What percentage of post retirement spend is pre retirement, is it close to 100%? I know you have ACA from another episode. Also, how well defined was your time/schedule prior to retiring (like here is my bucket list I'm gonna do when retired) or did you not have that plan of how you would spend your time?
@@b2bfusion Hi there - do you mean is my post-retirement spend what it was pre-? That is basically true as for the 1.5 yrs before RE as we intentionally tracked spending and moved towards our retirement budget to ensure it "worked". I didn't make a bucket list nor really plan out my time. Yes, I had a short list of things I'd planned to do around the house and even some hobbies, but nothing more than that. It's largely been things I figured out as I went.
Since SS is based on your highest 35 years of earnings, did the possibility of a lower benefit (versus what you would have received if you continued to work) weigh into your RE decision? I'm glad when one of my lower teen earning years drops off my 35 year measurement. LOL!
@@KG-oe8oo Jason here - it didn't weigh in. I calculated my FI plans assuming zero income from SS - even though I believe this to be very unlikely. I hope it's still around and I most often model 50% funding of my calculated benefit to keep things conservative.
Really enjoying your conversations… I am 56 and pulling the FIRE trigger this week. Of all the podcasts out there, this is one of the most authentic and useful in my book. I’m wired a lot like Jason, and appreciate hearing his insights and experiences from “the other side”. Thanks guys… have a great 2023 and keep up the great work.
Thanks, Daniel! We really appreciate your support. Congratulations on crossing the finish line! Please keep us posted on how you're doing. Best wishes to you in all things
Loved this episode, especially the conversation toward the end. I retired early in 2016 at 51 yrs old and one of the challenges I didn't fully appreciate was that I reached the finish line and nobody else was there with me -- that is, my friends were still working.
@@TwoSidesOfFI Most valuable? Hmmmm, there are lots. I guess one of the most valuable discoveries is that my circle of friends got a lot smaller. It takes a lot of work for me to maintain friendships with people who are still working. We don't see each other as regularly (i.e., at work) and we now have less in common. We had similar lives before I retired -- we had challenging and stimulating (and stressful) jobs, achieved and celebrated work-related goals, saved for retirement, made the most of the relatively scarce free time, etc. They still live in that world, are still immersed in that energy. I, on the other hand, have a pretty stress-free life and have minimal interest in anything related to my former profession. I take a 5-mile walk each morning while I listen to podcasts (like yours!), rest easy knowing I can live below my means, and am more interested in the well-being and welfare of the people in my community. In short, my interests are much different and so is the pace of my life, and that has forced me to initiate and cultivate new friendships with people who live on a similar "frequency" to the one I have now.
Good discussion as usual. I'm 6 months into retirement (retired at 60) and still trying to figure out what I want to do with all this free time. Have started up some hobbies and enjoy them, but find some days I'm quite antsy and looking for something else to do. One thing I have told people is that no matter how bored I am some days, I don't miss working and do not want to ever go back to a 40-60 hour work week. I love having all the free time and know I'll eventually find things that I like to do. And you both mentioned friends. It's a strange thing that happens as you get older in that most people, especially men, find the number of friends they have gets less and less. Just something that happens over time. Kind of sad in a way that we lose connections with so many people, but statistics all show it's something that happens to most men.
Thanks, Scott. We wish you all the best in finding things to fill your time that excite and fulfill you. Also, you're quite right about friends. Definitely makes us appreciate the really good friends that we do have, right? Best wishes to you.
1) Wouldn't you do better putting your cash reserves in CDs vs. T bills? I didn't find the logic in that. 2) Love hearing how you are wired Jason. I have long said that I would have been the happiest person in the world if I were given the opportunity to be paid to just study and learn for a living! You are the first person I have ever heard approximate that approach in my lifetime (and I'm older than you)!
There are a number of factors to consider when looking at CDs vs T-bills, and they do change with conditions (for example, lately CD rates are looking more favorable). Here's an article that summarize some of the key points: www.bankrate.com/banking/cds/bonds-vs-cds/#compare Thanks! I do love learning more than most things. Stay tuned for more updates on my latest undertakings :) Best wishes to you! -Jason
Great episode guys. Always look forward to your videos. Have you thought about gardening as a passion project? I find that this is my real creative outlet and gives me a lot of peace and satisfaction. BTW, hope you are staying safe with all of the rain we have been getting in CA. It has been basically non stop rain/wind in the Bay Area for the last 2 weeks. Hope you guys have a great 2023.
Jason here - thanks! Gardening is a great idea. My wife is more into it than me but I do my part on the manual labor side of things :) we are doing well with all the rain, thanks for asking. Best wishes to you in all things!
@@TwoSidesOfFI good to hear. its sounds crazy but the manual labor part is very satisfying. We live on a hillside and basically have to haul all supplies to the house/yard (including numerous pallets of stones/dirt, etc.. to build walls, paths, etc.). a labor of love i guess.
New listener to your show! Love this episode and Jason's discussion on his open space in his schedule. I'm also a polymath and the way he described how he likes to invest in hobbies is the same way I think about it. I'm 37 and a while from FI, so your show is super insightful for me!
Thanks for the information. I've started to think about what I'll do with all the time and Jasons comments resonate well with what I hope to do being an early bird as well.
great show-fyi newly retired and i have about 7 years in 2 to 5 year treasuries, extreme but keeps a cash equivalent giving me some income. In about 5 years i will wind that down into a higher stock %.
Jason here - Thanks! Glad you liked it. Belated congrats on your retirement! I do have a lot of my fixed income allocation in an intermediate treasury ETF but only hold short term bills as part of my cash allocation. What is your asset allocation (high level is fine)?
@@TwoSidesOfFI have broken out into deferred accounts which are about 60 stocks/40 bonds and roth which is about 75/25. my deferred holds the treasury (fund) which is a bit higher than i want to keep it long term. i will pull from that as long as stocks are down and rebalance. It's a by the skin of my teeth retirement, but no debt and looks like it might work lol. picked a hell of a year to retire. (only 61)
First of all, congrats to Jason for making into 30months of post FI mark! Your contents are so relatable, and useful to project how it's like to as one data point. I love watching your channel whenever I find my free time. I would love to know how Jason will work out finding his community/tribes as I had impression there are not many early FIRE ppl from his existing friends groups.
Jason here - Thanks so much, Jennie! We really appreciate the feedback and your support. You've asked an important question. For now I'd say I keep the FIRE engagements to that community for the post part. They simply aren't that relatable to people on a different path. So interacting with our audience, on social media, and via a FIRE-themed Discord server is where I get meet most of that need. Naturally I still stay in regular contact with existing friends - and have made some new ones after moving! But we don't spend tons of time talking about my FIRE path + the concept as a whole.
@@TwoSidesOfFI Thank you Jason for the comment, same here too! most of my regular friends and family members around me doesn't know much about the concept of FI or FIRE (or not interested in), I'm super grateful finding communities like here to communicate with the same minded ppl :)
I really appreciate these conversations! I’d also be happy to pay for some of Jason’s time for a portfolio review once I get there if he gets some kind of certification or etc. Not that he needs to monetize the knowledge, but I’m sure the demand is there from this community if he decides to do something with it 😊
Less than 4 months until FIRE(ish). The options and preparations can be overwhelming, but I think I have a very good plan. If not, you may see me greeting at your local box store.
Great show, love the conversation between both of you. I have learned so much from both of you. I'm hoping to retire in a year, so building my cash bucket now and plan on using T bills as part of that bucket. Jason- would love to have your thoughts on my plan, you would be a great advisor!
Love your show! I was considering buying new issue T-bills but then I'm wondering if buying "BILS" ETF is easier. Do individual t-bills offer major advantages over this etf?
Thinking of white space, this is one of the things I'm looking forward to when we move to Portugal is because everyone that's a retired immigrant there is going to be in a very similar situation as me so I won't have the same problem you are experiencing here in the US.
Portugal is wonderful! I don't actually view the white space as a problem - it's an opportunity, and represents time to fill with all the things I want to do that day/week/month. Best wishes to you -Jason
Interesting to see how decisions change regarding I Bonds and T Bills. I like that your decisions are fluid and not set in stone. Wait, Eric just threw in there at the end of the T Bill conversation that it didn't make sense for him since he is still accumulating. Why is that? Every time I think I have things figured out, I don't. LOL!
Hi K G...Eric here chiming in. Of course you'll want to think about this through your own personal financial lens and that will be different based on your financial goals, tax situation, etc. This is how I look at it: in the accumulation phase (where I am) I'm not trying to generate cash. Generating cash for me is just a tax drag especially while I'm in my peak earnings years. This diminishes the actual returns for any interest bearing investment (like TBills). For me, I'd rather invest in equities in both tax advantaged and taxable accounts as I believe the long-term returns will not only beat today's interest rates but outpace inflation (thus why I'm not investing in iBonds either). For Jason, this is different. In retirement, he's actively trying to generate cash every six months. He's also able to manage his income tax bracket and so it makes sense for him to use instruments that do that as close to the risk-free rate of return as possible. Right now tBills are a reasonably safe way to do that (not investment advice, as you know!) Good luck and thanks for watching! -Eric
@@TwoSidesOfFI thanks for the reply, Eric! It makes total sense. I was recently thinking about this as well. Although I am pre-retirement, I am on the cusp of a lower tax bracket and cashing in I Bonds or earning interest on T Bills could impact that. Interest rates are better than they have been so they are enticing (although still not keeping up with inflation) but if I needed cash, had to sell some stocks and had capital gains, they would be taxed at a lower rate - if I don't need cash, that money is invested WHEN the market recovers! Thanks so much to both of you. I come from a non investing family and I'm late to the investing game but thanks to you and Jason, I have started to consistently invest in a non retirement account. (Better late that never!) Despite proving to myself years ago that the market out performs safer investments, I was still afraid to take that leap. I'm not afraid any more - I need my engine running to get me to retirement!
As usually, great conversation! Jason, good to see you are doing better than fine 2.5 years after RE, and by the way, you could send me any Star Wars related item any time 😆 Not a problem at all! 👍 MTFBWY Keep on with this project, really enjoying your conversations Thanks
There certainly are people in the community who've done it. Naturally, the earlier you start, the easier the path. Best wishes to you in whatever you do
@@TwoSidesOfFI thanks for replying. That is good to know. We have a great nest egg in retirement accounts (which took a beating last year). The key seems to be lifestyle and getting everyone on the same page. Never easy!
What questions do you have for Jason about his first 2.5 yrs of early retirement?
What percentage of post retirement spend is pre retirement, is it close to 100%? I know you have ACA from another episode. Also, how well defined was your time/schedule prior to retiring (like here is my bucket list I'm gonna do when retired) or did you not have that plan of how you would spend your time?
@@b2bfusion Hi there - do you mean is my post-retirement spend what it was pre-? That is basically true as for the 1.5 yrs before RE as we intentionally tracked spending and moved towards our retirement budget to ensure it "worked". I didn't make a bucket list nor really plan out my time. Yes, I had a short list of things I'd planned to do around the house and even some hobbies, but nothing more than that. It's largely been things I figured out as I went.
Since SS is based on your highest 35 years of earnings, did the possibility of a lower benefit (versus what you would have received if you continued to work) weigh into your RE decision? I'm glad when one of my lower teen earning years drops off my 35 year measurement. LOL!
@@KG-oe8oo Jason here - it didn't weigh in. I calculated my FI plans assuming zero income from SS - even though I believe this to be very unlikely. I hope it's still around and I most often model 50% funding of my calculated benefit to keep things conservative.
Really enjoying your conversations… I am 56 and pulling the FIRE trigger this week. Of all the podcasts out there, this is one of the most authentic and useful in my book. I’m wired a lot like Jason, and appreciate hearing his insights and experiences from “the other side”. Thanks guys… have a great 2023 and keep up the great work.
Thanks, Daniel! We really appreciate your support. Congratulations on crossing the finish line! Please keep us posted on how you're doing. Best wishes to you in all things
Loved this episode, especially the conversation toward the end. I retired early in 2016 at 51 yrs old and one of the challenges I didn't fully appreciate was that I reached the finish line and nobody else was there with me -- that is, my friends were still working.
Thanks, Tim. What's the most valuable lesson you've learned in the time since you retired?
@@TwoSidesOfFI Most valuable? Hmmmm, there are lots. I guess one of the most valuable discoveries is that my circle of friends got a lot smaller. It takes a lot of work for me to maintain friendships with people who are still working. We don't see each other as regularly (i.e., at work) and we now have less in common. We had similar lives before I retired -- we had challenging and stimulating (and stressful) jobs, achieved and celebrated work-related goals, saved for retirement, made the most of the relatively scarce free time, etc. They still live in that world, are still immersed in that energy. I, on the other hand, have a pretty stress-free life and have minimal interest in anything related to my former profession. I take a 5-mile walk each morning while I listen to podcasts (like yours!), rest easy knowing I can live below my means, and am more interested in the well-being and welfare of the people in my community. In short, my interests are much different and so is the pace of my life, and that has forced me to initiate and cultivate new friendships with people who live on a similar "frequency" to the one I have now.
@@TimSmith-er7dq Thanks for sharing! We sound pretty well aligned on these points. Best wishes to you, Jason
Good discussion as usual. I'm 6 months into retirement (retired at 60) and still trying to figure out what I want to do with all this free time. Have started up some hobbies and enjoy them, but find some days I'm quite antsy and looking for something else to do. One thing I have told people is that no matter how bored I am some days, I don't miss working and do not want to ever go back to a 40-60 hour work week. I love having all the free time and know I'll eventually find things that I like to do.
And you both mentioned friends. It's a strange thing that happens as you get older in that most people, especially men, find the number of friends they have gets less and less. Just something that happens over time. Kind of sad in a way that we lose connections with so many people, but statistics all show it's something that happens to most men.
Thanks, Scott. We wish you all the best in finding things to fill your time that excite and fulfill you. Also, you're quite right about friends. Definitely makes us appreciate the really good friends that we do have, right? Best wishes to you.
This is another one of your top ten episodes. There is too little discussion in the FIRE community about life after RE. Jason is killing it!!
Thanks so much for the kind words. We really appreciate the support
Would love to hear more about the courses and the course work you are taking and how to get into it. Sounds very useful.
I enjoy listening to Jason's perspective on learning as a lifetime engagement. I'm attempting to adapt this view on white space now.
Thank you! -Jason
1) Wouldn't you do better putting your cash reserves in CDs vs. T bills? I didn't find the logic in that. 2) Love hearing how you are wired Jason. I have long said that I would have been the happiest person in the world if I were given the opportunity to be paid to just study and learn for a living! You are the first person I have ever heard approximate that approach in my lifetime (and I'm older than you)!
There are a number of factors to consider when looking at CDs vs T-bills, and they do change with conditions (for example, lately CD rates are looking more favorable). Here's an article that summarize some of the key points: www.bankrate.com/banking/cds/bonds-vs-cds/#compare
Thanks! I do love learning more than most things. Stay tuned for more updates on my latest undertakings :) Best wishes to you! -Jason
Great episode guys. Always look forward to your videos. Have you thought about gardening as a passion project? I find that this is my real creative outlet and gives me a lot of peace and satisfaction. BTW, hope you are staying safe with all of the rain we have been getting in CA. It has been basically non stop rain/wind in the Bay Area for the last 2 weeks. Hope you guys have a great 2023.
Jason here - thanks! Gardening is a great idea. My wife is more into it than me but I do my part on the manual labor side of things :) we are doing well with all the rain, thanks for asking. Best wishes to you in all things!
@@TwoSidesOfFI good to hear. its sounds crazy but the manual labor part is very satisfying. We live on a hillside and basically have to haul all supplies to the house/yard (including numerous pallets of stones/dirt, etc.. to build walls, paths, etc.). a labor of love i guess.
New listener to your show! Love this episode and Jason's discussion on his open space in his schedule. I'm also a polymath and the way he described how he likes to invest in hobbies is the same way I think about it. I'm 37 and a while from FI, so your show is super insightful for me!
Welcome, Cyrus! Thanks so much for the feedback. Best wishes to you on your journey
Thanks guys. As someone still adjusting to the RE world, these frank discussions about life after RE are helpful.
You’re welcome, Dean! Thanks for your support
25 months to go. Good luck!
Cheers, Ray...thanks!
28:00 Nailed it!!! "...people wanting to decide how i spend my time."
Thanks for the information. I've started to think about what I'll do with all the time and Jasons comments resonate well with what I hope to do being an early bird as well.
You're welcome. Best wishes to you, Ray
Thank you for sharing and very insightful. Really enjoyed the perspectives.
Thank you, Marco
the show must go on at the very least until two sides of FI becomes same side of FI 😊 thanks guys for letting us in on your journeys
great show-fyi newly retired and i have about 7 years in 2 to 5 year treasuries, extreme but keeps a cash equivalent giving me some income. In about 5 years i will wind that down into a higher stock %.
Jason here - Thanks! Glad you liked it. Belated congrats on your retirement! I do have a lot of my fixed income allocation in an intermediate treasury ETF but only hold short term bills as part of my cash allocation. What is your asset allocation (high level is fine)?
@@TwoSidesOfFI have broken out into deferred accounts which are about 60 stocks/40 bonds and roth which is about 75/25. my deferred holds the treasury (fund) which is a bit higher than i want to keep it long term. i will pull from that as long as stocks are down and rebalance. It's a by the skin of my teeth retirement, but no debt and looks like it might work lol. picked a hell of a year to retire. (only 61)
First of all, congrats to Jason for making into 30months of post FI mark! Your contents are so relatable, and useful to project how it's like to as one data point. I love watching your channel whenever I find my free time. I would love to know how Jason will work out finding his community/tribes as I had impression there are not many early FIRE ppl from his existing friends groups.
Jason here - Thanks so much, Jennie! We really appreciate the feedback and your support. You've asked an important question. For now I'd say I keep the FIRE engagements to that community for the post part. They simply aren't that relatable to people on a different path. So interacting with our audience, on social media, and via a FIRE-themed Discord server is where I get meet most of that need. Naturally I still stay in regular contact with existing friends - and have made some new ones after moving! But we don't spend tons of time talking about my FIRE path + the concept as a whole.
@@TwoSidesOfFI Thank you Jason for the comment, same here too! most of my regular friends and family members around me doesn't know much about the concept of FI or FIRE (or not interested in), I'm super grateful finding communities like here to communicate with the same minded ppl :)
I really appreciate these conversations! I’d also be happy to pay for some of Jason’s time for a portfolio review once I get there if he gets some kind of certification or etc. Not that he needs to monetize the knowledge, but I’m sure the demand is there from this community if he decides to do something with it 😊
Thanks for your support and confidence, Katherine!
Great show again!
This show, ChooseFI and The MadFientist are always on repeat in my headphones.
Cheers...that's good company for us! Appreciate that!
-eric
Less than 4 months until FIRE(ish). The options and preparations can be overwhelming, but I think I have a very good plan. If not, you may see me greeting at your local box store.
Best wishes to you on achieving all your goals with your plan!
Financial course sounds awesome, actually... I plan to do that as well, when I retire from my current job
Great!
Great show, love the conversation between both of you. I have learned so much from both of you. I'm hoping to retire in a year, so building my cash bucket now and plan on using T bills as part of that bucket. Jason- would love to have your thoughts on my plan, you would be a great advisor!
Thank you! Best wishes to you in achieving all your goals. if I decide to go the advisement route I'll be sure to share that here.
Love your show!
I was considering buying new issue T-bills but then I'm wondering if buying "BILS" ETF is easier. Do individual t-bills offer major advantages over this etf?
Thanks! You may find this thread useful. www.bogleheads.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=384351
A man I admire is a polymath. Bruce Dickinson is a rock star, airline pilot, competitive fencer, author, business owner, blogger.....
Great choice - us too! Bruce is a tour de force for sure.
Hey Jason, if you want a practice case for your CFP class, I'm your gal! LOL!
Thanks for the confidence, K G! -Jason
Thinking of white space, this is one of the things I'm looking forward to when we move to Portugal is because everyone that's a retired immigrant there is going to be in a very similar situation as me so I won't have the same problem you are experiencing here in the US.
Portugal is wonderful! I don't actually view the white space as a problem - it's an opportunity, and represents time to fill with all the things I want to do that day/week/month. Best wishes to you -Jason
@@TwoSidesOfFI Someone asked me the other day, "what are you going to do with all that free time?" I said, "anything I want, all the time."
@@rickchandler2570 💯 I have never, ever, been bored!
Interesting to see how decisions change regarding I Bonds and T Bills. I like that your decisions are fluid and not set in stone.
Wait, Eric just threw in there at the end of the T Bill conversation that it didn't make sense for him since he is still accumulating. Why is that?
Every time I think I have things figured out, I don't. LOL!
Hi K G...Eric here chiming in. Of course you'll want to think about this through your own personal financial lens and that will be different based on your financial goals, tax situation, etc.
This is how I look at it: in the accumulation phase (where I am) I'm not trying to generate cash. Generating cash for me is just a tax drag especially while I'm in my peak earnings years. This diminishes the actual returns for any interest bearing investment (like TBills). For me, I'd rather invest in equities in both tax advantaged and taxable accounts as I believe the long-term returns will not only beat today's interest rates but outpace inflation (thus why I'm not investing in iBonds either).
For Jason, this is different. In retirement, he's actively trying to generate cash every six months. He's also able to manage his income tax bracket and so it makes sense for him to use instruments that do that as close to the risk-free rate of return as possible. Right now tBills are a reasonably safe way to do that (not investment advice, as you know!)
Good luck and thanks for watching!
-Eric
@@TwoSidesOfFI thanks for the reply, Eric! It makes total sense. I was recently thinking about this as well. Although I am pre-retirement, I am on the cusp of a lower tax bracket and cashing in I Bonds or earning interest on T Bills could impact that.
Interest rates are better than they have been so they are enticing (although still not keeping up with inflation) but if I needed cash, had to sell some stocks and had capital gains, they would be taxed at a lower rate - if I don't need cash, that money is invested WHEN the market recovers!
Thanks so much to both of you. I come from a non investing family and I'm late to the investing game but thanks to you and Jason, I have started to consistently invest in a non retirement account. (Better late that never!)
Despite proving to myself years ago that the market out performs safer investments, I was still afraid to take that leap. I'm not afraid any more - I need my engine running to get me to retirement!
Hey Jason, you can text me about Star Wars anytime 😂
As usually, great conversation!
Jason, good to see you are doing better than fine 2.5 years after RE, and by the way, you could send me any Star Wars related item any time 😆 Not a problem at all! 👍 MTFBWY
Keep on with this project, really enjoying your conversations
Thanks
Thanks, Enrique! We'll keep the Star Wars coming :) Bad Batch season 2 started today and that was a fun watch -Jason
@@TwoSidesOfFI Yes, just watched both episodes, fun as expected!
Why not utilize high yield savings? This way you don't have to worry about liquidity and only losing a few bp against t-bills.
I use both. I have one year of cash in HYSA and another in T-bills. -Jason
What resources are you using to study for the Series 65?
Kaplan. You will find a link in the show notes, which are always listed in the video description.
twosidesoffi.com/30months/
When both of you are RE you can have someone else on that is not there yet 😊
My toxic trait is being 45 with 4 kids and thinking I can do this 😂
There certainly are people in the community who've done it. Naturally, the earlier you start, the easier the path. Best wishes to you in whatever you do
@@TwoSidesOfFI thanks for replying. That is good to know. We have a great nest egg in retirement accounts (which took a beating last year). The key seems to be lifestyle and getting everyone on the same page. Never easy!