We're working on trying to achieve a silencing nozzle but it's pretty complex. @@ricardopelc-wesoly3483
great way to produce cresote.
Thanks for the engagement. It's a valid concern. In fact it doesn't do so in a properly functioning stove and flue because the coil is in the hottest part of the flue and the heat recovered is a much smaller percentage than that lost through the flue wall. The vortex produced by the foiling action of the coil also agitates the particles to prevent them adhering to the metal. The coil demonstrably remains cleaner than the flue sides.
Do you have an agent in Ireland I would be interested in becoming a distributor ?
That would be great: please do give us a shout on sales@recoheat.co.uk