Some times you can use a clay flower pot to isolate the cathodes. The copper from the anode will flow through the pot to the cathode on the inside of the pot and your slimes will stay outside the pot kind of like an electrolytic filter of sorts. Also using a low flow pump to keep movement in your electrolyte can help efficiency.
I think the most interesting content of videos are the ones like yours. I applaud your efforts and ingenuity. Btw, best way to stop bleeding and seal a cut is with portland cement. No band-aid required. Best way to find a cut is with pvc purple primer.
I've done the same with what people refer to as "Gold Drop Bars" that is, Gold plated IDE pins melted down and made into ingots. I used to use a sulfuric acid stripping cell and a copper basket to de-plate pins, but most of the time a lot of the pins refuse to de-plate, causing me to have to re-run the same pins several times in the basket to completely de-plate them. I've found that melting the pins and making the ingots gets all of the gold, and also gives me some nice copper crystals as a by-product of the operation. I run my cell with just 1 bar and a length of copper wire. I set my voltage to about 2 volts at a very low current, about 3/4 of an amp. It takes a super long time, about a month to completely dissolve the ingot, but the crystal growth is consistent and SOLID. the growth you are experiencing is the result of high current (fast growth) and too high of voltage. The distance between the anode and cathode in my cell is about 5-6 inches, while yours is about 1 inch?
I would guess that the difference in bright and dark areas is difference in electrolyte concentration. It's easy to get a dens lower layer and a depleted upper layer unless you have some circulation of the electrolyte. If you check the design of large copper refinery they always circulate the electrolyte. It can also be from varying oxygen levels, a depleted lower layer and a higher area where the oxygen from the atmosphere diffuses down into the electrolyte. With your meter you could check the density of the electrolyte near the surface and compare it to a sample drawn deeper down.
That is not the color of cathodic copper. It almost looks like impurities are just being carried over by too high a field potential. (Too high a cell potential in turn causing too low a cell current)
The difference is current density. It’s always highest at the corners. Lowest in inside curves and blind holes. OP should be using a sheet of pure copper to plate from, parallel to the impure copper anode. A Dacron anode bag, to collect the anode slime would help. As would easy air circulation.
Hi Mike, Great update! Fascinating how minor changes affect the copper transfer. Appreciate your "R&D" on this project! Big learning curve. Take Care, Jim
This is really interesting and I am enjoying watching this series. I am watching the videos in order and I have not read any of the other comments. You said you were worried that the cathodes may not weigh enough and might not make a very good connection on the rails. What if you flattened the wire of the cathodes that sits on the rails to give them more surface area to touch the rails? You would have a better connectivity that way.
I think you need to have more equality in surface area comparatively between the anode and cathodes respectively. The quick buildup on the cathodes between days 5-8 is probably due to the larger surface area as the buildup occurs. Would using a thin plate of copper similar in size to your anodes be a better cathode shape instead of the wire shape?
Maybe you could look into making a solar powered cell connected to a car battery. The Sun would run the cell while simultaneously charging the battery during the day and running on the stored charge of the battery at night. Kind of a waste of a good solar panel, but if you have one lying around, try it!
I was without reliable power in my workshop for about six months due to construction work. I've only recently got it reconnected. I was seriously considering putting in some solar panels. I may yet do that.
I would really try to swap out your electrolyte for copper sulfate. Sulfuric acid is much more electrolytically inert than nitric. When you plate the copper out of the copper nitrate, you have nitric acid which is consuming copper when it isn’t being destroyed by electrolysis. Have you smelled any nitrogen dioxide in your shop while doing this experiment? Please be careful! If it’s a matter of just wanting to use what you have, there’s a great Nurdrage video about reclaiming nitric acid from waste copper nitrate by adding sulfuric acid which reacts to form copper sulfate and nitric acid, where the nitric can be distilled off and the copper sulfate is left behind and electrolyzed with a platinum anode to plate the copper back out. I’ve been able to refine over 4kg of sterling silver using ONLY nitric acid and copper reclaimed from a modified version of this method! You can skip the whole distillation step if you’re only after the copper sulfate by putting it in the freezer after you add the sulfuric acid which causes the copper sulfate to crash out which you can redissolve and use. If you don’t want to buy the sulfuric acid, I’ll send you some of my reclaimed copper sulfate! Let me know by responding to my comment and I’ll contact you through your website. Happy to help a fellow amateur electrochemist!
No noticeable nitrogen dioxide so far. I may switch to copper sulfate to do the next set of anodes. Or maybe I will continue with the copper nitrate solution I already have. I'll make a decision after this set of anodes is done.
btw. I woouldn't trust that current meter so much. I saw it stick in the first video when you where wobling the VarIAC. baybe tick on it a bit for more acurate reading.
You could only plate out more Copper I think when there is SIlver in the Kathodes. 1 Ag will go in solution and 2 Cu will plate out. Check elctrovalence of the metals. There is an exact electron balance in the cell.
It's going to take some time to tell. I'm only half way through dissolving this set of anodes. Probably averaging 3A at around 1V. That's only three Watts. Figure 50% efficiency in the power supply, so maybe six watts. Times however long this takes to get Watt-hours. Divide by 1000 and multiply by my electricity cost per KWH. It won't be much.
Please tell me how to deploy the AP solution, I was tried to find it in other of your video, but your video is too much that I hard to find 😅, most important things I would like to know is how many % is the HCI and H2O2.
FOR HYDROGEN PLATINUM IS NEEDED.sell gold buy platinum.price is low now.. follow platinum strategy...price will rise like gold promote platinum.......//
Some times you can use a clay flower pot to isolate the cathodes. The copper from the anode will flow through the pot to the cathode on the inside of the pot and your slimes will stay outside the pot kind of like an electrolytic filter of sorts. Also using a low flow pump to keep movement in your electrolyte can help efficiency.
You can try putting dacron bags around the anodes to contain most of the slimes so it won't matter if copper falls into the electrolyte
Make little saddles in the rails for each anode and cathode wire. This will give more surface contact for conduction.
Of all the gold refining programs I watch, this experiment is the most interesting. I look forward to each update. Brilliant!
I think the most interesting content of videos are the ones like yours. I applaud your efforts and ingenuity. Btw, best way to stop bleeding and seal a cut is with portland cement. No band-aid required. Best way to find a cut is with pvc purple primer.
I've done the same with what people refer to as "Gold Drop Bars" that is, Gold plated IDE pins melted down and made into ingots. I used to use a sulfuric acid stripping cell and a copper basket to de-plate pins, but most of the time a lot of the pins refuse to de-plate, causing me to have to re-run the same pins several times in the basket to completely de-plate them.
I've found that melting the pins and making the ingots gets all of the gold, and also gives me some nice copper crystals as a by-product of the operation.
I run my cell with just 1 bar and a length of copper wire. I set my voltage to about 2 volts at a very low current, about 3/4 of an amp. It takes a super long time, about a month to completely dissolve the ingot, but the crystal growth is consistent and SOLID. the growth you are experiencing is the result of high current (fast growth) and too high of voltage. The distance between the anode and cathode in my cell is about 5-6 inches, while yours is about 1 inch?
I would guess that the difference in bright and dark areas is difference in electrolyte concentration. It's easy to get a dens lower layer and a depleted upper layer unless you have some circulation of the electrolyte. If you check the design of large copper refinery they always circulate the electrolyte.
It can also be from varying oxygen levels, a depleted lower layer and a higher area where the oxygen from the atmosphere diffuses down into the electrolyte.
With your meter you could check the density of the electrolyte near the surface and compare it to a sample drawn deeper down.
That is not the color of cathodic copper. It almost looks like impurities are just being carried over by too high a field potential. (Too high a cell potential in turn causing too low a cell current)
The difference is current density. It’s always highest at the corners. Lowest in inside curves and blind holes.
OP should be using a sheet of pure copper to plate from, parallel to the impure copper anode. A Dacron anode bag, to collect the anode slime would help. As would easy air circulation.
Hi Mike, Great update! Fascinating how minor changes affect the copper transfer. Appreciate your "R&D" on this project! Big learning curve. Take Care, Jim
It's cool watching the copper grow!
Thats working right along! Thanks for putting this out there!!
This is really interesting and I am enjoying watching this series. I am watching the videos in order and I have not read any of the other comments. You said you were worried that the cathodes may not weigh enough and might not make a very good connection on the rails. What if you flattened the wire of the cathodes that sits on the rails to give them more surface area to touch the rails? You would have a better connectivity that way.
It will be interesting to see how this progresses. I was also going to suggest flat plates and then voila. 👍
Add a bubbler to help circulate the electrolyte.
I think you need to have more equality in surface area comparatively between the anode and cathodes respectively. The quick buildup on the cathodes between days 5-8 is probably due to the larger surface area as the buildup occurs. Would using a thin plate of copper similar in size to your anodes be a better cathode shape instead of the wire shape?
Lol I should have waited till the end of the video before commenting, halfway through you made exactly what I was thinking 🤔😂😂
@@Reasonist the same thing happened to me in the first video about this!
Another very interesting video in this series, thank you! Those new cathodes look better IMO
Maybe the dark and light color variation is caused by some stratification in the electrolyte solution. Idk tho
It's friggin hot here in Australia 🇦🇺 sitting at work in front of the fan.
It may be that you picked up some of your "slimes" into your Copper because you used a mix of Nitrate/Sulphate. Try using Sulphate only.
Até que o resultado depois de 12 dias rendeu parabéns pela recuperação, De cobre.👏👏👏👏👏
Maybe you could look into making a solar powered cell connected to a car battery. The Sun would run the cell while simultaneously charging the battery during the day and running on the stored charge of the battery at night. Kind of a waste of a good solar panel, but if you have one lying around, try it!
I was without reliable power in my workshop for about six months due to construction work. I've only recently got it reconnected. I was seriously considering putting in some solar panels. I may yet do that.
I would really try to swap out your electrolyte for copper sulfate. Sulfuric acid is much more electrolytically inert than nitric. When you plate the copper out of the copper nitrate, you have nitric acid which is consuming copper when it isn’t being destroyed by electrolysis. Have you smelled any nitrogen dioxide in your shop while doing this experiment? Please be careful!
If it’s a matter of just wanting to use what you have, there’s a great Nurdrage video about reclaiming nitric acid from waste copper nitrate by adding sulfuric acid which reacts to form copper sulfate and nitric acid, where the nitric can be distilled off and the copper sulfate is left behind and electrolyzed with a platinum anode to plate the copper back out. I’ve been able to refine over 4kg of sterling silver using ONLY nitric acid and copper reclaimed from a modified version of this method!
You can skip the whole distillation step if you’re only after the copper sulfate by putting it in the freezer after you add the sulfuric acid which causes the copper sulfate to crash out which you can redissolve and use.
If you don’t want to buy the sulfuric acid, I’ll send you some of my reclaimed copper sulfate! Let me know by responding to my comment and I’ll contact you through your website. Happy to help a fellow amateur electrochemist!
No noticeable nitrogen dioxide so far. I may switch to copper sulfate to do the next set of anodes. Or maybe I will continue with the copper nitrate solution I already have. I'll make a decision after this set of anodes is done.
hmm..difference in colour due to difference in density of the electrolyte in the cell? Just a wild guess.
btw. I woouldn't trust that current meter so much. I saw it stick in the first video when you where wobling the VarIAC. baybe tick on it a bit for more acurate reading.
Also resistance is a factor that has high influence in these low voltage systems. Try keep contact resistance as low as possible.
You could only plate out more Copper I think when there is SIlver in the Kathodes. 1 Ag will go in solution and 2 Cu will plate out. Check elctrovalence of the metals. There is an exact electron balance in the cell.
I have seen someone use stainless steel plates and the cemented copper just peels off in sheets fairly easily
Will you have to further refine this after your done?
I won't be further refining the copper. I am expecting It will take a fair amount of work to get the precious metals out of the anode slimes though.
Use stainless steel sheet for cathodes
What do you think your electricity costs are?
It's going to take some time to tell. I'm only half way through dissolving this set of anodes. Probably averaging 3A at around 1V. That's only three Watts. Figure 50% efficiency in the power supply, so maybe six watts. Times however long this takes to get Watt-hours. Divide by 1000 and multiply by my electricity cost per KWH. It won't be much.
Please tell me how to deploy the AP solution, I was tried to find it in other of your video, but your video is too much that I hard to find 😅, most important things I would like to know is how many % is the HCI and H2O2.
can't you melt and remake your cathode out of that copper
It’s coming out of the nitric solution
You really don't need band aids, just paper towel and electrical tape.
I've done that many times.
I had a friend that told me her dad used to put two pipes in the bank of a river connected to a battery 🤪
The extra copper came from your copper nitrate probably
go to the scrap yard. I picked up 1/8 plate of copper 12" x 10" cheap
I charge extra when I bleed ;)
I'll be sure to bill myself accordingly.
FOR HYDROGEN PLATINUM IS NEEDED.sell gold buy platinum.price is low now.. follow platinum strategy...price will rise like gold promote platinum.......//