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Why did Ducati Give Up the V-Twin Engine?
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- Опубліковано 15 гру 2019
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Remember why they make electric bikes
Not everyone can afford fuel on the new V4 like everyone could afford fuel 20years ago on the flagship inline 4...
You can have an R6 inline 4 120HP
The average rider doesn’t tune their suspension.
1500miles after a suspension tuner tunes the hydraulics it goes back to pogo stick mode which chews tyres and cannot get a pace faster. Unless you keep tuning.
Then you can have Aprilia RS660 Parallel twin 98hp and is lighter than inline 4, Non adjustable damper suspension.
If cannot tune the R6 fully adjustable suspension and having more power....
It will chew tyres x2 faster than the RS660 as they sit.
Unless can use that suspension technology to what it’s designed for. Optimum tyre wear and pace....their is not much difference, to someone with non adjustable technology.
All that technology....
Holy SHIT the Aprilia sounds so damn good.
Good joke.
30 Ducati models have a V2, only 6 a V4.
So Ducati gave up the V2, huh?
have they drastically cut back on premium 2 cylinder options?
I loved my 959 , fast revving engine , lots of torque , smooth and capable . But once you ride v4 you feel another set of emotions
Yeah, it usually involves a ray of light and a heavenly choir.
Force V4ever
The new Pinigale V2 seems like a better bike for the road. The V4 is flat out scary to push to the limits.
This was classic Yamster! Well done, though it would have been worth noting the cylinder firing order among the three bikes whose exhaust note you compared. Good to have you back Yam.
Angle between cylinders and the crankshaft alignment can change the sound and power delivery.
Much like cross plane vs flat plane for inline 4 cylinder engines.
Jordan Peterson?
Ducati may have given up the v-twin engine, but I'll never give up my papa yam
They didn’t truly gave up. They still have the baby panigale v2. Still a lot of power 150+hp.
Oh, give me that Aprilia V4 any day!
VFR sounds the best, while saving you a hell lot of money too.
Ducati did incredible things with their twin. They reached a practical limit with the twin though.
Exactly, I wanna see KTM score a podium with their twin, let alone winning world titles.
@@ampm9771
I'd like to see KTM build more parallel twins that don't eat cam lobes in 10k klms. 😂
@jamescampbell4334 yeah, you pointed out one of KTM's very well. Like you'll need to replace oil pump every 2000km on a KTM, or oil every 1000km.
They will never 100% give up the 90° V-Twin, at least I certainly hope not. The sound of that engine is so distinct and unforgettable it would be a crying shame for it to go away. Polyphony Digital the developer for the Grand Turismo series years ago made in my view one of the greatest games ever, Tourists Trophy for the PS2 which I still own (no ps2 though) and the sound of the 999 is so sweet. The game is great since it is one of the few ps2 titles that can display 1080 it still looks great today and the lineup of bikes is cool the Honda NR 750 is even a hidden bike. But back to Ducati, I pray they never kill their V-Twin...
The Yam has RETURNED
I never leave bb
The aprilia sounds godly
Opinion: Aprilia V4 sounds best. The "big bang" or "Twin Pulse" firing order of the V4 just makes it sound like a weird V2, which I've never been a fan of anyway. Rolling down the 405 at 90mph the V2 exhaust note just sounds like a pissed-off Cub Cadet.
The V4R is the only ducati that actually takes advantage of the desmo valves, even though 600cc bikes have hit 16,000 rpm on valve springs. It's been nothing but an additional cost for no gain. And you said "the engine was more reliable..." Show your work.
Make a video and show us how it's done. Commenting is easy, creating is hard.
Hahaha I'm glad you shit on this keyboard cowboy yammie, but the rsv4 sounds waaaay better.
@@yammienoob Show how *what* is done. I stated an opinion, then facts on how anything Desmo has done, valve springs have done. Doesn't take a video to prove that.
Thanks Yam brother for this, as a Ducatista I appreciate this. Man, the Pani sounds so good & it has sexier lines than the Aprilia however I will say the Aprilia does sound a bit better, put the Arrow Pro Race full exhaust on the Pani & it sounds even better. I'm lucky to have owned 3 Ducs, currently have a Diavel 1260s & it's just a beast!
Aprilia's got the best sound
You like Dachshunds because they look like yams with legs.
My 2001 VFR sounded like an angry sewing machine. Last of the gear driven cams. RIP.
I love this style of vid, you have a knack for making technical info clear and fun. Not many can do that well
IMO , I prefer the sound of the Ducati V4 . It's just sound more mechanical to me and I like that .
For racing, the V-twin died in 1969 when the Honda inline-4 came out. Some racing classes allowed V-twins to have more ccs so they could be competitive for awhile, such as the Honda RC51. Now, Kawasaki has dominated World Superbike with an inline-4, with the Aprilia V4 sometimes winning. Completely stock, it seems most riders go faster around a track on an Aprilia V4, however it might be many more miles to get to a mechanic used to working on them, and Aprilias are probably less reliable than other brands.
Wsbk 2003, 2004, 2006
1000cc maximum for any cylinder layout/configuration and the 999 Ducati came home ahead of the 1000cc fours.
I like the twin so I can claim some kind of similarity to all the Harley guys here in Indiana. Since we're both riding "V twins" they seem a little more accepting. Some of them even think it's pretty cool.
You *want* Harley owner approval?
Not really. Outnumbered 500 to 1 however, some semblance of commonality is nice to have.
@@Druwoods you mean like having 2 wheels?
You'd think that would be enough.
I have a road glide and a 1199. Trying to compare them is like comparing a human and a mouse just be cause we have 85% of the same DNA......
11 minutes? More cylinders, more power.
More peak horse power more rpm and more fuel used.
More parts more money
Oh dear. Not all Ducati singles were Desmo. The lower end ones eg the 160 and 250 Monzas never were although the GT clubman racer versions were. (The 250 Monza was a surprisingly nice bike, just a tad too small for me.) And desmos do have valve return springs, they're there to prevent valve train lash which, given that the whole point of desmo technology was to get humongous valves to keep up with a high revving race engine, was an issue. Owner of many ducks here.
Ducati made a 1260cc V4 in 1964. It was called the Apollo but it never made it into production.
I love the the V4 engine in some of my bikes (Desmosedici w/gp exhaust and rsv4 factory)totally unique power delivery. The music they play is a beautiful Symphony!
Is it just me or does the rsv4 sound better than the desmo?
yup
Coz the angle of camshaft, v4 90° rsv4 65°
Definitely the RSV-4 sounds way way way better. Maybe that’s just not the ideal exhaust for the Ducati ?
The sound comparisons were somewhat misleading since they all seemed to have aftermarket exhausts. My 2016 Aprilia RSV4 with a stock exhaust sounds very different from the one in the sound comparison (I prefer the stock sound). And my 2019 Panigale V4 Speciale has the Ducati-supplied Akropovic exhaust and also sounds very different (and better, IMHO).
@@rjw_utah you dont even have one.
"Dashuns"
>DASHUNS
*DASHUNS*
Dachshund. German. I can get "docks hound," "docks hoond," or the rare one that says it like "datsund." That dog breed has a name that has officially been murdered on this day.
And if yammie bothers reading through all that, this is a nitpicky detail because the rest of the video was awesome.
You guys are annoying
@@yammienoob
Welcome home, pappa yam!
After I upgraded the exhaust, my 1203 cc V-twin 2008 Buell XB12X Ulysses sounds like a big fishing boat, and it still runs great to this day. None of the bikes here even come close!
My understanding of the cause for desmo valve timing was that in the earlier days of high performance engines the valve springs would break due to inferior alloys. With the advent of superior alloys desmo timing has become obsolete.
Depending on the rev limiter. With classic valve springs a 1000 cc four cylinder engine can rev up to a little more than 15,000 rpm. For higher revs desmodromic or pneumatic valves are still the choice. But who knows what material science brings us in the future.
In the late 1960's my dad set up a 250 Ducati spring valve version that was raced against desmo versions in on a 1/4 drag course in Los Angeles. He smoked them and got a little plaque for his victory. Though the Italians definately mastered the art of the Desmo. They were so good they assisted Mercedes with there desmo's in the in the 1950's
The Aprilia sounds much better
That sweet Honda VFR sound... glorious
How about steel trellis frames? That's just as much of a Ducati thing as L-twins. I love the Panangales, but the move to aluminum frames shook me even more than the move to a V4.
Aprilia V4 sounds best 😍 ... the new V2 is cool too; looks sleek and flickable ... 😘
They couldn’t get anymore out of two cylinders without more displacement and wsbk wouldn’t allow that.
Trouble is the more you tune a vtwin the more it acts like a 4 cylinder thus you loose any advantage a vtwin gives you
Hi, its me again. I've been pointing out for a long time now (but not yet here) one reason why Ducatis pull the other bikes on the straights. Maybe you'll care enough to comment. Consider traditional engines with valve springs. 16 valves X average of 10,000 rpm X 45 minutes/race = about 7 million times per race that a valve spring gets compressed. If that doesn't rob horsepower then I don't know what does.
Ducati always has to have more displacement to keep up with the Japanese.
I didn't get the 765 moto2 they had last week, I got a 2004 st3.
Dry clutch for life.
The ducatistas don't feel like the 1199 and 1299 are bred ducatis, we are talking 1098s/r 1198 999s/r 916/998/996 those were the true ducatis. Regardless, a nice video mate, good looks.
Kawasaki and Rae kicking ducatis butt for for 8 years in SBK is the reason the V4 came back! V twin just can’t compete! You can see the improvements in motogp and sbk since v4 came out
"All engines consist of a bottom, to or lower end, and an upper, or top end..."
The Napier Deltic called and wants a word.
I just looked up both of these engines. I'm probably going to have nightmares tonight.
The R1 has the best exhaust note of all sport bikes. Inline 4 with the crossplane crank is music to my ears.
Side note, bevel drive Ducati’s of the 1970’s came in non-Desmo configurations too.
Thanks for another interesting and informative video Yam👍🏻
The Honda sounds better
Your mom sounds better.
I love all your vids but for me this was the best one so far! Thanks man!
Im a Ducati Biscotti guy but man cant deny the godly sound of an Aprillia RAV4.
They did not abandon twins. They did, however, develop the awesome Desmosedici out of necessity for racing purposes which why they sell bikes. End of story.
RSV4 sounds incredible, Panigale V4 sounds boring as hell
The music reminds me of Tom and Jerry haha. Nice.
You must mention the significance of the counter-rotating crank....handling.
You're going to talk about ducati engineering and you start by explaining how a four stroke works. You love that sound of your own voice.
Papa yam, why don't you get yourself an aprilia rsv4 for track days 😳
Inline 3, inline 6, boxer 6(too wide for racing but sounds wayyyyy better) >>>>
King Kenny rode a Yamaha TZ 700 which was basically two RD 350 mills slapped together like the Ducati V4 ,except it was an inline 4..
Now for the important shit when will we see Yammie noob thermal clothing to keep riding during this winter
I just looked at the 2022 Ducati advertisement and Ducati still offers V-twins?
It’s cool, but I wish a Japanese company would make a v4 supersport. The Vfr doesn’t count
It's about time
Can we get a review of that VFR?
Pretty please?
Spite actually has one up on his channel.
@@yammienoob Thanks Yamster, any chance you can throw a link to said channel?
I have had a Pantah for 26years. I am 'Ducatisti'. The new four is an expansion of Ducati's vision.
That Aprilia sounds like pure sex!
They're all good. Duc or Ape too, who's dissing any of these?
Only farm tractor Harleys deserve hating!!! 😂
Watched the whole vid and found no mention at all of low redline. I must of nodded off somewhere.
FINALLY !! I tell people about the Desmo valve system,, they look at me like I have a third eye. Personally, I feel my 1299S is the Icon of the Twin, so the future is in the V4. I have never ridden the V4 , will shortly when my 2020 Street Fighter arrives ..
I LOVE YOU YAMMIE
Great video 👍 Is the riding footage in Austin Texas?
clickity clackity like a coin in a tumble drier, some people love that noise and apparently others tune it out of their mind, personally i'd find it unbearable
I've got so many other subscriptions that I can't subscribe to your UA-cam channel if I wanted to anyways.
Likely, V-4’s will forever be my favorite configuration, but it raises a question: When the ICE age ends, will it be with a bang or a suck ‘n blow?
Thank you Jammie J for your service
OK , new video for you. we know RR always means "Race REady". so what does GSXR, ZXR, CBR and so on and so on mean. is there anything behind all the cool letters or just cool sales sound?!
Waiting for the V4 multistrada. Have ridden the V4s and I've got the multi 950. Combined, I think that is going to be my life goal to get one.
I pretty much love everything ducati does. I wish I could afford one of each.
They dumped the V twin because it's like you on a bike. Shit. It was only competitive in WSB because they were allowed to run a bigger engine displacement and on the street it had a bigger displacement to keep up with the smaller engined BMW and Kwakazaki bikes.
They don't have valve springs so they can charge you $400 for an oil service and as an excuse to run at lower RPM's.
If VFR had a open pipe like the other 2, you would have got something more comparable in sound.
I'm kind of a V-twin purist. I love my 748, I love my Monster (they sound glorious).
Panigale sucks, I owned a 959, and it's easily one of the worst sport bikes I've ever ridden on the street. It's probably excellent on the track, but everything about it is cramped, hot, uncomfortable, and cumbersome for road use, and it has the added benefit of attracting all kinds of unwanted attention.
The new V4 is epic. The older V-twins are also epic. There are still people that think the 916 series bikes are "the best" so theres lots of weird people around.. Then theres people like me that love the 999 and newer bikes. (maybe because i own a 999,1098 and panigale, but hey, if your hooked your hooked. And ofcourse a scrambler DS :p )
Yo, smelly poo - don't blame Ducati for Rossi's failure. He blamed the bike too. Casey won a world championship racing for Ducati.
What did Rossi achieve at Ducati?
Zero.
It's the man, not the machine.
L twin for the street L 4 for track.
Um, real question here:
Does yamaha R6's system valve suffer from valve float when it runs to max rpm which is 16k rpm?
The R6 has 150cc cylinders and tiny valves. It is a huge amount easier to control tiny valves for a 150cc cylinder than the much larger valves for a 600cc cylinder
@@paulstandeven8572 how about motogp?
@@adityajonathanmamahit2889 MotoGP bikes use pneumatic valves (except Ducati of course). Since they switched from classic valve springs to pneumatic ones they made a big step in terms of engine power.
Noticed you started using video footage of an MV Agusta F3 at 5:50 in, and again at 8:16 in. But the F3 is an inline 3 cylinder, right? Curious if the MV footage was an accident, or you just ran out of Ducati footage you could use? I certainly kept listening closely to see if you were going to mention MV for some reason. Fun, informative vid though!
In two words- Aprilia Tourneau
honda needs to bring back the rc and show them how a v4 should be. but I do like the hell out of the desmodromic valve actuation. and that rsv4 sounded awesome but need stock exhaust for fair comparison. and the new panigale v2 is almost an ideal bike
The vfr is my favourite V4 sound
Yammie asking whether we love or hate Ducati v4 and me asking myself wtf coz I haven't ridden a bike above 300 cc single cylinder 🤷♂️🤷♂️🤷♂️
Is the progress, but How many Superbike titles have the V2 vs V4?
Untill this day i dont know how "stoner" became a family name. It will be hard to held a party. Like example you asked by policeman, where are you going? Um, i got invited to stoner's party. Or why that place seem crowded? stoners held a reunion
Came here just to say that thumbnail looked like a jojo’s stand at first sight
I just have to wonder why you flashed a picture of Steve Wozniak near the end of the video. I'm a nerd so it's always good to see Woz but can't figure what he has to do with Ducati V-Twins.
Also less heat, less friction, and less cam and valve seat wear. And closer valve clearances.
V4 sounds like a single cylinder 🤣
Volkswagen owns Ducati figures they would destroy all the history
I actually thought the Duc sounded better; deeper throatier sounding by a tad
Desmo valves still have return Springs
The best V4 is 65° V4 used by both the RSV4 and VFR800..
I'm surprised you didnt include daytona destroyer to the intro 🤔
Aprilia sound was the best
In a perfect world Rossi would’ve stayed with Yamaha after the Honda departure and got the 10 wins slipped back some until recently I’d say maybe last year he’d switch to Ducati and get one last win maybe more then retire
Thank you for another great history lesson. Ducati is Italian. Looks great. Sounds great. Gotta love then.
Can the great people of MC design please re-introduce 6 cylinder engines? Gotta love the cbx1000 and z1300
Weight versus power is the issue here...
Ok, there's no doubt that the V4 Ducati sounds wicked, and the Honda is sweet in its own right...but the Aprillia's exhaust note is pure sex!
And sorry to disagree with your "fact" Yams, but Pomeranians rule the cute puppy world! POM POWER!!!