I Get Advice from an Architect on my Observatory Build
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- Опубліковано 27 лип 2023
- I talk to architect Timothy Emerson (tedesignstudio.com/) about my plans to build a backyard observatory, and he gives me tons of great advice you won't want to miss! Head to www.squarespace.com/nebulaphotos to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain using code NEBULAPHOTOS
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Make. A. Podcast.
Agreed
Indeed we need!
This makes sense .. 😀
Humidity is a big deal, he’s giving you great advice there. In my sauna there is two screened holes in the floor and and one above the door that closes. When open and heat on, you can feel the air coming out of that top hole via convection. Concrete retains energy, my open air pier is set in concrete and that retained energy keeps my feet warm all night. Great video.
Totally helpful interview/discussion. I'm not building an observatory; but his advice spans other backyard construction projects I have going on in my garden. Thank you!
Great video. I'm in the process of building my observatory that will also function as a club observatory, here in Central Maine. I also purchased plans from Backyard Observatories. The 16ft x 24ft club observatory plan is what I got. Though I was a bit disappointed as the drawings lacked some detail and had no cut sheet of materials that would be used. I am going a different direction with the floor and pouring concrete pad with 2 sections boxed off to pour the piers so they will be isolated from the rest of the pad. I don't think the pad will warm up enough to affect using the telescopes. I am planning on two piers and a warm room. One pier for visual use with a club mounted scope and a second pier for my own astrophotography use (telescope and mount tbd). Pad should be poured in the next month, if weather clears enough for the concrete contractor to get caught up. Clear skies!
On the shed (shack) that I'm using, I have the roof rolling off to the North. Several reasons for this, but one of the advantages is that after Polar alignment and depending on the direction that I'm taking images, it allows Me to roll the roof back and possibly get some of the equipment out of the weather. Plus in the South, definitely helps keep things drier from the Dew including Me.
Very interesting discussion. I have programmed a RaspberryPi with an inner and outer temperature and rel. humidity sensor steering an air vent and an chain opener for a windows to decrease the humidity of my cellar. With each combination of temperature and rel. air humidity sensor you can calculate the absolute air humidity. It does only make sense to vent the cellar if the outside absolute air humidity is less than inner absolute humidity. So in winter times it is easy to keep the humidity on low values. But in summer such a RaspberryPi is a very nice feature. I have used that combination for years now. I would highly recommend it.
Im a non-native english speaker. So i have to concentrate really and focus to get all of the spoken content.
But boy. You guys have really calming and warm voices. I got a good nap while you talked.
Now im watching again to consume the actual talk. ❤
Nico great video If I wasn't in a townhouse I would build one also. A couple of comments keep the concrete pier for the building. I would check with a local builder that you don't have any type of soil that could grab the pier and drag them up with the frost. Also with an unheaded building and no ground cover soil, grass just rock the frost can go deeper than the frost. I would maybe check what is used by the city or rural water for water pipe depths to prevent freezing of the water pipes. The comment on keeping the telescope pier free of the floor is what I've heard also. And depending on the soil I would definitely put this below all freezing ground. One last thought with digging out and vapor barrier and rock to hold it in place just don't create a bathtub that holds the water. Create a French drain if need be to a low spot that wouldn't back up into the space below the observatory.
My solution here in western Washington was a 12x12 vent in one wall and a small fan that I leave on year round speeds cooling to ambient and takes care of humidity. After 5 years or so I have no mold or rust problems.
Hey Nico, I'm a bit north of you....actually, I don't know where you live in NH, but I'm up in Jackson (Mt Washington Valley) so I'm assuming north.... :) Anyhow, I built a small observatory last summer and did a couple things that are a bit unique, but working well. Instead of a roll-off, I have four removable panels. The panels run east/west to follow the tracking and the roof is slightly peaked which helps with wind that typically is out of the north (mostly) or south during the night. Under the panels are three removable cross beams to given them support and since they are oriented along the panel seams, pulling the panels down on to them with an internal lashing system keeps things watertight. Mostly......I also have a fitted tarp that goes over the roof when we have big rain. Anyhow, the panels are less convenient to remove and replace than a roll off, but with them I can open up just enough of a slot for the scope and because they're oriented parallel to the wind (as opposed to the slot in a dome), I have great wind protection. Because wind is a big issue here, I also built the sides a little tall, but then hinged them about a third of the way down. So if I need to chase a target below about 40 deg, I can fold down one or two of the sides. With this system I've been able to image in winds gusting to 25mph, or even higher, and still maintain sub .75" guiding. The panel system is limited though in that my observatory is barely big enough for my one scope, C9.25, and if it was any wider or longer, the panels would probably get too large and heavy to easily take off and put back on. Here's a pic of it: photos.app.goo.gl/FFNER3AaRW9BuNjS9 More than welcome to check it out if you're ever in the area.
As usual, there's a lot more involved in this than I thought! You want something that will last and do its job well throughout. Great video and conversations, Nico!
This was an outstanding video because you're smart enough to get professional advice on the challenges that your location places on you. A lot of guys would build without thinking things through to that degree and have a lifetime of problems and regrets.
I for one am also in the same boat now, I’ve just recently started the hobby after almost a decade of wanting to since my undergraduate Physics days, and your videos have been a tremendous help and very insightful. Thanks for all the work you guys do for all us folks!
This might be the single most interesting video about obsy construction I’ve seen. Great conversation that goes into the reason obsy’s are built the way they are.
Bro, im echoing everyone else... podcast! I know id watch the hell out of it. This was cool to be a fly on the wall for this discussion.
Hi Nico, you’ve been doing a fantastic job interviewing people and visiting their observatories! I’m glad you’ve gathered enough useful information to finally build your own observatory! And share that information with others to inspire and help them to build their own😀 I wish you all the best with your build, and I’ll be watching your progress 👍 Good luck from here in the UK!
Really great discussion that touched on several critical points in constructing a roll-off obs. I built one (designed it but a carpenter did the real work) last year. One idea that has seemed to work is the use of a "soffit" on the inside of the observatory. It is constructed of two 2x8 boards (on each side) running the length of the tracks (in my case 3" garage rails and rollers). The two boards are connected at a right angle forming one half of a square where the two open sides face up and outward and the boards face down and inward. When the roof is closed, it provides added protection from two openings at the end of the rails. You can make this as tight a tolerance as you like realizing there will be settling over time. My main concern was snow here in Minnesota. BTW, there are many weatherstripping solutions that can block those end of the track openings without causing significant friction when moving the roof. Great stuff! Thanks again.
Excellent video! Learned a lot. Thanks to you both. CS!
Really interesting conversation. Looking forward to seeing the build and eventually the finished observatory.
Great video Nico. There's some fantastic tips that I haven't heard discussed elsewhere with astronomy being the focus.
First I would need to own my own place, but I would love to have an observatory! Love the idea.
Interesting conversation and lots of great thoughts about building an observatory. Being nearby in VT I can relate to everything Tim said, especially since we just had some hardscaping done this summer. Lots to think about for sure! Sounds like you're giving this a great deal of thought before grabbing the shovel, Nico. That ought to put the whole project on firm 'footing'. 🙂
Thanks for this great video! If I would have the space in my garden and a view, i already was digging some holes .. :D
This was SUPER helpful!! Thanks!!
Great content. wish this was possible where I live
. but trying to get into astrophotography on a basic level..
The time I get spare .. just a simple 10 sec exposure on a basic camera showed up soo much more than what I could see with the naked eye...
and its thanks to you Nico and other channels helps me take a deeper breather than normal when you get a better pic.
Excellent video as always! - Really nice of Tim to help out with advice like that! :-D I can't wait to see what you build mate!
Great video Nico. Looking forward to this build series. Plenty of tech details please!
3:45 there is and it's pretty easy, if wheels are mounted on bolts or another mechanism to raise and lower them it's enough to use a simple rubber seal around the perimeter between the roof and wall with locks to clamp the roof to the seal on the walls when not in use.
Although I'd say a geodesic dome with a door on the top would be best, a scope can be raised through and they stand up to nearly any weather you would ever get there.
They can also be made if many materials that are not prone to mold issues, also a dual compartment setup would be wise so the operations area can be heated or cooled whilst the scope can sit in the open area.
I'm a engineering student not a architect but this is just my opinion on the subject. Do your own research on domes you might find you like them.
Excellent!!!!
That was interesting, although I would never build one myself. Here in Switzerland in the middle of Europe there are just too few clear nights that fit with my daily life as a husband, father of three and owner of a small business. But for you doing this on the level you do, it will probably be a game changer! You sure know about it, but I still like to mention it, maybe others don't: Daniel Nimmervoll from Austria does some of the finest astrophotography I know. And he built an observatory I think even BEFORE he started doing astrophotography or right along with the start. He has some videos about that build on his channel and the amount of steel and concrete he used to make it perfectly solid is VERY impressive!
I am not planning building my observatory soon but that was an interesting interview. I’ve learned a few things. Thx 🙏
Very interesting talk, even if I am not interested in building an observatory. And I love stuff like this about astro community, because for many its just a hobby, so many have a lot of knowledge in other fields too, like Timothy here.
Great one. I'm hoping for a more permanent setup later in the year. So far lots of food for thought. .
For piers of the building you may want to look at the diamond pier invention. We can use them in Wisconsin for applications like this and are WAY easier and cheaper to use. They support things from swamps to Minnesota high frost areas. Forget those sonotubes and digging big holes.
Don’t forget to get a locator service to mark pipes and utilities. Most areas don’t charge for this.
Awesome content. I was considering building a roll off roof observatory on my 12'x12" concrete observing slab but decided (as much as I would love to have such a beautiful man-cave), it was not practical in my situation. I have a very large shop just a few steps away to store everything and use as a work station. Also, a roll off roof would signal the neighborhood that something unusual is happening here. This becomes a security issue. Previously, I was using a dark privacy fence material on t-posts to shield from local lights and wind, plus for security. But, of course, the fence material was up the posts when in use and down when not being used, thus signaling, "something unusual happening here". Plus it looked trashy (at least that's what my wife thought). My most secure and cost effective solution was to simply put up a six foot privacy fence on two sides of the concrete slab. As for convenience, I drilled and bolted a pier to the slab and routinely leave a mount head on the pier. Quick change cable management allows swapping or removing the scope during prolonged bad weather in under five minutes. But the lure of a roll off or dome is still very seductive to me.
I’ve also thought about simply building a permanent pier. But leaving the mount head out seems problematic. I’m not worried about theft, but does a cover such as a Telegizmo and a bag of desiccant suffice to protect it from weather?
@@lwizzit I don’t have much moisture issues here in the high desert. I remove the telescope if the weather predicted is bad for a few days. I place a towel over the mount, then a plastic bucket, then a reflective cover (Telegizmo or similar). I tie the cover down around the pier with a bungee cord to keep the wind from blowing the cover away or whipping itself to death. A desiccant bag under the bucket may be a good idea in more humid climates.
Jr architect, only 2 pens in his pocket and no pocket protector. - just playing, cool you are getting some industry insight from an architect
Hi 👋, If you make a curved roof out of bending plywood for the covering, at least 3 layers glued and nailed, forming the rib structure out of plywood, at least 3 layers of 3/4 of an inch, make an arch that you what on the flat sheet of ply 8x4 stagger joints to form the curve,
There is a lot on UA-cam, showing how to construct a curved roof, out of plywood, and the side walls of your building will be best made out of plywood as well less likely to move in humidity conditions, I do realise this is going to be more expensive than normal timber construction, but if you’ve got thousands and thousands of £/$/€ worth of equipment inside it is really well worth spending the extra money on your building to make sure it’s staying firm in place, especially if you’re having to go down 48 inches plus to get below the frost level,
It’s just a thought , Phil from the moulin France
You must remember, water is the enemy!
I think I would be renting an auger from Home Depot to dig multiple 4'+ deep holes in rocky soil. Having built a few fences in softer soil, I can say it's hard enough to use a post hole digger down to 4' if the soil is soft and clear of rocks. Don't think the augers are too expensive to rent either...
Simons Astro has set the standard for backyard observatories, I’m expecting something at least as good from you sir 😉 good luck.
Thanks for the shout out Woody, much appreciated mate👍
w.r.t. the ventilation: would this improve it even more? Instead of louvers at the bottom, pull the air in through a PVC pipe that runs underground for an extended length. Air would be drawn in through a little "tower" popping out in the yard somewhere, with a mesh screen to keep the critters out and a cover to keep the rain out, and be drawn in at ground level in the shed. The entire run length of the pipe would be so that it slopes downwards from both sides to a spot in the middle, where a T would connect it to a small section of pipe running straight down, with a water level sensor and a small pump to drain the moisture out when it fills up. This would run the air underground where it's always cool, thus cooling the air even more, and removing even more moisture from the intake air.
And before anyone says "this is a lot of work just to dry some air", consider the context: we're talking about construction of a dedicated shed, with a roof that rolls off, just so you can point a telescope up at the stars without having to pack it in after your session is done and drag it _all the way_ from your backyard to your house or garage. In the grand scheme of this project, it's not really that much extra effort.
@EvenTheDogAgrees I know this is done in a lot of passive houses in the mid west. From what I understand it works well out there but I have never heard of anyone doing it in New England.
Laying down the thick plastic underneath was very good advice. I'd be sure to stake it down really well. Maybe even use old tarps?
@afryhover I would not recommend old tarps in this case, especially woven tarps. Old tarps likely have been exposed to lots of UV rays from the sun and become brittle, once laid into the ground they degrade much faster than new polyurethane plastic. Stakes are not really necessary as you would want to cover the whole tarp with stones as mention later in the video. One thing not mentioned in the video however, is I would recommend 3/4" - 1" washed river stone 3" to 4" deep. Crushed stone can work and is much cheaper but the sharper edges can damage the plastic.
Hi Nico. Another great Vid. One thing I noticed is no one is talking about is cooling the observatory. I don't mean with passive or active ventilation like your architect friend mentioned . . . I mean with an actual AC unit. I live in Arizona where the temps reach 120-degrees ambient in the summer. Inside an observatory (or shed) can easily reach over 130-degrees on these hot summer days. Speaking with Orion and ZWO, both manufacturers have confirmed that the coatings on their optics (lenses, mirrors, or camera sensors) will all degrade significantly faster under these hot temps. They recommend keeping AP equipment at or under 100-degrees. That said, has anyone successfully used an AC unit in their roll off observatory without doubling their electric bill? I am concerned about what your architect friend said about pulling in the warm air from outside, thus making dehumidifying a futile and wasteful activity. With an AC unit we wouldn't necessarily be pulling air from outside (assuming a recirculation option), however, I have to assume the inability to seal a roll-off roof observatory would make cooling it with an AC unit expensive if not futile. Comments from everyone welcome. And thanks again Nico! You rock sir (no pun intended)!!
I believe there are clever ways to nearly seal a ROR observatory in the closed position using rubber seals that are flexible enough to still allow the roof to move. I have heard about people out west like you putting AC units in the RORs and using them when it’s going to be really hot. Should be possible. I think to save on energy costs, they also have the option just to use vents and fans. When they want to use AC, they close the vents. I’m not going to do it, because it won’t be necessary at my location (I don’t use AC in the main house and it never gets above 90F inside).
I envy you. When I retire, I want to move to a more moderate climate. I was born and raised in NY. I'll keep researching. Looks like I'll need a wood-built ROR Observatory. Thanks for the Reply!!!
Where can one get the plans?
When I built mine in 2008, I had no plans of any kind and just figured things out as I went. I have since moved it to the other side of my yard and recently rebuilt the roof to have the peak on the east side instead of along the middle. Again, just figured things out as I went. It isn't pretty, but works really well.
If I had the money, I would have done it differently.
The observing pier needs to be completely isolated from the floor that you walk on in the rest of the observatory by an air gap. A connection when entering or leaving will vibrate the pier .
I am just getting into astrophotography and found your channel!
Great work breaking down the equipment, workflow, and post!
I plan on systematically watching every video!
Is there an online astrophotography course you can recommend???
Thanks for your great work!
For PixInsight software (popular advanced software for astrophotography processing), there are several paid courses. I am a member of Adam Block’s courses for learning Pixinsight. He has a few different options at adamblockstudios.com and you can check out his UA-cam channel first to see his teaching style.
I don’t know of any general course, just processing courses. If I may ask, what kind of course do you have in mind? It’s something I may try to make in the future.
@@NebulaPhotos
Well, I'm a little embarrassed to admit that I struggle to understand even the most basic processes most astrophotographers talk about in their "how to" videos. For example, several videos will offer info on taking calibration frames such as "flats", "darks" and "bias". Ok, so what are those? Why do I need them? What do I do when I get them? At some point is something going to ask me to add my flats?
It's sort of like teaching someone to drive, but he doesn't even know how to turn on the car's motor.
There a many videos on using the ASIAIR with a DSLR, but none of them mention which port in the DSLR I plug the data cord into. The Mic? A/V Out? HDMI?
The presumption, even in the most "beginner" videos is that I already know this stuff.
I'm sorry, this sort of sound like a rant, but it's not, I am looking for a from the ground up type of course that will teach me not just what to do, but how and why I'm doing it.
@@choppermontana8212 Got it. Thanks for the reply! Have you seen this video I did?: ua-cam.com/video/Qb1ceFM-DkQ/v-deo.html Maybe something at that speed and level of detail, but with ASIAir and broken into 'lessons'? That video does explain the flats/darks/bias by the way, but just with the DSLR, not the ASIAir. I also strive in some of those early long videos to explain more of the how and why of the different gear and processes involved for beginners. The reason I stopped making my videos that long is because I don't like to repeat videos too much, and the info is all still the same. One of the issues with where to plug in cables into DSLRs, etc. is every DSLR is slightly different so it is sometimes hard to go to that level of specificity. But maybe the course could be a 'cohort' model so there would be time to ask questions live. In the meantime, if you have specific questions, you want direct answers to. You can join my Patreon (patreon.com/nebulaphotos) and ask all the questions you want. ~Nico
@@NebulaPhotos
Thanks, yes I joined your Patreon and plan on bugging you with a million dumb questions! 😆
Looks like a swedish house with that red colour👌 😅
I have a quick question. Is 80mm a good size for my next telescope? It also has 450-500mm focal length. Its light, it can work with a cheaper mount, i just need to know if it is a good size for astrophotography
Yes, absolutely. Great size for a mount like the Sky-watcher HEQ5 or the ZWO AM3, and an ideal focal length for emission nebulae, dark nebulae, and the largest galaxies (M31, M33).
48”! Mama-Mia! Is it not more practical to relocate to Arizona-New Mexico?
Just like soffit and ridge vents and
Hey Nico im planning to do astrophotography, u advice me getting a DSLR camera or a Mirrorless one?
If it’s just for astrophotography, I’d suggest a cheap modified Canon DSLR and spend what you save on the camera on a good lens or telescope. If you will be using the camera for more than just Astro, it gets more complicated. I have a video coming out Friday about DSLR vs Astro camera that may help.
@@NebulaPhotos Alright alright, i have rn in my hands a mirrorless one cuz i already had it indipendently of astrophotography, i mean cant i use it temporarely or it just doesnt work?
@@pierspinelli8352 oh, sure, it will work great. You can always start with what you already own. That is the best way to begin.
@@NebulaPhotos Thanks, it's really appreciated that finally somebody whos insto astrophotography and knows a lot of it answers me, just another thing at this point sorry if i catch the occasion, id like to observe galaxies and nebulae, do you believe that the right filter that would fit for me is an uhc+for exemple an O-iii or an Optolong l-pro?
@@pierspinelli8352 I would suggest no filter at all for galaxies and other broadband objects, and an Optolong L-eNhance or Svbony SV220 dual narrowband filter for emission nebulae. This advice holds no matter what your light pollution level is. If your light pollution is heavy, you may be using very short exposures when shooting galaxies and reflection nebulae, but the results will still be better if you use no filter based on my experience.
Without a stable foundation, the entire structure is in danger. Hire a licensed contractor with an excavator to dig the foundation and telescope pier holes? Same with pouring the concrete.
what ever happened to the astro critique? you said it would be done in february and I have not even heard anything about it since then
It’s still coming. I never said February. It takes me as long as it takes to go through all submissions.
@@NebulaPhotos Oh OK, thanks for the update
@@jackforlife101 👍 hopefully it won’t disappoint!
Do yourself a favor and rent yourself a tractor with a post-hole digger. You will save many hours of work and a sore back.
@markmeridian3360 The ground in New England is very rock and I can say from experience that sometimes a tractor with a post hole digger does not always work. When heavy machinery is involved, the hole always ends up being way bigger than it needs to be. The less undisturbed material the better in this case I think.