@@danieltaylor3231 well jump to 5:14 to hear the actual demo. This tip was brought to you by the Anti Waffle Bullshit League. AWBL - Protecting your precious time from overtalkers since 2008.
THis is the most helpful demonstration/comparison that I have come across in over 2 years of researching which VST that I should go with, not to mention the nicely written piece you have composed. While they all have strengths, I think finally I can narrow down which program I want. THANK YOU SO MUCH!
Indeed but I have the impression the Berlin Strings are closer micd than e.g. the hollywood Strings. Personally I like close micing better. You can still fake the effect of far micing with effects but the other way round is impossible
Berlin are good but not the best here. In the complete section LASS sounded so rich, you could also hear the authentic bite of the strings. Berlin does have good expression, and does runs pretty well. Hollywood strings sound beautiful in a complete section. You can hear the romance in the layers and it's not as in your face loud like Berlin. Personally I wouldn't bother with Adagio
Out of all the UA-cam 'comparison vids' out there, this is one of the best I've seen, particularly because of the simple approach taken - you get to 'hear' each different default product up close and personal. Really, really helpful and informative! Thank you.
I suspect the Berlin Strings and Adagio Strings sound better because they use fewer players, and are therefore more detailed. These might be the best choices for a smaller orchestra. LA Scoring Strings and Hollywood Strings use more players, and therefore are probably better suited to a bigger orchestra. For those who might be interested: Berlin Strings 1st vln = 8 2nd vln = 6 vla = 5 vcl = 5 db = 4 Hollywood Strings 1st vln = 16 2nd vln = 14 vla = 10 vcl = 10 db = 7 LA Scoring Strings 1st vln = 16 2nd vln = 16 vla = 12 vcl = 10 db = 8 Adagio Strings vln = 11 vla = 7 vcl = 6 db = 4
To me, BS is the best sounding library of all available string libraries.. HS is for epic hollywood -style themes, it sounds so great and real in its own way, but it is hard to use (i love bow chages a lot!!). LA is very unique, real and nice woody sounding library. It is more intimate sounding library than many others and definetly more intimate than HW. Adagio has too many artifacts, but it can sound very very beautiful (i like Adagio transitions and legatos).
my measure of Rating a string sample library is as follows: to me, legato strings make my heart swoon and sigh while string runs shake me up, which is due to the Dynamics of the Instruments. most libraries dont come with such Dynamics, but the Berlin strings do so perfectly well. I LOVE their Sound, it's incredibly full and voluminous.
Fantastic work, mate. Can't wait to see more of these from you as they are a huge help. Would love to see you do a Let's Compose series as well where we can spend a few hours watching you from start to finish working on a song. I'm especially interested in seeing how I can get more out of Hollywood Orchestra
To my surprise, Adagio seems below the rest, and I prefer LASS to Hollywood. I never expected that. Berlin is probably my favourite, but not 150GB of my hard drive better than LASS.
About expressivity and emotion Hollywood String is really surprising. In solo mode, it's not easy to make the difference. But inside the orchestration HS are really effective and more realistic than all others. For short notes, the really best and amazing are Sable or Mural from Spitfire audio. About legato Basses I recommend Spitfire because HS are not strong enough and blurred. About Brass, I recommend a mix between Spitfire and Hollywood Brass (Diamond) because nothing beats the HB Horns, and nothing beats Spitfire Low Brass or Bones. For trumpet you can use HB witch is really good but for solo part the essential and incredible is Trumpet from Sample Modeling. About winds, you should prefer Orchestral tool wood winds and complete it with Hollywood wood winds (Diamond only for "Close Mic") for low instruments witch do not exist in Orchestral tool. About Timpani and percussion, I like very much the power of Cineperc from Cine Sample. And for big Perc Sounds, HZ01 from Hans Zimmer (Spitfire) or StormDrum 3 East West.
I personnally play with the Adagio serie. I have Adagio, Adagio 2.0 and Anthology... I definitly prefer the sound of the orginal Adagio strings. They have a bunch of short notes articulations that are great tu use, wonderfull legatos and portamentos... need a bit of job to learn to use it properly (add EQ and Reverb). With a single Kontakt Script, it's easy to play every articulations from a single midi track.
Many thanks for this. I was especially interested in the different mic positions, and a bit sad you didn't show any for EW HS (given that it's a non-trivial price difference to obtain them). So much of these libraries are matters of taste, and you did a fantastic job showing 4 of the main contenders.
I must say, Berlin Strings sound the best. They are very expressive and there's a nice dynamic range. I also like the actual tone of those strings. There's a nice warmth to them that is lacking in LASS and EWHS based on this comparison. Great work!
Yeah, I really liked the demo. I think you did it properly, without mucking around with the sounds. Just straight out of the box, as it should be. I was pretty impressed with all of them. Maybe the Berlin sounds symphonic of the bunch. But overall, the technology of 2014 is darn impressive.
I think that LASS has a lot more capabilities. Given, it takes some EQing, Reverb and some extra layering. But I love the intimate sound that it brings. The second version of LASS comes with divisi features. I should say it makes it even more intimate and beautiful. But that's just my opinion...
After several YEARS testing several libraries, I got LASS and Berlin Strings. Both have excellent sound and flexibility. But Berlin Strings has two serious problems: It HAS NO DIVISI, and it is a devourer of RAM. It is IMPOSSIBLE to have a full symphony orchestra using Berlin Strings, unless you have a super computer with 32 GB of RAM and a absurdly fast processor and disk.... So my final choice was LASS, which I use to this day successfully.
Hey Rogerio, can you give me a few tips on how you EQ your LASS section? :-D I love using LASS for the intimate stuff but I am working on making it sound lush and big. Any tips? :-P
I do not touch in EQ to maintain the original LASS sound. I basically do something very simple: I point all LASS original audio to the Master Bus; everything dry (to keep the original pan between violins, violas, cellos and low). And then I use a Send to an auxiliar bus, which has a Impulse Reverb (I particularly use Altiverb) to get a convincing Reverb Tail and Early Reflection. The impulse reverb will depend on the context. To simulate a theater, I particularly like the Sydney Opera House.
Ahh thank you so much. I do the same thing actually but I use HOFA IQ reverb. Didn't like HOFA that much :-D I'm planning to buy Altiverb :-P I'll definitely try it out :-P and what reverb time do you generally have? :-D
Thank you for very professional analysis of virtual strings libraries. Your example is really demanding. Many times in string orchestral compositions we hear two areas - vn 1, melody and the rest of strings. In a sonoristic sense - it's very difficult create one organic world. Other problem, you record with a little unnatural dynamic and expression manner, very good with the rest of orchestral or other instruments. I suppose, you spent a few hours only for record, preparing all individual dynamic CC lines... Paradoxically, today for producing big orchestral material (for film) composer needs not only very good equipment but several assistants for record. You can extend this example using other, not so famous, libraries like Spitfire series, Native Instruments (Symphonic series), ProjectSam Symphobia (1), CinemaSamples (especially Core Strings) and others. I agree, It seems, Berlin Strings sounds very good, but this whole library needs really strong computer... forget about 16 GB RAM. Anyway, I have all libraries in your example plus other. All depends HOW you work with professional library (I mean articulations, dynamic, expression). If a string orchestra is a component of bigger form, so different between professional libraries is not so evident. Again, thank you for professional and smart example.
Interesting 2 studio lib vs hall lib comparison. Berlin and 8dio sound very similar to me. LASS clearly win that intimate sound. EW totally nailed that "old school" studio session imo. Thanks for the video.
First of all, this piece you wrote is absolutely gorgeous!! Seriously beautiful, thank you for writing it. Sounds great even on unpolished midi :). Second of all, thank you for making this! I've been wondering what the player experience is with East West orchestra libraries, because I'm debating between going with East West or Spitfire Audio. Spitfire makes great walkthroughs and tutorials, and it seems like their user experience is really nice and intuitive. East West seems a bit less intuitive, but their offerings are robust (and composer cloud has me drooling). How do you like the user experience with East West?
I can certainly appreciate the attempt to make comparisons, but comparing Adagio with other libraries only using X-Fades is really counter-intuitive to the Adagio concept. While Adagio certainly has traditional x-fades - the vast majority of the concept is built around using dynamic articulations, which is completely skipped in the comparison. I guess the comparison is fair - in the sense that all the other libraries are built around x-fade, however Adagio is 90% built around a massive selection of alternative legato articulation that are much more dynamic in nature. Unfortunately you cannot make a video comparing these to the others, since they don't have them. In summary ... This is a good comparison for people looking into comparing string libraries based on their basic legato articulations. But real strings are capable of so much more - and this everlasting notion of x-fade legato with sustains covers all string needs is so far from the truth - and in essence miscommunicating how real strings operate. If we started doing comparisons with round robin legato, legato with fluent note repetitions (loure), legato with dynamic bowings - it would paint a very different picture, since Adagio is the only library capable of this and it is much more vital articulations then dead-boring xfade sustains IMO. Here is a dead simple example of Adagio Cellos ... which is an unfair comparison I suppose. But it exemplifies the point I am trying to make - and that our legato goes far, far beyond lifeless sustains. 8Dio Adagio Cello Ensemble Emotional Slur Legato
You have a good point. Adagio is really built on a different philosophy than the others. I have a lot of respect for 8dio for approaching Adagio differently to other developers. It's becoming more obvious to me that we are reaching the limits with current sampling techniques. Apart from all that though, I think it's beneficial for people to hear what Adagio would sound like if they were to play a melody out of the box as is in the video. Honestly, I don't think this is a bad representation of Adagio anyway!
Joseph Truscott Strongly disagree with this point of view. Adagio is not "phasing", but it is a more natural approach to recording strings then other sample concepts, hence why our demos tend to sound more realistic. Here is an example of what I am talking about: 8Dio Adagio Cello Ensemble Emotional Slur Legato This is not possible with any other string library and if you think about it - the ability to repeat notes fluenty is one of the most common articulations for strings - yet we are the only ones covering it together with a slew of other things. But please send some actual examples of Adagio phasing, so we can have a qualified discussion about this compared to others.
8dioproductions You might be getting confused, by phasiness, we're not talking about the way the instruments were played, but in terms of how it was recorded and mixed, maybe the way the mics were setup or some phase alignment issues, but it definitely isn't what I'd call a 'natural' sound. Natural to me means sounding like listening to them live.
I have Hollywood Orchestra and the frustrating thing about it is that while it does what I like as far as shaping the notes go, theres something about the actual recordings that feel off, I feel theres excessive noise and I find I have to adjust the EQ heavily. I also write faster music which I found alot of libraries struggle with. Thats the one benefit to Hollywoond though. Berlin sounds very promising, I think I'll be trying that out
All the libraries are so close!! The ordinary person can’t tell the difference. Nice sounding tracks! (Like Adagio’s graph’s. I only own LASS, full bundle)
Based purely on the transitions from note to note, for me, LA Scoring Strings probably sound most impressive. A convincing, smooth legato truly is the key to realism.
7 years later and Berlin is still the champ in this specific race IMO... that CELLO, wow. Between Orchestral Tools and SpitFire (and Garritan CFX Grand), in 2021 you can pretty much cover your needs.
Uff...Hard to say, but...to me, as a composer I need something fast when I want to capture the essence of a strings line, mainly about dynamics, the attack..the feeling of "don't be afraid" when you play the keyboard, if you need sweet and soft, ok!, hard, warp...etc I will to be right... The sound of 4 libs are awesome, but...I love the overall dynamics of Berlin strings, maybe it is the youngest lib on market, so they are very enable to learn what is good or not (I love Berlin woodwins but, i stay in version 1!! I don't like the upgrades I noted the transitions between notes it's some worst comparing with the old ones, yes, it's just my opinion)... Hollywood is so complete, articulations, quality etc but complex for edit fastest... Adagio its "made with love", by someone that you feel like he is happy playing his products (Mr Folmann), because Adagio lib is gorguous!, but a little bit hard for playing in real time a lot of differetn legatos but... So, since its version 2.0, LASS is my winner... Stage color, with a combination with Quantum leap spaces or 2CAUDIO B2 is amazing..the way I play keys (sometimes very fast) with legato presets, with divisi and controlling vibrato, like Sample modeling with a lot of faders as a contols all in real time... Well. I use Adagio for "modern" strings when I try to get strings sound but not in ar orchestral mood, etc... Finally. Spitfire Mural strings are veeeery close to Lass, but the way how Mural is programmed, takes a lot of resources of my I7 intel Haswell with 16gb of ram..strange but it is so...I think Mural got the best of Sporit audio team with Albion family etc and bring us a very powefull and easy to play for keyboardists. Thank you so much for share this Blakus!! As always, great music and a wonderful taste to write music. Greetings from Barcelona!
It sounds to me that Berlin and Adagio sound the best because there is some reverb to them. If you add some reverb to LASS and HS - they would sound equally impressive. Berlin has better expressions - but I guess LASS using auto-arranger will easily do the same.. In this demo: Berlin and adagio at times sounded the best. However i've heard demos of LASS and for me they are just OP.
Si,Berlín strings es una librería muy buena y muy profesional aunque tiene un sonido muy directo indiferente de articulaciones...pero en combinación con Hollywood strings que es una librería más o con mucho más volumen...puede sonar estupendo. Bueno tb quiero decir que de lo mejor legato que pude eschuchar de todas las librerías que hay..Berlín lo tiene de cine hhh y me sorprende pq como yo realmente soy más de Vienna symphonic L...lo he escuchado a Berlín strings.
I love the Hollywood Strings Berlin strings and LASS.. I liked the Adagio Strings as well. I would layer them all together as he did in the end!! Nice piece as well!
Especially during the last part of the video when you played back the song...LASS was the only one that actually sounded like a real string section, just needs some reverb and you're done. The others sound like, well... sample libraries.
I loved the definition of Berlin Strings while keeping the largeness of sound. The second to that is Adagio. But I dont have much experience of writing so cant say anything about the dynamic reality which is maybe in the first place
That's a good comparison since most people think these libraries sound good out of the box (which most do not). Each library got it's unique color, tone, pros and cons. Examining a single patch for each part without writing the notes 'specifically' to each library is problematic (and that's an understatement). Even if you play an acoustic instrument in this mechanical fashion, it would sound as bad.
+blakus | music for media the combination of berlin and hollywood didnt sound all that bad though. in some aspects they nicely complimented each other.
Clearly one of the best "contest" between providers of Strings library. I just regret that you have not included VSL, Spitfire (Mural) and possibly Miroslav Vitous which is interesting too. For my opinion, all these libraries are very playable and sound clearly good and every one has a specific character. I thing Hollywood is probably the last one (attacks seem sometimes artificial) but the three others are very fine ! Congratulations for this "scientific" comparison...
great top 4 selection. all very nice Berlin is undeniable, but $$$ - hard attack wins, i think. HWS sounds very good and under $200 (Diamond BF) Berlin and HWS layered is insanely lovely. LASS - workflow is challenging and not quite sure about the tone and arts Adagio sounds gorgeous aside from its quirkiness. Thank you!
Berlin strings has less players, that's why it sounds more detailed. Despite this fact, i prefer Hollywood strings. By the way, awesome job! I look forward for the next video!
Nice Video! The lack of a nice LUSH Algorithmic or Impulse Reverb held things back a bit. I think Adagio has a gap on the rest. Looking forward to more!
I've provided stems so people can try out reverbs if they want to. But yeah, I might do another one later that tweaks the mic positions and adds reverb :)
Hi Blakus First of all thank you for all your videos mate, I've worked my way through all of them now, and they were incredibly helpful and inspiring! I don't know if you're still doing this, but if you should do another Tutorial, how about talking about the compositional aspect? How do you start a project from an idea, do you write it down on paper or straight into Cubase, how do you go about developing those ideas ect... Best, Moritz
+Moritz Wanger Hi Moritz, thanks for the message. I will see if I can find time to do another video. I do talk briefly about my compositional approach towards the end of this video - ua-cam.com/video/lbkzJX9Jck0/v-deo.htmlm40s
Thank you for your time in doing this. It's very informative and helpful. The only thing I'm wondering is what are the out of the box effects these products use. Is the reverb I hear microphone placement or an effect?
Thanks for this Blake, very informative! I would have liked to have seen Cinestrings included in this comparison but obviously that wasn't possible at this time, still I now have a much clearer idea of what my future library purchases might be. :)
***** I have Cinestrings wich are far away behind or below Orchestral Tool, East West or Spitfire. I just bought it because I read good things about it and I was really disappointed. Same with Cinebrass. But not with CinePerc witch is one of the best Classic Perc available.
Cyril Orcel Cheers for that reply, it's very helpful indeed. :) Right now I'm leaving towards a combination of Berlin Strings and Cinematic Strings 2, the fact that these are both recorded with smaller sections should mean that they will hopefully layer quite well too.
Cyril Orcel I don't have either myself yet, but I can tell you from talking to other composers that do use it and from the tutorial videos I've watched that the ease of use of Cinematic Strings 2 is very appealing indeed. It seems to be ideal for getting ideas down quickly and in an almost complete form. The current price of it is also attractive. Of all the string libraries demonstrated here Berlin was the one I found most attractive, i can't speak to it's ease of use though.
Good demonstration! Very helpful! Now I do have one question, what is the name of the soundtrack you used to demonstrate these libraries? It was beautiful!
I noticed you did not have the portamento / gliss patches loaded in LASS, doesn't that kind of defeat the purpose of the whole thing? Those are what gives it that real feel.
ok so I was at a Dream THeater concert (the astonishing) in november, and I swear, Jordan Rudess, the keyboardist for the band, played your piece, Green Acre. It was exactly the same, because right when he played it something popped into my head telling me ive heard this before, it was at that moment I remember this cubase video with the ensemble piece you play, it was the same compisition. So green acre is your own original work or is it a reowkring of something pre-existing? If so, I am pretty sure the guy from dream theater played your piece....
adagio a solid 4th place Hollywood strings and lass are a really close tie. with more fine tuning? maybe Hollywood. Berlin was the best. it had more natural expression. expression is so important. it is the one thing that is basically impossible to get. but berlin wasn't that far from Hollywood and lass. the bite from LASS strings probably came from mic positions.
Thanks for the information n your video. I checked out Berlin Strings because I liked the direct harshness of the bow a lot better than on any of the other libraries. I almost bought Berlin Stings and wound up buying Metropolis Ark 1 instead. You should check that one out.
Adagio is good, but we didn't feeling the attack. LA is much better, but same probleme, no feeling the attack of the notes when the mouvement is fast... Hollywood the best song, with the utilisation of the multi mic, it is awsome, but Berlin String has best articulation, so natural et realistic. If we can have the sound of Hollywood String and the feeling of Berlin string that will be awsome
Hey Blakus. Good to have you back. I've got LASS and Cinematic Strings 2. Been looking for a smaller string section to add for those intimate parts (I love LASS desks for divisi but not for playing solo). I'm split between Sable and Berlin Strings. I tend to shy away from the really wet libraries so Sable scares me a little since it is so attached to that Air Lyndherst sound. What are your thoughts?
blakus | music for media Sable, unequivocally, is the best divisi section there, it hurts mural has not achieved what sable achievement with respect to detail, perhaps the second number mural achieve what sable achievement, I would love to see a video of comparing products spitfire audio, sorry my English is not good
Owen | Blakus After getting deep and really working with LASS I have changed my tune. The key for me was adding a cc controller for the auto arranger and the amount of first chair so I could control them both on the fly. Then I added a tilt filter, some EQ, and a touch of Todd AO IR through Waves IR and bam. Intimate and warm divisi strings. The deeper I get the more I love LASS!
As a violinist, I second this - the tone of the string is more realistic for Berlin than for the others. I think it is because they only used 8 players for the violin sections so there is less blend and more detail.
it would be nice if you solo the exact same phrase on all libraries.Yo uare playing sequentially and switching the libraries so its hard to compare since different patches are involved in the piece. the way you are switching the 'Adagio string' almost always gets the last part (around measure 7) which is the hardest to do and it sounds bad. Not sure if berlin or HS will do better for this phrase.
Hi Blakus. Thanks for this vid. Would you mind telling which library you find has the most playability and expressive control? This is by the most important consideration to me. Thanks.
+Emmanuel Hoarau The man who created this video said he was only going to compare software that he actually owned. He mentioned that he doesn't own Sable Spitfire.
Adagio 15:51
LA Scoring Strings 16:44
Hollywood Strings 17:19
Berlin Strings 18:04
Imagine a world in which UA-camrs just got to the point, That's the world I want to live in.
@@danieltaylor3231 well jump to 5:14 to hear the actual demo.
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"you don't know what you're buying, until you actually buy it" --> mostly true in this VSTs' level of craftmanship. great video!
The Berlin Strings samples sound more authentic and seem to require less fine tuning than the other libraries. Great comparisons!
2020 Covid19. Lock down. Quarantine.... and the million'th view of this video, that still shines bright! Such a great melodic cue.
THis is the most helpful demonstration/comparison that I have come across in over 2 years of researching which VST that I should go with, not to mention the nicely written piece you have composed. While they all have strengths, I think finally I can narrow down which program I want. THANK YOU SO MUCH!
Glad you found it helpful Grant!
Berlin Strings ARE amazing.
I agree!
Indeed but I have the impression the Berlin Strings are closer micd than e.g. the hollywood Strings. Personally I like close micing better. You can still fake the effect of far micing with effects but the other way round is impossible
@Benny Griswold thank you for your experience, very intersting for me
Berlin are good but not the best here.
In the complete section LASS sounded so rich, you could also hear the authentic bite of the strings.
Berlin does have good expression, and does runs pretty well.
Hollywood strings sound beautiful in a complete section. You can hear the romance in the layers and it's not as in your face loud like Berlin.
Personally I wouldn't bother with Adagio
Out of all the UA-cam 'comparison vids' out there, this is one of the best I've seen, particularly because of the simple approach taken - you get to 'hear' each different default product up close and personal. Really, really helpful and informative! Thank you.
I suspect the Berlin Strings and Adagio Strings sound better because they use fewer players, and are therefore more detailed. These might be the best choices for a smaller orchestra. LA Scoring Strings and Hollywood Strings use more players, and therefore are probably better suited to a bigger orchestra. For those who might be interested:
Berlin Strings
1st vln = 8
2nd vln = 6
vla = 5
vcl = 5
db = 4
Hollywood Strings
1st vln = 16
2nd vln = 14
vla = 10
vcl = 10
db = 7
LA Scoring Strings
1st vln = 16
2nd vln = 16
vla = 12
vcl = 10
db = 8
Adagio Strings
vln = 11
vla = 7
vcl = 6
db = 4
***** I would like to note that because of the divisi in LASS, one can effectively reduce the size of the orchestra.
It always depends on what you are going to use,for me hollywood and LA are more versatile and more usefull
To me, BS is the best sounding library of all available string libraries.. HS is for epic hollywood -style themes, it sounds so great and real in its own way, but it is hard to use (i love bow chages a lot!!). LA is very unique, real and nice woody sounding library. It is more intimate sounding library than many others and definetly more intimate than HW. Adagio has too many artifacts, but it can sound very very beautiful (i like Adagio transitions and legatos).
Nothing is really touching Berlin's legato algorithm. It's quite simply light years ahead of everything else.
Thanks a lot for doing this! Berlin Strings sound so beautiful... it has the "fullest" sound imo.
Thank you for taking the time. Mighty cool of you.
If you Ctrl + Click the solo button it will deactivate all solo states except the one you're clicking. Helpful when comparing :)
That's awesome! Thanks :D
my measure of Rating a string sample library is as follows:
to me, legato strings make my heart swoon and sigh while string runs shake me up, which is due to the Dynamics of the Instruments. most libraries dont come with such Dynamics, but the Berlin strings do so perfectly well. I LOVE their Sound, it's incredibly full and voluminous.
A very valuable video. Thank you. Stayed right to the end.
Fantastic work, mate. Can't wait to see more of these from you as they are a huge help. Would love to see you do a Let's Compose series as well where we can spend a few hours watching you from start to finish working on a song. I'm especially interested in seeing how I can get more out of Hollywood Orchestra
My Ranking
1. Berlin Strings
2. Hollywood Strings
3. Adagio
4. Lass
i heartfully thank you Blakus for the comparison....
I keep coming back to this video because the Melody is so amazing! I love the soaring feelings behind it (:
To my surprise, Adagio seems below the rest, and I prefer LASS to Hollywood. I never expected that. Berlin is probably my favourite, but not 150GB of my hard drive better than LASS.
Mobbs Music I keep getting the itch man, everytime I come back remembering that I picked LASS for a reason
About expressivity and emotion Hollywood String is really surprising. In solo mode, it's not easy to make the difference. But inside the orchestration HS are really effective and more realistic than all others. For short notes, the really best and amazing are Sable or Mural from Spitfire audio.
About legato Basses I recommend Spitfire because HS are not strong enough and blurred.
About Brass, I recommend a mix between Spitfire and Hollywood Brass (Diamond) because nothing beats the HB Horns, and nothing beats Spitfire Low Brass or Bones.
For trumpet you can use HB witch is really good but for solo part the essential and incredible is Trumpet from Sample Modeling.
About winds, you should prefer Orchestral tool wood winds and complete it with Hollywood wood winds (Diamond only for "Close Mic") for low instruments witch do not exist in Orchestral tool.
About Timpani and percussion, I like very much the power of Cineperc from Cine Sample. And for big Perc Sounds, HZ01 from Hans Zimmer (Spitfire) or StormDrum 3 East West.
I personnally play with the Adagio serie. I have Adagio, Adagio 2.0 and Anthology... I definitly prefer the sound of the orginal Adagio strings. They have a bunch of short notes articulations that are great tu use, wonderfull legatos and portamentos... need a bit of job to learn to use it properly (add EQ and Reverb). With a single Kontakt Script, it's easy to play every articulations from a single midi track.
berlin strings - classical
hollywood strings - soundtrack
lass - pop
adagio - theatre
Many thanks for this. I was especially interested in the different mic positions, and a bit sad you didn't show any for EW HS (given that it's a non-trivial price difference to obtain them). So much of these libraries are matters of taste, and you did a fantastic job showing 4 of the main contenders.
I must say, Berlin Strings sound the best. They are very expressive and there's a nice dynamic range. I also like the actual tone of those strings. There's a nice warmth to them that is lacking in LASS and EWHS based on this comparison. Great work!
Cool video, beautiful theme, rocked it. Thanks!
Thanks Joris! Appreciate it
Yeah, I really liked the demo. I think you did it properly, without mucking around with the sounds. Just straight out of the box, as it should be. I was pretty impressed with all of them. Maybe the Berlin sounds symphonic of the bunch. But overall, the technology of 2014 is darn impressive.
I think that LASS has a lot more capabilities. Given, it takes some EQing, Reverb and some extra layering. But I love the intimate sound that it brings. The second version of LASS comes with divisi features. I should say it makes it even more intimate and beautiful. But that's just my opinion...
After several YEARS testing several libraries, I got LASS and Berlin Strings. Both have excellent sound and flexibility.
But Berlin Strings has two serious problems: It HAS NO DIVISI, and it is a devourer of RAM.
It is IMPOSSIBLE to have a full symphony orchestra using Berlin Strings, unless you have a super computer with 32 GB of RAM and a absurdly fast processor and disk....
So my final choice was LASS, which I use to this day successfully.
Hey Rogerio, can you give me a few tips on how you EQ your LASS section? :-D I love using LASS for the intimate stuff but I am working on making it sound lush and big. Any tips? :-P
I do not touch in EQ to maintain the original LASS sound.
I basically do something very simple:
I point all LASS original audio to the Master Bus; everything dry (to keep the original pan between violins, violas, cellos and low).
And then I use a Send to an auxiliar bus, which has a Impulse Reverb (I particularly use Altiverb) to get a convincing Reverb Tail and Early Reflection.
The impulse reverb will depend on the context.
To simulate a theater, I particularly like the Sydney Opera House.
Ahh thank you so much. I do the same thing actually but I use HOFA IQ reverb. Didn't like HOFA that much :-D I'm planning to buy Altiverb :-P I'll definitely try it out :-P and what reverb time do you generally have? :-D
The time depends on the preset you want. In Altiverb, the same theater (Sydney Opera House) has several positions, ranging around 5 seconds.
When's the next string video coming?! Can't Wait!
Most of included libraries is sampled at 24bit/48kHz. Your project is 44.1kHz so there is a downsampling applied
Thank you for very professional analysis of virtual strings libraries. Your example is really demanding. Many times in string orchestral compositions we hear two areas - vn 1, melody and the rest of strings. In a sonoristic sense - it's very difficult create one organic world. Other problem, you record with a little unnatural dynamic and expression manner, very good with the rest of orchestral or other instruments. I suppose, you spent a few hours only for record, preparing all individual dynamic CC lines... Paradoxically, today for producing big orchestral material (for film) composer needs not only very good equipment but several assistants for record.
You can extend this example using other, not so famous, libraries like Spitfire series, Native Instruments (Symphonic series), ProjectSam Symphobia (1), CinemaSamples (especially Core Strings) and others.
I agree, It seems, Berlin Strings sounds very good, but this whole library needs really strong computer... forget about 16 GB RAM.
Anyway, I have all libraries in your example plus other. All depends HOW you work with professional library (I mean articulations, dynamic, expression). If a string orchestra is a component of bigger form, so different between professional libraries is not so evident.
Again, thank you for professional and smart example.
I've been trying to decide on a string library to buy for last few years and i STILL can't make my bloody mind up! lol Soo many to choose from
Berlin does sound the most authentic. It's also the most expensive.
it's true!
Interesting 2 studio lib vs hall lib comparison. Berlin and 8dio sound very similar to me. LASS clearly win that intimate sound. EW totally nailed that "old school" studio session imo.
Thanks for the video.
First of all, this piece you wrote is absolutely gorgeous!! Seriously beautiful, thank you for writing it. Sounds great even on unpolished midi :). Second of all, thank you for making this! I've been wondering what the player experience is with East West orchestra libraries, because I'm debating between going with East West or Spitfire Audio. Spitfire makes great walkthroughs and tutorials, and it seems like their user experience is really nice and intuitive. East West seems a bit less intuitive, but their offerings are robust (and composer cloud has me drooling). How do you like the user experience with East West?
Very informative. Well done .Have now purchased LA strings which do not use as much memory.
I can certainly appreciate the attempt to make comparisons, but comparing Adagio with other libraries only using X-Fades is really counter-intuitive to the Adagio concept. While Adagio certainly has traditional x-fades - the vast majority of the concept is built around using dynamic articulations, which is completely skipped in the comparison.
I guess the comparison is fair - in the sense that all the other libraries are built around x-fade, however Adagio is 90% built around a massive selection of alternative legato articulation that are much more dynamic in nature.
Unfortunately you cannot make a video comparing these to the others, since they don't have them.
In summary ... This is a good comparison for people looking into comparing string libraries based on their basic legato articulations. But real strings are capable of so much more - and this everlasting notion of x-fade legato with sustains covers all string needs is so far from the truth - and in essence miscommunicating how real strings operate.
If we started doing comparisons with round robin legato, legato with fluent note repetitions (loure), legato with dynamic bowings - it would paint a very different picture, since Adagio is the only library capable of this and it is much more vital articulations then dead-boring xfade sustains IMO.
Here is a dead simple example of Adagio Cellos ... which is an unfair comparison I suppose. But it exemplifies the point I am trying to make - and that our legato goes far, far beyond lifeless sustains.
8Dio Adagio Cello Ensemble Emotional Slur Legato
You have a good point. Adagio is really built on a different philosophy than the others. I have a lot of respect for 8dio for approaching Adagio differently to other developers. It's becoming more obvious to me that we are reaching the limits with current sampling techniques.
Apart from all that though, I think it's beneficial for people to hear what Adagio would sound like if they were to play a melody out of the box as is in the video. Honestly, I don't think this is a bad representation of Adagio anyway!
Adagio definitely has a different approach, its just a shame its slightly ruined by the weird phasyness in its delivery, which is offputting.
1wibble2 I agree, the phasing for me with Adagios Legatos render them unusable.
Joseph Truscott Strongly disagree with this point of view. Adagio is not "phasing", but it is a more natural approach to recording strings then other sample concepts, hence why our demos tend to sound more realistic. Here is an example of what I am talking about: 8Dio Adagio Cello Ensemble Emotional Slur Legato
This is not possible with any other string library and if you think about it - the ability to repeat notes fluenty is one of the most common articulations for strings - yet we are the only ones covering it together with a slew of other things. But please send some actual examples of Adagio phasing, so we can have a qualified discussion about this compared to others.
8dioproductions
You might be getting confused, by phasiness, we're not talking about the way the instruments were played, but in terms of how it was recorded and mixed, maybe the way the mics were setup or some phase alignment issues, but it definitely isn't what I'd call a 'natural' sound. Natural to me means sounding like listening to them live.
I have Hollywood Orchestra and the frustrating thing about it is that while it does what I like as far as shaping the notes go, theres something about the actual recordings that feel off, I feel theres excessive noise and I find I have to adjust the EQ heavily. I also write faster music which I found alot of libraries struggle with. Thats the one benefit to Hollywoond though. Berlin sounds very promising, I think I'll be trying that out
All the libraries are so close!! The ordinary person can’t tell the difference. Nice sounding tracks! (Like Adagio’s graph’s. I only own LASS, full bundle)
Based purely on the transitions from note to note, for me, LA Scoring Strings probably sound most impressive. A convincing, smooth legato truly is the key to realism.
7 years later and Berlin is still the champ in this specific race IMO... that CELLO, wow. Between Orchestral Tools and SpitFire (and Garritan CFX Grand), in 2021 you can pretty much cover your needs.
Uff...Hard to say, but...to me, as a composer I need something fast when I want to capture the essence of a strings line, mainly about dynamics, the attack..the feeling of "don't be afraid" when you play the keyboard, if you need sweet and soft, ok!, hard, warp...etc I will to be right...
The sound of 4 libs are awesome, but...I love the overall dynamics of Berlin strings, maybe it is the youngest lib on market, so they are very enable to learn what is good or not (I love Berlin woodwins but, i stay in version 1!! I don't like the upgrades I noted the transitions between notes it's some worst comparing with the old ones, yes, it's just my opinion)...
Hollywood is so complete, articulations, quality etc but complex for edit fastest...
Adagio its "made with love", by someone that you feel like he is happy playing his products (Mr Folmann), because Adagio lib is gorguous!, but a little bit hard for playing in real time a lot of differetn legatos but...
So, since its version 2.0, LASS is my winner...
Stage color, with a combination with Quantum leap spaces or 2CAUDIO B2 is amazing..the way I play keys (sometimes very fast) with legato presets, with divisi and controlling vibrato, like Sample modeling with a lot of faders as a contols all in real time...
Well. I use Adagio for "modern" strings when I try to get strings sound but not in ar orchestral mood, etc...
Finally. Spitfire Mural strings are veeeery close to Lass, but the way how Mural is programmed, takes a lot of resources of my I7 intel Haswell with 16gb of ram..strange but it is so...I think Mural got the best of Sporit audio team with Albion family etc and bring us a very powefull and easy to play for keyboardists.
Thank you so much for share this Blakus!! As always, great music and a wonderful taste to write music.
Greetings from Barcelona!
awesome. berlin strings are crazy good, despite some room dropout problems.
This is really helpful! I'm in the process of deciding which library I should purchase. Thanks
I'm glad it was useful to you! :)
Great comparison video...and nice performance on your playing!!
Berlin an Adagio are the best i think ! Nice video ! How many RAM is working in your Machine?
It sounds to me that Berlin and Adagio sound the best because there is some reverb to them.
If you add some reverb to LASS and HS - they would sound equally impressive.
Berlin has better expressions - but I guess LASS using auto-arranger will easily do the same..
In this demo: Berlin and adagio at times sounded the best.
However i've heard demos of LASS and for me they are just OP.
The piece you written for these libraries is absolutely stunning! I'm not going to lie, I often play it in my free time...😳😳
Si,Berlín strings es una librería muy buena y muy profesional aunque tiene un sonido muy directo indiferente de articulaciones...pero en combinación con Hollywood strings que es una librería más o con mucho más volumen...puede sonar estupendo. Bueno tb quiero decir que de lo mejor legato que pude eschuchar de todas las librerías que hay..Berlín lo tiene de cine hhh y me sorprende pq como yo realmente soy más de Vienna symphonic L...lo he escuchado a Berlín strings.
very helpful. Some of the examples are very subtle
I love the Hollywood Strings Berlin strings and LASS.. I liked the Adagio Strings as well. I would layer them all together as he did in the end!! Nice piece as well!
Especially during the last part of the video when you played back the song...LASS was the only one that actually sounded like a real string section, just needs some reverb and you're done. The others sound like, well... sample libraries.
I loved the definition of Berlin Strings while keeping the largeness of sound. The second to that is Adagio. But I dont have much experience of writing so cant say anything about the dynamic reality which is maybe in the first place
That's a good comparison since most people think these libraries sound good out of the box (which most do not). Each library got it's unique color, tone, pros and cons. Examining a single patch for each part without writing the notes 'specifically' to each library is problematic (and that's an understatement). Even if you play an acoustic instrument in this mechanical fashion, it would sound as bad.
from my point :
من وجهة نظري :
الترتيب الأول Berlin Strings
Berlin Strings is the BEST !
Thanks for doing the vid...In general, for me:
1) Berlin
2) Adagio
3)LASS
4)HS
20:25 "All of them together sound terrible so I'm not even going to try" LOL!
+Jarrod Romine Haha! Yeah, I tried it for fun, it was... bad...
+blakus | music for media the combination of berlin and hollywood didnt sound all that bad though. in some aspects they nicely complimented each other.
I'm surprised there's no Blakus cello in there ;)
Haha Joseph! ;)
@@Blakus So you are a Cello Player. Aren't you Mr. Blakus?! Or a lover of Cellos ?! 😄
They are all really good, but slightly different. Will there be a part 2 called "Short notes" or similar? Correction "Oh I saw it in the desctription"
Thanks for your efforts and observations!
Clearly one of the best "contest" between providers of Strings library. I just regret that you have not included VSL, Spitfire (Mural) and possibly Miroslav Vitous which is interesting too. For my opinion, all these libraries are very playable and sound clearly good and every one has a specific character. I thing Hollywood is probably the last one (attacks seem sometimes artificial) but the three others are very fine ! Congratulations for this "scientific" comparison...
great top 4 selection.
all very nice
Berlin is undeniable, but $$$ - hard attack wins, i think.
HWS sounds very good and under $200 (Diamond BF)
Berlin and HWS layered is insanely lovely.
LASS - workflow is challenging and not quite sure about the tone and arts
Adagio sounds gorgeous aside from its quirkiness.
Thank you!
Berlin strings has less players, that's why it sounds more detailed.
Despite this fact, i prefer Hollywood strings. By the way, awesome job! I look forward for the next video!
Nice Video! The lack of a nice LUSH Algorithmic or Impulse Reverb held things back a bit. I think Adagio has a gap on the rest. Looking forward to more!
I've provided stems so people can try out reverbs if they want to. But yeah, I might do another one later that tweaks the mic positions and adds reverb :)
I thought that I'm only one. But in my ears, adagio have some serious sound artifacts. And high notes sounds a bit digital.
Why I allways hear a LOT of high-pitch artifacts from Adagio? Is it just me?
Hi Blakus
First of all thank you for all your videos mate, I've worked my way through all of them now, and they were incredibly helpful and inspiring!
I don't know if you're still doing this, but if you should do another Tutorial, how about talking about the compositional aspect? How do you start a project from an idea, do you write it down on paper or straight into Cubase, how do you go about developing those ideas ect... Best, Moritz
+Moritz Wanger Hi Moritz, thanks for the message. I will see if I can find time to do another video. I do talk briefly about my compositional approach towards the end of this video - ua-cam.com/video/lbkzJX9Jck0/v-deo.htmlm40s
Thank you for your time in doing this. It's very informative and helpful. The only thing I'm wondering is what are the out of the box effects these products use. Is the reverb I hear microphone placement or an effect?
these are raw samples recorded from diferent mic perspectives, no spacial effects.
Excellent video. LASS sounds good to my ears. By the way... I see you have HZ01. Would love to see a review on that.
Thanks for this Blake, very informative! I would have liked to have seen Cinestrings included in this comparison but obviously that wasn't possible at this time, still I now have a much clearer idea of what my future library purchases might be. :)
***** I have Cinestrings wich are far away behind or below Orchestral Tool, East West or Spitfire. I just bought it because I read good things about it and I was really disappointed. Same with Cinebrass. But not with CinePerc witch is one of the best Classic Perc available.
Cyril Orcel Cheers for that reply, it's very helpful indeed. :) Right now I'm leaving towards a combination of Berlin Strings and Cinematic Strings 2, the fact that these are both recorded with smaller sections should mean that they will hopefully layer quite well too.
***** Hi Terry, because I don't have Berlin Strings or Cinématic Strings, could you tell me witch do you prefer and why ? Thanks, Cyril
Cyril Orcel I don't have either myself yet, but I can tell you from talking to other composers that do use it and from the tutorial videos I've watched that the ease of use of Cinematic Strings 2 is very appealing indeed. It seems to be ideal for getting ideas down quickly and in an almost complete form. The current price of it is also attractive. Of all the string libraries demonstrated here Berlin was the one I found most attractive, i can't speak to it's ease of use though.
Good demonstration! Very helpful! Now I do have one question, what is the name of the soundtrack you used to demonstrate these libraries? It was beautiful!
Hey there! Thanks! :) The piece is just something I wrote to demonstrate libraries. I should probably turn it into something complete.
You really should. It sounds very good :D
I noticed you did not have the portamento / gliss patches loaded in LASS, doesn't that kind of defeat the purpose of the whole thing? Those are what gives it that real feel.
+Christer Holm Clever observation! And I was wondering LASS used to sound better than that
thank you for your video comparison
Very Good Blakus! Go on with others.
Cheers
How about "cinesample strings"?
all of them are amazing, no library is better than the other one, you have to have them all, but I have my preferences with Adagio Series from 8dio
Berlin strings got the release samples just right. Bought the Hllywood strings the other day because that's all I could afford.
Very Beautiful piece!
8DIO Adagio on sale now 70% off Makes the libraries sound a lot sweeter..
BLAKUS!!!.....YOU'RE B-A-C-K!!! WHERE 'YA BEEN BUDDY!!! CAN'T WAIT TO CHECK OUT THE VIDEO!!!!!
Haha!
This great video! thank you!
ok so I was at a Dream THeater concert (the astonishing) in november, and I swear, Jordan Rudess, the keyboardist for the band, played your piece, Green Acre. It was exactly the same, because right when he played it something popped into my head telling me ive heard this before, it was at that moment I remember this cubase video with the ensemble piece you play, it was the same compisition. So green acre is your own original work or is it a reowkring of something pre-existing? If so, I am pretty sure the guy from dream theater played your piece....
Hahaha really?? That's pretty amazing if that happened! It's definitely my piece :D
Hollywood strings are for sale for 199 dollars. Considering price of other libraries at the moment, i think ill just get HS. Nice video
adagio a solid 4th place
Hollywood strings and lass are a really close tie. with more fine tuning? maybe Hollywood.
Berlin was the best. it had more natural expression.
expression is so important. it is the one thing that is basically impossible to get. but berlin wasn't that far from Hollywood and lass. the bite from LASS strings probably came from mic positions.
that berlin strings is awesome... is there any other string library that has actual 1st and 2nd violins?
Jiwpgakis Hollywood Strings does also
aMinor6 CineSamples CineStrings :)
aMinor6 Berlin was amazing
Hollywood Strings you are using, is Diamond or Gold?
Thanks for the information n your video. I checked out Berlin Strings because I liked the direct harshness of the bow a lot better than on any of the other libraries. I almost bought Berlin Stings and wound up buying Metropolis Ark 1 instead. You should check that one out.
+F Ridge I bought Metropolis Ark last week. Some good stuff in there :)
Sounds like maybe Adagio has some built in dynamics????? (Think I like LASS the best)
Berlin strings sound different from others, seems to me a little bit too "Tamed2, for my taste, Hollywood strings are by far the best...
+1slowstar Hollywood strings is a great library! It's so tricky because they all excel at different things!
Adagio is good, but we didn't feeling the attack.
LA is much better, but same probleme, no feeling the attack of the notes when the mouvement is fast...
Hollywood the best song, with the utilisation of the multi mic, it is awsome, but Berlin String has best articulation, so natural et realistic.
If we can have the sound of Hollywood String and the feeling of Berlin string that will be awsome
Wow nice comparison
Hey Blakus. Good to have you back. I've got LASS and Cinematic Strings 2. Been looking for a smaller string section to add for those intimate parts (I love LASS desks for divisi but not for playing solo). I'm split between Sable and Berlin Strings. I tend to shy away from the really wet libraries so Sable scares me a little since it is so attached to that Air Lyndherst sound. What are your thoughts?
Berlin Strings is also quite wet as well. I haven't tried Sable, but I would like to!
blakus | music for media Sable, unequivocally, is the best divisi section there, it hurts mural has not achieved what sable achievement with respect to detail, perhaps the second number mural achieve what sable achievement, I would love to see a video of comparing products spitfire audio, sorry my English is not good
Owen | Blakus
After getting deep and really working with LASS I have changed my tune. The key for me was adding a cc controller for the auto arranger and the amount of first chair so I could control them both on the fly. Then I added a tilt filter, some EQ, and a touch of Todd AO IR through Waves IR and bam. Intimate and warm divisi strings. The deeper I get the more I love LASS!
Black Light Recordings thanks for the tip. which version you are using lass?
Owen barra ramos I'm using the full LASS 2.0 (or are they up to 2.5) The new update has great starter templates, too.
As a violin player myself, I obviously know realism and tone and the violin, Berlin Strings is by FAR the closest to perfection.
As a violinist, I second this - the tone of the string is more realistic for Berlin than for the others. I think it is because they only used 8 players for the violin sections so there is less blend and more detail.
Thx - I have to pick Berlin ... wish I could afford em
A midi file would be very nice..
It looks like you didn't load any of the portamento or glissando samples on LASS?
And I have never like the style how the Berlin series libraries cut the legato transitions.
it would be nice if you solo the exact same phrase on all libraries.Yo uare playing sequentially and switching the libraries so its hard to compare since different patches are involved in the piece.
the way you are switching the 'Adagio string' almost always gets the last part (around measure 7) which is the hardest to do and it sounds bad. Not sure if berlin or HS will do better for this phrase.
Hi Blakus. Thanks for this vid. Would you mind telling which library you find has the most playability and expressive control? This is by the most important consideration to me. Thanks.
Awesome! BTW, how do you swap between hard/soft attack with Hollywood Strings!?
And Where is Spitfire Strings ? :p
+Emmanuel Hoarau
The man who created this video said he was only going to compare software that he actually owned. He mentioned that he doesn't own Sable Spitfire.